Jean Smart Talks The Bittersweet End of Hacks | PLUS Charli XCX's First British Vogue Cover

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1:04This is The Run Through. I'm Chomanadi, and today I'm here with my colleague Rudika Seth. Would you like to introduce yourself? Yes, I'm Rudika. I'm the film and culture editor at British Folk You know, I always look forward to our conversations Me too Because you are literally the guide for all things film and culture So thank you for coming on today Thank you for having me back So I guess we have a lot coming up on the show today HBO's comedy Hacks is back for its fifth and final season And Jean Smart stopped by to talk to Chloe But first, before we hear from Jean We have to start with our big news Our May cover drops today which is great so exciting yeah super exciting it's Charlie X the first British Vogue cover which I'm so excited for I think we've been thinking about doing her for a long time and we wanted to wait until she just had the right moment and she's actually recording her first rock album so she's going in a completely different direction it's like the end of Bratz yeah so she's stepping into a whole new era and we had Laura Snape do the interview She did our Ray interview, which was really great.

2:13So she's a real music nerd and journalist and was really got into it on the creative process, which I thought was really great. And Raph Pavarotti, who's shot several times for us, did the cover, which I think looks gorgeous and really nods to that glam rock history with that wonderful blue eye makeup. and Kate Phelan, long-time contributing Vogue editor, styled it. And I think she just looks like a really, the best version of herself. And we were talking about the blue eyeshadow a lot in The Office as well because we were like, is this back? Because I feel like it's such a great look, isn't it?

2:51It's such a great look. And what was your favourite takeaway from the interview? I think for me, it's always lovely to hear how kind of intentional she is about everything and that for her, like, her life is art. Yeah. And art is life. There's no separation for her. Everything she does is kind of an expression of who she is in an artistic statement. And she talked, we did a video, a fun video with her at some of her favorite vintage dolls. And she talked about wearing her wedding dress, like, off into the world the next day or on stage. Oh, really? Yeah, like, she just kind of walking out of the house is a moment for her.

3:31Yeah. and that's what kind of I love about I love about her and I love about rock stars and kind of musicians in general is that they just it's a lifestyle they live it they live it and breathe it it's not like they're wearing a character and they kind of it's a persona it's a persona it's who they are and so that was one of the favorite things about the story for me I love it I'm so happy it's coming out me too me too big exciting day and I know you've been you've been busy catching up with Elle Fanning and Michelle Pfeiffer, which is really exciting. What a combo. So that's for the new Apple TV Muggles Got Money Troubles show.

4:09That's right. Yeah. And I didn't know how long they've been friends. Do you like it's kind of crazy. How do they meet? They're really close friends. So they actually it's really funny. They met on Elle's first ever film. I Am Sam in 2001. Elle was. How was she? Three years old. Oh my God. I can't believe she's literally grown up in the spotlight. And she's so like functioning. So they've been best friends since she was three? I think they like played Barbies together on the set when Elle was three and Michelle was in that film. And then now like they've stayed friends. I think they were in Maleficent two together.

4:38And now this is their like third big project. And they're playing mother and daughter. What's it like interviewing them? Do they have that rapport? Do they seem really like? Just totally like joined at the hip, like finishing each other's sentences, like giggling, like whispering off camera, like really, really cute together, which is so nice. Yes. And like, what's in Michelle? I feel like I've not seen her around in as many projects for a while. So it's just so fun to have her back. Like she's always been amazing. But this is like a really fun part for her. Oh, cool. I can't wait to see it. Have you read the book, Margot's Got Money Troubles?

5:07No, it sounds like a book that might trigger me. But yeah, I'm happy to. Money Troubles? But is it good? Yes. And it's famous? Yeah. So I actually haven't read the book either. So the show is my first introduction to it. But it's basically about this character who has kind of an affair with her English professor, has a baby, and then she loses her job. And she's like, how do I make money? And the answer is OnlyFans. Oh, so this book is recent. Yes, it's 2024. Okay. And it's basically so then she goes down this like rabbit hole. And it's all very like surreal, very creative, very imaginative OnlyFans content that she's creating.

5:43I know. So it's really just surreal and fun. And Michelle plays her Elle's mum in the show. And it's really fun and it's like the sort of OnlyFans like surreal looks are all like her like dressed as an alien with like green or blue skin and like crazy outfits. And I think it's a proper like new perspective on OnlyFans. So I think it's like a proper challenging your perceptions of it in a way that I thought was really fun. Yeah, I can't say I've seen many depictions of it in films or kind of never gets a proper. Do you feel like it's having a moment now though? Because I feel like euphoria is also.

6:17Right. Well, I was going to talk about that because I am the biggest Euphoria fan, but I missed this. Yes, I am. So I'm very excited for this new season. And there was somewhat of a preview at the Balenciaga show in Paris because Pierre Paolo is very good friends with Sam Levinson, who is the creator of the show. And they collaborated on this kind of immersive backdrop for the show. so that was kind of a sneak peek but I haven't seen it yet and so I need to know because I think you've seen you've seen quite you've seen three episodes I've seen the first three episodes and and I'm just so happy it's back can I say first of all because I'm also like you I'm such a big Euphoria fan I think it's so brilliant at its best it's just really really amazing the first episode I really enjoyed the second and third I think were a little bit slower so I'm just curious to see where the rest of the season goes but I'm also excited for episode three to be out because I think it's the wedding episode.

7:17So it's Cassie and Nate, Sydney Sweeney and Jacob Lordy getting married. Yeah, which is kind of goes exactly how maybe you would think that it would. We're talking a lot about it in the office because it's also a moment for very sexy wedding guest dressing. So Alexa Demme and Hunter Schafer go like really all out sexy for this wedding. And I'm just like, how sexy can you dress at a wedding? It's a proper like argument in the office, which is really fun. This is a story that I want to read. Right. Because I'm just like, everyone disagrees. Yeah, because it feels like not the moment to be uber sexy.

7:52I don't know. But is it fun? I don't know. Maybe it's fun. I think if it's a nighttime wedding and it's a bit more, it just depends on the location, right? Yeah. It's all about context. And like setting. Yeah, exactly. I agree with you. Because I've seen some, there was a kind of a very fun downtown New York wedding. I think they all went to Mexico and I felt like it was all very much skin naked dressing. I love it. And I was quite like, oh, I wouldn't. But I'm generally not the person who's going to wear a naked dress anyway. Fair enough. But I was quite surprised to see how naked it was for a wedding.

8:26But maybe that's the thing now. Maybe, and I hope this summer we see a lot more naked dressing at weddings. Well, yeah, I think we're going to see some naked dressing at the Met, given the theme. Oh my God, yeah. This is all about the body and art in the body. But yeah, I'm excited for you to see Euphoria. I think it's fun. I'm glad it's back. Excited to see where the rest of the season takes us. But also Zendaya is so good. She just keeps getting better and better. The most amazing year as well. Like the Odyssey, like June coming up. What are you most excited for? What next Zendaya moment? How does she even have the time?

9:03I just don't know. I don't know. It's just so many things. I think the Odyssey I'm very curious about because I feel like I don't know how big her part is in that. But I think that's like quite a different kind of, I'm looking up and I think Zendaya's playing Athena, the goddess of wisdom. Wow. That's pretty much a fun. So I feel like that I'm very excited about for sure. And then we've got Cannes coming up, which I always love hearing your reviews. But is there any gossip coming out of Cannes now? Anything that you're looking forward to already? Yes. Well, something's just happened that I need to discuss with you.

9:33And it's literally just happened before we've recorded this. Breaking news, guys. Well, so we heard that the new season of White Lotus would include something in Cannes. But now it's just been confirmed that it will be set during the Cannes Film Festival over that week. Wow. The next season. And they're filming it when I'm going to be there. That is so meta. I know. And I think there's going to be two hotels, but one of them is the Hotel Martinez, which is one of the big Cannes hotels. And what's it like? It's very glitzy. I stayed there my first time ever that I went to Cannes. It was like the most insane way to start.

10:03Like it was impossible. Basically like the lifts are teeny tiny. So you have to queue for ages and you get in and then you're like face to face with like Andrea Jolie. But like no one can speak to anyone. And everyone's like just like awkwardly trying to squeeze in while you go up. And then if you take the stairs, you can't go up because every level has a different influencer doing a photo shoot. So it's that kind of place. And that's where they're filming it. It's going to be nuts. How are they going to do it? Because also the Martinez is booked out for the entirety of Cannes. So I'm like, have they booked out that hotel?

10:33and where are the celebrities going to stay? Like, what's going to happen? This is so nuts. I don't understand why they would do that. What do you think the thinking is behind that? I really don't know. I guess maybe they want like a different kind of vibe because I guess they've had another European season before because it was in Sicily. I feel there's a lot of speculation this time about would it be a new continent? Will it be like a completely new location? So maybe this is like a differentiation thing. Do we know much about the cast yet? Yes. So Helena Bonham Carter, who I love, Heather Graham, Rosie Perez, Kamel Lundiani Chris Messina Steve Coogan Vincent Cassell Steve Coogan I know Oh my god I cannot wait I love White Lotus with a passion You do right Yeah it's like one of the shows that I just hold on to is like Euphoria Yeah The ones that I really stuck with Euphoria, Succession and White Lotus like forever Yeah And then Sex and the City before that This is perfect All the HBO classics HBO classics I'm so loyal I mean this week as far as fashion there were a couple of big moments Christopher John Rogers really beloved American designer has a collab with Old Navy which I think is really smart and I'm excited for that and their WNBA draft everybody's talking about how much fashion there was and I think we've been talking about how fashion and sport have just become completely embedded with each other so I mean I think when I started years ago at Vogue.com.

12:04I don't think we were doing, we weren't doing slide shows of all the best red carpet looks from the WNBA draft, but now we are. I mean, there's just... It's so cool that you are. I know. I know. It's so cool, isn't it? These are all new players. And honestly, like it's so impressive to see so many kick off their career with so much style and have such a signature personal style off you know from the jump and taking so many risks it's fun to see people having fun with it yeah people having fun with it and not be like i'm here seriously as a sports person exactly exactly and and i think it should feel like that you know we want we want to know what their personalities are we want to get to know them and this knowing what they're like off duty is such a big part of that we'll be back in a moment with gene smart on the latest episode of hacks but before we go it was coachella this past weekend or that did come through my feed too and our friends at american vogue and teen vogue were on the ground and have sent us this audio dispatch from the festival i'm christian malaire vogue's senior fashion writer and these are my coachella highlights so night one was sabrina carpenter as the headliner and her set was giving hollywood to the extreme all of her looks were custom dior by jonathan Anderson, so bringing some high fashion to the Coachella stage.

13:28She had such a big budget for the set. She really understood the assignment.

13:39The next day, Justin Bieber was sort of the show everyone was waiting for. I love that he took us down memory lane with his YouTube section, where he was basically pulling up old videos and singing along to them. Okay, okay, okay. Y 'all still with me, all right. He wore this custom Skylar hoodie that he designed. These really cool Lou Dan shorts, which are now sold out. I loved his look. I also really loved seeing how people were styling their artist merch. Taking their favorite artist tees and then pairing it with designer jeans or like this really cool crochet skirt or DIYing it. or studying it.

14:23Like, that was really fun to see the merch becoming the fashion accessory of Coachella. Overall, it was a fun Coachella weekend, and those were my highlights. Bye. Hey, Vogue. It's Jillian, the social lead of Teen Vogue. My favorite performance of the weekend was Hands Down Cat's Eye on day one. They were Teen Vogue cover stars last year, so to see them in person truly felt so full circle. And they also brought out Huntrix from K-pop Demon Hunters. Just seeing them perform Golden together actually made me a little bit emotional. In terms of standout fashion moments, accessories I do think truly were king.

15:02I felt like belts and headscarves, especially with maximalist patterns, were just everywhere. So maybe you'll be seeing me wearing those more. Who knows? That's it for me. Signing off. See you back in New York. Hi, Vogue. It's Emily, director of video at Teen Vogue, and Mee-Anne, creative editorial director at Teen Vogue, with a dispatch from Coachella Weekend One. My favorite show this weekend was definitely Fujikaze. He's one of my favorite J-pop artists. He did a great show and had an amazing crowd. Personally, I loved OK Lou. I saw her perform at Knockdown Center in New York, but this performance was just next level.

15:42Everyone tries to put on a major look. It's very Peacock City, but I loved seeing everyone's outfits, to be honest. It's like the best part. Anyway, signing off. Are you guys having fun?

15:59It's so fun to hear our friends at Coachella. It brings back memories of when I did used to go. I was going to say, have you been before Coachella? I went for my 20th birthday when Prince performed. Oh my God, that was so amazing. It was one of the most amazing nights of my life. Wow. The run-through will be back with Jean Smart.

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18:24Jean, I'm so excited to have you here. This is such a treat for us. The Vogue team are huge Hacks fans. So this has been a long time in the pipeline. We're very excited. I want to know about planning your premiere looks because I loved the silver suit that you wore. I just, I trust my stylist and he always gives me some choices and I think he's amazing and he knows things I like and things I don't like or things that look better on me than others. And so I like things that fit me under the bust because it's kind of the only curve on my body, you know. So, you know, and then, of course, a little something around the hips is good because I don't really have any hips.

19:13Okay. You know. Also, when I was telling my mother that, wow, we were speaking today, she's actually coming in later today. We're doing a Mother's Day episode. Oh, how nice. Please give her my best. I will. But she was remembering that on the set of Sweet Home Alabama, she said, Jean, you have such a great figure. And you said, unfortunately, this business only cares about the neck up. Oh, well, movies, yeah. On stage, it occasionally helps. But, you know. So has that – have you found that the industry is more forgiving as you get to a certain age? I know that she feels like once she sort of got past 60, it was like, okay, well, now you're just going to be past 60.

19:54There's something almost liberating about being like, oh, okay, you're in this category now. No, it's true. And I've been thinking about that since Hacks has ended that there's a part of me that thinks, okay, now can I just play, you know, fat old ladies with gray hair? It would be such a relief because, of course, Deborah was the antithesis of that. But she would say that women who didn't color their hair and didn't wear heels and tight clothes and things were quitters. Well, and I remember I listened to a Terry Gross interview you did, and you were saying that part of you wondered if playing roles where you had no vanity and you really let your hair go gray and be rough, that that affected the way casting agents thought about you for future roles.

20:48Do you think that that was the case? I'm not sure. I mean, I think people have sort of always mistakenly thought that if you were doing dramatic roles and without makeup, that that meant you were a better actor, which I don't buy into at all. Yeah, I think I've always been somewhere between character actress and leading lady. So I think there was a lot of time where casting directors weren't sure what to do with me. and I think it was easy for them to hire people who fit into certain categories, clearly. But I was from the theater, so I had always done every different kind of role and different styles of theater in different periods.

21:30And to me, that's what you do when you're an actor. Would you ever do theater again? And what would be the dream? In fact, I did a one-woman show on Broadway last summer, and that was a really, really satisfying experience, really great. I mean, I had to do a lot of it with a broken leg, unfortunately. Oh, my God. Other than that, other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, did you enjoy the show? But, no, and I'm hoping to do it possibly in L.A. maybe this year or next. Are there any classic plays that you've always had a hankering for? Oh, gosh. No, on my bucket list is definitely to do a Noel Coward on Broadway.

22:08Okay. Yeah, that's on my bucket list. From your lips to Apple Music's ears. Yes. I did love the EGOT storyline in this season of Hacks. And you have seven Emmys, which is fantastic. I want to know how you lost one of your Emmys. Oh, well, misplaced. Okay. Temporarily misplaced. I don't want people to think that I'm frivolous and that I don't respect them. I do. Where do you keep your Emmys? They're in my office. On a high shelf? On top of a cabinet, yeah. Okay. Have you moved them around? Have they been sort of gone with you? Well, I moved a couple years ago, so I still sort of feel like I'm unpacking.

22:48Okay. Because I've been too busy to completely move in. I know. I was very impressed. My mom's house in the Palisades burned down in the fires. No. It was very sad. Oh, I'm so sorry. She's fine, and we're all just a very lucky person. But her Emmy's burned, obviously. Oh, no. But they replaced them so quickly. Oh, they did? And it was so lovely. Oh, how nice. And so now she has them in New York, which is nice because they were always in L.A. Well, maybe I should tell them I— Burned them down? One of them, yes. Was swept away in a rain or something. You have to find your seventh one. We're recording this on a Wednesday, but this comes out on Thursday.

23:30The second episode of Hacks this season will come out when this show airs. The whole episode takes place in New York City. I love the beginning where it's set to back in the New York groove. I want to know what it was like filming in New York. Was that the first time the show had filmed in New York? Yes. Oh, it was great fun. It was beautiful here. And we, you know, people would drive by and wave. Hey, hi, we love hacks. So that was really fun. That was nice. And, you know, there's nothing like being in New York. And then we did Charlemagne Tha God, his show. Oh, wow. And we did The View in character, you know.

24:10Yeah. So, yeah, no, it was great fun being here. And without spoiling anything, I did love Debra's attempts to bribe people in that episode. Oh. Very impressive with her, impressed by her ingenuity. And I want to know when the last time you bribed someone was. It was probably one of my children, but I don't remember. Well, I was going to say, I bribed my children last night. I think bribery is actually called for sometimes in parenting. Oh, my God. I mean, certain gentle parenting specialists say that you can't bribe people. I don't know how I would get through a weekend without it. I mean, have you ever done anything at Madison Square Garden performance-wise?

24:50No. But that was, I mean, I was impressed. Debra wanted to take that on. It's a big, big venue. I guess to comedians, that's like winning the Tony or the Oscar. The Holy Grail. That's their egot. Yeah. Although I thought it would be funny. Unfortunately, it wasn't going to work because Debra says that she already has a Tony for one of the Monty Python shows because she slept with one of them.

25:20So she got a Tony. But I thought it would be funny if she just gave up and just went for an ego. That's very funny. But it wasn't going to work. She already had the T.

25:33I'm sure everyone asks you this, but I'm curious where you and Debra overlap and if you feel more like Debra after playing her for five years or less like her. Oh, I definitely think I feel more like her, definitely. Or she feels more like me. Maybe I should say that. No, I mean, we look a lot alike, you know, so that she's a little taller than me. Just a little. I definitely share a sense of humor. It's kind of sarcastic. The things I don't identify with are—and I love her house. Love her house, especially that kitchen. But I don't identify with her anger and her bitterness and her distrust. she's let those things that happen to her just kind of consume her and really but actually really fuel her yeah actually not consume her that's sort of been her fuel for many many many years and I think she starts to learn to give that up this season any parenting overlap oh god I hope not oh lord I watched that christening scene and I was like Thank God I didn't do a christening because this could absolutely be Candace.