Reid Hoffman: Superagency, How AI Will Help Humans Dominate the Future | Artificial Intelligence | AI Vault

24:45AI is going to destroy all jobs. And you're like, okay, part of that's like right now, you're like, look, there's a very long way away from all this implication that everyone's talking about. I mean, there's some that's right here right now that's really spectacular. But there's a long journey, a long path, a long role for human beings to be participating in various ways and to be evolving and changing. And, you know, I, for one, look forward to that path. Yeah. I mean, I have to say, thinking about agents is so mind-blowing. And when I think about AI and all the talks that I've had, a lot of people talk about it as being like a great equalizer.

25:25and we were just talking about how humans are not going to work and everything like that. But I'm competitive, right? So like, as I've been going through these conversations, I've been thinking about like, well, how am I going to be like the best version of me? How am I going to be like a better entrepreneur and compete? But now as I've thought about it more, I realized that it's like, you have to be the best trainer of the AI. Like I kind of imagine everybody being an entrepreneur, having agents that work at their personal company, basically. and you basically have to be the best at coordinating your agents and figuring out how to like mobilize all that AI and all your AI support.

26:02And so smart people are gonna be smarter at that, right? And creative and innovative people are gonna be more creative and innovative when it comes to their own agents. And so I just feel like a lot of people are probably worried that like, you know, there's not gonna be any room for them to your point as humans, but I really think it's gonna be how you manage your AI. Yep. So I think exactly as you say, in addition to training, it's also deploying, organizing, executing, strategizing, all of the above. And that's part of the reason why, you know, kind of with super agency and the other kind of content that I've been trying to get out there in people's hands, like, start playing with it, start exploring, because you want to start building the muscles.

26:44It's kind of like, hey, what's the way, you know, what is locomotion going to look like now? We've just invented, we've moved from the computers being the bicycle of the mind to AI being the automobiles of the mind. All right, let's all go learn how to drive. life, right? Let's figure out how these things work, how we want the technology to evolve, how we're going to use it, how we use it together, how we use it individually. And getting engaged with it is really important. And that's the most central thing. And again, part of the reason I called it agency, because it's like, you know, own your agency and go do it.

27:17And part of the super agency is when millions of us all start doing that, it benefits all of us much more than just even the technology benefits each of us individually by ourselves. Mm. So I know that you co-founded Inflection AI with Mustafa Salimhan. And one of your big missions there is to create companions that have high emotional intelligence for humans. It's not a workplace tool. You're really creating companions for people. Why do you think that's important? And what gap did you see in the AI world? Why did you get on board with that? So that's how we started with Inflection. And part of that was because we said, well, well, what's the world that we see that necessarily people don't see that could be a very good product to create?

27:59Entrepreneur one, right? And we said, look, this agent, eugenic world coming, everyone, there's going to be more agents than people. Everyone's going to have an agent that's their own personal agent that they have trust with and is on their side. And what are the key attributes of that? Because if you look at kind of even the very earliest of how other people were thinking about agents, they were thinking about as information processing and work. And we were thinking about this as kind of a trusted, you know, kind of companion for how you'd operate. And so EQ was as important as IQ. So we trained the inflection model pie, personal intelligence on this.

28:38Now, we've since then, you know, we spoke about pivots earlier. We've pivoted the business. The consumer application of that is now, you know, kind of being run, you know, kind of as part of things that Microsoft's doing. and what Inflection, the company is doing now, is providing that same kind of great, best-in-class IQ, but also best-in-class EQ to businesses that want to deploy this within their ecosystem, to their customers, to their products and services. So we shifted to kind of more of a B2B model where the pie agent is more the kind of exemplar of one of the unique models that Inflection has that it can deploy for your particular business challenges.

29:20So, you know, it's a classic startup journey in addition to being an interesting evolution of the AI things. And when it comes to having good EQ, I know obviously AI is not conscious, right? So how do you actually train it to have empathy and things like that? Well, so part of what you're doing when you're doing the kind of training of an AI is you're training it to say, you know, it's this prompt completion. Like, what do you say after this is said? And part of what you're doing, both in data and in post-training, is you're saying, okay, here's the kinds of things that count as good sayings. So you have a whole bunch of humans who are, you know, running the system through and saying, okay, you know, to prompt one, like you say, you know, like the person says, how was your day?

30:08And says, well, my pet died today. And it's like, well, I respond A or respond B. Which one's a better response? And then human beings respond to that. That's part of how it gets aligned with our beings. is part of how he gets to kind of an EQ. And you're partially telling your human beings who are training this where you want to nudge and prompt the responses to so that they're essentially doing the training for this. And so, you know, if it said, like, for example, option anyway, oh, that's too bad. You should really look up a grief counselor. Okay. You know, and option two was, oh, that must be really hard.

30:46Oh my gosh. You know, like, is there anything I can do to help? Is there, you know, like, you know, like, you know, I feel for you. Or, you know, probably wouldn't say that just because it's an AI, but it's like something else because you don't want to make false anthropomorphism. But say, look, I'm certain that connecting with friends or other kinds of things, you know, how can I be of most help? And, you know, shouldn't you want to have a conversation about it? That would be the kind of thing is, oh, B is better than A. Right. And so then by that, it kind of learns how to have empathetic, kind, compassionate conversations.

31:19Because you can do that even without, you know, necessarily being compassionate or empathetic yourself. Because as you noted, it's not conscious. And by the way, there's a bunch of human beings who are also not there empathetic who learn to be more empathetic just by, you know, kind of, okay, this is the way you do this. Yeah. Makes total sense. It's really cool what you guys are doing at Inflection AI. So one of the things that I wanted to talk to you about was trust when it comes to AI, because I feel like a lot of people are worried about misinformation. There's so many deep fakes out there.

31:51And people are just worried about trust when it comes to AI. So what are your thoughts around that? So, look, trust is in, unfortunately, short supply these days, generally, not just with AI. trust in institutions, trust in, you know, democracies, voting systems, other people's intent, you know, other kinds of things. So trust is challenging. Now, the way that you, that I think is going to be very important to build and maintain trust in the AI is for the people who are building it to be very clear about, like, what their goals are, what they're doing, what they're doing to try to build and maintain trust.

32:37You know, part of the reason why, of course, you know, my encouragement with super agency is for people to go try it, because as they begin to try it and learn what kinds of good things they can do, what kinds of things can be empowered, that will be the kind of thing that builds the kind of positive trust in these kinds of circumstances. And, you know, my advice to individuals, you know, encountering these things, like, you know, a classic suspicion is say, well, big tech companies who are trying to make a lot lot of money or building these things and they're trying to make money from you. And I was like, well, by the way, I'm trying to make money from you is usually offering you a product and service you really like that really is something that you come back for that you keep using.

33:13That's good for you. That's the goodness of modern business. So you go, okay, so which things should I trust these AIs on and which things should I not? And the answer is, well, if you generally shouldn't, you should understand that company is trying to have you as a lifelong loyal customer. That generally speaking, most of them are smart about doing that. So they're going to try to make it good. If it's something that's particularly important to you, cross-checking it's important. Like, you know, when I go to GBD-4 and get a prompt and I go, you know, huh, that doesn't really make full sense to me.

33:50I'm going to go look at this a little bit more, you know, because it's like, okay, you know, if it said something about like, yeah, your lab, you know, your black lab can eat that mushroom. It's like, no, I really want to know. Yeah, I'm going to double check that. You know, so and so, you know, that kind of thing. And by the way, over time, these will get better and better for, you know, kind of how it operates. And so I think that's that's the kind of thing. But I think that's the only by engaging and using having dialogue, having that dialogue match our experience over time. time, you know, being accountable as creators and companies for, you know, here are the things that we want in the use and here are the things that are still under development and being clear about that so that people have a sense of, okay, I understand it's not perfect, but it could be really good for me.

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38:55Terms apply. Money movement services are provided by Intuit Payments Incorporated, licensed as a money transmitter by the New York State Department of Financial Services. So I feel like we're in this like transition period where humans that have a specialized expertise, right now are at such an advantage. So for example, I have a podcast network and I'm probably like one of the most knowledgeable people about monetizing podcasts. And I write a newsletter that I write personally with like all my industry knowledge. And sometimes I'll just be like, well, what would chat GVT say? And then it's all wrong.

39:30And it's just like, kind of just so basic, right? It's so basic. It's kind of wrong. And then I just love it because I'm like, okay, like people are getting my newsletter, which is like this like human experience that they can't get anymore. And it's making me feel like I actually am more valuable. I think it will transition where that might not be the case in like two years, but I feel like we're in this transition where specialized knowledge from humans is actually like really desirable? Broadly, yes. And part of it's obviously kind of like that specialized knowledge being evolved with like how you're figuring out how to use, like you made this comment earlier, how you use these new tools really effectively.

40:18And so like part of, you know, even with the depth of experience, the early involvement with open AI and all that, Like, I constantly am trying, like, asking questions and trying to use, you know, a number of these tools myself for real things. Not just, like, create a sonnet for my cousin's birthday or, you know, any of this kind of stuff. But it's also things that, you know, like investment analysis or kind of market trends or other kinds of things. And, you know, frequently, just as you said, you know, like, ah, that's not very good. Okay, fine. And sometimes I go, I iterate on it. And sometimes I go, oh, no, no, I think that's just not very good right now.

41:01I'll use it for other things. But using it constantly. So I have, you know, I've enabled the voice agents on my phones so that, you know, I can point my camera at things and talk to, you know, chat GBT about the thing I'm looking at. you know, say mushrooms, right? And so, and, and, you know, that kind of thing as a, as a, as a way of, of kind of understanding it. And I do think that human specialized knowledge, creativity will, will, will, will, will even grow at a premium, but it will grow at a premium in the use of the tools too. Like you can't just buy it. Like I am genius. I don't need AI.

41:40It's like, no, no, I am genius because of the way that I use AI to be an extra special genius. Mm-hmm, totally. So you created, we were talking about deep fakes before, and I came across this interview of you interviewing your own AI on your YouTube. You call it Read AI, and it's an AI video avatar of you. Talk to us about how you felt in that interview. Did you learn anything from it? Did it help you realize anything about AI in the future? Well, so it came about primarily because I was like, look, here's a technology. that everyone's so skeptical about, our name for it is deep fakes. It's kind of like, if your name was disaster, okay.

42:27So it's like, okay, but can I imagine that there would possibly be good things that could work with this? And I was like, well, let's explore because we should and let's share the exploration. So we'll have this kind of interview and kind of conversation. And as I said at the end of the interview, I thought I was going to hate this because I'm not one of those people who talks to myself in a mirror. I was like, am I going to feel schizophrenic? Am I going to feel self-aggrandizing? Am I going to feel like, ugh, I can see all these different ways that I could possibly hate this thing. And actually it was more interesting as kind of a palette and exploration.

43:06Like if you said, well, would I only want to talk to read AI? Absolutely not. But would I want to talk to read AI sometimes in doing these things and have that as a way of kind of having a dialogue with myself and also showing kind of what's good at it. Because once I did that, one of the things I realized is I was, after I made that, I was off to go give a speech at the University of Perugia in kind of defensive and honorary doctorate. And I sort of wrote out the speech. And then I went, you know, I could actually have AI, read AI, give this speech. I'm only really fluent in English in all of these other languages, You know, ranging from Hindi to Chinese to Arabic to all these things.

43:46And to give the speech in those languages where people are much like, it was bizarre listening to me, my voice, speaking Hindi or Chinese fluently. It's like, what would I sound like if I were speaking Chinese? Now, one of the things that my French friends told me is my French sounded like Canadian French. and you know i don't know what what the story of that is whether you know how it is these are more data audio samples of canadian french or somehow it goes well you're north american so we're gonna make you from quebec rather than paris uh but you know who knows anyway so um but it was like it was humanizing um was with the thing as i thought i would i thought i would really dislike it uh and it was humanizing and it started making me realize just like any just just as i say to other people hey, you should use the technology to get a sense of it and control and to kind of, you know, give you to reinforce your own agency with the technology.

44:46It was like that was me doing that with that. And, you know, we continue to do new things with Read.ai. Probably one of the funniest ones was the number of different press outlets that asked, we'd like to do an interview with Read.ai. Oh, my gosh. It was like, oh, that's interesting. Cool. Yeah, it's so cool. I feel like in terms of content creation, I've got a lot of creator entrepreneurs that listen to the show. I feel like AI is totally going to change the game. Like even with me, I have my AI voice if I'm sick or if I miss a commercial, we can use my AI voice as like an intermediate step. Like I'll always rerecord it usually, make sure that it's me.

45:27But it's really close to my voice. Like people really can't tell. And we're working on my AI video. And to your point, like people probably think I'm crazy creating my own deep fake, but I want to be able to scale myself and this is the future. And you just gave me such a great idea in terms of the translations. You know, people love to watch content all over the world and not everybody speaks English. Not only do I speak English, but also people most emotionally resonate with content that's in languages that they are native to. And so most people are native one language. Sometimes they're native a couple, but it's within the languages they're native to, which roughly means languages they learned complete fluency before they were 12 for the vast majority of people.

46:09It's a human connection. If the person says, oh, I'm hearing this in Chinese, it's warmer, it's smarter, it's more engaging, etc., if Chinese is my native language. Yeah. I do feel like people who have a lot of content out there have a very unique advantage going into the future because we can actually create these advertisers of ourselves because we have all this content. Yep, absolutely. So one last question for you on the future of AI. So you're obviously at the forefront of this. You've thought a lot about it. You've written books on AI. So I just want you, and you can take your time with us because I think it's very interesting.

46:46How do you imagine our world to be 5, 10, 20 years in the future with AI? What do you imagine the world to be like? Well, one of the things that's a great way to look foolish in the future is to make overly specific predictions. Partially because, you know, the usual principle I used to say in this is the future is sooner and stranger than you think. And so, you know, people thought in the 80s we're going to get AI, but we didn't get AI. We got the Internet. We got mobile phone. Well, maybe now we're going to get AI. I mean, you know, we're going to get what shape of AI is the interesting question.

47:20And so if you said, you know, what I think is kind of the minimum guarantee is there's going to be like, as opposed to like computer interfaces or phone interfaces or else, we're going to have agents. And agents are going to be the primary mode of kind of navigation. What we describe in superagency is an informational GPS. So in this entire informational digital world, we'll do that. And there will be more agents than there are people, especially when you consider the, even though there might be just one agent, Pi, that's kind of then instantiated with what it remembers out of its conversations and interactions with Hala, what it understands or remembers in its conversations and interactions with Reed, et cetera, et cetera.

48:10There's kind of this flow of agents. Now, one of the things that I think people haven't really fully tracked yet, but I think will be very interesting, is how agents end up talking to each other. Because when we have that many agents, you know, part of how you and I are going to coordinate, like we say, hey, what should we talk about in the podcast? Well, one of our preps will be your agent will talk to my agent. Oh, my gosh. And they'll kind of go, well, you know, these topics will be really good. And, you know, hey, when you ask a question this way, it'll be great. And when you answer it this way, it'll be great.

48:40You know, and da-da-da-da. And, you know, that kind of thing. Or this could be a really new, interesting thing to try. And that will be part of the world that we will be in. And I think that, you know, part of that will then make, you know, like the premium on thinking creatively, thinking differently, you know, as you mentioned, will be much higher. the notion that, you know, what we, you know, kind of like my guess is like, for example, if you go back 30 years and you told someone there would be these jobs called web designer, data scientist, other things, they go, what are you talking about?

49:24You know, crazy person from the future. And I think that's another thing that we're going to see even more of, which is like, oh, didn't realize that was going to be the job. Huh. And that's cool. And so I think that's the, you know, those are some of the things, but, you know, I try not to make overly specific predictions because usually they're, maybe I'll put it this way. William Gibson, science fiction author, has a really good quote, which is, the future is already here. It's unevenly distributed. And, you know, he's been a great neuromancer with the internet, everything else. Now he was being asked in an interview, like, how did you see the future?

50:05And it's like, look, thank you for the compliment. But by the way, if you read Neuromancer, sure, I got AI right. I got the internet right. I missed the mobile phone. And so that's the kind of thing that, you know, we're always looking for is that surprise and delight moment. And who knows with AI, to your point, like we have no idea what we're going to see. I'm excited to see it unfold. Okay, so I end my show with two questions. I ask all of my guests. The first, and you can just answer however you'd like. Doesn't have to be about anything we talked about today. What is one actionable thing our young and profiters can do today to become more profitable tomorrow?

50:53So to become more profitable tomorrow, well, presumably, I guess I won't say literally tomorrow, like since one day, 24 hour. I would say the important thing, you know, and this is kind of part of how I think about the world. The important thing is to be thinking about, like, what do you think your business, what do you think the environment your business is going to be in in one, three, and five years? And what do you think that environment is going to be changing based on patterns of technology? What do you think that's going to be changing on patterns of competition? What do you think that's going to be changing in patterns of how you deliver your business, supply chain, et cetera?

51:33And so by looking at that kind of like probable guess, how do you run the experiment today that informs you about which big choices you need to make in that one, three, and five-year timeframe? The experiment won't necessarily make you profitable, but the experiment may give you the thing that either gets you to more profit or also helps you navigate the changes, which things are the new living creatures and which things are the dinosaurs in the future markets. Great advice. And what is your secret to profiting in life? And this can go beyond financial profiting in all aspects of life. So fundamentally, part of why in the Startup UU I said life is a team sport, because the Startup UU is actually advice I give to entrepreneurs refactored to individuals being the entrepreneur of their own life.

52:24So it actually applies to founders, applies to CEOs, applies to executives, applies to, you know, people working. But it's this question about life being a team sport. It's, you know, you are amplified by your team. It's more fun. you learn more. And they help you in both upside and navigating downside. So the most fundamental thing, life is a team sport. And now we're going to have agents with our team. Exactly. Amongst our team. Amongst our team. Yes. With our team, we'll also have agents. And everybody will have agents. Reid, this has been such an awesome conversation. I really appreciate all your time, all your wisdom.

53:10Where can everybody learn more about you and everything that you do? Well, LinkedIn, you know, I post just about everything there. I also have reedhoffman.org and, you know, this year, publishing Super Agency. Amazing. I highly recommend everybody go get Super Agency. Also get Blitzscaling. I love that book as well. Reed, thank you so much for your time today. Thank you for joining us on Young and Profiting Podcast. A great pleasure. I look forward to our next conversation. Yeah, fam, this conversation with Reed Hoffman could not have come at a more pivotal moment. We're stepping into a world where intelligence is no longer limited to the human mind, and Reed's vision gives us a roadmap for how to navigate it with confidence instead of fear.

53:50His core belief is simple yet powerful. AI is here to expand what we're capable of, not shrink it. And when we understand that, everything about the future looks different. One of the standout ideas Reed shared today is a shift from artificial intelligence to amplification intelligence. He really wants us to see AI as a multiplier for our creativity, our decision-making, and our impact. For entrepreneurs, this mindset shift is everything. When you stop worrying about being replaced and start thinking about how to be augmented, you open the door to entirely new opportunities. You can run experiments faster, communicate on a global scale, and build ideas fast that would have taken teams, money, and years in the past.

54:30And something that really caught my attention was his emphasis on the rise of AI agents. These won't be just random chatbots. They're going to be specialized collaborators who help you think, create, and operate at a higher level. Entrepreneurs will have teams of agents, one for content, one for research, one for strategy. Your job then becomes orchestrating these agents for clarity and intent. If you learn this skill early, you'll gain a massive advantage because the real competition will be between humans who know how to command intelligent tools and humans who don't. Another theme Reid drove home was the importance of optimism rooted in action.

55:07Every major shift in history, printing presses, cars, computers, came with panic and prediction of doom. But the people who leaned in, learned the tools, and experimented early are the ones who built empires. This moment is no different. Treat AI like a collaborator. Start small, test ideas, build momentum. Let your curiosity lead instead of your fear. Yeah, fam, thank you so much for tuning in to another episode of the AI Vault series. And I love bringing you these conversations with leaders who are shaping the new era of intelligence. And Reid Hoffman truly is one of those minds redefining what's possible.

55:41Take these insights from today and put at least one of them into play this week because knowledge means nothing without action. Yeah, bam. You can also watch the full video on Spotify Video and connect with me on Instagram at Yap with Hala or LinkedIn at Hala Taha. All right, gang, this is your host, Hala Taha, the podcast princess, signing off.