Isabel Hardman's Sunday Roundup - 18/10/2026

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0:37Hello and welcome to Coffeehouse Shots, the Spectator's daily politics podcast. I'm Isabel Hardman and this is the Sunday Roundup. This week, ministers face questions over Donald Trump's dealings with Russia and Zak Polanski defends his position on the Green Party's Zionism motion. Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has described Donald Trump's recent deals with Russia as a reward for Vladimir Putin. On Sky News, Aisha Hazarika asked Health Secretary Yvette Cooper whose side she thought Trump was on. Well, look, the US have been one of our closest allies for a very long time. We work very closely with the president, just as we work very closely with previous presidents.

1:22So, of course, that is a hugely important relationship as part of NATO. I'm just going to ask you the question again. Given the actions we've seen from Donald Trump this week, whose side do you think he's on? So, I presume what you're talking about is what we've seen around Ukraine. And as you'll know... Does he want Ukraine to win or does he want Russia to win? Because right now, most right-minded people think he wants President Putin to win. Well, look, the US are part of the NATO alliance and the NATO alliance has been very clear about the threat from Russia, not just to Ukraine, but to the whole of the alliance, to other alliance members, to the whole of Europe.

2:02We've been very clear that Ukraine's security is also our security. It's the Europe's security. It's also UK's security. So, look, of course, we've taken a different view on the issue about the need to keep increasing sanctions, and we will continue with that. But we also play a really important role. You've heard the Prime Minister talk about the role that the UK plays in terms of drawing that NATO alliance together. Well, look, no other NATO ally would be doing deals with President Putin on diesel, would they? As I said, we have taken a different view on this. We've taken a different approach and we will continue to...

2:42So he's wrong. Why don't you just say, beyond all doubt, President Trump is wrong on this? We have taken a different view. And we've said this, look, there's a series of areas. But why can't you see it? Why can't you see it? You've heard what the Prime Minister has said about this and the important role of the UK in pulling the NATO alliance together on this. And we're going to need to continue to do that. That's really important. But we can also be very clear, we have a different view to the United States president on this. I would also say I think there are different views within the United States on this as well.

3:16And we've seen that. And we've seen that through in recent years. We've seen different views coming to the fore at different times. So you do have to recognise... Look, I can tell you my strong personal views around the support for Ukraine. I can tell you our collective views about the government's support for Ukraine. But we do also have to recognise the crucial diplomatic role that the Prime Minister and the rest of the government have to play in pulling everybody together in order to support Ukraine. And that's crucial. We are at a pivotal juncture in this conflict, and this has been the week which many people think could have profound consequences in terms of Ukraine.

3:58This is, you know, we've all been doing the same thing. We've had European leaders bowing and scraping to Donald Trump, saying that they want to be a bridge. It's clearly not working. Isn't now the time, if we support Ukraine, and clearly we do, we saw how the Prime Minister welcomes Zelensky, isn't it time just to be clear? In fact, Donald Trump respects a bit of strength. Isn't it time to say, President, you are wrong on this and just say it? We have taken a different view from the United States in a series of different areas and we've done different things. So, for example, while I was Foreign Secretary, we took a clearly different view on Iran.

4:36We did not support the offensive action against Iran and I continue to strongly believe that that was the right decision by the United Kingdom So there are a whole series of times where we take a different view and we do different things. We are continuing to increase our sanctions on Russia, including on oil and gas, exactly because we think it is so important in order to put pressure on Russia and on Putin. But we do need to... You do also need to recognise, and I think most people will recognise across the country, we're not commentators. So I totally understand there are things that you can say, and I understand that and respect that.

5:14There are things that you can say, but there are also things that you would expect the Prime Minister to handle things in a slightly different way. Hazarika also asked former CIA Director General David Petraeus for his reading of Trump's actions. And look, many people have been really struck by Donald Trump's behaviour this week, the throttling of the use of Starlink, the lifting of the sanctions, calling for Zelensky to go. What's been your reaction to his behaviour? What have you read into that? Well, I think that this reflects, again, some frustration that he has not been able to do what he said he would do prior to the taking office, which, of course, was to end the war in 24 hours, in fact.

6:00I think some of it probably reflects shock that there'd do domestic politics in Washington in the final weeks before a midterm election, the polls for which indicate that he likely loses at least one of the houses of our Congress. And there always has been this relationship that he's had with Putin for many, many years. And of course, there is some historic enmity that he's had that dates back to Trump 1.0 and the relationships that existed at that time with President Zelensky all around President, Biden's son's activities out there. So you put all that together, and it does not result in the most consistent of policies, to be sure.

6:49But right now, this limitation on the speed that an aircraft can go and still be connected to Starlink, the military version of it actually, is a real handicap for the Ukrainians. And President Zelensky has been very forthright in noting that. Keep in mind that Starlink does not extend into Russia very far at all. So this is not what is needed to conduct the quite devastating strikes that Ukraine has been carrying out against Russian refineries, logistics distribution centres, military industrial targets and so forth. And look, President Zelensky has said that the Starlink satellite system is still not up to speed.

7:34He's saying that it's still not working. He is saying that lives have been lost as a result of this. Many people say that President Trump has blood on his hands. Would you agree with that? Well, I just don't know. I actually talked to people in the government two nights ago who are in the circles where they would know if there has been a policy change, and they actually said there has been no policy change, and there have been fingers pointed in all directions here in Washington. So it's hard to know what really is going on, Who is it that gave the direction to not allow Starlink to continue to communicate when aircraft go more than 160 kilometers an hour?

8:15So that's about 100 miles an hour. And obviously that limits the effectiveness in particular of the drone interceptor elements in Ukraine, which often have to fly faster than that speed to catch up to the drones that they're trying to knock out of the sky. It doesn't limit them in the front lines. There was a period, in fact, when I was flying home from the Warsaw Security Forum, when I was receiving texts from directly and indirectly from frontline unit commanders saying that they were losing control of their formations because at that time it was completely shut down. That is not the case anymore, and that is a big relief for all of them and for all of us who support Ukraine and want to see them prevail in this war against what really is still, at the end of the day, a brutal, unprovoked invasion by the Russian Federation.

9:05On the BBC, Laura Koonsberg asked Green Party leader Zak Polanski whether he believed Zionism was inherently racist after his party's conference passed a motion saying so. Well, Zak Polanski is with us in the studio. Thank you very much indeed for coming in. Now, there's been a lot of heat, a lot of noise. I think what we'd like to start by focusing on is what you, as the Green Party leader, believe yourself. So what do you believe about Zionism? Is it, in your view, inherently racist? Well, the first thing I'd say is I don't think this is actually controversial. I think what's controversial is that 75 ,000 Palestinians have been murdered in the last few years, including more child amputees than ever in modern history.

9:45So when you take that to account, the fact that they're being murdered because they're Palestinian, that's very obviously a racist ideology. You don't think it's controversial to say that Zionism is racist? As I say, I think the controversial thing is that Western governments across the world have turned away while Palestinians have been murdered because they're Palestinian. That's very clearly racist. That's quite obvious. But everyone listening will hear that I asked you a question about your belief of Zionism, and you immediately answered talking about something else, which many people have watched around the world and been absolutely horrified by.

10:19I am asking, is it your view, as the Green Party leader, that Zionism itself is inherently racist? Well, the reason why I'm answering that question is because rather than have a debate about semantics, it's about the practical application of Zionism. Your party has just had a debate about the semantics. That is exactly what the conversation has been about, which is why it's really important to understand what your belief is. This is exactly about semantics and definition. But you said I was missing from a debate, and actually before that debate I went on TV several times, including spoke to Financial Times, and explained that I think Zionism is racism in the practical application of it.

10:57Now the conference had a debate about the motion, about the word. I said I think debates about words are unhelpful, and I still think that. But if we're talking about what's happening in Palestine right now, people are dying every single day. And my party is unified on saying this government is still arming that genocide. We're still selling arms licenses. We're still sharing intelligence. And we've not boycotted divestment and sanctioned. That's what we need to do. So do you accept that for many Jewish people, Zionism is simply the right to have a safe place to live, a homeland? Do you accept for many people that is what it means?

11:32I think that's what people think it means, but actually in practical application, which is what we're talking about here, that homeland has come to the cost of the Palestinian people. I want equal rights for Israelis and Palestinians, but practical application of Zionism has not resorted in that. On GB News, Camilla Tominy asked Reform UK board member Gawain Towler about an ITV investigation that filmed reform councillors and candidates using racist, sexist and violent language. Let's look at the documentary as a whole. I mean, there is an argument for saying Channel 4, now ITV... I'm sure there'll be more.

12:08..is reformed victim of a witch hunt. I'd point out that Dominic Cummings quite rightly identified that you were going to be under more scrutiny than any other party. And we've known that for a long time. And therefore the party needs to rise above, right? The party needs to make sure it's, for want of a better phrase, whiter than white. And then you get, unfortunately, these people expressing really quite vile racist remarks. I mean, what's your evaluation of some of the comments that have been made? Utterly grim, some of them. Utterly grim. And happily, some of them have gone, these people. But in reality, we do not know what's inside a man's soul.

12:49You can ask them questions, they can lie to you. Yes. No matter how much you vet, you can ask, you can probe, But people can still lie to you. And this is, I think, what may have happened in some cases. But also, if you're trying to vet, no matter how hard you, whatever processes you've got, with thousands and thousands, again, to the other parties, they've been going for a long time. They get to know people over a long period of time. This is very quick, two years, really. And in that time, you don't have all that hinterland and that background knowledge of people. But it does mean we are under more scrutiny, of course.

13:22Why? Well, because we threaten everything. We threaten not just the Tories, but Labour, the establishment, Whitehall, big business, everything. So, therefore, we will be under target. You're going to find bad eggs in every party. But what is it about reform that seems to attract so many racists? Well, I don't think it does. There are some, yes, and happily. I mean, in some ways, it's a case of we do our vet and then there's other vets, isn't there? But you're talking about... Well, you say that, you do your vet. We talk about 5 ,000 people and there's a handful who are dodgy. All right, but these guys did get elected to fairly senior positions in councils, right?

14:01Well, councillors, they're councillors. But no other party vets its councillors. We do, but we haven't done it perfectly. Part of the vetting, and this was a part of the documentary that disturbed me, was part of the vetting was, oh, if I were you, I would delete those supportive messages about Tommy Robinson. I mean, that's not quite vetting, is it? That's saying to someone, erase some of your history so that you've jumped through a few hoots? If I hadn't... I hadn't seen that bit, but I'm aware of it. Because I'm waiting for tonight to watch it. Yeah. But if... That wasn't one of our vetters.

14:33That was just a local person talking to him. It wasn't part of the vetting team. So somebody local was saying, look, if you've got that, just get rid of it, because when you go to vetting, they'll catch it and get you out. So it wasn't part of our vetting team that did that. It was somebody advising somebody. They needed to find enough people to stand in the election. We don't know if we're going to win them or not. paper candidates, this, that and the other. I don't think it's right, but he wasn't part of our vetting team. He was just giving local advice. OK. There's a lot of question marks at the moment about whether Nigel Farage has got the right people around him.

15:03I'm going to name somebody who you'll be familiar with, Raheem Kassar. Yeah. Right? I saw him, actually, at one of the press conferences fairly recently. Yeah, he's in the States, he's here. OK, he is a kind of, I don't know, self-styled Nigel Farage fanboy. Well, he was Niger's press officer years ago. Right. Then he went to the States and has become very MAGA. He's become very MAGA. He was at a press conference. Yeah, he's around. He's aligned to not affiliated with reform. Is that fair enough? I think that's fair, yes. OK. He's described Kemi Badenok as, quote, a Nigerian scammer saying, don't give her your credit card number and bank details.

15:41You're laughing. I'm laughing at him. Yeah, but it's like, how many of these people do you want tarring you all with the same brush? How many of these people who have just got a habit of literally saying the wrong thing do you want associated with your esteemed leader if you're going to convince the nation this man can be Prime Minister? I think we do need a... We need somebody strong at the centre who has got experience in management particularly, experience of dealing with people. we sometimes have our structures are such that it's a bit chaotic. I put it this way. We like a corner shop that became Morrison's in two years.

16:25And the staff, the team, the structures, everything has to change, and it does change. But that doesn't happen overnight. It doesn't. Mistakes are made. And whilst it is astonishing what we've achieved in professionalising and getting everything together, while you've got this massive growth, there's no doubt Raheem is loyal to a T to Nigel. He is. But what's this whole thing about? I get that they're the enemy as far as you're concerned, the Conservatives, but is it right to be expressing concerns? I'm asking you an open question about the Nigerianness of Kemi Badenok and consequently her fitness for office as the opposition leader.

16:59She has been elected by the Tory party. She's their leader. Do it. Back on Sky News, Yvette Cooper said NHS staff who inappropriately access medical records need to be sacked after two ambulance staff were suspected of accessing the records of William Chapman, who was killed at Yorkshire Wildlife Park. Just one final question to you. Sky News reported on Friday that the medical records of the man killed in the tiger enclosure were breached by staff at Yorkshire Ambulance Service. and this was just days after he'd been killed in tragic circumstances, there have been other reports of quite serious data breaches in the NHS.

17:40What's your response to that? I take this extremely seriously. I know there's a specific investigation going into that case, but we just need to be absolutely clear. No member of NHS staff should be accessing records that they do not need to see for medical care and reasons simply for something to do with voyeurism or what is in the news or any of that kind of reason. Not only is it a total disgrace, but we've also... I've spoken to the NHS chief executive about this. We agree that if there are cases here of people inappropriately accessing medical records, then they should be suspended while the investigation takes place, and we need a much swifter line on this because these are basic standards, and everybody across the NHS knows that these are the basic standards.

18:29The overwhelming majority of our NHS staff not only respect these standards, but value these standards as critical for privacy. And these people need to be sacked. And we have to have firm action against this. And these people should be sacked. If there are breaches, then people actually need to be sacked. And Laura Koonsberg asked Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary Helen Wakeley whether the Conservatives' tough love message on youth unemployment was missing part of the problem. Well, yes. I mean, the announcement today is particularly calling on the government to take action in the budget. and to back businesses to employ more young people.

19:02What's going on there is we've got 1 million young people who are NEAT, not in employment, educational training, and an increase in youth unemployment under this government of 174 ,000. 174 ,000 more young people unemployed under Labour because their policies have killed jobs. So let me just answer your question about this. So we're saying the government needs to... Well, our example, we've announced a policy that we would halve the jobs tax, because that's the national insurance rate for 21 to 24-year-olds, so that there will be more jobs for young people to go into. But there is lots of evidence of why some young people don't feel able to go out and look for work is because of conditions that they are suffering, whether that's ADHD or autism.

19:43Do you think that your kind of tough love message is the right one? Aren't you missing part of the problem here? Actually, so we're looking at both sides of the problem. On the one hand, making sure that there are jobs for young people to go into who've been particularly hard hit by the 300 ,000 fewer jobs under Labour. And I mean, talking to employers, I was in a salon visiting with Kemi and some of the Shadow Cabinet last week and talking to the salon owner there who told us she's not going to be able to keep on her apprentices this year. She usually would because of the cost of employing people and how hard is the business.

20:15So on the one hand, we need more jobs. And actually talking about mental health, it's incredibly distressing for a young person to be applying and applying and getting endless reductions because it's hard to get a job at the moment. But we are also saying that what we need to recognise is the way the welfare system isn't helping people who are struggling with their mental health and neurodiversity. That's all for this week. I'm Isabel Hardman and this podcast was produced by Joe Bidel Brill. If you enjoy Coffeehouse Shots, don't forget to click the follow button on whatever platform you are listening to us on.

20:49That way you'll get the latest episodes straight to your feed as soon as it's released. and do subscribe to our daily Evening Blend email. It's a free round-up of all the political news each day, along with analysis and a diary on what to expect next. Just go to spectator.co.uk forward slash blend. Thanks for listening and I hope you join us again next week.

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