Anthony Scaramucci on Trump, Corruption & America at 250

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0:37Hello and welcome to this unique collaboration between Coffeehouse and Americano. I am joined today by Anthony Scaramucci, former press secretary to Donald Trump and now the magnificent host of The Rest is Politics America and by Mr. Freddie Gray, who is the deputy editor of The Spectator and the editor of Spectator World, our American outlet. And Anthony, welcome. We are marking 250 years of the United States, which is a big moment to talk about what's going on there and the relationship between the former colonial master and the upstart startup nation. I was at the US ambassador's party on Tuesday evening, where he talked about how John Adams, the first US ambassador as Britain had sort of said, we must get back on a good footing.

1:28And Adams would be proud of the relationship as it is today. And I think a lot of people who are watching that thought, well, it's a bit dicier than it's been for a while, old son. Where are we now with Trump and America? And, you know, just give us your reflections on, you know, this big moment for America. Is it living up to the sort of billing of this great 250th anniversary? You know, I mean, it's not for me, I usually don't defend the Trump administration or members of it, but I do have to defend the ambassador a little bit. I know him for a long time. He's a good man. And I think that, I think he meant what he said.

2:03And I think what he's meant, and I think it's generally true that Americans love the Brits. We're all basically Anglophiles. And hopefully for many of you, the feeling is mutual. I think it's a totally problem with one person. Okay. So it's just a, It's a relationship with one person who's decided that he has Vladimir Putin's checklist and on the checklist is to berate and belittle and try to emasculate our allies. And I think that's it. And so when he leaves the stage, which we've all got our countdown clocks on, hopefully we'll begin the process of renewing and trying to rebuild these relationships.

2:42But he's doing a lot of damage. I'm not trying to underestimate the damage he's doing. And I'm not trying to underestimate the amount of repair that the Americans are going to need to have to do globally. Let me bring Freddie in here. We were talking earlier, Freddie. I mean, there is affection between Americans and Brits in both directions. But you've been reflecting recently, I think, that quite a lot of Americans feel they sort of need to save Britain. Yes. Well, I mean, I talked to quite a few people in sort of Trump circles and so on. And this recurring theme comes up whenever Britain comes up in conversation.

3:14and that's, you know, you guys are in trouble, we want to save you. And it's sometimes quite irritating because it's quite de ho en ba. It's like, you know, and they have this rather exaggerated idea of how bad things are in Britain, but they're not entirely wrong. That's the thing that I always want to point out. You know, they are very concerned about free speech in Britain, legitimately, and they feel an emotional attachment to England and they want Britain to be a country of liberty because they feel their liberty 250 years ago was born, albeit in very fractious circumstances, from an English place.

3:45I mean, you know, the founders felt they were saving an English idea of liberty, and a lot of Americans feel that very strongly. So I do think it's quite sincere. And I think, I mean, I take slight issue with Anthony on Trump because I think he does love Britain. And I know it's all sort of surface music, and he's actually been quite unpleasant, and the administration has done rather hostile things to the British government. But it's very sincere, his love of Britain. I mean, he... Well, his mum was Scottish, wasn't she? His mother was Scottish. He likes his golf courses here. And he loves the pomp and circumstance.

4:18You know, that all appeals to him. So, no, I think the special relationship is, you know, always sort of endures in whatever way. And the more you talk about it, the more meaningless the term becomes. No, I think I'm an Americaphile. I should make that very clear. Always have been. And what I always think about is Sigmund Freud's quote in the beginning of the century where he said, at last century, he said, America is the greatest experiment ever attempted, but I fear it is not a success. And I think like a lot of what Freud said, he's been proven wrong. Yeah. Anthony, I mean, we talked a bit about Britain and America.

4:55Where are things for Trump at the moment, do you think? I mean, he's got midterms coming up. At the start of, you know, Trump 2, it looked like they had a better plan than they had in Trump 1. You know, they had all these executive orders due to come out right from the off. It looked like it was sort of purpose in a way that they didn't manage in the first term. But it feels a little bit like the wheels are falling off. What's going on there? Why is it all beginning to feel like it's going wrong? If it's OK, I just want to add to the conservative, we're going to say Britain thing, because I want to just give you my insight, perhaps lack of insight, but let's give you my honest opinion.

5:33I think what happens is the conservatives have decided that certain things are threatening to them. And when they are threatening, they light those areas up. And so California is a very big threat to the conservatives. If you really study California, it's the fourth largest economy. It's got everything from defense to VC, AI, Hollywood, fast food, Disney World, you pick it. And so they They go after the weak spots in California. The process in England is very threatening to American conservatives. If you read Project 2025, you guys have done a very good job of flattening out your power and having a lot of checks and balances on the prime minister and shadow governments and all the different things.

6:18The conservatives don't like any of that, in this country at least. So if you read Project 2025, they want to weaken the other two branches of the government and strengthen its sort of unitary executive power. So you're in their targets for brand management purposes. And so that's why they pick on the weak areas. Because ironically, it was you guys that were supposed to have the balance of power. You were supposed to have the sort of, you know, the split. Yeah, well, but the conservatives don't like that. They've decided that that's made us weak and that's made us a muddled group and that's allowed for seepages of cultural wokeism and this other stuff.

6:57And so the way to get to eradicate the cultural woke isms have a very strong unitary executive that can do sweeping broad things. And so you mentioned all these executive orders. And so the president put through these executive orders. He came in with a pretty nice win. I mean, look at the win. He won seven swing states. His cross tabs were fantastic, actually. if you really looked at the numbers of, I'll just give you a few of them, you know, 54 % of the white women voted for President Trump. Okay. 48 % of the overall women. Okay. If you look to the African American totals, they were way higher than usual for a Republican candidate.

7:37Same thing with the Hispanic totals. So he came in with a sweeping win. You have to acknowledge that whether you like him or you dislike him. But what I think they did was they jumped the shark. And we have a tendency, unfortunately in this country to do that. And sometimes you get arrogant and you start making mistakes. I think they overlept in Minneapolis. Those two deaths in Minneapolis, I think really hurt their whole campaign as it related to ICE. And by the way, I agree with them on the border. I've always said that. I say that on the rest of politics, US. You can't have a porous border if you have a welfare state.

8:12Milton Friedman would tell you that. You have to protect your border. that I'm all about legal immigration. I'm just not about illegal immigration. I think it doesn't make sense for the American taxpayer. And so I think that Joe Biden got that so miserably wrong. That was one of the reasons why the president was able to return to power. But where I think he's made a mistake is he's overlept on things. So he said something in the Oval Office you guys should really listen to. When he hit the bunker buster bombs June of 2025 into Iran, they put a microphone in front of them at the Resolute desk and they said, well, you know, what are the philosophies and principles of MAGA?

8:50Because, you know, you said no more forever wars. You said you were releasing the Epstein files. The president looked at the reporter and said, well, the philosophy is whatever I want it to be. And I think that that's got them into some trouble. We don't get it on the nose that often in politics. No, no, but literally what he said. And so when you're saying he's made a muck of it, to use a British expression, he's made a muck of it because he's overlept and he got out of the field of vision of what he campaigned on. So he splintered the group. So whether it's Tucker Carlson, Candace Owens, you pick the people that were supporting him, the podcast Legion of People, even Joe Rogan, who's more of an independent, has said, whoa, this is a little bit too much.

9:31We shouldn't be shooting citizens in the middle of the street in the freezing winter in Minneapolis. And oh, by the way, what is he doing with these crypto trades? And how could he have a 927 page financial disclosure? And you guys probably don't read this stuff, but I have to because I'm on Wall Street. He's doing trades and breaking the law. And if you read the 2012 Stock Act, the STOCK Stock Act, you can do that and you pay a$200 fine. So he was making multiple millions of dollars trading. And so he, I'll give you an example. he's got the tariffs. He's coming down from Mount Evil, like Orange Moses with the tablet on April 7th.

10:13I mean, the April 2nd, he's got the tablet in his hand, but he short the market three days earlier. Then he offers relief on April the 9th, but he's gotten long the market two days prior to that. Okay. So if you're actually looking at it, okay. And by the way, so those are violations. So he paid$200 fines for those violations. You could - That doesn't seem enough, does it somehow? I'm sorry? 200 does not seem, it's not much of a deterrent, is it? So you have to understand what's happening in the country is people are looking at him and saying, okay, wow, he really doesn't care. He's off principle.

10:48He's just doing things to feather his own bed and to take care of his family. And he's trying to antagonize the rest of us. So that's what happened. And so you guys could push back on me and tell me that didn't happen. But objectively, that's what happened. So, you know, we've got affordability crisis in the country. Prices are up. We said we weren't going to fight any more forever wars. We're in a quagmire in Iran. We said we were going to give up the pedophilia ring from Jeff Epstein. I feel bad for Pam Bondi because she actually believed him. She was like, oh, we're really going to do this.

11:20And he said, hey, I'm in it. You know, I'm in the Epstein file. I was just kidding about that. OK, I just said that. I don't want to do that. You're fired. Yeah. Okay, so that's why his approval ratings are at 33 % right now, as low as Herbert Hoover at the depth of the Great Depression. I mean, Freddie, it feels like he's broken with the public over what Anthony's outlining in terms of what you might call kleptocracy. And he's broken with the MAGA movement over Iran. These are both quite serious, potentially. Very serious, and interlinked too, because Iran is having inflationary consequences, and I think voters might be more inclined to look past corruption, perhaps not corruption quite this reason, but they are feeling impoverished.

12:04The Labour participation rate, which is an interesting statistic, suggests that there might be a serious unemployment problem coming on the horizon. There's all sorts of worrying signs for everyday Americans and then they see Donald Trump and a coterie of his family and billionaires getting extremely rich very fast through means that are pretty grubby. And so, yeah, no pushback from me to Anthony on the corruption issue. I actually looked it up just before I came in here because I was thinking about 250 years. If you're an American and you somehow live to be 250, but you had managed to earn$8.8 million every year for 250 years, you would have earned slightly less than Donald Trump made last year, which is a pretty staggering statistic and I mean it is you know we had the plane this week which is you know again people can argue about whether the Qataris gave Trump this 400 million dollar plane which the air force has spent another 400 million doing up and he put a big show on it and he was on the tarmac and he said you can either low-key it or you can show it and you know his approach is always to show it and show the wealth I think a lot of people are starting to find that a bit revolting.

13:18Yeah. And during, you know, particularly in the early stages of his political career, there was a lot of questioning of whether he actually was as wealthy as he made out. The point is he now actually is as wealthy as he's making out. Anthony, what does this mean for the midterms, do you think? What are you actually expecting to happen? So, you know, I'm writing a book which is coming out in September. It's called All the Wrong Moves. We've created a structural cartel in the country. You have to explain it to the people. We have a very tight duopoly. These are demo publicans or they're republocrats.

13:51And they're a very tight political establishment at the top. And they have strained out the ability to knock them out of office. You know, Chuck Grassley, I think is probably the great grandfather of George Washington. He's been in office forever. And he'll be here 600 years after the three of us are dead. and he's holding on for dear life. And so what happens in this country is they allow for this thing called gerrymandering. And so they redistrict to strain out their enemies and to bring in their allies. And so I just submit to you as a gentleman, is this a real democracy where the politicians are picking the voters?

14:31I thought the voters were supposed to pick the politicians. And so now you're in a situation where Trump is very unpopular, but he may not lose the midterms. I'm a contrarian on this because I've looked through the data. 181 districts lean Republican right now. And again, I just want you guys to think about how bad the gerrymandering is. We have 435 congressional districts in the House of Representatives. We only have 19 that are contestable. 19 districts will be contestable. Everything else has already been fait accompli due to the redistricting. So the Republicans have won more of those battles on the redistricting than the Democrats.

15:13So even though the president's unpopular and presidents usually do lose the midterm election and lose the Congress, he's got a good shot here of not losing the Congress. Okay. And he's also a smart guy. People always say, oh, he's not smart. He's smart. Pay attention, guys. He's going to have a midterm Republican convention. He's going to do that in the beginning of the fall. And if the Democrats aren't smart, they don't do exactly what he's doing, which I recommend that they do, he's going to get tremendous amounts of publicity and reach for that. So I think he'll lose the House, but I don't think he's going to lose the House by the wide margins that he should have if we had less redistricting and less gerrymandering.

16:02I mean, this sounds like sort of an homage to Britain, Anthony. I mean, those of us with a knowledge of, you know, 19th century British politics would say this is a rather touching recreation of the rotten boroughs, all this gerrymandering. Well, this is exactly what Elbridge Gerry did. Elbridge Gerry studied what you guys were doing in Great Britain. And he redistricted the area north of Boston in Swampscott. It looked like a salamander. And so his opponent said, this is a gerrymander. This is a gerrymander. It looked the redistricting. And so, but we've really taken that exponential now and it's damaged the system and it's created this duopoly.

16:42And by the way, you know, guys like Tucker Carlson say they're going to start a third party. Good luck. Not going to happen. There's no way to penetrate that duopoly. Unless the American people wake up and they say, we've really had enough. Remember something about America. There's 105 million people, guys, that the most powerful voting bloc in America votes the exact same way in every single election. It's 105 million people, and that would be the non-voter. And so just remember how powerful that is. If you have an entrepreneurial candidate that can reach those non-voters and get them to register and come into the swimming pool of politics, you could change the entire game.

17:23And the current politicians are banking on their apathy, banking on their indifference not to show up at the polls. This is something, of course, Elon Musk was looking very carefully at. J.D. Vance talked him down from it, but he was going to start a third party and go after those people and see if he could dislodge this duopoly. But without the dislodgement, we're entrenched in this circle. And again, one other thing very different from British politics is the money. We've allowed money into the system in a way that is absolutely astounding now. Since Citizens United, when Justice Scalia said you can let all the money you want into the system, we're up nine and a half times on political donations.

18:05And then go look at the legislative agenda. It's big business, big food, big pharma, tax cuts for the wealthy. It's corporate welfare. Oh, by the way, you guys don't like chlorinated chicken in your country. We don't like it either, but it's legally allowable in our country. We can also put glyphosate, which is a fertilizer. You can leave it in the children's cereal in this country because these guys have paid the politicians off to rewrite the regulation. So, you know, you've got World Cup players, okay, that are coming over here saying, this food sucks over here. What are these people doing?

18:40They don't even want to, they're trying to get the food shipped in from Europe so that they can play better. You know, I mean, you know this and I know this and you guys spend time in America. Our food system is a catastrophe because the politicians have been bought off and they've allowed the chemical industry and the food industry to corrupt the food. And so at some point, the Americans are going to say, hey man, you know, we had an enough of you guys. Chuck Grassley, you're 700 years old. You're going to have to step down at some point. At some point, we're going to get upset about all this.

19:12Freddie, the picture Anthony paints there, it's a bit like the uni party here, this kind of establishment that's all in it. But the Democrats, they loathe Donald Trump, but they seem to be trying to emulate him now. There's a lot of talk of them running ever more extreme and populist candidates of their own. I've heard people tell me in Washington, Oh, maybe they'll run AOC at the next presidential election. It feels like the techniques are being copied on both sides, even if the politics isn't. Yes. And just in the way that Trump ate the Republican Party in the 2010s, I think, you know, you can make a credible argument that Democratic Socialists of America are in the process of eating the Democratic Party.

19:51Well said. You know, the DSA was a fringe group until very, very recently, really. And then, you know, they had certain victories. AOC won in, was it 2018, Anthony? AOC won, I forget. I think it was 2018. Yeah, AOC won in 2018. Remember, guys, she dropped her pronoun off her Twitter feed after the 24 election, right? So she's a very smart woman. She's very smart. A lot of her constituents voted for Trump. And they said, what the hell did you vote for Trump for? They said, well, we hate the culture. So she said, OK, I'm going to become less woke as a result of this. Don't underestimate her either.

20:25She's another very clever person. No, I absolutely don't. But for some of these DSA-backed candidates, Mamdami-backed candidates in New York, we had another in Denver recently, AOC is considered a bit soft and moderate. They are really defund police, abolish ICE, ban all immigration enforcement, foreign policy to the left of some of our Gaza independents over here. And so, you know, as I was saying earlier, I think the choice of America in the midterm seems to be kleptocracy with Trump or communism with the Democrats. It's not particularly enticing.

21:24Everything your operation needs, all in one place. Right now, qualified shippers get a real dedicated person to get you set up and switched over for free. So when peak season hits, you're ready to go. Switch today at ShipStation.com, code audio. I think that's very well said by Jimmy, but can I just say something to both of you guys? Because I was in the UK last week. Somebody said to me, well, who runs the Democratic Party? I said, well, I know who runs the Democratic Party. Really? Because we don't know who runs it. Who runs the Democratic Party? Donald J. Trump runs the Democratic Party. Okay.

21:59Because he has made them crazy. He is the white cue ball on the billiard table and he shoots himself into them and they go all over the place in totally different directions from each other. and what Jimmy's saying is totally true because now this democratic socialism, they think this is the way back into power. And guys, I don't know, you guys spent a time in this country? The country doesn't want that. I mean, New York may want it. Maybe there's pockets of coastal cities that want that. But the buckle of the Bible belt in this country, trust me, does not want that. And Trump is laughing at these guys.

22:36He props up Mondani. People say, Well, why is he prompting up Mondani? Hey, dummies, he wants Mondani to be the poster child of the Democratic Party coming into 26 and 28 so that they can stay in power. Anyway, I'm sorry, guys. I just had to get that in there. You have to understand what I'm living through because I'm here in New York dealing with this stuff. Well, we've both had some madness for the last decade. I mean, in that sense, who Trump decides to select as his successor becomes quite an important decision then, doesn't it? Because it sounds from what you're saying, like you think that person would have every chance of winning the presidential election.

23:11Who do you think is winning out of Vance and Rubio? And is there anybody else we should be watching in Britain that we're not really sort of on our radar yet? This is such a good question. But remember, two years in America is like, you know, 200 years. But politics are going to change so dramatically if he doesn't restore his political support. And again, don't underestimate him. He's capable of doing that. He's at a low right now, but he's a very talented politician. I mean, and I submit to you guys, I don't like him. I've been very candid about that. But he's the prodigious political figure of the first quarter of the 21st century, not just for America, but for the world.

23:54And he's cast a very large shadow over all of us. But if he doesn't get his political support up in the country, the person that he anoints may not do well. You have to remember, like, he's blowing himself up with his, you know, his podcast buddies who helped him win this sort of B-swarm of people. He's blowing himself up with those people because he's reneged on every single thing he said he was going to do in this term. okay and remember if you're if we're sitting here at seven dollar gas prices in 2028 uh with the strait of hormuz closed i don't care who he annoys it's gonna be very very tough but if you said okay who's he anointing it's clearly rubio over vance for right now but i'm going to tell you something about marco rubio you better get out of that administration after the midterms because trump is a shakespearean figure he's an aging queen he's an aging dowager okay and he'll shoot rubio before Rubio can fully ascend, because that's what Trump does.

24:56He eats his young. Okay. And if you don't believe me, ask Pence, ask Pompeo, ask Nikki Haley. Okay. And he's already put Vance in the wood chipper, you know, like that Fargo wood chipper. Vance has already gone through the wood chipper and he'll come after Rubio before Rubio can leave the nest. And so if Rubio's smart, he'll say, Hey, this was great. I'm running for president and I'm resigning from my post as Secretary of State before Trump fires. And is there anybody else we should be watching? I mean, are there any governors who are coming up on the rails or is Nikki Haley coming back for another go?

25:32There's no chance. There's no chance. I mean, if those two guys flame out, then we can talk about that whole cast of people. But remember, the Republicans are very different from the Democrats. They anoint and then they get around each other. Trump was an unusual figure there because they were trying to annoy Jeb Bush. And he came in and crushed everybody. But he's a different beast than these other people. Remember, he had the media personality. Your fellow Brit, Mark Burnett, helped him out. These guys don't have that. And they don't have his scale. And they don't have his influence over the base.

26:10Look at what he's done to these establishment Republicans this year. If you voted for him 99 % of the time, like Cornyn and Crenshaw, he blew you out of the party. Now, interestingly enough, he's not blowing Susan Collins up because he knows that he doesn't have a replacement for Susan Collins in Maine, right? So he hates Susan Collins, but due to political expediency, he's not saying anything about her. But in Texas, because it's a red as red can be state, he blew those guys up. And look what he did to Cassidy in Louisiana, right? So Trump is a very powerful figure in that party. They're very afraid of him.

26:49And I predict that that will stay the course until 2028. Remember, you also did something no other American president has done. He raised$400 million for his PAC. That is a message to all those guys. If you're not falling in line with me, I'm going to use this money against you, even though you're in my own party. You love this guy? I mean, this guy's a piece of work. I mean, this guy is a really, I mean, he's the highest grade level of narcissism. It's almost like weapons grade narcissism. You know, it's in a weird way. It's like very impressive. You said he can turn this around. Are there things he might do?

27:26What might a sort of Donald Trump with two years left do? What might he do on Ukraine? What might he do on Iran? What might he do with the Chinese? Is there anything that you think might sort of shake the world again? Well, he'll do nothing. He'll do nothing on Ukraine because he's a slave to Vladimir Putin. Putin's got something on him. We don't know what that is, but he just goes down the Putin checklist, berate the British prime minister, attack the French president, do nothing for Vladimir Zelensky, belittle him in the Oval Office. I mean, he goes right down the Putin list of everything that he needs to do to satisfy Putin.

28:01So nothing will happen in Ukraine. The Ukrainians and the Europeans will have to figure that out without Trump. I think the Middle East is a different beast. I think he'll try to negotiate a piece there and get the straight open. The bad news for America is he'll be paying more money than the JCPOA, the deal that Obama negotiated. But he'll get the straight open, and that'll hopefully lower prices. And then he'll have a productivity boom in the US because of all the ascent of all this new technology. And that could help him. Because if prices go down, he's got the name brand, and that could help him.

28:37But just remember, guys, I want to leave you with a thought, okay? Obama was wearing a tan suit and Fox News went crazy. I mean, every anchor set their hair on fire over Obama's tan suit. I want you to imagine Obama, okay, starting a war and creating a quagmire that's going to cost the country several hundred billion dollars. I want you to imagine Obama trading in his personal account to the tune of$2.2 billion. dollars. I want you to imagine the right-wing outrage at Obama for doing stuff like that. And yet these guys are all falling in line. So on our anniversary, our 250th birthday, the spirit of hypocrisy lives in the country.

29:22Because if Obama did this stuff, my God, they would have gone crazy on him. But they sit there and they're like, hey, yeah, no big deal. It's fine. Freddie, what Anthony's talking about there is effectively a party and a whole political system that's kind of being held captive by Donald Trump's whims and desires. Even when he's not around, that may be the case to a degree. It feels like whatever he does or doesn't do, everybody's either embracing it or pushing against it. And that sort of is going to define things as long as he's around. I think Anthony's quite right. Trump is the titanic figure of American politics and world politics at the moment.

29:59I do think that in some of Vance's remarks, there is a little bit of the kind of not quite Trump derangement syndrome, but certainly that sort of hatred of Trump overwhelms everything. And he does. He makes it very hard to see the wood from the trees because he just occupies so much of everyone's emotional bandwidth and so on. So it's very hard to talk about America at 250 without talking about Donald Trump. Trump, I just think on that one key issue, immigration, he is the one politician who, using executive power, has done things that lots of Western governments would like to do. Yeah. And he has succeeded on it.

30:35And the insults he gives to the British leadership, where he says, you've got it wrong on immigration, and you've got it wrong on drilling the North Sea. I think there's quite a lot of conservatives in Britain would agree with every word of that and would quite like someone to listen to him. I mean, maybe it's not the case that coming from Trump, it's likely to be persuasive here. But he seems to be profoundly correct on both of those points. If a British politician could bring down energy prices and stop immigration, they would be extremely popular. Yeah. And Donald Trump has done that. And it's not clear.

31:04Well, until Iran. I mean, Keir Starmer has not done that. It doesn't look like that's going to be a priority for Andy Burnham. Trump's made a few comments about Burnham. How on earth do you imagine that relationship going? I bet what will happen is what always happens. Like when Donald Trump met Bamdami, everybody says, oh, there's got to be fireworks. And then they meet and Donald Trump says, he's the greatest guy I've ever met. You know, I love him. I love his voice or something like that. You know, he'll say that. And that's what Trump always does. He's very nice about people. Does Trump like black T-shirts and bomber jackets?

31:33That's the question. I mean, he does dress properly. I think, yeah, Trump might struggle with that. He didn't like it in Zelensky, did he? Yeah, exactly. This is not the kind of kit you wear to the White House. Let's hope Andy Burnham looks on it. Maybe Bernard will stick a tie on for the occasion. But he's already effectively said, you know, foreign policy, I'm going to leave that to maybe David Miliband and Jonathan Powell and I'm not going to try and suck up to Donald Trump. But this relationship, this 250 years of, you know, kind of symbiotic kind of existence with the Americans, it's not a luxury that a British Prime Minister can afford.

32:04It's very – to just go, I don't care about the American president. It's not on the cards. And the extent to which our future growth, you know, tech, obviously, such a huge area. And, you know, we were discussing in conference this morning, this worrying sort of slightly Luddite thinking in a lot of what's coming up from Burnham and his camp. That, you know, we don't want to be, what were you talking about, unfettered technological optimism. He doesn't like that. He doesn't like that. Doesn't think the public likes it. What he's really talking about is economic growth, which, again, is the one thing the British people really, really need.

32:40Yeah. And if you want to spend a load of things on socialist projects, it kind of helps if you've got some money to spend. Well, quite. It seems to be the missing piece in all of this. So on energy, tech and immigration, Trump has given a lot of things we could learn from his presidency. And do you ever sort of – you have got any predictions of the next sort of – let's forget the next 250 years, the next 250 days? I mean, Anthony's view on the midterms is a little away from the mainstream, I think. Anthony may be right. But my view is that they will lose the House in the midterms. And I'm beginning to think the Senate at the moment.

33:17But I think that's going to be pretty tight. And so after that, then you're just going to get lawfare again. I think you're going to get Trump being impeached. There'll be a lot on all this corruption. It's going to be a very difficult final two years to his presidency. And unless he can sort of magic the American economy to sort of rev up magnificently again and make the whole public think that he's giving them this golden age that he promised, I fear it's going to end badly. I know we haven't got you for much longer, Anthony, but last one, 30 seconds. Well, last time I met you, you were basically hinting you knew who killed JFK.

33:50Yeah. What can you tell us? Well, I can't tell you that, but I definitely know who killed JFK. I mean, you know, listen, I'll just take you back to what's publicly reported. OK, and that's the 1977 House Committee on Assassinations. They said without a doubt that there was a conspiracy to kill John F. Kennedy. And they refuted the Warren Commission saying that it was a lone gunman. And so I'll just leave you with that. And obviously, you've got a lot of people out there that say that it's a lone gunman. and I said and I predicted this when I read the file I told Trump you can't release the file and then he was still wanted to release it Pompeo talked him out of it thank God and then he got mad at Pompeo and then he said another campaign promise he was going to release the file and he released a bunch of nonsense and I'm as sure as I'm sitting here talking to you guys that file is never getting released okay maybe long after we're all dead that file will get released, but it's just not something that the American government should release.

34:52And that's more or less what I said to you. But, you know. You said there was a book that got kind of close to it that wasn't quite there, but what should we go and read? Yeah, Stefano Vaccaro wrote a book about the assassination. He's an Italian journalist. And I think he got as, I think he got, you should read that book. I'll just leave it to you. I'll leave it to you with that. You read that book, you get a good sense for what happened. It's not 100 % accurate, but it's pretty close. And that's public information, which I am allowed to talk about. Anthony, thank you very much for joining us.

35:28All right, guys. Great to be on with you both. And I'm sorry that we were traitors and we broke from your great country, but I'm glad we still love each other. And even though Trump is a little bit of a pain in the ass, ignore him and understand that the American people love you guys. Thanks, Anthony. Very great. Thank you very much for your time. Thanks, Tim Dirt. Thank you to all of you for tuning in.

36:30We'll see you next time.