Strongmen assemble: Putin, Kim and Xi in Beijing

0:00This is The Guardian.

0:09Today, Xi Jinping invites half the world to Beijing.

0:23As a scene designed to send a message to the world, this one wasn't subtle. On Beijing's avenue of eternal peace, Xi Jinping put himself front and centre, flanked on either side by Vladimir Putin and Kim Jong-un, both suited and smiling for the cameras. China, Russia, North Korea, all in lockstep. Leading a line of more than 20 world leaders, the three of them walked together to witness a victory parade like no other. And boy, what a show. More than 10 ,000 goose-stepping soldiers, air defense lasers, cutting-edge jets, stealth drones, hypersonic weapons. You name the military hardware and for 70 minutes, China paraded it through Tiananmen Square.

1:22— The Chinese leader said the world was facing a choice between peace or war, and that China firmly stands on the right side of history, notably absent any major leader from the Western world.

1:40And what's it all supposed to mean? Well, potentially, China hopes, a whole new world order. From The Guardian, I'm Noshin Iqbal. Today in Focus, China's super summit, grand parade and warning to the world.

2:02Amy Hawkins, you're The Guardian's China correspondent. and it seems to be a hell of a week to be watching China because of the sheer number of world leaders, all of the men who have been there over the past few days. It started with what's called the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation on Sunday and Monday. Can you tell us who was there? We had over 20 heads of state. We had Putin, the president of Russia. I thank you for the warm welcome extended to our entire delegation. Erdogan from Turkey, we had Lukashenko from Belarus, we had Pradao from Indonesia, Modi, the Indian Prime Minister, his first visit to China in several years.

2:52A real suite of global autocratic leaders coming to Beijing to gather and hobnob in one place and it's not something you see very often at this scale. I think most people, well, definitely myself, haven't necessarily heard of Shanghai Cooperation Organization until this week. Could you tell us what it is exactly? It is one of a number of initiatives that China has spearheaded to kind of show Chinese leadership on the world stage. It's a place in which leaders can discuss issues away from what they describe as US-led Western hegemony. The leaders of China, Russia and India are meeting together as China hosts a major Eurasian security summit.

3:35China's leader, Xi Jinping, is using the summit to present China as a stable alternative to the US-led world order. The Shanghai Corporation Organization represents half of the world's population. These huge countries which have long felt maybe sidelined by the US and now they are facing increasingly kind of erratic and unstable behavior from the US. It's even more of an opportunity for China to show leadership. I guess the most striking thing to come out of the summit this week is all the images, because you've got all these strongmen leaders basically cuddling up with each other. China's Xi Jinping called Russia's Vladimir Putin his old friend moments ago at today's summit.

4:14Also traveling to Beijing, North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un, along with a total of 26 foreign heads of state. Can you tell me more about them? Yeah, I mean, exactly like you say, they're all men. They're basically all from autocratic countries. The presence of Modi was probably the most significant one this year, just because he, you know, India is a democracy, has ostensibly had closer relations with the West over the years. The fact that Modi came, he was tweeting in Russian how great it was to be there and meeting with Putin. The kind of close personal relationship between Xi and Putin was very clear.

4:51Putin said that Sino-Russian ties were at an unprecedented level. They describe each other as dear friends. And so the kind of warmth between these leaders who are seen as serious security threats by the West was very evident.

5:10Distinguished colleagues, as early as 24 years ago when it was founded, the Shanghai Cooperation Organization established the Shanghai spirit. That is mutual trust, mutual benefit, equality. Xi Jinping looks very kind of relaxed among these leaders. He's not the most smiley or laid back guy, but his kind of reserve was a bit lifted and he is clearly very much in his element on his home turf, leaders coming to him. So this is really Xi's moment to shine on the diplomatic front.

5:54Amy, the show didn't just stop at the summit because after the conference, there was this extraordinary military parade in Beijing on Wednesday.

6:05Can you tell us what China was just happy to be showing off to the world? Yeah, so the parade was the real kind of pinnacle event of this week. It's a once-in-a-decade event. They last had a parade of this scale 10 years ago. And if there's one thing China does well, it's a huge synchronised parade. Quite remarkable compared to Trump's parade of not so long ago. Yes, yeah. And some people have drawn that exact comparison. They've been doing rehearsals for weeks. The disruption to Beijing has been huge. Not a kind of hair is out of place. You know, they pulled it off. They had hypersonic missiles on display, underwater drones.

6:49There's already widespread concern in the West about the fact that China, which already has the world's biggest army and the world's biggest navy, is rapidly increasing its military, both in size and technological advancement. And you saw some of this kit on display at the parade, particularly the types of technology that could be used to see off any aid that came to Taiwan in the event of a conflict with Taiwan and it was very impressive. And officially this parade is to mark the 80th anniversary of the surrender of Japan at the end of World War II. What is the story that China is trying to tell about that history and why does it matter now?

7:28Yeah, I think the message is that China is no longer a kind of mere witness or participant of global events, but it is the leader of global events. Particularly with regards to World War II, there's also been this massive propaganda push to say it was actually China that played the pivotal role in defeating Japan, while Russia or the Soviet Union played the pivotal role in Europe. And some people might wonder, well, why does the memory of World War II really matter in today's geopolitics? politics. But it's also important to remember that kind of a crucial part of the Chinese Communist Party's legitimacy is the fact that it defeated Japan in World War Two.

8:08So this is a resetting of the narrative from China's perspective. You know, the conference was about soft power, but this parade is very much about China's hard power and about telling a particular story about China's past, as you've mentioned. China, as we saw in Xi Jinping's speech on Wednesday, really presents itself as the vanguard of global stability, global peace. It defeated the aggressor in World War II is how they would describe it. And recently in China, there's been a massive push to kind of reset the narrative about World War II and really remind, especially domestic audiences, but also international audiences about China's role in defeating the Japanese.

8:46And a number of kind of blockbuster films have been released in China this year that are very kind of in the so-called wolf warrior genre, which just means very aggressive, very patriotic.

9:10Have they been popular? Yeah, they've done really well at the box office. And this is all part of China's attempt to show the world that actually China is a force for good in the world and also a very strong force. Its military is not something to be messed with.

9:32Amy, can you tell me a bit more about why now, in the sense that the Shanghai Cooperation Organization was formed sometime in the mid-2000s, but this show, the size of it and the scale of it, it's particularly to this moment. And I wonder what China is trying to tell the world this week. Yeah, I mean, I would say it's also particular to Xi Jinping. So he's been in power for more than 10 years now. And, you know, we saw in what he was wearing at the parade, he's wearing this kind of Chairman Mao style suit while Putin and Kim were in like more Western style suits. And Xi Jinping is the most powerful and the most autocratic leader of China since Mao Zedong.

10:13And I think this parade, which is, you know, the biggest we've seen in China in a long time is kind of in that vein. And he is also the commander of China's armed forces. Under the rule of Xi Jinping, he really pushed a much more nationalistic image on the world stage, much less keen and willing to cooperate with the West. And it's a real show that Xi Jinping thinks that China is ready to be the leader on the world stage. So essentially taking advantage of the unpredictability of the West, namely led by Trump and presenting China as a stable alternative to the rest of the world. Yeah, a stable and strong alternative.

10:49I mean, and Trump has been a real gift to Xi in that regard, his massive cutting of USAID funding around the world, the imposition of huge tariffs in lots of countries, and the complete instability and unpredictability of the US's behavior in terms of geopolitics. That has been very beneficial to China, who wants to partner with countries from all over the world and say, you know, if you work with China, if you give us your support on the world stage, if you do trade with China, you know what you're getting and we're not going to suddenly turn around and impose huge tariffs on you or tell you to democratize or protect human rights in your country.

11:30So it's kind of more of a no strings attached support. The US has slapped a crushing 50 % tariff on some Indian goods. The higher tariffs took effect earlier this hour, doubling the existing 25 % duty that was implemented on August the 7th. So with India, Narendra Modi went to China just after the US had imposed 50 % tariffs on Indian exports as a punishment for buying Russian oil. Similarly, you had the junta leader from Myanmar in Beijing this week. They've got a protracted civil war in their own country and are very grateful for Chinese support when it comes to arms, but also political support and legitimacy on the world stage, Like China will give legitimacy to these leaders who are not otherwise considered to be democratically elected or legitimate leaders by Western countries.

12:18For example, the leader of Indonesia, who's facing huge protests at home, he still considered it worthwhile to come to China this week. And I think it's a real chance for smaller economies and less powerful countries to come and show their allegiance to the Chinese vision of the world order. And what about with Putin? I mean, as you've said, he's described this moment in Chinese-Russian relations to be at their strongest ever. What's in it for him? I mean, what's in it for Putin is that China has been a complete lifeline for Russia since the start of the war in Ukraine. So as the Russian economy has been hit by Western sanctions and come under so much diplomatic pressure, Chinese and Russian bilateral trade has boomed.

13:00It's at record levels. The fact that China keeps on buying Russian oil and gas has kept the economy afloat. Western analysts generally agreed that without China's support, Russia would not have been able to continue the war on Ukraine to this point. And just this week, the two countries signed an agreement to build a new pipeline from Russia to China, which will go through Mongolia, which will allow, I think, 50 billion cubic meters of gas to be exported each year, which is a huge boon to Russia. And also, you know, in China, they're very concerned about energy security and have been trying to build up their own domestic supplies of energy.

13:40But if they've got a reliable supply from Russia, that's a supply that can't be interfered with by Western countries in the event that China is hit with sanctions in some future conflict. And of course, all of this will be watched quite closely by Trump and Western leaders. And what do you think the response is there to what they're seeing in terms of these deals being signed? Yeah, I mean, Trump sent a quite kind of sarky message on Wednesday about the parade, you know, saying congratulations on your parade. Enjoy conspiring against the US. And, you know, I mean, considering that Trump held his own military parade a few months ago, which was very unusual for a US president and very much in the style of an autocrat.

14:19You can't help but think maybe he's a bit jealous of the parade. Just a little bit. Yeah, the Chinese one definitely made the US one look a bit pathetic. But yeah, I think, you know, there will be growing alarm in the West about the strengthening of this alliance between China, Russia and North Korea. And the unspoken kind of elephant in the room of all of this is Taiwan. And, you know, will China ever try and take over Taiwan by military force? No one knows the answer to that question. But, you know, if they did, the US's ability and willingness to intervene in any potential conflict may be lessened by the fact that China is showing off this huge military might, which is designed to intimidate and deter any interventions.

15:05The events of this week will definitely be being closely watched in Washington. And it's very clear that while Trump himself is not necessarily the most kind of anti-China person, he's surrounded by people who are very hawkish on China. And part of the reason that at least when he came into office, he was intending to roll back US support and diplomacy in the Middle East and in Ukraine is partly because the US wants to focus all its attentions on the threat from China. and if that is your goal, if you're the National Security Advisor, if you're the Secretary of State in the US, then this week's events will have only heightened your concern about the need to invest more resources in figuring out how to handle China.

15:57Coming up, a big week for China. But is there anything concrete behind it all?

16:11Amy, what did all the powers there actually agree to do this week? Putin invited Kim Jong-un to Moscow for a meeting. 20 bilateral agreements between China and Russia were signed. China has introduced visa-free travel for Russian tourists to get more Russian ordinary people coming to China. At the SCO summit over the weekend, When China announced plans for an SEO development bank, it's not clear what the exact role of that bank will be or the exact structure. But it's another example of China trying to assert itself on the world stage. And, you know, for smaller countries that rely on borrowing for their own budgets, the options they have are, you know, things like the World Bank, the UN and so on.

16:52But now they have more and more options to borrow from Chinese lenders. and that obviously comes with influence and increases China's influence on the world stage. Is it fair to say that the bombast and the rhetoric, it's still quite far ahead of any concrete plans? Yeah, you know, for all the fact that there's all this impressive military kit on display, none of it's been tested in combat. Much of this week's announcements are more about kind of rhetoric and signalling And so when you look at, for example, the plans for a new SEO bank, it announced funding for$280 million in aid, which is actually not very much.

17:38Amy, despite this big show of unity, at the same time, a lot of these countries do have their own disagreements and conflicts, both with China and with each other. Can you tell me more about those? I think the most pressing internal conflict between these countries is the India-China border dispute. They have an unsettled border, which has been the scene of actual kind of clashes on and off over the years. And recently, when India and Pakistan had their own conflict, Pakistan was using Chinese-made jets to shoot down Indian jets. And even China and Russia have had their own border dispute that was only settled a few years ago now.

18:14So definitely there's some kind of complicated geopolitics internally within these countries. But I think the kind of broader picture is that they're willing to at least show to the outside world a display of unity and put their differences aside if it strengthens their position with regard to the US. Amy, finally, for your job, you talk to people in China every day, not just CCP officials, but normal, regular citizens. Do you get any sense of what they feel about this week's display to turn China into the world's dominant superpower? Yeah, I mean, there are definitely lots of people who are very supportive of that aim and very nationalist.

18:52And there's been a real kind of surge in recent years of nationalism in China and more what we might describe in the West as a kind of populist nationalism and kind of a might is right approach. and there's so much propaganda in China about overcoming the kind of century of humiliation that China was subjected to by the West and taking back its rightful place on the world stage and that is effective. It's kind of hard to underestimate the extent to which you're just kind of surrounded by it in China, online, on TV and films and the news. So that definitely does have an effect. At the same time, there are plenty of people who are a bit put off by the whole thing and they probably wouldn't say so publicly, but I mean, on the one hand, And the huge disruption to Beijing in the past few weeks has definitely annoyed a lot of people.

19:36And also the fact that Xi Jinping has completely cast himself as a strongman leader. He removed term limits for the presidency in 2018. And that still gets brought up as the kind of moment that people lost faith in Xi. The kind of bombastic events of this week will only underline to those people who think that Xi is trying to be a strongman leader, that that is really his goal. I think there are definitely people who very much disagree with the direction that he's taken the country in, but they don't really have many avenues to express that discontent. Amy, thank you so much for your time. Thanks for having me.

20:18That was Amy Hawkins, The Guardian's Beijing correspondent. My thanks to her.

20:25do follow her reporting on this story but also do check out the spectacle of images and videos put together by our editors all which is on the site at theguardian.com

20:39that's it for today this episode was presented by me Nosheen Iqbal it was produced by Ruth Abrahams and Eli Block sound design is by Joel Cox the executive producer was Sammy Kent We'll see you again tomorrow.