Michelle Tillis Lederman: 7 Mindset Shifts That Turn Networking Into Your Greatest Advantage | Leadership | YAPClassic

22:14We can have more than one unique charm. I was recently collaborating with somebody on my team. We were designing and co-creating a program. And I said to her off the bat, I said, please disagree with me. Please push back on me. I said, sometimes when I speak, I come off as if my answer is the right answer and there's no room for anybody else. I said, do not take me that way. So I let them know off the bat, not to interpret the way that I know my tendency is to be interpreted. And she's like, that was so great. Thank you. I will push back. And she does. And it's wonderful. That's such great advice.

22:46I think this is something that's like, it's not obvious. It's definitely a tool that we can use to be more open with others. And it's genius, in my opinion, because it's just calling out the elephant in the room. Let me just call it out so it's not awkward anymore and so that we can get along as well as possible. It's matching intent with impact. And so when we have some of these unique charms, when we have some of these blind spots, we have a certain intent, but it's not the impact that we're having. And so in order to have those things and bridge that gap, giving some information about how to interpret me or how to receive something I do or how to even keep me in line.

23:24Sometimes I'm like, sometimes I get excited and I interrupt. Don't let me. And so I talk to a lot of my coaching clients about teaching their employees and their assistants and things like that, how to manage them, how to manage up. And it is a amazing tool to create more collaborative, more cohesive, and more productive working relationships. When you tell somebody, here's how to keep me in line. This is really, really smart for any leaders or managers tuning in because especially as a leader, people get afraid to sort of tell you anything otherwise or counteract your opinion or whatever it is.

23:58So I can imagine that that could really help foster relationships in a business. Okay, so let's talk about emotional intelligence. So I know that it's pretty obvious to think that connectors are going to have higher emotional intelligence than non-connectors. Can you talk to us about the five levels of emotional intelligence and how we can improve our emotional intelligence. It's so funny. I was starting to listen to the 10th anniversary of emotional intelligence by Daniel Goldman this morning on my morning walk. I interviewed him. Really fresh in my mind. And there's a lot of different models of emotional intelligence.

24:34And I don't remember who I credit this model to, but I think of it in two parts, self-mastery and social mastery. So the first three levels of emotional intelligence about self-mastery. So that has to start with self-awareness, which we've already been talking about, right? Understanding my triggers and understanding the good and the bad. And then it's self-regulation. So how do I not be reactive and be more responsive in those moments of trigger? And self-motivation. So how do I act in the face of obstacles? How do I keep, as you said, let's go, go, go. When some roadblock or something doesn't go our way, how do we rebound and recover and regroup?

25:16So that's the self-mastery. Social mastery is about taking this outside of yourself. So it's picking up on those social cues, social awareness, right? The awareness of others and listening, I always say, with your eyes as well as your ears. So what am I getting? And then taking responsibility and checking that assumption, like I'm feeling this, what's going on there? Or checking in because we don't want to I just assume we're right. And then being able to act and make decisions collaboratively, that's at the pinnacle, right? When I can collaborate, co-create and make decisions with others, now I have really mastered the emotional intelligence where they feel empowered and appreciated and engaged.

25:59Yeah. And it's so interesting to think, you know, I think of my business partner, Kate, and myself. We're so different. We're both masters at emotional intelligence, but in our own ways. And it's just so interesting to think how you could be really strong in one aspect of emotional intelligence and not so strong on other aspects. What's the best way to gauge where we are? And what are some resources we can use to learn more about EI? Well, there's tons of assessments out there. And, you know, I am a fan of them, but you can do free ones online. There are paid ones where you get a robust report.

26:31But if you do the paid ones, do it with a coach because it has expertise in that one tool, because that will help you figure out what to do with it. So we might get a result and say, okay, great, you know what your triggers are, but you let them trigger you. And so you really need to work on self-regulation and to get to a more responsive place versus a reactive place, then they can help you put an action plan into place to do that. It could be you just don't have an awareness of others. You're not even looking up from your work. You're so focused down here that your eyes aren't up here to pick up on those cues that other people are giving you.

27:05So your social awareness might be lacking. So feedback, whether it is self-collected through an assessment, that's the best way you're going to get information. That's how we start to reduce our blind spots. And then Daniel Goldman, I think, has a bunch of books on emotional. He's like really the godfather. We also have a whole episode on Yap about that. So I'll mention it in the outro so you guys can check it out. Okay. So let's talk about agency over our lives and having a clear vision for our future. Why is that so important for connectors? I was kind of hoping you'd go to this one. For those who haven't read the book yet, the seven mindsets, we're going a little bit in order.

27:43I'm going to list them out just so you heard them once because we're probably not going to get through all of them. But connectors are open and accepting. They have a clear vision. They trust. They come from a place of abundance. They're social and curious, conscientious, and have a generous spirit. And one of the reasons I put have a clear vision really upfront. And by the way, these are non-linear. It's not like I have to do one, then do the next and do the next. They actually enable each other. It's really hard to be conscientious if you don't trust and have a generous spirit if you don't come from a place of abundance.

28:16So they really do enable and support each other. But to have a clear vision is the only way you are really going to access the connector's advantage. Because if you don't know what you want, you can't get it. So you can't get faster, easier, better results if you don't know what result you're looking for. But I've always hated the question, what do you want to do, you know, 10 years from now? Where do you see yourself five years down the road? I'm like, I don't know. I don't want to know now. I want it to be a surprise. I want the exploration. I don't want predestined. If you have that good on you, I've just never been that person.

28:48But it doesn't mean I don't have a clear vision for something. I actually have right here, always in my drawer, my sticky note. And you'll see there's lots of sticky notes over the years. Each year I write a sticky note of what's my vision for the year. And it doesn't have to be the far out plan. It could be the three months, six months, nine months, one year plan. And I don't usually go beyond that. And what that does for us is it has us understand when somebody is embodying the mindset of the connector with that spirit of generosity. And they say, what are you working on and how can I help? Which is something I would say everybody listening should be doing all the time in all those conversations before you get off.

29:28You know, what are you working on? How can I help? Who do you want to know? What would be valuable for you? It's a fabulous question to ask. It's also a really important question to have an answer to. And that's what having a clear vision does for you. So when somebody says, I'm here offering you help, you can say, okay, here's the kind of help I'm looking for. So is this clear vision just related to networking? Or are you saying have a clear vision for your goals? And then once you know what your goals are, think about what networking you need to do to support that. Give us some rigor around what you want us to do exactly.

30:05Okay. So the first question is, this is not about networking. This is about you, your life, your goals. So having a clear vision about whatever it is that you are trying to accomplish in your life, whether it is a personal goal of changing careers or getting healthier or running a marathon, or if it's a professional goal of landing a client, becoming partner, getting a new job, whatever it is, right? You have something you're working on. One time when my second book came out, the Heroes Get Hired book, my goal was to connect with Michelle Obama. And I put it out there. I put it out there so much so that I got a phone call with her chief of staff.

30:40I never spoke to her directly, but that's pretty close. And I got my book in front of her. And that was the goal. When my last book came out, my goal was very simple. I wanted to get to 100 reviews on Amazon. And so they can be small goals. They can be big goals, right? And I just gave you two examples of ones that I've had over time. And they can be different goals based on the person you're talking to. So first thing is, that's what the goal is about. The second thing is, and I kind of squirmed in my seat a little bit when you're like, do we do this first? Do we do that first? And you wanted rigor.

31:09And I was like, you know what? I've always been a little organic when it comes to connection. And the truth is that I've had to be a little more intentional about that post-COVID. I will say that it still makes me squirm a little bit to be too strategic and too tactical when it comes to building relationships. But I actually just designed a course called Intentional Connection in a Hybrid World and have been delivering. I just delivered it to Procter & Gamble women last month and they were so hungry for it because all of a sudden we don't have a water cooler moment. We're only in the office one or two days a week and the people that we want to connect with might not be there the same two days.

31:45And there's fewer live events, although they are coming back and we don't feel as connected to our organizations or to our coworkers or our friends because we're just not in their space anymore. And so, yes, I do think we need to be intentional about going out and building those relationships and having virtual coffees. And we can talk a little bit bit more about how to be tactical around that. And as I say that, I also just want you to build the relationships that you want to build because that's where the true relationship and connection forms deeply and strongly and it lasts. And you don't know who they went to camp with and you don't know who they went to school with and you don't know who their neighbor is and you don't know who they're married to.

32:24And those strong ties can lead to the weak ties and the introductions that you might need.

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36:56Totally understand. Let's talk about the ways that we can achieve what we want. And that means asking for what we want. So let's do quick fire. Right now, I'm gonna rattle off a type of ask that you mentioned in your book, and you can tell us what we need to know about it, how we can use this approach, when we should use it, why it works. So the first one is an opt-out ask. Perfect. And I was hoping you were going to take us to the ask because that's the other part of having a clear vision. You can't just have the clear vision. You have to be willing to ask for what you want. And I always say, if you don't ask, the answer is no.

37:30If you ask, you immediately increase your odds. And I'm like drilling this into my kids. Every time I'm like, ask, ask. And I'm like, see, you wouldn't have gotten if you didn't ask. I'm very annoying. The opt-out ask is actually one of my favorite asks. It is the easiest one to access. yes and the reason I love it is because you are giving the person the reason to say no and you want to make it as easy for them to say no as it is for them to say yes because yes is easy and no is hard and if I have to say no to you or I want to say no to you now I'm uncomfortable and that puts the relationship at risk and my goal in teaching you how to ask is to make sure that you don't put a relationship at risk it is not necessarily always to get the yes but to increase your chances of getting a yes, either now or later.

38:15And that is by putting the relationship at first. So an opt out ask might be, if your company allows it, I would really appreciate a recommendation on LinkedIn. If your company allows it is the opt out. Or if you have time, I would really appreciate a review on Amazon. If you have time is the opt out. I'm really busy right now. Totally get it. Don't even think twice. They feel like it's totally okay and you're not annoyed with them and now they don't feel like they need to avoid you. I love that because if you don't give them an opt out and they say no, then they just feel like, well, I can never talk to this person again now.

38:50It makes it less awkward. Okay. How about make it easy ask? So make it easy has actually a lot of ways to make it easy. And what we want to do is make it easy for them to say yes. And if it's not yet easy, we're going to find different ways to make it easy. So there is the alternate ask, and all of these are forms of making it easy. The alternate ask is, do you want to try this or do you want to try that? And they can choose because they're of equal value to you. And they can feel like, well, that one feels more comfortable. I'll do that one. So you're giving them options, the alternatives. If you want to make it smaller, you can do the shrinking ask.

39:26And so, hey, can I take you out for lunch? And they're thinking, or maybe just a coffee. or, you know, perhaps we can just jump on a Zoom or a phone call. Or, you know, if this is your busy season, I totally get it. Is there somebody else in the organization that you might connect me to that might have some time, you know, in the next few months? So we're going to make the ask smaller and smaller and smaller until there's something that they can say yes to because people do want to say yes, right? So instead of them having to figure out the alternative to what you asked for, you can give them smaller and smaller options in ways that you can be supported.

40:00And there's also the convenient ask, which is really making it easy. Typically when somebody is of a higher rank or brings more to the relationship, and we kind of know when we're in those positions, we might say, do you want me to come to your office? Or do you have a favorite coffee shop? What time is best for you? And just really make it as easy and you jump through all the hoops to get to that yes. I love that. A note on that is if you're talking to somebody busier than you, definitely don't send them a Calendly link. Definitely don't say my assistant will send you times. Like you bring the times, you bring the options, like just make it as easy as possible.

40:39This is something I see a lot of people screw up. How about the WIFIT ask? So WIFIT, for those who haven't heard this phrase, it's what's in it for them. And this is actually one of the most powerful asks because it is putting the benefit forward to create an impetus for action. But it's also one you need to be careful with because sometimes it is really not a benefit to them. And if it is not, don't pretend that it is. And I can't tell you how many times I've gotten email, LinkedIn things saying, I think it'd be mutually beneficial for us to connect and da, da, da, da, da. And I'm thinking, hmm.

41:15Where's the benefit? You know, if you're a student and you're going to a CEO, don't say it'll be mutually beneficial. Say, you know, I know that you're really keen on mentorship and I'm trying to learn this and might you or somebody in your organization, you can combine asks, right? So we're being deferential. We're not saying what's in it for them. And we're giving also shrinking, we're giving options, we're throwing it all in there. But what's in it for them was also there because I said, I know you're really big on mentorship, Right? So I'm saying this is something you've said you value. And here's a way for you to execute on one of your values.

41:53So there's a WIFIT there. When you are going to your organization and you want to go to this conference and it costs a lot of money and you're trying to convince your organization to pay for it, that's a great time to use a WIFIT. What's in it for the organization for me to go to this? What information can I bring back? How will I bring it back? How will I create value for the organization if I go? These are really good. I feel like this is my favorite part of the interview so far because I feel like it's It's so actionable. Like we can just use this immediately. Okay, how about the non-ask? So this is my newest favorite.

42:24I was all about the opt-out and now I have really kind of incorporated in the non-ask. And the non-ask is when you're not asking for anything specific. Instead, you're sharing a little bit about your goal or your vision without the ask. But here's the trick. When you bring your energy and when you bring your passion and your enthusiasm and your excitement and your sharing, And here's what I'm working on. Like, you know, hey, I want to make my book a bestseller or hey, I want to meet Michelle Obama. Whatever that crazy thing is, that excitement, that exuberism, it's contagious. And people are wanting to help.

42:58And if they don't come up with an idea themselves, then you simply follow it up with any advice or any ideas for me. And that's not asking them for anything specific, but that's tapping into their brain and their desire to be valuable, to add value, to tap into their generous spirit, their connector mindset and think about who can I connect them to? What information can I give them? How could I be helpful? What ideas? And this happens to me all the time. I have a mentor. He is a CEO of multiple companies that have gone public. And I've known him since I was pregnant with my first child, who is now 17.

43:32And we are still in touch and we get together once a year and COVID, maybe not so much, but we've stayed in touch. And I shared with him about my latest book. And while I was still writing, he goes, well, here's an idea. And I didn't even ask him for ideas. And his ideas were phenomenal. And it's because of him that I have 30 experts in my book giving me and everyone who's reading it even more advice and guidance. And it was because he said, well, let's get a millennial angle here. And it's those moments of brilliance that is just because I'm sharing, here's what I'm working on. Here's what I'm excited about.

44:07That's the non-ask. I think that works really, really well. So I know that we're not going to have time to cover all these mindsets, but I do want you to cover them at a high level. So let's talk about abundance, trust, being curious. Just walk us through at a high level some of these mindsets that we didn't talk about yet. I'll think about like when I'm doing my keynote, I give you a like a two sentence thing on each one. Trust for me is the foundation of relationship. And I talk about four pillars of trust, authenticity, which we talked a little bit about, vulnerability, transparency and consistency.

44:38and I will say you have to give trust to get trust, but don't be afraid of vulnerability. It is not weakness, it is openness. The next one is abundance. This is the hardest one for people and it's also the hardest one for me because I grew up with scarcity and whatever scarcity looks like to you, there's not enough money, there's not enough time, there's not enough clients, there's not enough room at the top for women, there's not enough something and a shift from scarcity to abundance, It's not everything's fine and everything's going to be great and there's no, no, it is the belief in the possibility and not, not even the possibility, the probability that things can be exponentially better than they are, that it doesn't have to be a linear progression and that there's enough to go around and that I am enough.

45:23And it doesn't mean that we're not jealous at times, but it means that we can put that aside and then, so here's an example, friend of mine landed this amazing client. I was super, super jealous. it was in the sports field. I'm like, oh my God, can I work for you? You know, do you need help? I'm like, how did you land them? And I was really like, ah, for a little bit. And that's okay. Feel it, let it go, release it. And then I went back and I'm just like, okay, teach me. How did you land that one? This is something I want to stick on for a moment, because for me, I consider myself a super connector.

45:56And I think one of my big things is that I never look at anybody as competition. You could be in my field. You could be also like LinkedIn queen, podcaster, whatever. I'm just going to figure out how you can help me and how we can help each other and how we can work together and collaborate. So I always say collaboration over competition. And if you don't have this abundant mindset, you will never work with your competitors. And this is one of the most important things you can do to get ahead is to actually be friends with and work with people who are your competitors or in your same field. And a lot of people get tripped up on this.

46:31They don't want to help anyone. They don't want to give away any sort of secrets. And like, that's definitely not how you grow within your niche. It's like we're of the same mind. I'm like, I knew when we met the first time that we connected because we think alike. Something I always say is I have no competition. I only have potential strategic alliances. People are like, well, who's your biggest contender? I'm like, I don't have competitors. I don't need to be in competition. There is enough and I have collaboration partners and I have strategic partners and alliances and friends and colleagues.

47:03And that's how I view everyone and anyone. Okay, so take us to the next one. So we are up to social and curious. And I'm always very careful with this one because a lot of the introverts out there are like, I don't like this one. But let me be clear. There's a section in this called the introvert's edge because being social and curious is not a social butterfly. It's not the life of the party. It is simply putting yourself in a position to be social and curious about one other individual. And introverts are actually really uniquely skilled and naturally good at this. So that's really why social and curious go together, because they need to go together if you want to build connection and relationships.

47:42Let me stick on this for a second. So I know that introverts are great listeners. So that's a great skill as a networker. Talk to us about the different formats that they can leverage to ensure that they'll be successful. So that's a really important thing. And I say find your format, right? Whether you want to be on this platform, that platform, face-to-face, big conferences, small roundtables, whatever format or channel of communication for you to connect and be social and curious on is your choice. At the same time, I want everyone out there listening to think about their stretch. I don't want you to be stretching all the time, but if we're always stretching just a little or often stretching just a little, then the next time it's not as big a stretch.

48:26So find your format, be comfortable and work in the environments in which you thrive and always think about a stretch. I really appreciate that advice because I know a lot of people that are introverts and they'll say like, well, I really only do one-on-one. but when you're friends with extroverts, we don't want to be one-on-one and so you might just get left out of opportunities that are not one-on-one, right? And so you want to make sure you're open to different opportunities. I know it's harder for people who are introverts but like you said, to stretch is important. Okay, so what else is down the line?

49:02Conscientious. And I wish we had more time because this is one that I think everyone needs and it's the idea that connectors do what they say they're going to do. They follow up and they follow through. and if they're able to do that, they need to learn how to say yes and they need to learn how to say no. And so it's about setting up boundaries. It's about being generous with yourself, right? So we said these enable each other, right? I can't be conscientious. I also have to be generous spirit, not just to others, but generous spirit to myself. So creating boundaries and recognizing that yes and no are not one word answers.

49:32And we won't go into it, but in that chapter, I give you lots of ways to frame a yes and a no. Again, not to be off-putting in the relationship. And then generosity, is that the last one? That's the last one. You can't be a connector if you do not want to add value, if you do not want to support and show that interest in something else because that's what a connector's mindset is, is thinking about not just me and not just you, but the interaction between us and how we can create value for all. Okay, so I love this. And let's transition into like our tactical best advice, give us exercises, activity portion of the interview.

50:12So like I mentioned, I consider networking to be one of my top skills, right? I feel like the reason why I'm very successful and dominated my niche is because I've had these networking skills. And so one of the things that I like to do, speaking of generosity, is I always think of ways to add value. And my favorite way to do this is to actually introduce two people together in my network. So when I first meet somebody, one of the first things I think about is who in my network can solve their problem. So I try to understand what their problem is, even if I have nothing to do with it, if I have zero expertise.

50:44I interview so many people on my podcast. I meet so many people. So I sort of know an expert in everything. And then I try to introduce them to somebody who I already know. And so what I'm doing is basically giving value to a cult connection and then warming up an existing connection and putting them together. And I learned from Jordan Harbinger to do this in the best way, I have to do a double opt-in intro. So I'll ask the first person, hey, I've got somebody who I think is gonna solve your problem. Are you okay with me introducing you guys on email? Then I ask the other person, hey, I think I have a potential client for you.

51:15Are you okay? Do you have bandwidth? Can I introduce you over email? You get both yeses and then you introduce them. What you don't wanna do is introduce people without asking them first, especially if one of them is like a celebrity or an influencer, you don't wanna give away somebody's email. If they're not really a celebrity or influencer, you have less risk there, but I would definitely do a double opt-in intro. Any other suggestions in terms of how we can bring value to other people when networking? So I have so much to add on the intro. Yes, go, tell me, tell me. I think you will build a reputation with people that when the intro is equal, you won't necessarily have to do the permissions all the time.

51:54When they're unequal, you want to make sure you're at least doing the permission at the higher level. Agree with that fully. So introductions, love. That's one of the greatest ways to add value. information, invitations, appreciation, recognition, engagement, right? So on the social media, a great way to add value is a like, a comment, a share. There's lots of light touches that we can do to show that we are wanting to stay in somebody's orbit and be in their mind, have our name pop up, but not get in their face. And one of the things that you said was something really tactical. And when you asked me that, the first thing that came to my mind is a lot of times introverts and extroverts will have somebody pop into their mind and then it'll float right back out.

52:36I want you to hold onto it. When somebody pops into your mind, write their name down, right into your calendar, your outlook, your whatever. And then when it pops back up, send them a note, send them a tweet, send them a text, send them a something and just say, Hey, I was just thinking about you. What's up? I've been just doing something on social media lately of just anybody who all of a sudden, if I see them pop up and I'm like, ah, and I have that moment of curiosity, they're going to get a little note on LinkedIn of saying, you just popped up in my feed, checking in what's going on. Here's what's going on with me.

53:06It's really quick. And so those light touches where you're not really requiring or requesting or asking for anything, but just keeping it fresh. And then if we think about tactics for if it's already kind of feels a little stale and it's gone a little stale, my favorite subject line of an email is it's been too long. Just acknowledge, as we said all along, we acknowledge the elephant in the room. I used to have this graveyard. I called it my graveyard of business cards, which I threw out over the pandemic. But like you collect them and then they just pile up. And sometimes you'd like go through and clean them up.

53:40And I'd be like, I forgot about this person. And I'd send a note saying, I just found your business card on my desk. And that would be another subject line. And usually I'd written something on it so I could reference. But those are two little quick things that anybody can do right now. Yeah, and you can take this business card idea and you can use your text messages or your email, scroll all the way to the bottom. see like whoever and I talked to in a while and just sort of refresh those connections. Okay. Last question before you go. Hybrid work environment. We teased it out before. What are some things that we should consider when connecting in a hybrid work environment?

54:11Oh, there's so much. Okay. So I really talk about being intentional about what you do at work when you're with people and being intentional about what you decide to do in a virtual environment. But one of the things you have to be intentional about is building into the agenda those moments of water cooler, right? So we get on and everyone's on a little bit early. The meeting always has a five-minute grace. That five minutes is the chit-chat that happens as we're coming into the room. Be inclusive. Everyone's listening to your chit-chat. So as people come into the room, invite them into that conversation so you're broadening the conversation and we have it.

54:43You can have rotating icebreakers and they're not necessarily icebreakers anymore. I'll call them connection activities. It could be, hey, let's give me a tour of your office. It could be hold up something on your desk that makes you smile every day or turn your camera around so we can see what you're looking at. I mean, I have a list of them. Like I have so many that I could share around little things, but rotate who's running it. So it's not just the boss every time saying, okay, today's thing is this. It's all right, we're going in alphabetical order. And next week it's going to be you and you get to come up with what we're going to talk about for the first five or 15 minutes and not every meeting, but build some of those things in.

55:22Well, I know you have to run, so we're not going to do your actionable advice because you already did that. What is your secret to profiting in life, Michelle? Relationships, of course. It's network, not for need or for now, but build a relationship that you want to, that you get to, that will sustain you all the way through. And where can our listeners learn more about you and everything you do? I love hearing from listeners and tell me that you heard me on this podcast. and best place to start is my website, which is Michelle with two L's, Tillis, T-I-L-L-I-S, Letterman, L-E-D-E-R-M-A-N.com.

55:57From there, you're going to find my blog, my YouTube channel, my LinkedIn newsletter. LinkedIn is my favorite place to be. So connect me there. I'm also on Insta. You'll find all the places from there. Perfect. And we'll stick all those links in the show notes to make it super easy. Michelle, thank you. It's always a pleasure. Likewise.

56:20Thank you.