How Microplastics Are Ruining Your Health And What You Can Do About It - Dr. Rhonda Patrick

22:21Because we've done numerous interviews with demographers, and they're talking about there's a population crisis in the West and across the developed world. And look, there's societal factors for that and et cetera. But you're looking, you're going declining testosterone. You know, men are going to be more anxious. They're going to be less fertile. They're going to want sex less. You go, this is a recipe for disaster when it comes to declining birth rates, isn't it?

22:47Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And it's not just men. These chemicals are affecting female reproduction as well. In fact, there have been studies showing that BPA, bisphenol A, that plastic compound, it's associated with women that are undergoing in vitro fertilization. If they have high BPA levels, it reduces their success rate by 50%. Wow. 50%. It also, egg quality is reduced. So we're talking about exactly on a very fundamental level, it is affecting human life, right? Our ability to procreate. both on the male and the female side. And these chemicals are, like I said, they're everywhere. Heat really speeds up the process of it coming into our water, into our beverages, into our food, because the oxidation...

23:36Dr. Rhonda Patrick:It's like almost time passing. It takes a lot of time for oxidation, but when you heat it up, you're oxidizing it really fast, and so you're getting just orders of magnitude more of these chemicals and plastics and stuff in your food. And that's why the to-go coffee mugs are such a big... In my mind, it's like, why haven't we solved this problem? All these cardboard plastic mugs are lined with these plastic lining to prevent the beverage from leaching and breaking down the cardboard. But you can use other things. You can use polylactic acid from sugar cane to do that. It's more expensive, but this needs to be done because adding the heated beverage to these plastic lining is the worst thing you can do in terms of plastics getting into your beverage, but also these chemicals.

24:20Dr. Rhonda Patrick:These chemicals are really getting into the beverages. BPA, there is a pretty short half-life. It's like a couple of hours, two to three hours. But the problem is we're constantly exposed to it, just constantly, constantly. So it's just always in our body. There are ways that we can get rid of BPA. Some does come out of sweat. Mostly we're getting rid of it through our urine. So if you exercise or you're using the sauna, you can excrete a little bit more BPA through sweat. But that's not the major root of excretion of this compound. It's actually through urine. And so there is an argument to be made to increase your consumption of a certain compound called sulforaphane, which is found in cruciferous vegetables like broccoli, kale, cabbage, that whole family.

25:12Dr. Rhonda Patrick:All the sexy greens. I know, all the ones that taste so good. it's really high in actually broccoli sprouts, which is the young broccoli plant. In fact, there's like a hundred times more of the precursor of sulforaphane in it. So sulforaphane is actually formed once the plant is crushed or like chopped or something. It's, by the way, it's actually a plant insecticide. So the reason the plant makes this is because it's trying to ward off insects. And so when we consume it, you know, we're chewing it and that's when we make, that's when the plant actually makes the sulforaphane. But sulforaphane activates these enzymes that are involved in excreting BPA and other harmful compounds that were exposed to, like benzene from air pollution.

25:54Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And it will, for example, in benzene, in the case of benzene, it increased the excretion by 60 % after just 24 hours. And again, this is like, benzene's a carcinogen, it's found in air pollution, cigarette smoke. The same enzymes that get rid of benzene are getting rid of BPA and BPS. and phthalates. And so there's a case to be made to eat your broccoli sprouts or supplement with a good, high-quality sulforaphane supplement. I mean, obviously, you want to try to avoid, you know, like I don't like to drink out of plastic bottles, you know, but there's a case to be made to, you know, supplement with this sulforaphane supplement as well.

26:30Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Well, here's the thing, though,

26:30Francis Foster:on the plastic bottles thing, I don't know if you saw this. There was something that went viral the other day when they did tests on glass bottles and they found they actually have more plastics in them because of the lids.

26:39Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Yes. Is that true? I'm so glad you brought this up. Let's talk about that.

26:42Francis Foster:Let's talk about that.

26:43Dr. Rhonda Patrick:So there there have been that wasn't the only study, by the way. There have been other studies that have done that have measured. So now we're talking about microplastics. We were talking about the chemicals associated with those plastics. But part of the problem with microplastics is they are a vector for these chemicals and they're in your body. Right. So microplastics range in size from like five millimeters, which is like the size of a grain of rice to like 100 nanometers, which is like a thousand times smaller than a grain of sand. So they're very, very, you know, wide ranging. Size does matter.

27:13Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And that's why I'm bringing this up. Size does matter.

27:16Francis Foster:This is going to be a great clip. You go, size matters.

27:18Dr. Rhonda Patrick:The bigger the plastics, the better, the better, actually. So sizes matter. So the study did look at microplastics that were shed in the beverage from plastic bottles or glass bottles. And as you said, shockingly, the glass bottles had more particles particles of microplastics than the plastic bottles. However, the size of the microplastics, because these microplastics were coming from the lid, as you mentioned, they're coming from the paint on the lid, they were larger in size. Why is that important? Because the larger microplastics less readily are absorbed in our gut than the smaller ones are.

27:57Dr. Rhonda Patrick:So you're much better off still drinking more quantity of larger microplastics than smaller quantity of the smaller ones, because the smaller ones are very, very problematic. Those are the ones that are getting into our gut and getting absorbed into our bloodstream. Once they're in our bloodstream, they're accumulating in organs, and then we can talk about the damage they're doing there.

28:19Francis Foster:I sort of feel like we've kind of got a shitty deal either way. Like, why are we drinking all this stuff in the first place?

28:24Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I mean, I think the companies that are making these glass, whether it's a beer bottle or my Mountain Valley spring water that I like because it's in a glass bottle, they can actually take action and do something about the paint that's getting into the water, right? It's easy to rinse off, blow air, get this stuff, or don't use the paint. Why do we need the paint? I don't need to paint on the lid. I don't care. Put it on the glass part, right? Not on the lid. So I do think that there can be action that's taken by the companies themselves. But even at home, like if you get open your glass bottle of water, you can rinse the lid off, right, too.

29:05Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Like so it's not continually shedding. But yeah, I still I'm still drinking the glass bottled water versus the plastic. You know, as you talk, I'm thinking more and more. So when I used to teach, I saw year upon year, more and more kids get diagnosed with ADHD, more and more kids get diagnosed with autism. And I was looking at these kids and going, are we just over-diagnosing? Is there something literally in the water? Is there a connection between conditions like ADHD, autism, and also other conditions as well, and these microplastics? Yes, there is. And yes, it is something in the water. It's called microplastics and the chemicals associated with them.

29:48Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Obviously, there is an increased awareness and people are, you know, aware more. And I do think it's overdiagnosis. I mean, like, kids are being diagnosed with ADHD. Boys are being diagnosed with ADHD. And really, they're just boys, right? I mean, they're just boys. So that's, aside from that issue, there are studies that have now linked, again, back to the bisphenol A, BPA, and BPS, they've linked that to autism and ADHD. So there have been studies with pregnant women that have the highest levels of BPA in their urine. They're six times more likely to have a child diagnosed with autism by the age of 11 than women with the lowest levels of BPA.

30:33Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I'm citing this one study because the statistic is shocking. Six times more likely. That's a very shocking number. But I want to, I just want to sort of emphasize that there's not just one study showing this correlation. This is just the big statistic number correlation. There's multiple studies showing this correlation between higher levels of BPA and increased autism risk. There's also animal evidence. So if you give pregnant female mice BPA, if you make them exposed to the BPA, they also are more likely to have pups that are, you know, As much as you can correlate this autistic-like behavior in these pups, that's what you're seeing in these pups, right?

31:15Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And again, this comes down to the disruption of hormones. And it's particularly during a very, very important time during development, brain development. And so I mentioned the aromatase enzyme. A lot of men are probably like, oh, aromatase, well, that's what causes my testosterone to be converted into estrogen, right? you do want some amount of estrogen. I mean, biology is the way it is for a reason, right? And so you don't want to be disrupting this delicate balance between hormones. Things are supposed to be, you're supposed to have high levels of estrogen at certain points and periods of development.

31:51Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And it's actually, we were talking about this earlier, it's counterintuitive because, you know, BPA is inhibiting that aromatase enzyme. That aromatase enzyme is important for increasing estrogen, particularly during very specific moments of brain development and what happens is is it is that estrogen is very important for actually masculinizing the male brain it's counterintuitive but it's pretty pretty well known that estrogen plays a role in actually masculinizing the male brain and so when you're not getting those estrogen surges during brain development what happens is the connectivity of the brain the wiring of the brain the structure of the brain isn't quite right.

32:32Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And so that's, you know, playing a role in, at least that's what's thought to partly play a role in the increased autism risk in women that are having these, you know, high exposures to BPA. And then again, like I said, you know, it's something that's been shown in, replicated in animal studies, which is nice. Again, going to that totality of evidence when you're like, okay, I'm looking at the epidemiological observational data with the correlation that doesn't equal causation, But now I have a mechanism here. I know that the mice are also better exposed to it. We see the same thing. And then we look at the genetic data.

33:05Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And if you look at genetic data in boys that have dysfunctional aromatase enzymes, guess what? They're much more likely to be diagnosed with autism, especially if they also have an environmental insult. So there's this gene environment interaction when you're already sort of vulnerable and then you add in that insult and you just get that plastic chemical. So any sort of aromatase function that they were having as low as it was now is like worse. Right. And so that's like that double whammy sort of effect. That's also known to be to play a role in autism as well. And then there's some interesting data on actually children with autism.

33:40Dr. Rhonda Patrick:This is really interesting. they have some sort of dysfunctional mechanism in excreting BPA. So children with autism oftentimes have like 15 times higher level of BPA than non-autistic children. And it has to do with like the excretion pathway I was talking about. And it's really, really interesting because this is all connected. That sulforaphane supplement that I was telling you about, so this is extracted from broccoli sprouts, the richest source of that compound, right? That sulforaphane compound has been now used in two different clinical studies, placebo-controlled trials, one with children with autism spectrum disorder and one with adolescents with autism spectrum disorder.

34:23Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And they were given this sulforaphane compound or a placebo. And the children that got the sulforaphane compound, it improved, you know, the whole battery of tests that they do for the autism, you know, array of tests that they do to look at, you know, improvements and symptoms. And so it was in two studies that it was shown to improve. And again, I mentioned that sulforaphane, it helps excrete BPA. Kind of interesting that the autistics are having such high levels of BPA. And BPA also is disrupting the hormones, right? Disrupting the hormones, causing oxidative stress and stuff. So I thought that was a very interesting connection between sort of all these pieces of the puzzle that we're talking about, like the plastic chemicals, the BPA, the hormone disruption, and then the autism.

35:07Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And by the way, ADHD is another one that's associated with BPA levels as well. So it's all linked. And, you know, there's a lot of underlying, I would say there's a lot of common denominators between ADHD and autism spectrum disorder. I'm like, there's so many different commonalities between the two. I mean, that's why it's a spectrum, right? You know, and I really truly believe that, first of all, that there's overdiagnosis, particularly with ADHD. I think that's, you can't ignore it. I mean, we were talking about studies that I read a few years ago where boys that were born in July and August, these are the youngest in the class, are three to four times more likely to be diagnosed with ADHD.

35:46Dr. Rhonda Patrick:There's nothing about being born in July or August that makes you have ADHD. You're just the younger boy, and so you're moving around more. The teachers are comparing you to the girls or to the older kids that are a little more school-ready, right?

35:59Francis Foster:That's crazy to me because, you know, we talked about this. I have a three-year-old and I take him to football, soccer, you'd call it every weekend. And if whenever there's an older child there who's been brought by a sibling with a sibling or something like that, you go, the level of distractibility in these two groups of humans is so vastly different.

36:18Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Yeah.

36:19Francis Foster:And boys and girls are so vastly different. It's become the controversial thing to say, but they are.

36:24Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Oh, yeah. Very different.

36:26Francis Foster:To compare them on things like distractibility, ability to concentrate and then go, well, one has a, that's not to say there isn't ADHD, it's just, it seems like if you start telling these myths about how we're all the same and ignoring certain realities, you're going to end up in a bad place in that way.

36:44Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Right. No, I mean, obviously there is such a thing as ADHD. But, you know, the fact of the matter is, is that it's, the kids are not just meant to sit still for so long, especially when they're younger. and it does make it easier on the teacher to have kids that just sit still and like pay attention. So to some degree, and I don't want to blame teachers because like they're doing amazing jobs, but like to some degree, maybe they're not even aware of it. You know, maybe they're not even aware of the fact that they're comparing them. And there's all sorts of things going on behind the picture. But, you know, back to the environmental chemicals.

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40:36Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Back to the environmental chemicals and to your question, You know, they are definitely playing a role. We have the data to back it up. We have the mechanism. You know, we have animal evidence, just all the things pointing to it. And, you know, I don't think it's the only thing playing a role in autism and ADHD. I think the reality is playing a role. I think other other environmental, you know, because there's genetics, right?

40:59Francis Foster:Genetics is a massive fact.

41:00Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Definitely genetics. And I think the genetics is like the is like the template. like it like sets you up for the environmental insults that we're all exposed to now that make those individuals more vulnerable and that's what we've seen with this aromatase enzyme data whereas like the boys that have the the defects in this aromatase are much more vulnerable to the environmental insults right and so i think that you know the genetics you you can't ignore but but it's really an interaction between the genetics and the environment. And if you can, there's some degree that you don't have control over your genes, right?

41:39Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I mean, you know, obviously there's futurism stuff where you're going to, you know, be mating with the people and you're going to be looking at your genes and doing all that. But like, that's not where we're at right now, right? There's only so much control you have over your genes. What you do have control over is what you put in your body, what you're exposed to. I mean, to some degree, right? Like we were talking about, I mean, like, you know, you don't even you don't even realize that your to go coffee cup is like a BPA factory. I mean, every time you I can't even think about how many like hot teas.

42:07Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And by the way, we got to talk about tea. But like, you know, the hot coffees and stuff.

42:11Francis Foster:That is sacrilegious on a British show. I we're going to talk about tea. You're going to ruin tea.

42:18Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I'm going to ruin tea, but only tea bags, tea and tea bags.

42:21Francis Foster:My wife is so onto this. Go on.

42:23Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Yes. Yes, yes. Because there have been studies now showing that the teabags themselves, particularly the ones that are like the pyramid-shaped ones, like the bougie teas, billions of microplastics. And remember, the microplastics have these chemicals associated with them. Billions being released into your cup of tea. Even the ones made of cellulose are releasing microplastics. So you have to use loose leaf tea. or, I mean, you can look for, there's some tea brands that are marketing themselves as plastic-free or microplastic-free. I don't trust it. I go for Loose Leaf. And if I can't get Loose Leaf at a restaurant, I ask them to give me fresh mint and lemon and I just use that as my tea because, yeah.

43:05So the question is this. From a political point of view, the evidence that you've outlined seems rock solid. So from a political point of view, autism is at the forefront. We've seen RFK Jr. talk about it. We've seen the conversation that has been had around Tylenol. And you go, this seems far more rock solid in terms of its evidence than Tylenol does. So why aren't we talking about this?

43:30Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I don't know. We need to be talking about this. We really do. Yeah, there is evidence of acetaminophen. And, you know, the problem, and I've been looking, by the way, I've been interested in this evidence, like, for the last 10 years. You can like go back and search X and I've like been tweeting about it. Like at least eight years ago, I was tweeting about acetaminophen link to ADHD and autism. So I was interested in it before it became a political issue just because I've published on autism. I've been very interested in autism for many years. But I think that, you know, with the Tylenol link, and there is a link there, by the way, and it certainly seems to be more predominant in males than females, which I think confuses the data a little bit because then you'll see that female fetuses that have been exposed to Tylenol in utero don't seem to be as vulnerable.

44:22Dr. Rhonda Patrick:But again, they're not as vulnerable in general to any of the environmental insults. And also as well, it's much more difficult to pick up autism in girls. Girls are much better at masking. That's another thing. True, true. That's a very good point. Yeah. Very good point. But yeah, when it comes to Tylenol, maternal fever is something that is also very well known to play a role in autism. So women that have a fever are much more likely to have a child with autism spectrum disorder. And so if you think about people that are taking Tylenol, they're also trying to reduce their fever. In fact, there's some interesting data out there that women that have a fever and take Tylenol actually have a lower risk of having a child with autism versus the woman that's taking the Tylenol every day because she has the headache or she has morning sickness.

45:06Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And it's the chronic use of it, you know, that I think is the more danger. The fever is dangerous. So taking Tylenol for a fever once or twice, there's evidence showing that's beneficial. But it's the chronic use of Tylenol. When it comes to the plastic chemicals, I feel like the evidence is so strong. We have the animal evidence. We have the genetic evidence. We have the epidemiological evidence. I don't know why it's not being talked about more. I'm genuinely wanting this to be a discussion. So I'm glad that we're talking about it because I think it needs to be discussed. I think it needs to be, you know, the thing is, is that it's also hard to get rid of, it's much easier to tell a woman, hey, don't take Tylenol every day while you're pregnant.

45:52Dr. Rhonda Patrick:BP is in everything. It's so much more pervasive and ubiquitous in our culture and in everything that we're eating and putting in our bodies and our drinking water, that it's harder to solve that problem. Do you think, and this is maybe the conspiratorial part of me. Is it as well governments going, I don't want to open this can of worms because once we open the can of worms, then big business and my donors are going to get upset and, you know, profits are going to go down. I'm going to be the bad guy, et cetera. No, I mean, I've thought about that. I've thought about that. Well, I'm like, I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but like I've thought about why isn't this being discussed?

46:33Dr. Rhonda Patrick:and it's only, to me, the only solution that I've come up with is because it is in everything. And so how do you fix that?

46:43Francis Foster:It's hard to fix.

46:44Dr. Rhonda Patrick:It's hard to fix.

46:45Francis Foster:So that being the case, and we haven't seen that politicians act quickly or effectively lately. So in terms of what we have left as individuals, what are some of the key steps that we should all be taking, in your opinion, to reduce our exposure to this stuff?

47:00Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Yes, I think there are some very, there's some heavy hitters here that can make a big difference, get you a big bang for your buck. And this is also in terms of microplastic exposure. Again, microplastics have their own problems and they have the chemicals that they're carrying with them. But one of the first and foremost things that people should do is get a water filter. The best one you can get is a reverse osmosis water filter. You can get a countertop one. that filters out 99 % of microplastics and it's filtering out bisphenol A, bisphenol S, the phthalates, the forever chemicals, PFAS. It's filtering out all those chemicals that are endocrine disruptors, that are disrupting hormones, that are associated with neurodevelopmental disorders like autism spectrum disorder, like ADHD.

47:48Dr. Rhonda Patrick:So a countertop one is an easy solution for people. You can get a whole house one as well. The caveat there is reverse osmosis does filter out everything, including trace elements and minerals that we actually want in our water. And so you can add those back with, you know, a mineral supplement, or you can get these little mineral drops to add back to your water that have these trace elements, you know, like manganese and selenium and these things that like, you know, you want in your water. And so that is also important to consider. Number one thing that you could do, easiest, easiest solution right there.

48:23Dr. Rhonda Patrick:You're going to be doing so much by doing that. The second thing I would say is avoid heating any kind of plastic, okay? Whether it's like your Tupperware, like get rid of any spatulas, all those plastic, anything that's plastic that's going to touch heat, don't do that. And I want to get to the coffee cups because that's the one you don't think about because it doesn't look like plastic. It's very tricky because they're lined with plastic. You have to like, I really want these companies like Starbucks and everyone to like start lining their cups with polylactic acid. You know, why not? You can, you can do it.

49:00Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I know Blue Bottle Coffee does it. It's the only, only one that I know that does, but you can, you can get sugar cane and line them. But like, until then bring your own mug or, you know, I don't know, stop drinking to go coffee because you're talking 55-fold more BPA into your beverage than if you were drinking just water from a plastic bottle. 55-fold. The other thing is shift from drinking out of plastic water bottles as much as you can. And certainly don't let them sit out in the sun, let them sit in your car, because that's, again, accelerating the breakdown of the plastic and the chemicals are going into your beverage.

49:37But when you say that, Rhonda, then I think, well, look at the supply chain. And as a supply chain, these are not always going to be perfectly chilled or at room temperature. They're going to be thrown in a corner somewhere. They're going to get crushed. They're going to get heated up. They're going to become warm. They're going to become cool and then warm again. Do you know what I mean?

49:54Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Yes, yes. When they're on the truck, they're in the summer. They're being transported to where? They're in the warehouse. They're sitting in, yeah. The reality is, don't drink out of the bottle. Just get rid of the plastic bottles. Get rid of them.

50:07Francis Foster:One thing we haven't talked about is tap water. Yes. Because the filter covers that, right? And what about hormones? Is there any truth to this idea that since the invention of the pill, there's now more female hormones in the water supply? Have I just got that out of my ass?

50:25Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I mean, I think there's some places maybe where you live where the tap water is. You're giving me the this is BS face.

50:34Francis Foster:You can just say this is BS.

50:36Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I think the bigger problem is the BPA that's disrupting our hormones. If you want to focus, if you want to be angry at something, you know, that's what you should be angry about. Because that's actually what's disrupting our hormones. And it's really what's ubiquitous.

50:50Francis Foster:So water filter, avoid coffee cups, avoid heating plastic, avoid plastic bottles.

50:54Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Yeah, that's the major thing for the BPA. Now microplastics, we're breathing them in. But like...

51:02Okay.

51:04Francis Foster:Anything else?

51:05Dr. Rhonda Patrick:For the BPA? For everything.

51:08Francis Foster:to do with plastics, microplastics.

51:10Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Yeah, I mean, yes. I would say that if we're talking about plastics on the whole, microplastics as well. So the major source is ingestion. And I mentioned size matters. Well, it turns out fiber, dietary fiber also can help you excrete microplastics. So both like the, you've heard of like prebiotics and fermentable fibers, soluble fiber. It creates like a viscous gel in your gut and that encapsulates plastic particles and moves them out through your feces. So you poop them out. So fiber is actually good for that reason. The other thing with the microplastics, so everything that I mentioned, reverse osmosis, water filter, not drinking out of plastic bottles, not heating them, all that also applies to microplastics because you're ingesting them.

51:52Dr. Rhonda Patrick:You're also ingesting microplastics in your food. So you want to avoid, like the oceans are polluted with them. So you want to avoid eating like fish that have their intact gut and intestines, like shellfish, you know, eating like shrimp or things like that because the microplastics are accumulated in the intestines of the fish.

52:09Francis Foster:I'm regretting doing this episode now. I love prawns.

52:14Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Yeah, prawns, exactly.

52:16Francis Foster:Shrimp, yeah, as you call them.

52:17Dr. Rhonda Patrick:But the other major source of microplastics is actually from the air we breathe. And so we are breathing in microplastics constantly, and that's also because we live in a plastic world. So, you know, tires, if you're in an urban place, that tires are made of rubber, but also a lot of plastic polymers. so the friction of like the tire is like bringing it into the air we have our clothes that are nice cool fancy clothes that we wear microplastics are all in the clothes so we wash them and they come come out they get in the ocean but also the dryer they come out into our environment they're so we're breathing these in our shoes i mean just everywhere okay it's in the air and so um when we breathe in the microplastics they get into our lungs which plays a role in respiratory disease but also So this is very disturbing.

53:08Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Essentially, so have you guys heard about this study? This was done in Sao Paulo, Brazil, where they looked at a variety of different organs and microplastics in those organs. And it was found that microplastics accumulated in the brain 10 to 20 times more than other organs. They're essentially everywhere. They're in 100 % of semen samples that have been measured. They're in testicles. They're everywhere, placenta. but 10 to 20 times more in the brain, which is astounding considering we have something called the blood-brain barrier that's supposed to not let stuff get into the brain like microplastics, right?

53:42Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And so part of that is that the nanoplastics, the size matters. So like the small ones are getting in. But the other part is that when we are breathing in microplastics, so we have something in our olfactory, in our nose called olfactory neurons. And those neurons have fibers that extend into our brain. And so essentially, you breathe in the microplastics and they can get into the brain through the olfactory fibers and then get transported to other parts of the brain. A lot of scientists have sort of, I would say, they're using this method to deliver drugs to get past the blood-brain barrier because it's a way to get past it.

54:17Dr. Rhonda Patrick:So essentially, you're breathing in microplastics and those are getting to the brain. There's studies now showing that people with Alzheimer's disease postmortem, if you look at their brain, they have 10 times more microplastics than postmortem brain in people without Alzheimer's. So it's playing a role in Alzheimer's disease as well. So you want to air filter. This is what I'm getting to, an air filter. You want to like, you know, any kind of HEPA filter. It can be, you know, it doesn't have to be the fancy, like really like medical grade ones. It can be any kind of HEPA filter. They really do work.

54:47Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I have a Honeywell HEPA filter in all the rooms in my bedroom. I also have an IQ air monitor that measures the particulate matter. And you can see the data. If you turn off the filter, the particulate matter goes up. And it's very, very obvious. Like if I'm traveling, I unplug everything. I don't like leave the filters running. And you look at the IQ, and it's like, oh, it goes up. So an air filter is another thing that I would say is a simple solution with in terms of getting rid of the microplastics that we didn't cover as well. Rhonda, and there's been one thing that I read about that was very interesting, positively racist, which is black plastic, which is the worst type of plastic.

55:25Dr. Rhonda Patrick:It is. So black plastic. So there's another type of chemical called brominated chemicals. Brominated chemicals are a type of chemical that's flame retardant. So flame retardants are often put in electronics because electronics, we don't want them starting fires. right? And so black plastic is often made from recycled electronics, hence the black color. And so these recycled electronics have the brominated chemicals in them. And there was a very famous study that was published in like 2018. I think it was like the University of Plymouth or something that published a study showed they looked at a variety of black plastic articles.

56:03Dr. Rhonda Patrick:So everything from black spatulas to like spoons to like baby toys and found that they had 30 to 40 times higher levels of these brominated chemicals, which by the way, are known carcinogens, then is considered safe. And so black plastic is something you definitely want to avoid. I mean, have you ever ordered like a rotisserie chicken? And it's like the chicken's still hot and the bottom of the thing is like black. And remember I told you, heat is accelerating the leaching of everything into your food, whether it's a brominated chemical or a BPA or a microplastic, it's all coming in and it's accelerating the process in real time.

56:43Dr. Rhonda Patrick:It's almost like getting something that was like, over the course of 10 years, this is leached into your... And it's just like minutes, right? Because that's what the heat does. It accelerates that oxidation process. So you want to avoid the black chemical, sorry, the black plastic as well. The black straw is like everything. The black stuff, it's not good, especially heating it. So get rid of all the black spatulas because that's like the worst culprit is the heat plus the plastic. So that's also something that's bad. And that's associated with cancer, the brominated chemicals as well. And but it's also the pans as well, because let's talk about pans, because I never like when I was a kid, like there was a pan, we'd never had much money.

57:21Like if there was a pan with a few scratches on it, who cares?

57:24Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I know, I know. Teflon. Yeah. So the Teflon, that that's actually has forever chemicals in it. So we didn't talk about forever chemicals. They're called PFAS. And they're called forever chemicals because they last in our environment for like years. So they're in our bodies. I told you BPAs, half-life is about two to three hours. It's excreted through your urine. Forever chemicals, the PFAS are in your body for like four to five years. So really a long time. These chemicals are added things to make them water repellent, stick nonstick, oil resistant, stain resistant, all those things, right? And so you have these pans that are nonstick and you're heating them.

58:07Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I probably have forever chemicals in me from when I was a kid. I remember my mom bought all that nonstick pan. We were cooking with that. And so that's the worst thing that you can do is heat that nonstick pan because you're getting those PFAS forever chemicals in you. And those are also disrupting hormones. Those are also associated with cancer as well. So yeah, also in our clothing, right? So anything that's just like water repellent clothing, I mean, that stuff is all forever chemical that you're getting into your skin and absorbing. The worst is eating it though. The worst is eating it. And the forever chemicals are now, unfortunately, they're attracted to, they're lipophilic, so they're attracted to fat.

58:47Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And they're found in high fat foods. So it's been shown now that our water sources are contaminated with phthalates. They're contaminated with forever chemicals. and so you have this sludge this like you know this this fertilizer that's used in you know farming and stuff um even the or even the organic farms are now contaminated with forever chemicals and phthalates which is in the sludge and um which have all these chemicals and so the cows are eating it and the way that the cows get rid of forever chemicals not like us we don't excrete it through our milk but they're they get rid of it through their milk their dairy and so there i don't know if you've, have you guys seen these studies that have been done where they've gone around and looked at milk, like organic grass fed, like the thing that you think's the best, tons of forever chemicals in it because the cows are contaminated and they're screening it through their milk.

59:38Dr. Rhonda Patrick:So dairy, milk, high fat butter, cheese, this all has the phthalates and the forever chemicals because they're lipophilic and they're attracted to fat. And so now even our fat foods are like sources for this chemicals. This is probably why no one wants to address the issue because it's like, what do you, It's everywhere. It's like, you have to do what you can. I call it like, it's like imperfect avoidance because like, you have to eat, you have to live, right? But like, do what you can to like reduce your exposure, whether it's, you know, the reverse osmosis filter, you know, getting the air filter, doing, not cooking with the Teflon pans and not heating the plastic and not drinking it to go.

1:00:17Dr. Rhonda Patrick:All those things, do all those things. Like, because you're going to be exposed to it. Like you order takeout, you know, those like, If you go to a bakery and it's like the tissue paper, that's all lined with forever chemicals. It's to prevent the grease from...

1:00:28Francis Foster:Or if you get pho, they give you a black plastic bowl.

1:00:31Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Oh, the pho is the worst. I can't tell you, during my 20s, I love pho and I take out pho and the plastic container. I mean, I know. And receipts. Oh, and receipts, yes. Receipts are terrible. I have this funny story. Receipts? Yeah. Oh, yes. Well, like paper receipts. Yes, yes, yes. What's wrong with receipts? It's dropping, mate. Oh, my gosh. You haven't heard about this? No. So, so receipts are, you know, the printing that's on the receipt is done with thermal paper. And essentially the way that you're able to get the ink, it's not ink, it's like the printing on it is it's coated with BPA. Coated with it.

1:01:10Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Bisphenol A, that's stuff that we're talking about. Now, the worst insult is ingesting it. but unfortunately if you have any kind of cream on your fingers or like sanitizer everyone uses now ever since covid like this hand sanitizer everyone uses that causes the bpa from the receipts to go into your circulation a hundredfold a hundredfold so you don't want you don't want to touch receipts and if you're someone that's working in like your you know with the cash register or anything like that you have to use nitrile gloves like you don't want to be touching that every day. Latex gloves don't do it.

1:01:45Dr. Rhonda Patrick:It has to be nitrile and latex doesn't filter out the BPA. But it's funny. I was in the San Diego airport and this guy was there and I just couldn't help myself because he was like, I saw him like the person in front giving receipts. And I was like, he's giving all these people receipts. And finally he came to me and I come up with my Yeti glass. And I was like, hey, can you put my like latte in my Yeti? You know? And he's like, oh, yeah. Because I didn't want the to-go cup. And I was like, hey, by the way, you know, you shouldn't be handling those receipts because they're coated with BPA. I'm like, do you know what BPA is?

1:02:15Dr. Rhonda Patrick:And he goes, oh yeah, something like endocrine. I was like, yes, it disrupts your hormone, testosterone. And it's a funny story. I was in the airport. I was going on Chris Williamson's podcast and I talked all about some of this stuff. And then I went, you know, I don't know, a month later, I was back at the same coffee place and he was there and everyone working there, I told him to wear nitrile gloves. Everyone working there was wearing nitrile gloves. I know it was awesome. but um so that's a kind of a funny story yeah but receipts are terrible because they have the bpa and like i freak out if like my son somehow will like get the receipt get a hold of receipt you know because it's disrupting the hormones and do you know what this conversation reminds me have you

1:02:51Francis Foster:seen that uh seriously good place no no a long story very short but basically it's about people uh who end up either going to hell to heaven depending on the total sum of their actions that they've taken throughout the course of their life that they do good things that they do bad things. And what they find is that society gets technologically more sophisticated. Everyone goes to hell because every decision now is so complicated and has so many trade-offs. So if you eat a tomato, some poor guy somewhere has had to grow that in some terrible circumstances. And it sort of feels like this with everything that we're consuming now.

1:03:24Francis Foster:Well, you're having to make choices between these two terrible options. Either you drink out of a plastic bottle, that's really bad for you. Drink out of a glass bottle, and that's just bad for you. you know it's just so complex now so i guess you haven't given us some like big hitters is where people should start really isn't it i think the big hitters is really like i said it's

1:03:44Dr. Rhonda Patrick:it's the water filter if you can if you can just get water from your faucet and have a reverse osmosis filter on that that's the best thing that you can do travel around with your own you know to go with yeti or whatever your favorite brand is a hydro flask or something and drink out of that water. That's one of the big things. And then just avoid the heating. You know, those two things will make such a big difference in terms of your exposure. Because a lot of it is coming from our water and heating the plastic stuff that we're consuming, whether it's to-go coffee cups or to-go food items as well.

1:04:20Dr. Rhonda Patrick:You know, I guess it's an argument to be made to cook at home too, you know? I mean, it really is because it's all in the restaurant industry. I mean, they're using all these, you know, containers and who knows what they're, are they using Teflon nonstick? Probably. It's easier to cook with. I mean, much easier to cook scrambled eggs on a Teflon pan than like cast iron or something. Right. So you just never know what you're getting when you're eating out as well. But I think at the end of the day, you know, obviously I don't think, I think there are other things that are very important to focus on with respect to health.

1:04:54Dr. Rhonda Patrick:But I think this is a topic that needs to be discussed because I do think it's affecting it's affecting hormone levels but it's affecting fertility and it's affecting neurodevelopment and i think that is so important you know i think it's so important because we have all these insults and we have to try to like at least do something as much as we can you know to to help decrease some of that insult that's that's really kind of affecting like you said our ability to procreate. I mean, that's crazy.

1:05:25Francis Foster:It's kind of important.

1:05:26Dr. Rhonda Patrick:50 % reduction, you know, in sperm production over the last few decades. I mean, that's a lot.

1:05:35Francis Foster:Well, thank you for ruining everything that we used to love. Including tea. Including tea. I mean, that really was a lot of love. And gum. And gum. Yeah.

1:05:46Dr. Rhonda Patrick:Gum base is made of plastic polymers. It wasn't before World War II, but after World War II, Gum base is plastic polymer, so you have to look for microplastic-free gum. Well, that's another thing crossed off the list. I know, but of course, the plastic-free gum taste, it's made of plant sap and stuff, and so the texture is awful, but yeah.

1:06:05Francis Foster:There we go. Well, before we head on over to our sub-stack where we ask you questions from our audience, thank you so much for being here. The last question we always end on is, what's the one thing we're not talking about other than plastics that we should be?

1:06:16Dr. Rhonda Patrick:I think a really important thing that we're not talking about that we should be is omega-3. The omega-3 fatty acids found in fish and seafood, they are hugely important for brain health and for overall health. In fact, there are studies showing that, you know, if you can supplement with two grams, about 1.5 to two grams a day, people that have that high level of omega-3 that you can achieve with that 1.5 to two grams a day have a five-year increased life expectancy, a 90 % reduced chance of having sudden cardiac death. I mean, it's the easiest thing that you can do is take a pill, and it really has a huge effect on depression, mental health.

1:06:59Dr. Rhonda Patrick:All these things are affected by omega-3. Neurodevelopment, very important. And it's, again, why do I think we should be talking about it? Because it's a simple solution. People like to take pills, and it's the one pill that really is having a big impact on not only your health, your overall health, your life expectancy, but your mental health as well. So I think that's something people should be talking about. And it's one of my favorite things to talk about.

1:07:21Francis Foster:Awesome. All right. Head on over to Substack where we ask Ronda your questions. Why is it that we focus so much on the adverse effects of smoking, but we don't talk about sugar, excess carbohydrates, alcohol?

1:07:57We'll see you next time.