Straight Edge For Life: Punk Icon Toby Morse On Positivity, Parenting & Plant-Based Living

23:26Like, I don't know, I just, I love it. I've saved every letter I've gotten from people my entire life. I've written every single person back. I appreciate my life and I appreciate people's support. So it's coming directly from me. Not that it makes it any more special, but I just, I'm very hands-on. Like I'm very DIY. I love just doing it. It doesn't bother me. and actually when I'm printing out labels and packs, it's really relaxing. I just chill in my office and do it. It's like shut everything down and just, I don't know. I've been doing forever, I just, I don't know. Yeah. So when you were on the show the first time, we went into like your whole kind of coming up story, backstory and all that.

24:00I don't wanna retread that, but I do think it's worth spending a few minutes on the fact that like you've been drug free your entire life, which is amazing. Like you've never taken drugs. You've never hadn't drunk. You never had one beer? No. Your whole life? Nothing. Smoked a cigarette? No, absolutely not. Chewed tobacco, anything? My mom changed in the house. So the straight edge thing enters your life at a very young age when you were extremely impressionable and needed a little bit of guidance. And that ultimately is what led you to New York City, right? But the fact that you have like adhered to this path without wavering for decades, without even dipping your toe in anything, even accidentally, is kind of amazing.

24:44So scared of it my whole life. Probably not anymore because I'm in my 50s, but yeah, I saw my brothers partying around me. They used me to punk rock and then I hear this different types of punk rock. Then I hear Minor Threat, song called Straight Edge. I was like, wow, these guys are aggressive. I can skate to them and I don't actually have to drink or do drugs. It'd be cool, fit in. Sign me up, 13 years old, sign me up. I'm never gonna try anything. I saw my brothers. I was so scared of them when they were high or drinking a beer. My mom was chain smoking, my clothes smelled like Virginia Slims my whole life.

25:15Smelled like cigarettes, all my clothes going to school. My mom smoked Virginia Slims. I hated cigarettes. Didn't you live, you lived in Maryland for a while, right? Yeah, for high school. St. Mary's, is that where you went to high school? Yeah, my mom got a job there. I know that town. Yeah, wow. Went from Rhode Island to there. But yeah, I just, the timing was perfect for me because I wanted to be a pro skater. I was skating to all this aggressive punk. It came, that was like the soundtrack in the 80s was punk and skating. and I heard Mind a Threat and that was it. Then I found other bands after that, the same ideals and also animal rights came in as well, but yeah, never tried anything.

25:48And then there was really no peer pressure in high school. I was like hyper break dancing, skateboarding kind of guy. I was the prom king. Were you, you were prom king? Like you're the kid who like everybody liked, it didn't matter, you know, like you didn't, you transcended the clicks, right? I guess, yeah. I could see you just going, toggle switching between groups with no problem. Yeah, I was going to cake parties, just like drinking soda and stuff. And they knew I was like the kind of weird kid in the school. Nobody tried to pressure me. The pressure kind of came when I left school and got in a band.

26:18I was with all these other bands backstage and traveling, there was drugs and there was drinking everywhere. But there was really no pressure. People was like, you still, you haven't grown out of that? My barber who I've had for like 30 years still asked me, have you ever had a drink yet? I was like, no, it's never gonna happen. Like it's not something that's gonna happen all of a sudden. You know what I mean? Like it's never, yeah, it's crazy. because my son's like that too and he's 20. Like you never try anything and there's no pressure. He just sees how I am. He's hyper too. And the no animal diet comes in with the entrance of bad brains, right?

26:50Like that - Bad brains, use it today, gorilla biscuits, soul site, even KRS-One had a song called My Philosophy. So 88 - Were you roommates with gorilla biscuits? Yes, in Queens. I lived in the closet. I lived in the Alan Cage's closet. It was a walk-in closet. There was Sib Walter and Alan Cage and I got to sing backups on Start Today, which is an incredible hardcore record classic and then a song called Cats and Dogs, Thou Shall Not Kill. And that really just, I mean, they would listen to Meat is Murder, like the Smith's record in the house, but I didn't really need a lot of meat growing up.

27:21My mom had like her amazing meatloaf. That was the same thing she pushed every week, some actually dry meatloaf. I had fish sticks once in a microwave. There was really not a lot of meat in my house, no steaks, we couldn't afford that. So when I got to New York and got into the animal rights stuff and then living with Grilla Biscuits, I was like, It was just a no brainer. It was just this is all my friends and this is what we're doing. We have like the PETA videos at the punk shows and the pamphlets. It was just like, it was great. And I stuck with that too since then, man. Right, so it was vegetarian for a while though.

27:47Yeah, for a while, yeah. The full vegan thing came much later. A little bit later, yeah. It's pretty brutal, like wearing canvas shoes in Manhattan. Yeah. Like through the blizzards and stuff, like all the sacrifices I've done for the cows and stuff, like I really probably appreciate it. Yeah, there wasn't, there's not, the vegan fashion thing wasn't online yet. Vans were converse in the winter. But yeah, I was part of the whole movement and like with sheltering these other bands and just stuck with it, man. It's interesting how the punk world and the animal rights activism world like overlap.

28:19We were both at an event last week to support Maggie Baird's support and feed nonprofit initiative. For those that don't recall, she was on the podcast. She's Phineas and Billie Eilish's mom. She's created this amazing organization where they're providing plant-based meals to underprivileged neighborhoods. And I think even on like, I've noticed, I don't know if you've seen this, like if you order Uber Eats or Postmates, sometimes when you're checking out, they're like, do you wanna support? And like, it'll say like, do you wanna throw a couple dollars at support and feed? Oh, that's cool. Which is cool.

28:53That's awesome. And I know they show up at all of Billy and Phineas's shows. Concerts and stuff. To provide meals, et cetera. They did Coldplay 2 and Paramore this year. Yeah, that was huge, right? Huge, man, yeah, it's so awesome. But I'm bringing that up because at that event, there's like, there's Moby, like there's a weird, you know, like that, he comes from the same world, that punk world, that straight edge world. So that's just a really interesting, like match of subcultures that unite around this issue. Yeah, it's interesting. I feel like obviously the Smiths, but then I feel like punk rock and the hardcore was some of the first bands, like even in England too as well, like really singing about animal rights back then, you know, putting in their music and then Karius one as well, dead prez and other artists.

29:41But yeah, for me, I was into that world. So I feel like these were the only bands singing about, I'm sure there were more, but it was really like a big part of the movement. Yeah. Sure animal rights. Well, the straight edge movement has a lot, seems to have a lot in common with the early days of hip hop. I don't know about now, how do you think about that? But you're kind of a music historian. I mean, like public and stuff like that. You're a big hip hop guy too, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just like against the grain kind of rebellious kind of music and singing about things that people, stuff like that, public enemy.

30:13Yeah, Boogie Down Productions, Deb Prez. There was so many artists back then that were singing about things like this conscious way of living and stuff, you know? It wasn't just what everybody else was singing about. Yeah, for sure. or even more now there's so many vegan hip hop artists and drug free artists talking about that in their music. It's really awesome to see. Well, there's certainly like a whole new generation of young musicians who like care about wellbeing in a way that like would have been totally bizarre, you know, not too long ago, right? Like, you know, even like, you know, people like big hit makers, like Mike Posner, you know, like he just wants to talk about sprouting and like his cold, you know, like his cold plunging and stuff like that.

30:52It's so cool though. It is, it's great. It's interesting, you know, like, how do we live well? How do we live fully embodied? How do we self-actualize as artists as opposed to self immolate and like self-destruct? Yeah, and I definitely feel like we said a few minutes ago, like the ability is a big part of that, like with her platform and having like vegan Nike's coming out and vegan Gucci and just all this different things she's trying to change and spread awareness to use her platform. There's not many artists that are that big that use their platform for good for the planet. You know what I mean?

31:21I mean, it's amazing. Huge role model. Powerful. Kids. Yeah. She is a powerful creator. Yeah. That young lady. And it's awesome. You know? It's a family too. It is cool. Like what Patrick and Maggie, you know, did with their family and these two beautiful artists that are their children who they still like, they go on tour with them still, right? Yeah, still travel with them. And the dad rolls with the crew too. The unit is like so tight. Tight. They support each other. and like what Billy has matured into and like Phineas winning Grammys, like it's, and recognizing like the power that they wield with their platform and then leveraging that to do good things for the things that they care about is really, you know, inspirational.

32:04There's not many artists I can really think about actually do that level at this point. I mean, yeah, yeah, it's awesome.

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35:34Let's talk about your journey with well-being. So when we first met, like you're a generally healthy guy, eating plant-based and all that kind of stuff. But at some point you decided you needed to level up and like enter like a whole new world of stuff that you've been exploring, you know? I know. Including running, right? Like you showed up in your on's, like you're all about running. I'd like to think I played a small part in trying to inspire that. A hundred percent. But I remember not too long ago, we were at Andrew Huberman's house and I watched you do your first like sauna cold plunge. Yes.

36:12And now you're like a plunging maniac. Your whole social media is just you and a cold plunge and then the people you have over for the podcast, you make them do the whole thing. Yeah, let's go back to that. So yeah, I did the plunge for the first time at Heuriburn's house with you, an ice plunge, which is different because I feel like it's two different things. The ice just sitting in there and then the cold plunge actually sprays, puts water on you, you know what I mean? It's like moving all the time. And I had to do it in front of you two who are like the kings of this. I was so scared. I was like trying not to shake, but I did it.

36:43And it just, I don't know. It was my first time doing it. It felt amazing, man. I just, I don't know what it was, but I've been seeing you guys do it for a while. And you're a big inspiration, obviously. Yeah. And Josh has like his own one too and Huberman. And so I did that and I just, I got obsessed with it. You know, I just set a goal that like, I'm gonna sell my car. I'm gonna get my son a car. And then I'm gonna build this thing in my backyard with the plunge and the sauna and I did it, man. It took like a while, but like now it's my everyday. I love it. It's a game changer. And then I started running more, my friend Alex as well, running and my friend Hakim.

37:18Thank you, I met him through you as well. And so yeah, we just started running and just getting more serious about it and doing weight training to balance just running and just, yeah, I'm upset. I love it. I wanna do my first half marathon soon and they actually do a marathon next year. That's cool. You're a big inspiration on that, man. I ran here and there, you know, so. I mean, I think it's, listen, you sold your car so you could make that dream a reality for yourself. For sure. And I remember you having like some discomfort around like doing something for yourself. You're like, it felt indulgent to spend a bunch of money on something for your own wellbeing or happiness, right?

37:58And so I think that you have, you know, earned the right to have that. And you certainly like, listen, And it's not like it just lies fallow in your backyard. Like you're in it all the time. And I think it's improved your life to have that. So I hope that you feel good about investing in yourself that way. At first I felt, yeah, the guilt and the thing about it, but now I'm just like, no, I love it. I sleep better. Just everything about it's incredible, man. And I'm so crazy. Like I dream of plunge acid, I clean it once a month. I keep everything spotless. I'm a freak about it. I love it. I have my gym in my garage.

38:32It's just, it's perfect, dude. I feel way better. And so for somebody who's never done that before, like what is the difference? Like, I feel like you have a lot of energy. Yes. Maybe it's hard for you to go to sleep at night. Like you're just, you're spinning, right? Like, I just know, like if I do like that kind of, you know, protocol like in the late afternoon or early evening, like I just, it calms me down. I sleep better at night. I just feel better in my body. There's definitely like an antidepressant aspect to it. Yeah, and I feel like going in the plunge is the only thing that keeps me calm.

39:08It's so crazy because I seen so many people have different reactions trying it for the first time, like jumping out, screaming and stuff. I can just get in there and chill to the point where I did like 13 minutes once. Did you? Yeah, I'm like, yeah. You set it, where do you, what do you set the temp at? 39. You do? So all the way. All the way. And I think somebody hit me up, I don't know if it was Josh or Andrew, somebody said, I said, you need to chill. I see what you're doing. I've done it before. Like you're pushing yourself. It's not about how long you do. Yeah, but I did that for myself because I wanna see how I could do it, but I don't do that no more.

39:37Now I do a couple of times every time I do it, but yeah, it keeps me calm. I love it. I zone out, I put some Sinead O 'Connor on. That's like my go-to music. I just zone out there. I love it. I don't know. You're wearing a Sinead O 'Connor hoodie right now. One of my favorites. Orange for Halloween. Yeah, 100%. What is the whole Sinead O 'Connor thing? I just feel like she's one of the most punk rock artists that was in the pop world. Things she sang about and spoke about, a lot of it came true. She was canceled before cancel culture for speaking her mind. Everything that happened became true.

40:07They never brought her back. It's a really sad story. The documentary she has out now is incredible. When they weren't putting hip hop as a genre, I think it was on the Grammy's, she did a Public Enemy logo on the side of her head because Public Enemy boycotted the show as well. Just her hip hop and her reggae roots and just her story, man, just like shaving her head, and not trying to be like stereotypical pop star, not trying to be pretty. I just think she's a bad-ass man. And like, I've been repping her for years. I have her eyes tattooed in the back of my legs for like 20 years. And it was just really sad, especially when that doc had just come out and then she passed.

40:46I know, I haven't seen it yet. Julie washed it, she was very moved by it. And you know, she was, it's hard to understand like how courageous she was at that time. Talk about using your platform and your voice. She got annihilated. Annihilated. Talk about, imagine doing like somebody at like a Billy's, right now speaking about stuff like that too. She was doing that, she was the biggest she ever was. It's crazy, man. Ripping up the post picture, all that stuff. Just like crazy, man. Super punk, did not give a shit about getting cancer or anything. I mean, maybe she did later on in life, I'm not sure, but just seeing like how it ended and stuff, it's just, and her son passing and stuff like a year ago.

41:28I was, I was wrecked by this man. Like I didn't, I was wrecked by it because I just, I listened to her all the time still, you know, and I had done this post where I was like, bucket list, Sinead O 'Connor. I did a post about people were damning me from Ireland. I work at a record label. People were trying to help me like track her down for like a minute. And then three months later, like she passed. Yeah, I just thought she was amazing. Yeah, I know that that was like your ultimate dream podcast guest, right? But I didn't know where she was. It was a point where it was on the news. Maybe she was in a hotel in New Jersey or something.

41:59I was always trying to keep tabs on her. You know what I mean? Like, I don't know. I just thought she was so, and then the doc came out. I was like, wow, man, this is beautiful and really sad. So yeah, I think she's one of the most punk rock, probably female artists that we'll see, that we've seen. And the spotlight too. Yeah. So yeah, man, rest of peace Sinead. Back to the protocol. Let's go. The Toby protocol. in addition to the sauna and the plunge and the running and all of that, like you also like really up level your nutrition, like you've been plant-based forever, but there's being plant-based and then there's like really being intentional about being a healthy plant-based person.

42:39And that's a world of difference. Yeah, I went like gluten-free like a year and a half ago. I thought being vegan would means not to get real personal, but going to the bathroom all the time and having a weird stomach and feeling bloated. and I did an 18 day juice cleanse and started reintroducing stuff to my body and the gluten wasn't cutting it. You know, the fake meats, all that stuff. And I just cut it out and it changed everything. My wife cannot believe it. Like, I'm gonna be honest with you. I used to carry toilet paper in my pocket. I had serious stomach issues. I had Modi Medi on me when I travel.

43:11The craziest life of stomach issues. I never got tested for it. And maybe it's something more than ever. Ever since I cut the gluten out, I'm not, everything's normal. I'm not bloated no more. I feel lighter. I eat totally way cleaner. I fed it greens just every day, just everything. Like I just, strictly healthy. You look good, man. Like how old are you? 52? 53. 53. Yeah. Like your skin looks good. Thank you, man. Yeah, man. It's working, right? I mean, it's the diet and the lifestyle. Sure. And the sauna and all that's good for your skin too. Yeah. Plunge. How old were you the last time you had meat?

43:46Probably 1987. 87, I don't know what it could have been, but something, yeah, like before I moved to New York for sure. Cause I worked at Subway. I wasn't even to meet then though, but yeah, it's crazy. Yeah, that's OG status, 87. I actually worked at Subway, wait, wait, let me rewind this. I went to New York and I came back for like a summer for some reason. And my first tattoo is a Grilla Biscuits tattoo. And it says, meat is murder. and I got a job at Subway. I was like 18 or 19 and they made me, they ordered me a long sleeve Subway shirt because they didn't want me promoting vegetarianism at Subway.

44:26So I was the only person with a long sleeve, this is a true story, with a long sleeve Subway shirt to cover my meat as murder tattoo. And I hate, I worked for a couple months. I was like touching the meat and so I was like, I can't do this. Like, I then went to landscaping or something. Yeah. So when people say, how do you get your protein or how do you make it work? Or, you know, you're gonna wither away and all that kind of stuff. Like how do you, how do you like, but you must get asked that a lot as somebody who's notable and you know, even people who are curious, who just honestly don't know the answer to that.

44:57I mean, there's supplements, there's everything you can do. Now in 2023, there shouldn't even be a question. Do you know me plant-based is so like popular and everywhere. It's like, you just got people, you can just Google what you need to get, but I'm like, I'm quinoa, I'm kale, I'm beans, I'm tofu, a lot of tofu. Yeah, vegetables, greens. I'm always doing juice cleanse, nuts. I told you I'm in molasses now because molasses have this crazy high iron in B12, which I never knew. Do you know that about molasses? No, I didn't know that. I mean, they're not the tastiest things, but. Yeah, I couldn't tell you like the last time I had molasses.

45:35Yeah, I've probably never had them till now. Blackstrap molasses? Yeah. Where do you even get it? Just at the grocery store. You go to the like natural foods. It's like a microbiotic store. It's just organic molasses, yeah. But I try to do so many supplements that the greens helps a lot. And what do you do when you're on tour and traveling? I bring the greens and packs. This Happy Cow, thank you Happy Cow because every city, state, country, you can find a vegan or vegetarian restaurant. Whoever created Happy Cow should get crazy award. It's a game changer. Yeah, I use that every time I travel.

46:10Yeah, there's restaurants in every city, everywhere, man. like Hungary's thriving, Poland, Berlin's the Mecca. Like going to Europe is incredible. Berlin is the vegan capital of the universe. They have vegan grocery stores. Yeah, vegans. Vegans, it's so good. Grocery shop up top and eat at the bottom. I mean, it's just a different world. People shouldn't, I mean, it's now it's just like, that question's not really been asked in a long time, maybe, but yeah, I mean, that's people's main concern. Iron, just all this stuff. It's like, do you take supplements too? Take Athletic Greens and I do supplement.

46:43And I think supplements have their place, responsible supplementation. And I think even no matter how well you're eating, everybody has certain levels of deficiencies. All you have to do is get a blood test. If you do a broad enough panel, you'll realize you're gonna be lower in some areas and higher in others. And especially as you get older, I think there's a lot of good reasons to do that. And I think people will use that to say, well, your diet must be insufficient or incomplete if you're supplementing, but I don't care what diet you're on. Like I think supplementation has its place. Not as a replacement for trying to get your nutrients, those should come from the foods that you eat.

47:26But we don't all eat perfectly every single day. We don't, man. And if you wanna be optimal, then I think that having your blood work done regularly and paying attention to where you're lacking and addressing that is, you know, an easy fix. Yeah, the greens definitely help. It's a game changer in the morning, just have that and then know that just in case that day, you don't get them in. Right, shout out Athletic Greens. This is like a sponsor fest. Shout out Athletic Greens, shout out Momentous, shout out Plunge, you know, the cold plunge. Shout out Ryan. Yeah. We both have our plunge with him, great partner for us.

48:02But these are all things that help you like. For you and I came and did your podcast with him. Yeah, man. So lots of love here. all the way around. But these are products that are like life-changing. They're good products. It's sort of like, that's why they're sponsors of the show. Of course. You know, it's not like just a thing. It's like, I, you know, like yourself, I'm very conscious of the partners that we work with. For sure. I want them to be things that I'm excited about and that I use. For sure. And also for people that can't afford a plunge, like a cold shower or just putting ice in your bath.

48:33And I see people on tour creating their own like buckets that they're going in after stage with a trash bag and ice, like whatever works, man. That's super DIY. You're seeing that when you go, like bands are doing that backstage? Yes, yes. Who was I talking to? Oh, Travis got a little ice thing he does before and after the show. Interesting. But you can get these ones that are inflatable and they come on tour and stuff. So does Travis have like a plunge? Yeah, I got my plunge. Part of his rider? No, right. That travels with him when he's playing? It's a portable thing though, for sure, yeah, yeah.

49:01That's interesting. I think a lot of bands are doing that. Really? Yeah. That's cool. Yeah, I had a band on the other day, And the guy's like, yeah, we do it all the time. There's a lot of bands now that are going to like spas during the day and doing the sauna and the cold plunge. It's crazy. Everybody's being so conscious of like mental health and everything and physical. And because on tour, it's not the most glamorous thing, man, you're like grinding, you're getting no sleep. Like when I go on tour, this LA fantasy diet is out the window. Like it's a survival for me. Whatever I can get each day and get that sleep.

49:29It's so important. And the fact that younger bands are like focused on that, even if it's a trend that they're doing the ice in this sauna, it's great. You know what I mean? Because this has been a long journey, like living this way and playing music, jumping around and stuff. It's cool. I mean, I think the, you know, I can't imagine being on the road and being in a bus and city to city to city and getting in at weird hours and having a sleep disrupted. Yeah, van, like I just know for myself when I'm traveling a fair amount and I arrived somewhere new and it's late, like it's already past dinner time, like pretty much everything's closed.

50:01And so what do I do? I open up, like I see what's at the hotel, on the room service, terrible. Then I open up Postmates or Uber Eats or whatever. And the problem is that there are options, but they're generally like - Closed. Well, the stuff that's open are like vegan, like cheeseburgers and fries. It's like, so it's junk food, you know what I mean? Like you can get, you can eat quote unquote vegan, but you might as well go to Wendy's or McDonald's. But we're not in LA, so it's just - I know, so it's like, well, I have to eat and I end up eating shitty food more than I would care to admit. We got into DC like one in the morning, like two weeks ago and we were starving.

50:40We sat in the lobby and we ordered Domino's pizza and I had a gluten-free cheese-less pizza like at two in the morning. It's basically gluten-free bread. It was so brutal. With like red sauce on it or something. I'm like drinking like a Coca-Cola. I'm like, what am I doing? Like this was like two in the morning. I would never do that here, but I was starving. I woke up the next day, I feel like all guilty and weird about it. I'm like, I'm gonna survive, man. I gotta eat though. It's so important though. You mentioned mental health. You're the PMA guy, just born and bred positive. I don't know how that works.

51:11Me either, I don't know. You know, it's crazy. And, you know, I opened up this podcast by saying that, that, you know, a lot's happened since we first talked. And, you know, four years ago, the world was very different. And now we're in, you know, we're on the other side of a lot of insanity. and now there's a whole new level of insanity, especially on social media channels, the discourse, a lot of acrimony, a lot of shouting and yelling and signaling to in groups and all of that. And it's dark as good as my life is and as positive as my disposition is and as grateful as I am to have the life that I have, I find myself struggling to remain positive about the broader world and kind of what I'm noticing transpire.

52:02And that's not specific to any particular issue, just in general, like when you log on to, you know, social media platform of your choice, I have to like log off right away. Like I just, I literally start to get depressed as I scroll and kind of see how people are interacting with each other. So how do you do that? and like how do you maintain that positivity? I think I live in a bubble a lot of the times as far as like what's happening on the world that stuff I can't control or fix. Even if I post about something, is that really gonna help? It could help or should I do it or not do it? And just seeing how the world is.

52:36And I do feel, and that's the thing that makes me sad is stuff that I can't fix or can't help that I feel the world's pain, especially with things are going on the past couple of years, shit the past for a long time, especially now though. And like, yeah, maybe I just scroll by and look at it or read about it. I got deep into it the other day about what's going on now and it was really happy. I've been talking to a lot of my friends about it who come from there and different places in the world and just trying to understand it. And yeah, it's hard because the world is fucked and the world is a negative, dark place.

53:06And I do my best to be a good person in this world and try to help people and inspire people and live a good life. And you want the whole world to be like that too and be conscious of how they treat people. It is frustrating. Yeah, it's hard. Now I'm getting dark about it. Yeah, it's hard to scroll through that thing because social media is a dark place. And if you get on that spiral on there and people fighting in the streets, you see so much anger right now and violence and this tension. Since coming out of the pandemic, it seems like it's gotten, and even more magnified with social, everything's magnified from social media.

53:43If there was no social media, I think the past couple of years would be way less stressful than it ended up being. It's just everything's on there in your face all day long. You know, especially when we had a president who was on Twitter talking crazy shit. Like it was just a crazy time. Then now what's happening in the world. It's like, like, what can we do? I mean, we can talk about, we can get people on the podcast to talk about things about it or who are living there or being part of things. But yeah, it's frustrating. And I do get dark and I do, maybe that's when I go for a run or maybe I, sometimes I would zone out and I'll put my phone away when we look at it.

54:13Cause it's hard to digest it all. Especially when you feel like kind of powerless. And we have these platforms to talk about it and try to help things. But like, if you're not really there in the midst of it and the mix, do you know what I'm saying? It's like, I don't know. It's hard, man. I guess I do kind of, I know about things. I try to keep my ear to what's happening there. But at the same time, I kind of just keep it moving my zone and having these amazing conversations with people. And you know, it's hard, man. You mean, you truly are one of the most positive people in my life. And, you know, I've watched you in the world, like interact with people.

54:48everybody you meet, you meet with love, compassion, non-judgment, you meet people where they're at, like you like all different kinds of people, especially like when it comes to music, where it's like, you're only allowed to like this kind or that kind, like you like everything, you love Coldplay, like you like to, you know, all the bands that are not supposed to be cool, like you're the first person to say like, you know, these guys are amazing or whatever. Like there's just a really beautiful kind of welcoming energy that you have. And it's clear that like, you've just been a fantastic dad. Like I look at Max, this kid walks into a room and just owns it.

55:30Like he's so like charismatic and sure of himself in a healthy way. Like he knows who he is. He'll look you in the eye. He talks to everybody. He's not intimidated by anyone. And he just has this like really kind of joyful spirit about him as well. And I was like, man, you guys did a good job. Thank you, man. Yeah. I mean, yeah, I mean, communication is key. My son traveled with us since he was very, very young. We've always had open relationship with my son, talk about everything he wanted to talk about and unconditional love. And probably, you know, for me, I didn't grow up with a dad. So everything was new to me, just learning along the way and stuff.

56:13And my wife's an incredible mother. And yeah, he's just a very well-rounded, open-minded. He's been all around the world, seen different cultures, you know? He's been everywhere. And I grew up around a lot of awesome musicians and people. And I'm very lucky, man, especially a kid growing up in Hollywood too. Yeah, I know. There's so many different things, temptations, there's all kinds of stuff. Yeah, all around, right? All around. Like he went to a big high school too. Like it could have gone any number of different ways. Yeah, yeah, it's true. He went to Larchmont for a while, then he went to Hamilton High, which is a great school music program.

56:45The guys in Interruptors went there, the three brothers. They have like a whole like sort of recording studio. I think that high school has its own label. Yeah, they do. Yeah, my son's band, okay, my son's band, Wren was on that record label. Wow. It was signed to the label. And then one of the students was their manager at the school. That's crazy. There's like an Adidas sound lab there or something. Yeah, yeah, that's what I was thinking of. Yeah, so yeah, it's a really great school. He learned how to play the piano really well. He knows how to read music. It was a really wonderful move. He was kind of sheltered in the Larchmont world.

57:12And he's like, I wanna go. So he basically said eighth grade, I wanna go to a school where there's bullies and lockers. That's what he wanted. So he went to a real school. Yeah, I mean, Hamilton is that, you know, like that's a big place. It's a really big campus, man. And there's kids from all around the whole city that would go there and stuff. And yeah, man, really happy. He's a really good kid, man. And how did he end up in the band? Like, what is it? Like, I know he's like modeling. He wants to be, he's pursuing acting. Yeah, he's doing all that, yeah. So the band just happened. I mean, he would play one song with us really long time.

57:43He played a song called Nothing To Prove. He come up on stage since he was like nine years old. And then fast forward, my drummer, Todd Friend, shout out the Todd Friend. He had a problem with the shoulder. He had a couple of surgeries where it was hard for him to perform. And the timing just happened with my son to jump up and play a gig with us because of that. And it just continued. It's been continuing since that for like two years now. And we still see my drummer, he comes out to the show in New York. He sang a song with us. It's all love. It's perfect, man. Yeah. So I don't know how long it's gonna last.

58:14Right, you just take it while you can get it, right? Like what a cool thing to like play music with your son. Yeah, I'm gonna be cool next year. I don't know, you know what I mean? He might join another band. There's nothing you can do to be cool for your kid. Doesn't matter. You confront like a cool band or whatever. It's still gonna be, you know. We'll always be cool, I hope, you know? No, I mean, you'll be cool with each other, but you always think like, I mean, I can't imagine a cooler dad than you, but like no matter what you do or who you are, like your kid is always gonna on some level and it's supposed to be this way.

58:48Like you're not as cool as you think, you know? Yeah, that's definitely true. And it's meant to be that way. Yeah. Because they're the next generation and they got their own ideas about what's cool. He'll check me once in a while on different things. It's stupid or that's cringe or that's silly. Something I say. Yeah, what do you do that's cringe to him? I don't know. I don't know. He said that to me before that about something or something or even before if I post them, I was like, you sure wanna post that? They can check me on stuff, I like that though. There is a certain thing when you're that age where most people like in their early 20s, it's all about like kind of cynicism and irony, like nothing's cool, everything's lame, all of that.

59:27And you're a very earnest person. And I feel like Max is pretty earnest. Like he doesn't strike me as that person who's like everything sucks or all those bands suck. Like he's like, he's pretty enthusiastic about it. Yeah, he is, man. He has a good life. You better definitely have that enthusiasm. He's definitely had a wonderful, he still lives at home, he's 20 years old. It's awesome. How long is that gonna go for? I don't know, man. There's a lot of kids now, it seems like to be like in this generation, they're still living at home kind of late. It's interesting. It's so expensive. It's so expensive.

59:57I don't know where he would live in Los Angeles. Yeah, I mean, that idea, I mean, our generation, it was like, get out the door, you know, and it doesn't matter if you have to go into debt or run up credit cards, It's like, you're not staying at home. But to me, that's insane. It's so expensive out there. And I don't want my kids to be running up a bunch of debt or spending money unnecessarily if they don't have to, because that then ends up sort of impinging on the decisions that they can make about their life and the freedoms that they have. And if I can provide a buffer by just like, they can hang out at home a little bit longer.

1:00:32I'm more than happy to do it. Well, our boys had moved out. They were living in Echo Park, doing the music thing. And then when the pandemic hit, it's like, don't pay rent in a tiny little apartment that you're stuck in, like just come home. So they're still home and that's fine. And they're working and they have their own lives, but I'm not in a rush for them to leave. It's like stay as long as you want. I don't care. I don't care. I like having them around. Like, you know, it's not gonna last forever. They're gonna be gone. And then you're gonna be like, oh, wasn't it great when they were there?

1:01:04Like I'm trying to enjoy it for everything. I can't imagine like an empty house, like walking by his room. Like it's an empty nest syndrome. Our two younger ones are both gone now at school. So it's the older ones that are around. Yeah, it's hard. Yeah, it's hard. I mean, I'm happy for them. You're an emotional guy like me too though. Yeah, I mean, I'm definitely - I'm super emo, man. Yeah. I don't know if I'm as emo as you, but I can get pretty emo. But just seeing about him being gone, it's like freaks me out, dude. Like I don't like stay as long as you can. Like, I mean, I could pay rent where he works right now.

1:01:37It's impossible. You're gonna blink and he's gonna be gone and doing his own thing. And you're gonna be proud of him, but you're gonna miss, you'll miss that time. So to be able to be present with it and appreciate it for what it is now. And to play music with me, it's like. Oh, that's incredible. What a gift, you know? Who gets to do that? I know. I'm very lucky, man. I'm very blessed to have a very awesome life and family, man, and friends.

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1:03:40The other big thing that's changed in your life is the podcast. I mean, I think you were doing it maybe when, when did you start it? You had just started. It was more of like a side little thing, but it's really become like a, maybe not the main thing that you do, but like one of the big main things that you do with your life. Yeah, when I'm home for sure. Yeah, it definitely is a much higher priority than it was. Especially I started before the pandemic. So I had bank some episodes. So I'm really lucky and like, I love the conversations. I love doing it. It's very therapeutic. It's inspired me to actually go get therapy for the first time in my life from one of my guests.

1:04:14Oh, wow. I go to her therapist. I've never done that. Nobody's my family has been to get therapy. I'm the only person that's going. So, it's a big deal. How has going to therapy impacted you? It's interesting because it's kind of scary when you start like pulling back the layers and it's like, you're wondering like what you might find. You don't wanna find what you find, then you know it, you know? So, I'm like slowly going back to like through my grandparents and my, actually my mom's dad and how he was towards her, just all this stuff. I have some resentment with my mother. I love my mother, we're close, but just a lot of things with my dad passing and how that all stuff happened after that.

1:04:53So yeah, it's been really interesting to go. I love the person I go to. It's cool to talk to somebody who doesn't know anything about you and just like spill everything. I was there for like a consultation. I just started spilling it. She's like, wait, wait, wait, I'm just meeting you. I started this like almost crying, just telling everything. If I'm gonna do this, I'm doing it. I'm gonna do it all right now. So the first time I go, this is a consultation. I don't know if I like you or not. But now, yeah, I love her, but yeah. Well, I credit you for doing that. I think it's easy. Like, I think you would be somebody who I would imagine might be dismissive of that because you're like, my life's good.

1:05:29I'm a positive guy, lots of friends. Like I love my wife and I've got, you know, whatever. Like, why do I need to go to therapy? But I also know your backstory well enough to know that there's probably some trauma there. For sure. But somehow you figured out a way to either compartmentalize it or, you know, however you work through it or however you keep it in abeyance to like make your life manageable. And it's scary to say like, well, if I go towards that, that might threaten like the stability of what I've kind of created here. What would that mean? Like suddenly like it could disrupt all of this.

1:06:02And there's no guarantee that you're gonna be able to like find a new way forward and keep everything on the rails. Yeah, that's the scary part. Take like stripping the layers back. You're right. That's the thing that was kind of like tripped me out because there's definitely something there with a no closure of my father passing and not going to his funeral and not being allowed to even hear anything about it and thinking for like the next year or two, kept asking my mother when my dad's coming back. We had no closure in that. And I understand my mom didn't want her three young boys to go to her funeral.

1:06:29But for us, my dad just had chest pains, went to the hospital and never came back. That's all I remember. And I think that's probably why I also hate death and have a fear of death my whole life in hospitals. I'm figuring all that shit now. Like I hate the whole concept that we're going to die someday. Like I want to be here forever with my kid and my family and watch over everybody. Who knows what's going to happen? But like I was actually texting with Travis about today, but just the concept of death and how like, I just feel like I want to be here forever. I know it's not going to happen. And I have that fear probably since I was a kid with my worry about if my mom is going to die or my friend's going to die.

1:06:59Like there's definitely something there for sure. And then that growing up with no dad and becoming a dad, then all these emotions come out. like when you become a dad it's like it's a life changer you know i mean things that i would be upset or cry about or i i didn't want to see any violent movies anymore i loved violent shit growing up i could care less about that when i became a dad then you have this whole world you have to put this child into that you don't own but you make and you raise and he goes out there just all this shit it's just like a lot of shit in my childhood for sure i probably um covered up and thought i got it out with songs i wrote a lot of songs about my dad him passing a lot of songs about and I thought that maybe that was some therapy for me, but it's obviously not for sure.

1:07:38You know, once you start talking about it. Well, I'm sure there was a therapeutic aspect to that. Like you're trying to work it out for yourself. Yeah. And you mentioned like this, you know, lingering resentment with your mom. And I would imagine perhaps the original resentment stemming from her not being transparent about what was going on with your dad. For sure. But then understanding like she was doing what she thought was in your best interest by not sharing, not sharing all of the information. Like I'm sure she thought she was protecting you. Totally, I know that now as an adult and as a parent myself too, for sure.

1:08:09I probably do the same thing, you know, but then every man that tried to marry my mom after that, we'd run him out of the house. Like nobody was good enough, like my dad. So me and my brothers would run every boyfriend she had out and she never got married with me again. That was her one true love. It's crazy, man. That's a whole other podcast, but yeah, definitely a therapy's digging deep. You know what I mean? like it's interesting. I was always scared of it. I thought it was like silly, but like, I think it's awesome. And so many people are like, so comfortable talking about it now. It's like cool to go to therapy and talk about your issues and your problems as opposed to back in the day, like keep everything in, be tough, hold it in.

1:08:44And now don't show any weakness, do you know? Yeah, well, it always ends up coming out in a negative way, in a bad way if you do that. If it was snap. Yeah, I'm very, so that podcast, yeah, it just definitely was very therapeutic in many ways. And you just had Travis Barker on, like that just dropped today, right? We're recording this, what is it? October 30th today? Probably my biggest episode will be, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I noticed it's already getting picked up by news outlets and stuff like that. It's crazy because I've known him for so long and he hates podcasts. He's done yours and Rogan and several others, but not many.

1:09:21And like, he's not really the talkative kind of guy, but we know each other. So it was really great. I really got to know him more. And I know him for like, you think you know these people for like 20 years and you sit down with them or talk to them. You get deep. And that's what I love about the podcast is like reconnecting with friends or actually people that I maybe had preconceived notions about what I thought they really liked. And you sit down like, oh my God, this guy's awesome. I've heard these stories about you my whole life and you're really this, you're fucking cool. That's what I love about it too.

1:09:47Like being shocked by like how these people really are. Once you sit down, meeting them at a show or backstage is so different, playing with them. But like when they come sit down face to face, it's incredible, man. And it's like, so the Travis, I'm so proud of it because we got really deep. We talked about things he wasn't really talk about. And I'm really, really, and he hit me up to how proud he wasn't stoked on it. And cause he's kind of doing the circuit now with the new album out, but like, it was really nice, man. I love it. He's a really special person and a very thoughtful, quiet, kind of introverted, sensitive guy in a way that is surprising if you only know him through kind of like celebrity tabloid journalism.

1:10:33You see what he looks like and the kind of world in which he operates and this rockstar kind of like veneer that is who he is on some level on the outside, but he's not that at all really. Like he's such a sweet, thoughtful person. And I said to you before the podcast, like I think he should do more podcasts because, and I'm sure there's a trust thing there. Like he's only gonna do it when it feels right to him and he knows someone like yourself. But I think that format allows him to show who he really is. And I think shifts people's perspective of what kind of person he is. 100%, he's been the same person since I met him over 20 years ago.

1:11:20exact same person, soft-spoken, sweet human, supported by nonprofit financially and all kinds of ways, supported my son's drumming, my band, amazing father, a really caring person. And like, yeah, he's in a massive band. You know, he's in the world he's in now, but we hang out and we have the same conversations about the same stuff. You know what I mean? He's the exact same person. Like he's maintained just to be that through all. He may look different or dress different or whatever, but he's still Travis, you know? It's like, but people have, especially with the internet, people just wanna like have these things about people.

1:11:56They think that like everything you post is a hundred percent you, that could have been a moment or a feeling in that second, you just followed your heart and post. People just think that everything on there is like all of you and it's not. And everything written about you is true and everything is that. And like, it's like, unless you really know somebody, it's like, you're never really gonna know them. And we're lucky that we do know them like that. And I'm glad I had the platform to have a conversation with that. So people, some of the comments are like, I don't know if I'm listening to this, like this blah, blah, blah.

1:12:21I'm like, listen to it. This is a conversation. Like listen to a person they have to say, not just their music and not just the tabloids and the headlines that people were so like excited to like see a headline or a link about somewhere, a photo and like jump to conclusions about people. That's what the internet really kind of did. I think to like people's reputations or musicians or artists, or I don't know, I feel like people think that they really know you, they can get inside your life by something you post. Well, it's interesting because when we were growing up, all you had to go on was like the liner notes and the album art.

1:12:55And then you would just fantasize or use your imagination to try to dream, you know, who these people were, what they were like. And then maybe, you know, months later or a year later, there's an article in Spin Magazine or whatever, you know, kind of publication where you would be like, oh my God, I can read it, you know, and that was it. Yeah, yeah. And so we were left to our own imagination. I love that mysteriousness. But there was a myth building to that also where you built these people up to be, you know, people that they probably weren't because you're projecting this idea onto them, right?

1:13:27That's true too. And then there's the paparazzi kind of era where everything's exploitive. Yeah. But I feel like mediums like podcasting bring that all the way back around and put the artists more in charge of, you know, basically sharing who they are. Like you can either say, you could be an artist who says, I'm not doing anything and I want people to just not know who I am and my art speak for itself. Or you can go on a podcast and talk to somebody for three hours and be kind of in control of the narrative that gets spun about who you are rather than reacting to whatever TMC decides to, you know, post about you or put on a television show.

1:14:08Yeah, I think the podcast, like the realest rawest form of like seeing a real person, I think with these conversations, I really do. I don't know. I think that there's been so many I listened to or just people I've had on just like, they really get comfortable and want to talk about things that they wouldn't usually talk about on an entertainment tonight or like, you know, in my big studio, I don't know. It just, especially, it's so important now, man. Especially if people actually want people to know what you're really about. Cause you're not going to find it online. Do you know what I mean? But I'm psyched in the Travis one.

1:14:39Yeah, I mean, I can't wait to listen to that. I mean, he did my podcast. I don't know, it was probably like six years ago. So it was a long time ago, right? And like, unlike you, I don't know him that well. Like we live sort of nearby each other. And I used to see him at Erewhon, you know, like I'm sure he doesn't go to, I haven't seen him there in a long time. He's probably too famous to like go buy food anymore. But I just found him to be, you know, really open and sweet and sensitive. And I've had occasion to bump into him a number of times since then. And we, you know, we went to that crossroads thing and he was there and he was very kind.

1:15:14But I wouldn't, he's not somebody I'm hanging out with all the time, I guess is what I'm saying. And yet he like texted me like a week ago because he was in Portugal and he was sitting at a cafe and he struck up a conversation with a stranger and somehow like my name came up and this guy was like, oh, Rich helped me get sober through his pot or whatever. And this guy hadn't even listened to the Travis episode. So I don't even exactly know how it all came up. But then Travis texted me to just tell me that he had had that experience. Like he didn't have to do that. And I think that speaks to the kind of person that he is.

1:15:52And it's cool. Yeah, I mean, he stayed himself the whole time and navigating through all that celebrity and fame, just everything his whole life's been like pretty much being filmed. Even before when he had like Meet the Barkers and even Blink is a massive band. He's been famous for a really long time. For such a long time. I'm like, how do you do that? In a spotlight. I wouldn't want that. Oh, like a TV, like a reality show? Just all the time. Yeah, I couldn't, yeah. Your life being chronicled in that way. Yeah, just lights like this every day. Yeah, you know what I mean? Like some people can do it though.

1:16:23I mean, whatever works for people, but yeah, I just. How many episodes of the podcast have you done? Today's 249. And you're like banked through like May or something. You told me. I'm in May next year right now. But I'll move things around. People wanna like promote something, but mostly my stuff is conversation, nothing really promoting. Yeah, I bank them and I gotta chill on that. And you just wanna keep it the way that it is? Do you wanna like, what's your, do you have an ambition for it or you just enjoy it? I filmed one before, I just didn't like it. Yeah, you don't film yours, yeah. I like the audio, I like it.

1:16:55People are comfortable in my house and not being filmed. There's no really lights and they like enjoy it. And I get, I feel like me personally, I'll get a good conversation just like that. And like my dog farting on them or Max coming in or getting them a drink or taking a bathroom break, which we do. Right. It's just like - You could do that here. That's true, yeah. You would take breaks during the podcast. You need to go to the bathroom? No, I'm good. You can go. But I'm saying, but yeah, I love, it's working for me. I'm happy with it. It works for me. I love it. I enjoy it. Don't fix waiting broke, you know?

1:17:22Right. You've got a liquid death in front of you. And I know that you do like some brand work for them. Like you've been like an ambassador for that brand. I was saying this a while ago, man, I remember. I know. And we were like at a Superbowl party and they had their big Super Bowl ad and you were so excited. Like that company went from zero to a hundred, like so fast. These people are like marketing geniuses because it's basically water and it's great. Mike Cesario, man. Oof. Yeah, unbelievable. What I didn't know until this morning was this thing that they did where artists like yourself and a bunch of others created music and songs out of their bad reviews.

1:18:04Yeah, I'm in there. And there's like a music video. They took all bad comments and make songs. And they like use them as lyrics in a song, right? Yes. What is the backstory? Like that's a brilliant move. And the music video is like Puritan, like Scarlet Letter, like women dressed up as like colonial Puritans, like reading, like basically singing about how, you know, this brand is evil. So some negative stuff written about them. They did like a punk one. I was just on the 80s one, and me and I had Chappelle on there, Chris Cole, Mark McGrath, Tony Canale. They got a whole bunch of people on this new record that came out.

1:18:42And basically, yeah, they're making catchy-ass songs from negative comments. They thrive on that shit, dude. It's pretty funny. It's like a water brand with like 2 million followers. It's crazy how they're doing it. Like, latest drop that MeUndies collab. It's like the biggest collab MeUndies have done, supposedly. MeUndies Liquid Death collab. It's really good too. It looks good, yeah. Yeah, it's like, what can't they do? Only in like the podcast world, you know what I mean? But it's like, what can't they do? They're doing every call, it's crazy, dude. Like every week something else comes out, I'm like, oh, I need to get that.

1:19:11It's cool stuff they're doing. Yeah, I mean, owner's great. The company's great. I'm an ambassador. Yeah, they do my pod and - That's cool. Yeah, it's a great brand. They're really killing it, man. It's just water in a can. People just freak out about it. People hate on it too, so bad too. I don't care, it's just to get some water, you know? Marketing, dude. Marketing's everything, man. It's a marketing company. In the same way that Red Bull is a marketing company, right? And Red Bull uses the money that they make from selling this beverage to fund this media empire, which is to me the interesting part of that company.

1:19:45Yeah. So it'll be interesting to see what Liquid Death does. I mean, last year they ended crazy and this year has probably ended really crazy financially. You know what I mean? They came out last year, how big it was. Like it's just everywhere. And now it's in Europe, it's everywhere. Just come out in England. It's water, man. Are you still doing the public speaking thing? Like that was a bigger part of your life. It was a big. Prior, right? Like going to high schools and stuff like that. Like, but I haven't heard you talk about that or - Cause schools, everything went to Zoom. It was really crazy for a couple of years.

1:20:15I was doing the last couple of schools, maybe 2018. And now, yeah, I loved it. I went to like 30 schools. I'd love to bring it back. I was talking about somebody the other day about it. If there's like physical schools I can go to, I'd love to do it again, yeah. But also like it's just getting me there and finances and all that stuff. What I was doing, I'd piggyback, I might go do them for free. I do it on a weekend of shows, it was kind of hard. They'll play like three shows and like try to have a voice and then go speak on a Monday. So I was kind of like separating church and state, separating H2O and speaking.

1:20:48So I could just do it, fly out there and do like a couple of schools. Do you still have the foundation though? One life, one chance? I have a nonprofit, yeah. It took a while to get that. You gotta kick that back up, man. I know, I'd love to, I'd love to do it again, actually. I feel like that would give you an energy boost. Not that you need it, you have a lot of energy. But no, I would love to do it again. It was really fun, actually really. I was talking about some of the, when are you gonna do that again? But the pandemic kind of crushed everything. And then when I was doing that, my band wasn't really doing much.

1:21:14Then we put a new record out, somebody just kept touring. So like, I'll bring it back for sure. When are you going out to tour again? What does that look like? Rest of the year, nothing. And then next year we have like one show book, but then we have a bunch of festivals in Europe, June and July. The whole festival thing in Europe. It's incredible, man. I love it. We should always go during the summer, bring Moon and Max to come. Now Max is with us obviously, but just go away for like two or three weeks and play all outdoor festivals. It's awesome. Uh-huh. And you got Chappelle into a band, right?

1:21:46Like you got him playing music. Well, he's got his own band, they're called Mad Peaceful, they're awesome. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But he had never been, like you guys became friends on social media or podcasting, right? And he's a standup comic, but loves hardcore. Loves hardcore, he changed his life as a young kid. Yeah, Black Flag. But that's a different thing from like, okay, now I'm gonna be in a band. Yeah, started a band. Actually go see him play tonight actually. And Alex is playing guitar tonight. They're playing tonight. Alex, are you in Chappelle's band? Oh, you are? I play guitar tonight.

1:22:20That's crazy, wow. Dude, they're a great band. He's a great front man. They sound awesome, the songs are great. It's like this agnostic front, black flag kind of mix I like to say about them. And he loves it. It's another way for him to like, you know, get it out. Yeah, and then your other boy, Derek. Sepultura. I never know how to say that. Sepultura? Sepultura, yeah. It's a Brazilian band, isn't it? He came in later, like when the lead singer left or something happened? Yeah, I think the first thing was in 20 years and he's been in the second 20 years, been 40 years. Kills it, amazing front man.

1:22:52Also big time plant-based dude. Yes. Who's got that show. What's it called with Tanya O 'Callaghan that they do Highway to Health, right? Yes. Is it a YouTube series? Yep, it became one. Yeah, they had it for a while. They were shopping and then end up on YouTube, which is great. And yeah, it's doing really well on there too. It's a great concept. I'm getting Tanya in here soon. Nice, you are. To do the podcast, she's great. She's awesome, dude. She's playing bass with Iron Maiden right now. I know, man. Incredible. She was playing with like a white snake. She's a striking person. When she walks into her room, people notice.

1:23:25Like super tall with the dreads and the whole thing and like, you know, just rocking the base at like the highest level of like metal. I think she was in Whitesnake too or something crazy. She was before that, yeah. And Steven Nather's band, yeah, she's amazing. She does a lot for the animals in her platform. Huge, huge like vegan plant-based animal activist person. She's cool, man. From Ireland, yeah. There's some cool people around us, man. Yeah. Cool little world. I know, so what is the coffee bunch look like these days? since I've been around, like, or the sort of lunchtime crew. Oh, they go with the crew we have?

1:23:57Yeah. So the same crew, Chappelle, Derek, Alex will pull up. We were training for a while in my garage. You gotta sign up for some kind of running race though. Cause when you came out and when we shot that video and we were running around LA and we ended up like running up that hill that gives you that vista, that view of like that was LA, we did like repeats on that. And like the head, everybody was rallying around like you making it up there, man. And I felt like that was like a breakthrough. It was a breakthrough, thank you for that. Yeah, so I've been running ever since. And I've like, I was told by Hakeem to have like different changes up different styles of running shoes.

1:24:30Always switch them out. I have five different styles that switch out, but love my arms the best. And yeah, so that was a great, great moment with you. So yeah, thank you for that. Is Hakeem still doing like the run club stuff? I'm not sure about that. Yeah. I love Hakeem. He's awesome dude. He's a great soul. I'm gonna talk a big with you. He's a great dude. So yeah, man, I wanna see that happen. Would you run with me? Are you back in the running game? If my back gets healed, I'm working on that. So maybe next year? So I've been benched, hopefully sooner than that. Well, I mean run a marathon next year.

1:25:03Oh yeah, I'd love to. I'd love to do it with you. It'd be fun. I'll do a half marathon before that. You should. I can step up my miles though. You should. I fell off a little bit. Get back on that. Keep you lean, bro. I know. You're feeling good though? Yeah, my back is getting better. I still have a little bit of ways to go, but I'm anxious to get back out there. Like I've just, it hasn't been fun. It's a whole other story. Well, you're an inspiration for everybody. And I appreciate being your friend and being here. And he inspired me to run and step up my game with a plunge, the sauna, everything.

1:25:32You, Huberman, Brolin, everybody, everybody. Yeah, it's cool. My peers. It's funny, the whole Huberman thing came together cause he's like a fan of H2O. I know, I talked with him, you called him on the FaceTime. We met right then at the moment. It was crazy. Cause he wanted to meet you and I knew you wanted to meet him. And I was like, this Alliance has to happen. That was crazy. So it's cool. Fully tatted punk rock skateboarder, like killing it. Yeah. And he blessed me with the plunge and then I blessed one to Josh in the trap. So yeah, thank you for that. That's pretty cool. Pay it forward, man.

1:26:01I love it, buddy. It's been cool to watch you kind of embrace all these lifestyle practices. That you've been doing for so long. Not really, no, man. I mean, like, you know, I haven't been plunging that much longer than you and all the sauna. I just got a sauna for the first time recently. So such a game changer, man. hooked me up with that and I'm really enjoying it. Do you do it in the morning or night? I do it like late afternoon, early evening. That's my favorite time to do it. Same. Yeah. Nighttime is kind of gnarly. Yeah. It's cold out. I do like, I could plunge in the morning and that's great.

1:26:33But like sauna in the morning, like that kind of lulls me into like - Wanna take a nap or something. Yeah, like I wanna take a rest after that. Yeah, nighttime is really great. And like doing this direct sauna and stuff. And yeah, it's just game changer, man. Cool. Well, I love you, buddy. I love you too, man. Thank you for coming here and catching me up. This is even better than last time. This is great, man. It was good. I don't remember what happened last time. It was like, I don't know. Like I do the thing and then I move on. Like, I don't know what we talked about last time. I'm curious about your hairstyle.

1:26:58What's gonna be next for you? I don't know. It's bad, right? I don't know what to do. You have great hair though. I'm growing my hair out. I'm in the in-between phase. So I just been wearing hats, but like, I don't know what to do with my hair. So I need a style consultant. What should I do? I don't know, I'll just take it back. I tried that. You did? You just keep growing, I wanna keep growing. Have you ever had long hair before? I have, yeah, I've had really long hair. I don't know if I'm gonna go all the way. If you still have it, since you have it, grow it, man, let's do it. Yeah, man. And if I ever decide to get a tattoo, you're the first person I'm gonna call.

1:27:28I got you, I'm not even doing it on your - Yeah, I have, it's a virgin canvas. Would you ever get one? Maybe, we'll see. Like a little PMA tattoo or something? Maybe, maybe, we'll talk. I got anybody you want, I got you. All right. Never too old to get for a tattoo. To be continued. All right. Thank you. Thank you. Peace. Peace.

1:27:54That's it for today. Thank you for listening. I truly hope you enjoyed the conversation. To learn more about today's guest, including links and resources related to everything discussed today, visit the episode page at richroll.com where you can find the entire podcast archive as well as podcast merch, my books, Finding Ultra, Voicing Change and The Plant Power Way as well as the Plant Power Meal Planner at meals.richroll.com. If you'd like to support the podcast, the easiest and most impactful thing you can do is to subscribe to the show on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify and on YouTube and leave a review and or comment.

1:28:39Supporting the sponsors who support the show is also important and appreciated. And sharing the show or your favorite episode with friends or on social media is of course awesome and very helpful. And finally, for podcast updates, special offers on books, the meal planner, and other subjects, please subscribe to our newsletter, which you can find on the footer of any page at richroll.com. Today's show was produced and engineered by Jason Camiolo, with additional audio engineering by Cale Curtis. The video edition of the podcast was created by Blake Curtis, with assistance by our creative director, Dan Drake.

1:29:17Portraits by Davey Greenberg, graphic and social media assets courtesy of Daniel Solis. Thank you, Georgia Whaley, for copywriting and website management. And of course, our theme music was created by Tyler Pyatt, Trapper Pyatt, and Harry Mathis. Appreciate the love, love the support. See you back here soon. Peace. Plants.

1:29:58Thank you.