#352. Brixton's Top Boy To Jungle Legend - Jumpin Jack Frost

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2:12What was it like growing up in Brixton and where did the name Jumping Jack Frost come from? When I was growing up I was a little told if you looked at me wrong I'd have a fight say the wrong thing fight anything bam just straight away I got expelled from primary school for hitting someone with a milk bottle. Remember when they had the milk bottles? I hit someone in the end of the bottle and then I threw a knife at a teacher. When I was young, I was stabbing. When I was like 11, I literally just stabbed you. And I just... With no fault whatsoever? Wouldn't even think twice. Talk me through the journey of burial.

2:40Did you know at the time when you created one of the best jungle tracks ever, did you know at the time it was going to be an absolute banger? Five hours later, the record was done. Is that it? And I sat there like, this is all right, you know. I've turned around to my business partner, Brian G. I've gone, I'll make this tune, you know. and he's like, do you mean you made a tune? So I put it on and he's gone to me, what the fuck? Like, you've been sitting on this? So I'm going to test this out at the weekend. Oh, everyone's gone fucking nuts. I've been arrested on possession of firearms. I've been sitting there thinking, fuck me, I'm going to jail.

3:08Why were you carrying?

3:16Hey guys, we've been running this podcast now for five and a half years. We've had some most amazing business guests on here. Simon Squibb, Daniel Priestley, Barry Hearn. The list just goes on and on from billionaires to people who have built brands. If you want to come on the podcast and talk about your business and sit here with me in the studio and tell your story, go check out dodgewoodall.com forward slash guest and check out the three-minute video. We've also left the link below as well. Frost, welcome to the show, mate. Thank you very much for having me, sir. It's been a long time coming, this one.

3:46Yeah, definitely. We've tried and tried and tried. as I said, everything in his right time. Absolutely. Let's roll all the way back. What was it like growing up in Brixton and where did the name Jumping Jack Frost come from? Well, growing up in Brixton in the 70s was, for me, because you don't know anything else, do you? So for me, it was just vibrant, colourful, very loud, very engaging culturally, you know what I mean? because, you know, I grew up in a West Indian environment, reggae music, jazz, soul, a lot of shouting, a lot of fights, a lot of people just having it. Do you know what I mean?

4:30But it was very joyful. Do you know what I mean? We never had much money growing up, but, you know, the love was there. It was a very community, like community love. And then when they say it takes a village, do you know what I mean? Like I'd get in trouble. I'd get a clip around a year old from somewhere on the road. they say I'm going to tell your mum then I get another clip around the year old when I go home the fear when someone says I'm going to tell your old man or your mum innit I'm going to tell you yeah I'll be like oh I'll say by the way come here and then I'm going to tell her later when I'll be like ah it takes a village so what was it so what was your world then at school what were you like at school what were you like growing up what were you like in your teens and twenties well when I was growing up I was I was a bit of a I was a white old you know what I mean I was a little toe rag do you know what I mean I I was always fighting I'd fight over anything Do you know what I mean If you looked at me wrong I'd have a fight Do you know what I mean And I don't know I don't know How I got like that But when I was young I'd have to just have a fight Over anything Anything at all Say the wrong thing Fight Anything Bam Just straight away And I think my dad Was a bit like that as well Do you know what I mean And maybe You know Let's say you're a product Of your environment So I always saw people React like that Since I was little So that's just the way I was Do you know what I mean it's only when you get older you realise that that's not the way do you know but yeah I'd have a fight over anything when I was young in school I got suspended like regularly like yeah come and get him he's had another fight again do you know what I mean what sort of age are we talking here I'm talking about from I got I got kicked out of primary school mate I got expelled from primary school for hitting someone with a milk bottle remember when they had the milk bottles I hit someone in the head with a bottle and then I threw a knife at a teacher do you know what I mean I was I was out of control Did you have a fatherly figure?

6:18I had my dad, but my dad was in, he was in the scrubs. Do you know what I mean? And what was nuts, because my dad, I'd go and visit him in scrubs. And then I remember my mum saying, they've moved him to the Isle of Wight. And I remember going to Albany. Yeah. At that time, I was nine or ten. And I remember going in there thinking, there's no keys. Because all the screws, there was no keys. Everything was high-tech press button. And as you get older, you realise he was in a high-security prison. So that father figure wasn't really there when I was young. Do you know what I mean? He was banged up for like, I think my dad was banged up.

6:54He'd done about 12 years, something like that. In total? Yeah. In one hit? One hit, mate. He'd been banged up like little bits before that, but he'd done a straight 12, mate. What did he get banged up for? Arm robbery. And then when the police came for me, threw a couple of them off at the balcony. Do you know what I mean? So yeah, it was a bit of a situation. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what sort of age were you when he got banged up then? I was in primary school when he got banged up first. And then when he came out, I was just about to leave school. Do you know what I mean? No. Yeah, when he came out, I was just about, because I got exposed so many times, they sent me away to boarding school.

7:33But I was quite smart. I was quite clever in school. So they sent me away to a school for maladjusted boys, what they call maladjusted boys, which was just very difficult boys do you know what I mean so I because I'd just fight all the time so but they thought they were like this guy because I was super smart so they just thought alright I think the council paid for half and my mum paid for half and then off to boarding school I went where was that whereabouts in Berkshire in Newbury okay and it's nuts because it's right near Greenham Common so when all the stuff was going on with the women and all that I'd see them chain themselves up to the fence and all that which was quite an experience You what?

8:13You what? Who was changing that? The women at Greenham Common. Because there used to be an American airbase there. Yeah. And the cruise missiles were coming in at that point. And they were out there demonstrating no cruise missiles at Greenham Common Airbase. Oh, wow. Okay. And they'd chain themselves to the fences and stuff like that as a protest. Do you know what I mean? If you just Google it, it will all come up. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'll have a look. Right in Greenham Common. Do you know what I mean? And I remember, because our school was about five miles away from there. so every time we'd go past it we'd see the women chained up chaining themselves against the fences do you know what I mean it was nutty yeah it was crazy so what was it like for you then when you were growing up and your old man's in Nick did that make you go more nutty more wild do you know if my dad's gone to Nick I'm going to end up and get Nick one day I don't know because for me it's just normal it was normal like my uncle Roddy was away a couple of them was away and then my friends brothers and everyone was going to ball stall and my cousin was in ball stall my older cousin who I looked up to he was in ball stall so it was just like I didn't even think well I'm gonna do it yeah it's just the way I was it's just you know what I mean so I'd always have a fight over anything or do you know what I mean I was like I was like when I was young I was like stabbing you when I was like 11 I literally just stab you do you know what I mean and I was and I just no fault whatsoever no no nothing at all wouldn't even think twice wouldn't even think twice do you know what I mean you have an argument what's that Batman stab you do you know what I mean I wouldn't even think twice about it so who were you hanging around with did you have older lads around you who were your kind of mentors well kind of mentors at the time there was a group of like 30 of us that would all go around together like a pack of wolves mate do you know what I mean and yeah it's just normal it's like a community because I grew up in a council estate and then you know what I mean there was like loads of us Irish black, white do you know what I mean?

10:07we just all were like all our parents knew each other we'd be in and out of each other's houses and in them days you know you could be 10 years old and you could walk the street safely you know I'd leave my house in Brixton when I was 8 and go to my grandmother's house in Clapham Junction you would never let your 8 year old do that now but it was normal back then you know it was a normal thing to do you know what I'm saying so what were you doing when did music come into your life then? what sort of year? what hour were you? I oh because I had my mum's brothers were real good guys they were like sometimes I look and I think how did my mum and dad even get together because my dad it's like now and day do you know what I mean I think how did you two even meet when they get older you think when they get older you start thinking about these things how did you two even meet do you know what I mean because my dad was right at it and your mum was a straight guy straight do you know what I mean she was at university she was at university and her brothers were like the same and they were into music so I always watch my uncle and be like I like this music thing, you know what I mean?

11:06Plus, you know, Brixton was a place where there's a lot of sound systems. You know what I mean? I'd go out to the park, there's these park dances and all the sound systems with all the wires. And so I was always exposed to it and it always excited me to see the sound systems and stuff. So, you know what I mean? I remember when I was nine, I used to go to a place called Shepherds Youth Centre and they'd say to me, speaker wire's massive like this. Go on, grab that. And I'd have to catch it and fall on the floor. And I'd say, take it in there and hide. You know what I mean? So I'd take it in there and hide because if I come back out, I wouldn't be able to get back in.

11:49So I'd hide in there and then when the party starts and I can come out and start walking about, but I'd have to wait until they'd wired up all the sound systems and that. And I'd hide behind the speaker and all that because I was too young to be in there. Do you know what I mean? So that's how I started really getting into music. And then from there, I kind of, when I got a little bit older, I graduated to like lifting the boxes, the speaker boxes in. Do you know what I mean? And then I'd get in the back of the van and when like, like Frontline International, that's the sound I used to always be around.

12:24They're from the Frontline in Brixton. Do you know what I mean? And Railton Road. And they're the sound system. So I'd get in the back of the van. if they were going to play in North West London or something, I'd get in the back of the van and we'd all go over there and help to lift the sound system, the boxes, into the party, wait all night till the dance is finished, lift them back into the van, get in the back of the van and travel back all like that. You know what I mean? Crazy, man. And I was like 10, 11 years old. When did, like being one of the pioneers of jungle music, when did that come about?

12:58well originally i tell you originally i was as i said i was really into the reggae sound system and the dub because i used to follow joshaka since i was nine eight nine years old i used to go to joshaka me and my friends when i was 10 i was at joshaka and then i went into front line international then i was in boarding school for three and a half years so i'd only come out in school other days but I took that culture with me there because we had a clubhouse with you know I mean so I'd take all my records there and play records and I influenced everyone there so let's get into this kind of thing and it was crazy because you had boys there that were into like that time you had madness bad manners and that you know people so you'd learn about other pockets of things and all that as well I'll take it all on do you know what I mean because you know music's music you know what I mean and it was just nice to be able to learn because I was literally only exposed to dub and reggae and it's nuts because I'll tell you something even a roast dinner a British roast dinner I'd never saw one until I went to boarding school I was like when I went when I saw Yorkshire Pudding I was like what's that I had no idea I'd never seen it before in my life do you know what I mean so learning about a whole new culture the culture of the country that I'm living in was when I went to boarding school up until that point I'd never even seen a roast dinner before in my life do you know what I mean so it's nice to go there and just kind of add some strings to your bowl do you know what I mean and kind of refine your communication skills and just learning about other people so yeah and I think not I don't I think if I didn't go to that school I wouldn't be sitting there today do you know what I mean but um going back to the original question I got into the dub and then when I got to about when I left school I'd start going to the African Centre in Covent Garden where Soul to Soul played and I'd go there every Sunday religiously because I really liked that kind of vibe that they were doing at the funk and I'd be there and I got to know Jazzy B, H and all the other brothers and sorry Trevor Nelson otherwise known back in the day he was called Trevor Madhatter but now everyone knows him as Trevor Nelson so I got to know those guys and I just you know became part of that whole soul to soul community do you know what I mean and then the acid house explosion came do you know what I mean and I just was like wow this is something different I remember once I went to the first time I went to an acid house party I went to Clink Street and I was just stood in there like what the hell is this do you know what I mean everyone was just like smiling and I was like I thought this is nuts do you know what I mean the first time I went I was like nah I can't be dealing with this and so I went away I was like nah that's ain't for me and then I went back again and the second time I went I got it I was like right do you know what I mean and I just like fell in love with it and that's when I started playing the music and then I was on pirate radio and then from there it just my journey started you know yeah pirate radio what station was it passion radio It was like a community station in Brixton.

16:14And it was nuts because me and Brian G were on there and it was like a reggae station. Yeah. And when we were playing the rear groove and the soul and all that, they were like, yay. But then one day we just turned up playing this music, Acid House, and they're like, what the hell is this? And everyone's like, you're playing devil music. Like, this is devil music. And we're like, what are you talking about? Because these tunes, you had tunes like Dance with the Devil and tunes like that. And we were just like so engrossing it. and they're like stop playing this music this is devil music and they'll be like what happened to the nice music that you used to play like this is us now i'm afraid yeah where did the jungle come from so rave first of all it started with acid house yeah and then from acid house you had this kind of acid acids originally came from detroit um detroit and chicago this whole that whole house acid house thing and then when we started playing it obviously people here started thinking we can do this as well do you know what I mean so people started making their own music so what started off with the four that the boom boom boom boom obviously we're from here so we just thought put some breaks with it do you know what I mean so you put some breaks through it so at one point you had the four fours to the floor and the breaks together then people started thinking what if we take out the fours to the floor so the fours to the floor came out and you're left with the brakes.

17:38And at that time, it was hardcore. It was like hardcore with the speedy that vocals and stuff like that. Because people, you're learning on the job. You're making music, but you don't quite know what you're doing with the samplers and the technology. So you had these, what we call pinky and perky vocals. That was just too fast and stuff like that. But, you know, people started learning how to manipulate the equipment and stuff like that. And slowly, this hardcore sound started going into something else which we all grew up in reggae here and stuff so we started putting the reggae samples in with the breaks and then you know you start to hear the early development of what is known as jungle and then you know other people came in because not everyone grew up in a reggae environment some people grew up with like a rock kind of environment or soul or whatever so people would put in what inspired them and what they grew up in.

18:34You know what I mean? So you had these different interpretations of this music with the breaks and whatever background or whatever influenced you, you'd put that in there. Do you know what I mean? So basically just testing it the whole time. Testing, testing, testing, testing. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? So the actual boom, boom, boom went and it just breaks the, you know what I mean? And then you put samples in of, you might put in your favourite soul tune. I wonder how that sounds. Do you know what I mean? and I think that's how it was formed and it was a bunch of people at the time like minded people that we all kind of came through together do you know what I mean it's nuts as well because I remember Fabio and Groove Rider playing at Rage and I think they really championed this sound because especially Groove Rider Groove Rider would play a speeding up hip hop record and mixing like an acapella with it like a house acapella do you know what I mean and it was like okay and everyone was like you know what I mean Groove Rider was really really on that do you know what I mean Was he the top of his game even back then did you know he had something extra special always always always always because I'd known like we used to play in Brixton me and Brian G used to play on Passion Radio and Fabio and Groove Rider used to play in a station called Phase One and we were almost like like a friendly rivalry we didn't really know each other that well funny enough Friendly or was it Aggie at the same time?

20:02There's nothing at all. There's nothing like that. Just like, I mean, I've known Fabio since I was young. So there was respect there at the same time. Okay, that's nice. I knew Fabio. I've known Fabio since I was eight, ten years old. Do you know what I mean? But Fabio's always been like a soul boy, jazz guy, always. Do you know what I mean? But I was like completely opposite. Do you know what I mean? So when I came into that acid house thing, even he was like, hold on a minute. Do you know what I mean? What's all this then? do you know what I mean but I've known him since do you know what I mean I didn't know Groove Rider at all funny enough Fabio and Groove Rider didn't even know each other until they were put together is that right no they didn't know each other I never knew that they did not know each other they were on the same station but they didn't know each other so whose idea was it to put Fabio and Groove Rider together then a guy called Mendoza okay because Mendoza's brother done a club done an acid house kind of party thing and Mendoza wanted to have one at his little club and Fabio and Groove Rider were both playing this music but they didn't know each other.

21:07So he's gone, you two come down, I want you to do this thing together and that's how they met. So they didn't even know each other at that point. Do you know what I mean? So they're like brothers now but at that point, that's how they got. They smashed it, haven't they? They've absolutely smashed it out of the park. Smashed it out of the park. They're just like innovators, mate. Total innovators. Both just, and then you know the blend of the two of them as well because Groove Rider has got a much harder edge and Fabio's a lot smoother so the blend of the two of them is just perfect you know what I mean the synergy between them is just fantastic did you know at the time when you created one of the best tracks ever one of the best jungle tracks ever did you know at the time it was going to be an absolute banger you know it was crazy what is nuts right I'll tell you the story of that I'd been arrested on possession of firearms with intent, right?

21:59And I was let out on bail. And I was like, I was sitting there thinking, fuck me, I'm going to jail, bruv. Do you know what I mean? I got arrested with a Glock, a nine millimetre Glock, with ammunition. But the ammunition wasn't in there. It was like somewhere else in the house, which made a big difference. Do you know what I mean? So. Why were you carrying? I was just, this is, this is, I've just, I've just been that guy. Do you know what I mean? I was like I was living in the area I was becoming really successful people were just watching me what are you up to blah blah I was hearing little things because people would just rob you do you know what I mean people that you know you got something envy people think if you got 20 quid people think you got 100 quid do you know what I mean so I'm like fuck this fucking shit got my clock do you know what I mean so anyway would you take it with you everywhere I never took it out with me You had it in your bedside table?

22:57I had it in my house. Do you know what I mean? Sometimes, you know what I mean? I'd never take it to a party or anything like that. Do you know what I mean? I just had it. I was like, yeah, I got it. Did you ever have the fear of taking it out with you, that you're that mentality, you could have someone pissed you off, you'd go bang, see you later? Or was it there just to show as protection? No, no, if I had to do it, I'd do it. I've got no problem with that. I've used it a couple of times, not fatally, but I've done things before. I've got no problem with that. whatsoever. If I had to do it, I wouldn't even think twice.

23:28Do you know what I mean? I haven't got a problem with that. Do you know what I mean? When you let, when you let some bullets go, why was that? Well, do you know what I mean? I was provoked. Do you know what I mean? And things were said and things were said and you know, sometimes if you give someone an inch, they won't take that mile. If you don't, if you don't shut it down. You know what I mean? And if you've shown that people, if people think that they can do that and you're not going to do anything, they will push it and push it and push it. So you have to shut the whole thing down and I've done that a few times, yeah.

24:00What sort of age were you? When I was like 17, 18, do you know what I mean? 17, 18, 19, yeah. Were you at your loosest, at maddest in your 20s, 30s or 40s? I think when I was in my teens, teens. Okay. Because I think when I started getting into this business, I started realising, this could be a really good life. Do you know what I mean? And I'd start mixing around with people that were nice, that were kind, people that I'd never really been exposed to before. Do you know what I mean? And people that were really smart, people that would just give me good advice. Instead of hotheads, I'd start meeting people that have got a future.

24:53Do you know what I mean? A new life outside of this, the parameter of Brixton and that whole thing. So it was, you know what I mean? After a while, I was not silly. Do you know what I mean? I started thinking I could really do something with my life out of this. So you become less mad and less likely to be in a situation. Do you know what I mean? That's going to put you in that situation. Do you know what I mean? Or doing something stupid that could ruin your DJing career or something to do with music. was music your get out or were you were you still naughty while doing the music well there's a bit of a crossover do you know what I mean because you know while the music was nice and everything I still had to maintain my lifestyle and at first it wasn't really helping me do you know what I mean but as I started getting more popular um I started getting good money do you know what I mean so I was like you know what you know what I mean I had to change my friends change my environment But the thing about it, I still stayed in the area, which maybe I should have moved out a little bit earlier.

25:56Do you know what I mean? Because, you know, then I wouldn't have had to do some of the things I did or protect myself the way that I did. But, yeah, you know what I mean? I was still in the area and I was, you know, it takes a while because, you know, you give a kid, I was still a kid, weren't I, really? And I started playing at big events and all that when I was 19, 20 years old. and I still wasn't developed in my mind. I wasn't developed. I still had that old mentality. Do you know what I mean? I still had the same friends as well and they were like still out here and come on let's go. You still think that way.

26:35Do you know what I mean? It's only when you really develop and get older that you start looking at things differently. Were you using at the time? No. Crazy. No drugs, no... No drugs. No drugs, no drink? Nothing. I did not do... I did not start taking drugs until I was in my 30s. Okay. Which I can't believe because I used to look down on it. I used to think, oh, fuck that. Yeah. So I used to be like, what the fuck? Do you know what I mean? But it wasn't... There wasn't so much about it. It's probably when you're in your 30s when it really come about even bigger, wasn't it? No, because I was out DJing.

27:07Legities. When I was out... Yeah. When I was playing... How old are you today? I'm nearly... I'm 60 next year. Okay. Do you know what I mean? I'm 59 years old. 30 years ago. It's about right. Yeah. But in my days, going out playing at big parties and all that, I never took E's. I never took cocaine. Never took anything. I'd just go out there and play music. And I'd smoke a spliff. That was it. Do you know what I mean? And then when I got to about 35, I fucking turned into... Smashed the back side. I smashed the eyes out of it. I just think, what the fuck happened there? Do you remember your first E?

27:42Yes. I do. I took a pill and I was like, fuck it, no, this is all right. Do you know what I mean? I was out with some girls and I was like, mate, this ain't too bad. Do you know what I mean? I was like, this ain't too bad at all. But funny enough, even though I took an E, it wasn't, it wasn't something that I'd done regularly. Do you know what I mean? I just thought this is all right. Do you know what I mean? Proper love done. Like, whoa, this is all right. Got a little girl with you. Later on, like, bosh, bosh, bosh. Like, you know what? This thing's all right, know what I mean? But it wasn't something, like, some people take an E, they start taking them every weekend.

28:20I'd do it, like, once every three months or something like that. Do you know what I mean? If I was out with a girl or something like that, I'd do it. I would never take an E going out with the boys. It's just, nah. I wouldn't do that. Nah. It worked for me. What was the, going back to the original question, talk me through the journey of burial. Yeah. When that was created, why it was created, where were you did you know it was going to be one of the greatest double tracks ever as I said I had been arrested on possession of firearms right so when they bailed me they said you're right we're going to bail you I sat there my head's all over the place I'm like for fuck's sake I need something to concentrate on I tell you what I got to the studio yeah so I've gone down called Dillinger he's my engineer at the time he lived up the road he was only a young kid 16 something like that 15 I'm gonna I'm gonna come and make a try and make a tune every time I I'd go in there before I'd just give him some money and he'd engineer for me and nothing it's just you know what I mean but this time I took some of my favourite records I picked up the Foxy album what's the sample ooh I picked up that and I picked up a compilation album right a reggae hits album and I went in the studio went in there I said to him sample this sample that put that break on it and I sat there and I'm like wow this sounds alright do you know what I mean yeah five hours later the record was done is that it yeah and I sat there like this is alright you know this is alright I started feeling like this is alright but you know when you've listened to something a thousand times in a few hours you're not too sure do you know what I mean so I took it away sat on it for a bit um didn't play it to anyone I just listened to it a few times I'm like then one day I've turned around to my business partner Brian G I've gone up make this tune you know and he's like what do you mean you made a tune because I've never said that before you know I mean I said do you want to have a listen to you get it on so I put it on he's gone to me what the fuck like you've been sitting on this and i'm like yeah and he's like so i cut it on a dub plate so i'm gonna test this out at the weekend thinking fuck's sake all right let me just test it out because you need to know don't you i need to know because he's gone yeah and brian g if he told you it's a good tune it's a good tune yeah so i'm like i need to know so i've tested it out well everyone's gone fucking nuts and i'm like you know what it is alright you know then I've spoken to Mickey Finn who's like always quality guy love Mickey do you know what I mean Mickey what do you think of this he's gone Jack you know Mickey already Jack I'm telling you that's a hit yeah so I'm like alright then so I've played it to a couple of other people but then I'm starting to play it out on this dub play and everywhere I've gone everyone's just going mad this fucking yeah and I'm like okay okay okay and that was it mate from then boom we've put it out sold so many that ridiculous amounts of records do you know what I mean licensed it to the amount of compilation albums that we licensed it to and at that time we'd we'd go around ourselves to the record shops and the drop off boxes do you know what I mean and it's it's just ridiculous the amounts we sold thousands of those did that make you who you were that track Is that the one that put you on the map?

32:03No, because I released it under an alias, Leviticus. Yeah, Leviticus. That's another one. I wanted to know why you released it under there, not your own name. Because I just wanted, I think at that time, everyone had an alias. Okay. And my dog was called Leviticus, Levi. And I just thought, hey, I'm going to call it. Yeah. Quality. Yeah, his name was Levi, Leviticus. So I just thought, yeah, I'm going to call it. Everyone had an alias. Do you know what I mean? And yeah, that was it. So I was already well-established by them. do you know what I mean well established as a DJ so I didn't really need that record to to make me established do you know what I mean it must have added cred though surely of course straight away like yeah but the thing about it is that it took a long time before people knew it was me okay it's like it was just Leviticus who's Leviticus like yeah banging do you know what I mean yeah if I'd have known what I'd have put my name yeah I was going to say if you know what you know now yeah because it's out now again now on Def Jam yeah Def Jam have re-released it have they yeah yeah yeah that's what the documentary is all about that's a quality documentary by the way thank you you pinged me last night yeah yeah what I loved about it Goldie Jazzy B Groove everyone just picking it up and this is what it was like back then yeah yeah that's a lovely feeling for you wasn't it yeah it was great because what's nuts is that obviously 32 years later my manager said to me I've got I've got some news for you I'm like what she's gone Def Jam want to put out your record as a celebration at the anniversary I'm like are you serious she's going mate Def Jam want to put the record out so we went for a meeting with them she negotiated the deal and funny and here we are Def Jam like one of the fucking most iconic record labels in the world want to put this record out we've got new remixes got a remix from Todd Terry Colisey Super D Blade Runner and I'm just about to do a re-record with new featured artists on it.

34:03I'm not really going to, can't really say the names at the moment, but it is like literally the hottest ticket in town again, 32 years later. Unreal, isn't it? Mate, unbelievable. Yeah. Unbelievable. The whole thing about it, and then obviously I sent you the documentary. I had a screening at the Ritzy Cinema in Brixton and it was just packed. It was all like friends, family, record execs, like like my friends from TV like people that I'm working with like Shaznay Lewis because I got I've just recorded a record with Shaznay and just like so many different people Retro 32 so many people came to this screening and it was nuts and it's got big massive billboards on the street like unbelievable so it's nice because I got my grandchildren just like granddad that's you that's you I'm like well there you go do you know what I mean it's better that than coming to see me and my Peter.

34:58Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah. What does that mean for you now? You personally know, Def Jam, what openings is that going to, what's that going to do over the next year or so? God knows. All I know is that it's given me the opportunity to record with amazing artists. And it's given me the opportunity to really, to live how I've always wanted to live. Because after I'd done the deal, I was like, you know what, I'm leaving London. I'm going to go live in Hertfordshire. Do you know what I mean? I moved out to Hertfordshire, which I've always wanted to do. Do you know what I mean? And it's like, I've thought to myself, now I've done this deal, now's a good time to go.

35:44Do you know what I mean? I don't want to be in that position again where I'm in everyone's faces and people just like, people are struggling out there and I'm there walking around. Like, here we go again. and I think I don't want to be back in that position again. Do you know what I mean? It's like repeating itself. So I've done what I should have done in the first place and get out. Do you know what I mean? And that's what I've done. Do you know what I mean? But it's given me the opportunity to really sit down, focus, not have to run around DJing everywhere, just concentrate on making music and just becoming a real, like a recording artist in my own run.

36:22Do you know what I mean? And just work with really amazing people and that's what I'm doing at the moment, do you know what I mean? Which has just been, do you know what I mean? It's just, I can't be grateful enough to be at my age to get a big record deal like that with such an iconic label after all the things I've done. Do you know what I mean? Because at one point, I nearly threw it all away because I was getting on it so much and just burning bridges and I wasn't very, I wasn't a very nice person to be around because I was so out partying all the time and to turn it around the way I have has just been incredible do you know what I mean yeah and now I can look back and really follow my purpose do you know yeah that's quality mate to do how long were you saying you were out partying what were you using mate I was I was smoking fucking crack at one point like I literally was so fucked at one point I had to take about a year out and go to rehab okay I was fucked do you know what I mean I was just like I look back now and I'm like I was talking to my boy Brian G the other day and I said to him I saw a clip of us talking of one of our artists talking and at that time I wasn't about and when I looked at that clip and he cried tears come to my eyes I was like fuck look what I've done to myself do you know what I mean I was like I was such a and I just I just don't think I was a nice person either I wasn't nice to people I was just not I was just not the person I am yeah I just it just wasn't me do you know what I mean and then even when I came out of rehab I was like stop smoking crack but then I'd start having a fucking sniff yeah and then I'd be out drinking and being around girls I'm not meant to be around and being out for two three days and I was like what the fuck do you know what I mean I look back at that now and I think because now I don't drink yeah clean I don't I don't even smoke weed do you know what I mean yeah So I'm just clean as a whistle.

38:24And I don't hang around people that party or anything. And I'm such a different person. Do you know what I mean? Like everyone. I was talking to Mickey the other day. He's like, Jack, I just can't believe the person that you are now. Do you know what I mean? How long have you been claimed for? Three and a half years. Respect. That's a respect. Three and a half years, mate. What was the point when you hit rock bottom going, I've got to stop? I just, you know what it was? there's loads of different things. Firstly, I ended up in hospital, right? What for? I just fucking, I think I'd have like a mini, mini heart attack.

39:01Do you know what I mean? But I just collapsed in my ass. I was well overweight. Do you know what I mean? You know what it is as well? I think in lockdown, lockdown fucked me up because I literally didn't leave my ass. Just me and my dog. I never saw my mum for nearly two years. And I just sat there, I had all my money. Do you know what I mean? Because you just think, all right, everyone's fucking can't work. I'm all right. I've got a few quid. So I'd just be calling, getting gear all the time and drinking on my own. Do you know what I mean? And when I came out of there, I was like, I was a mess, bruv.

39:36By the time lockdown, I said, all right, everyone's going back to work now. I was fucked. Do you know what I mean? So I went out and I was like, no, mate, I'm just not right. This ain't right. and then one day I just said fuck this shit enough's enough and I never looked back you know Dodge I never never that day bang that was it was it but you know I think I don't know because I'm very I'm really spiritual yeah I believe that there was a divine intervention that stopped me yeah because when I gave it all that day and I never thought it would be that easy I just thought oh fuck I tried before I'd said it before, but all I've got to do is be around the wrong girl with the wrong party.

40:23You're having it again. But on that day, I was like, I'm never doing this again. Do you know what I mean? And I never did. Never. And it's crazy because about nine months, nine months into my sober journey, my mum started getting ill. And then we had to take her down and they diagnosed her with terminal cancer. So I was like, whoa. oh and I was like this is why I done that because subconsciously you know something's coming that you have to be strong for and I believe that that was a divine intervention to stop me because something is coming your way that you're gonna have to be totally switched on for and me and my sister we sat with my mum I sat with her every day for eight months and because she you know I mean she didn't want to go into a hospital or anything so we had to look after her at home and I sat with her every single day.

41:18Do you know what I mean? Until she died. I was with her when she died. And I, all the way through, I just like, you know what I mean? Said my prayers in the morning, done my gratitude list. Yeah. And just was just grateful for the time I had left with her. And since then, I couldn't even imagine even having a drink ever. Do you know what I mean? It's just not for me. That's quality to hear. Yeah. It's just not for me. when you're like talking like this through now you're three and a half years clean what was Frost like to be around if you were a mate of Frost's how would they explain you 30s and 40s and 50s until three and a half years ago arrogant dickhead prick up his old ass just not great to be around okay and that's the way I look at I look back up myself do you know what I mean and I could just think fucking how how did people even put up with being around me do you know what I mean such a dickhead mate do you know what I mean give me an example someone booked you and there was like 10 DJs there would you bowl it how were you I was always nice to people but I just had this sense of entitlement sometimes I'd turn up fucking turn up and I was all sniffed up like you can't do that do you know what I mean you can't do that and just maybe rude to people a bit intimidating because once you've had a little thing you're like do you know what I mean and it's just like I look back and I think like who do you think you are do you know what I mean be bloody grateful that this position that you're in be grateful that you're able to make a living from playing music and do you know what I mean and you know be grateful that you can be around people and and people still want to book you yeah do you know what I mean be grateful do you know what I mean and so you know when I I'd when I went on this journey I don't know because I think I just the way I am now is the way I really not naturally am do you know what I mean and now I like to help people do you think that's the bugle talking all those years probably yeah probably do you know what I mean because you get distorted yeah distorted confidence yeah yeah and a and a and a and a thing that's like it's not really you but you think it's like do you know what I mean did you feel like did you feel like you had to be dangerous to be around that people wouldn't take any liberties anywhere no did you have that sort of aura about you don't muck about with him yeah man and it's just a lot of shit I should have left that in my 20s I should have left that in my 20s you don't walk around this big grown man a grandad acting like you're a fucking hard man what the fuck what you should be doing is helping people that need a lift.

44:12A big idea. Helping people that, that's what I should have been doing. Do you know what I mean? And that's what I, that's what I, that's what I. Have you done the 12-step programme? No. I went to a couple of meetings, but I thought this ain't for me. Do you know what I mean? Everyone was just sitting there chatting shit and I just thought this ain't for me. Do you know what I mean? I think I got to step two and I was like, oh, this ain't for me. Do you know what I mean? And, Would you ever do the 12-step programme? No, I wouldn't, as it goes. Okay. Do you know what I mean? I wouldn't do it. do you know what I mean I go to meetings now and again I go to meetings good friend of mine he's like I met him at the at the meetings A.A.

44:46N.A. C.A. C.A. do you know what I mean and I've got I always go to about three four meetings a year just to remind myself mate you're never out of the woods one wrong you're one wrong decision away from being back down that fucking stakes and that is like sunshine and don't forget it do you know what I mean so I do go to a meeting and sit in there and do you know what I mean? I'd like to chair a couple of meetings. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? I think, I think, listening to you, right, I think you can help a lot of people. I really do. Well, listen, I do because a lot of people now come to me and be like, and they talk to me and I give people advice.

45:26I'd love to help a lot more people. Do you know what I mean? The only way you can help more people out there is the people who are stuck in addiction. Yeah. While you're going to meetings and say, I really want to help you. Yeah. I want to be a mentee to you. Yeah. Because, you know, you've got that celebrity status behind you. People will look up to you. I'd love to. Imagine how many people you could help, Frost, like the kids are coming through. Yeah. Same as you in their 20s. They're in their 20s and 30s. You're like, hold on a minute, boys. I wasted all those years. What's the point? I've done a few podcasts and I've done a few, like, talks.

45:58Yeah. Like, I've been to places and spoken to people. And, you know. How do you feel good? It makes me feel great. Yeah. because it makes me feel like I've contributed something like the feeling that you get when you help people is like no other it's the best it's not like whatever personal accolades or whatever you get nothing beats helping someone and I've helped a few people like there were a few people that called me up and I talked to them and do you know what I mean people reach out to me on Facebook and be like I can see I see your journey blah blah blah can you help me and I always help them and I check back in with them do you know what I mean how you're getting on and blah blah blah like girls guys younger DJs as well do you know the more you help people the more you help your own soul of course you know because you're helping yourself you're helping yourself because you're going through the process to help them talk to them about I did this and this have I think about that before doing that they'll look up to you you know this 59 year old fella who's been around the block yeah mate do you know what I mean I'd love to do more do you know what I mean I'd love we've set up a programme called the V Legacy Program where we got some funding from the Arts Council and we set up this mentor program for kids that want to be in the business and it's like a six month program but it's just people that want to be in the business but I'd like to do something like that for people that have struggled with addiction and stuff like that.

47:21There's plenty out there. Yeah, I'd love to. Do you know what I mean? Especially, but you know, a lot of people come and talk to me who are struggling. Do you know what I mean? and I'd like more to I'd like to be part of I'd like to be part of an organisation and be really involved in stuff like that it's something that I like to do does the 12 steps scare you at all having to go through the steps because the fourth step is when you have to go back to the back to people who you've done good to yeah I've done all that you know what I'm sorry about that even like 20 years ago I remember this this and this it was a bit of money thing I'm sorry about that I've just got and you've got to you've got to hold your hands up yeah yeah yeah that's probably one of the hardest one of the hardest parts I guess I've got no problem with that yeah because I've actually done that without the steps yeah I've just gone straight to it I've cleaned that do you remember that time I've done that anyway do you know what I mean Dodge yeah yeah yeah I've done that anyway do you know what I mean I've done that to everyone or is there any is there people in the back of your locker here thinking you know what I really need to reach out to them but there are some people I just can't get hold of do you know what I mean but most people that I've done something fucked up to I've done that and I've tried to be like some people people will be like, fuck off.

48:30Do you know what I mean? At least you put your hands up. I put my hands up. Do you know what I mean? Because, you know, mate, I've, you know, I haven't always been great. Do you know what I mean? And I put my hands up to it. Do you know what I mean? I put my hands up to it. And I like, as I, as I would love to help people just, you know what I mean? I think you'll be really good. I'd love, I'd love to. I think you'll be really good. I think after this show, I think more people are going to reach out to you. Reach out, man. Come on. Reach out. No, I'm serious. Is there anyone out there that you would like to reach out to who you think might not want to reach back to you?

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50:45There are a couple, but they're both dead. They're both dead. Do you know what I mean? Both cancer, funny enough. Any ones that are still alive, you'd like to have that convo. Nah, everyone. Everyone who I think I should have reached out to, I've done them. I've done. And I've sat down, cried. Yeah, amazing. We've had a hug. Do you know what I mean? People are like, mate, I'm super proud of you, man. Because I am not shy in talking about my journey. Because I talk about it on all my socials and everything. so people can see if this guy can do it, I can do it. Do you know what I mean? And then people reach out to me and I'm like, listen, blah, blah, blah.

51:27If you need to talk, if whatever. Do you know what I mean? And my door's open to anyone. Have you ever been banged up? Me? Yeah. How many times? Twice. Twice, mate. What did you get? What was the first one? First one, for that firearms offence, I got five and a half months. Funny enough. Because for possession. That was a result, wasn't it? That was a right result, mate. That was just before. Yeah. That was just before they'd done, because I said I'd been threatened and all that. I'm like, I've been threatened, blah, blah, blah, blah. Here's what I do. I'm like, all right then. And that's just before they'd done, they brought in a minimum five year thing.

52:00Because, you know what I mean, if they'd have done that a little bit later, it'd be a minimum of five. Do you know what I mean? Where were you? Where were you for that five and a half months? Funnily enough, I went to Brixton Prison. Yeah. And then they, then they must have observed me and thought, this case is all right. Sent them, sent them to an open nick. And then after, and the time before that, I was in Olysy Bay when I was young. Do you know what I mean? And that's, that's it. That's the only two times I've been banged up. Do you know what I mean? It's the only two times I've been banged up.

52:28It's funny that, do you know what I mean? Because that was, that was nutty. Cause I remember like people coming to visit me, like Groove Rider came up, DJ rapped, Groove Rider come pick me up from the, you know what I mean? And it's nuts because I had a show on Kiss FM at the time. and there was a few of us on rotation. So I'd done the show on the Wednesday night. I got banged up on a Friday. And when I came out, it was my time to do my show again. Two and a half months later or whatever. Result. When I came out, it was my turn again. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was a bit of a thing, but mate, I'd love to help as many people.

53:13do you know what I mean because like to have the amount of the long career I've had and to achieve what I have I think it's it's my duty to help people I think so right that struggle and you might I've been I've gone through loads of struggles like depression like just being down and you know what I mean I love to be able to help people sit and talk come and spend the day with me just have a little walk and sit in the park and talk about it If you were to pick between the two which is your favourite Jungle or Drum and Bass It's all the same Okay for you Okay Yeah For me it's all the same Listen there's two kind of records you've got a good record and a bad record Do you know what I mean There's some Jungle records that I was like what the fuck There's some Jungle and Bass records that I was like what the fuck Do you know what I mean But a good record is a good record and I I'm not going to be Do you know what I mean For me It's like the marketing people package it up, sell it, sell it.

54:18We'll pack it up. It's just for sale. That's for sale. It's all the same thing. Do you know what I mean? For where I'm sitting. It's all the same thing. Are there any raves that have really stood out for you DJing at when you've gone in the UK? We'll talk for the UK for now before we could talk about the world. Yeah. Any raves you've gone, oh my God, that one stands out for me all day long? Well, there's a few. I remember playing Amnesia Ass. Donatum Park Yeah Donatum Park This is

54:51I think it's early 90s Early early 90s And it's nuts because I don't know a guy called I don't know if you know a guy called Nick Hawks Yeah Nick Hawks I remember when Nick Hawks first came To London And he was from Bristol And he was like Just a man about Just like hungry What's going on What's that what's that record what's this what's that what's that what's that and I remember Nick he got a job at XL Records and Nick was like he was like this is what A &R Man is meant to be Nick Hawks A &R Man is meant to be like Nick Nick was at all the raves yeah and I remember I remember me playing records I remember me playing a record and then coming up to me saying what's that record and I said Tickle T99 and he's like alright then and he signed it and it went number one in the fucking charts mate yeah Nick signed he signed the Prodigy I need to get Nick on the podcast yeah you need to get Nick on it yeah mate right Nick he done that tune called Your Name's Not Down You're Not Coming In is that his track is it it's his track it's like a mule right but he he's also he's also the Prodigy's manager now but he signed the Prodigy to XL but Nick was all there's about what's this he was on it he just turned up 10 ,000 people he just come up what's that tune Jack what's that tune and I'm like okay no Nick what are you doing there I remember saying it's T99 isn't alright then see you later and he's off he signed it it went number one in the charts yeah but Nick he's like I've known him since God knows and he's still still like that he's still the same like he signed Prodigy to XL now he's their manager do you know what I mean and he done that tune your name's not down you're not coming in Nick Hawks mate you need to get him on he's an absolute legend where's he based he's London based is it mate he could be based anywhere mate he'll be here tell me about that gig Donovan Park what are you talking big numbers what sort of numbers are we talking 10 ,000 people 10 ,000 Nick has turned up out of it Nick has just come out like that I'm playing that T99 tune and he's come up because it was in a Belgian import Nick's just turned up what's this I'm like Nick what are you doing there what's this record I'm like T99 alright see you later he signed it it's gone number one yeah that one stood out for me also amnesia rouse when Mickey Linus got married on the stage.

57:14The book of love. Yeah. Yeah. So me, Groove Rider, Carl Cox, Sasha, all of us playing it there. But the promoter, Mickey Linus, got married. On the stage. On the stage. To his wife. Yeah. God bless you, Mickey. Rest in peace. Do you know what I mean? But that is one of the most, I'll never forget that. Do you know what I mean? He proposed on stage. No, he got married. He got married on stage. He got married on stage. mickey was there as well me mickey groove fabio carcox yeah right all of us played yeah mickey linus got married to his wife on the stage you're coming with a vicar the wedding dress the whole thing mate yeah groove rider was the best man yeah groove was the best man because him and mickey were well tight do you know what i mean how did mickey pass um i think it's something to do police the The police.

58:07Because, yeah, I think the police... Something to do with the police, I'm pretty sure. I'm pretty sure. I might be mistaken, but I know that he had problems with the police and something like that. But I'm not going to put my answer. But I think it was like... As a promoter, he got squeezed by the old Bill. No. Something completely different. Yeah, exactly. Okay, fair enough. All those covboys, they were right at it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Football fan, football hard. Because Neville still does have Neville. I love it. Big shout out to Neville. Amnesia House and the All-An Amnesia House crew. But they were right at it, those boys.

58:40Do you know what I mean? Lovely. They're like family to me, mate. They're lovely. They still do events now. Do they? Yeah, mate. They still do events now. Quality events. Do you know what I mean? You go to Amnesia, it's just like being back in 89, 90, 90, mate. Yeah, mate. Where else? Tell me some clubs. Tell me about clubs. What clubs did you enjoy doing? Did you enjoy sticking around London or did you enjoy booting up North Midlands? I was lucky because I used to DJ on every Thursday. at a club called The Fridge in Brixton, yeah? I bought my first place on Brixton Hill. Really? Yeah, mate, next to the prison.

59:12A masonette apartment. It was year 2000. Right next to the prison it was. Do you know the thing about it? Go on. Where I moved from recently to Newt to Hertfordshire, it was right there. Okay. Right there, opposite the prison. Do you know what I mean? Kingswood Road it was. Kingswood Road. Yeah. Were you on it? I was born at the top. That's where I was. In our new park road. Yeah. That's where I grew up. Okay. Do you know on the documentary, at the beginning when I'm walking through the flats, that's where that is. Is that there, is it? Okay. That's where that is. Okay. Funny enough, yeah. Yeah, mate.

59:42It's right at the bottom of Kingswood Road. You come out of them flats and you do a left. I couldn't afford Clapham, so we went to Brixton. Yeah. And also Brixton was a 6am finish. Yeah, mate, listen. I swear to God. No, mate. You can't. You can't. I know. No, try and buy somewhere around there now. Yeah. I bought it for 180 in year 2000. Yeah. I think now you're looking at 8, 900 or something. Yeah, definitely. Wow. 100%. 100%. 100%. Like, we bought our council flat. Yeah. Our council, it's like a three-bedroom council flat for£19 ,000 of the council. Sold it for nearly£400. You're joking, mate.

1:00:16In the council flats, mate. Do you know what I mean? Crazy, bro. Do you know what I mean? What's Brixton like today? It's crazy. It's like a real melting pot of being gentrified. Mate, when I go back there now, it's a bit of a shock for me because, There are so many crazy mad people walking around. There are fucking so many of them. I agree. Real mad people. Mixed with all ex-students and all that sort of thing. There's an underbelly that no one knows about. Mate, there's like junkies lying on the street like this, like they're dead. I'm like, what the fuck? What's going on here? I go back there now.

1:00:51I'm like, it's just too busy. Yeah, mate. It's too busy. I'm used to being out of town now. I'm like, get the fuck out of here. Go see my kids or my grandchildren. I'm out of here. Fridge was good though, wasn't it? Remember the church? opposite the fridge the mass the mass and then they would have those massive waterfalls people sleeping underneath we had they would press a button and it would go we used to have an event there at the mass do you know what I mean and it was nuts because Ralph who owned who ran the fridge he never liked it do you know what I mean but he's known me since I was little so he used to say listen I need to talk to you you know because like you know how come you're not doing the event over here I'm like well you know what I mean because you need my family and all that as well.

1:01:34So I'm sure that if, if I was someone else, it wouldn't have ended nicely. But we actually kind of having a little negotiation and blah, blah, blah. Did you enjoy promoting or did you before DJing? Because obviously promoting is a financial risk. DJing, you're getting paid and guaranteed your work. I never started, I never really started because we had, when, at that time we used to do events, but we had people that worked with us that were promoting. I've only started promoting myself and did my own event in the last five years. Do you know what I mean? Which is like my, my event, Brixton base we're that we won the award for the best club night in the country two years in a row do you know what I mean so I enjoy doing that but it's a lot it's a lot of graft you've got to be made to be a promoter it's hard for someone to be a DJ and go I actually want to be a promoter yeah it's a lot of graft you know what I mean it's got to be in the blood I think yeah it's got it's a lot of graft I think I think it's easier now because I'm such a happy-go-lucky person now and I'm more approachable there are people before be like oh yeah I was just so easy to talk to you now before I was scared to talk to you I was like what do you mean I said yeah you were just so moody I was like really but you just don't see it when you're in that you know what I mean now people are just like so I find it a lot easier to put on a party you seem a lot happier I'm so happy and even on your socials you give off a beautiful vibe you know that yeah thank you yeah I'm just I'm at peace with my life and I want other people to be at peace as well and I want to give that off I want people to see listen you know you can you can live in peace listen none of us will promise an easy life do you know what I mean none of us none of us but it's how your attitude your attitude and how when you go through hard times will make it easier or harder because you've got to go through them or also you've got to like yourself to like other people yeah if you don't like yourself yeah exactly it's hard to exactly do you know what I mean and you've got either way you're going to go through it anyway do you know what I mean so it's up to you how you go through it what other faces have come out of Brixton over the last 30 years well well you've got Fabio Fabio's from Brixton Tipper Eyrie he's a fucking legend Dillian White from Brixton Dillian White yeah Dillian White's from Brixton Spencer Ferron the boxer yeah

1:03:56so many people man yeah yeah yeah so many people Smiley Culture yeah Gorest His Soul Smiley so many people man so many people like actors David Bowie's from Brixton right yeah David Bowie there's a big mural of him there so many actors and you know entertainers and there's a long list you know what I mean but I can't think of them all off the top of my head but there's a long list of people from Brixton was there anyone in Brixton as you were growing up that you had the fear of um older than you like mate he's got a serious reputation yeah a guy called jimmy bish yeah jimmy bish was a monster mate we was all scared of him yeah he was like do you know i mean god rest his soul do you know i mean he was like when jimmy came you all hid everyone just like his name's come up a few times you know has it yeah when jimmy came yeah when jimmy when jimmy turned up you know yeah and the thing about it is like my family and everyone we're all everyone but when jimmy came Lay low Do you know what I mean Hide your stuff Like get your thing Get your ring off Everything When Jimmy It's funny His name's turned up a few times Yeah yeah yeah When Jimmy turned up Yeah behave yourself mate Do you know what I mean Like just got that Just molt into the background A little bit That's like yeah mate Yeah When Jimmy turned up What um Has there ever been a time When you've been close To losing your life Yeah Um Yeah A couple of times When I've been involved In like Um gang fights and stuff like that.

1:05:30I got a scar down there. You can't see it. I'm really lucky. I got a scar that goes all the way down here like this. But it looks like a laugh line. But it's a scar all the way down there. That day I nearly lost my life. Do you know what I mean? Where were you? I was at a party and there was a bit of a fight between rival gangs, me, Arsenal and another lot. And I got cut there. I got cut with a small razor blade. and it's like I look back and sometimes I look at it and think oh yeah I forgot I got a scar but it's all the way down my face all the way down there where were you I was at a blues party do you know what I mean did you know it was going to kick off or did it just kick off it just kicked off and those days the blues party it was pitch black the only time there was any light is when you opened the toilet door do you know what I mean and it was pitch black in there so it was kicked off and I've gone outside and my friends looked at me and gone I'm like what it's on your face and I'm going and it's just my face was open like that man do you know what I mean and there was stabbings choppers going everywhere do you know what I mean and yeah and it was nuts because after that happened we went round the guy's house I was like I can't leave this I've had to go round his house and do something not very nice do you know what I mean and it was I think that was the last time I'd done something really bad to someone because I just I went round there and I dealt with everyone in the house like mums dads everyone and I'm like mate I thought I can't be doing things like that to people anymore and I think that was the last time I'd done something really bad to someone do you know what I mean I thought I've got over the line this time do you know what I mean I thought but at that time I thought fuck this shit everyone's getting it and I thought yeah I can't be doing that to people no more were there any were there any people in that 30 of you hanging around were just holding you back and mate don't let it go or they were like if you've got to do what you've got to do no we'll go together we'll go in there together there's none of that stopping there's none of that everyone's like fuck this shit we're going over there do you know what I mean everyone's like fuck that we're going over there how naughty was the postcode wars back then there was when I was young or was it more there was no actual postcode wars that came later with the kids later we as Brixton boys wouldn't go to Peckham or we wouldn't go to New Cross but it wasn't now you've got postcode wars in the estates between them yeah this estate they were one estate but they've got two different postcodes and you can't cross that road because the kids over there will kill you and it's like what do you know what I mean so when I was growing up it wasn't really a postcode war thing it was more the area like if you came from Brixton you came from Brixton but now there are about four different postcodes in Brixton and they're all fighting against each other little kids do you know what I mean and it's just like do you reckon you'd have any influence over that now now well do you know what I mean they look up like the kids now you know they don't give a fuck they don't that's what I'm saying they don't give a fuck they're probably looser now they're like who are you we don't know who you are they don't give a fuck about me yeah do you know what I mean if anything their dads and all that would be like yeah yeah yeah if anything they're like oh you're so-and-so's dad oh yeah but now they might be like oh yeah my mum knows you or my dad knows you yeah I've heard about you yeah I listen to you yeah do you know what I mean okay but personally if I just went up to them and be like who the fuck are you but they're like oh you're that guy that my mum talks about or my dad or you're the guy we saw in the billboard in Brixton like we know like they all know me now do you know what I mean then the respect comes then the respect comes like oh yeah my dad says that you're a legend oh yeah man my dad knows you because my dad all the elder ones all talk about me to their kids so they're like oh you're the guy that they're talking about yeah man but me just going up to them talking to them I'm like who the fuck are you old man yeah fuck off but now they're like oh yeah my dad talks about you tell me what your thoughts are on the drum and bass scene as we sit today in 2026 I love it I love seeing I love seeing

1:09:51stride only to have a spinning loading icon bring everything to a halt. When navigating competing priorities, reliability isn't a luxury, it's a foundation. AT &T Business is built to work so you can spend less time troubleshooting and more time focusing on what actually matters. Powered by AT &T Business, built to work. Get today at business.att.com. Most women have been there. Something feels off. You don't feel like yourself, yet your doctor says everything looks fine. Spoiler, it's your hormones midi is a virtual care platform built for women by women and offers specialized hormone care from trained clinicians plus it's covered by most major insurances getting started is easy you can book your first visit with a clinician right away it's not you it's your hormones visit join midi.com to book your first visit that's join m-i-d-i.com insurance coverage varies check with your plan for coverage just young people coming in making music playing music finding a way out of the rat race and moving the music on now do you know what i mean like really moving it on to new audiences is global now and it's just so good to see these young people coming in do you know what I mean just making their mark do you know what I mean a lot of the young people are making like trying to replicate the old sound and but modernize it and I love it mate I just love seeing young people coming taking something that we created taking it onto another level on a global stage and paying homage and having respect for the founders, the founders as well.

1:11:45You know what I mean? It's just, it's just a great thing to see. Who would you, what names would you put as the original founders of drum and bass? If you were to put a pool of people? Well, it's, I just don't know. You've got, you've got different, different kind of people. You've got people like Lenny Dice, who made that record, We Are E. That's one of the first founding father tunes, man. we are way ahead of his time and then you know you got people like Fabio and Groove Rider that championed the sound at Rage on a Thursday night do you know what I mean and then you know you got loads of us like Randall God rest your soul rest in peace my brother Randall then Goldie came along and took it to another level you got people like Doc Scott who always believed in that underground sound and he's from Coventry and he's always stuck true to his you know you've got people like DJ SS from Leicester who ran that formation records from the early inception so from the early 90s he released so much records I remember one time he'd put out about 10 records a month you know what I mean and then Ronnie Sighs Ronnie Sighs came a little bit after a bit later wasn't it because he came out Did he come under your wing, didn't he?

1:13:05He came under our wing. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. By the time Ronnie came out, the thing was already, the machine was already moving. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. People like Paul Ibiza, he's done Ibiza records. Do you know what I mean? People like... How would you explain Goldie? He's a genius. Yeah. Absolute genius. A maverick. Yeah. Trailblazer. Absolute genius. as an artist a very complex guy wears his heart on his sleeve but is an absolute genius when you get to know him as well as I do we're very close friends we talk about lots of things and he's an absolute bloody genius mate yeah and as a human being?

1:13:53beautiful human being kind kind yeah comes across that way very kind very misunderstood yeah Why do you think he's misunderstood? Because His exterior Yeah You know people often look at people And you And you kind of People judge straight away Yeah You know what I mean Read the book Don't judge the cover And plus as well You know I think You know During his life He's had to kind of put that That thing on As a Defence mechanism Do you know what I mean? But he's such a Such a wonderful man And he's such a Talented Talented guy And I think his brain goes in all different directions and all that as well.

1:14:32You know what I mean? Yeah, I've known him. It's crazy, man. Like, I remember one time he called me up. This is when he called me up one time and some people had broken to his yard, his yardies, broken to his house and took some stuff out. What about? When he was living in the Swiss cottage in the tower block. And someone broke in there and took his stuff and I was like, what? Fuck this fucking shit. Come, we're going over there. So we went over there and I had my thing on me. so I've gone over there and I've burst in the yard and I pulled out my thing and then I fucking had jumped over the fucking jumped over the balcony so I chased one of them down caught him hit him in the head with a couple of gun butts and then we got the stuff back do you know what I mean?

1:15:18Colin yeah yeah yeah where's he at the moment? he lives in Thailand Thailand yeah he lives in Thailand living a healthy clean clean clean focused so concentrated on his new album and with his band and he's got an art gallery as well he's done really well for himself he's done well but he's at peace yeah the peace you know he's at peace with himself you can have a few quid but you can still be at war with yourself and you can still be but he's in such a peaceful place you know what I mean and that's what I ever want from my friends just to have that peace once you find it you want it for other people that you love as well you know yeah where are you today how do you feel today i feel i just super grateful for where i'm at in my life successful living in peace i tell you something 10 years ago i did not never ever thought that i'd be where I am today.

1:16:22Like, in terms of financially, my brain, my peace, I never ever saw, saw it coming. I could end up just being so. Do you feel like your life has become manageable now being clean? Yeah. It's a lot easier, right? Yeah, I can manage, I manage my life now. I manage my emotions. I manage, I manage my reactions. Yes. Because you know what they say? They say that something might happen, that first 10 seconds that's a normal reaction then in between that's where your character is then your last reaction do you know what I mean? It's the decision you make It's the decision you make so now I'm not I just go okay is that what happened alright and I sit with it and I'm going okay and then I make a rational decision where before I'd be like bang you know what I mean Calmness is a superpower It is so good Yeah mate And it's nice to be around people who have got nice calm energy as well.

1:17:21Yeah, yeah. I just like to. And often, you know, because I'll be the first to this. Mate, that's not the way. Do you know what I mean? You remember the Godfather, right? Do you remember when they got Sonny on the bridge? And he went, are you fucking cunts? And he went out in the car and they shot him up because he reacted. Do you know what I mean? Being reactive is not great. They got him on the bridge. They're like, I know we're going to get Sonny. that's how Al Pacino ended up being the Don because Sonny was meant to be the Don but Sonny was a hothead and that's how they got him that's how that was his downfall man do you know what I mean have you ever been married never never been married kids I've got nine no what's talking about I've got nine grandchildren how many kids you got six have you got six six what a play six oldest one's 40 youngest is 25 do you know what I mean how are they around you now they love me do you know what I mean I'm just like Nah, they're like, Dad, we're before.

1:18:21I'm just happy for them now because they've got a dad now that they can just be like, yeah, dad. Do you know what I mean? We're before. I was unreliable. Who knows? I might not even turn up. Do you know what I mean? I say I'm going to do something, but I might not go. Do you know what I mean? More time than not, I would never stick to my word. So I'm going to come and do this in that day. You might not even turn up. You might not even turn up. Do you know what I mean? So you're nice to feel present, right? Oh, mate. I'm just, I'm so there now. like yeah man do you know what I mean they know they can count on me that dad he will be here and one thing about me if I say three o 'clock it's three o 'clock it's not half past but it used to be it used to be it used to be yeah do you know what I mean he'd be happy if I turned up half past do you know what I mean before we finish up here have you got anything to say to your children um yeah thank you for putting up for me thank you for putting up with me thank you for loving me and I'm glad you're all proud of me do you know what I mean now and I want to say to my business partner Brian G thank you for never giving up on me mate because I don't know how he never I don't know how he never gave up on me mate you know what I mean and I know now he's super proud of me and to everyone else as well who never gave up on me.

1:19:47Thank you for never giving up on me, man. And I hope I've made you all proud. Yeah. Frost, I've absolutely loved this, mate. Thank you, Dodge. Thank you for having me. You know what? As we said before, I should have came down ages ago, but I think we've done it at the right time. This is perfect, mate. It all falls into place, mate. Exactly that. Yeah. You know what I mean? I wish you all the best. I can see so much light in you. Yeah, thank you. I can see the light as we're talking. The light's there. There's nothing there. You know, it's gone. Yeah, man. There's all those years, decades a day.

1:20:15You don't need that in your life anymore. I just want to, I just want to just bring peace and love to everyone. And, you know, live the rest of my days in peace, man. We didn't get to that question. Where did the name Jumping Jack Frost come from? Yes. That was the first question I asked you at the start of this week. Right, so, basically, I'll tell you what happened, right? We was, we was in a pirate station, right? And, my name used to be Underworld. Can you believe it? Underworld. Fuck's sake. Yeah, the Underworld. So they've gone to, they've gone, they're giving out licenses. Yeah. And we've, we're like, we're going to apply for a license.

1:20:55But they said, everyone who's applying for a license has to switch off. Yeah. And that's how you apply for your license. We're like, fuck this shit. We're staying on. Right. So we changed the name from Passion Radio to Lightning FM. And we, all the DJs changed their names. Yeah. Right. We changed frequency and everything. and so we came up with all these little names just come up come up with like silly names and I'm like alright I'll be jumping Jack Frost and I've developed a new voice and a new persona but it just caught on and I thought fuck that I'm staying like this mate yeah I thought fuck that I'm not going back to Underworld because I was like yeah I'm Underworld I was all moody but now I'm jumping Jack Frost yeah yeah and I'll be like that and everyone just like started the phone started going nuts yeah jumping Jack Frost and I was just like yeah I was like, fuck that.

1:21:45I'm staying like this, mate. And that was it, mate. Quality. Frost, I love this, mate. Big love. Nice, thank you, brother. Thank you very much. I wish you all the best in the future as well, mate. Thank you, brother. And go and help a load of people, mate. Mate, that's what I want to do. If there's anyone out there who... How can they get hold of you? Get me on the socials, yeah? Get me on the socials. If you message me, I will always reply. Do you know what I'm saying? I'd like to help as many people as I can. I should try to set up a little kind of, you know, organisation and hopefully I'll get round to that.

1:22:17Do you know what I mean? Because it's something that I'm really passionate about because if I could do it, I swear to God, you guys can do it as well. Do you know what I mean? Life is beautiful when you live clean, mate. Yeah, that's the key. With a good heart. Yeah, mate. Live with a good heart, you know. Life is never going to be easy but it's manageable when you're clean and you've got a clear head and a good heart. Mate, loved it. you're a good man I wish you all the best thank you very much cheers fella take care mate hi guys I really hope you enjoyed that as much as I did can you do us a favour and leave us a review as it massively helps us grow the show cheers guys

1:22:59hey everyone it's Chris Gillebeau here host of the Side Hustle School podcast this episode is powered by AT &T Business in my early days I did some of my best work in parked cars or coffee shops. But when I landed my first big contract, I realized I couldn't bet my future on a public connection that cuts out if someone turns on a blender. As a small business owner, you're already wearing at least 10 hats. You shouldn't have to be your own IT department as well. That's why I rely on AT &T Business. They keep your connectivity reliable so you have one less thing to worry about. Powered by AT &T Business, built to work.

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