Trump Rejects Regulation of AI Despite Industry’s Warnings

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1:01Tonight, as the AI CEOs issue new warnings, the president insists the industry doesn't need regulation, just new branding. It's been officially changed to super intelligence. Plus, they insulted him. You will go down as a total dirtbag. They lectured him. Javert from Les Mis would look at you with astonishment. But did their circus show that Republicans don't have anything on Jack Smith? Right before an election, this is what they want to spend their time on. Also, as Americans feel worse about the economy than at any point in modern history, J.D. Vance has a cure. A lot of the problems that exist in American society would be solved, not all of them, but just by deporting illegal aliens.

1:47And it's one of the biggest midterm races in America. So why is Jasmine Crockett sitting on the sidelines? Live at the table, Keith Boykin, Caroline Sunshine, Christopher Hahn, Elizabeth Pipko, and Philip Bump. Americans with different perspectives aren't talking to each other, but here they do.

2:19Good evening, I'm Abby Phillip in New York. Will today live for infamy in generations to come? Because the future of artificial intelligence and its power seem to have been determined behind closed doors at the White House. As Americans and the very people creating AI are growing more concerned about that technology, President Trump hosted the most powerful men behind it, and they signed a voluntary pledge to self-police the industry. Is it the belief of everybody that you're meeting with today that no guardrails, no regulation of AI, superintelligence, as you call it, is necessary? Well, there's a belief that there should be tremendous self-regulation.

3:01And we automatically have regulation with the Department of Justice, the FBI, all of that. But the self-regulation is very important. The White House released the four steps that were agreed to, which included both internal and external independent reviews of AI models to ensure that any issues are detected and fixed. But will anyone enforce it? Here's what Trump said about that. Is this a core that everybody signed? Is it binding in any way? I think it's morally binding, yeah. He was asked again about the safety concerns, and he took a page out of the Beatles playbook. Mr. President, tell us why the world should not be concerned about AI, why there shouldn't be guardrails?

3:45Because we have people that love our country and love the world a lot. But it requires more than love, doesn't it, sir? No, it requires this, and they're the smartest people in the world. So when asked about the legal repercussions of a company's AI model, for example, breaking the law, Trump quickly changed the subject to his new branding effort. Who should be held accountable when the AI agents committed a crime? It's not It's SI. That's the other thing. We've changed the name officially today. It's been officially changed to superintelligence or SI. Before we open it up to the table here, we invite you at home to join the debate.

4:27Head to CNN.com slash Abby. Weigh in there. We'll get to some of your comments as we go throughout the show. So, Philip, it looks like President Trump's strategy and the White House's strategy is basically let them deal with it. And the president also, characteristically, is very concerned about what we call AI and not so much concerned about the details of what the challenges are and why this industry, unlike pretty much any other industry, gets to basically do whatever they want and self-police themselves. And we don't really allow that anywhere else in our economy. Yeah. I mean, it's sort of amazing to change it to America intelligence, given the pattern.

5:06Exactly. That is the big surprise of today. You know, I think that one of the fundamental issues here is that President Trump and the staff in the administration understand AI is underpinning a significant part of the economy right now. A lot of the economy depends on building out AI, on spending on AI, and the back and forth wash of money between AI companies and NVIDIA and chip makers and things like this. And I think that he understands that trying to put his foot on the brake in terms of that is going to be bad news. But it's also the case that even the AI companies themselves are not able to effectively, in real time, understand what the AI is always doing.

5:40We see it break out of sandboxes. We see it do these things that they are not anticipating and that they do not know about until after the fact. So allowing them to self-police it means allowing them to keep doing the path that they've already done and proven to be inadequate. I'm dubious if they don't know this. I think some of what they're saying is a marketing strategy to get people to pay attention to AI. They are not making money right now, and they want more investment. They want their stock to grow. So does the president, by the way, who owns a significant amount of AI stock. Do I think they're going to self-regulate?

6:09Absolutely not. Nobody ever does. This country is going to at some point elect a Congress that will impose regulations on it. This president now is on the wrong side of another 80-20 issue in this country, and it is going to cost him and his party this November. What's another 80-20 issue that he's on the wrong side of? Data centers. I mean, the same same issue somewhat. The war in Iran. It's like gas prices are okay. That's like a 90-10 issue. I don't think he's ever said they're okay. Oh, he said people are okay. I've been on this show many times, and every time I'm on here, I remind people he doesn't say that they're okay.

6:38He says they're a small price to pay. They are, in fact, a price to pay. Okay. Here, well, let me just play what he said. Keep going with that. There are real concerns among Americans about AI, but the president has described it as basically like climate change, which he says is a hoax. Listen. You've also indicated that Democrats are talking about concerns about AI as a hoax. Do you believe that after meeting with all these AI tech leaders? Yeah, I do. I think they would love to see it shut down, just like it was a hoax the 12 years for global warming, which they changed right now to climate change.

7:15Yeah. I mean, to Chris's point, this is basically an 80-20 issue. 82 % of Americans say they are very or somewhat concerned about AI. 87 % say they are very or somewhat concerned about data centers in their communities. This is, even if some of this is overblown, the president isn't even acknowledging that the concerns are real. I understand the concerns of where the American people are at with AI because it's human nature to be skeptical of the new. That's just how our brains work as humans. But as Americans, we also are a people and a nation that expanded our continent. westward and we got to the moon first and that's also part of who we are and I think the president has an apt analogy with climate change because the United States self-inflicted put enormous regulations on our own country Europe did the same thing in regards to climate change but you know who didn't China and as a result what has happened is maybe the U.S.

8:17has capped our emissions maybe Europe has but the globe is not better for it because you know who didn't cap their emissions China. And the president is aware of that right now. Okay. AI isn't just happening in a bubble. He says that they did. It missed a race with China where China and us are neck and neck. And the fact is AI is here and it's here to stay. And either China is going to lead on it or the U.S. is going to lead on it. We want to be the leaders on it. I love you and shake it up. My daughter's 19. Big fan. Now I'm going to disagree with everything you just said. Okay. So here's the thing.

8:48I think that makes it more okay. China, China regulates what side of the street you can walk on. Do you think that they are allowing somebody in a lab to develop a super intelligence that's going to tell all the people what's really going on in China and overthrow their totalitarian government? Of course they're not. They have incredibly tight regulations on AI. And I'm not saying we need to stop production of AI. I didn't think we needed to stop production of a lot of things. If we don't want to stop production of airplanes in this country, but we regulate that. We don't want to stop production of cars, but we regulate that.

9:18We can regulate this. It just takes a Congress and an administration that is going to work on it properly to make sure that we could regulate it and still have growth. But what I would counter is we have a Congress that won't even regulate itself on stock trading. They should. That's who we're going to trust to regulate AI. We have a Congress that takes congressional hearings. And we get Chuck Grassley up there saying that he thinks that Facebook runs on a floppy disk. But here's the thing. That's who we want regulating AI. As a political strategy, right? Because I look at this politically. That's the only way I look at things.

9:49I look at it from what's good for the country, not just politically. If I was a Republican running for office this year and seeing what the president said today on that 80-20 issue, I would be petrified. He is allowing them to be on the wrong side of this issue. Because he's not thinking about politics. He's thinking about the future. He's not thinking about anything. Which is what his job is as a private national leader of the free world. He's thinking beyond politics. I think Chris is exactly right about this. I mean, this is not only morally irresponsible for Trump just to dismiss this, but it's also politically reckless.

10:21It's politically tone deaf for the president, the leader of his party to gather a group of billionaires and one trillionaire at the White House and tell them, you know, Americans just suck it up. It's not so bad. It's not so bad. People are struggling with gas prices and groceries. This guy, this guy is sitting there trying to tell them you have nothing to complain about. I just think if you want to use that as a strategy in 2026 in the midterms, 35 days before the election, I welcome you to go do it because as we see from the polls, it's not working and it's not going to work. As Caroline said, I don't think we have to be here and talk about the polls every night.

10:58I think you can want what's best for America and not look at things politically. And I think we're all on the same page. We want Congress to do the right thing. We always do. They never do the right thing, or at least they rarely ever do the right thing. And I think if we're going to wait for them to do that in a race that we just entered at which we don't know what speed we have to compete in, we're only going to hurt ourselves. So let me just this is a somewhat separate issue, but it's related. The White House today also launched their own AI chatbot. And and actually, you know, I mean, I think the idea that they're that's behind some of the website is is fine.

11:30They want to modernize dealing with the government. But this chatbot, you can ask it whatever you want. And so Democrats have. They've asked things like, did Trump lose the 2020 election? The chatbot says yes. Did Trump drive up gas prices? The chatbot says yes. Did Trump, is affordability a hoax, as the president says? The chatbot says no. So all of these questions, it actually is kind of comical to me because the same president who is very much behind AI probably doesn't realize that AI is going to tell the truth and might actually be his worst enemy in terms of fact checkers who he doesn't like very much.

12:13Yeah, I mean, AI tells the truth because so far it has been modeled on the corpus of human knowledge, right? And that is reality. And that's why AI does that. But it is also the case. And one of the reasons that China is very interested in AI is because you can shape it. You can change how it answers. And China wants to be able to control that and wants to have people ask questions of its AI so that it can give it the answer it wants. The White House wants to do the same thing. The White House wants you to go there. All of those fixes, I'm sure, fixes will be done by the time the sun rises tomorrow.

12:40They will have changed all these things so that it gives some sort of non-answer. So it doesn't reflect reality because that's the entire point of this. The point of the White House doing this is in part, yes, efficiency. Right. And you're right. I agree. There is a lot of room using AI for efficiency in government. But it is also to be able to have the white have the American people believe the things the White House. Here's why I'm not afraid. Let me just correct myself, because I actually I said the AI is going to tell the truth. And the truth is, sometimes the AI really doesn't tell the truth.

13:06If you've used these chatbots, sometimes they really do a straight up lie to you. But at the same time, an A.I. that they clearly didn't tweak to fit their ideological narrative gave answers that are known to be generally true in the world that we all live in. Yeah, look, I think that we don't have to worry too much because I think he got the A.I. chat box from the same guy he bought the pool liner from. So we'll be OK in America. But here's the thing the White House is afraid of. They are afraid of people understanding the truth. They are afraid of voters who have been fooled twice. I think this is the, you know, fool me once, shame on you.

13:43Fool me twice, shame on me. Election for this president and the Republican Party. And I don't know how many chatbots making his own lies he could put into play right now that's going to save them from what's coming this November. All right. Next for us, we're going to call it an air ball. A Republican senator tries setting a perjury trap for Jack Smith, but it backfires in a spectacular, cringeworthy way, does it show that they have nothing on him? Plus, J.D. Vance claims that most America's problems can be solved by simply deporting illegal immigrants, even housing prices. We'll debate that.

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15:30Tonight, an embarrassing moment for the Republicans who were hoping to catch former special counsel Jack Smith in a lie. Smith testified before the Senate Judiciary Committee where things took a combative and even bizarre turn. GOP lawmakers pressed him on his investigations into President Trump, they called him names, accused him of perjury, but ultimately failed to land a definitive blow. You may think you're a hero in this story, but let me tell you something. You're the villain. You will go down as a total dirtbag. Mr. Smith's operation was a partisan weapon that broke the rules. Javert from Les Mis would look at you with astonishment Do you believe in the tooth fairy?

16:20I do not. How about the Easter Bunny? I no longer believe in the Easter Bunny. You make me want to throw up in my mouth.

16:33Smith was defiant. He defended his actions thoroughly. I stand by my decisions as special counsel, including my decision to bring charges against President Trump. I made those decisions without regard to President Trump's political association, activities, beliefs, or candidacy in the 2024 presidential election. Our investigation developed proof beyond a reasonable doubt that President Trump engaged in serious crimes against our nation. I will not be silenced by continued threats of prosecution from the president or others. Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, Les Mis. What was the point of this hearing for Republicans?

17:24I'm not sure they got much out of it. Well, Jack Smith should be behind bars. He shouldn't even be at that hearing. Oh, here we go. Jack Smith should absolutely be behind bars because he committed one of the gravest sins in recent years of American politics, which he weaponized the justice system. Oh, my God. Is that a crime, though? And you don't have to take my word for it because both the cases... I noticed you called it a sin. Is it a crime? Both the cases, that's going to be, hopefully, for a grand jury to decide because both of his cases that he brought were dismissed, first by the Supreme Court, second by a federal judge who also ruled that he was appointed to the position unlawfully and unconstitutional.

18:01You know what? Can I tell you? And frankly, I don't know why the White House hasn't been more on top of this. This is something that we can't have happen again, and I don't know why the chief is up. White House hasn't just directed the DOJ. They had a whole hearing today. C.C. Wild seems to be really busy having lobbyists come into the White House instead of executing the president's wishes, which is to make sure that Jack Smith, via the DOJ, is behind bars. We can't do this to somebody again. That's a lot of words, Caroline. A lot of words to say they got nothing. I didn't hear anything about what they uncovered today.

18:29The Republican Party basically took a swing at the defenses, and they got absolutely nothing today. They struck out. When I first heard they were doing this, I asked myself, Why are they holding a hearing about with Jackson? A month before an election. A month before the election. Like, what? That's going to hurt them. I don't understand why they would do that. And then I saw all these scripted lines they had with Ted Cruz and John Kennedy and everybody. And I realized, oh, it was all an ambush. They were trying to ambush him because Donald Trump wanted to distract his base from the gas prices, distract his base from the Iran war, distract his base from the Epstein files.

19:02So they can focus on some other red meat to get them worried about that. Get mad about Jackson. Get mad about CNN. Get mad about CNN. And they accomplished nothing for doing this. This was the moment of the hearing. And the context here is that Senator Eric Schmidt wanted to insinuate that Jack Smith had gone down to Georgia to maybe collaborate with Fonnie Willis or what have you. So he tried to lay out a perjury trap. Listen to this. what would you say if i had a series of text messages from your team that said you were in atlanta at a warrior hawks game on february 3rd 2024 the day after willis and wade announced their affair i don't think you know that we have this stuff so i'll give you a second to process it so you don't you know perjure yourself you just took it down really quick if i could look at that again I recall going to a University of Maryland basketball game.

20:05It was Maryland playing Iowa, I think, February of 2024. But again, you can check that out if that's what we're talking about. University of Iowa. Is it the Hawkeyes? Yes. Could it then be that University of Iowa is the Hawkeyes? Could that be it?

20:27Yeah. You know what I miss in politics? That's not it. You know what I miss in politics? Shame. There used to be a time when you were a senator and you did a stunt like that. You went back to your office. You closed your door. You worked on your resume and you didn't run for reelection. In this environment, since Donald Trump came down the escalator, shame does not exist in our politics anymore. That senator, Senator Schmidt, should not be running for office ever again. And everybody should be making fun of him like we're doing here. I can't wait to watch Saturday Night Live this weekend. He doesn't know the difference between the Hawkeyes and the Hawks.

21:01Well, it was a really fun episode of Veep to watch, and it's probably evidence more as to why you probably don't want these people regulating AI. But I do agree with you. This should not be happening. I don't want him regulating anything. That's because it should have already happened. I agree. Why have we waited this long to prosecute Jack Smith? This should have happened a year ago. The point is that he could get into the attention economy. There's an attention economy that Donald Trump has created in which if you are able to get a ding on Jack Smith, then you win. You got a point earlier. Congratulations on that.

21:30That's the attention economy. I want Jack Smith behind bars.

21:36Donald Trump attempted to overturn the results of 22 hours. He stoked the sentiment that led to the riot at the Capitol. He took classified documents down to Florida. These are incontrovertible truths. Then why were both his cases dismissed? Because they had a hack judge named Ileen Can. Oh, so federal judges are hacks now? Because when they agree with you, they're not. That's right. Because Jack Smith withdrew the prosecution. No, because there is an objective reality in the world which you refuse to acknowledge. The fact is that Donald Trump developed proof beyond a reasonable doubt. There's proof beyond a reasonable doubt that President Trump engaged in serious crimes against our nation.

22:12We know what those crimes are. Jack Smith was the avatar for them because he was in that role. And now people like you and people like Donald Trump. He's not going to be appointed into that role. Oh, my gosh. Okay, great. Don't take my report. Take the federal judges. The idea that you are going to say that Donald Trump is going to stand up to weaponization of government is laughable. It's what he's doing all day. Laughable. So, I mean, there's been a lot of talking against Jack Smith at this table, mostly by Caroline. I haven't started yet. Elizabeth hasn't spoken yet. I still I think the issue with today is that Republicans are taking issue with Jack Smith using legal and honestly just normal investigative tools to investigate a case that he was given.

22:55And they have not provided any evidence that he did anything at all that was unlawful. Well, I'd like to see the evidence. Right. We all want to see it. I want to see what this turns into. I 100 percent agree they could be doing more. This stunt didn't help. But the judge is not letting us see what they're doing. I mean, look. Look, let me just let Elizabeth finish. I have to say, I don't wish what friends of mine, even family of mine, experienced at the hands of Jack Smith on anyone at this table. I don't wish it on any of my worst enemies. That's how bad things were. And when he was investigating Donald Trump, he reached so far past what I think was in his legal purview.

23:32he ended up obtaining the kind of information that no one should have on thousands of Americans, on members of Congress. It's all going to come out. Donor information? There are things that... Publicly available. Publicly available. What are we talking about here? We're talking about the fact that he went too far. I haven't finished talking. We have an oversight committee to literally do this. This is their job. I would hope that if the president of the United States was ever investigated like this in the future, Democrat or Republican, we would all agree that our elected officials have a... Because we can't even evaluate what you're saying because you're not providing any evidence of the claims that you're making.

24:08What is it that he did that went too far in your mind? The people that he targeted and how much information he got on them illegally. I'm not going to name names. They're personally related to me. Can I just say... That's how much I know about this compared to everyone at this table. I'm telling you right now. Donald Trump targeted Ruby Freeman and Shea Moss, two Fulton County, Georgia election workers who had nothing to do with this election except doing their job. Donald Trump took these two people, drugged them to the ringer just so he could make a political point. And they're private citizens.

24:45Donald Trump, the president of the United States. This is the reason why Jack Smith was leading this investigation. Yes, it was extraordinary. But you know why it was extraordinary? Because we have never in my lifetime or anybody else's lifetime had a president of the United States. He was an insurrection against the United States government. And I'm to deny the election result. I used to work in the American people still elected him. So they clearly disagreed with all of you and Jack Smith. I used to work in the U.S. Senate. And when I worked in the U.S. Senate back in the early part of the 2000s, when there was a hearing, you learned something.

25:19Right. What did we learn today other than that Jack Smith likes women's basketball? We're on the same page. We didn't learn anything. So if all of these. But here's my point to both of you. My point to both of you is all if all of these things happened and we had senators with massive staffs and massive research resources to research into it. We learn nothing today from them. They came up with nuts. Right. That is that is ridiculous. And in the Senate, look, the Senate, I work there. OK, they have the ability to find a lot of things out, to ask the agencies to find out and really put them through the ringer.

25:50They tried, but they didn't. And I will say and I will just add to that. We're talking about this in the context of an administration that is being run by Donald Trump. Right. If there were profound misdeeds by Jack Smith in the FBI, in the DOJ, we would know about it by now. because guess what? Donald Trump runs those agencies. And so, oh no, he doesn't? Honestly, I really believe that the president unfortunately has so much on his plate. Unfortunately, the chief staff out in White House to be on top of this. He's decorating the oral office day and night. That is the role of the chief of staff to make sure the president has made it clear this is what he wants.

26:37And it is the role of the chief of staff to make sure that the DOJ opens up a prosecution so that we can go through the discovery process. The president has made it explicitly clear that he wants Jack Smith prosecuted. Yeah, so why doesn't it happen? You don't think that there's anybody in his government that takes that seriously. No, I think his own administration is obstructing it. They do take it seriously. And if 15 months into this administration we have learned nothing, it might be because there's nothing. We've learned that his staff actively works against him. All right, next for us. Who's the president?

27:03Next for us, deportations. That is what the vice president says is going to help make Americans feel great again. And we're going to discuss that next.

27:18When it's time to scale your business, it's time for Shopify. Get everything you need to grow the way you want. Like, all the way. Stack more sales with the best converting checkout on the planet. Track your cha-chings from every channel right in one spot. and turn real-time reporting into big-time opportunities. Take your business to a whole new level. Switch to Shopify. Start your free trial today.

27:50As Americans grow increasingly pessimistic about the state of the economy, Vice President J.D. Vance is throwing out a solution. Here's what he claims will solve all of the nation's problems. A lot of the problems that exist in American society would be solved. not all of them, but just by deporting illegal aliens. So lower housing prices, lower rents, lower violent crime statistics.

28:16It's an age-old trope for this administration that they are responsible for all of our problems. The problem is that there's not a lot of evidence to actually support what he's saying there, but it does make sense that they would try to do this, although they've been saying it for a while, but re-upped this message right before an election? It's factually untrue, and it's politically ineffective. It's factually untrue because we know from data that immigrants who come here actually commit fewer crimes than Native-born Americans. It's factually untrue because we know that actually deporting immigrants creates a housing crisis because a quarter of all construction workers are immigrants in this country.

28:55So if you take them away, then you have a problem with, you're going to actually raise labor costs and raise the cost of housing. So it's counterproductive. But it's also politically ineffective because we are in a situation now where people, every time they go to the gas tank, they go to the gas station, they see 450 gas, 650 diesel. And this guy is talking about, oh, well, let's just deport more immigrants. They said that two years ago. They said that two years ago. The economy still hasn't gotten better. I don't care about your language. You're not using the word illegal. We're not talking about language and all that stuff.

29:27We're talking about reality. You can use all the distractions you want for your base, Caroline, but the American people, the people who are paying attention to their gas prices, paying attention to their grocery prices, paying attention to the beef prices, they don't care about this nonsense. It only plays to Donald Trump's base, and that's not enough to win a midterm election. I notice you're not using the word illegal, and I just want to know why. Who cares, Caroline? That's a distraction. I don't want to get caught up in your silly distractions. I'm not using the word illegal to describe your reality.

29:54It's not your language policing. Thank you. Is there not a difference? I thought that that was something that liberals did. There is a difference. And that Republicans were opposed to people sitting here telling them what they can't say. There's two different things. There's people who come to our country lawfully who are immigrants. And there are people who come to our country. And thank you for giving me the chance to explain this. There are people who come to our country illegally who are illegal immigrants. That doesn't detract from his points. And the thing that's really interesting is...

30:23So what does it have to do with anything I have to say? In terms of the issues that we're discussing, housing, crime, etc., what's the distinction? The distinction is if you look at housing prices in the U.S., the Federal Reserve came out with this study showing that housing and rent prices have gone down 20 to 30 percent. Okay, that's not what the study said. That's not what the study said. The labor market is the best it's been in two decades for people without a college degree because of massive locations. We're talking about politics for a second. Let me just, well, let's just deal with the...

30:51You're no better than slave owners in plantations in the 1860s. Caroline, what are you talking about? Stop doing misinformation on national television, Caroline Sunshine. Caroline, where is the sunshine? Everybody just stop for a second, including you, Caroline. Let's just deal with the things that you just said, which are not true. Thank you. That study that you're talking about doesn't say that immigrants caused housing prices to go up. Illegal. It doesn't say that either. 30 % on home prices and 20 % on rent. It says, and it equates to an increase of 6.6 % in home prices and 4.3 % in rents, not 30%.

31:32That's according to the Wall Street Journal that read that op-ed. And you know what that coincides to? On rents, it's about$5 a month, okay? So what you're saying is it's misdirection to the point of just not even being relevant for the conversation. There is no evidence that immigrants are causing housing prices to go up. Do you deny that the Biden administration allowed in 10 million illegal immigrants? I didn't say anything about that. That number is false. That number is false. No, that did not happen. What you just said is false. I think it was more than 10 million. I'm looking at the polls.

32:15And Caroline, and on top of that, even during that time, guess what happened to housing prices and rent? They went down, not up. So you don't have the facts on your side. So now we have to talk about all kinds of different things. But the politics of this is bad for the president. This is called a gish gallop in which you can't make your point, so you make a different point. Thank you. Your point about building housing, construction workers, about farm workers, right? Are there people who are here illegally who are working in those fields? Absolutely. Are they doing important work that the economy needs?

32:48Absolutely. It's slave labor. It's modern slave labor. And if you support that, you're no better than a plantation owner in the 1860s. You know what? As a black man, I'm offended that you would even go there. So just please not even go with the slave labor thing. It's modern slave labor. And Democrats used to believe that. Democrats used to believe. My thought is simply that. You're a distraction. Any advance said is demagoguery. That's all it is. It is demagoguery. It is exactly what we thought we thought in 2024. Elizabeth, I'll let you have a word. Go ahead. I'm genuinely just surprised that we all think it's okay to conflate immigrants and illegal immigrants.

33:20Genuinely baffled if you had done this in any election, three, four, whatever years ago. Talk about 80-20 issues. No, I have to get this out. I talked to my dad earlier today who told me that he got more paperwork earlier today on the death of his father at the hands of the KGB as he was trying to escape. The people that come to this country who go through hell and back to respect our laws and do it the right way deserve to be treated better than those. You know who conflates it? ICE does. This administration does. And that is why Latinos and other immigrants who are racially convoked are leaving.

33:50Guys, guys, one at a time. Right now it was a complaint. Hold on a second. The reason why Texas is in play, Florida is in play somewhat, is because immigrants, Latinos who had voted for Trump, who are here legally, or American citizens, are leaving in droves because ICE, not only do they not distinguish between illegal and legal immigrants, but anybody who's Latino who's here, they are suspicious of. And they are not voting for Republicans this year. And it is all this stuff about Paxton and Tal Rico. It is Latinos in Texas who have left the Republican Party who had voted for Trump just a year and a half ago who will not do that this year, which is what's going to cost the Republicans.

34:26The other thing, Elizabeth, that is relevant to your point is that I think it's also a fallacy about this administration that they are only targeting illegal immigrants. They have severely restricted the legal immigration process to the point where it is almost nonfunctional for a lot of immigrants. They take people's money in applications and refuse to process their applications. They take people who are in the legal process and then arrest them as they are getting on airplanes while they are waiting for their cases to be adjudicated. It is not true that they are only targeting illegal immigrants.

35:01And that's one of the reasons why I think this has become such a politically toxic problem for this administration. Imagine this, that Trump comes into office and he is trusted more on immigration, trusted more on the border. Today, as we sit here, 52 % of Americans say they trust Democrats more on immigration. That can only happen because Trump has lost the plot. I just read a quote from Jim Justice in West Virginia complaining about ICE picking up immigrants. He's talking about illegal immigrants in his state and ripping them out of their communities. It is not popular. An 80-20 issue here is that Americans think that people who have been living in the country, regardless of immigration status, for 10 plus years, grown families, have jobs, that those people should be allowed to stay in the United States.

35:52Those people are being removed from the United States by this administration. All right. Need a process. Next for us, Congresswoman Jasmine Crockett isn't adding James Tallarico's name to her PAC's list of endorsements. That's after she said that she'd support him when he beat her in the primary. So what's behind the snap? We'll debate.

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37:18Will you campaign with him? I will be campaigning down ballot. For me, I think that making sure that people that maybe are getting overshadowed because it seems like it's only about one big race. That was Congresswoman Jasmine Crockett last month saying that she would not campaign for James Tallarico, the Texas state candidate, Senate candidate who bested her in the Democratic primary. But not campaigning for him is very different from not endorsing him. Her leadership pack released a list of new endorsements in Texas on Monday, and noticeably missing from that list, again, was Tallarico. Crockett responded to that report by calling her critics corny and accusing the news media of peddling tabloids.

38:00She also reposted her tweet from March congratulating Tallarico and her call for unity and to rally around all Democratic nominees. Keith, I wonder what you think is going on here, because there's what she said in that tweet back after the primary, and what she's said ever since, which is she doesn't think there's energy there. She's going to campaign down ballot. She doesn't have time to appear with Tallarico. What's going on? Well, I think she says she's already endorsed him. Tallarico says that she's already endorsed him. Tallarico says he doesn't have a problem with her. She says she doesn't have a problem with him.

38:40She's not going to go out and campaign for him. But she has already said she's supporting him. I don't really see that it is an issue. As long as the two of them are cool with it, I don't have anything else to say. You acknowledge that she's not campaigning with him. She's choosing not to do that. That's not typically what inside the text you're doing. I get that. And I understand. I don't know what her motivation is. I don't really necessarily think it matters. I'll tell you this. I've been in Texas all year. and at the beginning of the year and through the primary, I didn't think this party was going to come together.

39:10I thought there was no way. And even after the primary, I thought it was going to be too fractured. But I've seen in the past month or so, the energy in Texas is coming together. They're focused on Donald Trump. They're focused on Ken Paxton. They're focused on Greg Abbott and getting rid of those three. And they're focused on gas prices and immigration and ICE. They don't care about what Jasmine Crockett is doing. I'm telling you, Texas is in play because they're upset about Trump and his policies and what the Republicans have done in that state for the past few decades. I've been on the losing side of a primary.

39:40It stinks. You do not want to go near the person you want. There are more family battles. It's worse. You have an easier time going and saying to the other party, congratulations, I'll work with you, than you do with your own party. It's a family battle when that happens. On the other hand, I don't think endorsements matter at all. Unless it's like President Trump in a Republican primary, It rarely matters at all. So what Jasmine Crockett does or doesn't do doesn't matter. I don't expect her to go out there and be waving the Tallarico flag. She wanted to be the senator. He has a chance of being senator now.

40:11So what she said is, look, I said it. What else do you want me to do? I think that's OK. I love it. I love it. And I respect Jasmine Crockett so much for doing it because she is a star. And I will never take another lecture from the Democrat Party on racism. because they had a black woman with riz and aura, and they pushed her aside for a bland white guy who looks like a political consultant's idea of what a normal white guy looks like cooked in a lab. So Jasmine Crocket is completely right on this. You go, petty queen. Okay, so let me just say that. I love the way you dissed her there at the end, talking about you like her.

40:46But, you know, I supported Jasmine Crocket in the primary, and I support James Tallarico. Why did you support her getting pushed aside? Let me tell you. They pushed her aside. Did everyone let anybody speak Caroline Sunshine? Caroline, it's called an election. It doesn't sound very sunshiny to me. You've got to steal her sunshine. It's called an election. Elections are not the same thing. I was there for the primary and the general process. I supported Jasmine. I support Talarie Clendale. I don't have a problem with this whole thing that's going on. I think it's interesting that people at Caroline, the Republican Party, want to create this controversy.

41:20But I'll tell you, the Democrats in Texas don't give a damn. They're focused on Trump, Paxton, and Abbott, and they're focused on those gas prices and immigration and ICE. That's what they care about. But isn't that part of the problem here is that if Republicans wanted to drive a wedge, she's making it easier for them to do it. Let me just play what she said in August, because this is where she talks about the lack of energy that she said she was seeing. And in my mind, the best way that I can help the people of Texas is if I go in and I help out on these down ballot races, because typically people rely on the top of the ticket to drag people in.

42:02I personally don't feel like the excitement necessarily exists within the Black community right now. But I do have some amazing Black candidates that are running for office in some of the largest counties. So if I can introduce black folk to them, that may excite them and get them to the polls. I think two things can be true. One is that it does make more sense to put more resources down ballot because there's a ton of money going to Tallarico's race. The other is that she doesn't seem to have handled the election very well. I will say, though, that the Texas Politics Project has measured or measured in June enthusiasm among black voters.

42:38Tallarico has a much bigger lead now among black voters than did Colin Allred in 2024, Beto O 'Rourke in 2018. So it is not the case that there is this lasting fissure within the Democratic Party, to your point. And, you know, I appreciate Ms. Sunshine being the avatar for racial politics. My party wasn't the one that pushed a black woman aside. You're not taking the bait on that one. That's how we go to interview. Next for us, Christopher. We'll react to your feedback from CNN.com slash Abby.

43:23And now some viewer feedback from CNN.com slash Abby. Elizabeth, this one's for you. It says, imagine Elizabeth's dad trying to come to America now. Do you think he would be able to, given that they've shut down, for example, asylum, refugee status, things like that. If we had longer right now, I would get to tell you the story of what he went through to get here. I think it actually was more difficult then than it would have been now. He went through hell and back to give me this life. And more importantly, I think he would have loved to come here now just as much as he did then and risked it all once again.

43:51If he's not a white South African, he wouldn't come in this year. I think he'd be. Those are the only people that Trump is allowing in his refugees right now. All right, we got one more from a viewer that says, I'll pledge to self-regulate too. No need to enforce the laws on me. to be fair what are laws even? I'll self-regulate my driving on the expressway, please, cops Right, yeah, I mean everyone would take that No one would say that we don't have laws that we have to abide by, but yeah, self-governance like, hell yeah, that is an American way to go to question Anarchy We are people that say listen, you're not gonna there's something very American about that We're a nation of laws, but we have some independence.

44:34People don't love that either. You know what? You got some crazy ideas, but I did love that show. Alright, we got one more. Wow, Abby, I'm surprised tonight hasn't thrown you into labor. I mean, if that were a risk, I would probably have been in labor months. There you go. Thank you. Alright, before you go, you can stream the show live or watch on demand anytime with an all-access subscription. Scan that QR code on your screen or go to cnn.com slash watch to learn more. And thank you very much for watching Newsnight. Laura Coates Live starts right now. Shaq here. What's it like to buy a car from Carvana 100 % online and get it delivered to your door?

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