Status: Untraced - E2: Walked Into Heaven

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0:50This podcast also contains subject matter, which may not be suitable for everyone. Listener discretion is advised.

1:02How did you get to know him? I originally met him through social media. He found me on Instagram, ended up messaging me. We spent a night together when clubbing the whole typical Vegas thing. This is Amanda. She lives on a reservation in the Mojave Desert and spent time with Justin on a handful of camping trips. We connected in a similar fashion to the way she and Justin did, sending a message on Instagram and seeing what would happen. how would I describe him? A firecracker. He was like one extreme to another. And he finally opened up one night. He got in that state where he just like drifted off a little bit, I guess.

1:59Then he sat there and he's just like, you know, sometimes I feel ashamed for the way I live. because I feel like I'm a kid running from all my problems. Like I get in an argument or something gets rough. I just, I run. I leave. I travel. I go somewhere. I meet new people. And it was one thing that kind of made me feel weird about whenever he'd talk about his plans for India. And the more I've thought about it, especially over the years, it almost seemed like he was preparing for something because he wanted to be famous he made that openly clear like that was his end goal and it was just weird as i thought about it more and more just how he was trying to visit everybody before he went on this one last big trip where he was trying to find himself like he was saying his goodbyes to everybody and then just disappears.

3:01When he left, I just had this weird feeling like, oh, okay, he's going and I'm never going to see him again.

3:19Sometimes I get the feeling I'm lost. Yes, I

3:41I'm Liam Luxon, and this is Status Untraced. Episode 2, Walked Into Heaven.

4:00A lot of pieces like that. How often were you guys in contact when he was traveling around on his motorcycle? Oh, I... Most of it through his Instagram account. I'm in Sarasota, Florida, with Alex, at the home of Terry Shetler, the father of missing person, Justin Alexander Shetler. I'm here to try to figure out what happened to Justin. It's been just over five years since Terry last heard from his son. And when I asked how often they were in contact, this is not what I expected to hear. I mean, I felt very connected, so I wasn't like, wow, you haven't called me in three weeks or, you know, anything like that.

4:42In fact, the last time I saw him during our FaceTime from the MoMA Cafe, he said, yeah, you probably won't see me for like five years. Oh, really? Yeah.

5:01Okay, so that's like right before he went on the trip with the Baba. When he told you you probably weren't going to see him for about five years because he was planning on being like international for that whole time, do you know if that was, did he say why? No.

5:19Terry didn't ask his son why. As if the phrase, you probably won't see me for five years, was as casual as saying he was going for a run. But it wasn't casual. Justin was calling all the way from a remote village in the Parvati Valley, a place deep in the Indian Himalayas. Before this podcast, I had never heard of the valley before. But when I began digging, I fell upon a series of strange phenomena. The Parvati Valley is associated with India Syndrome, a pattern in which foreigners, mostly Westerners, are mystified by Indian spirituality and culture and decide to start a whole new life on a whim.

6:03They leave behind everything, belongings, friends, family. I read of one case where an Austrian man resurfaced after 12 years. He told the Tribune he chose to vanish so that he could live in complete peace. Regis Herald, the French psychiatrist who coined the term India syndrome, wrote that susceptibility to the plight depends on each person's past traumas. Because India speaks to the unconscious, it provokes it, makes it boil, and sometimes overflow. So now think about Justin, a man who says he never really had a sense of home. and told his dad, you probably won't see me for five years. Did he mean that?

6:50And why would a parent take that at face value? I want to understand this father-son relationship better and possibly determine how Justin's past influenced his future. So about the time of the divorce was a crucial time because he was 11. He started rebelling, but it was mostly against me. So, you know, we sat down. I said, listen, I want to change this whole struggle. I want to change it so it's you and me against the world. So we'll make a deal. and the deal is whatever you want to do just tell me and I'll help you do it. Except if I think that it will kill you. So that was the kind of relationship that we had.

7:53It's like from here on in you're on your own.

8:02Terry's a real character. With a white-braided ponytail and a home full of holistic contraptions, he's, to the degree, a quintessential hippie. After his divorce from Justin's mom, he stayed in Florida, and she moved west with Justin in tow. When he did get time with Justin, he was determined to make the most out of it. When he came here, I mean, I could just feel that his energy was kind of disconnected, And I thought, what can I do to actually make a difference in his life? And I thought, well, for me, the most obvious destructive thing that happened in my high school was the D.A.R.E. program.

8:50You know, where they fill you full of shit, the just say no approach to drugs. I mean, it's complete ignorance. You can't get more opposite of education than just say no. And for most people, they go away to college and they do the stupidest shit imaginable because their parents have tried to control until they get away from home the first time. So then it makes it much more dangerous. So then I felt that, yeah, if I gave him like a real drug education, he would know what the hell he's doing. And so then he could make informed decisions.

9:37And so then I just rented the cabin in Gatlinburg for two weeks. And I went around and just got all the drugs that I could find. And we drank Jack Daniels one night. And we did wine a couple of nights. and we, you know, we did pot and wine. And the whole time I was talking to him about the mushroom lore and concepts that I had developed. And I didn't realize how close I would get to Justin smoking pot with him. You know, doing mushrooms with my son was like a treasured experience. I am not a parent, but I have my reservations about this. I'm all for informed decision-making, but I don't know that I would go out of my way to give a 14-year-old drugs or alcohol.

10:42I will admit, I myself began experimenting with marijuana and psychedelics in my teens, unmeasured and unsupervised. I don't look back on it as a mistake, but I recognize that the experience could have gone badly. So I get why Terry wanted to guide Justin's introduction to drugs. But to encourage it? And what made you feel that he was ready to do that at 14? Because I know myself, first time I did LSD, I was like 18. And it definitely was mind-altering in a way, right? Were you ever concerned that it was a little early then, or you just felt that he was ready? I would have been concerned about LSD, but the mushrooms have a different...

11:29It's very rare for someone to have a bad trip, unless you're drinking. But usually, like the mushroom god will come in and look at your chart and say, okay, it's the first time, take it easy on them. Just the dancing mice and the little candies and, you know. And so that was my thinking from my experience. I'm not really sure how to respond to this, but it makes me curious how these experiences shaped Justin. Coincidentally, I later found that he spoke about his early trials with drugs on the Tangentially Speaking podcast. The first time I took mushrooms, my dad took me to a circus. Oh, that doesn't sound good.

12:15It was actually amazing. Really? It almost feels genetic to hear the resemblance between Terry's and Justin's perspectives. Well, actually I was introduced to ayahuasca as a young teenager, maybe 14 the first time I did it. And I've only done it maybe 10 times. But I feel like that probably played a big role in who I am today. Because you really end up questioning a lot of things and seeing through a lot of kind of societal bullshit filters. I mean, it feels like therapy in a way. The only reason I consider myself spiritual in any way is from my experiences with that.

13:00Terry says during high school, Justin asked to enroll in the Wilderness Survival School. It was a renowned program run by an elite tracker, Tom Brown. As we know, Justin spent years honing his skills there. But after graduation, he followed in his father's footsteps and decided to become a massage therapist in Florida. So he stayed with me for about six months, which is the length of massage school. Yeah. And so I got him a job working at a restaurant, you know, waiting tables. He fucking hated it because it was just so frantic. And he didn't hardly make any money, but he had the car. and he heard about this strip club down in Miami.

13:48How old was he, I think? 19. Oh, okay. And so he drove down there for the weekend, strip Friday and Saturday night, and then rested and came back on Sunday with, you know, like 1 ,500 bucks. And so once he did that, he's like, fuck, that's it. I asked Terry if he knows if Justin attempted stripping while traveling. Probably a lot. That was probably a lot. It's like a go-to. You know, any time you can pick up a thousand bucks on the weekend. When I first read about Justin's life, I envisioned him as a wealthy tech entrepreneur, a Tim Ferriss type. Despite how he presented himself, I'm now thinking maybe Justin's adult life wasn't that financially stable.

14:38In Venice, Jason Schultz told me he was worried about Justin's finances. So I asked Terry if he ever worried as well. At that point, I was making really good money, and I said, you know, like, I can, you know, send you some money. And he said, no, no, I've really been enjoying getting by. And he liked having hash because then he was popular, had a lot of friends always. Hash, also known as hashish, is dried marijuana resin. Outside religious purposes, it's an illegal substance in India. Justin was smuggling the hash from Nepal into India. And that was kind of a thrill. So he was thinking after the trek that he was going to go into the hills and buy some hash from the Parvati Valley.

15:42You know, that was kind of the plan in the back of his mind. While Terry says Justin planned to buy more hash after the trek, he isn't aware of any more details. Well, then I got contacted by Linda and Suzanne. Linda is a friend of Justin's. Suzanne, or Susie, is Justin's mother. Oh my God, oh my God, Justin hasn't checked in, Justin hasn't checked in. And I realized that Suzanne had contacted the government and the CIA and the army and the embassy over there. And I said, holy shit. You know, like if he comes back, you know, into the town and he has a pound of hash and everyone is looking for him, he's going to be really thankful to you from fucking jail.

16:36Terry never made it on the ground in India, so he was left to receive updates about the search secondhand. Hence, not all his claims are accurate. To my knowledge, the CIA and the Army were not involved in the search for Justin. Yet, these revelations about the smuggling, the stripping, I don't see a reason for Terry to make it up. It causes me to wonder what else they spoke about towards the end. So I asked him. So he took some photographs that were prohibited by the holy man and the culture there. And he felt that he picked up a curse. That he couldn't shake the whole rest of the time in India.

17:30So the thing with the holy man, I cautioned him about getting close to these guys who would curse you, and it could affect your health. Satya Neryawan Rawat is the holy man who accompanied Justin on the trek. You'll hear us refer to him as the Baba, or Baba Rawat. He can be seen forever frozen in black and white on Justin's Instagram. A scrawny figure with tumors the size of tennis balls on his elbows and wrists. You know, like, for me, someone five feet tall, less than 100 pounds, killing Justin, it was laughable. I mean, five people that size trying to kill Justin was a joke. So with no evidence, then you're left with what you think should have happened.

18:30That's not what I think should have happened. So what do you think happened from the lack of evidence that we have? I mean, I don't know. Justin had hash and some liquid LSD and like, yeah, if he had a spiritual experience on the lake. and, oh, what a good idea. I'll trip a little bit and be able to figure this all out. I'm not suggesting a suicide in any way, just a lack of judgment. So is that my most probable scenario? Yeah, probably. Probably. And then your explanation for the Baba being hung is... The authorities trying to get this American woman off their back. Do you think there's any possibility that Justin...

19:36Isn't dead? Isn't dead, yeah. That he's alive and still just living off the land right now. Yes. Well, what I would like to just say is, in some ways, that kind of confirms the spiritual process. I mean, I don't think that being murdered by some desperate thieves really facilitates spiritual growth. Maybe I'm mistaken, but I don't think the story usually goes like that. Like, I don't know if a portal opened up and he walked into heaven.

20:21We end our conversation with Terry, and I'm left with a lot to process. But before I can fully collect my thoughts, Terry FaceTimes someone he says I need to speak to.

20:35At the time, her name was Pixie, but now she changed it to Zandra. Yay! How are you? Wow, I am doing amazing. How are you? I'm sure you are. I'm introduced to Zandra, who I learned changed her name in memory of Justin Alexander. I gotta tell you, he was a showman, and this disappearing also didn't surprise me. I'm like, motherfucker, you pulled off like one final scene. I was madly in love with him. Life was safer with him around, and it was a lot more magical. Zandra doesn't just share memories of Justin. She declares an undying love for him. As we peel back the layers, it becomes clear she's not the only one.

21:27There's articles calling Justin the hottest guy I never knew. affectionate comments addressing him as my love, and posts recalling life-changing moments spent together. We wonder what insights could the women from Justin's past hold. This is how we met Amanda, who you heard at the beginning of the episode, and what led us to this call.

21:55Okay, here we go. St. Thomas there, so at least three different places. Maybe she'll be over right now.

22:06This is Ashley. Hey, Ashley, this is Alex Vespested. I don't know if you recall, but I had messaged you on Instagram about Justin Alexine. Yeah. I do remember. We messaged Ashley because of a multitude of comments she posted on Justin's Instagram. Reaching out, we had no clue about the extent of their relationship. We met and dated for about a year. He was a great person, a great human being. I don't think he had a bad bone in his body. He struggled a lot with wanting to have that family life and that he needed to feel worthy in the world. Would you say he was trying to find himself in a way? You know, that idea of like, you know, I want to find myself.

23:01It's not that he didn't know who he was. It's that his childhood really, really damaged him to the core where I don't know many people who have that type of internal struggle on a daily basis and comes out in everything that they do. One day we're in the car and he looks at me and goes, I just wonder who I would be if those bad things didn't happen to me. He wanted to prove to everyone that he was a man, that people could look up to him, that they wanted to emulate him, that he was his own comic book character. That was what he needed to do in order to be able to cope with that pain. I ask Ashley if she can elaborate on Justin's damaging childhood.

23:44But she feels it isn't her place. It was just a very, like, tumultuous relationship. He would travel for weeks on end, and I would be here in Miami working. We would break up all the time. You know, there was like one time he was in China and then we broke up. And then I didn't hear from him for like, I think like four or five days. And then he popped back up and said that he had tried to commit suicide. And I ended up checking into a hospital. And that's when he like contacted me.

24:15This incident unfolded four years before Justin's disappearance. a span that might have permitted time to heal. But hearing this, coupled with his dad's comments, it makes me uneasy. Was Justin suicidal? What was he thinking at the time he vanished? Somebody has to know. In terms of their relationship, Ashley says their diverging paths ultimately brought it to an end. You know, if you don't want to have kids, like, you know, that's kind of a deal breaker for me. And I said to him, you can find someone else who's going to travel with you that you're going to love, that you're going to have a connection with.

24:57That's okay that it's not me. And I said, you don't want to get married. I'm done. And then I think because I said that, he called me up and said, I wanted to take you away for your birthday. So I was hesitant. I said, we're not going to go back and forth anymore. And because of that, he confessed that he had bought a ring and he was planning to propose to me. And, you know, whether or not that's true, I don't know. And then when I wasn't willing to kind of go along with that in December, I think is when he started selling off the possessions. And then by January, he was gone. This pattern of events strikes me as turbulent.

25:35A difference in desires leads to a hasty proposal, culminating in a dramatic life overhaul. Such extreme shifts bring me back to the question. would disappearing on his own will be out of Justin's character? Despite the breakup, I asked Ashley how she felt when she heard the news that Justin was missing. You know, the problem with Justin is that he would put his trust in anybody. Like, he did not have the ability to judge people's character. He would find a random stranger, think that it's totally okay to leave, you know, his computer and everything else with them, and that they're just going to, like, you know, be nice and return it.

26:17He would do shit like that. It's like, you can't trust everybody. That's not the way the world works. You could read his posts about the guru. He knew this guy was bad news. He knew that there was something wrong with him, and he still chose to go with this guy. The minute I heard about what happened to him, I said, oh, my God, you know what? It's another story of him trusting the wrong fucking guy. I cannot, like, you know, if there is one way that he would not want to have died, it would have been by trusting the wrong person and the person to have killed him. So I hope, and I think about it all the time, I hope that he slid down that mountain because he was just hydrated and delirious and he took a wrong step.

26:57Do you think there's a possibility? No, there's not a chance. He's dead. He's not alive. There's no way. There's no way. There's no way, one, that he would have done that to his mother. And if you are a person whose entire existence relies on how other people view you, then there is no way that you would go missing because that would take away every point that you are making with doing what you're doing. I'm not trying to, like, humanize him. You know, like, I think that the way that other people viewed him is a really, really beautiful way to see him. And I think that he was a phenomenal human being.