EXCLUSIVE: Mrs. Prada and Raf Simons's First Joint Podcast Interview

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0:51FX's American Horror Story returns for an unrivaled 13th installment. with the iconic horrors you love to fear and an all-star cast reprising fan-favorite roles. Light your candles, draw your pentagrams, and prepare for a supreme surprise. FX's American Horror Story 13 premieres September 24th on FX and Hulu. This is The Run-Through. I'm Chloe Mal. And today I am here at Prada HQ in Milan the day after the Prada Spring-Summer 2027 show with Mrs. Prada and Mr. Simmons. We are in the beautiful headquarters in the room where the top of the slide is, which is very exciting to me who spends so much time at playgrounds.

1:45It's very thrilling headquarters to be in. So I'm very excited. Also, I can't believe that I get to speak to you both the day after the show, which was so beautiful, and everyone has been so excited about it. I feel that everyone who loves skirts is rejoicing. It's been sort of the skirt mafia has risen. And I like that you both call the skirts a Prada obsession. And I want to know how this collection started around a skirt, if it started there or if it kind of worked its way down to that. It started with the skirts or over time. No, no, no. It really started. We always start with conversation.

2:28So early in the design season, early in the design process, and we both felt like, ah, we are interested to focus on skirts. How early in the process does that happen? So this year, the very beginning? Yeah, I don't know. Yes, I remember. Somewhere. Ah, the timing and that. But is it soon after the last show? If sort of... Not so soon after the last show. So you take a minute and then it comes to start discussing. We don't start super early. Okay. Right? Actually not. Actually, we start very late. We start very late. Okay. So you start with a conversation. I loved that, Raph, you, in Nicole's review, you said that you had referenced the Charlie Rose interview you wear, Mrs.

3:17That came much later. Oh, interesting. Much, much later. First you talked about skirts and then you talked about. Yeah, and then I said like, oh, but why don't we go like all the way skirts, like every look skirt. And then she said, I love that idea. That's how it started. Yes, because since the men collection where we did only trousers, recently we are interested in approach one single garment and see what happens. so this season because we came from only one white trouser and now it was only about skirt which by chance is something that for me was always very relevant well and Raph will you tell us about the Charlie Rose interview that you found because I loved that quote.

4:03It was very late it was only a few weeks ago and it was somebody from the team who showed it to me and I thought it was really interesting. And Mrs. Prado you said that to you a skirt is like a t-shirt. Yes yes in the sense that usually in t-shirt you put your ideas and for me I put my ideas on a skirt waist down so not near the face basically and because it's where you can have all the possibility you can have all the ideas here that is not near your face so you can be free to be free. A sweater, something simple. And also, the skirt allows to compose your different selves. So feminine, masculine, sexy, severe.

4:58In that sense, I like the skirt because it needs another thing. Then it can show more complexity, the complexity that we are. It's an important building block. Also because in one dress, what you do, you are one thing. With a skirt, you can be at least two or three. Plus the shoes, plus. So if it starts with the skirt, do you start by thinking about the different versions of skirts, or you think first with entire looks together? I'm just curious how that process evolves. Very much this time, it was really approaching the skirt as an object. And then, of course, in the beginning, you think maybe we should go in a lot of different directions, but then also quite in the beginning already we said, like, interesting to work in a more kind of restricted, informed language, but then open everything up in terms of possibility and material.

5:58and so at the you know we decided early on that it wouldn't be like a train skirt and a historical skirt and a marriage skirt and a mini skirt no that would no you know because we are both specific there is also a specific kind of form language that we like at a certain point in time so that's and it's more like a tissue because a tissue is rectangular that's why we insisted on this idea of a simple shape, so you are obliged to put your idea into actually modern, a modernist shape. Because we also felt like we don't want historical, for example. How do you decide on what the set will look like?

6:41Because the set was the same or similar to the men's set. This time, for the first time, exactly, exactly the same. Because we loved it. You rebuilt it or you kept it? We kept it. Okay, good. Yeah. Sometimes we change it, sometimes we adapt it, but we really liked the show space very much this time. It's so simple, but somehow so strong. And this idea that we are with the other four men and now, they work very well there. Mrs. Prada, you wear a lot of skirts yourself. How do you think about your archive of Prada skirts? Do you wear skirts from many of your collections over the year? Do you tend to do more recent pieces?

7:24It depends. Sometimes I readjust or change a bit some. Maybe there is something I like, but maybe it's not enough or the proportion is not right, so maybe I redo them. Depends. But you don't, for example, have skirts from the 1988 collection that you're still wearing today? Yeah. Could who? Oh, that's right. I don't dedicate a lot of time to dress. Okay. I dress very quickly, mainly when I have to go to work. I'm kind of uniform. What is your uniform? Maybe one period is a pleated skirt, one period is an airline skirt, one period is something else. But it never looks to me as if it was a very fast decision, but I know what it is.

8:15Maybe I'm thinking about something or a color, so I try a piece of a color or a shape. But after I have no time to, so I put another simple stuff. But I, because very often I'm searching the next silhouette or the next color or decoration or decoration. Are there any other brands that you buy and wear or try? No, actually, I became a fashion designer because I didn't find anything to wear. Raph, do you wear? I used to wear a lot of vintage. Okay. Back then, before I was doing mine. Do you have any of those pieces that you've given to Darwin Lounge? Yes, of course. I keep it all. Wow. I have three floors.

9:04Wow. In an archive separately or at your home? In an archive separate. Wow. Do you ever look at those for inspiration when you're thinking about a collection? No, because I remember and I prefer to have the memory, even if it's not exactly actually better. Maybe I remember something for something that actually doesn't exist. that. Both of you have worked independently as designers for a long time, but this is six years that you've been together at Prada. And I am always amused reading press reviews that guess which part of the collection each of you designs. And then you've said that often it's the reverse.

9:44I'm so happy with this question because it's so often not true what you see written. So often is not true. Why do you think that is sometimes really the opposite? I don't know. I think people kind of like to place you in a box. Do you think you purposely... It's not me critiquing the people who write that, but like that's just how it goes. Probably we do that as well. But probably here people would think like all the skirts are from Uja, all the leather is from Raph, which is completely not the case, but it doesn't matter. Do you think that shows an instinct that both of you are inspired to be thinking the way the other maybe is thinking, or it's just that people are wrong about their assumptions of which sensibilities belong to each of you?

10:31I think it's much more complex than that because actually we decided to work together because we had very similar sensibilities. And so from many, many, from many points of view, we have the same ideas. Of course, each one has his way of thinking. I love that you said a while ago that you wanted someone, if you want to know someone, you want to work with them. Yes. That's the way you like to get to know someone. How did you know that you first wanted to work with Raph and get to know him that way? I don't even remember the story. It goes back a long time. They placed me on Gelsander in 2006. But did you know each other well then?

11:19No, didn't know each other at all at that time. Okay. Like. But I knew the work. Yeah. Exactly what I was going to say as well. Because for me, the important thing, when they say I will present you people, for me, it's enough to know the work. So you don't need to talk to the person. I remember. It's enough. I see what one person does. So that would count for me. Well, I remember Mr. Bertelli coming to Antwerp, sitting with us in the kitchen discussing this possibility for Jill Sandra. And it was a big surprise to me, of course. And that was quite a long time. What year was that, 2006? 2006 and for seven years.

12:07So he asked to travel to Milan to see me. And I didn't really understand because I was like, what could that possibly be? you know like Mujia is full on on both brands like I didn't really understand but because we knew each other and in the meantime we had also seen each other a few more times dancing in Tokyo I remember after a Mio Mio show tell me about this well that was a Mio Mio show where coincidentally me and my CEO we were in Tokyo and then we were invited and then we were at the party and then when Mr. Bertelli and I had the meeting because it was here in Milan this is now after Calvin in the first meeting was very like, oh, we want to just discuss possibilities.

12:52We have to think about our future. But I still didn't really, I was like, hmm. And I think that I said to him, I said like, would you be interested to do it together? And that you then said, oh, that's something I find interesting. Yes, but no, but before it was like, I kind of felt that we had to do something new to renovate something. And we thought, why don't, he doesn't do the man and they do the woman. And after he said, let's do both together. And they said, yes, finish. Which is amazing because no one has really, I can't think of anyone who's done something similar. I was trying to think of examples.

13:28Total out of, not coincident instinct, not a decision thought in the rooms of the power, let's say so. And actually I can recommend it. I feel like that's sort of how Anna and I am at the moment. I can recommend it. I think it's really interesting. We both think so. Yes, because you can't confront. You can't confront. You can't reach. Probably I said I'm bored of myself. I want to enrich myself to have a dialogue. Yeah. But also because I think that the responsibility that you have in a fashion environment that completely changed from 20 years ago feels so different when you can do it with somebody who you respect so much, who you admire so much, vice versa.

14:19I think it's a really, really, really big difference than taking on a big brand alone or being in charge on a big brand alone. Yeah. Because a designer is so much more than just a designer now, which you've talked about. It comes with so much more. So to be able to share that is huge. Yeah. It kind of also gives, besides that what we originally intended, I think, that it's for what Mirja just said, I feel very comfortable if I am, for example, for X amount of days not here because I know she's here. And it's the same for her. Even if you have, of course, incredible people that work with you, still different, I think.

15:02Yes, definitely. Mrs. Prado, you've explained that Olivier Rizzo, who you've worked with for a long time, the stylist, that you would be talking about ideas before a show. And he said, oh, no, we can't do that. Raph's already done that. Yes. It's true. How do your ideas overlap now? Do you often share the same ideas? Do you often come from different perspectives and then somehow they integrate? I don't think we often come from different perspectives because it starts usually in a very kind of loose conversation. It's not like, oh my God, we have to do a collection. What should we do? It's just like, what do you feel?

15:45What do I feel? Yeah, I also, it's more that. Maybe we start trying stuff and see, this makes sense. And then are you drawing? Are you just pulling in fabrics? Okay. Me, I'm not even able to do a house. And me, I'm not able to draw silhouettes because I was trained as an industrial designer. So I could draw this thing here, but not a human. It's too ridiculous to look at them if I would try. But also, I think, you know, like it's been so many years we work with teams that automatically. Right. And actually, we don't really work so much with drawing either. But it's really, I mean, I've never been in a place where it's so much about...

16:28Or in theory, or something that we try on and we assemble. Yeah. I hope I can speak for you. We are both not the kind of people who would go and sit on a desk, think, what should I do, and then start drawing or something. It's not how we operate. You can have an idea and exchange what you think. Yeah. This collection, for example, if you're starting with... You say, I'm starting with the skirt. How do you decide what that first silhouette is going to be? If you're not drawing it, are you speaking it through with a team of designers and cutting it? Yes, absolutely. Immediately? We tell what we want.

17:04Okay. On this one, I think we can be clear. It was what you just said. It has to be that kind of shape. And I didn't know why. And after I understood why, because it became conceptual. Like a painting. You have to stay in that frame. so it obliges you to theorize the concept. Those are the moments where it comes to these respect moments. Like if I was to be, for example, floor length, train, whatever, and she doesn't feel that at all, I'm completely at ease with that because it also happened already the other way around. It's like we said it since the beginning. Sometimes I say something, he'd say, shit.

17:53What's a recent example of a thing one of you has hated? It happens hundreds of times during a show that you say, no, no, no, yes, yes, yes. Yeah, of course. Raph, your background began in menswear, but obviously you then went to do womenswear at many places. And Mrs. Prada, you focused much of your career on designing for women, but how do you approach... No, sincerely not. Also men. Well, but I was going to say, how do you approach designing your men's collection? And Raph, how do you find designing women's different? Not. It's not? No. The sensibility is the same for the two? Sometimes I thought, but not anymore now, but back in the days I thought sometimes men are a little bit more difficult.

18:37That's interesting. More restricted in types of garments that you are allowed. I mean, you can of course do also dresses and skirts, of course, but like, it's still, you better make sure you make good pants. Yeah. You know, like, hopefully in women you can do a shower that is good without pants. Yeah. Here we go. As we saw yesterday. Hopefully. And me, I always thought that to find new ideas, I had always to think about women. So which kind of detail or silhouette or thing to renew the man, I started always by women. But because as I imagine myself a 15 years old girl, I imagine myself a boy. I imagine myself everything I want.

19:29Were you surprised by the reaction to the skinny jeans that you showed at the men's collection? I feel it was all anyone talked about for several days. I tend to be sensitive to reactions the first two, three days. And then after, I also kind of forget about it, I think. It's very strange. No, me too. But I think that's how... If I had bad review, I am set for three days, but after it goes away. It's the... Two days and a half. Yeah, it's deep. We talked already a little bit about it earlier on. Today, things are... I think people can be really, really harsh online. It's not so much the present reviewers.

20:08It can be hard. And sometimes we think, just don't go there. But, you know, we are humans. We are sensitive. It's so hard not to. This is our creative outcome. I don't because I'm not able. Yeah, you just don't look. You don't look? No. And any reviews? Reviews, yes. But nothing. I don't have a comment on the internet, except I receive the press release in the morning where they say, they tell me what's going on. I'm interested to know what's going on. Yeah, we both. But actually, because technically I'm not able to use that. We both think reactions from the outer world are crucial and essential.

20:49It's important. I mean, like, why would we bring things out if we would not welcome reaction? And also have no problem if people don't like it. But I think it's also not counting only for us. It's in general, if I look at the landscape, I think that there is now a lot of hearts. Not social media. That's why they are forbidden to children. Because it can really affect you. I am not on social media, so I don't know. I was so amazed by the new store. I went on a full tour yesterday. I did the Underground Passage, which reminded me of Harry Potter. I wonder, this was the oldest Prada store, but now it's obviously the newest as well.

21:31Do you have memories of going there as a child? And is there anything that you wanted to? No, because until my grandfather was alive, we were not allowed. Oh, wow. Why not? Not my mother. No, no. Wow. Probably he was conservative. What was important? I didn't know. But you don't know why. I didn't know that you were not allowed. I never asked. Your mother didn't? I was not. No, neither. I had everything else in mind. They couldn't care less about this part. What was important to you when you were designing? I loved the exhibition space and the twirling skirts and everything that's happening there.

22:10Actually, they told me that I had to do it because it was my history. And my son told me, this is up, you have to do it. So do the effort, you have to do it. And I realized that actually it was Galleria. It was my story. I had to do it. And that's Yone Prada, founded in 1993, is another big aspect of your work. I remember when you referred to it as a third of your life, you dedicated to the foundation and art. How much mental energy do you put into that? And how does it bleed into your inspiration for your work? Following this last Prada sphere, I always wanted to keep the field of interest separate, mainly art, because I didn't want people thinking that I was using art for commercial reasons.

23:00So I was really drastic at the beginning in keeping them separate, but they were never in my mind. So now that I had to do the Prada sphere in Milano, I decided that I wanted to put everything together because Prada is what it is because it was about sport, it was about art, it was about architecture, cinema. So my mind was always present together and I decided that at this stage of my life I should tell the truth. And of course I had always had a political interest, So the Fondazione was a way of dealing with other subjects and fashion. What do you enjoy most about working with the Fondazione?

23:51I'm just interested in what's happening in the world. And so I want to try to touch subjects that make sense now. So art more as a place of ideas, and which are the ideas that are current relevant today. So it's less about art, art, but more about ideas on the back of it. Yeah. You both are art collectors and lovers. Do you ever go to exhibitions together? No. No. Do you gravitate towards different types of art? Are your collections have any overlaps? Yeah, there was overlap. Yes, absolutely. But obviously they have started collecting way earlier than me, so there is a difference as well in a bit of a generational shift.

24:44I always say, for instance, my husband and also him, they are much lower of art than myself. Okay. My husband really likes art and he really likes art. For me, art is a way of thinking about ideas. Do contemporary artists ever influence what you're thinking about for collections or it feels separate? I cannot separate it because it's always everyday in my system. But it's only occasionally and when it feels naturally from both parties that I, in the past, really connected to do something together within the body of work, which is defined as fashion. I never went to an artist that I didn't know or that I didn't already, where I was not already close with.

25:33I have to say, walking through the protosphere last night in the new store, I felt so much about how rich your archive is now. And everyone is so fascinated by clothing from the 90s and 2000s. You've brought back prints and styles before, but I wonder how you both think about self-reference and looking back to the archive and using it today. What is the value of that and what is the risk of doing that? For my brand that I stopped now, I have been just always bringing it to the archive, not really archiving it. I am now since one and a half years in the process of archiving it with a team. and it is it's kind of confronting actually because you hear so often from outside people talking about it oh and this and on that and then there was also secondary market and yeah and i travel at least once a year to tokyo and it's it's big thing for my own brand and and and it's kind of emotional i have to say for me interesting but it's maybe also because i always kind of stayed away from it because our company was so small that we never really got it organized so it was always about moving on next next future future so it was just like to bring it there but now we are going back we literally started archiving it from day one 1995 wow yeah do you have ever feel emotional when you are looking at your archives in that same way i want to say something different.

27:10I think that in this moment in history, people are very interested in the past. Probably because the present, the future is so scary and such a drop and no one knows what's going to happen. So no one is able to envision a future. And so it's good in any field. I see it happening in another field to see, to look at the past. And also because there is, I remember in the 70s, future, future, future, even in the food, spaghetti, what are spaghettis? So just new. And now people are scared and wanting to hold. You have to be bound to something, otherwise you are lost. and it's mainly young kids seems that everything they want is just vintage.

28:11So it's a moment when the past has a big relevance. It's not a question of being conservative, of repeating. It's an instinct of surviving, probably. Also because no one can imagine rightly the future because we are in front, we are in the middle of the biggest change in history, industrial revolution, no way, between artificial intelligence and global communication. Who really knows? Because everything is kind of collapsing. And actually, talking about artificial intelligence, it's very important that people take care, otherwise the other takes care of us. So, in that sense, you search safeness in your past.

29:02I completely agree. I used to really, really be very vocal about I'm not so interested in the past. I used to always say the future is romantic to me, so I'm going to focus on the future. The past is just, you know, like… Yes, very much. if you'll receive that. That's, I guess, why we just, when we had something done, it was already the past for us. Like, we just put it there. And kind of changing now, because for all the reasons that you just said, it's many things. Artificial intelligence, politics, climate. Like, I find myself, for example, like really, really calming and inspired going to small places like the village where I came from seeing my dad, and only sometimes the overload of information, which could be cities or online, and that's paired with the possible dangers that are growing.

30:06It's too much for persons, you know, so. But also I think that is a trend, just a fashion trend. There are periods that I remember myself dressing vintage for two or three years. And I think besides everything, it's also a trend. Also because probably somebody would tell that new stuff is so expensive that people like vintage because it costs less. Altogether, it's kind of trendy. It's also interesting, especially, I mean, a year ago, there were 15 new creative directors at historic fashion houses, And it was so fascinating to see how each of them looked to the past of the brand, how Mathieu was looking at Coco Chanel and looking at all of the archives.

30:54And it felt like a real distinction to be able to imbue your own sensibility and also keep the heritage of the house. And I wonder, Raf, do you ever feel like you are interpreting Mrs. Prada, but with Mrs. Prada? She is the real modernist in any case. Yes, I think. I think I have to absolutely give a confirmation answer here. But it was also... Because anytime I try to suggest stuff that I know already he will hate. What makes this very different is that I have operated under my own label, just like Nuchess operating or has been operating for many, many, many years on her own label. And besides that, I have been doing both together.