How Trump made $2.2B US in his 1st year back in office

0:00The United States is about to mark its 250th anniversary. And so on the Global Story podcast from the BBC, we're telling surprising tales of American influence on the world stage and in ordinary people's lives all across the globe. We have this ability to export our story and a lot of people have bought it. I feel like the American dream is alive, but not well. From the BBC, it's the United States at 250. Listen wherever you get your podcasts or find us on YouTube. This is a CBC Podcast. Hey team, how we doing today? Good, Willie, how are you?

0:37Willy Lowry:Well, I'm well, but wait a second. Wait a second. Katie? New Katie? Alt Katie? Other Katie? DJ Mixmaster Katie? What's going on? Just stepping in. Thank you for having me to your private little podcast club. Well, we are very, very happy to have you, Katie Nicholson. Our Katie Simpson is away today, but we are super lucky to have our DC colleague here, Katie. So many Katie's. Again, we are surrounded, Paul, by Katie's. But it's good. But we're lucky. Yeah, we are. Because each is super and wonderful in their own right. Let's get down to this show. Yeah, lots to talk about today from crypto to questions about conflict of interest.

1:17Willy Lowry:Also, the value of alliteration. I'm just going to say there's no denying that. A new mandatory disclosure has revealed that Donald Trump raked in more than$2 billion during his first year back in office. Yeah, and it's being called an unprecedented level of personal profit for a sitting president. Personal profit. See, alliteration. It's the day of alliterations. If I was smarter, I would have found a way to do another alliteration. And so on this week's episode, we're asking, how has Donald Trump made so much money in the White House? And is that even allowed? I'm Willie Lowry. I'm Katie Nicholson.

1:53Willy Lowry:And I'm Paul Hunter. We're CBC's Washington Correspondents, two blocks from the White House.

2:04Okay. First question goes to you, Paul. So excited. I know. I knew you were going to say that, too. What exactly was revealed in this mandatory financial disclosure? Like, what do we know now about Trump's personal gains since he returned to office?

2:21Willy Lowry:I don't think it would be a surprise that Trump made a lot of money in 2025. He made a ton, like a very large, a very extremely large amount of money, not from his presidential salary, which I think is something like 400 ,000 U.S. He's said no to that, and he takes the symbolic$1 a year, and he makes mention of that when these questions come up. So it's from his investments. Investments during the time he's been president. Per this disclosure that we're going to be talking about today, he made$2.2 billion in 2025. biggest source of income crypto ventures but also the trump meme coin which we can talk about his real estate holdings mar-a-lago among them trump bibles sales of a copy which i think i saw at the republican convention in 2024 they're in a plexiglass case in the lobby trump sneakers trump watches trump sort of you name it we don't know how much income tax he paid this is just a disclosure of his income.

3:31Willy Lowry:But importantly and significantly, it's not like he makes this kind of money every year and always has made a couple of billion here, a couple of billion there. This 2.2 billion is almost four times the amount of money that he made the year before. And I think that's a big part of what's raised eyebrows here. I mean, it is a pretty astronomical number, at least compared to kind of the everyday human. Yeah. Or I think safe to say any other U.S. president ever. Yeah, for sure. Katie, let's zoom in a little bit on the president's crypto business, which I'm still trying to wrap my head all around what that really means.

4:10You and me both, buddy. Can you explain crypto, Willie? No. Lucky for me, that's Katie's job. The New York Times called it, quote, stunningly lucrative. Can you break it down for us? Why was this particular stream of income so profitable? Okay. So it's fascinating, too, just because Trump was such a skeptic about cryptocurrency early on in his first administration. He called it a scam. And then somewhere along the way, he sort of had this sort of conversion on the road to crypto Damascus. And here he is. Starts off this particular administration by relaxing some policies, having policies that are more friendly to cryptocurrency.

4:51And launches this company, right? Or his sons at least do, and Steve Wyckoff's son. And so they create this thing which holds a bunch of these coins, these Trump-branded coins, and also meme coins, which are slightly different, more risky, speculative ventures as well. And the way that he has made money off of this is kind of, in some ways, reflective of how he has for years made money off of real estate, right? It's about putting your name on it. It is getting your sort of on the front end of it, getting people to buy these things when they're super valued at the start. And also another way that he profits from this is that every time these elements of cryptocurrency, they are transferred and exchanged hands, he gets money from these transaction fees.

5:42So it's not necessarily tied to the value of the cryptocurrency itself, but also to all of the transactions as it moves from owner, buyer, seller every single time. So that's sort of how he's been making the money. The other thing is with these like meme coins that are tied to specific moments in his presidency. Just three days before his second inauguration, he posted and he's also really good at doing the Trump thing of selling, selling himself, selling his brand on Truth Social. Always has been. I mean, that is Trump. The Trump name is the brand. And it's about seizing that moment to that taking capitalizing on the excitement around the second inauguration, posting on Truth Social, encouraging people to sort of cash in, buy these tokens.

6:28And I think that there is, you know, an argument that American historians, presidential historians would say that by kind of selling your name, you're perhaps cheapening the office.

6:43Willy Lowry:Others might say, so what? So what's wrong with that? Here's a guy, I think a lot of people in Magaland would say more power to him. There's a guy who knows how to make money. And that's one of the reasons that I voted for him and will vote for him again. That's one of the paradoxes of - I think you're 100 % right. I mean, the fact that he made$2.2 billion in 2025 only further attests to what he always says about himself is that he is an excellent businessman, right? So this probably is something that the base, if not is okay with, then it actually is quite pleased with. Crypto is wildly popular among certain elements of his base.

7:17And it's very male. It skews male. And it's the Whitney Cummings joke, right, that crypto is astrology for men. And it sort of has this kind of feel to it, right? There's this kind of bro-iness when people talk about crypto that I think speaks to an element of the sort of the hyper-masculine MAGA world as well.

7:39Willy Lowry:And I think Trump was, you know, saying that he was marketing it to his base in MAGA, whether it be male or female. But certainly they bought into it in large numbers. And Willie, it hasn't really ended well for a lot of them. No. So Katie referenced it three days before the inauguration. He released this Trump meme coin, not a coin, looked more like a stamp. It had fight, fight, fight on it. That, you know, we can call it what it is. Quite an iconic image now of Trump raising his fist just after the assassination attempt on his life in Butler, Pennsylvania, back on July 13th, 2024. And this meme coin spiked at just around$75 in the day leading up on January 19th.

8:44Fast forward to today, it's worth about$1.60. So that is a pretty precipitous drop. And cumulatively, according to the New York Times, nearly a million investors lost a total of$3.8 billion on Trump crypto coin. That's a significant, significant amount of money. I want to take a listen to economist Paul Krugman, who shared his own reaction to this development, this news on his substack this week. And he was pretty unsympathetic to the people who bought this coin. Even more surprising is the number of people who were in effect suckers here, which is almost a million. That's really amazing. I didn't think, I mean, I was completely cynical, but I didn't think there were that many suckers out there.

9:35But it turns out there were really a lot. I think perhaps suckers is a little unfair, but I think what it does show you is that this president has a significant amount of supporters who are willing not just to vote for him, but in a sense to invest in him with their personal finances. I want to take a brief listen to another clip, this one from Eric Lipton. He's a New York Times reporter who's covered this story extensively. I mean, we're talking like, you know, billions of dollars. These are people, followers of his who he said, you know, listen to me. I'm your leader. Follow my lead. You know, I'm a successful business person.

10:21It sort of reminds me of Trump University, you know, in which he, you know, he suggested that, you know, you could become rich by studying my formula. Paul, we just heard a reference to Trump University. How does that story, can you kind of refresh our memory a little bit? And how does that tie into Trump's history of selling his brand?

10:42Willy Lowry:Well, sometimes this podcast feels like flashback. I remember covering when the Trump University story kind of ended. It was a rare, apparent public loss for Trump. In operation from 2005 to 2011, it was a for-profit university. Effectively speaking, this wasn't the slogan of it, but I think a lot of people took it as a kind of course on how to get rich, right? Didn't work out that way. It was basically seminars in hotel ballrooms and things like that. And a lot of people were angry that it wasn't what they were expecting, I think I can say. And lawsuits followed class actions and Trump settled in 2016 for$25 million without admitting any wrongdoing.

11:35Willy Lowry:2016, of course, was when he was running for the presidency the first time around. To the central question inherent in raising that, it's another example, and we can go back further if we want to, but of the Trump brand again that we've been talking about. It's adjacent to make America great again. And the degree to which people took that literally and believed that he would make not, yes, America great again, but also their personal lives that Trump effectively was promising and has throughout his time in office sort of a country, a world, a life of milk and honey and money. People believe that he can lead them to the promised land of money themselves.

12:19Willy Lowry:And that is a huge part of his kind of magical appeal that he has managed to parlay that into people buying his meme coin, let's say, or people voting for him in the ballot box. That's been the ride he's been on from the get-go. And I think one of the things that MAGA supporters will tell you, at least in the lead up to the 2024 election was, you know, he's doing this for altruistic reasons. He doesn't need to do this. He's a billionaire. He could be sitting at his, you know, in Mar-a-Lago or Trump Towers in Midtown Manhattan. But he's doing this because he wants to. It's somehow part of his mystique.

13:06Willy Lowry:I don't disagree with that. I mean, I think you're right. And it's an unexplainable one, because at the same time, he is making more money than most people could even dream of. And yet it's done in the name of, I don't need to do this. I'll give back my salary. And so therefore, you know, I also think that a lot of people in so-called MAGA land think, man, if I was in his spot, I'd do the same thing. There's also this intersection of brands, right? So Trump brand, which is this thing that people sees on, I too can be rich, I too can follow this, and the office of the president. And these things together, when he is saying buy my crypto coin or whatever, it could be argued, it gives this sort of sheen of legitimacy to cryptocurrency, right?

13:54And so that also engenders trust. And so that has been one of the criticisms of how he has sort of been pushing this through his true social account, that sort of thing. Yeah, I think that's a really, really good point. It blurs this line, right? That historically has been pretty distinct. The reactions to disclosure has been pretty predictable, but there have been some notable responses. Just take this clip of Republican lobbyist Joe Borelli on CNN. Am I concerned with a billionaire making more billions on more money? No, I'm not. In fact, look, look, look, nobody, let me just sum up. Nobody who voted for Donald Trump, a guy with skyscrapers with his name on it, with a plane that has his name on it, is suspect of him making money.

14:37That's not the problem. So, Paul, there you go. And it's so funny because when you talk to the MAGA base, right, they are so divided on the Epstein files, on Iran. Why is it that this issue, it seems, I don't know.

14:54Willy Lowry:How is it different? I don't know. See, this is central to the whole thing, isn't it? Like, forget Trump's bankruptcies, by the way, which, you know, this great businessman has had a taste of that. Yeah, exactly. Forget the lawsuits. The brand of Trump remains that he knows how to make money. That's the guy we want in the Oval Office, right? He will make money for us somehow. And maybe that means buying a Trump meme coin and we'll see what happens. But it didn't. So the question I think you're asking. So why aren't people standing up and shouting, right? The real answer is that remains one of the great mysteries, except maybe, say Democrats, hope Democrats, that this time it'll be different on this particular issue.

15:47Willy Lowry:The economy is a big part of the story right now in this country. This is a year for the midterms. People are paying still More for gas. Things are more expensive. Inflation has been higher than it could be. All these things are making people, including MAGA people, think more about money than they have for a while, perhaps, potentially. And maybe this disclosure will make them think, well, wait a second. And the people that invested in Trump coin and lost money, maybe. Well, it's just not the same fissures that we're seeing with Epstein or the war. A hundred percent. And I don't know. I mean, as I say, will it be different?

16:29Willy Lowry:Will this be a tipping point? How many times have we said that about Trump? Will this be the thing that sets off his hardcore supporters? And with the exceptions of things like the Epstein, and that's a sliver, I would say, and not all. I mean, we don't know. Katie, this has been called an unprecedented level of profit for a sitting president. Many have pointed out that it's shattered that norm that we've spoken a significant amount about already of U.S. presidents trying to avoid financial conflict of interest. Is this actually legal? I am not a lawyer. You're getting the really easy questions today.

17:08I feel nice to tag me in, guys, with all the hard questions today. Paul literally just sighed in relief. But I may not be a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV, but I have done some research. And strictly speaking, no, this is not illegal. You can profit from private enterprises during the presidency. It really boils down to a question of how you profit. And it often becomes more of an ethics issue as opposed to anything. That said, you know, the framers, when they were putting together the Constitution, they were worried about a president being influenced by domestic or foreign money. And so there are emoluments clauses, right?

17:51Emolument clauses that are supposed to kick in here against any kind of potential financial exploitation in the Oval Office. So have we seen that kind of court action? Not really. In Trump one, there were some lawsuits that were brought forward that were alleging that there was an overstep here by Trump in a number of capacities, that he was profiting from hotels. Trump Hotel. Exactly. Foreign money coming in. That landed with the Supreme Court after Trump had left office. And they said, well, he's no longer in office. And they kind of kicked it out. We have not seen, aside from Congress, every now and then you'll see Representative Jamie Raskin bring some bills to the floor again and try to get some more traction.

18:37And those bills never go anywhere. You just put another one forward in April. And, you know, this is obviously a question. It's on Congress to step up if they want to try to enact any kind of action and challenge some of this profit making. But we could just like sort of look at this from the, I don't know, just look at the Qatari jet, right? Just zoom in on this one kind of sticky wicket, which could come up, say, if there's a change in government after the midterms, right?

19:06Willy Lowry:For example, at the midterms. Yeah, for example. So here's this$400 million gift, which seems to be this immediately had people questioning whether or not this was a violation of the Foreign Emoluments Clause, right? And so is it? It is a gift to technically the Department of War, Department of Defense, whichever way you're leaning on that. They did need a new plane. Air Force One was aging out. So they get it in. They retrofit it. Taxpayers foot the bill for, we're told right now, under$400 million to retrofit it. He took it for its first flight to North Dakota last week. It was a part of a big air parade over the mall for July 4th.

19:47And it's supposed to land eventually with the Trump presidential library, although, you know, there are questions about does he give it up? Does he keep using it after the presidency? And where does this all fit into it? And to say nothing of taking such a large gift from a foreign government and the national security implications around it, all the stuff that came up when this first happened. So how is this going to be treated once there's maybe a more objectionable or a more motivated Congress to sort of hold these types of moments to account with this presidency? I'm glad you brought up the Trump library.

20:27The mock-ups that have been released are quite something. The plane is apparently going to be inside the lobby of the building essentially or have it – it's going to be inside what is a giant skyscraper in Miami.

20:43Willy Lowry:In fairness, there is a former Air Force One in the Reagan Library and they've had presidential debates right in front of it. We've seen it all on TV. I mean it's a fantastic library by the way if you haven't been. so that I mean again I've said this before on the podcast that it's complicated because you have to things are seen through the prism of Trump and everything is therefore negative or bad say some but they're all valid points I mean another way to flip that is to say what if Barack Obama had done the same thing and taken a gift of a plane from a foreign country Republicans probably would have lost their minds And they're not now.

21:53Willy Lowry:our story and a lot of people have bought it. I feel like the American dream is alive, but not well. From the BBC, it's the United States at 250. Listen wherever you get your podcasts or find us on YouTube. Now, the White House has denied that Trump and his family were profiting from the presidency. According to the White House deputy press secretary, quote, neither the president nor his family has ever engaged or will ever engage in conflicts of interest. And here's how Trump responded when asked if he's using the presidency for personal enrichment. He said this last week. Let's take a listen.

22:31Well, you know, I don't do anything having to do with my business. My kids run it. I put a lot of money. I had a lot of money and I have a lot of money. And I've always made I've made money. You know, I'm a business person. I'm a really good business person. And I've made money. I've made a tremendous amount of money, more than I would have ever thought I would have made. And I let people invest it. I don't even speak to I don't even know who they are. But it's given to big firms like that are on your show all the time. My son, Eric, handles it. I don't talk to him about things such as this. I think I'd be allowed to.

23:05I'm not sure even what the status is, but I don't. And he gives it into these like semi blind trusts or blind trusts where people invest. Let's give this a little context. How does this all compare to what previous presidents have done to avoid accusations of using their position for personal gain?

23:26Willy Lowry:Well, this is the thing. I mean, and it's not just presidents. I mean, Mark Carney has put his holdings in a blind trust while he's prime minister. Bill, who did that? Bill Clinton did that. George W. Bush did that. Barack Obama and Joe Biden did not. But they, whatever holdings they had in stocks and what have you, they, they sold into cash or mutual funds. So they cashed out essentially during their time in office. What presidents tend to do is make their money after. And it is a very lucrative afterlife through speeches which command many tens and tens of thousands of dollars per speech. ex-presidents, especially Barack Obama, including with his books, have made a lot of money outside the Oval Office.

24:15Willy Lowry:But that's the point, right? I think for a lot of people, it's acceptable to make money when you're not in a position to influence policy. And that, I think, gets to the heart of all of this. The difference with Donald Trump is all this is happening while he's in a position to influence policy, the laws and regulations that govern the things that he is investing in, even if it's through his family, which isn't a blind trust. When Eric is managing his money, that is not a blind trust. A blind trust is somebody completely else who you have no real relationship with. There's a wall between you and the person who is overseeing all that.

24:52Willy Lowry:That's the difference here. Trump is, it's not a blind trust, and he is, this is happening while he's in office as president of the United States and in a position to influence policy. So, Katie, this cannot be, is this an outlier? I mean, have past presidents been surrounded by kind of these potential conflict of interest? Always, yes. Yeah, I mean, you go back and Andrew Jackson brings in the Indian Removal Act of 1830. And here's a guy who for years had been a land speculator, right? Lyndon Johnson, Lady Bird Johnson, her family's media holdings. There was always questions swirling around as a senator and even as a president.

25:34Some FCC decisions that were seen to potentially benefit those empires, even though he held the, or the family held, the media empire in a blind trust during his time in the Oval Office. And then, of course, Nixon, right? So the way in which that over a five-year period, he was able to enrich himself, and that included major real estate acquisitions with the help of an industrialist friend, which, of course, raises a lot of issues around influence. and the New York Times did some fantastic reporting around that back in the 70s. You see from that, and it is Vice President Spiro Agnew, of course, accused of taking kickbacks from Maryland.