Victoria Price meets Henrietta Rix of Rixo

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0:48Hello and welcome to the Business Leader Podcast. I'm Graeme Ruddock, the Editor-in-Chief of Business Leader and the regular host of the Business Leader Podcast. I'm delighted to introduce you to a special series of interviews with entrepreneurs around the UK by Victoria Price. Victoria is head of private capital at Alvarez & Marcel, the consultancy firm, and has spent over 20 years in professional services in a collection of senior roles. She's the mother of three and a vocal advocate for working parents. She's also an investor in promising businesses and involved with various charities. In the third episode of our series, Victoria speaks to Henrietta Ricks, the co-founder and chief executive of fashion brand Rixo.

1:34Honestly, it's difficult to know where to start with the journey when I look at what you've achieved because you've created garments that are iconic. You know, they are instantly recognisable as Rixo. So you have grown from a wholesale perspective, but you've also got your boutiques. And I know you've kind of recently opened one over in New York, which is an achievement in itself. You've become a mum over the time that you've been running the business. And I believe that you're going to reach that kind of 25 million threshold nearly. It's a rounding difference kind of this financial year. So, you know, from a financial perspective, you've performed really, really well as well.

2:13So do you sort of pinch yourself about all of that? does it seem real? I think what's the nice thing for both Laura and I is when you're randomly on a tube and then someone comes in and sits next to you opposite you and they're wearing a Rixo dress and you're like that's a really nice moment or in a restaurant or wherever you are I think we were I remember our first trip to Australia we went to a bar on the first night and this woman walked in wearing a Rixo dress and I was like you know when you just flabbergasted How did that get to Australia? We do not do delivery to Australia Did I pick a pack?

2:45so I think there's really nice moments like that I think they're the real pinch me moments when someone's actually spent their hard-earned cash and they're a loyal customer to you I think that's that's that's really amazing I love that it's been an incredible growth story and it's become such a much-loved brand and it's that instantly recognizable handwriting of the garments that you've got that I think I admire the most and we're going to talk all about the clothes and all about the journey but in order to do that I'm going to take you right back to the very beginning so little Henrietta um kind of going off to school what what were your passions were you creative from a young age or was it something that kind of came later on for you yeah no I think I definitely was I think it's kind of it's either in you or not my mum is really creative she paints and she was kind of very interested in fashion but kind of taking me to vintage fairs and auction so I I guess I was exposed to that from an early, really early age.

3:42And at school, I loved textiles and art, but I also loved business studies at A-level and maths and kind of understanding the business context of things as well. So, yeah, definitely, I'd say creative from an early age. It's quite unusual, isn't it, to kind of enjoy that blend of, you know, the business side of it, but then also the kind of art outlet and kind of, you know, making things. So I don't know, did you ever have a vision from that young age that you'd one day be running a business or was it just doing what you enjoyed and it was the way that it happened? I knew in, so when I was doing, I think it was even like GCSE textiles when I was 15, 16, one of my friends who's still one of my best friends, so she's like, how did you just know at that age?

4:21You were saying that when you were at the sewing machine that you were going to have your own brand one day. I was like, I don't know. I don't even really remember that myself. And I was like, did I say that? And she's like, yeah. so I don't know whether it's kind of just in you and it's probably a blend of my mum and my dad so my mum's more creative but she was a stay-at-home mum looking after all of us kids and then my dad was kind of going out to work had his own business so I maybe I was exposed to hearing all his conversations and the work that went into that and building your own businesses then I've got four older brothers as well and the two eldest ones they didn't go to university or anything they set up their businesses when they were 16 so I think it just was normal to me that's kind of what you did like when you finished school so there's almost like entrepreneurship in the blood and that kind of like business around you by osmosis you're kind of hearing about it maybe it didn't sort of seem such a scary thing for you um but you grew up in manchester didn't you and do you think that that had any kind of impact on your sense of fashion or um kind of shaped the the love that you ended up having for vintage style clothing i think probably it definitely did like I would go to vintage fairs with my mum all the time and we'd kind of or like auction houses or just anything called it even like charity shops and stuff like it was always rooting for something different and something special so I'm sure it probably definitely did I mean I love Manchester I loved my my childhood growing up here I think everyone was really friendly as well you'd talk to different people like even at all the vintage fairs you'd get to know the dealers then they'd be like oh I'm going to France next week and this is what I'm bringing back so he became almost friends with all these dealers and a lot of them were really like kind of odd old men but me and mum were kind of just there living like oh yeah have you seen this or that and then they'd end up being like I've got loads more at my house come and mum was like okay well so we just kind of went and then we'd find these amazing like vintage dresses and stuff that they'd collected and so I think kind of building up those relationships with like antique dealers as well that kind of just became a bit normal so maybe it was I feel like there's going to be a bit of a theme here because I know you've got a great story a bit later on that you kind of form these friendships with quite unusual characters and I think that's definitely like the northern friendly side of things that we just talk to anybody yeah I take them on face value so so you uh you do quite a blend of things when you're at school um you then go off to to London to to study and it you know you you went to uh you took a place at one of the most highly sought places to go to study fashion um you know you must have worked incredibly hard and and you know sort of seen that as a massive opportunity so kind of tell me what it felt like to be suddenly immersed in that environment with so many people doing something that you were passionate about yeah I guess it was difficult because the school where I went to everyone was either going to Oxford or Cambridge and it was very much you were going to like kind of English or maths or law or you wanted to be a doctor whereas when I said I wanted to do fashion and they didn't really understand it but I was really determined I knew what grades I had to get and the course was fashion management so they very much were looking for like business studies as well and then they needed as much experience as possible so I knew that from the age of like 16 17 I needed to get experience kind of retail experience and any experience I could so in any school holidays for instance I would try and try and get as much experience as I could and so I think that definitely then set me up I took it really seriously and then when I applied and then there was rounds of different interview stages where you had to talk about your experience and kind of anything that was relevant at the time within the fashion industry and it was actually quite intense you were on like a table with like seven other girls and before you went in they were like one of you or two of you will get it and you were like oh my god so I have to compete against all of you it was quite intense but I guess I just kind of took it in my stride and just did it I mean you definitely took it seriously preparing I really admire that about you and you know sort of for young people listening about how they can forge their path you know you really worked hard to put yourself in the best position to get that place at the college and you know I heard you had a very high-powered role at Chanel as an intern.

8:28I was dusting the bags in the stock room for two weeks straight not doing anything but I was just there immersing myself and kind of I thought it's just little things like that that give you you can then put that on your CV. You can put Chanel on your CV. I mean, when you're 17, I mean, it's really, you're not really doing much, but you can just, it just shows that you've got an interest, you've been there. And then even like working in retail on the shop floor in the right, in the right places, you're just exposed to the customer. And I think you do kind of. I'd love to know how you described that role in Chanel, especially in today's world where everybody's getting a bit of a slating for kind of like over egging what they've done in the CV.

9:01Should we, yeah, yeah. Looking back and cringing on that. so you kind of get in and you make what's come to be a very important friend there because obviously that's where where you met Orla who you went on to co-found Rixo with but I think even before the the Rixo days you were going out as a pair weren't you kind of doing things and projects and so on so it'd be just great to hear what some of those early experiences were where you kind of got a taste for what was to come yeah absolutely I think Orla and I were both in a similar situation we both already come from Ireland I'd come from Manchester and I think everyone at London College Fashion they all kind of use that as an not an excuse but an opportunity to reinvent themselves and take fashion really seriously where we were kind of like we love fashion but we're not going to change ourselves or be kind of these dramatic characters and stuff so I think we kind of we felt a bit lost in London we didn't really like our first year in London so I think we probably bonded over that and we both love vintage so we'd go to vintage fairs together and then yeah so like you said we had a um a project where we had to go out into industry and find kind of a company that would take take you on I guess to do to do a case study on them we didn't know anyone we had no connections at all so we were like everyone at the time was all the kind of fashion designers were based in like East London studios so we got the bus and kind of went around the whole of East London I remember it was like pissing it down with rain and it was like the work the most embarrassing day ever because everyone was just shutting the door in our faces and then we got to one design A bit like being a sort of double-lazing salesperson.

10:34Hi!

10:38So, and then the last one we were like, oh, let's just, so I think maybe that was even like a lesson in not giving up. It was the last one and it was all who actually said, she said, oh, there's antipodium, let's just try and knock on. Geoffrey's the creative director. We'll knock on and see what he says. And he was Australian. He was like, yeah, come in girls. And he was like, I can see like we were drenched. We were all like dressed up and ready to pitch to him. And he was like, yeah, just do what you want. So we were like, oh, my God. And then we were so excited that we got given that opportunity that then we worked really hard on the project.

11:07And we did really well within that project, presented it back. And our lecturer said, oh, you two seriously work really well together. You should consider doing something together, maybe. And I don't know whether that kind of planted a little seed. But then Ola and I then lived together, did our dissertation. And then, yeah, roughly around six months after we graduated, we set Rexo up. Amazing. And I love that. And it is just a small nugget. And maybe it was just that somebody had a belief and maybe it was just something in the back of your minds. But, you know, the fact that it was one of your lecturers that sort of almost empowered and said, you know, you two could be great together.

11:41I love it because I think sometimes the impact that people in education can have on futures, it's kind of underestimated, isn't it? So I think that's just a really nice little nugget. So you leave, you graduate, you're kind of six months down. What are you doing for that six months? Are you kind of, you know, have you gone into a role in a different fashion business or are you kind of working at McDonald's at that point? No, so I was, I had a really weird story to you. So during university, we both had placement years. So I was at ASOS for a year in the buying department and Ola was at 2K Max.

12:14So then when we graduated, Ola then got kind of a job at ASOS and then was there for around six, seven months. Or it could have even been a little bit longer. and then um I actually after we graduated we went Ola and I both together and some of the other girls from uni went on a yacht week holiday I fell in love with a guy from Venezuela and then didn't come home for six months so went to Colombia went traveling and he came back we went yeah long story short but anyway it ended after about six months um thank goodness it did for the fashion world yeah and then he was we were polar opposites he was like I know you're really passionate about setting Rick so up because that's all I was talking about whilst I was with him and he on the other complete other scale he was really passionate about going to costa rica and setting off his hostel and wearing no shoes and whatever else he didn't need any fancy clues um so then we came back and then yeah or me and all the kind of just then we were like right okay we're serious now heads down we're working all i continued to work at asos for a little bit and then i remember i'd pick her up after work and we kind of work in the evenings work at the weekends and then when rick so got to the scale where we were like actually now we kind of need to be in meetings in the daytime and stuff, Aula then kind of left ASOS and then we were full-time on Rixos.

13:27So I just want to pause on that for a minute because, you know, the two of you had really great roles, you know, yourself with ASOS, Aula with TK Maxx. They are two powerhouses in the fashion industry, kind of really revered for, you know, the buying and what they do from an e-com perspective. Did it feel like a risk to you to step away from those maybe safe and corporate jobs where there's that ladder and you can see what's coming next to say, no, actually, we're going to do it all by ourselves and we're going to set something up from scratch? Looking back now, I kind of think we probably seem really naive, but I think I loved my time at ASOS, made so many great friends.

14:10It felt like a really buzzy culture. It was brilliant. So I could have gone back into that after I graduated, but I think there were so many things that we actually I think they got a vintage garment then dumbed it right down but they not they had to to get the price point they wanted to and stuff and that was like that first original vintage garment was so gorgeous and I believe that the you could charge a little bit more so it was just I think it was more about where we wanted to sit in the market and I learned so much about the whole process from design to fit sessions to strike offs to sign off so which was invaluable but I think we felt ready and we felt like there was a real gap in the market and we had no responsibilities really no boyfriends no kids no mortgages so it was kind of like now or never let's just go for it and we were both in the exact same mindset which I think helped um so yeah maybe naive when you look back but we just thought let's go for it yeah fortune favors the brave so you you set up Rickso and you know you all of a sudden have to think about you know the the designing you have to think about the buying the factories that you're going to work with never mind kind of how how you're going to sell things so you know how much are you feeling really confident about all these elements and how much you're just kind of winging it from day to day trying to work out what's going on complete winging it like every single day it was like one day at a time and we said yes to everything and then we were like how the hell do we do that even like simple things like we went so when we had our first samples we made all our samples in the UK and then we go to press offices we used to get kind of I remember it was a boiling hot summer and we'd have all our 12 samples with us like all of beholden six i'd be holding six in a suit bag and then we'd be getting the tube to all these press offices when all like kind of press were in kind of still in the head offices then and we'd go and meet them and if we were if someone was lucky enough to get back to us we'd be like we'll meet you whenever you want and they were like okay come in for a desk side and we'd be like what the hell is a desk side no no idea what that means but we'll just turn up and then they'd be like right okay so what's your rrp and when's it launching and we were like oh um we'll get back to you and we know and we were like okay so what are we retailing this out when is it launching and then they were like can you send us a flat shot and we were like what's a flat shot we'd come home and google what is a flat shot and we were like okay and then we'd research that it would cost like 30 quid per flat shot and we were honestly like well we don't have any money in the business so we were literally we got sellotape sellotape the garments to our uni walls took a picture on our on our cameras and then all actually learned photoshop and kind of photoshopped on the walls on our white walls take a picture and then we were like we don't need to spend 30 quid times 12 so we've saved even though we'd be doing that like two in the morning or whatever it was um but then the next week like our flat shot that we'd done at home was in grazia and red magazine and then you'd be like oh my god a mate like that was i remember first driving and collecting like the first grazia magazine and the first red magazine and we were like oh my god it was our camellia dress there and it was they were like real pinch me moments and then you'd get like one order online you'd be like oh my god picking and packing it writing your name and then taking it to the post office so it kind of just and that was it was just like daily just kind of gradually built up and have you have you kept those magazines have you got those my mum will have them yeah yeah mums keep everything don't they definitely um so so then that's kind of on the actual fashion side the bit that you're passionate about but of course like running a business it comes with all this other stuff like you need to have insurance you need to be uh doing accounts you need to be we do now yeah yeah yeah just to be clear just to be clear but yeah a little birdie told me and obviously you know I'm an accountant first and foremost that maybe your accounts weren't in the best order but that that sounded like a fantastic story of when you finally got somebody to come in and sort out the books oh yeah she was brilliant so we had this lady I don't know why but we thought oh we need an accountant yeah we can't afford recruitment fees we don't know anyone what should We do.

18:00We put an advert on Gumtree like you would for your cleaner. I wouldn't even trust a cleaner. This woman applied. We were so excited. We went to Ikea over the weekend. We turned Ola's bedroom into her office. We got like a, honestly, we looked back and we're like, oh my God, we got like a stapler, files, everything for what we thought an accountant would need to come into the, well, Ola's bedroom. And then, yeah, she joined us. She was there for about two to three weeks. Then she went to Notting Hill Carnival for the weekend and then never came back. Never came back. Never heard from her again.

18:33Did she leave the stapler or did she take it with her? No, she hardly even came to the office. We were like, where is she today? So, yeah, that was a bad hire. But, yeah, we've got lots of money. But hopefully, thankfully, she voted with her feet so you didn't have to deal it. So I now have got this image of this sort of flat that you're sharing in London because, you know, you're designing there. It sounds like you've got your stock there. You've set up an accountant's office there. So is this place absolutely enormous or are you kind of... We're pigeonholing everything into it. So we'd ring our landlord and be like, you need to get rid of the coffee table.

19:06We need more, like IKEA Kallaxes became our life. So we were either in the living room or in IKEA. It was a house, so there was four bedrooms. So we had a flatmate as well on the top floor and then all his twin sister. So when all his bedroom then became the accountant's office or someone else's office or a stock room, all of them bunked in with her twin sister. in my room there were rails where we'd have all the stock so it was and the kitchen was just honestly like the kitchen was just a stock room it all became a stock room um so it wasn't massive it was our uni flat but we just we was we just utilized every single space but we were lucky because our garments were silk and when they you could fit like you could fit we would just became so efficient with the space planning and in the whole house we'd be like sat there watching tv and be like you could get another shelf there and fit more stuff there but it was it was when we had the big massive like wholesale orders coming in and then we were like what do we do like we we don't want to take a warehouse or so we were we'd contemplate maybe renting a van and having the stock outside for a week and stuff and this was like in london where there was areas where the van would definitely get stolen no no insurance for the stock but we were like it's coming in for a week and we're sending it straight out so we don't need insurance it's fine we'll just wing it um so yeah i think we didn't really we hadn't had practices of what to do so we didn't really we didn't really know we were just kind of using common sense or maybe no sense and just kind of just just going from there but I think we were so busy because it was just the two of us we didn't have anyone else helping us so we were like doing customer care picking and packing the e-com orders like you said designing sending po's selling the collection pitching it out to press it was like all consuming that we didn't actually realize that money was then kind of coming in slowly and we were just really careful about cash flow and just didn't we wouldn't even put like a coffee through the business or anything we were so careful and you basically carried on like that for over 18 months didn't you was nearly two years that it was just the two of you kind of doing absolutely everything using whatever space you you had available and those wholesale relationships that you built they were really game-changing weren't you they were some really high profile like Net-A-Porter as an example so just kind of talk me through um you know was that a clear strategy that you had did you kind of fall into some of those relationships because I think that just helped elevate the brand so much no it was a definite clear strategy we became professional stalkers so we had an excel sheet and we had like all the best independent boutiques in the uk on this excel sheet and then on the set on a separate excel sheet or tab it was like all the department stores and all the online pure players and we honestly got their name we got their linkedin we made up email addresses we got that instagram to the point where they were like you tried to work out what their email addresses were oh yeah yeah yeah got their instagram and then we dm them follow them basically we were stalkers then we were like oh my god we saw her on instagram that she just got a puppy at the weekend let's email her on like stalkers like absolutely like worrying to the point where some of them were like look we get it thank you can you stop emailing now but we were like and and back then there wasn't like instagram was only just a thing email was good but we were just calling everyone like every single morning we'd call all the boutiques and we got honestly the phone got put down and there's been like can you stop calling them we were like can we just show we didn't understand we so believed in the product i was like i don't understand why you wouldn't even just look at the product and the price point like i just don't like we so we just believed so much in the product the the gap in the market for us and what we were offering that we were like just give us a chance so how we got around it was some of them we were like look don't pay us we will give you the stock for two weeks or for a month put it in your store and then if it sells call us up so we did that we managed to get like five to ten boutiques within london outside of londonst albans and stuff and within like two weeks they were like oh my god it's all sold we need more so i'd then drive get the stock in my car drop it off to them and it was very much like that so i think once we then kind of they actually had you kind of gave them the kind of chance to have the product in the store then it kind of it just built up from there and then we were then stalkers with them with all the stylists and the press and we're just like kind of like can you meet us like in Whole Foods and we'll show you the collection and then Holly Willoughby wore a blouse then like some of the Made in Chelsea girls wore it to Fashion Week when that was like really big and kind of just emerging 10 yeah 10 years ago um so it kind of just slowly snowballed from there really Whole Foods was a bit of a thing for you wasn't it um so I'm scarred go on tell us about that well we were so embarrassed to tell people that we didn't have an office because everyone was like oh we'll come to you then okay where are you based and we were like in all his bedroom yeah um so yeah whole foods just became and it was it could be the one in the one in fulham or it could be whichever one we were like just let's just meet whole foods for a coffee yeah um so the same was when we needed a um a web developer for our first website i remember we met loads of people and like kind of not interviewed them but they all pitched kind of in whole foods and there were loads of little kids like listening to us and like laughing and we were like oh my god this is more like what are we doing um but then i think we met similar people on a similar level to us when they were like kind of just setting up their e-com agency or something so it was actually quite nice in a way where they were kind of starting off and they were willing to kind of do it for quite cheap because they wanted to have a brand on their portfolio even though our brand wasn't big so that's kind of how we did it but yeah whole foods yeah was our office for about two years and so as you're starting to put the e-com side of things together and obviously then you need proper shoots of your product they're kind of like sellotaping it up onto the wall it's not going to quite cut it anymore so um I said I was going to pick up on your propensity to talk to strangers and um but I believe there is a bit of a story around that first photo shoot yeah so this was when our office probably it was Costa Coffee that day it was in a retail park in Costa Coffee I don't know what we were doing there but anyway we were there and then Ola and I were both working on our laptops so that was the biggest expense we had through the business was our laptops and then we got this camera and nothing else we and then And obviously stock, but we managed to get good payment terms on that.

24:59So we didn't have to pay for that straight away. And yeah, this guy was next to us and he looked a little bit, not troubled, troubled. He was really sweet, but he was like really inquisitive, kept on asking us questions and stuff. But he was a bit smelly, to put it politely. And then he ended up telling us, we were saying, oh, we're just working on like kind of, we set up a brand. And we got talking to him. And then we said, oh, we're looking for like a quite cool location, but we don't have any money for our lot. and he was like oh I'm a squatter and I live in this really cool building and it's like all art deco and he was selling it to us and he was quite artsy himself in a way um and we were like oh right okay well do you want to where is it and he was like oh it's 10 minutes down the road and we were like oh well we've got our car outside do you want to just show us and we'll just have a quick look at it I think my mum would have killed me but anyway I was just gonna say as a mother now if your daughter phoned you off yeah yeah exactly so you're following this man 10 minutes did you let him in your car yeah he was in the back seat in the car me and all of a driving and then we were kind of like the windows were down and we were driving and then we got to this building and we were like oh my god it was just really cool it was like an old office block i had an art deco big staircase and we were like oh my god and we were like can we shoot here and he was like yeah and he was like the lights really good it's like as if he owns it yeah he was showing us around he was like the light he was like the light's really good in the morning from here blah blah so we're like brilliant so we were like location sorted model i used one of the girls actually i I worked with her at ASOS and she was really sweet.

26:25So Gillian was our first model and she was a friend. And then we wanted like an older model as well. So we spotted Anne who had grey hair and she was in like then all our London Fashion Week shows and stuff. And she's just a gorgeous woman. How did you meet Anne? In the gym, in the changing rooms. I think she was like probably getting changed half naked. And we were like, oh, we just saw this gorgeous grey hair that she was clothing. drang and we were like oh my god she's gorgeous and we asked her and she was like quite cool and bohemian herself and she's like yeah sure she's like my boyfriend will drop me off just give me the location we'll turn up and stuff so we had ann gillian squatter um and then uh we actually did get a photographer but then ola's twin sister was an architect and in the office she had a girl that was doing like studying hair and makeup on the side she was like oh i'll come and do the hair and makeup and stuff and yeah so we did this shoot and it probably cost us around 200 pounds And that was your first lookbook, was it?

27:19And it went into Grazia, it went into all these different publications. And the imagery was really beautiful. And it kind of just set us aside from having this younger, beautiful model, an older lady as well. And the prints were really vibrant, but it felt really vintage-inspired. So that was our first shoot. And so let's kind of stick with that style that you've got, because there's a few things that I feel that you've done really, really differently with Rixo. So you are vintage inspired, but you still manage to keep what you're doing fresh and current. And so just kind of talk me through that creative side of it and how you see the brand.

27:57Yeah, definitely. I think it's like, Oliver and I love a vintage fair, but you can find the most gorgeous dress in a vintage fair, but it doesn't fit or it's got a hole in or it's either not in the right material. So it's kind of getting that gorgeous kind of the essence of what you love from a vintage fair, but then making it, timeless for today's woman and also it's got to be a bit effortless it's got to fit them right so it's kind of taking all the beautiful elements of that vintage piece but then putting it into a garment that's suitable for today's lifestyle so you can wear it with a flat you can wear it with a heel it's just the right midi length and so I think that's kind of what it is it's got to be fit for the contemporary woman and women today are just busy like they're just they need to kind of be able to like put something on in the morning and actually be able to then wear it later on in the evening and kind of just took a heel on or style it in their own way so I think it's definitely about kind of taking the essence of what's beautiful about a vintage garment but then making it effortless for today's contemporary woman and I've heard you talk about that kind of every time you take one of the rixo dresses out the wardrobe you fall in love with it again and it's it's that sort of it's timeless but it's also seasonless isn't it because you feel like you can wear these items all year round and you're going to come back to them again and again and again and was that kind of purposeful or is that something that your customers have fed back to you that they feel about the dresses I'm just interested yeah I think it's a bit of both as well and we didn't from an early stage because we bought such tight quantities and they would sell out we never had to go into a sale so for the first pretty much fact it was only Covid that forced us to go into like pretty much our first online sale we were just selling full price the whole time so the customer knew she wasn't waiting out to kind of get that so then when she had that piece she would then wear it so today like last week we had a London Fashion Week party in our flagship store and it was just so nice to see customers wearing their pieces and they almost compete to be like oh I discovered you in 2017 and this is my piece and like they're wearing it and they were like they'll tell you the story of where they got it from and it's like actually that piece is like seven years old and it's still gorgeous and you remember the story around it and they're all so special so I think for me that's one of the most rewarding things is seeing our customers and even the girls now that come and work for us and come to interviews and they'll wear their first piece to be like I knew I've been a fan for like ages I love the brand I've been following this story and And so it's really nice to have customers that can actually still wear, because there's not many brands where actually you've got something from seven years ago or six years ago or four years ago that you still love and it feels timeless and relevant, I guess, for five years later.

30:22So I thought we'd try and give the listeners a bit of a sense of what your style is. So I've got some quick fire questions so that we can kind of try and bring it to life. So first question, if you could only accessorise with handbags or shoes to splurge on for the rest of your life, which would it be?

30:42shoes you can have shoes you don't have to be barefoot but you just to splurge on for a collection which one are you going to lean towards shoes shoes um if you had to wear sequins every day of your life or wear black every day of your life which would you choose black definitely we do yeah definitely i couldn't do sequins every day that's not me uh would you choose to dress like 1920s flapper or would you put on an iconic 80s power suit 80s 80s power suit and if you could only wear one print for the rest of your life would you go polka dot or leopard print and i can tell you where it's gotta be and then i guess my final question has to be of all the iconic pieces that you've had from rick so is the one that stands out to you as your kind of favorite piece that you've designed?

31:34I think our Evie dress is one of my favourites. It's been kind of fit and tweaked over the years, but it was named after my mum's first grandchild and kind of our first niece into the family. So Evie's now nearly 17, which is crazy. But the Evie dress, yeah, stood the test of time and it was based off a vintage dress of my mum's. So that's kind of a dress that I absolutely adore. Oh, that's lovely. And brings us on to motherhood quite nicely. So you're now mum to two children yourself. yeah um so tell me a little bit about the the juggle the balance is it possible to have it all kind of how's it going um the juggle's real um but I'm really lucky I've got such a supportive partner so I think it allows me to kind of thrive at work and then when I'm at work I'm fully focused on Rick so and then when I come home and weekends and stuff I'm fully committed to the family so I think it's difficult to have it all in all honesty you've got to kind of but you've got to be comfortable with what what you want out of your life and I think for me it's it's work and my social life is I guess throughout work like if I'm out in the week in London and then when I come home it's purely family so I'd say my social life probably isn't isn't isn't the best you don't go out oh no I'm just sad Friday night is bed bath time story time yeah just time to catch up with my husband I guess and see him um so yeah no that's kind of my weekend is kind of at the park and with the little boys they're only they're only young so and you just seem really comfortable with it and I agree with you I think if you're trying to do a demanding job if you've got family you know obviously there's other social things that you'd like to do the truth is you can't always fit everything into a week but I think what I often see is that women really struggle with it and they feel guilty about different aspects of it and I think it you know you've you sound very much like you're just comfortable with these are the things that I need to do and I don't feel guilty about it that's just the way I've done it is that something you've had to learn to be kind to yourself about or have you always just kind of felt okay with it no it was really hard actually more the social life I think when we first started Rixo I would kind of get the fear of missing out because I'd be like oh my god all my friends are going out and then you they stop inviting you to things and you're like oh and and that is a bit kind of but you have to then and then I was like then when I got pregnant I was the first out of all my friends to kind of get pregnant and have a kid so I was like there's just no way now I can go out on these social things so no wonder kind of so things like that I think it does kind of it gets you a little bit but then you when you actually put the shoe on the other foot you're like well I kind of get it if they've been inviting you out for years and you're not going then why would they carry like so there is a little bit of that so it has taken a while like over the 10 years to actually kind of get to a place where I'm just really comfortable with it but I think when you're a mum your priorities just change like all I care about after work is the boys and like them being happy and spending time with them so your priorities do change but I think it has taken me my eldest is three years old and it's taken me three years to kind of get to that stage where I'm like fully kind of comfortable with it because it was having my first child I found really difficult kind of like how do I then because I felt so guilty on Rick so I was like oh my god like how can I not be at Rick so 24-7 and then how can I not it was really I found that really difficult so it took me the first year of having Wolf was actually really difficult I I think it's it's hardest with you first because it's the mindset change of I can't give everything that I was giving to the thing that I was doing before and I found it hard to be honest going from one to two because then by that point I felt like I was giving everything to my first child then when number two came along I was like I felt like I was not only neglecting work but neglecting the first one as well but I think that definitely the shift the first one it's just a big lifestyle change yeah no I did find that really hard and I think if I look back at the 10 years of Rick so that about seven yeah seven years and having that was really difficult and also it was I kind of then moved out of London so I was having to commute back and forth and it was just it's just exhausting having a kid when they're kind of and I went back to work after 10 weeks and it was it was difficult yeah but you get through it and you get stronger yeah yeah and obviously you've got two boys so is is there going to be like a boy version of the Vixo stuff coming out are they going to have any nice shirts that come out in any of the nice prints the first question any husband or boyfriend asks they're like can I be a model when's the men's wear coming and I'm like men are so confident aren't they like would you ever meet a woman and be like I'll be your model um so men we get asked all the time um which is really funny I mean eventually I'd never say never but I think at the moment we've just got so much to conquer just within women's wear and like broadening the categories outside of dresses and separates and outerwear and knitwear and then international expansion so not for the foreseeable yeah well I was going to say to you what's coming next but you've just like you know broadening the range broadening the international horizons and and you've done all of it so far without taking any external investment haven't you so just kind of tell me what what is next what's the vision over the next couple of years yeah I think we still want to remain kind of where all of our eye are the sole owners of the brand and try and avoid investment where we can just I think we feel so passionate that we've still got so much more we want to do with Rick so it's not like our ideas have run out or we're not passionate about it so we're still really determined to kind of keep keep going that being said we need to be really careful and strict with cash flow management and allowing us to have growth but it's got to be sustainable growth where we can then pump the money back into the business so yeah it's going to be a difficult juggle but I think we can do it yeah I know it feels like there's bright things ahead and that momentum I mean I forwarded you an article that I saw just yesterday kind of the momentum of the press internationally picking up on the brand and starting to really resonate over in the US as well which must just feel like a massive opportunity for you yeah definitely really excited about that I mean we're tiny it's like a needle in a haystack over there so we launched our first New York store last year turned on digital marketing in the states so definitely and like we're launching collaborations this year with partners in the US so there's definitely a lot of kind of groundwork to do I feel like we're starting afresh there but it's a new challenge um and exciting and let's hope that Trump doesn't throw in any any spanners yeah spanners in the world for sure he will but I mean And it'll be, yeah, so it'll be a really good challenge for us.

37:39And it's good learning as well in regards to what product resonates over there and how we can attract some brilliant talent that have been there and done that and grown an international retail business. And it's like, what are the next steps for XO? I just love the mindset as well. It's, you know, there's so many businesses that grow so much more in one jurisdiction and it almost becomes a mental block about really going after some of the international markets and the fact that you've just really started off with that global mindset. I mean, I think it just heralds great things to come. So I always like to finish off doing these interviews with kind of leaving a few nuggets for anybody that sat there that would like to set up their own business or has got some sort of like entrepreneurial spirit kind of hidden away inside them.

38:26So what would be your advice to somebody in their early 20s that feels like they've got an idea, whatever it is, to kind of take the leap of faith that you did? I think I'd say, first of all, I think it's easy to say, oh, just start and get going and stuff. And there's never going to be a good time. So I think there's always going to be something, whether it's like, oh, there's a holiday or a friend's wedding or you've got this job at work and there could be a promotion or you want to finish this project. So I think there's never a good time. So kind of you've got to become comfortable with that.

38:55Whenever you start it, it is going to be daunting. But I think always just think like everyone is just one person at the end of the day. everyone's got 24 hours in the day like no one's some superhero that's got magic powers or anything like everyone is just one individual so don't kind of think that it's unattainable because it's not you can learn on the job and also people like helping people like we asked so many people went for so many coffees and I think you've got to know what you want to get from a conversation you can't just say oh can I have a catch-up and you don't really know it's a bit of an ambling conversation because people's time is quite precious especially if they're successful and you want advice from them so I think asking people as well like people are willing to share their journeys and help you along the way but yeah I'd say probably there's there's never a good time but just go for it yeah yeah definitely I'm the worst convinced right here to any of my friends that want to do something I'm like just do it yeah why not that's like a nice action orientated ending so um thank you so much for sharing the story with us it's incredible I have got absolutely no doubt that you'll continue to make a massive success of everything that you're doing with Rickso.

40:00So very well done. And I'm looking forward to more of those press releases. Oh, well, thank you for having me and for listening, I guess.

40:10You've been listening to the Business Leader Podcast. A thanks to Henrietta Ricks and Victoria Price. I'm Graeme Roddick. Our producer is Anushka Tate. If you've enjoyed this episode, then please follow the Business Leader Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts to get updates when new episodes go live.

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