Two Top Wedding Planners Share Trade Secrets

26:51So I don't know. And I think, you know, there's nothing wrong with asking your friends before you decide on the date. You know, the people that you really want there. Yes. Rather than sending it out and hearing that the people you want there can't come or don't want to. I mean, I do find anecdotally some people will pick a destination for a wedding thinking people will say no, but then everyone comes. Everyone happens every time. Do you agree? Yes. I'm like, don't do it because they're all going to come and you're going to be sorry. I know. What's the craziest location you've ever planned a wedding?

27:21Even in California at some of these private homes, I have to say, they can be so difficult to load into and logistically challenging. It's not always, you know, St. Barts or having to deal with flights. Sometimes it's for completely different reasons. I would say Montenegro. Montenegro was really tough. What was hard about it? Getting anything there. Okay. And I always say I still have table linens that I bought that are in Romania somewhere. I was like, it's the wedding version of Chopped where they hand you a box of stuff. Here's what came through customs. A candlestick, three, like, you know, napkins, and one of your programs.

28:02Go. That's insane. Yeah, that was rough. But anything overseas is definitely tricky, especially with the tariffs now. Yeah, how has that affected things? Terribly, of course. Yeah, it's arbitrary. I mean, you ship things to Italy, for example, even from—well, if you ship things from England, which is not in the EU, to Italy, you know, hello, education. They're like, we don't know what the taxes are going to be. And they'll look at it and go, ah,$8 million, right? So you don't know what to tell the client. Everything has just gotten really expensive. Even flights for us right now, I don't know if you're having this experience, but our staff travel budget has changed so dramatically for a wedding we're doing in France.

28:44and it takes away from a lot of the creative fun things that you can do. Right. There's only one pot of money. It's not like, here's for travel and here's for your staff. I know. Just spend more. It's not always like that. And we're shipping in welcome bags for a wedding that's actually this weekend. Oh, I'm sorry. You look so well. Thank you. From India and, I don't know, we're spending so much more on shipping than I thought and taxes, and it's not fun. I know my best friend and her husband haven't been to France in a long time. I mean, they live in San Miguel now, and Bruce used to live in France, and they wanted to go.

29:19So I said, let me give you the miles, you know, so you can go first class, business class, whatever. It was two million miles. Oh, my God. I was like, whoa, that was a hell of a present I gave you. So everything, it's getting to rely on miles. I am curious what it's like booking a headliner for a wedding because you had Snoop Dogg perform in Dubrovnik. Wow, you are amazing. How does that process begin? Are you reaching out to people? Are the bride and groom reaching out to people? We wouldn't let them do that. Are you kidding? We'd never get a headliner. Well, I mean, for example, we had a birthday party last night.

29:56I mean, we did it for one of my long-term clients, wonderful person. We had James Taylor. And the way the process of getting a headliner, by the way, and I'm sure Melissa and others, is not at all what you would imagine. You have to make an offer. You call up, and they'll say, make an offer. So you call the agent, they'll say, make an offer and we will get back to you. So it's like pin the tail on the price. If you say, you know,$500 ,000, they'll go, ha, ha, ha, don't even consider. I was like, can you give me a window? You know, a window. No, and you just keep going back. And some people like James Taylor is absolutely lovely and delicious to work with and fantastic.

30:34And there are other times you're like, wow, I don't know. We just spent, you know, a zillion dollars and I'm not sure anybody got it. Right. What's the craziest rider you've ever gotten? I'm working on one now, and I can't say who it is. Give us a specific of what's in it. What's in it, interestingly enough, is— Nerds gummy clusters? Are very, very specific details on what the entourage or crew can and will eat. Well, that's nice. It is nice. I appreciate that. Yeah, agreed. That's nice. Considering I never feed my staff. They don't need any more anyways. Just like shoving a roll in your pocket.

31:12Exactly. Whenever you have a moment. My experience has been a little bit different, but it is a dance. It's a weird dance of back and forth. I try to get a baseline from the agent just so that you know what ballpark you're working in. And craziest rider, I mean, sometimes it's the amount of people that they need to bring in, especially if you're working in a different country. It's fast travel, et cetera, private. Yes. Oh, my gosh. And if you're working in the Bahamas, you have to get work permits for everyone. And as the producer, you have to justify why they need like 30 wardrobe assistants.

31:46Wow. And why nobody on the island themselves would be capable of doing that gig because otherwise they're not going to let you in. It's very complicated. Interesting. Okay. I love, Marcy, that for LeBron's wedding, the invite didn't have a date or a time. Thank you. And that wasn't a mistake. We did that on purpose. Although in the beginning, I think I had done one, you know, 39 years ago that probably didn't have a date on. You're like, oops. Yeah. What are some of the wildest measures you've taken to protect clients' anonymity or, you know, keep secret where or when the wedding is going to be?

32:25I think— Have you given a false address? No, I haven't done that. I should consider that. I think, you know, basically not giving any information until the person calls this number and you vet who it is. Oh, so it has to be a voice call. Yeah. Okay. Exactly. Kind of like wiring money these days. You don't allow anything to be done on the Internet, right? So it has to be a voice call. And, you know, basically it's interesting, and we all talk about this, my colleagues and I, it's always someone's cousin. You know, just because they're rich and or famous, that doesn't mean the people they were raised with in like Akron, Ohio, have any idea that, you know, not to tell TMZ that they got.

33:03So that is what you have to be concerned about. Right. Where do you think Taylor and Travis are going to get married? Do you have a guess? I don't know. Oh, that means you do know. No, I don't know. I think I have had all sorts of ideas about it. Tons of ideas. I think it's in New York. I really do. And I had this fantasy, which I don't think is true, but I thought, how cool would it be if it was a Gracie mansion? I don't think that's true. I know. It's not true. Has a wedding ever been there? Years ago, when Ed Koch was mayor, he was very close with my family and my ex-husband and my brother.

33:38And so I've done bat mitzvahs there, but never a wedding. But it has a fabulous lawn. I thought, what a brilliant PR coup that would be for Mom Donnie, because everyone loves Taylor. I was like, cross the board. That would be it. If the mayor's office is listening. That would be amazing. Yeah. We'll see. Yeah. I mean, I don't know either. I've tried. Only because for my own satisfaction, I work at Zero Bond. You know, this is where my office is. So apparently right when I left last week, they came in. I was like, I'm coming back. I don't know what I was going to do. Are you sure you don't want to change planners?

34:13Yeah, exactly. Wedding planning becomes very intimate. You basically become a couples therapist before they're getting married. Do you have any tricks about how to navigate marital, premarital discontent? Well, hopefully it hasn't gotten to discontent yet. It's some malaise, but not—it's all about respect. I know that sounds trite, but it really is. You know, nobody cares if you say, like, I hate pink, but it's different. I hate pink, but, you know, you're so stupid, I can't believe you picked pink again. It's a totally different conversation, right? If you just stay respectful and know that, you know, you're going to be with the other person's family for the rest of your life, hopefully as well.

34:56So, you know, don't be nasty to their mother about what she's wearing. So I really think it's, again, you know, it's just be kind. And I will talk to them separately. I try to go, you know, can I have a call with you? Oh, interesting. And sometimes, you know, they don't always love it. But I feel, you know, I gave it my best shot. I'm just telling you as, you know, someone who's been around longer than you that I really think this is an example of how your partnership is going to go. Yeah. So let's try to do our best. Yeah. Isn't it interesting when you have to get yourself involved? Oh, yeah.

35:29What's an example of when you've had to get involved? A bride and her future mother-in-law were really not getting along. And the mother-in-law was calling us, trying to change certain decisions. And then the bride would call us and say, don't listen to her. And it was getting out of hand. Oh, my God. So what did you do? Who was paying for it? The mother and the lion, I bet. The families were splitting. Oh, even worse. It was very complicated. And it's true that who is paying does affect decision-making power. I started off with the bride. I just acknowledged the situation and how complicated and awkward it was, but said ultimately we have to address this with her because this cannot continue and we really have to face it head on.

36:08And what happened? We had a very awkward conversation, but— All of you? Yes. I'm sorry. Wow. You're giving me hives. I recognize this. It was super, super weird. And was it better after that? It was much better. I know every situation is so different in what our jobs require of us. No question. But sometimes they're like, we need you to negotiate this situation for us. Prenups. People ask me about prenups. I'm like, that's a different business. That's crazy. I would have gone to law school if I knew that this was a possibility. Well, you are a lawyer and a therapist. Everything. But also you're an engineer.

36:47I mean, the first time someone said to me, well, how many pounds do you think that this tent is going to hold for a chandelier? I was like, huh? I know. I was like, no, no, no. I plan parties. They're so pretty. What is the best way to calm down a bridezilla? I have never met someone who was a lovely human who became a bridezilla. I've met people who were difficult, who became deranged during their wedding. But someone who is essentially a really—everyone's nervous, and they're not at their best or their nicest. But if it's a decent person, I try to remind them that there is life after this. But also I say, what do you want?

37:28Like, what are you looking for? Because they'll say, well, the client wanted that. I said, the client doesn't know what they want. The client wants to have a great party. That's what they want. And how we get there, that's our expertise to explain to them that I know you don't like mushrooms, but other people do, and we just won't serve you any. You're not allergic to them, but this obsession with not having a mushroom anywhere is not really what— Not drug mushrooms. No, no. Well, that's another story. That's a whole other story. But that is not really what you want. You're focusing, you know, and I use this sentence all the time as it's just, you know, my mother used to work for me, and I miss her terribly.

38:04But my mother always is like, you know, the emphasis is on the wrong syllable. And that's how I really like you're focusing on something, but that's not really what you're thinking about, you know. And do people take that feedback? Depends. Sometimes they fire me. No, I'm teasing. Or they're just, no, I, you know, I said, listen, I'm just trying to help, you know, and if you don't want to listen, that's fine. This is my job is to give you my expertise, but it's your wedding. At the end of the day, I am not, you know, a dictator. It's your wedding. We will do as you wish. I just, my job is to tell you the possibilities.

38:34How has social media, I mean, you, I feel like, don't have a pre-social media reference point. Right, existence is true. But how has social media changed the way that people think about their weddings? And also, how has Vogue changed or coverage of weddings changed the way people think about or plan their weddings? I think people are very aware of how they'll be perceived online. We have clients that want their phones locked. They don't want people posting in general or even to be able to take pictures at the wedding period. And it's privacy, maybe a little bit of paranoia, wanting people to be present, but just knowing that it will really live on.

39:13And I think there's a certain permanence to that versus just the disposable cameras and things. Right, and a lot of these people are connected to, I mean, where did the money come from? It's a corporation. It may be a public corporation. They don't want stockholders to see that they spent, even if they're right about spending it, they made it. You know, the excess looks inappropriate to someone who has$10 worth of whatever. Or the inverse. They want to show that they have plenty. You're right. Or they want to show that they have enough money to do this. There's a certain echelon of brides. And then I always find it very funny when we're working with a couple and I say, oh, you know, so-and-so's wedding is coming up.

39:54We're going to be watching. and they're watching the stories of all the guests that they know are attending and thinking of it as, oh, this is my competition. It's fascinating. Wow. I am riveted by the, I mean, it used to just be, obviously most people can't afford a wedding planner, but for people who can, you hired a wedding planner and you got a dress with your mom at Kleinfeld's or Burgdorf's or whatever, and then you got married. And now there are wedding stylists, there are wedding publicists, There are content creators and creative directors. I mean, it's wild. It's almost like billing for a film.

40:34I couldn't agree more. How do you work with all of these different vendors that have popped up, and how do you think they affect the overall experience? Marcy's being careful. I can see her thinking, choosing her words. You know, the stylists have been doing a really good job, and some of them are really talented and have found things where I wouldn't have thought of in a million years to put this woman in that, and they look fabulous. And it's, you know, Armani Privé or something. I didn't even know where they got it in some atelier. And what I object to is two hours outside of the wedding in the middle of the wedding when all your guests are there and it's a photo shoot or things.

41:13Oh, no. Oh, yeah. And it's not gracious. Everyone is, you know, where's the couple? Where's the couple? I mean, obviously, I'm old school. So I—and we're very active on Instagram. It's not that. But I'm very specific about what we post and what we had to do with what we posted, not—look at this beautiful woman. Like, I didn't make that woman, you know. Like, the flowers are nice. We consulted on those. But I think, again, it comes down. You know, if you were throwing this as your coming out party, which some people are, that's a different perspective. Also, I mean, weddings now seem to almost inevitably be two or three days.

41:51I mean, there's many events. So it makes more sense that you have someone help you plan outfits for that entire wedding. I mean, I think about the Embodding wedding. There were like 14 events over four continents. And then there was a boat trip, I think, two months before that was a whole, yeah. I loved that one. It was so funny. They're like, we got off the boat and the Backstreet Boys were performing. And then we got on the boat and NSYNC was performing. I used to because every time my client would say to me, don't you think this is a bit much? I was like, did you see the Ambani wedding? You're going to be fine.

42:24Do you feel that people are doing more destination weddings? And are there any destinations that you feel like are overlooked that are great wedding venues? Well, we're not going to tell you that. You have to hire Marcy or Melissa. There's a little bit of gatekeeping that's healthy. Only for, yeah, not vendors, but I really do think about destinations because, you know, you were asking one of my bride's illustrators. Many, many years ago we did a wedding somewhere overseas, and she found out some other people were getting married there the same month. And she went like ballistic and wanted me to call all the other wedding planners and make sure they wouldn't be anywhere near the same venues.

43:05I was like, well, I can't do that. You know, they wound up making a map. It was like General Patton, like little thumbtacks in it. Like, okay, she's going to be here then. It's true. I mean, you definitely at this point, it's like, oh, they're getting married in Lake Como. Okay. But it's so sad because Lake Como is so beautiful and so special. And they don't want us there anymore. I don't know about your experience. They were not very nice to us last time we were there. They've had enough people who saved up enough money. They just want the Cloonies, right? Yeah. You know, the curfews are so early.

43:36They don't want us there. People want to live there because it's beautiful. The same thing with the Hamptons. I mean, they'll put up with us, but it's not easy. Melissa, what's the wedding planner stare? If you're talking to a wedding planner and they have a headset in and they're kind of smiling and they're a little bit delayed, you're like, is something going on? Is something really bad happening? You're like, no, of course not. They don't put me on that channel, by the way. My staff, they're like, I was like, are you on a separate channel? The secret channel? Yeah. That's intense. I was like, wait a minute.

44:10Did something blow up? Hey, everyone, we need to go to Channel 3. So Marcy can't hear us. It's amazing. Don't do that. Yeah. What is a wedding trend that you wish would go away? Like food styling or decor? I think trying to be too traditional with things. I think people can be afraid to branch out and make bold decisions. Maybe not our clients because I think they're a little zany and creative. But I think being scared to branch out, that's one for us. No, I agree with you. And conversely, throwing out the baby with the bathwater. You know, because my clients I think are similar to yours. They're creative, interesting people.

44:49I mean, people don't generally hire me for, you know, church and plaza wedding. rarely that it would be actually silly because I'm expensive and you're paying for my brain power. Not, you know, that. But I think if someone says, we're not doing a first dance or I'm not doing a father, daughter, mother, son, whatever. And I'm the same thing. Well, you didn't. Why do you have to throw that out? Like, I understand I am not a traditionalist. You know, I'm an old hippie. I get it. But your father's probably been waiting his whole life to have a dance with you. Is it going to it's not going to kill you?

45:20You know, maybe being a little bit too cool. Yes, I guess that's what I was getting at. So either side, yes, you're absolutely right. Our team is very divided on dogs at weddings, like wearing a sign that says something like just married or being involved in the wedding. Do you involve dogs? My husband is a vet nurse. We are big animal people, animal rights people. I think the dogs are miserable. I don't really care. It's not, you know, again, I'm not the morality police or the taste police. I'm like, that poor dog is suffering. I mean, you know, all he does is see you down the aisle and like, where are, where's my parents?

45:56Where's my parents? And like, I was running and like, who are all these people? I've never seen a dog. You know, it's like a six-month-old being, you know. I was like, they're not enjoying themselves. I mean, my dog couldn't handle it. Yeah, no, no, no. I mean, my dog would probably eat someone, which is not good for business. I think it's stressful and confusing. If you want to take photos, then you hire a sitter and they can bring them in for a very short amount of time. Maybe they walk down the aisle and then they need to leave. Exactly, yes. They can't stay for the ceremony. No. And to have to like fasten somebody to their collar, they're not happy.

46:25No.

46:29The run-through will be back with Marcy and Melissa after this break.

46:43Hello, I'm Elizabeth Day, the creator and host of How to Fail. It's the podcast that celebrates the things in life that haven't gone right. and what, if anything, we've learned from those mistakes to help us succeed better. Each week, my guests share three failures, sparking intimate, thought-provoking and funny conversations. You'll hear from a diverse range of voices sharing what they've learned through their failures. Join me Wednesdays for a new episode each week. This is an Elizabeth Day and Sony Music Entertainment original podcast. Listen now wherever you get your podcasts.

47:20We just got through our Super Bowl, our Met Gala. Oh, I didn't notice. Was there something at the Met? Yeah. The seating chart is of utmost importance. A lot goes into it. Months are spent. Speaking of general patent, it's like, you know, an enormous poster board under a cloak, basically, where sort of, you know, Sasha puts her head underneath to look at it. What are your seating rules? I think I'm rare in that I don't need to be seated with my husband. I was about to say, well, you are raised, you know, very European and American. No, it's true because in Europe, as you know, they'll never sit you next after the first year.

47:59I just think it's odd. I mean, I see my husband every day. I say the same thing. But should it be someone you know? Can you sit with strangers? I like doing a mix. I just planned my mother's 80th birthday. And I had so many emails afterwards saying, thank you so much for seating me with so-and-so. I loved meeting them. I mean, I had, we still talk about, I got married two years ago in St. Lawrence. I had 14 people. My friends, my friends switched the place cards at dinner. That to me is a no-go. I was, I was, I was, I was like, are you people kidding? I was like, do you think I just like haphazardly put, I was like, there was a point here.

48:35It's going to spend a weekend together. I thought you'd get to, I couldn't believe it. That's one of my big pet peeves. And actually someone on my mom's birthday moved their place cards so that two women were next to each other who have a historic feud, and it was very uncomfortable for the person who was negotiating that between the two of them. That's challenging. No, because people, I mean, when I were in the dining room before, you know, the guests come in and you see people, and I, you know, the party line is the host spent a lot of time doing this. Don't think that this was just the default position that you were seated with, you know, all the cousins.

49:12It's like someone thought that you would like that. Yeah. It's not haphazard. Right. And aside from the intentional connections, maybe you're trying to forge relationships or what have you, there are reasons that, you know, we have this information, whether it be allergies or maybe meals are assigned. There's lots of different reasons why we need to know where you're seated. So it messes things up for us, too. How important are themes for weddings? I like a theme. I mean, not necessarily for the wedding night, but I think, you know, the welcome party. If the welcome party is in, you know, we've done everything from Roberta's Pizza to a, you know, fabulous bar downtown for a very fancy wedding, but the night before.

49:53So, you know, maybe not, as I always say, we do a medieval theme. You know, we don't want people coming in armor. But just a smidge of a theme. Welcome to New York or something like that, I think, is really. I like to have a hook. Something that, you know, we can say. There's a reason it's not just pretty. There's a reason everything makes sense. Do you – have you seen more mood boards for dress codes? Oh, boy. I'm astounded by it. Every wedding now has a Pinterest board for the themes. And it's for the guests. Well, I mean, my mother was invited to a wedding recently at the Beller Hotel, and the dress code was formal.

50:34And she got a Pinterest board, and she wrote back – she replied to the wedding planner, What do they think I am, a moron? I was going to say, do they know who your mother is, like the most elegant? I mean, I got that email shared via the planner. The planner. It was hilarious. No, and also to a certain, there's helpful and then there's all the way to the right of that, which is rude, you know. And then there are people, I mean, Kate and Kevin love. Kate had a strict rule, you know, either black or white. Yeah. And the time I was like, wow, that's intense. And the truth is the photos are amazing.

51:13They're amazing. They look like from another era. Everybody. And did anyone not adhere? They're scared of her. Okay, good. Me too. I would have sent them home or given them a dress. You know what I really would like to see an end of and to? Black tie optional. Oh, my God. I call that the passive aggressive dress code. I was like, just saying, you want people to wear black tie? It's an attack. It's obnoxious. It was like, well, we really want you to wear this, but we don't have the nerve to say it. So I figure— Well, especially for men, I feel that half the men come in black tie and half come in a suit and both feel terrible.

51:47Feel stupid and terrible. Absolutely. So I think a specific dress code—I mean, we're writing on something. Commit to black tie. That's right. Just commit to black tie. Just do it. Or just do— Or just say dark suits. I like when sometimes for Vogue events we just say dress up. You're going to a Vogue event. I remember, you know, years ago we did a 50th birthday for some, you know, TV person and then we just wrote glamorous. Yeah. And, you know, it's fun for people, right? I think when it's open-ended, it's good. Formal could be confusing, though. Yeah. Your mother obviously knows how to dress up, but some people actually don't.

52:17Don't know the deal. Formal, what does it mean? You're right. It's difficult. Sometimes we'll have on the website say, as some of you have inquired, we've linked a Pinterest board, you know, should it be helpful? Right. And otherwise, some people will ask us. A lot of guests will ask because they feel insecure and they don't want to be under arrest. And actually, if it's the bride's family or the groom's family, I'll give them my cell phone and I say I know because they don't want to piss off the other part. And I feel so bad for them. I feel like, you know, this woman is so scared of her son's new wife.

52:45Like, I'll tell you what to wear without you having to ask her. That's a really good example of things that we do that nobody knows about. These kind of secret hand-holding that we do to support behind the scenes. Because anybody in this business, all of us, maybe I've met two over the years, we're really kind people who actually like people. Really. Well, I think that's an essential quality. Absolutely. You couldn't stay in this if you really didn't like people because they really make it hard. What is your favorite wedding cake trend or flower trend right now? Hmm. Or wedding dress trend. General trends that you're seeing.

53:24Although I hate the word trend. I know. As I said, we did a birthday party last night for a dear client, and we used one of those very eight-foot-long cake that was decorated. And it was really fun when we brought it out, when we finally got it out of the kitchen and into the dining room. It's like Subway's foot-long cookie. Exactly. So I really think it's fun. I mean, obviously, you know, I come out of a food background. I love a really frivolous, crazy dessert buffet with the cake as just, you know, a piece, a punctuation of that. And we're doing tons of those, you know, layers stacked in all different colors.

54:00And I think people love that. And I think we always like to get people up. You know, nobody wants to sit more than any. So you get people up for dessert. Yeah. Okay. People have had enough. I don't care. They're sitting next to, like, the most fascinating person in the world. They want to get up. It's two courses, appetizer, entree, up for dessert. Up for dessert. Yep. I think that's best. And you can do cake cutting. Doesn't need to be announced. Have everyone dancing. When are speeches? If it were up to me, never. But that's not the choice, right? Well, yeah. And they're, you know, again. I like when speeches are stacked opening night.

54:34I agree. I like doing a heavy speech Friday. And then the wedding night, it's like just parents of four. I agree completely. So you're like three max. And some of them should be, you know, if there's a smaller rehearsal dinner, you know, if everyone's going to make inside jokes where the rest of the guests are like, what are you talking about? You know, it's got to be at that intimate dinner, definitely. We're doing a wedding soon where they have so many friends that need to give speeches that we're actually just completely leaning in. And on Friday night, there's a roast, we're calling it. That's what it is.

55:07So we've created a dinner theater experience where everyone is seated and the show is actually all the speeches. Yeah. There's a lot of pressure for the guests, but good. I think everyone's actually very nervous. And they're all Hollywood writers and work in comedy. I'm actually very excited for these speeches. Oh, that's fantastic. That sounds like a million years ago we did J.J. Philbin and Mike Sher's wedding. And they were both writers on SNL. And those speeches, and I wish I could find it. I can't find it. There was a program on the speech. Seth Meyers was the best man. And we were just crying.

55:35All of us. It was so hysterical. I think that's great. I may plagiarize that idea. That's a good one. I give you permission. Thank you. Thank you. I think you just have to lean in. But to your point, I think stacking them on the first night and keeping it really light for the wedding is good. What's your favorite cake or food trend of the moment? Really over-the-top, dramatic cake displays. Tall. I was just in L.A. for the Dior resort show, and they had a 900-person afterparty at the Chateau Marmont, which was— It was 900. I saw snippets. I didn't realize. It was a lot of people. But they had a cake table that looked like it was out of Sophia Coppola's Marie Antoinette.

56:17And they had real non-edible ribbons on the cakes, which I felt like if they actually were cutting the cake seemed like a hazard. But nobody was cutting the cake. No. What is your favorite floral motif you've seen or used recently? I'm actually seeing a lot of, you know, topiary fruits and grapes and really Renaissance things. And, you know, less floral, I think. And I like that a lot. There's only so many things you can do with flowers, right? Yeah. We did a 1960s Palm Springs wedding a couple of years ago, which Vogue featured and was one of my favorites I've ever done. Whose wedding was that?

56:55Sophie Cohen's. Okay. And for some of the arrangements, we just had these Gerber daisies. Really simple, classic. We didn't overdo it. The wedding food was Italian. There was, it's very niche and nuanced, but all the flowers had different spaghetti names, if you knew. Oh, that's cute. It's very esoteric. Good for you. Yes.

57:20I'm curious what people should be spending money on and what they should be saving on for their weddings. I think the guest experience is something that you really should invest in, having extra staff. Staff. I was just going to say staff every time. I would throw out all the flowers if I had to, given a choice, and get more waiters, right? Definitely. That's what people care about. I mean, at some point you won't really remember what the flowers—I mean, we care and the bride cares. And you want a beautiful, but there's beautiful, and then there's how much more beautiful. Right. But if someone's waiting for a drink or the bathrooms are dirty, you know, these are things that we all recognize if we go to an event.

57:55Definitely. I also think you sort of find one thing that you really care about personally. I mean, I'm saying as the bride, like I ordered really expensive tablecloths. It was Carolina Irving fabric that I loved, and I turned them into curtains. That's beautiful. See that? And they're great. And I still use – I have them as curtains, and then I use the extras as tablecloths now. But to me, having those in the photos— Now the children are wearing a little— Yes, exactly. It's very sound of music.

58:22But yeah, so you choose the guest experience. That's a good one. Is there anything people often tend to spend on that then they don't appreciate? You know, invitations, I think. And I hate to say that because we do beautiful invitations and they're not inexpensive. But you have to care about it. If it's just, you know, something performative. Or people come in and they say, I guess we have to have an after party. And I'm like, well, if you go to sleep at 10 o 'clock every night, why do you have to have an after party? So it really depends. You know, they used to ask me incessantly, Brides Magazine, all the other, can you do a chart that says how much should be spent on each piece?

58:57And I was like, no, I can't because it depends on the client, right? I only cared about the food and wine at my wedding, you know. Well, I wanted to ask you about that, and then we'll be done. But, Marcy, what was it like being your own client? I feel like it's like hairdressers have to cut their own hair. Well, the first time I got married, which I was starting my career, it was, you know, we spent way too much on things. But we had, it was great food and great wine. And we were in the restaurant business. Le Code Bosque lent us their china. We used a lot of favors. This time I was like, I just want four days with my dear friends to have fun.

59:30And it was great. I mean, one of Patricia Voto, you know, did my dress, one of. And it was fabulous, short dress, and it was in St. Bars. And basically, I just danced on tables and drank rosé for four days, which is really what I wanted to do. Fantastic. Yeah. I think I carried a carnation. I don't even know what it was. I refused, you know. Because once you start, you're like, oh, because we know everything, right? So I was like, I'm not doing that. You know too much. Yeah. Are you married, Melissa? I'm not married. Okay. Will you be planning your own wedding? Good question. Depends on who I marry, I guess.

1:00:05I'll give you a business card. Oh, thank you so much. Thank you, ladies. Thank you so much for having us. Thank you. All right, that's it for the show. See you next week.

1:00:23The Run Through with Vogue is produced by Chelsea Daniel, Alex DePalma, and Alex John Burns with help from Emily Elias. The show is engineered by Bran Van D and mixed by Mike Kutchman. Bye.

1:00:44We ask the question all the time, are men okay? No. This week on Critics at Large, we're looking at a new slate of shows that take on the so-called masculinity crisis, from half-man to heated rivalry. There's a sense of being profoundly misunderstood by the wider world going on in all of these. And I think that stems from the very idea of archetypes, that if you don't subscribe to a clear archetype and make yourself very legible to the world at large, you won't actually be seen. But if you do subscribe to one of those archetypes, you're not going to be seen anyway because your individuality is going to be completely scrubbed.

1:01:21I think it's about this feeling of being invisible. I'm Vincent Cunningham. Join me and my co-hosts for new episodes every Thursday, wherever you get your podcasts.

1:01:36From PRX.