Maya Hawke and Christian Lee Hutson - Live from SXSW

0:06Pushkin.

0:10Maya Hawke first became known to audiences as an actress, especially through her work in Stranger Things and in film. But she's been quietly building a parallel life as a songwriter of genuine depth. Since her debut album Blush in 2020, she's released four records that are ever more reflective. Maitreya Corso, her fourth album, arrives at a formative moment in Hawk's life, following her marriage to longtime musical collaborator Christian Lee Hudson. The album's built around a central persona named Maitreya Corso, who serves as a conduit for exploring themes of ego, ambition, and creation. Recorded in Woodstock in New York City late last year, the album's co-produced by Hudson and Jonathan Lowe, with the album's artwork taken from watercolor paintings made by Maya herself.

0:58On today's episode, recorded live from South by Southwest, I sat down with Maya Haack and husband and co-producer Christian Lee Hudson to talk about the making of Maitreya Corso. Together, they reflect on the development of their artistic lives separately, Maya in New York and Christian mostly in LA, but also what it's like to come together as partners in life, as well as music. This is Broken Record. Real musicians, real conversations.

1:28This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human. Small businesses are the pulse of every community. They bring people together, create opportunities, and drive growth. Chase for Business helps business owners like you with personalized guidance and convenient digital tools all in one place. With that guidance and your determination, you can take your business farther and help build a brighter future for your community. Learn more at chase.com slash business. Chase for business. Make more of what's yours. The Chase mobile app is available for select mobile devices. Message and data rates may apply.

2:07JPMorgan Chase Bank. N.A. member FDIC. Copyright 2026. JPMorgan Chase and Company. Hey everyone, it's Cal Penn. I'm inviting you to join the best sounding book club you've ever heard with my podcast, Earsay, the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club. Every episode, I nerd out with amazing guests and dive into the best new audiobooks available on Audible. It's the book club for your ears. Listen to Earsay, the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. This episode is brought to you by Navy Federal Credit Union. May is her favorite because Military Appreciation Month is their time to celebrate those who go above and beyond.

2:55They know the military community protects our country, takes care of their families, and volunteers in their communities. That's why they've helped the military community for over 90 years. Learn more at NavyFederal.org slash celebrate. And happy Military Appreciation Month. Navy Federal Credit Union. Navy Federal is insured by NCUA. Here's my interview with Maya Haack and Christian Lee Hudson, live from South by Southwest. Hi, everyone. All right.

3:33Thanks for having us. No, thanks for coming. Thanks for being here. It's cool to be in Austin and South by Southwest. It certainly is. This is one of my, I was thinking about on the flight here, there's like five American cities that feel like they have their own internal logic, different from any other. You know, it doesn't feel like, it's not better than, it's just very different than any other part of America. New Orleans feels that way. New York feels that way. I would throw LA and the Bay Area, or the LA area, the Bay Area, and Austin, you know, feel like just completely their own unique things.

4:06Chicago is kind of unique too. person agrees Chicagoan would agree yeah you know what that is true and it has it certainly has a history all those other cities do so I wouldn't take that how did you guys' musical connections start? how did you guys start playing together? via email that's what I was going to say the postal service we have a mutual friend named Benjamin Lazar Davis who produced my second record Moss and played base on my first record and he knew Christian from working on Aquaville River right? exactly which you I did a tour with them and just met the band kind of and then the guy Will the songwriter and I wrote a few songs together cool and Benjamin joined them at some he's a member now he's like on again it's like one of those bands like Bright Eyes where it's like who was the members of it I don't know who's around.

5:08Right, right. Collective. But Will and Ben were on that tour. Will is obviously Aquaville River, but then there's another Will, Will Grafe, who's also been playing with me since I started, who we were on that tour with Christian. And then I asked Ben to work on this record with me, or really to work on an EP, and then all of a sudden I had like nine more days off of Stranger Things than I was supposed to have, and was like, what if instead of making an EP we made a record, because we've got some extra time. so then we had like two months to write six more songs and i was sending ben and will like poems every single day and they were i think drowning in poems um with which to put music to and they were and ben was like can i send some of your music to can i send one of your poems to christian and i never responded to the email and then i got an email from purpose on like no i just am bad at my email um and uh and i never responded and then uh i got an email from christian being like got your poem and then I was so embarrassed because I was a big fan of Christians and was like oh no oh that poem that was just a first draft please let me send you an edited don't work on that yet um but we've gone back since and like read those early emails and they're actually very sweet uh and they're awesome yeah they're awesome so that's how it's a great first poem too I wouldn't I was like this is awesome well Ben sends crazy emails and that was a really good one again good yeah for you did it feel like this is maybe like the idea of it like okay you're going to get these poems in some form and write to them is that like a typical process for you or did that feel were you surprised by how easy or natural that process was kind of I mean I was writing I like to write in a lot of different ways and that was a really fun way to be like you know sometimes you'll go in a room and someone has like 75 percent of a song and you're like cool i'm just gonna throw out some like ideas for the last 25 percent in there this was a fun way to just be like this has no music and no you get to decide what the rules are because this is also covid yeah so we were i was just sitting in my closet like with my guitar being trying to figure out how to what made the most sense out of the thing so it was different and fun and immediately I was like, send me another poem.

7:31Yeah. And then we had really a lot of fun, and we met kind of making that record. It's incredible. I want to get back to just sort of the evolution of how you guys got to the latest record. But, I mean, it's interesting because you're, or maybe I'm wrong, but I'm just going to say this. You're not primarily like a songwriter, or you were new to it at the time. You're right, you're right. You're not wrong. I would argue with that. I would say, but I would say, but I don't just, maybe it's. I knew I shouldn't let you up here. I would say that Maya is constantly writing songs. She writes songs every single day.

8:08She is a natural. In the form of, like, in the. Absolutely. I feel like before I, like, even awake, there's, like, a full, like, complete song that I'm just like, what the fuck is this? Well, okay, what I will say is that a big part of what's happened in my own musical evolution, so to speak, is that Christian, when we worked on Moss Together, was so encouraging and was so like, well, actually show me, like, when you wrote this poem, what music did you imagine? And I would play it for him and he'd be like, wait, that's good. What do you, like, why didn't we do that? And I was like, no, it's not, it's trash.

8:44Because I was a very fortunate young person who was around artists my whole life and around amazing musicians my whole life and people that were so good at guitar and piano that it felt embarrassing to pick up an instrument in front of them, you know, and who were such extraordinary composers and instrumentalists that it didn't feel like I had anything to offer. And Christian was kind of the person that entered my life and was like, you have something to offer because it is you that is offering it. It's not about the jazz school. It's about the nature of your heart. Yeah. And, like, the truth that, you know, the music and the words and how they combined.

9:21And so that sort of encouragement working on Moss kind of created Chaos Angel in a lot of ways because that was a product of me being like oh I can incorporate my own melodies and I can write music and That was your third album so by the time you did your third album you did start to have more confidence in yourself as a person who is writing songs Absolutely which isn't to say that I wrote them by myself I didn't at all but I would instead of coming to the table with just a piece of paper with words on it I would come to the table being like this is what I've been playing like what do you think I really like this chorus but the verse melody sucks let's make it better you know it was a sort of more wouldn't you say that that's an accurate description of the vibe?

10:06Yeah I think that's a really accurate description I think that you like chronically underestimate what because most of the musical ideas Well I'm working on it! I know! Most of the musical ideas that you have I'm like wow this is so fucking heady and trippy There's a certain beginner's mind of when you don't know what the rules are, you don't know that you're breaking them in a way that might be cool. You're very smart. You're very good at undercutting. I am very good at turning a compliment into an insult. It truly makes me wonderful to be around. That is... I'll be like, oh, so you're saying I look beautiful by which you mean I'm dumb.

10:43You know, it's like a really... You know, it's really... There's a lot of fun ways to twist a sentence. It's really convoluted. To go from your... I'm a pleasure. you are actually yeah is the inverse true like if someone says you're smart do you feel like well why aren't you complimenting my looks come on aren't i beautiful yeah yeah yeah what do you mean i'm smart you know what i think about this with my so you're saying i'm ugly i have three daughters yeah well one's a baby so she doesn't really count but i have so two daughters are sentient in the sense of they can understand what i'm saying i can kind of screw them up or or or or maybe set them up for some sort of you know healthy life you know um and i'm always like oh wow you look so beautiful i'm like oh yeah but you're smart too like i'll i'll be like fuck i shouldn't have just said that or i'll be like oh you're so smart and i'm like oh i don't want her to think she's just like a nerd oh you're beautiful too and i i don't know i don't know i'm very neurotic about like balancing any compliment i make with them yeah being a woman sucks you know i mean there's just like it's like there's just like it's all bad oh don't clap for that um no it's okay um but like it's all bad but i i will i think as long as neither one is that heavy you know I mean smart can be heavy but I think it's just all about like yeah it's not about what your parent says it's about what you think they value about you yeah and like and I think that kind of extends more broadly to you know your partner or your friends it's not about what they say to you like your best friend can be like you're such a bitch and you'll be like I know you know but like that and that's a wonderful and it's a compliment and so it's never about what the words are I think it's always about the feeling behind the words when it comes to intimate relationships yes the intense the intent or perceived intent at least in in terms of when there's intimacy it's about intent yes when it's a stranger it's about what you said i think generally right yes that does make sense i mean i hadn't really thought about it or broke it down that way but i think that's probably accurate yeah i'm curious about because you both are really um you know potent artists and engaged artists who have had different paths you know each have had a new different path and they've kind of converged in this way but what was your experience with the arts growing up like what was your relationship with it both in terms of how was it introduced to you and then how did it sort of evolve on your own how did it become something that you sort of took ownership of and felt like oh this is like for me like I grew up with a lot of like my I grew up with my grandma who was from Detroit so I just grew up with Motown in the house and I thought to the point I thought it was new music but then I got to junior high I got into skateboarding and And I was like, oh, the Ramones, like that's my music, you know?

13:15And that sort of, and then you circled back, circled back at some point to Motown. But I did at some point start to forge my own identity in art outside of whatever my family thought. I'm kind of curious how you guys, what you guys came up with and how you guys started, what music and art started to be formative in your own sort of identity? I'm going to set you up. and I'm going to set you up by saying that I think that we, no, positive. I know, always positive. Like, just that one, I think the thing that's cool about our friendship and collaboration is that we had really different experiences.

13:54Like, I was drowned in the arts, and I think Christian really had to find it on his own. I don't know if somebody said the arts when I was a kid, I don't know if I would know what they were talking about. There was no, like, art in my life. but there was weirdly there was Motown like a lot of my grandmother was a record collector but like didn't talk about the arts she just grew up in Chattanooga and like was loved getting Stax records and Motown records and showed me all of that and and did that take absolutely I was obsessed with it but I also thought it was new music which was very funny because I would like take it to school and it was like wow no one kind of knew what I was talking about they were like oh yeah it's a song from like Remember the Titans or something or whatever.

14:42And yeah, so I didn't really know about it. And when I was like a teenager and there was like an arts program in school, I went to like a fundamentalist Christian school where there was like art was like, I don't know, it's like a poem about Jesus maybe or something. Yeah, it's liturgical. It's just like it's all. Versus I went to a high school where, not while I was there, but in its origin, the headmaster used to take parents on school tours and say that if the students didn't have interracial sex and tried at least three different drugs before they graduated, he would consider himself a failure.

15:14Yeah, I had a very different headmaster. He had very different priorities than you. Really different priorities. You know, he had his own issues, Stanley Bosworth. But what I mean to say generally is that I really was just like, the arts seemed like the main option. Like I kind of remember meeting people with other jobs and being like, what do you do? And people would tell me, I'd be like, why? you know and just like you know a normal thing to do every weekend was go to the Metropolitan Museum of Art and like go to the Nutcracker it was just like everything was art and music and film and storytelling so it's something really cool about getting to work with you is to kind of combine this like art as revenge and art as identity that I feel like you hold where like i couldn't rebel by being an artist that was not a rebellion for me true but it was for you and i feel like i love getting to like bring the feeling of like no art is everywhere art is everything and you can bring the like art is rebellion art is crazy yes and we can kind of combine that in a way that feels really cool yeah growing up in new i mean like you said you grew up steeped in the arts and in new york city so like art probably has to go pretty far for you to feel like it's rebellious right i mean i this walks us down a whole new rabbit hole that we could talk about forever which is like how do you make rebellious art now how do you make protest art now i'm curious i don't have an answer like i i it's very it seems very borderline impossible because of the way that the internet works and the way that like moments happen and like niches happen and how difficult it is.

17:04I was reading something about, you know, like, it used to be so, the way David Bowie dressed used to be so transgressive. And now it's like Harry Styles and Benson Boone and like, you know, everyone dresses like David Bowie. And so how, what could you possibly wear that would be transgressive? Yeah. I don't, like, I don't have an idea. What sound could you make that's possibly transgressive? I don't know. I think Yoko Ono is the closest. That's the most transgressive thing I can still think of. Not even anymore. It's just bad. It's true. It's like, oh, not that she's bad, but what I just did is bad.

17:40She's amazing. Nothing is transgressive at all anymore because everything is everything. Yeah, and the only way you can pretend to be transgressive is to be ugly or unfortunate or make a sound that no one wants to hear. I mean, sonically ugly, by the way. The biggest way you could be transgressive is just shut the fuck up. Yeah, that would be a crazy rebellion. It would be. Silence. We all are obsessed with ourselves. I guess getting off the internet, you mentioned quitting social media. I don't know if I heard that right. But getting off the internet, I guess, which is, I don't want to say it's a weak way to be transgressive.

18:15But it's, I mean, in the grand scheme of things, I guess it's not that. It's more of a personal thing than it is. I don't think I even get any points for being off social media because I'm still benefiting from it and profiting from it. because I have the capacity to have someone who can like run my social media for me. Right. So I like, that's not, I not a rebellion at all because I'm entirely participating in the system of it. I'm just trying to protect my own brain and peace from it. Yeah. So I, that's like zero rebellion. That's like, um, that's just like walling yourself in, which is working for me, but like, I wouldn't brag about.

18:52We'll be right back with more from Maya and Christian after the break.

19:22Thank you. online resources are always available to give you the solutions you need to help your business thrive. See how your business can go farther with Chase for Business. Learn more at chase.com slash business. Chase for Business. Make more of what's yours. The Chase mobile app is available for select mobile devices. Message and data rates may apply. JPMorgan Chase Bank N.A. Member FDIC. Copyright 2026. JPMorgan Chase and Company. Baseball is back and BetMGM, official partner of Major League Baseball, is bringing the heat all season long. Step up to the plate all season with Swing for the Fences, the free-to-play game where every swing could score you rewards.

19:58We're talking parlay boost tokens, odds boost tokens, same-gate parlay boosts, and even bonus spins all season long. And the action doesn't stop there. Get more out of every at-bat with MLB same-game parlay boosts. Stack your picks and boost your potential payout. Plus, lock in bigger value with MLB odds boost tokens and MLB parlay boost tokens all season long. More boosts, more swings, more chances to win. Download the BetMGM app and step up to the plate today. See BetMGM.com for terms. 21 plus only. Promotional offers may vary by market. Subject to eligibility requirements. Rewards may vary.

20:36Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER. Available in the U.S. For New York, 877-8-HOPE-NY. Or text HOPE-NY 467-369. For Arizona, 1-800-NEXT-STEP. For Massachusetts, 1-800-327-5050. For Iowa, 1-800-BETS-OFF. For Puerto Rico, 1-800-981-0023. In partnership with Kansas Crossing Casino and Hotel. Hey everyone, it's Cal Penn. I'm the host of Ear Say, the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club. This week on the podcast, I am sitting down with Ray Porter, the narrator of Andy Weir's audiobook Project Hail Mary, massive sci-fi adventure about survival and science, and what happens when you wake up alone very far from earth.

21:24I really had to make a decision because I caught myself getting that frog in my throat and starting to get teary as I'm narrating some of these sections. And it's like, okay, yo, yo, yo, is this indulgent? And I really thought about it. I was like, no, at this point, it would kind of be betraying the trust the author and the listener have in telling this story if I don't go through it. But there's places in this book that deeply emotionally affected me. and I left it on the mic. That's great. Because it served the story. People will say like, oh my God, I cried at the end. It's like, yeah, dude, me too.

21:56Listen to Ear Say, the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. We want to talk about a song, like Lioness on your new album is something that seems like it's to a large degree ripped out of your life, but probably that there's also some things in there that we wouldn't necessarily recognize, you know? Well, I guess I would say that I think that that song, Miley Cyrus actually talks about this, and I quote her all the time about it, which is that every, I wish I could remember her pithy way of describing it, I don't, but that every song is like an encapsulation of a singular emotion, or like we are, we contain multitudes, right?

22:43Like sometimes you wake up in the morning, you're like, I hate my life, and then an hour later, like, I love my life, And then, like, you know, we are always so many people. And a lot of the time, one thing that helps write a song is to, like, zero in on a specific feeling. And to take out all the nuance and all the different ways in which you know you don't really feel that way. And to add as much breath and life and blood into the singular feeling as possible. And I think that Lioness is a song about a moment where I was really struggling with gratitude. and like you know I had had all my dreams come true I was doing the thing that I love most in the world and I was doing it and was able to take care of myself and provide for myself and that was everything I wanted and I was really depressed and really not feeling the magic feeling the spark of creativity and I had this incredible moment on set where I got to watch my best friend bring the freaking house down with a performance and i was like oh my god it's not this environment that's not allowing magic to happen it's not the genre or the tone or the budget or the this it's me i'm i'm emotionally shut off i'm blocking out the magic and i think that was a song that came from like me wanting to kind of just do a wake-up call and get out of the funk that i was in and in and And so it's kind of like a cartoon version of my most ungrateful, like bratty self until the last verse.

24:21Like we've recently been talking a lot about this. You know the voice in your head that tells you that you're like an absolute monster and that you're a bad person and that everybody hates you? Like we've been talking about that voice and been calling it like Schmeagle. And like Schmeagle is like, you are a bad person. nobody loves you you do that voice too Christian? is that awesome? mine is kind of maybe just because my voice is lower a little bit scarier I would say yours is kind of charming easy to interface with do yours mine is like you are not doing good you are doing bad stuff and no one likes you and you're you're a delusional weirdo.

25:11Exactly. Sometimes when I go to a fashion event, I speak in an accent, and I do it accidentally, but she's really fabulous, and she says, darling. She's like, yes, darling, I'd love a glass of water. And these kinds of different characters that exist within all of us, right? You have a little demon in your head, and you have the fabulous person in your head, and you have you, and I think sometimes I like to write from those... Christian is an incredible character songwriter and actually writes songs about characters that aren't him at all. And I would say I write songs from the points of view of different characters that are all me.

25:49So the lioness is kind of like this depressed actress. She's like, everything's great, I'd love another water with ice. But I'm so sad and I don't even feel like an artist anymore. Am I an artist? That's like that cartoon character. so you write from characters that are external primarily you would say I mean they're external in the way they have behavior that is like different an amalgamation of different I'm like a collage artist of just different stimuli or whatever mainly my characters aren't anyone specifically but they're sort of kind of a lot of people that are stories from experiences that you never had Yeah, exactly.

26:36But that's what I mean. It's just like a collage of different people's experiences or whatever and how they would... It's like a fan fiction of life, of people and stuff, you know. They got that joke. Okay. Well, I didn't even mean to make the joke. Did I miss the joke? I missed the joke. I'm an idiot. Christian has a song called Fan Fiction. Yeah. And they laughed, and I think it's because they know that. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. I'm ashamed I didn't pick up on that. Well, I didn't pick up on it either, and I'm embarrassed that I accidentally quoted myself. I want to ask, Maya, you're, as some maybe still are, a fan of Taylor Swift?

27:17Totally. I mean, yes. Well, you're going to say how what? How could you not be? She's the GOAT. She has inspired a generation of songwriters to be themselves and to be free and believe in themselves. That's what I wanted to hit on. So what is it about her songwriting and her influence? Well, she's an extraordinary musician who I'm pretty sure can do anything. But I think she chooses to write songs that are really simple and really approachable. Or, you know, like a lot of the time musically. And so much music is so intimidating, especially for young women. And I think it was really, when I was a little girl and I like got my first guitar and I went home and I typed in, oh, I want to learn how to play All You Need Is Love by The Beatles.

28:07And I was like, I can't. Maybe that one is actually kind of simple. No, it's weird. It's weird, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was like, oh, I can't do this. And I was like, oh, this is so discouraging. I feel so bad about myself that I can't. It sounds so simple when I listen to it, but when I try to do it, I can't do it. and then I was like okay I'm gonna learn to play Taylor Swift's Hours and I was like oh I obviously can't play it as well as she can but I can play it I can sit in front of my family and be like these are the chords and I'm playing it and I'm singing this song and it's so encouraging like it's so inspiring and it makes you feel like oh my god a song that I love that changed my life and inspires me is accessible to me and it makes you believe that you can write songs and that you could even write songs that could change the world yeah it's like punk rock it's like the Ramones or whatever I'm sure that like everyone that plays music had the moment where they're like oh shit I could do this today yeah yeah right now just go to like the thrift store and buy the thing and I could play like fucking whatever that's what Taylor Swift does I think and then she does that and then also happens to have like written I think a lot of the greatest songs of the last 20 years and like over and over again album after album and it's pretty impressive and does it while being pretty incredible role model at the same time and not seeming to have that be too much of a burden.

29:35So it's pretty cool. Yeah. What is your favorite Taylor Swift album? Fearless, but I've been in the game from the beginning and you can't replace your first experience. So I wouldn't say that I wouldn't, I don't, I wouldn't say it was the best album, but it is my favorite. Yeah, yeah. It's also, we did fall in love to Fearless, the Fearless song. We did, yeah. And then to some Red. So I would say like Fearless, Red, and then Torture Poets Department. Wow. You guys fell in love to Fearless. We had some pivotal, we've had some really pivotal Taylor Swift bonding moments. Most men that you meet as a young woman, when you say you like Taylor Swift, they say, oh, that's so annoying.

30:21Don't put it onto the car. I don't want to listen to it. and you get to meet one who puts it on in the car on purpose, not to manipulate you it's a pretty big deal Christian I'm speechless he's a lifelong fan he heard Taylor on the country radio and went to go see her live during the fearless era no, during the self-titled self-titled era I grew up in LA and there's one country I don't know what there is now but there's one country station Go Country I don't know what the numbers are or the letters but it was teardrops on my guitar they started playing and I was like I used to listen to country music because my dad introduced me to Hank Williams and I was like this fucking rocks this guy is amazing this new music from the 1940s and when I listened to country music mainly as a joke because you could turn it on and be like damn you hilarious they're punning on this truck so hard like song after song truck puns fish puns and taylor swift uh or whatever tim mcgraw or whatever i think is what it was that and i was like this is amazing and and like like weirdly like meta and felt like the internet at that time and like the myspace days of the internet or whatever and it was cool and I called into the radio station and won tickets on the radio to go see her first LA show and went and was very an embarrassed 15 year old boy who was like oh shit it's a bunch of little kids here and I was front row just ripping it, it was amazing I went with my best friend at the time Michael Mann who's not the director but a different guy.

32:21So in other words, I'm the luckiest woman in the world. That is phenomenal.

32:30I want to ask you about Heavy Rain from your newest album. I'm so glad that you do. That is, it's stunning. It's a gorgeous song. And there's like some, like halfway through, something happens halfway through one of the verses verses that is like, I don't even know what you guys do, but something just changes. I wish I could play it. That's Maya. There's a modulation that happens because I was on tour in Europe and Maya had sent me this. We tried the old method of Maya sends a poem and a vague melody and try to map it out. Maya sent me this crazy melody that modulated all over the place and then I sort of figured, I don't even think I've really figured out how to do it, but figured out how to modulate into a different key.

33:23It's just boring. You figured how to do the guitar, how to play against what she was singing. Yeah, and like change it. She went into a different key in a way that was really effortless and kind of like, whoa. Just something I never would have thought to do. You know, have you ever seen on YouTube those videos of people like reharmonizing like a guy on the news or something like that sort of like I tried to do that with the thing that she sent over it was a really cool that song was really fun to write and fun to communicate about and came from a really special like some songs kind of drop out of the air and that was one of them I was having a weird day and I went with my brother was doing a play at Lincoln Center which had been a lifelong dream of mine um and i walked him to the stage door and then we sat out on a bench and we were just like talking and all of a sudden just the like you know when the sky just like rips open and dumps water like out of the blue and it just and it did and i got into a cab and i wrote 90 of that song um in the cab um like running away from the rain while he went into the stage door and um and it was and i like and it's now that's like my favorite song we really i've christian taught me about judy sill um who's beautiful one of my favorite yeah singers and songwriters ever and we really i was like feeling very inspired by her at the time and we were really inspired by her for the production on the song awesome um and i so it's like i don't know but that song feels very magic magic to me wow i would i there's no way i ever would have imagined Judy Sill was the inspiration for it.