Matt Abrahams: Think Fast, Talk Smart! The Mindset That Helps Entrepreneurs Beat Speaking Anxiety | Human Behavior | YAPClassic

24:06My personal symptom that happens to me, I blush and I perspire. I turn red and I sweat. That's because your core body temperature is going up. Your heart's beating faster. Your body's tensing. It's like you're exercising. When most of us exercise, we sweat and we perspire. So we have to cool ourselves down. before I ever speak, before I'm a guest on a show like yours, I will always hold something cold in the palms of my hand. The palms of your hand control the temperature of your body, just like your forehead or the back of your neck. You've done this on a cold morning. If you've ever held warm tea or coffee in a mug and felt that it warms you up, we're doing the opposite, cooling ourselves down.

24:45So there are things you can do, and there are many other things you can do to reduce the symptoms. But we also have to think about sources. Sources are the things that initiate and exacerbate anxiety. In your case, it sounds like you didn't want to look foolish. You wanted to look your best being. You wanted to show up as best as you could. That's a lot of pressure you're putting on yourself. So by removing that goal, what's making you nervous in that situation is the goal to come off in the way you wanted to come off. A goal is a future state. So what's making you nervous is a potential negative future outcome.

25:23So if we can make ourselves more present-oriented, by definition, I'm not worried about the future. So anything you can do to get more present. Some ways to get present are to do something physical, walk around the building, do some light exercise. You can listen to a song or a playlist like athletes do to get present-oriented. Start at 100 and count backwards by 17s. That gets you present-oriented. My favorite way to get present-oriented is to say tongue twisters. You can't say a tongue twister right and not be in the present moment. Plus, it warms up your voice. So by managing symptoms and sources, you can be more present-oriented, you can be more focused on what's happening in the moment, and less nervous.

26:03So that was a very long-winded answer, I'm sorry, but the question is very real, and it's something that most of us can benefit by managing our anxiety.

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29:23Hala Taha:And I was repeating like that stuff. Like you're the podcast princess, Hala. You're the podcast princess, Hala. I love that. So I say, I have a mantra I use and my mantra is you have value to bring. So I remind myself, because I can get negative. I can get my thought, you know, I'm not prepared. This person I'm talking to is so amazing. I just say, I have value to bring. There's something that this person has chosen to speak with me, be it on a podcast, be it a student asking me a question, be it somebody I just randomly meet. I have value to bring. And that alone cancels out that negative talk.

29:56So that's great. You found a tool for you, which is, it's called positive affirmation. And that seems to work for you. That's great.

30:02Hala Taha:And how about the fact that I felt so embarrassed afterwards? Like, what's the importance of being kind to yourself when it comes to these things? So grace is really important in this. I think what helps many people is to realize that they're not alone in this, that lots of people suffer from this. A real quick story. The very first book I wrote was called Speaking Up Without Freaking Out. It's all about how to manage anxiety. I was in San Francisco airport. they called my name over the loudspeaker because the chair I was supposed to sit in on the airplane was broken and they wanted to let me know that.

30:37I come back and the guy standing next to me said, you wrote that book on speaking anxiety. I said, yes, have you read it? He said, no, but it helped me. I was like, you didn't read the book, but it helped you, what do you mean? And he said, just knowing that a book like that existed helped him normalize his fear. He said, I thought I was the only one because at my work, everybody's so good, but I realized you didn't just write the book for me. So my point here is you have to give yourself a little grace. It is normal and natural in the presence of somebody you admire, in the presence of somebody who is very qualified and accomplished, to want to do well and to be nervous.

31:12That makes complete sense. So allow yourself that permission to be nervous and then remind yourself that you have value to bring, that you can do some things in that moment. And as you said, your conversation yesterday turned out great. and that he didn't even know you were nervous. So we have to remind ourselves of that. The biggest thing that can help here is reflection, not rumination, but reflection. Reflect now, Hala, on how and what you did to get yourself through that. So the next time you interview somebody where you might feel that way, you remind yourself. It is through that reflection that we can change.

31:49If we don't take the time to reflect, if we don't give ourselves grace, we're gonna fall victim to that same cycle over and over again. So congrats on doing it and congrats on feeling a little embarrassed. That means that this was important for you.

32:02Hala Taha:Totally. And I feel like now that I've like totally reflected on this, like this conversation couldn't have came at a better time. I feel like the next time I interview somebody who's a huge podcaster and I feel like is going to be judging me, I can kind of give myself some grace and do some of those activities that you mentioned to just get myself ready. Like, okay, Holly, you are going to feel nervous. This is how you're going to get over it. But so one of the things that I do when it comes to spontaneous speaking that I don't know is right or wrong is I tend to be comfortable sharing my own stories.

32:34Hala Taha:And I was doing that a lot, especially when I first started podcasting to the point where I got some bad reviews where some people were like, Holla, stop talking about yourself. And then I got like more careful about I'm only going to share stories that I don't share very often, and I'm going to share new stories and not tell a lot of the same stories because my listeners listen to more than one episode, right? So what are your feelings about talking about yourself when it comes to spontaneous speaking? So this is a great question because you have to find a very delicate balance. Those who study communication and conversation distinguish between supporting and switching tactics.

33:20And the idea, a supporting tactic is where you reinforce what the other person is saying, and a switching tactic is where you switch to something that you want to say. And I'll link this to your question in just a moment. So if we're having a conversation, Holland, you say, hey, I just got back from Hawaii. And I say, oh, which island did you go to? That's a supporting tactic. That invites you to say more. If I say, oh, I just got back from Costa Rica, that's a switching tactic. You want to balance these out. And the research suggests you want to be slightly more supporting than switching because that puts the other person in the position of you demonstrating interest and you wanting to hear what they have to say.

34:00The same ideas apply to disclosure of our own stories. We want to share some, but not too much. So the other person, we should be communicating in a way that gets the other person to talk more, but we still have to share some of our stories. So the rule of thumb that they have in this switching versus supporting approach is you want two-thirds supporting, one-third switching. And I think the same idea when it comes to telling stories about ourselves or that are very personal to us versus soliciting stories and input from other people. So I think you should tell some, because if not, it just sounds like you're interrogating people if you don't share anything about yourself.

34:40But if you say too much about yourself, then it becomes almost rude. So I like this one-third you talking, two-thirds them talking approach.

34:48Hala Taha:Yeah, I feel like that's good because people love to talk about themselves. So if you want somebody to like you, you actually want them to talk about themselves because they'll feel like it was like a really happy, positive experience because they got a chance to speak about themselves. Absolutely, absolutely. And that's why going into those situations, thinking about questions you might want to ask is always a good thing. Even if it's spontaneous, even if I'm going into a party or to some kind of conference setting where there's gonna be people milling around, right before I go in the room, I can come up with two or three questions that I'm interested in.

35:24And that's how I start. Because you're right, people like to talk, people like to share information about themselves. Having those questions at the ready can really help you.

35:32Hala Taha:And when people are talking, is there certain things we should be listening for and things that can help us keep the conversation going? Absolutely. So first and foremost, we need to listen better. We're just not good listening. We listen for the top line and then we begin judging, evaluating, rehearsing. You need to focus your listening. You need to listen for the bottom line. What I teach my students and what I try to do myself and when I host my podcast, when I just talk to people on the street, I try to listen to paraphrase. So as somebody's talking, I'm saying, what's the core essence? What's the bottom line?

36:06If I had to paraphrase or summarize what they said, what would I say? And when you listen that way, you listen more deeply. So in conversation, I'm listening for the bottom line. And that's where I start my response. So I might even comment on what that bottom line is. I might say, oh, you're really curious about this. So I name it and then I add to it. So we have to listen better. We have to listen for the bottom line. So as you're listening to somebody, think about if I had to paraphrase what they're saying, what would I say? So use that as the starting point for what you want to contribute next.

36:43Hala Taha:This reminds me of something that Chris Voss does. Do you know who that is, Split the Difference? I can't remember what the word is. Yeah, I just interviewed Chris for my podcast. Great guy, really interesting insight. Yeah, I've interviewed him like five or six times. So I should definitely remember what I'm talking about right now. But basically, I don't remember what it's called, but you paraphrase what somebody's saying as a question. So then they'll just say more information. He likes to talk about mirroring. That's what it is. Yeah, that's what it is, mirroring. And then Charles Duhigg calls this looping.

37:15It's this notion of you start with what the person says, you loop back to it, and then you move forward. And they're both talking about exactly the same thing. It's you recognize what the person has said, which validates them, which builds connection and trust, but it also gives you a starting point for what comes next.

37:31Hala Taha:Okay, Matt. So I know this is spontaneous speaking, but is there any way that we can actually prepare? Because when it comes to wanting to prepare for something, if you know the general topic, I'm assuming that you can at least prepare a little bit, even if you're trying to talk on the cuff. Right? Absolutely, Halala. You are right. We can prepare to be spontaneous. And that sounds counterintuitive, but it really is true. One of the key ways to get yourself prepared is to become familiar with structure. Most of us, when we are nervous and we're put on the spot, we just list and itemize things.

38:11We just say whatever comes into our mind. And that makes it really hard for the audience, the person or people we're talking to, to digest it. A structure is a logical connection of ideas, a beginning, a middle, and an end. Let me give you an example. If you've ever watched an advertisement, you have likely seen the structure problem, solution, benefit. Advertisements start with some issue challenge that exists. They then say how their product or service fixes that issue or challenge, and then how you benefit. So if you're selling cars, selling medicine, selling alcohol, it does not matter. They all follow that structure.

38:46It's a logical connection of ideas. If you are familiar with structure, you have a recipe that you can follow for answering questions, for making small talk, for giving feedback, for apologizing, whatever the situation is. So if it's okay with you, can I share my favorite structure that I think works in a lot of situations? Would that be all right?

39:07Hala Taha:Yes, of course. Excellent. So it's three simple questions. What? So what? Now what? The what is the information you're getting across. It could be your idea, your product, your update, your feedback. The so what is why is it important or relevant to the person you're talking to? And then the now what is what comes next? Maybe it's, do you have questions for me? Let's go into that other room. Let me show you something. It's the next step. So let me give you just real quickly a couple examples of how this might work. Imagine you're in a meeting and your boss says, hey, give me an update on that project you're working on.

39:40You hadn't prepared for an update. So you follow this structure. You answer the three questions. The what is your update. Here's what I've done. The so what is, here's why it's important. It matches our goals or expectations. And then the now what is, here are the three things that I need to have happen before I can progress. So simply by answering what, so what, now what, you've given a structured, packaged, concise response to the update. Similarly, let's imagine you're walking out of a different meeting and somebody turns to you and says, how do you think that meeting went? Again, you're not prepared to give feedback.

40:13You didn't know you were going to have to give feedback. You simply answer these three questions. I might say, I thought the meeting went great, except when you talked about the implementation plan. You spoke quickly without a lot of detail. That's the what. When you speak quickly without a lot of detail, people might think you're nervous or unprepared. That's the so what. Next time, slow down and add these two additional bits of information. That's the now what. So in two very different situations, both spontaneous, by just answering those questions, what, so what, now what, that structure helps me get through it.

40:46And it takes pressure off me because I don't have to think about how to say it. I know how I'm going to say it. I'm just going to answer those questions. I just think, I just have to think about what those answers are. So structure is key and you can prepare and practice structure. I challenge all of your listeners when they are done listening to this episode or any of your other awesome episodes, at the end to simply say, what was the key takeaway for me? Why was it important and how can I use it? And by drilling that just for 10, 15 seconds, you get more used to using this structure so it becomes natural to you.

41:19So structure is a really key ingredient to helping with all these situations we've been talking about. Yeah.

41:26Hala Taha:And when it comes to structure, would you consider storytelling and stories to have structure too? Stories are structures. That's all this. Structure is just another fancy word for story. All stories have a structure, right? Beginning, middle, and an end. So yes. So when somebody says, tell more stories, or this is about storytelling or narrative, what they're really saying, and what I am hearing them say is, use a structure. Use a structure that engages people. And so yes, I see those as synonymous and very important. And what kind of other structures do you lay out in your book or anything else that you want to share about structures?

42:04Oh, thank you. So the whole second part of the book, the first part of the book is about the six-step methodology. The second part of the book is about six specific spontaneous speaking situations. And for each one of them, it has a particular structure that I like teaching. So let me give you an example of one. Many of the people listening to your show are entrepreneurs or people who have ideas that they want to motivate others by. I have a structure that I really like for pitching. So this is short persuasion, like an elevator pitch. This structure is different from what's the what now what this structure is just sentence starters.

42:41You finish these sentence starters. So it's what if you could so that for example, and that's not all. If you finish those four sentence starters, you have a good pitch. So I'm going to ask you to put me on the spot if you're willing to do that. Will you Pick a particular product or service that I would know, something I know. Just give it to me. And without any thought, I'm going to pitch it just using this structure. So if I do my job right, I'm going to demonstrate spontaneous speaking. So I don't know what you're about to say. You didn't know I was going to ask you to do this. So we're both being spontaneous.

43:14Give me something to pitch, a product or service that I would know about.

43:17Hala Taha:A Mac laptop. You did that because I had problems with my Mac laptop. And maybe I, anyway. So what if you could easily access all of your information in a sleek looking device so that you could be prepared and have the information you need at your fingertips? For example, imagine you are flying from Los Angeles to New York and you have to create a presentation that you have to deliver when you land. Wouldn't it be great to have a small, compact, good-looking laptop that you could work on? And that's not all. You get access to a whole community of applications and users that can be supportive of your efforts.

44:04So by simply answering those specific prompts, what if you could so that, for example, and that's not all, you can craft a pitch. What if you could gets people's attention. Attention is the most precious commodity we have in the world today. So that makes it relevant. Here's what's important for you. For example, grounds it in reality. We remember detail better than we remember high-level information. And that's not all extends and expands, whatever you're talking about, beyond the moment. So just knowing those four-sentence starters can help you pitch anything in the moment.

44:40Hala Taha:And one of the things that can also help us with having our speeches be sticky and having people remember what we say is brevity. So speaking of Apple, you talk about Steve Jobs, and he's got the iPod, and he's got very focused messaging. A thousand songs in your pocket is the focused message. But how can we come up with our own impromptu brief message? Like, what are some tactics for that? Yes. So two things. Beyond having a structure, structure is critical to being more concise. Two things. One, you have to think about your audience and what's relevant and most important to them and then focus everything you're doing like a magnet towards that relevance.

45:21So I am constantly thinking to myself, what is most important to my audience in this moment? And that's what helps me focus. Second, all communication, planned or spontaneous, needs to be goal-driven. A goal has three parts, information, emotion, and action. What do I want the audience to know? How do I want them to feel? And what do I want them to do? So before I walk into a conference room where I might get questions or be asked for feedback, I think, what do I want this audience to know? How do I want them to feel? And what do I want them to do? By focusing on relevance and by focusing on your goal, you will become more concise and clear.

46:00And if you can then convey your message in a structure like we just talked about, that's how you truly become relevant and focused.

46:08Hala Taha:And it makes sense because in this podcast, when we first joined, I was like, hey, it's a lot of entrepreneurs. And then you decided out of all examples to talk about the pitching example. Yes, exactly. Because you felt like it would be very relevant for our audience. And as I was asking. We are getting so meta right now. Yes, that's exactly what I did. Yeah. So one of the exercises you suggest to help us with focus is called a brevity challenge. Can you tell us about that? Yes. So most of us, as I said, say more than we need to do. And so we can actually challenge ourselves to say what we're saying with fewer words.

46:43This is a game that comes from the world of improvisation, where you start by saying something, and then you cut it in half, and then you cut it in half again. So a great way to do this is to look at something you've written, maybe even a text or a document or something, and challenge yourself to say it in half the number of words. How would you do that? And again, I'm not saying that whatever the result of that is in half number of words is the right way to do it. But what we're training our brain in this brevity example is we're training to prioritize. Here's a great use for AI, by the way. If you've written something, an email, a document, put it in AI and say, make it half as long or highlight just the key elements and then look at what it comes out with.

47:28I'm not saying to leverage what it comes out with, but just look at what it has done to make it more concise and then use that as a reference point. Say, oh, you know what it did? It cut out all the big words. Or do you know what it did? It took all of the action verbs and put them up front. So you begin to see how you can prioritize and get briefer in what you say. So whenever you write something, you can always challenge yourself and say, how would I say this in half as long? And that by training that brain, by training that process, you train your brain to do that in real time.

48:01Hala Taha:I know Mark Twain, I think, has this quote, writing is easy, you just gotta cross out all the wrong words or something like that. Absolutely, he's got wonderful sayings about communication, but right. It's about self-editing, but doing it very quickly. And the more you practice it, the better you get at it. How do we get better at reading the room in business situations? Yes, yes. So my podcast is Think Fast, Talk Smart. The book is Think Faster, Talk Smarter. the think fast and think faster part are all about pattern recognition. And we have to remind ourselves that whenever we're communicating, patterns are at play.

48:39And we have to be looking at those patterns and cataloging those patterns. Many of us are in repetitive situations. We have meetings with the same people over and over, or we do similar tasks like you interview. Now you interview different people, but you're interviewing. And you can begin to look and notice patterns. Many of us are just so focused on getting through our communication that we don't spend time focusing on the patterns. And if we can train ourselves to look at those patterns, it helps us read the room. That's what reading the room is. It's pattern recognition. So we might notice that 10 minutes into most of our meetings, the energy level dips.

49:17Well, that's a pattern. And I can notice, hey, we're coming up on 10 minutes. Maybe I should do something different. So reading the room to me is all about just observing what's going on in the moment and then reflecting on it after the fact and coming up with a plan on how to deal with it in the future. So we have to take the time to get a little meta in our communication to observe what's going on and then to really reflect and then be prepared to adjust and adapt when we see those things play out.

49:44Hala Taha:I remember one of the first interviews that I ever did on this podcast was with Chase Hughes. Yes. And he's this like behavioral expert. And I remember he told me if people start blinking really fast, it means that they're not paying attention. Right. And that like, if somebody is blinking normally, that means that they're engaged. But if they start blinking really fast, it kind of means that they're not paying attention. And of course, if they're looking around like other shoes or like, well, I'm now going to just, I'm just going to stare the whole time. So you think I'm paying attention to it?

50:15Yes. No, you're right. But you have to observe that. You have to notice that, right, in order to act on it.

50:21Hala Taha:Yeah. How about when we're negotiating? I know that's a big thing also for entrepreneurs. When we're negotiating or trying to convince even like our partner of something, how should we communicate? Oh, this is a big topic. Think Fast, Talk Smart is all about communication tips, and we've spent a lot of time talking about negotiation. So I've talked to lots of experts, as I know you have. Let me summarize a couple of things that I've taken away from all of my interviews. First and foremost, we have to know what we want. What is it that we want and what is it that we're willing to give up and what is it we are non-negotiables?

50:55Many of us enter into negotiations without a clear what's our non-negotiable and where can we negotiate? That's number one. Number two, we have to take the time to think about the other person's position. How much do they prioritize what it is we're negotiating over? We have this assumption that we make that everybody that we're dealing with holds whatever they hold at the same level we do, right? And let me give an example. My wife and I over the years have developed this technique. So we don't fight and our negotiations go better. When we have something that we might disagree on and have to negotiate about, before we ever start, we declare how important that is to us.

51:36So let me give a really mundane, simple example. Let's say we want to go out to dinner and my wife really wants to go to Italian food and I really want to do Mexican food. That could be a negotiation. That could be a fight. But before we do it, we simply say, declare our priorities. She might say, going to Italian food, that's an eight on a scale of one to 10. And for me, Mexican food's a four. There's no negotiation. There's no conflict. What happens is I might assume, well, her desire is the same as my desire and I'm going to really push. And now all of a sudden, because I'm pushing, her desire rises because, hey, nobody likes to be threatened.

52:10So figure out priorities as best you can, because you might not even need to negotiate. The third bit of advice is to think about the approach and metaphor that you're bringing to the situation. Michelle Gelfand, who's a colleague of mine at Stanford's Business School, studies negotiation. And she says, mind your metaphors. A lot of us, when we approach negotiation, see it as a battle, see it as a fight. And when you see it that way, that changes your whole demeanor, how you approach it, the words you use. But if you see it as a dance or as a conversation, that changes it as well, or a problem to be solved.

52:47So think about how are you approaching it. And then the last thing, and I'm sure this isn't surprising, you have to approach from a place of listening. Many of us go and say, here are all the reasons we should do it my way. Start by listening. Start by asking questions. That also connects you, but you get an idea of what's important. So if you follow those four steps, really know what your non-negotiables are. Think about the person's prioritization. How are you approaching it in terms of your mindset, your metaphor? And then ultimately listening, you're going to negotiate better.

53:19Hala Taha:Okay, one of my last questions for you is about networking. A lot of us have to go to these networking events. How can we best prepare? Like you mentioned, even though it's spontaneous, there's still preparation involved. And then how do we excel at small talk? So when you're networking, just like when you're interviewing, first and foremost, you should be thinking about who are the people that are in the space or in the room or on the Zoom that you're connecting with. So do some research, reconnaissance and reflection about who the people are that you might be speaking to, because that will help you focus your content.

53:51Second, come up with themes that you want to get across. So in a networking environment, what are some key ideas I want to get across and share? And you can plan those in advance, whatever those are. You might want to share your opinions or you have strong opinions on AI or something going on in the news. That's your theme. And then stockpile some specific support for those themes. Maybe it's a story you have. Maybe it's some data you heard about. Maybe it's a conversation you had with somebody else. So you stockpile those. Think of it this way. You know, if you ever see a restaurant's kitchen and everybody's cooking fast and furious during a high peak time at the restaurant, they have everything prepared in advance.

54:34Everything's pre-chopped, pre-sautéed. So they're just assembling. You can do the same thing. Think about these themes and then think about these different types of support for those themes. So when I'm in the networking situation and somebody brings up a point, I could say, I can connect that point to this theme I wanted to get across and I can pull in this example. So you've taken the pressure off of yourself to originate in the moment. And instead, you're just connecting and building. And that can actually help you feel better. And it allows you to be more agile and spontaneous. Think about this.

55:07An athlete does drills for certain aspects of the game. You know, professional basketball players do a lot of free throws, right? Or they do a lot of positional work. So if I'm in this position and the ball comes to me in this way, I shoot it in that way. That's what you're doing. So when it happens, you're free to respond, but you've done that pre-work. So have a clear theme, have some supporting material that you can pull into that theme. And then when it comes to small talk directly, start with questions or observations. Ask somebody a question or observe something that's happening in the environment.

55:40Just comment on it. I made a great, good friend simply by standing in line at a conference. I didn't know anybody. I looked around and I noticed lots of people were dressed in blue. It wasn't a uniform. It just happened to be coincidence. I turned to the guy. I said, I didn't get the memo on wearing blue. He looked around and said, you're right. Everybody's wearing blue. Started a great conversation. We've now become friends. When I travel to where he lives, I visit him all the time. It started simply with an observation. The last thing I'll say is the thing that challenges many people in small talk is getting out of it.

56:11How do you end it? Rachel Greenwald, who I mentioned earlier, taught me this technique. She calls it the white flag, not for surrender, but in auto racing, the white flag is what you wave right before you end the race. So when you want to end small talk, most of us just rely on biology. I'm hungry. I'm thirsty. I have to go to the bathroom. It's awkward. Instead, you wave the white flag. You signal you're going to leave in a little bit. If you and I were talking, I might say, I've really enjoyed this conversation. In a few minutes, I'm going to go over there and talk to people. But before I leave, I want to ask you one more question about something you did on a recent podcast.

56:45So do you see what I've done there? I've signaled that I'm going to leave soon so you can prepare yourself. It's not a surprise, but I dive in for just a little bit more information. So before you start, you do your stockpiling in your themes and you now know a way to end. It makes networking and small talk so much easier.

57:04Hala Taha:Oh my gosh, that was such good advice. And I don't do this on purpose. I never did it on purpose, but because I go speak at so many podcast conferences, what happens is I'm preparing these like awesome presentations and I'm pulling all this data. And then I really do like the whole time, I'm just like touting what I learned in my presentation to everybody when I'm doing small talk. And that's my theme. And I never realized that I'm actually doing that. So you, in your book, you talk about an NPR journalist who has a killer last question that she likes to ask her interviewees. Can you tell us about this killer last question and why it works.

57:42This is Debra Schifrin you're talking about. Debra is also a colleague at Stanford. And before I tell you the question, her goal is to give people an opportunity to say more. So a lot of us in our dialogue, we ask a question, they respond, we ask a question. But if you actually pause for a moment and you ask people and you just give them an opportunity to say more. So not only does she say, is there anything else you'd like to say? Her magic question is, is there anything more you'd like to add? She also builds in a pause. So when somebody's done answering a question, if you pause just a little bit before you ask the next question or comment on it, you give people space.

58:26We are so busy and our attention is so pulled in different directions. Space to say more is a gift. And so if you allow people more space, you actually show that you care, that you want to learn more, and that you want to connect. So I encourage all of you, when you are having deep, meaningful conversations or want to have deep, meaningful relationships, pause a little bit, give people space, and really listen to what they say, and it will transform those relationships.

58:59Hala Taha:So we're going to get meta again. Is there anything important that I neglected to ask? Oh, well, thank you for that opportunity. I think one of the things we did not talk about that is important for us to think about is not just what you say, but how you say it. We need to be thinking about our body and our voices when we communicate. So it's not just feeling comfortable and confident speaking in the moment. It is appearing comfortable and confident. So let me share just a couple bits of advice about what we can do with our body and our voices. First and foremost, you want to be big. Many of us, when we get nervous or are feeling threatened, we make ourselves small.

59:40So the best thing you can do is take your shoulder blades and just pull them down. Make yourself broad. I'm not pushing my elbows back. I'm not puffing my chest out. I just pull my shoulder blades down and I make myself look bigger. You look more confident. You want to hold your head straight and not tilted. I'm not saying be stiff and rigid. Just make yourself big. When you speak, vary your voice. If I were to have spoken like this for this entire interview, people would have left a long time ago. Our brains are wild for novelty, things that change. So add emotive words. If you are somebody who doesn't have a lot of variation, add adjectives and adverbs.

1:00:19So I would never say, I'm really excited to be here. No, I'd say I'm really excited. So emphasize those words. So the one thing we didn't talk about is how you say what you say. And we need to remember that. And the single easiest way to work on this is to record yourself, either through voice memo or through video. It's really easy to do that these days. And watch. It's painful to watch yourself. But when you do, you'll see these things that work for you and things that you might want to change. All of my MBA students I teach, whenever they do a presentation, I make them watch themselves without listening to it.

1:00:54And then I make them listen to themselves without watching it and then do both together. And while they hate it, they love it because they learn so much and they actually are able to change.

1:01:04Hala Taha:Got it. Yeah, that'd be really painful. Like, for instance, like when I listen back to my interviews, I'm like, I hate this. I can't listen to it. But you have to do it. You have to do it to improve. It's the burden of being a podcaster. You have to listen and watch. But my hunch is, Holly, you've probably changed some of your communication based on what you've seen. Of course. Of course. So, Matt, this has been such an incredible discussion. Like I mentioned, I'm so excited to just like go back to your book and study it tooth and nail. It's called Think Faster, Talk Smarter. I always end my show with two questions that I ask all of my guests.

1:01:38Hala Taha:So the first one is, what is one actionable thing my young and profiters can do today to become more profitable tomorrow? focus on your communication. At the end of every day, take 30 seconds to think about what is something that went well in my communication today and what is something I'd like to improve. By simply taking time to catalog what works for you and really lean into that and take the things that challenge you and start fixing that, working on it, can help. Every day I do this and on the weekends I go back and look at everything and then I set a plan for myself. So I am constantly working and honing on my communication and it will help you be more profitable.

1:02:19It'll help you connect better with people and ultimately help you feel better about the relationships you have.

1:02:25Hala Taha:And what is your secret to profiting in life? And this can go beyond financial and business. Being open to opportunity. I rarely say no. I say yes to many opportunities and my life has unfolded really pleasantly and in great ways, simply because many people's natural response is to say no, to be protective. And I like to approach things with curiosity and openness. So I encourage everybody to do that. It has been my superpower where I've looked for opportunity and really driven towards it. And where can everybody learn more about you? Tell us about your podcast and everything like that. Oh, thank you for the opportunity.

1:03:05This has been fantastic. So the podcast is called Think Fast, Talk Smart. It is 20-minute episodes about communication, all aspects of it. We've been around for almost five years, lots of episodes. Check us out at fastersmarter.io, where everywhere you get your podcasts, including YouTube, check out the book, Think Faster, Talk Smarter. You can get it wherever you get your books. Really trying to help people hone and develop their communication and improve their careers.

1:03:34Hala Taha:Amazing. Matt, I had such a fun time in this conversation. I personally learned so much. I feel like you're going to impact me for many years to come just with this conversation. So thank you for your time today. Hala, thank you. This was a true delight. You are a master at what you do.