Status: Untraced - E3: The Legend You Live

0:08Y 'all, gift-giving season is here. And I have to say, my Quince order completely spoiled me that I'm considering thinking keeping everything for myself. Quince makes gift giving ridiculously easy. I am obsessed with my new European linen shirt dress, and I cannot wait to give one to my mom. It's a seasonal staple for me, layered with tights and one of Quince's Mongolian cashmere sweaters. Quince also has gifts beyond clothing, home, bath, kitchen, and travel, so you can cover everyone on your list and maybe sneak a few things for yourself too. Find gifts so good you'll want to keep them with Quince.

0:51Go to quince.com slash vanishedweekly for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. now available in Canada too. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash vanished weekly to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com slash vanished weekly. Welcome to Radio Rental. The scariest stories you've ever heard in your life. All told by real people. And off we go. This wasn't a human being that I saw. There's something here in this house, something out of this world. There was a woman moving through the hall. I stepped back and I was completely alone. Radio Rental is available now. Listen for free on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.

1:44Hopefully you're already familiar with our newest show, Up and Vanish Presents, Status Untraced. It topped the Apple Podcast charts at number one for a week. and previously we've aired episodes 1 and 2 in this feed and over the next few weeks we'll be airing the remainder of the season episodes 3 through 10 so if you haven't listened to the first two episodes stop right now and search status untraced in your podcast app that's status untraced a new show presented by Up and Vanished follow the show and listen to the entire season right now And it's even ad-free for Tenderfoot Plus subscribers. Again, this is Up and Vanis Presents Status Untraced, Episode 3.

2:32Hope you enjoy the show. You're listening to Status Untraced, a production of Tenderfoot TV in association with Odyssey. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely those of the individuals participating in the podcast. This podcast also contains subject matter, which may not be suitable for everyone. Listener discretion is advised.

3:03Never seen you this giddy. Put this in your back pocket and you can just hand it to him. It's kind of funny how this comes full circle. Alex suggested someone we should visit. Someone he worked with in the past. So we took a drive up the Pacific Coast Highway from LA to Malibu.

3:28Our host welcomes us inside his bungalow home, a familiar place for Alex, who spent countless hours in this same living room, piecing together another missing person case. One interview into another, the whole way through. Alex knows, too, this is my day. Like, boom, boom, till 9 p.m. But then the rest of my week is, like, just empty. This is Neil Strauss, a New York Times bestselling author and the host of the podcast To Live and Die in L.A. All right, so let me go to my computer because I might want to read his. While Neil has experience with true crime, that's not why we're here. We're here because he knew Justin Alexander.

4:10So I ran a men's group called The Society. We have survival intensives where they learn how to evade interrogations and survive torture and escape from handcuffs. And Justin joined in 2012 and was just a really positive, interesting, connected guy. I really, really liked him. As we're chatting, Neil grabs his laptop and pulls up a document he says he hasn't read since 2013. routine. So yeah, so when someone joins the group, the first thing I do is I talk to them for half an hour and I see like who they are and what they're about. And I'll ask them a number of questions. And then I'll sort of read between the lines of what they say.

4:55So his goal is he wanted to prove his confidence, learn to command a room in any situation, be generally happier and more awesome, and become the best person he can be in just about every arena, which is so Justin because he wants to do everything, right? The best in everything is a very ambitious goal. Yeah. He also later said in five years he wants to be retired. Retired meaning traveling and not needing to make decisions based on money. Wanted to be single, collecting amazing stories and doing cool stuff that he'll remember forever. It's interesting that he puts it that he wanted to be single, that that was like something that was important on there too.

5:29Yeah. Like I remember him saying like, I normally break up with someone when they ask me to marry them. You know, so he definitely was your classic avoidance. I don't see where they're at in terms of their emotional state, anxiety, joy, depression, guilt. What was interesting is with the positive emotions, super high. I asked about depression, guilt, anger on a scale of one to ten. He said his was a zero. So right away, you know, there's somebody who's actually denying their emotional reality. That was the first, to me, sign that there's more going on underneath than even he's aware of. Which brings us back to your original assessment of him in a way.

6:10Right. So this is what I wrote at the time, and this is, I had not met him yet. We just talked on the phone for half an hour, which was interesting to look back on it when Alex contacted me. I wrote, has turned himself into an awesome, adventurous, self-made guy. However, at some point, all this is going to blow up on him. And he's going to realize he may have taken his life in partly the wrong direction as a reaction to the way he was raised. Definitely needs some inner work to the degree that his five-year goals actually change. Otherwise, he will have an existential crisis in 10 years, also completely emotionally disconnected from himself.

6:48Interesting that just to look back on him, it appears to be close to what happened. Almost gives me the chills to read it.

7:07Sometimes I get the feeling I'm lost Just hiding it is never enough Now I find that every mirror of ghosts Only once I saw the killer Once I saw the killer of clones I'm Liam Luxon And this, his status untraced. Episode 3, The Legend You Live.

7:48I don't fucking know what happened, but my feelings for what I know about Hashish and the area and what travelers do there, if he did get involved with some crooks, I am like 90 % sure that it had to do with hashish. You probably remember this voice from the last episode. This is Linda Barini, Justin Alexander's former romantic partner and first responder on his disappearance. She's the one who told me about the mafia who lurk in the Purvati Valley and the dangers of dealing hashish. And I think the porter, the famous porter, yeah, I think that's a key element. As a reminder, there were only three people on Justin's trek.

8:37Justin, the Baba, and a porter, a guy hired to carry supplies. I don't remember if he mentioned the porter or not. It's like I've been racking my brain for years trying to remember that detail. But it's not clear, and that's very unfortunate. it. Because what do they need the porter for? For a kilogram of rice? This porter's name is Anil Singh Kumar. He might be the only person from the hike that's still alive. But he's nearly impossible to find. The names Anil and the surnames Singh and Kumar are extremely common in India. It's essentially the American equivalent of Matthew Johnson. And just as a point of interest, there are no white pages in India.

9:23We know little about Anil Kumar. He was hired by the Baba and, like him, never reported Justin as missing. As far as I know, they don't know anything about the porter. I don't know if you were able to get some more information, but there was this porter and then there wasn't.

9:44While Linda was the original point of contact, she never actually made it to India. At some point, I got pushed out of the equation and they wouldn't listen to me. I was a pain in the ass. I was a pain in the ass, I admit it. But it was a bunch of people that had never been to India. We really need to speak to someone who had boots on the ground. So I asked who I should reach out to for more answers. Did you talk to Jonathan? I recognize the name in connection with articles about Justin's disappearance. He's reported as Jonathan Skeels. One of the two men who found Justin's belongings off the hiking trail.

10:24I know that everybody was trying their best. I know it. I know it in my heart, including Jonathan, you know. But it also seemed very detached, you know. Like people cared for a couple of months. And then, you know, the thing froze over and then that was it. Well, thank you for being willing to talk about it. I know it's a lot. I want to find out what happened. If somebody figures out what happened, I will help 100%.

11:00While the offer for help is reassuring, this is the last I hear from Linda. I don't hold it against her. I come to find that's just how this group of people around Justin operate. Spontaneous, constantly on the move, and rarely checking their inboxes. I learned this the hard way. After Linda, I attempted to speak with everyone involved in the search for Justin. And it wasn't easy. While I did land a few interviews, one refrain echoed throughout those conversations. Jonathan Skeels was at the center of it all. So all I could do was hope this self-proclaimed investment banker turned skee-bum would pick up our call.

11:44Hello. Hey, what's going on? Hey, how's it going? Good, good. We got a good connection on my end. Thankfully, he did.

11:55Ready to level up? Chumba Casino is your playbook to fun. It's free to play with no purchase necessary. Enjoy hundreds of online social games like Blackjack, Slots, and Solitaire anytime, anywhere, with fresh releases every week. Whether you're at home or on the go, Let Chumba Casino bring the excitement to you. Plus, get free daily login bonuses and a free welcome bonus. Join now for your chance to redeem some serious prizes. Play Chumba Casino today. No purchase necessary. VGW Group. Void word prohibited by law. 21 plus. TNCs apply. The holidays are here and wow, they're busy. It's easy for your wellness goals to slip.

12:31That's why I rely on Bruins to stay on track. They're a daily snack pack of gummies. That's more than a multivitamin, a greens gummy, or prebiotic. It's all of that at a fraction of the price. And the best part, they taste amazing. Each snack pack has six grams of prebiotic fiber, three times the fiber of leading greens powders, and more than two cups of broccoli, plus 20 plus vitamins and minerals. Vegan, nut-free, gluten-free, dairy-free, no artificial colors or flavors. Groom's ingredients are backed by over 35 ,000 research publications. There's even Grunz Kids, so the little ones can enjoy the same all-in-one nutrition.

13:10Get up to 52 % off with code tenderfoot at grunz.co. That's code tenderfoot at grunz, G-R-U-N-S dot C-O. Did you know Justin before this as well? Yeah, yeah, we had met in 2015 and stayed in contact. He was friends with common friends. Surprisingly, Jonathan Skeels, the man who spearheaded the ground search for Justin, hadn't known Justin very long. Only a year. So I ask why he decided to look for him. I was like, well, I've been to the area where he's missing. I have lots of very influential friends in India. I have the financial means. I have the time. I'm pretty savvy. and I was looking at all these other friends of Justin's that were making nice social media posts but no one was doing anything about it.

14:04And I was like, well, I would not feel good if I didn't go and help. Now, I'm not trying to float my own boat there but that's the reality of it. We continue to talk and it becomes evident that skills, like we've been told, possesses the secrets of the search. intimate details we couldn't have learned anywhere else. With what he shares, Alex and I are able to piece together a timeline of the 2016 events. We're going to take you on a journey through this timeline, and I want to emphasize that these details are crucial. Because when you see this case in its entirety, the facts appear in a whole new light.

14:53It begins with a new story. August 18th, 2016. I should return mid-September or so. If I'm not back by then, don't look for me. Justin puts on his Instagram and blog the ominous message, saying he's headed with Baba Rawat to a spiritual ground called Montalai Lake. Two days later, he makes what will be his final post to Instagram and last calls to his mother, father, and Linda Barini. Mid-September comes and goes, and Linda, worried, contacts their mutual friend, Chris Lee, who is in the Parvati Valley. She was like, yeah, I feel something's wrong. Have you seen Justin? I was like, no, but he's up there, and he's planning to stay for a while, you know, so I wouldn't get worried about Justin.

15:44He's a big boy. A few days later, with no word from Justin, Chris hikes eight kilometers into the mountains to a campground called Kierganga. It's where Justin started the trek, and where he was supposed to have returned. And when I did go, the Bubba was back. He was in his hut, but there was no Justin. So I went over and interrogated him gently, you know. And I think at that time he had told me that they were walking back together, and that Justin had decided to turn around and go back towards the lake with another group of trekkers. And I found that a little bizarre. I told Linda what I had heard.

16:25So that's kind of like when we started to feel that, yeah, there might be something a little weird going on. September 30th. Linda Barini informs Justin's mother, Susie Reeb, of the concerns. And the next day, they launch a GoFundMe titled Find Justin Alexander with a goal to raise$25 ,000. Word of Justin's disappearance spreads, and a friend of the family reaches out with a tip. They found a pivotal photo of Justin on Facebook. It was uploaded by an Indian hiker who supposedly passed Justin on the trail. In it, the hiker holds Justin's flute walking staff, grinning. Justin stands next to him, wearing a gray headband and a dark brown shawl.

17:11His mouth is clenched, and his face appears worn and tired. It is now the last known image of Justin Alexander. Around this time in early October, Chris also reports Justin's disappearance to the local police. However, they are slow to take action. It was just like, oh yeah, okay, another white boy lost in the mountain. It's not like common-common, but it's happened quite often. In contrast, through the GoFundMe gaining traction, more people learn about Justin's disappearance, including Jonathan Skeels. I told the group that I was working for I have to go to India and figure out what's happened to my mate.

17:53I don't know when I'll be back. Sunday, October 9th. Skeels meets Susie Reeb at Heathrow Airport. Together, they embark on the long flight to New Delhi, where they meet with embassy officials. plead for help, and then continue north to the mountains. It's like an 8 a.m. arrival. 10 a.m. we were sitting in the offices of the superintendent of police and had the barber brought in for questioning right in front of us. And did you and Susie do the questioning? Yeah, I got video of us hearing him explain his side of the story. Is that something they usually allow you to do? I'm sure that wouldn't happen in Mumbai or Delhi, but in these hodunk little backstations.

18:37You know, there was a lot of attention being brought to it. So they were trying to appease me in any way. As Baba Rawat is interrogated, officers and locals who are in the room translate his words. The first story was that Justin went back up into the mountains after they had a disagreement. The next version was Justin was ahead of him and it was pretty clear that his story was changing. There was just too many versions. The porter is also questioned, but let go. In the following days, Skeels gathers stories about the Baba's reputation.

19:22October 13th. As urgency mounts, Susie Reeb files an official missing persons report. And Skeels pays for a helicopter to scour the vast mountain terrain.

19:37and just hoping that someone crawled out behind her off with a broken leg, you know, waving a flag. Unfortunately, nothing is found. October 15th. Finally gaining momentum with police, Babur Watt is apprehended and put in a cell on a 15-day hold. October 16th. After much persuasion, the state government grants Skeels another helicopter trip. Accompanied by an Indian mountaineer, they are dropped at the suspected location where the last photo was taken. Skeel says that along the entire hiking trail is the powerful and immense Parvati River. It's well accepted that the river, it tears up bodies and stuff it's never found.

20:25They talk about this one incident where a bus went off the side of a cliff and the river never gave the bus back or the 50 people that were in it. They descend the mountain, scanning on and off the trail.

21:04pushed him there. October 21st, just after 7 p.m., the only prison guard on duty at the Manikaran police station allegedly steps outside to use the bathroom. When he returns, he discovers Baba Rawat hanging by his cloth doughty.

21:34and missing American, then maybe they just, you know, constantly strung him up.

21:43October 23rd. A peculiar update is made to the GoFundMe. The porter, Anil Kumar, is now assisting police search teams in the mountains. Just a few days later, on October 26th, there's another development that changes things. The porter, who until recently had been accompanying a police search team up in the valley, has now been placed under formal arrest and is being held in suspicion of foul play. Again, in the most unusual of events, Jonathan Skeels and Susie Reeb are allowed to interrogate the porter. Your interrogation of the porter, what was that like? That was more of, please tell us, like clear your conscience kind of thing.

22:30because we didn't really suspect him. You know, he was probably just in the wrong place at the wrong time, is my conclusion. Skills goes on to tell us that he dismissed Anil Kumar because he didn't speak English, and therefore viewed him as illiterate, uneducated, and simple-minded. The presumption seems more like prejudice, and also doesn't prove Anil Kumar clear of suspicion. And do you speak the native tongue? No. Did you get a translator? No, no. Maybe he went over a certain social class and I started speaking English. Did you get like a guide or anything to help you through that? I had at my disposal this guy to help out, but I didn't specifically get a guide, no.

23:14Preparations are made for a final helicopter trip. This time, a full police team joins Jonathan Skeels, as well as Susie Reed, and a tracker named Tom McElroy. We went back with an Indian forensic team that was kind of a joke. You know, all the flows off the side of the mountain were starting to freeze over and it was getting cold. At that point they're like, well, prime suspect dead. The family is accepted that their son is not coming back. So their interest in solving the mystery waned pretty quickly.

23:56Days later, a final team hikes to the location where Justin's items were found. They hope to uncover more belongings or a body, but they return empty-handed. Eventually, Susie Reeb flies home to Oregon. In honor of their missing friend, Jonathan Skeels and Tom McElroy ride Justin's Royal Enfield motorcycle through the Leladoc Pass. and the porter, Anil Kumar, is released. What is the process of even finding someone over there? Oh, like if you had the name of a police officer and you wanted to track him down? Exactly. Oh, no. No. No, you'd have to go to the area, find out who was involved, look at old reports.

24:45You'd need me, basically. I have mixed feelings about this search. On one hand, I'm impressed by Jonathan's skills. He sacrificed weeks of his own time and leveraged every resource he could muster to try to find Justin. He didn't have any experience in this type of work. He didn't even know Justin that long. He just wanted to do a good thing. Skills threw his entire being into the effort to influence law enforcement and Indian officials to take action. On the other hand, that sort of influence gives me pause. was due diligence conducted to look at this case from all angles? And how many potential leads, like the porter, were glossed over?

25:33Skeels, who holds all the cards, doesn't share more with us. So for now, this is everything we know. No problem. Have a good one. Thank you. Yeah, have a good one. Bye.