Trump & Vance Attack El-Sayed as AOC Campaigns with Him

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0:46Hyperbound, a YC-backed startup, used Vanta to unlock the Fortune 100 in under a year. Snowfire got audit ready in a month and closed a multi-million dollar deal. Trust matters. Get started at Vanta.com. Tonight, all eyes on Michigan as the president attacks. He's a Muslim Brotherhood guy. A candidate gets a visitor. Trump administration is doing specifically is attacking women's ability to get an education. And gives his take on Trump voters. We've got to help those folks. They're paying for$5 guys too. Plus, the donor list for Donald Trump's ballroom is revealed. and despite promises, he's not on it.

1:28And I'm paying for it. Also, is the U.S. on the verge of abandoning Ukraine? The urgent new developments may be a turning point in the war. And we need to expand the Supreme Court. Kamala Harris gives a controversial take about the fate of the Supremes. Live at the table, Charles Blow, May Millman, Ashley Allison, Horace Cooper, and Geraldo Rivera. Americans with different perspectives aren't talking to each other, but here they do.

2:12Good evening. I'm Abby Phillip in New York. Tonight, if the Republican outlook for the midterms wasn't grim enough, President Trump is preemptively assigning the blame for a potential loss in at least one Senate race. In a post, he calls out Senator John Cornyn and his little buddy, super rhino, Karl Rove. He says that their opposition to the Republican Senate candidate, Ken Paxton, is hurting Texas and the U.S. overall. And if Paxton ultimately loses, it would be because of, quote, weak and ineffective political hacks like Cornyn and Rove. And in the other critical race, about 1 ,100 miles north of Texas, Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez joined Michigan Senate candidate Abdul El-Sayed on the campaign trail as the vice president and the president attack the Democrat.

3:01The race there is razor thin. And in a state that Trump won by just 80 ,000 votes in 2024, Trump's approval rating is now at an all-time low. Flipping people who voted for Trump is key to El-Sayed's victory. He has an interesting message, though, to his supporters about that. And his neat trick is to become the subject of every conversation and to force people to take sides. And here's the thing about it. Once you take sides, he's forcing you to double down on crazier and crazier stuff. And soon enough, you're out here signing on to a bunch of things that like three years ago, you're like, that's insane.

3:41And you know it's insane. But here's the problem. you don't want to have to face down that one friend who's going to tell you I told you so and so what happens is that you keep doubling down on the craziest stuff and you find yourself so far gone up that tree that there's no way you can climb down we've got to help those folks because guess what they're paying for five dollar gas too we've got to be the folks who can rebuild that bound of humanity re-invite them back Now, before we open it up to the table here, we invite you at home to join the debate. Go to CNN.com slash Abby. You can weigh in there.

4:21We'll get to some of your comments as we go throughout the show tonight. Ashley, it seems like a lot of the argument that is being made on the right against El Zayed are basically he's not American enough. El Zayed is trying to do the pivot from the primary to the midterms. And I'm trying to strike more of a conciliatory tone toward Republican leaning voters. What does that tell you about where this race is? I mean, the race is close. Interestingly enough, I sat down with him on Monday for my outlet The Root. And I talked to him about that exact thing, about where how are you going to build the coalition that Kamala Harris could not build in 2024?

5:03And the thing he said to me was that the thing I've said in the primary is the thing I'm saying today. and I am being consistent. And I think I will be able to win voters is because I'm not changing because of my donors. I'm not changing because it's a general election. I am who I am. I do think that the Republican Party has tried to paint him and use racist attacks, quite honestly, anti-Islamophobic postures towards him. Now, you don't have to agree with his position. That's democracy to debate. But there is this tone, this anti-Islamic tone towards his candidacy. And he literally said out of his mouth, it breaks my heart because I love this country so much because I know if I wasn't born in this country, the opportunities that I wouldn't have, that I have now that I don't wouldn't have in other countries.

5:50And so he is going out and telling that message, but also telling people he is fighting with them, not against them. He is for them. And he will deliver that for him if he's elected. Let me play what to your point about the how he's dealing with the attacks on his essentially his loyalty to America. Here's what he said after J.D. Vance essentially questioned his commitment to this country. Listen. He wanted to raise questions about my commitment to America. And let me tell you, nobody understands how deep and profound the gift of this country is like a kid who was born here but for the accident of history that allowed that to happen.

6:35They've been saying all kinds of things, trying to point to my name and my faith, telling me, oh, you can't win an election. His name's Abdul. He's a Muslim. Yeah, I'm a Muslim. But I also understand that my allegiance is to a constitution. It's a document they don't understand very well. So, May, I mean, why is it that Republicans are focusing so much on how American he is? Well, I disagree that that is the focus. I think affordability is the focus. They're talking about how Michigan has the highest gas prices. I would say that his endorsement of all sorts of giveaway policies, the Council of Economic Advisers said that these DSA policies, including Medicare for All, which he has endorsed, is going to raise the national debt by$45 trillion, and that's going to cost people in GDP, which is going to cost people in their hourly wages.

7:32So, yes, affordability is definitely the number one target. But also, I think it's an authenticity issue. So when he goes on TV and says, I have no connection to the Muslim Brotherhood and my family doesn't, and then when his sister says that they do, and he's confronted with that, Instead of explaining it, he says, how dare you ask me about that? That authenticity problem, I think, is an issue for Michigan voters. There's two problems there. So both of us have talked to El Saeed in the last two weeks. I went out to Michigan and interviewed him, went to a couple of his rallies. If you watch television in Michigan, as I did watch all the commercials, listen to all the commercials, it really is Islamophobic.

8:12Nobody's bringing up the affordability issues. But because it is. But I'm just going to finish this. What you just said about their focus on affordability, that's not what they're focused on. And when you watch Roger's interviews the last couple of days with that watch, he's not talking about affordability. He's talking about issues about his identity. And one of the really interesting things about the El-Sayed campaign, I wrote about this for The Guardian, I was pressing him that he should be more engaged in identity politics. There is not a single mention on his entire website, in his priorities section, of black people, African Americans, these words, Latin, Hispanic.

8:52He doesn't deal with his own. When they played that clip and he said Muslim, he didn't say it all day. I went to two rallies. He didn't say the worst. He would say people are concerned, worried about who I pray to rather than what I pray for. He was kind of doing illusory references to it. He's avoiding this. And it is Republicans that are hammering the idea of his identity as a problem for him and for Michiganders. The second thing that you said was that there's this issue around whether or not a parent, an Australian parent, by the way, because she was divorced from his father when he was three years old.

9:32and she moved away, she got remarried, moved back to the Middle East. But a parent's involvement with any kind of connection to a terrorist group is a problem. Is that what you're saying? I do think if your parent is a terrorist, that is a problem. That's not what he's saying. So are you also now about to disown Donald Trump and condemn him? Is his parent a terrorist? Yeah, well, you laugh. So in June 1st. That's a fair question. Okay, let me answer it then. Since you're laughing, it's funny to you. On June 1st, 1927, in Queens, there was a giant Klan rally. Right. A thousand Klan's men got into a scuffle with 100 police officers.

10:20And when the dust settled, only seven people were arrested. One of those people was Fred Trump. That's interesting that that is the same name as the president's father, right? Okay. Right? No, no, no. You're not going to stop me now because you were laughing before. It's like complaining about the weather. I'm sorry. I can laugh some more. Well, then keep laughing because I'm going to keep going. And then when his bail was posted, it was reported in a newspaper where his address was. Interestingly, it was the same address as the president's father. So either there were two 21-year-olds at a Klan rally in Queens on June 1st, 1927, or they are the same person.

11:01And there were two groups involved, Klan members and their supporters and police officers. And Fred Trump was not a police officer. So the basic math is two minus one equals this one left. What does that have to do? You don't work for the New York Times anymore. I know that. You ain't working. Where are you going? Let's just be clear. When I see this in print, I can verify and validate what's going on. Horace, that story has been reported many times. Many, many times. Many millions of times. It's not breaking news, but I also want to just make one point about the familial issue. As Charles just pointed out, Abdul El-Sayed was not raised by his biological mother.

11:47His parents divorced when he was three. He doesn't have that kind of relationship with her. So the idea that he would be... That's not what May said, though. But the idea that he would be tarred and feathered for a Muslim Brotherhood connection... That's not what May said. What May said was... That, frankly, A, is not verified, and B, does not actually say anything about how he was raised. He was raised here in Michigan. What May said was... Is the issue that he is... asked this question and his answers are incoherent. Well, no. That's a problem. She also said that it's a problem. The connection was the problem.

12:27Based on your... To answer the question. Is that a problem for you now? And he said, to his knowledge, he is not aware of any connections with the Muslim Brotherhood. And you know what? You can take that up with him, but the insinuation is that he is a member of the Muslim Brotherhood. Exactly, because he is Muslim. Because here's, okay, here's Donald Trump. And that is Islamophobia. And here's Donald Trump, and just pay attention, not just to what Trump is saying, but how Abdul El-Sayed is responding to it. Listen. His name is Abdul, but I think I call him Mohammed Abdul El-Sayed, and he's a Muslim Brotherhood guy, 100%.

13:10He's taken to calling me Mohammed, which is my middle name. I got a lot of names. And the funny thing is, Abdul just means servant. Mohammed means the praised one. So he didn't realize he took me from servant to praised one. Cool. However, he decides to say it, we're going to make sure he has to say it with the word senator in front of him in November.

13:35This is why I disagree with Charles Blow and his idea that we ought to embrace identity politics. We don't need to focus on anyone's background. It's good for him that he doesn't put black or Latino or any of these things. What are you doing? You just fucking know the other thing. It sounds, Charles, like he's critiquing. Are you critiquing Donald Trump here? Is that what you're saying? Put your hands down. Put your hands down. Put your hands down. Put your hands down. I'm not in your face. The person using identity politics in this scenario is the president. He stood right here in the show and said, we need to have more.

14:15Hold on a second. Hold on. Horace, are you are you saying that Donald Trump is wrong? I said two people can be wrong, Abby. Two people. I just want to hear you say the words. Are you going to say it? I don't agree that the president should engage in identity politics. And the problem, as I see it, is this is a progressive policy of using identity politics. When the president does it, all of a sudden he gets called out. When the left does it all the time, there is silence. I don't have a problem with identity politics, honestly. It makes me great. Isn't the issue that here this is now the front page that his half-sister was this or that and he and Mohammed and all the rest of it?

15:03I'm a pragmatic idealist. That's the reality that people are thinking in the back of their minds that this is a radical Muslim person and is scaring the hell out of Jewish people and others in Michigan. Why not embrace the mainstream of the Democratic Party and surround yourself with all of these American, indisputably white people that just... Because you don't need to be... Oh my God. No, wait. This is what happens to me. I'm not... I'm not understanding. That is identity politics. Honestly, I want to understand what you're saying, Rado. Finish what you're saying. AOC is my favorite politician in America.

15:42I'm very proud of her. I'm proud of everything that she's accomplished. Okay. I would, and do you think that the people in northern Michigan are going to look at AOC and say, well, now I'm more likely to take the chance with El Saeed than I would before? So you're suggesting that he should campaign more with white people than with AOC? If you want to be as blunt as that, white people, black people, American people. I'm just trying. AOC is American. Oh, my. It is. I'm a Puerto Rican. I think we should call time out. I don't care if you're Puerto Rican. It's so offensive. It is. It's so offensive.

16:16I just think. It's so offensive. You want her to get a left hand on? No, no. It's so offensive. One at a time. Go ahead, Charles. I went to a rally of his in Michigan. You can't tell race of anybody. Would you understand? Of course, please. Go ahead, Charles. Now, so I counted the, trying to see how many people were percentage I thought were white and how many I thought were other races. You can't always tell. So you were engaging. Hold on, guys. Will you let me finish? I wasn't interrupted. Exactly. Hold on a second. Let's just do this one at a time. And I went back to his campaign. So I said, I know that I can tell roughly how many were black.

16:51I'm going to say one in 10. The vast majority of people in that rally, in a city where 60 % of the population is black, The vast majority of people in that rally were white. That man did not engage in any identity politics, and he was surrounded by white people. But why didn't he? And that still is not enough for you. That still is not enough for you. Why didn't he surround himself with black leaders? It is so offensive. Why didn't he have black leaders? And you want to close the gap? This is what happens when you come on TV and talk and you haven't been there. Hold on, Gerardo. So he did have black leaders.

17:25Hold on, Gerardo. He did have black units introduce him. Ashley, go ahead. Here's the thing. Now what you got to say. I don't have a problem with identity politics because I actually think it's diversity that makes this country great. I think it would be great for us to have our first Muslim senator. I think there are people who are terrified of that, not because of their policies, but because they have biases towards Muslim people. And the only way we can get ahead and get away from that is to have frank and honest conversations. When I did sit down with El-Sayed, it was about the black vote, because right now in the primary, a lot of the black vote went to Haley Stevens.

18:04And I asked him and he talked about the historical tension between black and brown communities and Dearborn and Detroit. And he understood the experience of black people and the experience of black people are different than the experience of a Puerto Rican in this country and are different than now. Now, he is making a strategy. He is making a strategy to go talk to AOC. And let me tell you why he's making that strategy, to go up to the Upper Peninsula and talk to AOC. It's because right now, AOC is quite popular. That is probably why you're proud of her and of all of her accomplishments. But she also can go into southern communities and talk about data centers, which is really important right now to Michigan, about the clean water that they're stripping out of communities, about them not being union jobs.

18:45She can talk about how expensive the price of gas is. Be brutal. Be brutal about it. He needs black people to vote for him. He needs black people. Where's Barack Obama? I want President Obama. He'll be there next week. Kamala Harris was there before. He'll be there next week, and a whole bunch of other folks will be there again. The problem is you need more than just one type of person. You have to build a coalition. You need white people. You need black people. You need people who used to vote for Donald Trump and might come over. And guess what? I think he can get that. You know what's the best argument against Mike Rogers?

19:17Florida. That's the best argument. And he makes that argument, too. Florida is a tan and a tan handicap and he lives in Florida. All right, we're going to leave it there, guys. The best argument against him? Yeah. And what's in those ads up against Mike Rogers? I haven't. Darkened shades of his face. The fact that he is not one of us. That is not the economy. That is not cost of living. That is Islamophobia. All right, we're going to leave it there. Next for us, the Post gets a secret list of ballroom donors from tech giants to someone whose family member got a pardon from Trump. But there's one name that's raising eyebrows, and it's not on the list.

19:53Plus, breaking news tonight, we are learning that the order to restrict Star Shield intelligence from Ukraine came from inside the White House. Is the president on the verge of abandoning Ukraine? We'll debate.

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20:59For days, we have been wondering whether the president is on the verge of abandoning Ukraine. Well, breaking tonight, another explosive sign. Reuters is reporting that an order to restrict a SpaceX satellite system used by Ukraine came from inside the White House. when Pentagon officials received a message asking to slow it down. Now, keep in mind, Elon Musk's Star Shield service is used for battlefield communications and drone operations. It's a technology that saves lives against oncoming attacks. It's not clear who ordered the restriction or who was responsible for implementing that order. And the White House claims it wasn't Trump.

21:38But for some context, in recent days, Volodymyr Zelensky says Trump betrayed Ukraine with his deal with Russian oil. Ukraine has restarted its attacks on refineries since Russia has as well, despite Trump asking them both not to. And Ukraine has now run out of Patriot missiles, which is a red alarm in its fight against Russia. This is a very serious situation. And this Reuters report seems to confirm what Ukrainian officials had said, which is that the Starshield technology, which allows them to operate these drones at high speeds and allows them to be accurate, was basically being throttled. They could only go so fast, and that limited their ability to respond.

22:22And in response to that, Zelensky says that Russia has launched 124 drones overnight alone. He said this on Wednesday, and another 145 during the day. In terms of scale, this is one of the largest attacks. It's clear that the Russians are trying to take advantage of the problems with Starlink in Ukraine, and our interceptor drones depend on this connection, among other things. So it's creating a very clear opening in the battlefield for Russia right now. And it's awful, and it's breaking my heart, and I hate to think of the United States of America standing by, and not only just standing by, but maliciously intervening by ordering these systems to operate at a slower, a slower speed.

23:11There's a picture that CNN has been showing today of a mother clutching a little baby's hand under the rubble. And when you see these people that the mother was obviously trying to comfort the child when the Russian missile or bomb exploded. And so, I mean, a picture tells a thousand words. It was so humiliating to think that my government is willfully withholding what this heroic nation, defending itself against this monstrous neighbor. I mean, it's just the worst. It's so disheartening. And you just, it's pathetic. It is. I mean, this is a really active battlefield. And it's hard to understand.

24:00But I mean, May, do you have an understanding of what the White House's and Trump's rationale is for throwing Ukraine under the bus in this particular moment? Well, A, I think we're dealing all with anonymous leaks, and so I'm sure we have only part of the story. But if you look at historically the presidencies in which Ukraine has been the most unprotected that has been during Biden and Obama, and President Trump is trying to end this war. Now, it's very difficult right now because he's telling Ukraine not to attack Russian energy sources, but Biden did the exact same thing. And I think that some of this...

24:42How is he trying to end the war? He has been trying to end the war. Hold on, I'm talking... They were just negotiating this week. But what is the strategy? If I knew the strategy, I would probably not tell the story. It seems like the president has been putting the squeeze on Ukraine, letting Putin have a pass, and I don't see how that advances an effort to end the war. He is continuing to increase European support for Ukraine. So, one, when Biden was in office, he would give enough missiles to sort of defend yourself, but not replenish and not take payment for them, especially from Europe. And so there was no way to build the defense industrial base.

25:22A strong America comes from a lot of a multi-pronged strategy that you might not all just see of like, and he's been working with. You're talking about Biden. I'm asking about Trump. What is Trump doing to end the war? For one thing, a mediator doesn't take one particular side and only pursue it. He has to work with both sides. So then where's the evidence that he's pressuring Russia as much as he's pressuring Ukraine? We have sanctions up the wazoo. The former senator from South Carolina who died, he signed that. I know you were around last week when he announced that he was going to free up hundreds of millions of barrels of gas from Russia onto the global market so that Russia can have a multi-billion dollar windfall in the middle of the war.

26:15Again, he's under my... I agree with you. Lindsey Graham would be rolling over in his grave right now. That is a mischaracterization. Those are not my words. Those are what other Republicans have been saying. What you just said is a mischaracterization. He would be rolling over in his grave, according to other Republicans, because this is exactly what he was trying to prevent from happening. OK, Abby. So why is the president doing it? The blank check days for Ukraine are over. That was the Biden administration. So now the president Trump campaigned on saying we're going to have loans. So we're going to have royalty agreements.

26:51We're going to have. Why are we writing a blank check to Russia? You're saying that they are going to end Ukrainians. You're not right. That's a mischaracterization. Okay, so then characterize it for me. Okay. We have in America a shortage with regard to diesel fuel. And we are saying to both of the parties that we are trying to mediate. We'd like an interim assistance. What about the release of Russian diesel onto the global market, which is in defiance of U.S. sanctions? What about that? That's a waiver, as I just said. Why do we have that? As a way to bring... That is also called a blank check.

27:29That is not called a blank check. That's a mischaracterization, Abby. Putin is getting a rainfall of money that they would not otherwise have. That is a mischaracterization. He is losing trillions. Because the president is undermining U.S.'s actual existing policy in order to make that happen. Russia? And Horace... That is not true. You can say it. You can interrupt me while I try to speak. So tell me. So tell me. What's the impact going to be on the cost of diesel? It will have some ameliorative effect. What is the impact? Probably a two, three, a four cent drop. But that's not my point. My point is Russia has lost over a trillion dollars.

28:06Its GDP is impacted right now. Russia gets billions of dollars for us to get a three cent discount on diesel for a couple of days. First of all, of course, you said it's a blank check. Like, May, you said the Biden administration wasn't doing enough. So I don't know where. But the rhetoric was a blank check. We just listened to you do this whole thing that you do. No, you didn't. I got interrupted the whole time. And you're still talking. I'm still going to interrupt you because it's too much. It's just too much. So here's the problem, though. I don't necessarily think that Donald Trump is trying to settle the war, get us out of the war.

28:44I think Donald Trump is trying to get headlines for a midterm. He is trying. He looks at diesel. He realizes it is expensive. He realizes that people look at that and say, this is costing me something. He wants to get something out of the diesel market in advance of the midterms. And he is willing to give it, throw a bone to Russia to get it. And that's a real problem. Wait, wait, wait. I was agreeing with you on everything. I don't need you to agree with me on anything. I need you to be quiet. Well, you're in error. You are always in error. Horace, just stop for a second. Okay. Please. Listen.

29:18The diesel prices are high not because of Ukraine attacking Russia, but because of the Iran war. Exactly. And if Trump really wanted to rectify this diesel issue, he would actually solve the energy crisis that has been caused by the Iran. And I think the thing that is so contradictory in this moment is that many folks sit at this table and talk about eliminate Iran by any means necessary. And I used to think that that was a similar posture for our enemy Russia. But there seems to be a compromised posture now that if it will help Donald Trump in this interim for midterms, we can take a more passive approach.

30:04I just grew up thinking Russia was the enemy. Understanding. It's not the country itself. It's the regime, right? So when people don't say eliminate Iran, there are great and amazing people. He literally has said that. He literally has said that. The reason you would want to destroy the Iranian regime is the Iranian people don't deserve a terrorist leader. The Russian people deserve Vladimir Putin. He literally said he was going to wipe out the Iranians. That's what I mean. Russia is getting a windfall from diesel. then they're turning around and they're using that money to undermine our troops in Iran.

30:40Yeah. So you've got to... No, no, no. When did we jump to Iran? It's all... We have sort of... Hold on, hold on, hold on. Did you follow that? He said... They were too busy. He said the support from Iran to Russia is going to Iran. Yes. Going to Russia to spend in Iran. Horace, you haven't seen the reports from U.S. intelligence that Russia is helping Iran? Right. And I have not. You haven't seen that? Oh, yes, sir. You haven't seen the testimony from the Defense Secretary, Pete Hegseth, under oath on Capitol Hill, where he says that Russia is supporting Iran? You haven't seen that? I saw that back in January and February, but I have not seen that since the war broke out.

31:26Let me just tell you. Wait. The war? Hold on a second. Hold on a second. I'm here to inform you that that is what is happening. Okay? So what Geraldo just said is correct. It is correct. Russia is not just waging a war against Ukraine, but they are acting against us. They are our enemy, working with our enemies. They are helping Iran target our bases where our service members are being killed. Secretary Rubio says that they've had conversations with Putin and that they are not doing this. So you can tell me that you have no... My man Horace, I know you are not going to believe the word of Vladimir Putin.

32:12Okay. That is basically what you're standing on. No, I believe Rubio. All right. And do you think Vladimir Putin would lie to Rubio? Listen, let me just be clear. That is not what Rubio said, okay? That actually may be what the president said, but that is actually in contravention of what his own intelligence agencies are also saying. So let's just leave that there. The truth is so hard. Next for us, The Washington Post reveals the big donors for Trump's ballroom construction. But one key player isn't on the list, and it's the president himself. We'll debate that.

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33:23A new report is shedding light on who exactly is paying for President Trump's White House ballroom. The Washington Post says that it obtained secret documents revealing major donors behind the$330 million that Trump has collected so far for his prize project. The list includes names like Apple and NVIDIA, which contributed$25 million. There's also Lockheed Martin, Palantir, Comcast, Amazon, Meta, and Coinbase, which all committed$10 million or less. The Post notes its reporting doesn't establish a connection between donations and favorable actions by the Trump administration. But the documents show a vast majority of the funds came from companies and wealthy individuals with interests before the federal government.

34:07Noticeably absent from this list, though, is Trump, even though he has promised that he would donate last year. And I'm paying for it. I'm paying for it. The country is not, and that's an expensive ballroom. It would actually be a beautiful addition. It's going to cost nothing. I'll spend the whole thing myself. I think there'll be nothing like it. And it's being paid for 100 % by me.

34:33Shocked. I am absolutely shocked that Trump has not committed a dime to his ballroom. The presidency is young. Oh. We still have two years. You don't have to defend this. But when he says me, you know, he means me as in not the taxpayer. And so not like my personal opinion. No, that's not what he means. Me and the zero me? No, no, no. That's not what he meant. He meant me as in I'm worth$7 billion on paper. I'm a lot of you. Where's the money? Okay. So, all right. We can see for the next two years every day. We can go check and see whether President Trump has donated. But I think people are, you know, this was a big story because people wanted to know who paid for it.

35:11And I think at the end of the day, private donations for public works is a pretty common thing. Ever since Jackie Kennedy took money through the White House Historical Association to pay for White House renovations, Smithsonian, Carnegie Libraries. This is very common. Why is it being kept like a state secret? That's the thing I don't understand. But why is it even a story as long as we're not paying for it? Well, because, let me answer that. First of all, it is a secret. The reason The Washington Post has this is because it's disclosed, but because they obtained it, which the White House called a leak.

35:48But let me give you just one example of why you might, as a taxpayer or as an American, be concerned. There was an individual, a Venezuelan-Italian banker, who was indicted on bribery charges. His daughter donated to a Trump PAC first and then agreed to donate$25 million about a month after her father's charges were reduced to a misdemeanor in a plea agreement. He was pardoned by Trump. And this whole arrangement in which people who are getting, we don't know what happened here, but you're getting a pardon from the president, but your child is also donating, perhaps on your behalf, not only to the president's political interests, but also to this ballroom.

36:44It raises questions about whether there are favors being done here. It raises questions, but as the Post states, they did not answer. They didn't complete the loop. Sure. But are you curious? Are you curious? Would it be bothersome to you if someone basically paid for a pardon? I think in terms of pardons, if you look beneath the blankets in pardons, the whole sphere is rotten. I mean, there are all these reasons that presidents pardon people. You can't even compare anybody else to Donald Trump's pardon regime. Not even close. I don't mean pardoning your son, maybe. So that one, and then he pardoned every single person who was involved in January 6th, and you were comparing that to one part of Biden's son?

37:34Are you serious? So I will say the other thing that the Washington Post, the reason that they did not connect the dots, is because when you look at the sheer, like the vast number of donors, a lot of them are competitors. Like this is not something that they want. Now, Microsoft, it says donated$10 million. Microsoft has an H-1B program suspended. This is not what Microsoft... Hold on, we have to take a break. But just to be clear, most of the companies that I named have business before this government. And it's not about H-1Bs. It's about billions in government contracts. If it were about H-1Bs, that's small ball by comparison to the type of business that they're doing with the United States government.

38:21A lot more to discuss on this when we come back from a quick break.

38:43no negotiation, no guy from an online listing lowballing you. Which means by the time I'm done explaining this, you could have basically done it.

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39:38Welcome back. As we've been discussing, President Trump's ballroom, to the tune of$330 million, is being funded by a secret list of corporations and individuals. And one of the reasons this is very relevant is because it turns out that this idea of corruption, of people paying to play, of people being able to buy their way into favors from the government, is emerging as a top issue for voters. A Fox News poll found that corruption in government is right up there. Almost 90 % say it's one of their top issues in this midterm elections. This administration has, up until this moment, seemed to not care at all about that perception or reality.

40:19Yeah, I don't, I mean, just one word with corruption, especially from a Fox News poll, I can't tell exactly what people are targeting because especially the president has been focused on the fraud task force and And looking at the amount of money that seems to just disappear. If actually Medicaid paid out what it says that it is per person in poverty, it would be like$85 ,000 per person. And people are not getting$85 ,000 a person. So I can't really read into that. Of course, nobody wants corruption in government. But there's a lot that's contained in that work. A couple of things. One, I actually, to go back to the first segment, I actually think that's why AOC was on the campaign trail with Abdul in Michigan.

40:56because she has been a backdrop person who has said there are billionaires who are getting rich and enriching themselves, including potentially our president. And regardless of you're a Republican or Democrat, it's the top versus the bottom, not the left or the right. And so I think that is actually a message. I don't think the corruption that you're talking about is Medicare fraud. They are thinking about how we're raising hundreds of millions of dollars for a ballroom and people can't afford gas or food. The other thing I think that is important to point out is who is on that list and the type of issues they're actually facing and issues in this midterm.

41:33Let me finish this way. AI data centers is a key issue right now. And a lot of the tech companies on there know that depending on the outcome of the midterm elections, what happens in 2028 could actually affect their bottom line and how they do business. And so I think those are some of the questions that are coming up of like not just if people are paying, but who is paying and for what. Going back to your point about corruption, I submit that if you add up all of the, and I'm a pretty moderate person, I think, in my politics, you add up all of the money that was misspent during the COVID years, you would find fraud of such a gigantic scale, it would dwarf even a golden ballroom.

42:18Yes. Absolutely. But that's interesting, though. But I think people are seeing an advancing plutocracy. And this is not the 80s. We are not interested in lifestyles of rich and famous. We are interested in more equality and more of that money coming down to the workers. And it is not there. And we keep seeing ballrooms and rich people donating and getting favors and getting advances. And that is not good. All right. Next, we're going to react to your feedback from CNN.com slash Abby. Stay with us. We will be right back.

42:59And now some viewer feedback from CNN.com slash Abby. The first one says, look, as a Texas Democrat, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. We wanted Paxton because he is beatable. If anybody is to blame if Paxton loses, it is the MAGA voters who listen to What's-His-Face, not Cornyn. By What's-His-Face, I suppose it's Donald Trump. Well, in my county, likely going to see between 80 and 85 percent of the county go for the Republican. It's San Jacinto County. It is the county that made the difference for Rubio. And it is the county that said Rubio for Cruz. OK. For Cruz. But is Paxton a weak candidate?

43:40What's that? Is Paxton a weak candidate? He's a weaker candidate than we had. He's a weaker candidate than we had. But Mr. Cornyn needs to understand that if you get beat by a weaker candidate in the primary, that's on you. That's not on the voters. It's not on Donald Trump for putting his thumb on the scale in the primary. President Trump put his thumb on the scale. But a lot of Texans were tired of Cornyn. He's in his fourth term as a senator. I mean, he's given it a good run. And I think Paxton actually was really well-liked as an attorney general. He did a good job as an attorney general. And when you would see cases, blockbuster cases, be brought to the Supreme Court, who is that?

44:16That was Paxton. And that's why he won the primary. It makes so much sense that you live in 80%. If Paxton wins in Texas, it'll be in spite of the immigration policy that has alienated the entire Rio Grande Valley in Texas. So here's another viewer comment. I'm a Muslim African-American born in this country, and it hurts my soul to hear a president say that about Islam when he doesn't know anything about Islam. Yeah, it hurts a lot of people when he makes derogatory comments about countries, asshole countries, when he says terrible derogatory things about Asian people around COVID, calling it, I won't even say it.

45:02But words have power, and they especially have power when it comes from the person who is sitting in the bully pulpit. A commenter, this might be in your interest, says identity politics are actually stereotyping politics. No, I think that what politicians would generally do at the end of a campaign is try to figure out how to get out each segment of their base. That's just smart campaigning. the the the elsaid campaign has taken a principal position that they are going to not deal with do it that way they are going to to focus on these big issues about health care about money in your pocket money out of politics they believe that everybody has uh you know is can relate to those things and that they are riding banking on that to get people to the polls i happen to believe that acknowledging and saying, I see you in particular, gay person, woman, black person.

46:06How about wearing a tie? That's not it. But I think that actually helps him. But I do think this idea of getting each individual base out by acknowledging them is very helpful. But there's a lot of ways. Sorry, Charles. There's a lot of ways to identify. and I think that the easiest pit against identity politics is to go to race. But like NASCAR, I'm a NASCAR driver. I'm a soccer mom, right? But we're okay with those type of identities, right? Because anyone can go to NASCAR. So the thing is, I don't go on identity. But I do think that, to her point, it is a form of identity politics. It is. NASCAR, UFC fights on the White House lawn.

46:50That's identity politics too. and identifying people, not based on their preferences and how they choose to live their lives, but on who they, what they look like, that might be powerful. That might work. But I don't think we have to say it's a good thing. Yeah, when 80 % of the people who are Republican are white, you don't have to do any of that. Okay, two quick things. One viewer who says you should be the new White House press secretary, so take that as well. At least you can read. Another says, another says baby boy Philip will be a grown man before Trump donates to the ballroom. perhaps.

47:20All right, everyone. Thank you very much for watching Newsnight. Before you go, you can stream the show live or watch on demand with an all access subscription. Scan the QR code on your screen or go to cnn.com slash watch to learn more. Lower Codes Live starts right now. Starting a business can seem like a daunting task unless you have a partner like Shopify. They have the tools you need to start and grow your business. From designing a website to marketing to selling and beyond, Shopify can help with everything you need. There's a reason millions of companies like Mattel, Heinz, and Allbirds continue to trust and use them.

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