140. Mamdani’s Rise, Biden’s Shadow, and the Line That Was Finally Crossed

12:34Anthony Scaramucci:It's said a lot. So I'm going to go with that one. Okay. Most under-discussed, under-appreciated moment of the year. Anthony Scaramucci, which is your most under-discussed, under-appreciated moment of the year. What do you think?

12:48Katty Kay:So, Cady, the most under-discussed and under-appreciated moment of the year is actually Donald Trump's health. You say, oh, we've discussed it. We've discussed said, we really haven't discussed it. Okay. He's wobbling. He showed an unsteady gate in August when he was with Vladimir Putin. There's a scene where he's walking down the corridor there that leads out of the Oval Office with his grandson. He's wobbling again. Okay. That's a recent one this past November, right after the Thanksgiving holiday. He's had several brain scans. Again, And I'm just speculating with you, but a lot of the times if you've had an aneurysm or stroke, something's going on with the brain, they go back and forth on the brain skins.

13:35Katty Kay:Nothing's been released related to this. And again, the president is deserving of his privacy related to his health, but he's showing signs of age-related deterioration. Acknowledged by them are the ankle swelling, which could be cardiovascular or could just be leaky valves in his veins and his legs. I'm just suggesting that there's something afoot that could play itself out in 2026. And even though it's been quote unquote discussed, I think it's underappreciated. I think it's under discussed, frankly. He's done a good job of sweeping it under the rug.

14:10Anthony Scaramucci:Oh, my God. What did you think of that New York Times article about Donald Trump's health and frailty and lack of stamina? The one I think you're referring to that came out just after Thanksgiving weekend. end. That was like the New York Times' Thanksgiving gift in this season of goodwill and harmony, Mr. President, the headline you are least going to like blazoned across your paper record from the city that you love, all about how his stamina is failing. And they ran this video. Actually, I thought the video was a little cruel of him sitting in one meeting and his eyes start to shut. I mean, I've sat in meetings and my eyes have started to shut and he probably doesn't get enough sleep anyway, but it was pretty brutal.

14:51Anthony Scaramucci:For me, I think, and again, I'm not wishing the

14:54Katty Kay:president poorly. I know people think, well, I dislike him and so therefore I wish him poor health. I don't. I don't wish anybody poor health, but I will say this, something is afoot there. It's been under-discussed and under-appreciated.

15:07Anthony Scaramucci:So my candidate for most under-discussed, under-appreciated moment of the year, I thought of the Cyril Ramaphosa meeting with Trump in the office where he accuses the South African government of committing genocide against its white population, because then that led to what we have at the moment, which is effectively the United States cancelling all asylum applications, except for white Afrikaners, who the president keeps coming back to as being this beleaguered group who are under attack and need to have asylum in the United States. So that's kind of odd in and of itself. But that was a bit of a weird moment.

15:43Anthony Scaramucci:But actually, I think one of the most underappreciated moments of the year, because it was happening at a time when so much was happening that it was hard to focus on it, was in March when Elon Musk went up to Wisconsin to weigh in on the Wisconsin Supreme Court race. and he bounced on stage wearing that Wisconsin wedge of cheese hat, that foam, bright orange cheese hat. And he starts handing out million dollar checks. And he tells the people in the audience that, look, this is so important. I've even bothered to come up here. Effectively, I can't. Words to that effect. You're so lucky that I managed to come.

16:22Anthony Scaramucci:Look, it wouldn't be if somebody like me has come here. If I have come here, it must be important. Otherwise, I wouldn't be here. And he sort of slightly belittles them. And anyway, the Wisconsin race does not go his way. And that is the sort of nail in the coffin for Elon Musk's supremacy. And the reason I think it's such an unappreciated moment is because we've slightly stopped talking about Doge, but Doge, which dominated our lives, right? This podcast for the first few episodes of this year after the inauguration has died an ignominious premature death. It was meant to end next summer. It's already been folded.

16:56Anthony Scaramucci:All of the doge acolytes are out of town. There are big questions about how much money it actually saved, if any at all. And it sort of slunk out of town with its tail between its legs. And I think that that moment when he weighs in on the Wisconsin race and looks kind of dorky with this cheese head. I'm sorry, people from Wisconsin. I know you love those cheese heads, but I am never, ever going to wear one. He jumps up on the stage with cheese head on. I think that is the beginning of the end of Elon Musk's power over Washington, D.C., because it didn't work out for him. Have you ever worn one, by the way, a cheese head?

17:30Katty Kay:I can't confirm or deny that, Kat.

17:31Anthony Scaramucci:Oh, you have. Is there evidence? Is there photographic evidence?

17:36Katty Kay:I was friends with Scott Walker, the former governor of Wisconsin.

17:39Anthony Scaramucci:How did it go for you when you went on a date wearing a cheese head? I just want to know. Have you ever seen that film, The English Patient? I have. Okay. You know when he dresses up in the Santa Claus outfit?

17:48Katty Kay:Yes, I do remember.

17:49Anthony Scaramucci:And Ralph Fiennes and Kristen Scott Thomas are having a torrid affair in the glass. It just, there are certain things you should never do as a man. One is wear a cheese head and one is dress up in a Santa outfit.

17:59Katty Kay:It's duly noted. When I have my Mickey Mouse ears on next time, I'll be thinking of that. But, but, Katty, I want to be self-congratulatory, not that you and I are deserving of any awards, but if we were, we did get the doge thing right. We both said that there is no way that that system known as Washington, that beast is going to tolerate Doge. It's just not going to happen. It's a great idea, a great business idea, but Washington does not run like a business. And they blew that to smithereens. And by the way, I think the reason why Trump has returned to the presidency, he's never run his businesses like businesses.

18:39Katty Kay:He just doesn't. He doesn't think like a businessman. He thinks like a marketer and a roncontour, and he thinks like a wave surfer of the current culture war. And that's what's going on now in our country, and we just have to accept that.

18:56Anthony Scaramucci:Okay, we'll take a break and come back with more of the TripUS Awards.

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20:54Katty Kay:okay caddy we're back from the break i gotta i gotta give my two cents in on the biggest political blowout of the year which was totally unpredictable i would have never gotten this right and that is marjorie taylor green's departure from the congress and her riff with trump if you said to me on january 20th 2025 there's going this woman was screaming liar and traitor and wearing Trump hats. Trump is right about everything, these red hats and cavorting around like a lunatic. And then she flips the script and says, hey, I apologize for my rancor and I apologize for my political idiocy, which doesn't say it that way, but I'm translating.

21:36Katty Kay:And then she disavows Trump and then leaves the Congress before her term is up. Nobody leaves Congress.

21:43Anthony Scaramucci:They all go in. They stay there forever. And then you have to kind of carry them out on a gurney at the end of it. I know, I thought that was kind of remarkable. The Musk-Trump one is pretty obvious. We knew that was going to happen. I think we called that right. The MAGA breakups are pretty good. For biggest political blowup, the fight between Ben Shapiro and Tucker Carlson, Nick Fuentes getting thrown in there. Where does that leave J.D. Vance in this kind of stew of MAGA? I guess we could see that coming. It came a little quicker than I thought it would. You know, it's a bit like when you took Tito away from Yugoslavia and things started to disintegrate.

22:17Anthony Scaramucci:It feels like people are looking at the end of Trump and now MAGA is already eating itself up in a civil war to try and see who's going to be the inheritor of Trumpism. I am going to go with, because I think it had the most impact around the world, particularly a part of the world that I'm interested in, I'm going to go with Zelensky in the Oval Office. When he came over here and he got ambushed by the vice president and then Donald Trump weighed in and he was accused of not thanking America and not having any cards to play. And it all went incredibly bad. I mean, I remember watching it at the time and it was excruciating to watch.

22:55Anthony Scaramucci:You and I are not confrontational people, Anthony, either of us. We avoid that kind of scene like the plague. And I watched it and I thought, oh my God, I want to be anywhere else. I could barely watch it. And I watched it several times afterwards and each time it makes my skin crawl. But of course, it showed us how little J.D. Vance has any inclination that America should lead in Europe or should be helping the Ukrainians, does not see that there's a rationale for helping the Ukrainians who are, after all, doing in a way the West's dirty work for them. It's Ukrainians who are dying and the Russian army that is being degraded and the Russian economy that is being degraded by the Ukrainians.

23:33Anthony Scaramucci:But J.D. Vance clearly doesn't feel that. And it was a kind of dramatic moment of J.D. Vance asserting himself as vice president, slightly hijacking the conversation, but getting away with it. It signaled, I think, just how much this administration doesn't like Europe, wants to get out of Ukraine. And it was a moment that the world noticed and thought, wow, something very different is happening in America right now.

23:55Katty Kay:You know, I mean, it's a really good one, Cady. I want to ask you the following question. Does President Zelensky survive 2026?

24:06Anthony Scaramucci:That's a good question. For the first time, he's under pressure at home. And there are conversations about whether he was a great wartime leader for the first three years. I mean, listen, this guy is under a huge amount of pressure and has been ever since the war began. He must be exhausted. And maybe it is time, I think the thinking in Ukraine now, if you look at a polls in Ukraine, particularly since that corruption scandal erupted in November, you saw a pretty quick shift in polls when it came to Zelensky's popularity, who has been massively popular in the country and are thinking that maybe it's time for another leader there.

24:38Anthony Scaramucci:So I think you're right. That's a good point. He may not make it through 26. What do you think?

24:43Katty Kay:I think it's a big issue. I think if we're sitting here a year from now and he's still there, I will applaud him. But the Trump administration is sided with the Russians. And right now, I don't see the backbone. You know, my friend Adam Kissinger is out there banging symbols, telling European leaders, get it together, push back on Putin. You've got the goods on him. Your combined militaries are technologically superior to his and push him back. But the Europeans are going to be very reluctant to do that without the Americans. And Trump is not there. And whoever replaces Hexeth, I think I'm going to make a prediction here, which is I think apropos to your great reporting, is that Hexeth doesn't make it through 2026.

25:28Katty Kay:By the way, if Hexeth does make it. I want our producers to remind me so I can take a dunking for that, but I don't think Hexeth makes it. And we're sitting here with an America that's still supporting Russia. I think that puts an enormous amount of pressure on Zelensky. So I have it 75 % that he goes. If he stays, and I would like to see him stay because I do applaud him and I am a fan of his, but I think it's going to be very rough on him.

25:51Anthony Scaramucci:Okay. Surprise star of 2026. Who is your surprise star of 2026? I was going to say Erica Kirk, but I already mentioned her in terms of that speech. And I think that was what the surprise breakout moment was for her. Fiona, our producer, made a very interesting suggestion, which I've been kind of mulling over the last few days. And that is Caroline Levitt, who I actually think has done an amazing job of defending the White House and defending the president at every single turn, even when it became tricky and she had to slightly tie herself in knots to do it. she has never for a single day come out anything less than fighting.

26:32Anthony Scaramucci:And if you are a principal, you want a spokesperson who is going to go to the mat for you, whatever their own views are, that there's going to go to the mat for you every single time. As members of the press, we can now count on Caroline Levitt to come out fighting, feisty, pushing back, calling us all idiots and fake news, but doing it in a way that every time makes it sound like she really believes it so let's give caroline levitt the surprise star of the year young very

26:59Katty Kay:young can i can i push back and say something really controversial which will probably be

27:03Anthony Scaramucci:upsetting to some of our viewers and listeners no never nigel farage wow that's going to go down

27:10Katty Kay:with alistair and rory very well no you're gonna be mad at me but but again it's the same thing with the zohan mandami or donald trump nigel farage is it's mathematically possible that he could become am i making this up caddy you're saying absolutely it's mathematically possible that he could become the prime minister okay uh it could either if he forms a coalition if you just look at the ladbrooks voting look at the poly markets i think he is the surprise star of the year and uh i'm not saying alistair or already be happy with that and obviously i'm an anti-populist because i don't think populism is actually serving the people that are supporting it i just think that's the irony of populism but i i i have to look at it empirically and say that he's got to be up there caddy on the list it's quite interesting isn't it that we start out with

28:07Anthony Scaramucci:person of the year and we both said zora mom danny the other surprise star of the year i think you could say is javier mille who okay he's been around for a while but he had a good election run and he managed to get$20 billion out of the Americans. Not a bad deal. And actually, the people we are pointing to, Caroline Levitt, Nigel Farage, Mamdani on the left, they're all populists. So maybe it's just that the nature of populism with its communication style that is very direct, authentic, in your face, produces these figures who seem like stars. Erica Kirk and Caroline Levitt both remind me a little bit of Sarah Palin.

28:44Anthony Scaramucci:And when she spoke at the Republican National Convention up in St. Paul in 2008, and we immediately thought a star is born because she had that same kind of slightly pugilistic manner about her. These kind of people are people that you notice, and that makes them look like stars.

28:58Katty Kay:I want to move on to the political interview of the year. There's a lot of different candidates for this. Some could say that it's the Marjorie Taylor Greene CNN complete U-turn, but I don't see that one making it to the tippy top. The tippy top for me is the Nick Fuentes Tucker Carlson interview. And I'm going to explain why I think this is so important because this is a bridge too far for so many people on the conservative right. And this caused a fissure in MAGA. So Tucker's out there allowing Nick Fuentes to spew his anti-Semitic nonsense. Ben Shapiro, who we know is a mainstream conservative, but also an American Jew, goes crazy about this.

29:46Katty Kay:And Trump world split in a number of different ways. And I'm going to argue this hurt Tucker Carlson. It's actually changed the trajectory of his future because is he a journalist or is he a movement leader? and one of the things you have to do if you're a movement leader is you have to form a coalition you have to get people again hate trump like trump he is a movement leader he was able to form a coalition of sparring people and disparate people and you are now watching in my opinion a destabilization of maga and i think it was represented by the nick fuentes tucker carlson interview.

30:26Anthony Scaramucci:Yeah. And of course, Tucker Carlson, very close to J.D. Vance. A lot of questions about that relationship in the kind of context of that Nick Fuentes interview. I think I would probably go with that. Ross Douthat at the New York Times on his podcast, Interesting Times, has done a lot of interesting interviews with conservative thought leaders this year. And I found all of those fascinating. His interview with Amy Coney Barrett was really interesting on her views on jurisprudence. She has been a very interesting figure. She is the figure who who has, of course, this year in a separate interview said that she does not think that President Trump can run for a third term or that any president can run for a third term in office.

31:04Anthony Scaramucci:So I think that's worth a listen, going back and listening to her, both to her life story, which is fascinating and why she has such a big family and what that means to her. And there's a lot of personal stuff there, which I found interesting as well, but also about her legal views. Okay. Wildest moment of the year. Our award for the wildest moment of the year overall in a year in which there have been 500 gazillion wild moments. Okay, this is a bit of an odd one, but it's hard to go. You have to use a lot of memory when it comes to Donald Trump because so much happens that you forget things and that's part of the intent of it.

31:38Anthony Scaramucci:That's the flooding zone stuff. But it's worth going back to the beginning just after inauguration when Doge came in and the White House shut down USAID. And I do think for me, that was really one of the wildest moments. It felt like a hurricane had come through the city. Lots of people I knew of and knew personally had lost jobs because of that. You had a ton of expertise. You had massive ramifications around the world that is still happening, by the way. People in the aid world are saying the chilling effect of America withdrawing from international humanitarian aid has been extraordinary. We know that people have died in countries in Africa, in Latin America because of the pullback of USAID.

32:21Anthony Scaramucci:The lack of outrage, because everybody, I think, was in sort of shell shock. So much was happening at the time. And then by the time the impact became clear, it was too late for the outrage. But the lack of outrage also surprised me. I do think that was one of the wildest moments of the year. What is your wildest moment of the year, Anthony Scaramucci?

32:38Katty Kay:I don't know if it's appropriate for the podcast, but I think the wildest moment of the year are the allegations that are being made about Donald Trump in the Epstein emails. Okay. And just the salaciousness of what was suggested in those emails is wild. And you know, and I know that saga is unfolding right now, but I think that there's some stuff. I mean, there's some mentioning of him and Bubba. I don't know who Bubba was. But there's some wild stuff in there. I mean, these are insane allegations even by Trump standards. This could turn out to be a political Chernobyl in 2026. How's that for a light touch way of saying this so that Fiona doesn't like delete everything?

33:27Anthony Scaramucci:Okay. Finally, before we go, I think we should have an award for our personal highlight of the year. Anthony, you go ahead. What was your personal highlight of the year?

33:38Katty Kay:Well, my personal highlight of the year wasn't political, but it was forcing Caddy Kay, my great podcast partner, my better nine-tenths of this relationship, to open the window, to open the shade in her yacht as she was overlooking this beautiful vista in the Mediterranean. Because knowing how British you are and how you try to pretend that you're not bougie, which I, of course, am full bougie. I thought that was the political highlight. And that was my favorite part of the year, that we shamed you into raising the blinds to show us the view.

34:18Anthony Scaramucci:My personal highlight of the year was when you were somewhere in the Caribbean recording the podcast with the sound of birdsong in the background. and suddenly the fountain starts up in your incredibly bougie house that you have rented in the Caribbean and you have to call the maintenance guy, which I don't know, did we clip that out? I hope we didn't. You had to call the maintenance guy and say, please, can you come and turn off the fountain? Which is not a line you hear very often in political podcasts.

34:49Katty Kay:I knew I made a mistake bringing up the yacht, but it was still my personal highlight. It was worth it.

34:54Anthony Scaramucci:Okay, wait, I have another one. I have another one. I have another one there's so many okay another personal highlight of the year when you actually went and made your own cup of coffee because it was so early in the morning you made me make the bed in a hotel room i mean i mean come on all right keep going oh the time the time you didn't show up because you overslept and i had to do a live stream for 30 minutes by myself which i have to say that i the repartee was not what it quite could have been. What was I going to do? Play two different roles? That was not that great.

35:28Katty Kay:My personal low light of the year is bringing up my personal highlight. I'll just leave it there.

35:34Anthony Scaramucci:It's been a great year. Happy Christmas, everybody. We hope you've had a lovely time with your families.

35:38Katty Kay:Merry Christmas, guys, and very happy new year to everybody.

35:41Anthony Scaramucci:And don't forget to check out our members episode this week. Anthony and I are getting personal with some Aunt Agonies. Is it Aunt Agonies, Anthony?

35:50Katty Kay:It used to be called Agony Aunt, But I think we've changed the name to Aunt Agony. So I like Aunt Agony.

35:55Anthony Scaramucci:Aunt Agony says sign up at the rest is politics US.com. And we will be back next Monday with more of the rest is politics US and all of the latest news. Bye, everybody.

36:06Katty Kay:See you guys next week.

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