Aspire with Jay Shetty: How to Succeed in Business Without Losing Your Soul

22:50I never thought about it in the sense of connecting it to the gratitude practice. Absolutely. And it changes everything because you just said, and I'd say that to people, for the next seven days, do what Emma does. Send one person personally and one person professionally a text, an email, a voice message, a video message. It doesn't have to be long, 30 seconds. And share gratitude that's specific and personal. It will change your relationships. It will change how you feel. It will make you feel like you're connected to people. You're not lonely at the top. You actually have, you're paving the way for others to follow as well.

23:21There's so many benefits. So that has to be - I love that one. And you can do that in work too. Like, why wouldn't you do that with your colleague? Absolutely. Because we're in such a rush all the time and the winds happen and you could literally turn around and be like, you did this amazing job. I love the way you did X, da, da, da, da. It's like so simple. All right, what's the second habit? So the second habit is something I called insight. I think about humans really interestingly. if you're hungry, you go to your refrigerator or Uber Eats or whatever it is, and you find food. If you're out of milk, you buy milk.

23:50But when we're out of inspiration, we panic. If we're out of motivation, we panic. If we're out of energy, we panic. It's like, oh my God, there must be something wrong with me. There's something like that's not working for me. I think it's really important that we learn something every day. The problem is we stop studying the moment we leave school. And we need to learn one insight per day. It could be the tiniest thing someone says to you. It could be listening to your podcast right now and you'll take away one insight. It could be learning a new word. It could be anything. Just learning one tiny thing a day changes the brain.

24:22It makes you feel like you're moving. You don't feel stuck anymore because you have a new piece of insight. You have a new experience that you can share with someone else. And your podcast is going to do that for so many people. Honestly, I love, well, I love that you say that first of all, But this is one of my biggest single things. And, you know, I feel like I didn't take very much away from school at all. But there's this great quote that I love and I think about it every day is that the more you learn, the more you earn, which is a very Emma quote. It wasn't me. It was Warren Buffett. But it's one that, you know, I'm a lifelong learner and I have been like that since I was a kid.

24:52But I think I've connected it to this idea of like just growth, right? Personal growth in my life. If I can learn something every day, learn something about someone, that is me expanding my horizons, expanding what I know. I love the way you contextualize it. It's like insights, right? And that is so important for people. Like if you can make that a habit every single day, I'm just going to learn the smallest little thing. How do you practice that? Like, what do you do? What do you learn? I think you can literally go, okay, I'm going to learn a new word every day. I'm just going to get chat GPD, give me a new word every day.

25:23Like something unique, something I've never heard before, a word in another language. It can be that simple. For me, I like to just, I mean, I'm lucky. I get to sit down and interview people. So I'm learning stuff all the time. And I think anyone who's listening is learning all the time. But it's like, at one point in my life, I listened to Steve Jobs' Stanford commencement speech every day for nine months. And not only did... What a speech. What a speech. One of the best speeches of all time. What a speech. The one where he talks about dogma. Yeah. Oh my God. It's so insane. First of all, I've taken so many parts of that speech.

25:57I keep like post-its on the inside of my bathroom mirror. So many parts of that. I've posted that speech in parts in so many ways. It really is. Because what does he say? There's a part in there where he talks about - Don't be trapped by dogma of other people's thinking. Yes. And the best invention of life is death. That it's finite. And I'm like, it's so crazy, that speech. It's so good. So you listen to that every day as a way of learning, like feeding yourself. At one point in my life, I listened to it every day for nine months. And I promise you, not only did I know the words off by heart, the words started to change my heart and my life because you start to live them.

26:32Repetition. We also living at a time where we always want new and fresh. I think there's a power in repetitive insights. Sometimes learning the same thing again and again every day lets it drop into your consciousness and all of a sudden you're acting differently. Yeah. It changes you. It changes you. Oh my goodness. These habits are changing me. All right. Number three. I'm feeling good. We talked about number three, so I won't talk about it too much, but mindfulness or meditation. Yes. Having a check-in with yourself. I always say to people, you schedule meetings with your family, your friends.

27:02You never cancel things for your kids. You never ever cancel a meeting with someone else, but you'll never schedule one with yourself. You just don't do it. It's not there. And so what I say to people is just at the beginning, at the end of your day, have a meeting with yourself. It could be three minutes, put it in the calendar, three minutes at the start of the day, three minutes at the end, and just check in with yourself at the start and say, what do I need today to make it a great day? Is it a cup of coffee? Is it a great meeting? Is it me making sure that I'm prepared for Emma's podcast?

27:31Like what's the thing that's going to make today great? And at the end of the day, let me just reflect on how my day was and how did it go for me? That's the beginning of meditation. Why is it so difficult for women, for example, to actually create that space and time? Because like I said to you, my husband will have no problem meditating and finding the time to meditate 40 minutes a day. This is a very busy businessman. He also has four kids and a lot going on. Why would so many women find it hard to make that appointment with themselves and to make the time and the space? If I'm honest, I mean, women are more caring and more nurturing.

28:05But just not about themselves. They've been programmed to believe that they should be taking care of everyone else. They have the capacity to, so that's their role in society. I think women have been programmed to believe that their worth comes from helping everyone else and not themselves. Their value comes from being there for the village and not themselves. And so a lot of it's programming conditioning for decades where women have had to put themselves - Centuries. Centuries. Sorry, centuries. No, but absolutely true. Where women have had to put themselves second, third, tenth, even if they're on the list at all.

28:38And it's really sad because if you think about it, women have the greatest impact on society I mean, when I think about my mom, my mom made me and my sister breakfast, lunch, and dinner fresh every day. She dropped me and her to school until I was old enough to take the bus myself. She picked us up from school. When we got home, she did our homework with us. She went out to work in the evenings and then came back. My mom has had more impact on me than any other human on planet earth. Without a doubt. And because of her sacrifice for me, I feel so in love. but the only thing I would have wanted as a child is for her to do something for her.

29:15Now, when I think about it, and even at this age, like if I told my mom, mom, fly to LA, I miss you. She'd jump on a plane. 1000 % as any mom would. But that's why I always talk about this idea and I've mentioned it on your podcast of putting yourself first. And I do think that at the end of the day, we've just got to get comfortable with putting ourselves first. And if you can think about meditation in that sense, that actually you're doing something for the good of everyone around you because it betters you, it adds to you, it feeds you. It just is that, again, that reframing of how we think about something as being, is this taking away from everyone around me or is this giving to everyone around me?

29:52And I find the meditation piece, this is giving. You hit the nail on the head. It's all about the reframe. It's all about the reframe of, am I giving people the best of me or giving them my leftovers? And most of us are just giving our leftovers. And by the way, that's not your fault. It's how things have been structured, how society has been conditioned. but if you start investing in yourself, your parents get a better version of you, your partner gets a better version of you, your kids get a better version of you, your colleagues get a better version of you. You will give the best version of yourself to everyone if you've done the one thing in your day for three minutes for yourself, whether that's a coffee, watching a video, whatever it be for you.

30:29Oh, I'm just glad we're down to three minutes and not 90. This I can cope with. All right, number four. Number four is the one we all know, which we've heard a million times, but we don't do it, is exercise. And I know you say that, like you've heard all of these things a million times, but it is the most obvious things that have the biggest impact, right? 100%. So when you talk about these habits, because they feel simple, making it a habit, like how do you make your exercise a habit? There's two things about human psychology that make exercise easier. One is it has to be collaborative and two, it has to be competitive.

31:04Collaborative? I work out at 5.30 in the morning. Like who am I doing that with? So you don't need a real person there. Even if it's an accountability partner, if there's someone else who's waking up in another environment, it could be someone online. Like whenever you're, even if you're posting your scores with your friends and you might not be working out at the same time, but it's collaborating and knowing that other people you love and trust are working out as well. It's having that community around you. I don't like this one. Am I not allowed to like some of the... Of course you are. It's like 5.30 a.m.

31:31I look like shit. I don't want to talk to anyone. That's my quiet time in the day. Like the collaboration. Could I like text someone? Yeah, it's a different definition. When I say collaborative, I don't mean it has to be with someone because that's not possible for a lot of people. When I say collaborative, it means you know other people who have the same goals. You're talking about it. You're texting about it. You're messaging about it. You're connecting about it. And that's important for what reason? Well, because you feel like, well, we're both on this journey together. We've both got that goal together.

31:58It's the community. We all work better when we feel accountable, even if it's to a friend. That doesn't mean that they're there in the room. It doesn't mean that you've got to be dressed up for your workout at 5.30. What it means is me and my friends set a goal and there's a community of us and we're all inspiring each other. Humans work better that way. The second is make it competitive. Humans love winning. Now there's one I can get with. Humans love winning. You do the 10 ,000 step contest in your family. Everyone's going to be walking at 9 p.m. trying to get to 10 ,000 and two. It's so true.

32:28So make it competitive. That's what we've not done with exercise. We've tried to make it routine. Yeah. We've tried to make it a habit. this stuff gets boring. Competition doesn't get boring. We all loved it when we were kids and you had to go and beat the other school. Now it's like, what are we doing? Exactly. So that's how you make it more interesting. I can get with that one. And then the final one is sleep. And this one is the underestimated one because people just don't realize how much sleep is boosting their life. So those five habits go thankfulness, insight, meditation, exercise, sleep.

33:00It spells times T-I-M-E-S. So you can remember that as always being the five non-negotiables. That's a really good five non-negotiables. And when we talk about purpose, because I feel like this is such a signature for you in every single thing that you do, when you write a bestselling book and when you do this podcast and when you go out on tour and when you're doing your coaching, every single thing that you do is fully on purpose, right? There feels like there's no accidents. It feels like everything that you do is for the greater good. Have you been able, like, did you really understand that that was a winning formula or was it something that you just were like, this is just who I am?

33:46And how do you think about broadening your business empire and still keeping purpose at the heart of it? Like, I wonder sometimes, does it stop you from doing things? Do you get offers and be like, yeah, I wish I could do that. If it had more, if it had what purpose to it? I would take that check. Like, but does that happen? Yeah. I've left far more, far much more money on the table than for sure. But I don't feel bad about it. And I don't feel like I missed out because the purpose is what makes it meaningful. And actually I would argue that nothing can sustain without purpose. Everything that has lasted in the world has had purpose behind it.

34:21It's one of the reasons why the world religions have lasted for so long. It's why stoicism has been 2000 years old. It's why the Vedas are 5000 years old. Like what else in the world has lasted 1000, 2000, 3000 years? It's only things with really deep purpose. So to me, purpose actually is what clarifies your brand. It's what creates who you are and why you're different. If you didn't have a purpose and you did just take every deal that came your way and said yes to everything, you actually wouldn't be a well-known brand or entity because then you just be what everyone else is. Totally. There's a thing that defines you as being different.

34:57That is your purpose. It's your reason for being. So I actually think purpose strengthens business and brand versus weakens it because otherwise you're just some homogenous product that could be anything. But you must work with a lot of people that come to you and say, I don't know what my purpose is. A hundred percent. Yeah. That's the biggest question. And I think the problem with that question is, is we think purpose is this one thing that solves everything for us and figures it all out. And to me, purpose is a lot simpler. It's finding what you're passionate about and using what you're passionate about in the service of others to improve other people's lives.

35:33And does it always have to be in the service of others? Do you believe that? Like you wouldn't do a business, for example, if it's not helping someone, if it's not helping - I don't think it would work. I think that is the core value of business. I can't think of a business that exists successfully that hasn't helped people in some way. Whether you like the way it helps people or not is subjective. You could argue and say, well, this business shouldn't exist, but there are people that buy that product, which means it is useful for those people, whether you think it's useful or not. Like this microphone, whoever invented it, it's like to us, it's really important as podcasters.

36:07To the average person, they don't need a microphone in their life. So this product has a use. And so I think every business that exists must have and does have a purpose because that is what makes it relevant, accessible, and practical for people to use.

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39:22What happens if your purpose is not linked with your profession? Because I think for so many people, if you work like just some regular job that doesn't, you know, you don't find particularly inspiring. What, like, you know, can your purpose be something that is just totally unrelated to your profession? Yes. And this is one of the biggest mistakes we've made in the world of personal growth is we put pressure on people to say, your job should satisfy every part of you. It should make you happy. You should love it. It should be meaningful. Now that's well-intentioned because you spend like nine hours a day at work.

39:56You're going to spend a third of your lifetime at work. So the truth is you should make it as good as it can be because otherwise you're basically saying I'm okay for a third of my life to not be great. That's a lot of time. So I would encourage people to do this. There's a beautiful study that Amy Wrasniewski and her team at Yale did. And in 2019, they went out to find what they believed was the most difficult job in the world. And mainly in America. So they went out and they were like, what's the most difficult job? So it wasn't what you do. It's not what I do. Funny that. And the most difficult job in the world was to be a hospital cleaner because these people have to clean routine.

40:34By the way, you just cleaned up and now the toilet's a mess again. Yeah. You just cleaned up and someone's bed's changed again. You clean bed sheets, toilets, plates, et cetera, et cetera. And you have to even clean up after people pass away. So it's a really heavy job too. It's a heavy job. So they went and interviewed these hospital cleaners and they asked them, what do you do? Half the hospital cleaners said, we're low skilled labor. We clean plates, toilets, et cetera. in their own words. Then they went and interviewed some other ones and they didn't call themselves cleaners. They called themselves healers and carers and servers.

41:06These cleaners or healers worked the exact same hours. They worked the same job. They worked the same shift. They worked in the same hospitals with the same people at the same pay, but they were happier and more purposeful. They asked them why they call themselves healers. They said, we believe that a clean hospital is integral to the healing journey of the patient. If the hospital is clean, people feel a sense of dignity when they use the toilet. If the hospital is clean, people's family spends more time with them by their bedside when they need it. If the hospital is clean, it's just a nicer atmosphere for someone to be sick in.

41:43And I was thinking, wow, like it blows my mind when I share it. It literally gives me goosebumps. Because it's the hardest job in the world, but you've made it make sense for you. And so what I realized through that is it's not what we do for work. It's how we feel about it. Yes. And that's what Amy Rosniewski and her team, they came up with this term called job crafting. It's not what you do. It's how you feel about the work you do. So what I'd encourage people to do, if you hate what you do, you don't like it. By the way, I've been there. You've been there. We've all been there. The best thing to do is ask yourself, what am I going to learn from my next job?

42:13Yes. What can I get passionate and excited about? What passion? Before I was doing this, I was teaching meditation on top of my day job at Accenture. I was in a big corporate company. and I was teaching meditation in my evenings, lunchtimes, whatever breaks I had. I didn't get paid for it. It wasn't my job, but I loved it. Bring your passion to work. And do you know what that does? It gives you the confidence to build a side hustle. It gives you the confidence to make it your main hustle. It gives you the confidence to go and do it. All of the things. All of the things. So yes, your purpose doesn't have to be your job, but if you can make your job more meaningful, you'll have a better life.

42:48Yeah, I believe that a thousand percent. And I also think there are people that will just find purpose outside of work entirely. Absolutely. There has to be that part. And I think that right now we're so obsessed with, you know, success and we're so obsessed with, you know, what that means professionally. But I think there are a lot of places in my life where I take a lot of pride. And, you know, it's like, I love cooking and I aspire to be a better chef every single day. But it's something that I practice at, right? It's like, I take a lot of pride. I'm going to try like a really complicated recipe over the weekend.

43:20Like, it's a challenge to me, but it's something that to me, outside of what I do here every day in this building, it feels like I am learning and I'm growing and I'm leaning into like a different part of me. And I'm not saying that that is necessarily something I can get really ambitious about, but for me, it gives me purpose. And you know, it's like now it feels like we've kind of lost this idea of hobbies. And I feel like hobbies can be so purposeful. You can have this other side of you that gets nurtured. And I don't know, I just like enjoy the idea of like having different parts of me and that can sometimes feel very lost.

43:53Do you have another side of you, like a thing that you do that has nothing to do with like the J that we know? Yeah. And I, and I love what you're saying because your purpose doesn't have to be big. No. Your purpose doesn't have to get you followers. Your purpose doesn't have to make you money. Your purpose can be something that you love doing and you do it and share it with the people you love. For me, it's, so I love football. I'm a huge Manchester United fan. Manchester United. Yeah, it's not a good time. I'm an Arsenal girl. Oh, you're in Arsenal? Yeah, sorry. Yeah, I grew up right in between Arsenal and Tottenham, but my dad, as every immigrant Indian who moved to England in the 80s, he either supported United or Liverpool.

44:29So my dad supported United. So you've got to go with your dad. Yes, I had to go with my dad. See, I'm that much of a rebel. This says a lot about us. I went against my family, who are all West Ham supporters, and I went to Arsenal. Good choice. Yeah, it was just, it was a good choice, wasn't it? A glory hunter, they call me in England, I think. It was a bad choice. I love football. I love playing football. I love talking about football. I can get so into it. for me it's pickleball is my challenge right now like I love pickleball I'm playing this weekend I get hyped about it can analyze it all day my whole TikTok feed is just pickleball clips and it's something to get excited about that is so disconnected and me and my friends talk about it all the time you're not on your phone when you're doing these things you're not watching something else you're not distracted you can only do that thing when I'm playing pickleball there's nothing else on my mind and it's a beautiful thing to get lost in as well no it's amazing I think it's really important to have these things I want to get back because you spoke to us so beautifully about these habits for wellness, for your own kind of, you know, idea of personal growth.

45:23One of the things I think about so much is actually this idea of like constantly getting better at what I do. And you're a coach, you're a coach for, I think a lot of really fabulous people, people that are very, very incredible at what they do and very accomplished at what they do. But do you have a coach? Yes. You do? Yeah, you have to. Do you? You have to. I mean, my coaches out of it. My coaches are definitely my monk teachers. Okay. Like who I still see. So every January I'll go back to the monastery that I used to live at in India. No way. You do that every January. Yeah. And Ravi comes with me too.

45:53No. The time has definitely got less. When I first left, it used to be like a month every January, three weeks. Now it's like 10 days. Yeah. But for 10 days I go back into monk mode and I lock in and I'm just learning from my teachers. I see them as coaches and they're guiding me to deepen my spiritual practice and my meditation. And I find that I make so much progress because of that. Because if you have a coach who doesn't have a coach, then they're not growing either. And that's just the reality of it. It's like, you want to have a teacher who has a teacher. You want to have an entrepreneur mentor who has an entrepreneur mentor and that's how it gets passed out.

46:24Yeah, I'm sensing a theme here, Jay. This is really like something that you believe in. But this constant learning, this constant growing, does that get exhausting? Do you get to the point? I just wonder, does Jay Shetty ever get to the point where you're like, I'm so annoyed and angry? Do you ever just lose it? Like, do you ever just like go nuts and not be like centered and meditative about it? And do you know what? Like, please, please. I'm going to give you the honest answer. I grew up in a house that was very angry and very like chaotic. And so I promised myself I would never feel that. And I don't.

47:03Anger is not an emotion that I struggle or experience. Do I get frustrated? Do I get annoyed? Do I get struck? Of course I do. I'm human. Like, of course I do. The anger thing is just a very separate, you know, a very separate thing. But of course I get annoyed. Do I snap at my wife who I adore? Yes, of course I do. Is she really forgiving and tolerant? Yes, she is. Like, you know, have I been in a mood and a strop and, you know, been irritable and agitated? Of course. Like, yes. But you don't lose your shit, Jay. I just, I grew up in a house where I saw that every day and it was just a promise I made to myself that I couldn't do it because I didn't see value in it.

47:39I just didn't see benefit in it. What I'm trying to say is there's a difference between aggression. Yes, of course. And frustration and stress. Yes. I feel lots of frustration and stress. I don't feel aggressive. And I know you say like, you don't lose it and you don't like get angry and have that feeling, but it's something that happens, right? And in business, when you're doing as many things as you do, not everything goes right. Not everything plays out the way that you want it to be. So how do you handle discourse and how would you like handle conflict or something just like not going your way?

48:11Something that is really like, do you know what? This thing happened and it was really unfair. I don't feel good about it. What are your tips for that? And by the way, of course, and I don't want to, I don't want to de, like, I don't want to make it out like I don't get upset. That's not the point. It was the aggression. It's the aggression part. Yeah. For me, I need, if I'm going through something that feels unfair, if I'm going through something that I don't understand, if I'm going through something tough, I need to switch off all outside noise and be alone. Because my take is if I can't figure out how I feel about it, hearing everyone else's opinions is not going to make me feel better.

48:45So even if my friend goes, oh, but you're fine, like you're doing great, not going to make me feel better. If my mom says to me, remember how strong you are, not going to make me feel better. I need to go into complete silence, complete isolation, and complete seclusion and figure out how I feel about it. That means going to the darkest place in my mind and heart. It means feeling the anger and the stress and the pain and the frustration and everything else it is, and then figuring out what I'm going to do about it. And it all has to be on me because that's how I know how to move through tough moments.

49:15Then I can go out and say, all right, let's check in with this person, figure it out. But I need that complete seclusion of step one. Because I think so often we're angry and we talk to someone and you kind of use that as a crutch to get over it, but you haven't processed it. And for me, processing my emotions and my feelings is my number one priority. Does that give you clarity? If you go into that place, that very dark place, you come out and you have absolutely clarity and you know what you need to do next. Well, step one is I just feel the pain. I allow myself to feel sad. I allow myself to feel upset.

49:47I allow myself to feel stress. I then ask myself the question, is what I'm feeling a fact or a feeling? What is the fact and what's the feeling? I have to get to that point. So after feeling the pain, is it fact or is it feeling? Then I realize if I actually focus on the facts, it's probably not as bad as I think it is. There's something to be able to, that I can solve here. If it's a feeling, okay, there's something, there's healing required. The second question I ask is, do I need an affirmation or is an action going to solve it? An affirmation could be just, I'm here for a reason. I belong here.

50:18I deserve to be here. I'm doing the right thing. Sometimes I need to repeat that thought. Sometimes I need to take an action to solve the problem. Or I need to go call that person. I need to go figure that thing out over there. So those two questions save me the stress after I let myself feel the pain. Is it fact or feeling? Let's deal with the facts. Let's not get carried away with the story. Let's not build a whole story here. Let's not build a narrative that didn't happen. That didn't happen in my head. And second of all, if it's a story, then I need an affirmation. I've got to keep changing the script in my head.

50:47I'm here for a reason. I belong here. I deserve this. This is the right thing for me. That's going to solve that. And if it's a fact, then only an action can solve a fact, right? You've got to go figure out what the fact is and solve it. And I think too many of us, we don't get into action because we don't focus on what I'm actually feeling. We don't get to the root of it. If you get to the root of it, you know what you need to do. Well, because people spin in conflict, right? What happens is you get the thing, the feeling that drives you crazy and you stay there and you ruminate on that feeling instead of processing, as you're saying, and then being able to move past something and figure out what the action is.

51:21that that takes a lot of, it's training. It's a muscle for you to be like, okay, I'm going to get past this and actually do what I need to do to move through it. And I actually think that that's a really useful tip in business because at the end of the day, we've got to move forward. You're trying to get to a place and you're ultimately trying to win. And if you stay in that place of conflict, of something like really getting to you, you don't ever get to the place where you move past it. Totally. And that's where you have to focus on facts because your feelings will always lie to you. Your feelings will make stuff up.

51:51Don't believe what your brain will tell you. Don't believe everything your mind thinks and don't sign up and think it's the truth. It's going to keep tricking you because your brain is wired to spot the negative and to spot the worst and to spot everything that's going to go that way. So yeah, it's a muscle that you have to train for sure. I just wonder, do you think that you can be really successful in business, really like an absolute animal and be at the top of your game and have the purpose element and the kind of gift that you've got of like everything coming together so beautifully. Do you think that those two things are simpatico or not really?

52:29I didn't used to believe it was, but now I believe it's necessary. I don't even know if it's possible, but it's needed. I want the most successful people in the world to be the most purposeful people in the world. That would build a better world because otherwise we're seeing unhealthy, unwell people be leaders of the world. And I don't want to live in that world. So I don't think it's a choice anymore. I think every one of us who has a purposeful bone in our body has to go and build something and make both work because that's what the world needs. The world needs organized people who are heart-centered.

53:02The world needs people who are strategic and really sincere and genuine. The world needs people who are high performers and highly compassionate and graceful. By the way, you're all those things too. So it's not just about me. I feel that when I'm with you. I feel that with the people you work with. I feel that with friends we have in common. I know plenty of people that I think are wonderful people and operating at a really high level. I also know people who are not doing that. And so you get best of both, but you get that everywhere. I just think it's what we need. And I think it's what we need to encourage.

53:30I think it's what needs to be taught at business school. I think it's what needs to be taught online. Why do you think it's not taught in business school in that same way? Like, do you feel like we're missing a module of, you know, people having, like being able to like, you know, flex that muscle of here's how you're going to look after yourself. Here's how you're going to find purpose. Here's how you're going to like thread this, uh, you know, element of self growth or, you know, or maybe even it's, it's, it's more like self love, but is that like a balance that somehow we're missing in our education, in our bit, like in our business education, or even when we just talk about business?

54:07Because if you ask me, I don't know many people that are truly like when I talk like the mega successful people that don't sit at this like that or haven't discovered the intersection of their success and some kind of either spiritual practice or you know something that has a deeper meaning within them and yet it's not something that we talk about in business school at all so like do you reckon something's just missing yeah I think that I mean if you look at some of the greatest music artists in the world their art comes from a really spiritual place. Like the artists I know, like the stuff that moves us, it didn't come from some strategic formulaic algorithm.

54:44It moved you because it came from someone's heart. There's a reason why that song made you cry. And there's a reason why you wanted a song played at your wedding. There's a reason for that because it brought out real emotion. That didn't come from an algorithm or a formula. And so I think we all know that real art, when you see it, when you feel it, like if you think about it, like all of our most special moments happen when we close our eyes, when we pray, when we kiss, when we meditate, when we take something in, like all of that happens in that moment. Am I just hearing that for the first time?

55:11Am I crazy? No, you feel it, right? Or say it again, all of the most special moments happen when you close your eyes. Yeah. Like all the most like intimate, like deep felt moments. And there's something powerful about that. And I think that that makes us realize that you can't get an algorithm to do that. Right. It has to be human. Meaning that you've got to close your eyes and go inside you yourself to get to a place of like real truth, real authenticity, and to be able to be and to do and be the most successful version of yourself. Like you believe that that is a part of it. Yeah. And we have to teach people to do that more.

55:46I think the reason we haven't taught people is because we do live in a society that only cares about results. But by the way, everyone who's got the results isn't happy. Yeah, we do it the wrong way around. That's what happens because it's like you get successful and then you're like, oh my goodness, I need to like work on this other side of me because I'm out of balance. I'm out of whack. Where it would be kind of interesting to think like, what would happen if you started that at the beginning? What would happen if you like, you know, did your, you know, your business plan and thought about your launch.

56:11And at the same time, we're like, I'm going to balance this with this other stuff that has equal weight and equal importance to make me successful and to look after me while I'm doing it. And I think it would slow people down. I mean, there were years in my life where I worked 18 hour days and weekends and, you know, and work, I work harder today than I did 10 years ago. So it's not about hard work and not, I think that has to be there. I think it's the work needs to be infused with a spirit and an energy that is about wanting to do something good or do something great to help people. I think that's the goal.

56:42It's not complicated. I always say to people, if you're building something that you wouldn't let your kid use, don't build it. Don't build it. Don't build it. That's the point. That's the simple test. Wouldn't that just be the test? That's the simple test. Which is crazy because I feel like every single person that I speak to in Silicon Valley ever It's like, yeah, but my kids are banned from da, da, da, da, da. Like whatever it is that I do and I'm working on. Like for a hundred percent. And that's the worrying part, right? Because then you're saying I'm happy to exploit other people's children, but not mine.

57:10But not my own. And that is - And I have the information up front and I have the, you know, the education and I can see down the road what's going to happen with this. And yet I'm happy to do it. Yeah. But that's where purpose-driven businesses come into play, right? Because at the end of the day, when you're doing something that is inherently good, inherently positive, when you're thinking about, you know, underrepresented communities, underserved communities, when you're actually thinking about the good as the primary force, right? And balancing that with this is a business and we need to be profitable.

57:43That changes everything. Like that is, and again, it would be so great if all businesses were like that. But I think, again, it's just something that we need to speak about more and think about more and infuse as the norm. Because you can be really successful as you've shown and yet still have all of these pieces in check. And by the way, and it's really important, no one's doing it perfectly, neither am I. It's a constant balancing act. You're constantly trying to figure it out and figure out, oh, well, where did my intention get messy there? and, oh, maybe I shouldn't have said yes to that. Yeah, totally.

58:17Of course. I'm glad you still feel like that. Oh, no, of course. No, no. So I was actually going to say, that is the work. That is it. That is the work. The moment you stop questioning, that's when you lost yourself. Like the moment you stop thinking about ego and envy and greed and pride, that's the day it's taken over your life. So for me, that is the daily work. The daily work is actually checking in with your intentions. And I always talk about it as, every day I check in and think, am I planting seeds or weeds? If I'm planting seeds, they're going to grow beautiful trees that have beautiful flowers and fruits.

58:51If I'm planting weeds, that's going to tear down everything I create. And that's something I have to do every day. You've got to unweed your garden weekly, monthly, constantly. You can't just say, I'm going to do it in three years time. And so I think that's a process. And that's what I have to do. What's the practice of that for you though? Because I love that idea of like, you know, weeding because I feel like if you're doing a lot of stuff, if you're trying things, you are going to make mistakes. Like I make mistakes all the time. And I find it, you know, I'm a pretty easy person in going like, oh, that was me.

59:22Like I made that decision and that was the wrong decision, but it is difficult for some people. So how do you unpick and what's the practice to, to be so, uh, you know, self-deprecating and, and to have that muscle that every week you could go back and be like, that wasn't, that wasn't what I intended. I think it is actually what ends up happening is you make the mistake, you plant a weed, it destroys all the other garden. You go, oh crap. And that's the reality of moving fast. I'm the same as you. I've made so many mistakes in the last 10 years because we're moving so fast. It wasn't intentional.

59:53It wasn't conscious. You make them because you're moving and you're moving at the speed of light and the momentum's there and all the rest of it. And I think what we don't realize is that is the only way to grow. If you take that out, so you will make mistakes. it's actually looking at those and going, okay, I'm not going to make that twice. Okay, I'm not going to make that three times. I'm going to figure that out. And I think that's what I'd focus on. I think this idea, and that's why I keep saying it, I haven't perfected this balance. I just believe it's needed in the world. And I'm almost, the way we'd call it in our philosophy is you're relishing the battle.

1:00:24It's a battle every day. Every day. It's not something I fought three years ago and I solved. I battle every day with my ego, with my insecurity, with my envy, with my greed. that's a daily battle. But I love you for saying that because I feel like we look to somebody like you and think you got it all figured out. I don't. And the idea that actually you're standing there going, I don't have it all figured out. I'm trying a lot of things and I'm making mistakes because that's what people don't show, right? You're not posting those mistakes, but it's like you are admitting them. You are saying they happen.

1:00:57And in a journey, like again, you say in the last 10 years, you've made a ton of mistakes. I think about that for myself all the time. And in a way, I wish I could sit down. And one of the things that I intend to do on this podcast is to be really honest about the things that didn't go well for me, because it's in those things. And it sounds, again, super trite. I made, you know, I had a lot of learnings when I made this mistake, but it's more than learnings. It's like, well, I won't do that twice. Right. And what was the behavior in me that led to me doing that thing? And I think once you kind of dig a little bit deeper, I find it's the same things in me that over and over and over again happened, right?

1:01:34Once you spot that behavior, you're able to, you know, figure it out a little bit more easy. And so for me, it's like, I do want to talk about that stuff because it happens to the best of us. Well, I think it happens to anyone who does something for the first time. Yes. If you do anything for the first time, start a business, play tennis, raise a child, whatever it is, you're going to make mistakes because it's the first time you did it. How were you going to get it perfect the first time? And I think - There is no way. We're living in a world right now where everyone wants everyone to get everything perfect the first time they do it.

1:02:05And it's just not possible. It's just not possible. It's just not possible. Even when you walked as a baby, you fell over a million times. And that was just life. And so this want for perfection internally or externally, it just doesn't work. And so, no, I'm definitely not perfect or haven't got the perfect balance. It is me constantly questioning the balance that allows me to try and hold on to it. 100 % And what do you want now? Like I know that you're about to go on tour Yes Which I think is so insane and so amazing Because you've got this like incredible podcast Where seemingly you know you're in your comfort zone You come to your home even It's so beautiful It's such a setup And now you're gonna And I know it's not the first time you've done it But that idea of getting on stage In front of thousands and thousands of people Completely freaks me out Like what makes you want to do that?

1:02:55Do you know what it is? I just miss seeing people You do? Yeah, because I started my, like I said, I started my career in rooms tinier than this. And I'd sit with people for hours and hours and hours. And when I'm on the road, I get to look in people's eyes. You get to see people smile, cry. You get to hug. Like we're going to 15 cities, 15 surprise guests. We're going to do Q &A with the audience. Like these are people who listen to On Purpose every day, every week, every month of every year. I love it. And people are doing it when they walk their dog or in the kitchen or commuting from work.

1:03:26Imagine we're all going to be in the same space. So people are going to walk out with new boyfriends, girlfriends, marriages. That is what's going to happen. People are going to meet each other and they're going to be like, oh my goodness, did you listen to this episode? This was my favorite. I love him. It's just magical. I love that you're doing that. When you think about these new types of business ventures for you, like how do you think about it in the grand sort of suite of things that you do in the brand like world of Jay Shetty? How does it fit into the mix? I think of good connection and even good business as what I heard years ago, this term on a TED talk, and it was called mass intimacy.

1:04:03It's this idea of how do you reach people at scale, but then have a really deep, intimate conversation with one person. And I think any business, product, service, individual, guide, wisdom, teacher, whatever it may be, we benefit when we can reach a lot of people, but then we reach people really deeply. And I think that's why brands do pop-ups, right? It's like, why is a brand doing a pop-up? What's the point of it? But it's because you want to meet people in person, the people who actually care about what you do. And you want to give them a hug and you want to look them in the eye and say, thank you.

1:04:32And so to me, it's that anything that's successful, powerful in the world has the ability to scale and the ability to go deep. You want to be mass and you want to be intimate. And if you can't, and this is what it comes back to, everything we've been talking about, everything has to be opposites. Yes. There has to be strategy and sincerity. There has to be art and there has to be action. it's all about embracing polarities and if you don't embrace these opposites and you think you have to choose you actually miss out on an experience I went on tour two years ago I did 40 cities across the world I got so much out of that I bet you did from the tour that I would never get from staring into a camera yeah I can imagine you must get so much back I feel like you've got so many fans and when I think about someone whose success is so unbelievably well-deserved, I really think about you.

1:05:23I think that everything you're doing is, honestly, I think you're like a one-of-one. You know, when I think about people who I truly aspire to, are creating a lane for themselves, I think about you. And I'm so grateful for the conversation. I think you're amazing. And I wish you even like, if it's possible, even more success than you're already having. Because I really, I believe in the good of what you're doing. and before I let you go I have a couple of rapid fire questions that I want to ask you let's do it here are the rapid fire questions alright what's the first thing you do when you wake up the first thing I do is wonder if what time my wife woke up because she always wakes up earlier than me to meditate and I was walking to our meditation room going what time did you wake up she's like an hour ago I'm like how long does she meditate for same yeah I'm feeling very competitive she wakes up at 5 yeah that's the first thing I do is think about what time my wife woke up I'm going to come and hang out at your house.

1:06:19What's the last thing you do before you go to bed? Tell my wife I love her. Yeah, I love telling her. She's always just like... You are literally the cutest couple in the world. I don't know about that. No, I have a theory about you too. I feel like you saw each other and you both looked into each other's eyes and you're like, they're so beautiful, they're so beautiful, he's so beautiful, she's so beautiful. I feel like that's what happened. No, no, no. She didn't tell you. No, no, no. That's a true story. Yeah, the first time she met me, she was like, oh, whatever. Really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, well, she grew to love you.

1:06:46Oh, the moment I saw her, I was, yeah, exactly. What are you currently aspiring to in your business life? Oh, I love that. I'm currently aspiring to study new models of business that haven't even been invented yet. I'm so fascinated by how the models that were successful in the last 25 years, where Facebook, the biggest content company, didn't make content, Uber, the biggest taxi company, didn't own any taxis. Like that idea was so of the business of last 25 years. I want to know what that next is. What is something that you're aspiring for in your personal life? Oh, I'm aspiring for, that's a great question.

1:07:26What am I aspiring for right now in my personal life? It tells you how much I think about work too.

1:07:34I think it's making sure that the people who are getting older in my life really know how much they're loved. because that's the reality of love and connection is that at some point you're going to have to say goodbye to the people you love. And as someone who doesn't want to die with any regrets, I'm constantly thinking about how do I make sure that all the people that are aging in my life know how valuable they are, what an impact they had, that I make time for them. It's so easy to not make time for people as they age or they're maybe not as fun or mobile or active or whatever it may be and making time for that and giving energy to that person who gave you so much that's a big thing I'm aspiring for because yeah when you're on a rocket ship it's hard to be present it's hard in that way especially with someone you don't live with yeah and so I think yeah that's probably the thing I'm aspiring for I'm so glad I asked what's a book that changed your life?

1:08:31oh okay there's so many good ones I know I'm going to give one that I don't think any guest will ever give that's why I'll give it It's the Bhagavad Gita, which is the wisdom book of the East. It's 5 ,000 years old, 700 verses. But the most important part of it is it's a conversation between God and the most talented archer in the world. So the most talented archer in the world is about to go to battle, but he's doubting himself. He's feeling anxious. He's feeling insecure. His bow is slipping from his hand. He doesn't know if he can shoot an arrow in this battle because he's confused about whether it should take place and whether he should be the one fighting.

1:09:06and it's a conversation between God and this archer and it literally depicts all of the anxiety, the stress, the self-doubt that we feel and the divinity or God is talking directly to the archer in how to rebuild his confidence, how to find real worth, what it really means to live a life of value and purpose and it's spectacular and it's on the edge of a battle which I think so many people feel like we're at now constantly and God speaking directly to someone who's really talented, really gifted but has forgotten that they are. And I think that's true for so many of us. So it's my favorite book.

1:09:41That's a fantastic answer. And what is something that you valued when you were starting out your career but that you don't value now? Oh, wow. That's such a great question. Did I ask you this as well? No, I don't know. Yeah, that's a good question. What did I used to value at the start of my life? Okay. I used to value people around me that were close to me really understanding what I was trying to do. And now I'm okay being misunderstood. I'm okay accepting that sometimes I have to do things that people around me don't understand because it's really hard for people to understand themselves, let alone understand someone else.

1:10:22And usually when you're doing something new and fresh and different, people won't understand you. And if you do what they want you to do, they'll misunderstand you. If you do what you want to do, they'll misunderstand you. If you do nothing, they'll misunderstand you. If you do something, they'll misunderstand you. So people are going to misunderstand you no matter what you do. So you might as well do something you love. And I think for me, I used to really value at the beginning of my career that people really understood me and understood my purpose and saw it. And now I'm just like, I've got to see it because no one else can.

1:10:54And I can't for anyone else. Even if I love someone really deeply, it's really hard to see and fully understand them because you're the only one who's lived through the struggle, the stress, the pain, the trauma, the moments you were crying. And you can explain that to your best friend and your best friend can empathize, but they can't really understand it just because you can't for them. So it's too much pressure to put onto people. Yeah. And, you know, that is such an amazing answer. And I think it's so relevant when, you know, it's like for both of us, right? We moved away from where we're from.

1:11:26We sit in a very different context now to how we grew up. And it is difficult for you to explain that to anyone else. And how could you, how dare you almost in fact, like even think that they would understand and that they could be, you know, beside you and get it and be super, you know, thoughtful about the decisions that you're making and feel the same way that you do. It's just not possible. So I love that advice because I think for anyone who's doing something, you are looking for people to sympathize. You do want the people around you to be like, I'm fully with you. And so often they're like, I'm just not.

1:12:01Yeah, I don't get it. I don't get it. I don't agree with it. And it's, it is too much pressure. So learning to just like, let it go and not be looking for it is very freeing. Yeah. Just don't put pressure on that person and you'll have a better relationship with them and move on with your thing. Yeah. Stop, stop trying to be missed. Stop trying to be understood. I wish that was my last question because that was a really good answer. You'll sort it out in the edit. Yeah, yeah. Tweak it in the edit. Okay, the last question for you is, so what is something that you value now that you didn't back then?

1:12:34Oh, God. I don't think I valued how people have such different values. And what I mean by that is when I married my wife, we literally moved to New York three months after we got married because I got a job offer, the job offer of my dreams. And to me, I was like, we're moving to New York. We're in our late twenties. Like this is like the coolest thing ever. And for my wife, it was, New York was hell. You know, she wanted to be with her family. And in the beginning, I didn't get that. I was just kind of like, that's cool, but look at this life we're building. And we weren't successful or we didn't have a lot, but it was cool to be in New York in our late twenties.

1:13:15And I think over time it made me realize just how you can't make someone value what you value. You can only respect their values and they can respect yours. And I think over time I learned to respect that what made my wife special was her relationship with her parents. And that I didn't have to build something to compete with that. I didn't have to win the value war. I had to just let her be that person because that's what makes her beautiful and bubbly and wonderful is this amazing relationship she has with her family. And what makes me who I am is my purpose and my mission and everything that I'm building.

1:13:54That's what makes me lovable. And so if she's also tries to change me, it wouldn't work. And so I think I didn't realize the value of people's values back then. And now I deeply, deeply understand that you can't change someone's values. You can't make their values, your values. You can't even change yours. And it's better to help someone chase their goals and protect their values than it is to try and get them to change over to yours. And so that is something that I deeply value now. I see why it's so important to follow their truth and their calling and their value because that's what makes them lovable and who they are.

1:14:31If you take that away from them, you wouldn't love them anymore. That is like, there's so much truth there. We could just do a whole number of podcasts just on these two questions. They're really good questions. It's like, I'm blown away. That's so thoughtful. And so there's so much truth in that. yeah I'm that's thank you so much for sharing that answer I'm beside myself we talk about it offline yeah oh my god darling Jay thank you so much I love that you came and you did this for me and I just have to tell you when I texted you I was like oh Jay I'm starting a podcast and I wondered if you could you were like what yes I adore you like I'm in like tell me where and I was like you're your she's gonna do my podcast You're one of the most infectious energy people I've ever met.

1:15:21And we hit it off immediately since day one. So whether I see it at a conference or an event or whatever it is, it's just, you have the best energy. I couldn't not. Well, that means a lot. It means a lot. It means so much coming from you. But, you know, words, people say a lot of stuff. And I think just the fact that you would, A, you come here, you are just an absolute dream to interview. but it really honestly means the world to me that you would just show up and that you would do it with such ease and such enthusiasm and such thoughtfulness. Anytime. No one's going to answer that question better than you.

1:15:56Anytime. Anytime. Thank you. I love you. You're the best. I love seeing you. You too. Thank you, darling. This is amazing. Thank you.

1:16:05If you're loving this podcast, be sure to click follow on your favorite listening platform. While you're there, give us a review and a five-star rating and share an episode you loved with a friend. We'll be so grateful. A Spy with Emma Greed is presented by Odyssey. I'm your host, Emma Greed. Our executive producers are Corrine Gilead-Fisher, Derek Brown and me. Our executive producers from Odyssey are Maddie Sprung-Kaiser, Leah Reece-Dennis, Asha Saluja and Jenna Weiss-Berman. Justine Dom is our senior producer. Our producer is Kristen Torres. Sound design and engineering by Bill Shultz. Angela Peluso is our booker.

1:16:41Original music by Charles Black. Video production by Evan Cox, Kurt Courtney, Andrew Steele, Carlos Delgado, and Arnie Agassi. Social media by Olivia Holman. Special thanks go to Brittany Smith, Sydney Ford, my teams at Jones Works and WNE, Maura Curran, Josefina Francis, Hilary Schuff, Eric Donnelly, Kate Hutchinson-Rose, Tim Meikle, Sean Cherry, and Lauren Vieira. If you have questions for me, you can DM me at Aspire with Emma Greed. Greed is spelled G-R-E-D-E that's Aspire A-S-P-I-R-E with Emma Greed. Or you can submit a question to me on my website, emmagreed.me In football, value isn't just about making flashy plays.

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