The latest in sports media talent musical chairs, a big weekend for the NFL in Brazil, and puck drops on the NHL season

0:00Coming up on the pod, keeping up with the latest in media talent in sports, a big weekend for the NFL in Brazil, and more fallout from the Protect College Sports Act.

0:18Welcome into the SPJ Sports Media Podcast. I'm Austin Karp. And I'm Josh Carpenter. Austin, let's get right into it. Let's talk media talent. It's been one of the major storylines around this kind of fall sports season. A lot of re-signings, Joe Buck back with ESPN, a lot of other moves. And then this week, Kirk Herbstreet is kind of the latest to re-sign with Amazon Prime Video for Thursday Night Football. Not really a surprise, right? I was kind of surprised, to be perfectly honest. I thought this might be one of the places where a seat opened up. Because I thought Herbstreet, traditionally a college guy, I thought that might be one of the seats that opened up for either Greg Olson or one of these other musical chairs.

0:57But to see him sign on for a couple more years, that first deal he had, and this is all from Andrew Marchand over at the Athletic, that first deal he had for Thursday Night Football, five years, this is going to be less than that. Prime Video and Amazon kind of left them a little wiggle room, apparently, to go after a big name that they wanted. And that's Sean McVay, the coach of the Rams. Were he ever to become a free agent? They love him. A lot of people love him as a TV talent, but no signal yet that he's going to be leaving the Rams, but they wanted to keep their options open. I just figure Herbstreet would want to go back and just do college, focus on that, apparently liking what he's doing with the NFL.

1:32We'll see who's going to be sitting next to him long term. I'm not sure how much Al Michaels is going to be doing this. He's been going on those year-to-year deals. But what do we know so far? Like you said, Joe Buck staying in that booth. He came out this week. He'd love to have Aikman back, solidifying that. They are still friends, and you and I have talked about this, but I'm not sure that that necessarily is going to matter. I think Aikman has a number. He and his folks have a number that they're going to want to get to. Can ESPN get to that number? And we also, we still don't have any resolution as to what's going to be going on with CBS.

2:01We're heading into week four of the season, and what do we know is that Tony Romo is still not back in that A booth. It's going to continue to be Watt this week. I feel like it's a week in, week out check-in on what's going on with this resolution regarding Tony Romo. So we don't know CBS's situation yet, and we have to figure out what's going to be going on longer term with Troy Aigner. Yeah, I feel like with Romo, it's just indefinitely. I'm just anticipating J.J. Watt being in that spot with CBS until we hear otherwise. And I don't necessarily know that CBS is in a huge rush to bring Tony Romo back.

2:34I think they'll play that situation out, be very cautious with that. I'm not saying they don't want Tony Romo to come back, but I think right now they feel like they have a good thing going with J.J. Watt and Jim Nance. Pretty happy with that. Yeah. Well, and the last thing I'll say about Herbstreit is I did think this was going to open up and I thought it would be a potential landing spot for Greg Olson as a number one. Or if Romo doesn't work out with CBS, I thought that that could be a potential landing spot for him in this game of musical chairs. But that has now been taken off the board. But interesting point on Herb Street being a shorter term deal.

3:05And I think probably that has to do a little bit with Al Michaels. Do they want to lock Herb Street up for another five or six years when, you know, we don't know. Like Al Michaels might say after this season, hey, I'm done. I don't want to do this anymore. So if they try and line up Herb Street with that same Al Michaels time frame, then, you know, maybe if both those guys move on in three years. I don't know how short term it is. I don't know if it's a year to year deal or anything like that. Correct. But maybe you could see Prime Video start fresh with someone new with a Sean McVay, along with one of these up and coming guys on the play by play side.

3:36But certainly a lot of intrigue around that as we head into kind of the beat of the NFL season. Austin, you know, speaking of media talent on this week's podcast, our guests were from UTA, Jerry Silvowitz and Ryan Hayden. Anything that stood out for you from your interview with those guys? No, I just like the interesting stuff that they are doing with their talent, specifically the likes of Rob Gronkowski and Rich Eisen, so many other big names. We talk about that, what they're trying to do for their clients and what they're seeing in the landscape. Sounds great. Let's take a whistle. We're always trying to get a lay of the land with regard to media talent.

4:12And United Talent Agency, UTA, is in that top echelon of agencies in this space handling work for the likes of Barstool Sports, Rob Gronkowski, Rich Eisen, and many more. So here to talk about the agency's work and what they're seeing in the business are the co-heads of sports media at UTA, Ryan Hayden and Jerry Sobowitz. Gentlemen, welcome into the SBJ Sports Media Podcast. Thank you for having us. Appreciate it. These days, when you're recruiting talent, when you're talking to prospective clients out there, what are some of the key traits that you are looking for? And how does that maybe differentiate these days when you're talking about TV talent or maybe creator talent?

4:50So rooted at the core is some sort of charisma or magnetic effect, you know, that sort of engages anyone, no matter how you're consuming something, listening, watching, you know, whatever the mechanism that delivers it. So I think that still cuts through. And then popularity is another component, you know, like something that's interesting and sort of widely appealed to. Now, obviously, something that could be in an earlier stage of its evolution from a talent perspective, that's the part where you're using your instincts, your gut and experience to say, will that resonate? But it still has that magnetic thing, the charisma thing, authenticity.

5:26It's a word we all use a ton, but it still is the thing that cuts through that people can get behind. You know, now we just have more ways of doing it and more devices to do it on. But I still think when looking at someone that we want to work with and be a part of their journey from a representation standpoint, whether it's a talent, a property or anything, those are the hallmarks you want to have. And then you want to be a great teammate with them and a great partner. Ryan, what catches your eye with talent? I think it's the ability to connect with the audience. I think for us, that's sort of, you know, when we're looking at a prospective talent, a lot of men and women can, you know, they have a tremendous body of work, a resume, Hall of Fame resumes, more often than not.

6:13That is fantastic at the start, but then it has to get to a point where there is a real connection with the audience and an ability to drive that audience and fuel what the audience wants. And so, you know, the whatever their resume looked like beforehand that was, you know, not front facing in front of the camera or behind a microphone, that's all well and good. But it is that ability to make that connection, especially now. You know, obviously, it used to be, you know, you could stand up in a studio and, you know, analyze a game or analyze a player. And that was enough. And now in a world of clicks and views, you really need to have that natural and organic connection with your fan base.

7:02I think nobody in recent years has had that sort of organic connection better than what Barstool Sports has done, especially with young sports fans. One of the bigger deals in sports media over the last couple of years, what they have done with Fox Sports. So I'm curious, what have the folks at Barstool, Dave Portnoy and all of the others, what have they thought so far about this Fox Sports relationship? And also, like, what has Fox done for the Barstool brand today? It's mutual. Like, both sides enjoy working with each other a ton. It's been a mutual respect. Both Dave as not just talent, but as an executive and a leader of his organization.

7:34And, you know, dealing with Eric Shanks and Brad Zager and Jordan Bajon, who are, you know, amongst a myriad of executives and talented people they interface with daily at Fox Sports. I think it's been a shared respect for what both sides bring to the table. I think the great examples on any given Saturday or the Michigan game a couple weeks ago where you get both setups at a footprint. It's Barstool will do their college football show before Big Noon kicks off. And that's on a streaming-only available basis across both the Barstool-branded channels, Fox Sports-branded channels, and Tubi. you know and then that leads right into the big new kickoff where dave and big cat and the rest of the team will join throughout the show in various ways and elements and it's just a great marriage i think there's a creative sort of authentic through line between both organizations that they respect a ton i think it's also it's great acts from a barstool perspective love the access of being a part of the broadcast partner and a part of the the lead-in i think my thing is the Fox folks enjoy the authenticity, especially when you're in the college football marketplace and you're constantly recycling 18 to 22-year-olds that we too are constantly recycling that audience while still having our audience mature.

8:53Because if you were early in on Barstool 20-plus years ago, you've probably grown up a bit, but then we still replenish the younger fan base. So it's, again, one of those great partnerships when it just works and there's just a great loop of dialogue. So it's fun and it's worth football season right now. This is the best part. I think Dave even mentioned this at the Michigan game last week is that when you're at a company like Barstow or others like it, you do have this sort of innate feeling that you're a bit of an outsider, right? You're not part of traditional media. And I think for Dave to sit there and say that, you know, walking out of the tunnel with Charles Woodson and getting to experience that and being sort of alongside one of his heroes on a traditional, very well-respected medium is something that I don't know that he thought sort of possible in his wildest imaginations prior to doing a deal such as this.

9:52So I think it's a win-win for all sides. I think if you look at the college football show in the beginning, that crowd, that organic crowd that just goes totally wild for Barstool and Dave, that sort of gets it all warmed up. And then you just move that crowd sort of right across the way over to Big Noon. It's great for everyone. To Ryan's point, it's great. Just additional platforms, additional partners, I think, thematically. And you talk about it all the time, regardless of whatever the platform or the partner does, by way of their day-to-day business, when you put together those right elements.

10:29And everyone just has very candid, thoughtful, warm dialogues with each other. And usually try to make sure the answer is yes, as much as possible. The rest of it's easy. One of your other clients, Rob Gronkowski, we've had him on this pod. The podcast he's doing with Julian Edelman, we talked about that. That was one of my favorite interviews. He also, after his career, stepped into that Fox NFL analyst role. So how has he enjoyed this new media personality that he's been developing? He's loved it. I think the chance to be around other greats, when you look at Michael Strahan and Howie Long and Terry Bradshaw and Charles Woodson and obviously his old pal Julian, he's loving uh being in that group in that circle it feels very much like a locker room situation to him and being being able to to talk football now compounding that with what him and julian are doing has been fantastic he's loved it they've treat you know treated him so well and the things that they've had him been doing off of football as well in terms of the indy 500 and and and other areas.

11:35And, and, you know, I think the, the part that he's really loved is they've allowed him to be him. They've allowed him to be unapologetically gronk. And I think Brad Zegers and, and Bill Richards have done a tremendous job of saying to him, you know, don't try to be someone that you're not, you know, you have a sort of a special role in this world and fans love you. that's what we want you to give them. Don't try to be an analyst following in the footsteps of someone else. You're Gronk. Be Gronk. And that's what we want. And they've been fantastic with it. No, I just love that you can call him Gronk like Madonna.

12:17He's just got the one name. You can identify him that way. That's how much he's developed. That's it. And from kids, it's so interesting with him especially is kids who were sort of growing up maybe a little too young to actually watch when he played even five years ago, but they all know the name and they all know him. And he's done a tremendous job in making sure that the persona and everything he was on the field, he's carried that to the post career as well. All right, a couple more for you guys. I'm going to get a little personal on this one. Growing up, Ryan, I'll start with you. Who was your favorite sports TV talent?

12:55So for me, this was an obvious one. growing up just outside the D.C. area, George Michael, who was our local sports broadcaster. We had a lot of great ones there, but George Michael was tremendous, and he also hosted Red Screens Report and other things. And then when I, you know, you take them as your own. And then when I went to college, the first time I remember turning on the TV and seeing in Atlanta the George Michael Sports Machine, which I had always assumed growing up that that was just a local show that George did every Sunday night. And that was sort of my first foray into realizing what the syndication business was, realizing that George Michael, that all these other friends that I was at college with also watched George Michael, you know, knowing from the sports machine, not obviously from the local part, but knowing that.

13:50So he was someone, to me, I look at as sort of a, you know, a pioneer in that space and syndicating, you know, what was a local show and then taking it across the country. So for me, that was, you know, I'll always hold a special place when I think about this business and growing up and, you know, realizing what this business could actually become. Definitely got beyond the DMV. All right, Jerry, favorite talent growing up besides you and i watching rich eyes and i'd say um probably the big show with keith and dan was i mean it was a seminal sort of mean mean stay but then also being from new york i guess i'm probably obligated to say len berman or warner wolf to some extent so if we can go to the video tape but i know i'd probably be the big shout that was uh that was definitely a highlight in my sort of sports consumption day love it all right i'll get you guys out of here on this jerry we'll go to you first.

14:47You guys have your hands in so many pods. You're seeing so much of the media business. So what is the biggest headwind and maybe the biggest tailwind with sports media representation right now? Look, combination, right? You do this show, which I listen to regularly and always do an amazing job at it. And some of these other shows where we talk about whether it's, you know, modifications to how people are consuming and that's the sort of push pull of the size of the cable bundle today versus your sort of streaming subscription business. Again, my argument's always it's kind of other than the great economic model that it is, six and one, half a dozen and the other.

15:25But there's some of that and then sort of the amount of people buying certain type of talent. We're talking just talent facing business wise. Anecdotal, even this summer, a client of ours, Tom Pelissero, was a part of a small round of layoffs post the ESPN NFL Network acquisition. shit and there were a few others impacted and you know used to be called xyz you know networks to see if there was another job you know granted not ideal the two people who bought the most of those were now one you know but then all of a sudden headwind tailwind you know we make a deal with both the ringer and netflix who you know how x amount of years ago didn't exist as buyers you know and granted not putting on you know it's a different sort of capacity where they're not putting on, you know, in a linear fashion, you know, X amount of shows per day, but do have a high output, you know, on either two, three or even daily basis.

16:18And then those shows are exhibited in a variety of ways, as well as on Netflix. So, you know, I'd say, look, headwind and tailwind, I'd say adapting, you know, in that and even when your guys are covering what's going on in the regionals right now and how those teams are sort of transitioning their rights into zones, trying to see if they can come in and sort of be a solution to that, you know, pre-leading into wherever the hub goes, you know, fast forward. Yeah, I think both can be the same thing, you know, when we look at it today. But I think the more you sort of throw out the playbook in some instances or just say like it's changing and we adapt and love everything and not, I'm probably too young to complain and be to get off my lawn guy.

17:01So since I got another few decades at this thing and still need to make money, I have who lean into everything that's contemporary and be open-minded. But even like Case of Tom, all right, so he's got two employers, you know, that do complementary things that happen to be in a complementary business that both were, you know, rooting for each other to be the landing place for him. And that's just talent facing. So that'd be it. But or even when you point out a bar stool, you know, or like kind of opportunity, Dave's success was building on his own branded channels, you know, free to the audience.

17:34in a free ad-supported model, whether it's audio or video. And being able to, younger people look at us and say we're crazy sometimes when they don't understand why would anyone go work somewhere for some salary? You don't own your content and you have to be somewhere at set time and you do this and then if you leave, you don't have anything. You're like, well, it's because they used to platform you. But if you're blessed enough to be in the rarefied air to invent your platform and establish your following, you kind of just park your ship at whatever dock you're at. You talk about the next couple of decades.

18:05Heck, you may be pitching talent to open AI and Anthropic in a decade or so. Selling fictitious, fictitious talent, artificially created. But they, too, need to get paid. They do. All right, Ryan, you get the last word. To Jerry's point, headwinds and tailwinds, they are sort of one in the same. And I think we're in each deal we're looking at and in sort of each new territory. You know, when you start to look at it, you know, the deals we're doing, we're trying to take something that's native digital, native creator, and put that with something that's a little more traditional or vice versa. You know, we always like to laugh.

18:44It's like putting a PC and a Mac together and trying to get them to communicate. And so we find ourselves very often in these conversations with executives, with business and legal affairs of, you know, trying to both teach what we've learned from our experiences with our colleagues here in our sort of creators group and digital group, but also learn from the places that we're doing deals with in trying to marry all this together. It's tremendous that we get to be able to do these types of deals and they can be extremely lucrative. Obviously, the headwind involved in that is it just it can take much longer to get these deals done.

19:29But I think that we've always found is if you just do a little bit of listening and some learning alongside that, it makes everything so much easier to hear sort of both sides where each side is coming from. Jerry and I were just in London all last week talking to buyers over there, people who run those sectors for most of the larger conglomerates. And hearing what they're thinking, hearing how they're doing business, not trying to sort of jam our people down their throats, but hearing what they want. Where's that business overseas headed? And it was a learning experience for us. And some things they're doing just like we are here and some things they're doing differently, which is very, you know, which is very refreshing.

20:20I think the other piece to this whole thing is Jerry and I are utilizing what we're learning on this side in terms of clients who are owning their IP, licensing that IP to networks and taking it to other areas that the agency has been in, in terms of traditional media rights. You know, we're representing right now the Tournament of Roses and the Rose Parade. It's something no one had really sort of thought of that as a representable piece of IP and given sort of free to air across 16 or 17 different networks and platforms. And, you know, we look at that and say, all right, this is a piece of owned and operating IP just like the Rich Eisen show, just like Ariel Hawane's show, just like a lot of other things, just like League rights.

21:14And so we're translating what we're taking on one side and utilizing it into another space. And, you know, for us, it's great to wake up every morning thinking, all right, what can we do next? What can we, you know, what can we take what we've learned and put it into another area? Yeah, definitely so much evolution still to come, Aaron. And just to dovetail on Ryan's point, New Year's Day, you know, no different than Thanksgiving Day. There's certain things where that is a holiday, is sort of a must-see, is just a part of culture, you know, and sort of probably much better to find it in one specific destination that's partnered and, you know, destined to market it.

21:51Well, they are the co-heads of the sports media practice at UTA. Jerry Silbowitz, Ryan Hayden, thank you so much for coming on the pod this week. Thank you for having us. Thank you. All right, Austin, thanks for that interview. Great interview. Let's stick with the NFL. We were talking about this before. Big weekend for the NFL in Brazil. There was a lot of discourse heading into that Cowboys-Ravens game, kind of about the field conditions there in Rio. Nothing too off the wall for me. It seemed like they held up. But I think maybe some of that discourse around that led to this international game having the biggest viewership for an NFL international game today.

22:26Everything came together. And, you know, much like Zika in Brazil in the 2016 Olympics, nothing really happened with all the dust up around the field. It worked out well. I don't think you could have asked for anything better in terms of a finish to a game. Getting the Cowboys, having a popular team like the Ravens, they are a popular team out there. Having a last second finish like this. It was in the national window, that Sunday afternoon national window, for the first time because it actually lined up. Brazil only being an hour ahead. This isn't like London where you either have to have it.

22:56You have to play in the morning. where it's got to be in that 1 p.m. regional game. They've done that a couple of times. But, yes, it's got just south of 25 million viewers. I've got to be honest, that's a strong number, but I thought it would be higher. That's only the third best Cowboys game this season, and we're heading into week four. So that's how popular the Cowboys have been. Yes, it had a little bit of head-to-head competition there with the end of the President's Cup. The U.S. came back there. You had some WNBA playoffs getting decent numbers, particularly a fever game there. in that Sunday afternoon window.

23:27But I thought it would be closer to 30 million viewers, still a strong number, best international game audience yet for the NFL. And does that play into maybe a small, obviously a great number, anyone would kill to have 25 million viewers for a football game, but does that play into it all? You know, maybe some of the bearishness that we were seeing from the NFL heading into the season about viewership, maybe not being as strong year over year as it has been, you know, in recent years. The thing about international is like, the games are the games. NFL games are going to do what they're going to do, but I don't think you're getting any added bonus by games being in Brazil or Australia.

24:00Those games have been kind of not what I thought they would get. The YouTube, the Netflix games, those should easily be clearing 20 million viewers. I thought this sort of game, maybe, yeah, you got a little bit of what's going on in Brazil there, but there have been games in Brazil. That sort of finish with the Cowboys in the Sunday national window, I think you've got to get closer to 30 million viewers. So what I'm saying is the international part of this is not really drumming up more interest. So if you're trying to sell an international package of games, what's that worth? Is that going to bring the dollar?

24:28Is there going to be interest, multiple bidders for that sort of package? Yeah, I mean, you look at, you know, just for that matchup specifically, obviously you have the Cowboys. I mean, the Ravens are, yeah, they're a smaller market. Maybe they're not one of the most popular teams, but they've got a market. And we don't know that they're going to break off that sort of package yet. The NFL has talked about it. Goodell has hinted at it, like selling that sort of package. We know we talked to Netflix, you know, before this season, to Ted Sarandos. Could there be a package out there of international games?

24:53Netflix wasn't necessarily interested at the time, but as we look into the future at these media rights that are coming up, getting out of those last couple of years of the existing deal, could they create an international package there of games for a streamer, a global streamer that really has interest in that like a YouTube, like a Netflix? Yeah, sure. Josh, the other big news this week is on the college side, the passage in the Senate of the Protect College Sports Act, but there's a very strong media tie in there, and that has to do with the pooling, potential pooling, of media rights. What do people need to know?

25:24Yeah, I think, as you mentioned, the potential that the conferences could pool their media rights if they get 75 % buy-in from all FBS teams. You and I talked about this earlier. I don't really know that they would get to that number. That's a pretty large number. And another fun note that I think the New York Times pointed out is that the SEC, the Big Ten, and Notre Dame make up, I think, 25.4 % of... Funny how those numbers work out, right? Of the FBS meteorites overall. So I don't know that they'd get to that number, but interesting to think about. Yeah, Austin, one other thing on this PCSA, the potential of pooling meteorites, that could not happen until the current contract for the college football playoff runs out.

26:02This is what, 2031? And you also might see a lot of realigning, which was a big part of the PCSA, you know, what those schools, if they left a Power 4 conference, they would have to sit out for what, three years before they would join another P4 conference. that also kind of aligns with the end of these media rights contracts. So a lot is going to be going on here on the media side. And we've had somebody like Tim Pernetti, the commissioner of the American Conference, on this podcast. He, from a group of six perspective, would love to see the pooling in media rights. He thinks they're leaving a lot of dollars on the table, but like you just alluded to, if you don't have the SEC and you don't have the Big Ten and Notre Dame on board, it ain't happening at any time.

26:37It's not worth it. And this is all an academic conversation. Josh, we also saw the start of the NHL season this week. A lot going on there with the NHL, not just with what is happening this season from a national and local perspective, but also peering into the future about what the next round of media rights might deliver. Yeah, NHL season getting underway, Austin. I would push people to go read Alex Silverman's Q &A with Gary Bettman this week that really dove into a lot of topics around the NHL, but specifically around media. Their domestic deals here in the States with Turner Sports, with WBD, ESPN, and ABC, those deals are up after next season.

27:10They do have an exclusive negotiating window starting January 1st. So with the WBD, Paramount, Skydance, Murder and all that, that'll be something to watch. And then you have this kind of new streaming era for teams. You know, MyHurricanes opened up yesterday. They're on ESPN on Wednesday to open the season, but they've kind of launched this Hurricanes hockey network. You see other teams doing the same. You've got the entrance of Amazon Prime Video. I think Gary Bettman in that Q &A with Alex said, hey, like the biggest priority for us was to just make sure that all the games are available to fans.

27:42And they are. and he was also very bullish on kind of just the attractiveness of life sports right so it didn't seem overall you know too concerned about the league's media future um i'll say one thing just about opening night i hate how they have these opening afternoon to me it just sucks a little bit of life out of a team raising a stanley cup banner at five o 'clock in the afternoon i mean you know you look if there are any west coast fans it's two o 'clock it's middle of the day Yeah, to me, it just takes away from the event. You want opening night to be opening night. I know they had last night, they had, you know, Bruins and Rangers and that kind of primetime window and Vegas and the nightcap.

28:19But to me, it just, they've been doing this for a few years now and I just don't really love it. Well, how do you think Braves and Phillies fans felt having all their games at 2 p.m. Eastern time for the first of the wildcard? But that's baseball, different sport. NBA also doing what the NHL has done in the last couple of seasons. Yeah, sure. They're going to have an afternoon start and they know. The numbers support this. This is research people telling them if you put an afternoon game on, you can get an audience much better than actually what we were showing, whether it was local news or otherwise.

28:45Yeah, for sure. They kind of own the day a little bit. They do some broader programming leading into that. No, I'm a fan of the traditional two-game doubleheader. Give me an early primetime window and a late primetime window for the West Coast. That's how I want to see a season. You should put your Stanley Cup champion in primetime. Open the next season. I know the NFL is different, but look how the NFL starts every season. They have one game in primetime. Make a big deal out of it. But to your point, why is Gary Bedman sitting a little pretty, I think? Because I think he's going to have multiple bidders there.

29:11I think he's going to have the right amount of bidders there for this next contract, regardless of what David Ellison decides to do. When you bring them together, TNT Sports and CBS Sports, are they going to stick with the NHL? I think that remains to be seen, whether they're going to be at the table for something like that. But like you alluded to, Prime Video has really made their presence felt in the United States now with some of these local deals. I think they're doing like seven local teams coverage this season in collaboration with the NHL. prime has been obviously a partner of the nhl on the canadian side for a couple of years now but this could be a big way for prime video to maybe get a national package in this next round of nhl media rights i think that'd be very very interesting all right awesome really excited to have the nhl season underway uh let's go to who won the weekend who won the weekend for you uh this past week you know i'm going to give it to the wmba and i know there's a lot going on there was president's cup nfl college football why am i giving it to the wmba i'll knock against the league has so often been, why are you putting your playoffs still up against the NFL in particular?

30:11And you got to give them credit. That fever Aces game one was ESPN ABC's third most watched NBA playoff game ever. Over 2.1 million viewers. Josh, that outdrew the final day of the President's Cup coverage. Not any knock against the President's Cup because this is Kayden Clark. It just shows what she can deliver. Shows what the Aces, also a draw, are able to deliver. we're going to get tonight game three of that series a big winner there is versant usa network cnbc going to have that game three not only is it going to be a solid number for them maybe their best wmba number yet but i think it's going to be a great ad for yes we have a semi-final series on usa we're going to have part of the wmba finals a lot of people forget that this year nbc and usa they're carrying the wmba finals it's not on abc espn this season but i like the number that they were able to pull with that first game in fever aces of the first round yeah and you look at a 4 p.m start going head i mean head to head with the nfl like kind of in the witching hour we talked about it it was that national window with cowboys so nice draw there i'm gonna stick in that same window and i'm gonna go with the president's cup two million viewers listen it's not an astronomical number for the final day there but you had an interesting event you had the international team which hasn't won since the 1990s in this event in the lead heading into Sunday.

31:27The U.S. makes a big comeback. And 2 million viewers on Sunday afternoon on NBC, up about 37 % over the most recent event back in 2024. Again, that's not a huge number. But it's decent when you're going up against, as you mentioned, WNBA playoffs, thick of an NFL slate on a Sunday afternoon, Cowboys-Ravens, big-time game like that. One reason I think of it as a win for the PGA Tour specifically is like, hey, it sets them up to go into the future in terms of what does Brian Rolap want to change about this event? And at least he can go in there and say, hey, look, our viewership, we saw a nice trend on.

32:01It's nothing to sleep on. Two million, nothing to sleep on. And it's also, that event, that final round in particular, it got a lot of exposure out there on social media with the president in attendance. Whatever you think about the president, having him at your sporting event draws a number of eyeballs on social media, especially for something like the President's Cup that wouldn't have gotten the attention on an NFL Sunday. Yeah, it's an event that a lot of people have complained and talked about the lack of juice around the event. So certainly a good thing to see numbers trending upward for that event.

32:29As I mentioned, like kind of as the PGA Tour, Brian Rolup has changed so much about the PGA Tour. Well, now you've got this one-sided event. You know, the Americans, this was their 11th straight win in this event. You know, so Brian Rolup has shown the appetite to make changes at the PGA Tour. So now he could look at the President's Cup and say, hey, we made money on the event. We saw viewership go up. What can we do with it next? I think it's a good cap to the PGA Tours. We'll call it the season. I know there are some fall season events, but as far as like marquee events for the 2026 calendar, having that strong number for the President's Cup is a good finish for Brian Roloff and company.

33:03Well, that does it for this week's SBJ Sports Media Podcast. Thanks again to our guests, UTA Sports Media co-heads Jerry Sobowitz and Ryan Hayden. And as always, thank you to our production team of Chris Mason, Reginald Walker and A.C. Wyatt. it. Finally, thank you for listening. Please make sure to like and subscribe to the pod wherever you get your podcasts. For Josh Carpenter, I'm Austin Karp. Make good choices out there, and we will talk to you all again next week.