Why Dentists Need a Personal Brand More Than Ads | Dr. Tyler Hales

0:00One, dentists aren't great businessmen initially, right? And so they need help. But what they're doing is they're telling dentists, they're saying, hey, let me take over marketing for you, make these trending videos, right? And what's happening is these dentists aren't actually creating a brand for themselves. They're buying the marketing team's brand because their brand is just pushing all of it through it. So every dentist that's underneath this marketing team, they're just pushing the same brand for every dentist, right? It's not unique at all. And it's not actually building their own personal experience.

0:30Welcome to another episode of Talkings. When I first met you, I'm like, this guy looks cool. He's got a bow tie on. He's got a mullet. You know, like he's just got class. He's got style. I got to ask you, what is it that motivated you to have a distinguished look like that? a unique look like that in the world of dentistry and just run with it on social media? Yeah, growing up, I was always into fashion. I like shopping and things like that. But really, the biggest impact for me was actually my grandpa. So when I was in dental school, and I was about to graduate, he was one that always set an example for me.

1:11So he was an anesthesiologist. And what he would do is he actually got dressed in the morning in his suit, and he would drive to work and he would get to the hospital and then he would change into his scrubs and he'd work all day. He would finish his day and then he would change back into a suit and drive home. Right. And his whole representation was like, if I'm going to be the best, I'm going to look the best. Right. And that was really the, the, what he recommended for me when he sat me down and when I was graduating down school and he told me that that was his advice. He's like, if you want to be the best, you look the best.

1:45And so that was the initial thought is, okay, well what am I going to do to really stand out and be who I want to be because dentistry is kind of boring you know when you think about dentists you kind of think nerds or you think about you know just kind of a this guy in some scrubs that's going to dig into my mouth and make me go through hell for an hour yeah so it's the way that I can really show my personality right I love bow ties is something my grandpa was big into and that's evolved into really being the bow tie dentist and and then as you learn from branding, what's important. I love it.

2:19You know, I love obviously personal branding. I'm a big personal brand guy myself. And for me, personal branding has totally changed the landscape of my entire business, especially, and we were just talking about this, like for my own personal growth. How has personal branding helped you, helped your business and helped you personally? Yeah, it's definitely the most important aspect. that's really gotten me to the level that I'm at now within dentistry. At first, when I joined my practice initially, I started taking over the marketing, and I looked at all the different aspects. And I actually stopped looking at dental marketing because all the marketing companies just suggested the same thing over and over again, right?

3:02Paid per clicks, like we've got to get SEO, we've got to get your website. And to me, that wasn't really the answer that I was looking for. I was like, there's no way we're going to really be able to beat anyone else out with this type of marketing. And so I started actually looking at other aspects, other businesses and what they were doing. And really influencers, this was really when influencing started to take off. And I was like, why are these people so successful? Why are influencers like people trust influencers, right? They ask for their suggestions no matter what. They care about their opinion.

3:33And I was like, what is it about these people that are so relatable but also so trustworthy? and it's really their branding influencers are amazing at branding themselves uh where people trust them and so for me i saw that and i wanted to try to create that within my own brand and so once i started getting into that right it's about letting them see who i am and they understand and then building that within the professional of dentistry really that's so cool that what year was that when you started uh building your brand so this was like 2019 was probably when i really started uh focusing on my my personal brand nice i barely started in 2023 2022 2023 but i went all in i went all in on personal brand it was like i quit my regular job built my brand yeah you know but then that obviously we were talking about you know how that the business has been just exploding as a result of me building my personal brand investing my personal brand and i'm personally investing in it the company's not investing in i'm personally investing because i see the opportunity that's going to be outside because i live now and breathe as my own entity because of personal branding so the opportunity opportunities just knock all the time and i feel like that's what it's doing for you because we're meeting at masterminds i'm sure there's collaboration opportunities gonna be more collaborative opportunities every podcast you go on yeah and I think like going all in just like you said is one of the big aspects of what's made you so successful at it right because most people don't want to do that they want to you know dip their toe in and kind of feel it out and be like okay is this is this worth it is it working and really it's not going to be successful and you don't see it you don't see it like you're like why am I building my personal and then you'll get like your spouse but like why are you so egocentric just in front of a camera or whatever you know yeah and it's like no this is like what personal brand he is you know like it's not ego it's like this is what it takes yeah and and it's interesting like i've learned a lot throughout these years and i think if you actually would go back in high school and you would tell people like hey dr hale or tyler hale is gonna be right this big cosmetic dentist who's treating celebrities like no one would have believed you right um because at that time like i i was very uh just like conservative like i didn't care to be you know the most outgoing person i didn't need to be the life of the party you know i enjoyed my friends and and we kind of did our thing and as we kind of grew this brand right it's it's changed definitely changes on who you you need to be and uh being this type of dentist like i love it i love what i do i love showcasing that i love being you know in front of the camera more now than ever before because it is your brand and you're excited about that and you do have to go all in it's risky but when you do it it's passionate and everything you do is driven towards that now we talked about this and you're launching a course and you're like well my course is not going to be a traditional dentistry course my course is going to be how to teach dentists how to brand themselves which is a course that's never been done and a lot of people if you talk to a dentist five years ago they'd be like that's the most useless course ever now you tell dentists i'm launching this course they're gonna be like i'm buying that course because they need that course yeah or else they're gonna be extinct this course needs to happen for dentistry right the what what we're seeing trending within dentistry is all the marketing people honestly there's a ton of money in dentistry like if you actually look at a lot of marketers sales people like they're all trending towards dentistry and getting involved because one dentists aren't great businessmen initially right and so they need help but what they're doing is they're telling dentists they're saying hey let me take over marketing for you make these trending videos right and what's happening is these dentists aren't actually creating a brand for themselves they're buying the marketing team's brand okay because the brand their brand is just pushing all of it through it is so every dentist that's underneath this marketing team, they're just pushing the same brand for every dentist, right?

7:48It's not unique at all. And it's not actually building their own personalized brand. So what my idea in this course that I'm going to create is how to take it individual and change the mindset around dentistry and create the brand for themselves. I love that. Now, before the cameras, before all the clients, what what is it that drew you to dentistry why don't you do anesthesiology why don't you do you know some other medicine yeah so I actually wanted to do anesthesia all growing up my dad was an anesthesiologist my great my grandpa was an anesthesiologist so I was gonna follow in their footsteps I love the idea behind just the medicine and how being able to help people and when I was in college I finally actually started to think for myself and be like you know what am I actually passionate about and it wasn't that my dad or my grandpa pushed me to do this it just I love the idea of like kind of being the legend and then like following in the footsteps of my my family but when I thought about it it was like that wasn't interesting to me I was only doing it because of that idea and so when I went and researched all the different professions within like medicine which I enjoyed medicine I knew that's something I wanted to be in.

9:09Dentistry was something where you're working with your hands, you're working with individuals, you're creating relationships. And that was really important to me. I love to learn by doing things. I love working with my hands. And so this profession really just kind of fell into my lap when I figured out this is exactly what I want to do. You know, it's, uh, of all, I mean, I, of all the medicines, I feel like, you know, but you specifically went into cosmetic which is i don't know is that an extra two years so with cosmetics it's interesting there's not really a specialty within cosmetics so technically every dentist can say they're a cosmetic dentist they don't need additional training to do that right um they're trying to push now that there is going to be additional training that needs to be done to have the title of cosmetic dentistry right like you you have to go to special training if you want to be an endodontist or an orthodontist or periodontist These are all specialties, and it's a certain degree that you get from it.

10:07And then an oral maxillofilial surgeon, it's like another four years. Yeah, four to six years, right? So you've got to have all this extra training to be able to get that. And to be honest, I see it as a problem because the problem is we're seeing a ton of dentists now just doing cosmetic dentistry without really the right training, one. And I think it's a disservice for our patients, but also a disservice for dentistry. There's a ton. Because there's a variance in veneers now. You see somebody like, oh, he went to a cheap doctor. Yeah. And unfortunately, I see it, right? Like, I've become known to, like, be the fixer, right?

10:43I have to go and fix all those problems from what other dentists are doing. And so, again, with my course, it's like I want to help these doctors understand real cosmetics and how to take and level up of the expectation to where the cosmetics is, you know, It becomes the standard instead of the poor quality that we get. Now, I want to talk about a topic that's near on my heart, near on your heart, and that's insurance. A lot of people aren't happy with insurance. You said something about insurance earlier today, and let's just dive into insurance. What are your thoughts on insurance? Is it helping the general Americans out there who have dental insurance?

11:28Is it worth getting? And, you know, can you use it on on veneers? Yeah. So that is one of the questions I get asked the most is, can you use my insurance towards the veneers? Right. Or cosmetics? And the answer is no. No. Like there's no way any dental insurance. Regardless of what insurance you get. Regardless of what insurance you have. I've yet to see an insurance company that does have money towards cosmetics. now they're the problem is that a lot of dentists will be what's called in network right with these insurance companies now that insurance company doesn't cover cosmetics right so they say well we don't cover nothing's gonna go to it but what they're doing is they're saying but as a dentist you can't charge whatever you want you have to charge what our fee is so some dentists right are stuck charging five hundred six hundred dollars for a veneer right when the lab costs to get really high-end cosmetics is anywhere between like$500 to$1 ,000, maybe$1 ,500 just for the lab costs, right?

12:36So that means that dentists are having to go to China and get some cheap, cheap veneers just to be able to cover that cost, right? So insurance, honestly, I think is a huge disservice to— That's a one-off veneer if they broke a tooth. That's a one-off, right? And at the end of the day, insurance, if you buy insurance, dental insurance, right? You put all this money towards it, they're only going to maximize usually about$1 ,000 towards your treatment. So let's say you need a crown at the end of the day, this year, you pay dental insurance every month, right? Well, that crown is worth, it costs$1 ,800 to get it done.

13:14But insurance is only going to cover$1 ,000. So their coverage doesn't even always include what an entire amount of treatment plan would be. and that insurance companies they haven't increased that amount it's been a thousand dollars for like 50 years right so inflation right everything's going up but dental insurance is refusing to actually put any more towards what your coverage would be but they're charging you more each year to cover their so we feel inflation with our insurance costs but they don't adjust for inflation to their providers. Yeah. So, and you're seeing more and more dentists where they're leaving, they're going what's called out of network, right?

13:57Where they're stopped going in network. The problem is dentists that are in network, they're getting, uh, the fee that insurance company is demanding for services. So general dentistry, like a filling or crown is so low that dentists are having to overpack their schedule just to kind of get by, You know what I mean? And so it really for the patients, if you're going to someone that's trying to pack, you know, 30, 40 fillings in a day, like I wouldn't want that on my mouth. So no one wants that. So I would rather pay more, get the service and get a filling that's going to last than try and like get just the cheaper option.

14:3630, 40 fillings some dentists are doing a day. Yeah, that is a brutal job. Yeah, so out of dental school, I went and worked out of a Medi-Cal office, and you had to do that. You're only getting paid$50 per filling, right? And people would come in, and they've got a full mouth of cavities because they, again, haven't seen a dentist in forever. And so we're filling that schedule full, and we're just doing a ton and ton of fillings. So initially, I was just doing extractions fillings all day long. Fun. Yeah. on a bunch of people in uh long beach in the ghetto well this was this was over in colorado yeah and i loved it honestly i learned a ton and i tried to be as create the care that i could right like i tried to do the best work i could and i learned so much being able to do that at that time and i learned that's not the way i wanted to do it the rest of my life i wanted to do it differently and that's really the stepping stones have taken me to where i've created what I've created this brand for.

15:37What's, what's your vision with the bow tie doctor? Like what do you envision with it? How is this brand going to impact dentistry and you know, your overall growth strategy? Yeah. I want to represent, I want to be a representation for dentistry, right? I think that dentistry has a bad, bad rap, right? When you think about your dentist, everyone's like, well, pain, bad smells, usually a fish tank in the front office, right? and usually not nice uh the offices aren't that great so i want to really change the mindset behind dentistry because what we do can actually be beautiful and can actually make a huge impact right like getting your cleaning can actually be a comfortable enjoyable experience ah i don't know about being comfortable enjoyable how do you do that you put like netflix on or something well yeah so we have tvs now right we have blankets we have um you know there's new machines that that aren't as painful where you're having to scratch and claw and poke your gums right um there's different topicals or numbing agents that we can use that aren't shots anymore um that we can use so there are processes that we can use to make it enjoyable and not have to be just that terrible experience you know every cleaning i've ever done has not been fun i would love to be just you know chilling numb watching netflix but the sound alone is like you know annoying yeah um we just actually interesting say that yesterday i went bought some apple headphones right and the idea is right you've got noise canceling headphones now okay there's so much new products out there that like again we don't think about these things right people hate people fear dentistry because of sounds and pain right so if we can eliminate sound and pain well how does that experience all that would change game changer yeah so exactly noise canceling headphones right okay blankets comfortable chairs uh yeah just the way that we take care of yeah netflix right so all these things we can create this process where it's not the same thing that we've had for the past 50 years that's awesome that's awesome now what was your when you when you were a kid did you decide like I know you were thinking and you wanted to be a doctor in medicine and was there a moment that sparked your your love for helping helping people feel more confident um I mean I've always enjoyed like leadership as a kid like so I was big into sports and always being like a team captain and like what and helping other kids grow and helping develop right that was always a huge passion of mine um and i think that that just kind of continued into my professional career where when i started doing dentistry fillings are fine but no one finishes the filling it's like that's the best experience i've ever had and like i feel so much more confident because this filling's done right so when i started doing cosmetics and i saw how it changed people's lives like these are the stories that that I have from like when someone started with me to like a year later and like their business went from like struggling for five years to all sudden doubling booming right in one year and not saying it was all due to the fact of the smile transformation but they come back and they go my confidence and the ability to go speak to people in sales like is life-changing and that was one of the factors that just completely changed it right and the psychology behind okay what does a smile do for people if you are having a bad day and you just smile right it does it changes the chemistry within your brain within your body to spike certain things to give you confidence to give you happiness joy right and so when people smile more there is this, um, there is a chemical balance that really changes, you know, who they are.

19:45And so the more I learned about it, the more like impact I could see that I could bring when I'm able to give these beautiful smiles and the artistry behind it. Like that's where I love getting crafty and like doing all these little things to make it look real. Um, and to be able to change the look that people can have in their lives. Artistry. I want to dive into that. So you're saying how much artistry is really involved in veneers? I thought it's like you send it to the lab, they give you your veneers, you pop them on. Like, do you got to be an artist to do that? Like, are your veneers better than the next guy's?

20:22Like, how do they differ? Yeah. So, right, again, with dentistry, cosmetics has always been where dentists didn't really have a say in much of the veneers. They would send a case to the lab. The lab designs it. The lab does what's called a wax up, sends it back. The dentist will prep the teeth. and then send it to the lab to then design the veneers. And there's not a lot of communication on like what is actually needing to be done. Um, we get them back and we see them. So early in my career, I did the same thing. I sent it to what I thought at the time was the top cosmetic labs, which they say, right.

20:58Um, and I would try to give them feedback on like, here's what I want, but I get the cases back and they were never exactly what I wanted. It was always kind of, if you looked at all the cosmetic dentistry, everyone was doing pretty much the same thing. There was no variety. And so I finally wanted to make a change. I was like, this is not, I'm not happy with what I'm getting and I need more control. And so I went and found a ceramist. His name is Daniel Yang. And we started to work together. And I was like, Dana, we've got to do this differently. And so he showed me how porcelain works. He showed me how he makes every veneer.

21:32And then we looked at the natural teeth and we pushed the limits on how do we create that natural characteristics but do it within porcelain and it's not just a one block one color thing it's actually layering hand layering porcelain to get that that depth and that reality to it but it comes with a knowledge between a dentist and a ceramist and so for us that's really what makes me different than everyone else and why we've been able to grow so quickly is like the attention in the detail, but also the effort that we put into making our veneers better each and every time. So now Daniel, his lab is actually next door to my office.

22:12We've created this process where it's just so unique and different than anything that's been done out there. That's so cool. So then your veneers are better than the next guy. I mean, that's the goal. Like I strive to be the best cosmetic dentist in the world and my veneers need to represent that and you're the coolest personal brand and cosmetic dentistry in the world so you know you got to match up to that of course it's all got to match um now can you walk us through the biggest turning point that led you to building your own personal brand biggest turning point um and hopefully the audience doesn't need a big turning point like maybe this this episode is enough yeah I mean I think it came down to a mindset to be honest there was I really was loving cosmetics but there were still like doubt in my mind a lot where um where I felt like I could become somebody right I always felt like there were better cosmetic dentists out there and um I'm still kind of new and I'm young right um Um, and I finally like realize, like just switch that, right.

23:25Take away the words of like, Oh, I'm anxious. I mean, I'm young, I'm inexperienced and realize that like, I'm as good as I want to be. And as long as I believe that. Right. And to be honest, I remember, um, I did, uh, this celebrity Madison LaCroix, I did her teeth. I remember going to work the day that she was coming into the office and we'd done a couple big, big name people before that. But I remember walking out my front door, walking to my car and I was like, today is the, I thought to myself, like today is going to be the first day of the rest of my life. Like, and that was the first time I, I felt super confident in like who I was as a dentist and that what I was doing was incredible right and maybe it took seeing a celebrity to kind of change my mindset but the reality was I was creating that for a long long time and she finally saw that and that's why she came to me but I as soon as I changed that like really started booming because I finally felt confident in myself how'd she find you was Instagram yeah on on social media um but again it was the branding celebrities are finding you yeah so where'd she drive in from LA no she's from South Carolina she flew in yeah she flew in from South Carolina flew in and then you how many veneers did she do so we did 20 veneers on her so we did top and bottom uh on her and really turned out six figures up yeah it's a big one yeah but uh yeah it was fun to kind of work with her she's incredible person and you know the same time a lot of pressure like you know she's on tv she's a beautiful girl like you don't want to screw it up and I think about that with all my patients like I want them to have this beautiful smile.

25:13And, you know, the details we put into her veneers, you know, that was an exciting day because I was like, okay, like I got this, right? And that was the confidence that I needed in myself that pushed me to really focus on myself and my brand. Now, we talked about something that I think the audience should know about, which is the impact that COVID had on material costs. And this is across the board in every industry, But how much have we seen material costs go up in the world of dentistry in the last five years? Yeah, COVID is rough. I mean, it's rough for everyone, right? I remember I was on a ski trip with my family, and we're literally driving back, and I'm getting messages about everything breaking out, and they're basically saying, like, every medical office has to close down, right?

26:02And I'm like, man, we are in big trouble because we had the unknown of what we were supposed to do and how long were we closed for so literally came back i think we got back on sunday and like monday we closed like uh with covid and we were closed for a long time um and it was crazy the dental in the dental world our supplies went up 4x like there's things that like at the time cost a dollar are now close to like five six dollars a piece um and it's across the board nothing stayed the same after COVID. And to me, I think they're, yeah, everything good went up in the world, but at the same time, it's like people took advantage of that opportunity as well.

26:46I think that just like, they're like, okay, great. Now we can push everything up. And, um, and that hurts us because how do I try to give my patients what they want without, you know, my goal is not to increase my fee. My goal is to always be affordable for as many people as possibly can. But when the underlying cost soars, then everything else has to go up. And then that spiked also employee pay. So after COVID, the dental field, especially for whatever reason, a lot of those employee payments went up. So we paid them a lot more to do the same job. And I love my staff. They're the best in the world.

27:25And my goal is always to have them be successful. Um, but it's tough when you're trying to, how do you do both, right? How do you make it affordable to patients, but also support a staff? And, you know, I don't think veneers are affordable. Like three grand a tooth is not that affordable. Yeah. The good ones definitely right. Um, like if they break a tooth and they got to get a veneer, is it, is there a difference between a veneer and veneer quality if they break a tooth versus the veneers that they put in for, um, not for me so again there are some doctors will be like okay a crown's gonna be cost different than a veneer right or an onlay there's all these different aspects to it um but insurance covers the one veneer well they they'll cover a crown but they won't cover a veneer right no the difference is a crown covers the back side of the tooth the veneer covers the front side but it's both made of porcelain it's both the process is exactly the same so why why is it a one over the back side yeah so like it covers the whole tooth so the inside of the tooth as well as the front side okay so veneer only covers partial of it but you know I think you know at the end of the day what is affordable right I think that's an that's an important concept because you know is a Rolex affordable no but how many people have Rolexes right because Rolex does a very good job at branding yeah I mean it's affordable if you get it from Rolex well because people want a Rolex or Rolex is not a watch okay in reality you're spending hundreds potentially tens to a hundred thousand dollar on a timepiece right when you can get one Walmart if you want but why do people want Rolex and why do people spend the money to buy Rolex it's because what Rolex has branded themselves as is it's like this accomplishment yeah so like and I felt this when I opened my office I I was like, okay, I feel like I need to go get a Rolex because we worked so hard for this.

29:21Like, that's my goal, right? And Rolex has done so well at doing that. But people can go and afford a Rolex because it's an accomplishment. It's something that they put their money towards and they want that. So if it's a want, then they're going to go and find a way to make that work.

29:41Now, let me ask you. um what did it feel like when you when you emotionally had to walk away from your from your partnership and then you had to go solo a lot of people especially because this is an entrepreneurship show a lot of people right now are struggling with their partners and they're like do i go solo should i go solo should i stay in this partnership or this bad marriage or whatever it is like what's what did it feel like to go solo yeah that's one of the hardest decisions i ever had to make when when I join something I want to be all in the reality and and when I make a commitment I want to make sure that I fulfill my commitment that's that's you know I like to live up to my word and that's important to me and the partnership was great for me for a while and things slowly began to change right like I really wanted to focus on the branding of the business and I wanted to focus on a branding of myself when that differs and all of a sudden your partners don't really care about the brand of the business, then how am I supposed to grow that?

30:47There's limitations when partnerships don't agree. And if you're building a personal brand, unless he was partners on the Bowtie Doctor. Yeah, right? I mean, yeah, so I had expectations for myself, and I wanted to exceed those, and there's money and time that I wanted to put into that that weren't— Joint funds. That resources weren't available. They weren't willing to put those resources. So, um, you've got to decide whether it's how good it is for yourself. Right. Um, and me leaving that partnership was the best decision for myself. Yeah. You went, yeah, it just, and, and to be honest, when I was finishing up on that partnership, it was, it was hard that like, I've actually been reading my journal, uh, these last couple, uh, since the beginning of the year back from two years ago of, of like that experience.

31:39because I want to remember, like, what was my mindset going through all this? Do you journal every day? I journal almost every day. For how long? So usually only like maybe 15, 20 minutes. So I get up, my schedule, I get up at 4.30, wake up, I go meditate, and then I journal and I read my Bible, and then I get ready for my day and go work out. I think that your morning routine is so important. I'm not saying everyone has to wake up at 4.30, but you've got to have a system that works for you that gets you ready for your day. And whether that's morning or whether you're a night person, right, there's got to be consistency there.

32:17Otherwise, you're just living life and you're going through the motions. Yeah, and I didn't ask you, but is that your morning routine? Wake up 4.30, do your Bible reading, do your journaling, do your workout, then go to the office? Yep. So I do that every single day. I can't tell you, honestly, I can't tell you the last time that I missed the day of doing that. So every day of work, that's important for me to start my day. Morning routine is clutch for me. I have to have a morning routine. And I'm updating it all the time. I'm, like, always studying stuff. Like, what can I do? Like, today, you know, I dipped my face in ice water.

32:59That's awesome. And then I was reading the benefits of doing that. I'm, like, I just added that. I'm like, oh, that's a quick one, you know, like 10 seconds. Well, it's hard. So I used to get up at like 530, right? Yeah, I got up at 430 too. And it's funny because as I add things to my schedule, my morning routine, it's like it gets early and earlier. Yeah. And so, yeah, I mean. I still don't have enough time to journal. And, you know, I'm on a Bible study while I'm doing a bunch of other stuff. So I'm like, there's a live Bible study that I'm attending. But it's not focused, dedicated Bible reading.

33:32It's hard to do everything, right? I think you've got to find what's really impactful in your own life and then really make that time for it. And then when there's other things that you want to do, right, then like you said, try something new. Add that to it or take away and give and take with what you see is working for you. Yeah, I would have to incorporate a night routine where I prep all my morning stuff, like the vitamins and the protein shakes. Yeah, it's funny you say that because that's what I do. So literally before bed, I get up, get my blender out, get my pre-workout, my protein shakes.

34:08Everything's on the table right before I go to bed. Yeah, because that will save me the time in the morning. Yeah, it saves you honestly like 15 minutes. Yeah, that's the time I need. Then I can incorporate journaling. Yeah, there it is. Yeah, so that's what I got to do. I just realized that. I'm going to try that now. Now my morning routine will go faster. Yeah, no, it's true. The morning, you can't waste time. It's not worth it. And I'm literally like, there's my gratitude journal. just oh i didn't have enough time yeah well and i think it's important to go back and read it right yeah i i keep a journal for a long time but i never read it and then i was like well what am i learning then uh and again my kids can read it in the future um but no if you don't look back at the last year then what are you learning from and so i've really taken the concept of like uh looking back and and learning from everything i'm doing and then how do i improve each time if I get better 1 % every day, where are you going to end up after a year?

35:04Yeah. Yeah, you're right. Now, a couple questions I have for you. What's a personal goal that you have for yourself, a family goal? You have for your family, you've got four kids, and a business goal you have. Yeah.

35:23That's a good thought. Family goal, my goal for my family is actually I really want to travel with my kids. I really want them to see the world. And so my goal is to do, you know, take them out of the country at least once a year. Have you done that ever? Yeah, we took them to New Zealand last year. Okay. We lived in a van for two weeks. And it was the best trip I've ever taken. Like, best experience. and my everyone always is you took four kids in a van in new zealand for two weeks and like honestly i i love spending time with my kids like it's it's my life right that's what i work for that's what i do and like to give them that opportunity like we had no one watching tv no no shows and they never once asked for it right and it was taking us out of this orange county bubble and putting us in this environment where we spent time together but they were so involved in like all the little things that we were doing and it was so intentional and it was amazing and like the time we were able to spend in that two weeks was just incredible and I felt like so impactful for them and we worked on things we worked on every day we talked about our Hales values right so what does it mean to be a Hales and what kind of person do we want to be when we show up and you know these aren't conversations that we get to have every day when school and sports are going on and so now we refer back to that of like hey you know are these decisions you're making are the hails values and so it's taking the time to get away to be able to like really prep for the whole year and what you want them to be that's you know that's beautifully said and how often do we talk to our kids about their values and like what's it mean to be you know your legacy name and that's like that dawned on me like i need to do that more you know like i always say this and i told this to you earlier in the you know like if anyone's been benefiting from this podcasting it's me like i just i just you know i'm receiving mentorship i'm receiving you know wisdom from another father and parenting's hard in Orange County.

37:38We're in a bubble and our kids are growing up affluent. You grew up anesthesiologists. So you come from a lineage of anesthesiology. So basically you grew up in abundance. Yeah. But you turned out great. How did your family keep you so grounded? And how are you keeping your kids so grounded? Yeah, my parents did an amazing job. I mean, parenting is hard, right? um and I think all of us parents think we're doing a terrible job for the most part right yeah we're always like oh we're screwing up our kids um and what I realized is like our parents all parents are just doing their best and I I really did look up to my parents they did a phenomenal job just loving me and like supporting me all growing up um and like you know putting pressure on me to like they succeed and to work hard and you know they they made opportunities where I could play sports and I learned teamwork.

38:34I learned leadership. Um, and my dad, I remember a lot of times, at least once a year, not a, not a ton. Right. But he would sit me down in his office. Like, Hey, let's talk, let's have a chat. Right. And, um, he just really would talk about life and like what's important. And I just love those meaningful talks. Like it's just the time he spent really kind of helped me evolve and grow up with the idea of like having an idea of legend right becoming a legend and making sure there's a legacy behind Hales or our family and respecting you know my elders and my grandparents and like seeing how hard they work to provide this life like I saw the hard work that they put into giving me abundance right and I wanted to give back I wanted to create that for my kids and so just their example uh has allowed me to become hopefully an example for my kids that hopefully they turn out well yeah I mean I'll tell you I they definitely see me working you know they they see that happening and uh but they see because I you know I get to work remote and uh as a CEO I could I'm on the I'm on the go so I'm I'm one of those parents that's hyper involved in all their sports and activities and in between you know recruiting calls or business development deals i'm just involved in every single sport they're in i like to be like involved like they're in basketball i'm playing they're in a basketball league i'm in a basketball league they're in jujitsu i'm in jujitsu yeah your hobbies are their hobbies yeah like every single hobby they got i got you know they collect sports cards i collect sports cards you know we go to basketball games together you know like so i'm in the weeds with them just like I am in my business.

40:24Yeah. Uh, last question for you. When you're in front of the pearly gates, what do you think God's going to tell you?