Ask Dodge #2. You're in Trouble If You're a Secret in Business

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1:57Peruse endless styles in our stores, or use our app to virtually try on frames and get personalized recommendations. To find your next favorite pair of glasses, sunglasses, or contact lenses, or to locate your nearest Warby Parker store, head over to warbyparker.com. That's warbyparker.com. Welcome to Ask Dodge. I'm an entrepreneur who's built five businesses over the last 28 years, Exited two of them and still running three today. On this show, you'll get straight talking, real business chat with no fluff. I think we're going to help thousands of people in business. I've got my good mate with me, Marky Masters, who's going to be the co-host of the show.

2:33Dodge, looking forward to this. If there's something you guys want us to answer, send your questions to askdodge at dodgewoodle.com. I hope you enjoy, everyone. Hello, listeners. Welcome back to the show. And today, we are going to look at choosing yourself. Let's just set the scene for you. Give us an instance from your life where you know that you didn't wait for someone else. I'm just going to do this. From a very early age, mate. From a very, very early age of living above pubs. Whether I was selling tickets to the nightclub next door as a 10-year-old. Whether I was setting up a hot dog stand or an ice cream stand outside the front of the pub, outside on the River Thames.

3:18where I was setting up a stool at the back of the pub selling toys with a bum bag. I just had that in my blood. I enjoyed earning money, mate. Oh, really? Yeah, I did from a very young age. Living above pubs is a very different upbringing. You're around adults the whole time. You're around doormen. You're around police rage. You're around toxicity. You're around people wheeling and dealing. You're around DJs. You're around people dancing. You're around people being boozed. you're around right next door to a nightclub a big buzzy pub of two floors and it was just i enjoyed seeing people around me earning money and then my old man i would see him earning money as the as the pub owner and he'd always have a grand in his pocket cash so you grew up with that you know and in the 80s so coming back to now coming back to things such as the sevens what did you do why did you do it well i was doing the nightclub world for 10 years and it was like right i need to get out of the nightclub world.

4:17I've had a great hit in my 20s, been travelling all around the country, I had 12 nightclubs every week. I'm going into, why don't I start up a festival? But no one had ever done a sport and music festival. So it kind of was the next step for me. Like people in the nightclub world, whether you're a promoter, most people would go and own a nightclub once they've been a promoter, or they would go and own a bar. Very, very small percentage take the massive risk and go from the promoter world, being a promoter, taking the door money from nightclubs, flyer and poster in and fly posting and being chased everywhere because you're not allowed to do that.

4:51But the more people you got into your nightclub, the more money you would earn. And once you've done that for a certain period, when you're in your 20s, you think you can do it for the rest of your life. I'm thinking, this is amazing. You know, three quid on the door back then. It was 1 ,500 people, 2 ,000 people. This sums are amazing. Minus your DJ, minus your promoting costs and your flyers and posters. But to then jump into something that is a lot bigger was a big, big gamble. Because your revenue streams in the world I was in was you take the door money. You then go into the festival world.

5:22The revenue streams go from tickets to camping to glamping to VIP upgrades to sponsorship. So you're now dealing with global sponsors and national sponsors. You're now dealing with catering companies, bringing 40, 50, 60 trucks to your festival. and now you're dealing with drinks brands because everyone's going to be drinking at your festival. So you're now opening yourself up to seven revenue streams where before it was just one. So it was... Does it make you feel good though? Like, I built this. Yes. I did this. Yes. Yes, yes. There wasn't a handout that I got from here or this investor put this bit in and he's still getting his cut in there.

6:01Everything was stopped, mate. Everything was bootstrapped. I didn't know what bootstrapped was. It was just, this is what we do. This is what we did. You set up businesses, you start businesses, you earn the money you've earned to then move on to the next bigger thing. Actually walking into a festival, that is risky, risky business. Super risky. Especially back then when people wouldn't trust putting their cards over a computer and put their bank details in. And back then there was no social media. So it was like you were getting whacked from both angles compared to the promoters now where everyone's buying on their mobile phones, buying tickets.

6:30They're seeing social media being promoted on tickets. Here we go. Because choosing yourself, thinking yourself is this thing that comes with risk like you don't know it's gonna work is it but that thing we talked about before if i don't try then i'm never gonna find that i'm never gonna find out and it's just like the bravest thing ever is to step forward and say i'm gonna give this a go yeah do you think that lots of us though wait for permission wait to do something and sometimes that can hold us back i think quite a lot i think so it does it does come down from your parents you are your parents whether you like it or not they were their parents where they like it or not it's whether they've given you the freedom to be creative or they've given you the restriction of going you must go and get a you must get straight a's in all your exams you must get this you must go and get a job mine was very different mine was a lot of freedom going go and do what you want to got to do go and earn a pound note son go decide what you want to do when you're 16 17 18 19 give it a go and it was always give it a go try it see what happens open some doors be curious be kind be respectful and and and i guess that then goes into the in adulthood give it a go back yourself i guess you said they're that thing of freedom in it where there are instances where we're that you stepped into the middle it's like well it was all right because it gave me that freedom because i was doing things that nobody knew where i was and i could figure it out as i was going along i've just figured it out as i've gone along and everything we've launched just figure it out that's the bit that i enjoy i enjoy the chaos what does it work where when does it when does it work how do you know it's working what a business yeah like all this stuff like the clothing brands and all that kind of stuff when you start things that you didn't when you start like the clothing brand the sportswear brand for an example you know you're making a dent in the in the market that we're at because back then our competitors were buying all their sports gear and make getting made in china so i was like but that but you get made in china you've got to ship it over that takes three months then you're stuck in customs so I didn't like that model at all and I wanted to beat the industry model so we then found a factory we checked out China we checked out Turkey Pakistan India making everything didn't like it I need to find somewhere close to home so the so I could beat the business model it would not be in 12 weeks landed on your door I found a factory in Lithuania and in Lithuania it took four weeks landed on your door so if you're doing a hundred thousand pounds or fifty thousand pounds worth a kit for a university, all their track suits, all their hoodies, all their socks, playing socks, whatever it was, we know we had an advantage because it was four weeks instead of 12.

9:07We know that the stuff that we made was all bespoke. We know that we weren't getting stung with language barriers. There was all these things that we found out by just doing. But by just doing, there is a lot of chaos. But if you're used to entrepreneurship, which I am, I know the chaos is coming. If you're not used to entrepreneurship, you're going to have a shock that the chaos will be there. Because you're trying to juggle growing your business. You're trying to do the marketing. You're trying to do the sales. You're trying to build a culture. You're trying to deal with the accountants. All of a sudden, you've got a lawyer's letter coming in and you're trying to do everything yourself.

9:49It's only when you get to a point where you can actually, when you're bringing money in, you go, oh, I need help. but don't jump so quickly to get in trying to build a team of three, five, six, seven really, really quickly. So it's interesting thing you say that it's all about who we are, characteristics and what we bring to the table, isn't it? Like you say that, wherever was brought up by our families and the way that we are and the characters that we are, where sometimes it is, we, we, we're encouraged to do things and you know that there is support and love and whatever that's around us to do it, whether I, otherwise there is a kind of straight down the line way.

10:23that you have to behave in a certain way. So the ability to pick ourselves and to choose ourselves, whatever it is, events, business, starting something, audio, video, the biggest thing is inherent is our own values and what we believe in, isn't it? Otherwise, we just toe the line with everybody else. You've got to stand out. You have to stand out in anything you do. How can you stand out in what you do? but do you see but do you see there is a lot of the reason people don't make that step up is because you're following the same path as everybody else well no people don't step up Marky because you've got the fear of judgement who cares about being judged why do people care so much about being judged everyone's judging everyone do you read a one star review of course if there's something like that you want to find out what it is and you if you ever got anything like that you amend it you get in contact with them but you are being judged you're being judged for people are judging you for doing nothing.

11:23Not you, I'm saying people are judging people for doing nothing, going, God, they're wasting their life. They've got, you know, I've got friends, I'm like, God, he's got so much potential, but they might be a bit lazy or they're very happy in their job. They're happy to guarantee that there's money at the end of the month and no financial pressures. But the way the world in the moment is people can lose their jobs because businesses aren't doing as well as they used to do. so you have to have that you have to build build people have to be building something whether you're building your personal brand which they called whether you're building a personal brand really does come in nicely because it's not just about being the face of your company personal brand is your reputation when you're not about what people talk about you whether you're writing on linkedin people get to see you they never met you before they get to see your personality it helps you hire people does it come back to then this thing about if you're saying right i see this little space in the marketplace and i'm going to make that step and i haven't tested it before like you were just sharing about the clothing brand is that the big step when it comes to picking ourself is this thing of like we've just got to be prepared that we we cannot listen to what anyone else says in term not in terms of those people when you say being judged or the things that are there the negative stuff that fills us sometimes it's our own determination that enables it to work over time?

12:45Or is it a fact that we're sticking close to something that's worked before or a strategy that we're working to? Or is it a fact that, or the importance that we're leading with something because this is what I believe in and what is true to my heart? Well, you have to believe in, you have to believe in something if you really want to make it work. But I know many entrepreneurs who are successful who have chosen in the wrong industry. You can jump into an industry and it just not make money. But you're putting in the same amount of graft and the same principles as you would do jumping into another industry and that other industry, you might make a quarter of a million pound a year.

13:21You know, so again, it's doing your homework and finding out what the market tells you. What does the market, I mean doing your homework, I mean doing it for months, months phoning up, homework, get more information, get more data because if you jump into a business you could lose a lot of money you could lose a lot of sleep you could lose relationships around you and at the end of it you could be skint yeah because you have picked the wrong industry so where is the the opposite side to that where you know that you know that there is a return where was the where's the early signs like like from your experience where you knew that things were working just because you stuck with something I mean, could you have believed in it?

14:05Feedback, feedback, feedback. Oh, really? Yeah, 100%. 100 % feedback. Because it's like with this podcast, isn't it? It's like what you do and like listening to... Like if someone's listening now, if someone may listen to this on a clip somewhere and they go really liking this new show called Ask Dodge with Dodger Marky, or someone goes out of their way and leaves a review, go, boys, really enjoying that. Thanks for that. Straight away we're going, oh, people are enjoying this. It gives you that boost that you're doing something that may help people. you're speaking real talk which not many people speak real chat these days because even on LinkedIn a lot of people don't speak real chat because they are employed by someone they have to be seen to be doing it in a certain way but when you've never had a boss and you've got no one looking over your shoulder saying you can't write that I would encourage all bosses out there for all of their staff to use LinkedIn and let them be themselves on LinkedIn in yeah that's a big thing in terms of you give somebody uh autonomy autonomy sorry to have a go to do it rather than being judged looked over yeah following towing the company line yeah of you never know how you would express yourself in whatever way that it is that can actually be of a huge benefit yeah to the company isn't it as well as i say i agree when i see people who have got character on LinkedIn like go on go for it I'll big them up and I know if I write something I know that my audience will see them you know I want people to be successful it's just like a it's just such a simple thing of wanting people to improve and progress and be a success and earn money and be happy I guess as well coming back to this theme as well of choosing ourself is that what we're talking about is this gradual build-up of our own self-belief what are the things that drive you success that is no success drives me being successful in whatever you're building from nothing building a team around you and seeing everyone growing around you like i love gen z's i think gen z's i think they get a they get a real tough rap market but i think they're fantastic and i've i've made gen z's and built them up through the business that they've become directors as a gen z as a 23 or 24 i don't care what age you're at if you're a sponge and you want to learn and you've got a brilliant attitude and you're a go-getter and you're thinking about things before I'm asking you, could you mind doing this?

16:30And they've already thought about them. You can't, that's golden. You made me think about this as well. It's like, when you talk about that, the talented team, the team that are a part of the wider space that you're building. It is like being back at school because it's like you can either wait to be picked for the team and everything else and wait and it never, never happens. Or you can say, I'm going to choose myself and do you know what? I'm going to pick my mates as well. I want to pick my mates or my friends that are around us. We can make something that's pretty cool together because we didn't have to do what everyone else was already doing because we're making that space.

17:01And I just find that really, like on my side, it's like over the years, no one ever picked me. Like, for instance, to talk, to stand up, to present on the stage and everything else that goes with it within a business context. But you're very good at that. No, because that was because that thing of me picking me. Yes. Because I started a project where I could create that platform, like to host. I wanted to know how to host and to welcome people. And I want to understand that. But I can also see why you didn't get picked, why you got picked last at football. That's not funny, is it? You don't want that, do we?

17:36Hang on a minute. I've never seen someone do, hang on a minute. When I've seen you play, it's like free kick-ups and then you're going for a volley. Come back to school. It's like that. But we don't. But you are a wonderful host. You're a wonderful human being. People warm to you. like when you're around and you're doing your events and when you are bringing people on stage and making them feel good about themselves you bring this wonderful energy and when i first saw your event i was like i'm loving this and i can see why you've built a community of people loving you for what you do cheers that comes with time isn't it that comes with time by knowing that you wanted to step into that space to become better at your craft but it comes with that of being judged and I kind of want to pick up on that you're quite forthright by saying I don't let this I don't let this affect me definitely why would it affect me I've always been a promoter I've always had built my own businesses so no one's going to promote me no one's going to give me a wage and a salary no one ever has done so you've got to promote yourself that's a big bit there that bit now promoting yeah ourselves because you've highlighted this before that I'm all right with this because no one else is going to do this yeah I've got to kind of back myself to the hill here because I'm just going to be shouting from the hills about me.

18:49Who's putting money at the table at the end of the month or the end of the year? If you're not promoting yourself and you're not promoting your brand or your company, you're in trouble. You're in serious trouble. If you're an entrepreneur who can't sell and can't market, you need one of those gifts. If you're not a salesperson, you need to bring someone in or you're not a marketing, but vice versa. But you've got to have one of those gifts to give you a good chance of being a success. But you have to promote yourself. Don't worry what people think that's a good one to pick up on but if you want to talk about your business in a certain way you haven't just you haven't got to go and talk about your business this one you just talk about your business on linkedin and linkedin is the best the best social media platform has ever lived for for businesses if someone's listening to this and they're thinking okay you're talking about this and uh i feel a bit nervous so i'm going to feel a bit silly if I'm talking about what I'm starting my business of what I'm doing, or I feel like I'm showing off a little bit here if I'm going to give it a nice thumbs up for something that's gone well.

19:49What would be your advice to somebody that is a little bit reticent or hesitant to share something because they feel really good about it, but they feel a bit embarrassed? Mate, whack it up. Put it up. Go on. Because people don't care. People don't care what you're doing. They're more worried about what they're doing, what they're building, what they're saying. Friends around you would like it and get supportive. And people who don't know you will start coming on. If you start speaking real, just be real. Don't overthink it and go, I must do that. I must put it in chat GPT, all that. But I've seen people on LinkedIn put chat GPT.

20:23The person we're speaking about a minute ago who writes all the LinkedIn stuff and it's all church. Everyone can see through it. Just be you. I like that what you said there because no one else cares. And I've lived by this. No one cares about your birthday, your dreams and your kids apart from your family.

21:03We've also left the link below as well. But I think people overthink. I don't like overthinking things. It makes life a lot easier. Do you think that holds a lot of us back, that? Particularly that? That drive that we're trying to do, make something happen? I think the overthinking holds people back. So I think as well, where we're looking at being judged, we're being held back by our own securities and everything else with this whole theme, picking ourselves, choosing ourselves. So it's like there's lots of barriers in front of us, isn't it? The more that we can kind of knock them down and the more that we're more comfortable with ourselves.

21:36And as you kind of said there, if something's happened, that's all right. As you said, tomorrow's tomorrow. It'd be fish and chip. Love it. We're getting a fish and chip analogy. But it's fish and chip newspapers the next day. It's forgotten. But you might spark someone's mind. You don't need the like. You don't need the comment. But I tell you what you do see is you'll see people will be watching you. People will see your character. People see what you're about. People will warm to you. and then one day someone will just pop up in your dm you're like wow i didn't see that coming because what you're saying is what you build up over time isn't it this thing what you're building up if you're putting you're making that big brave step to say this is what i'm going to go with and i don't know if it's right or not well if you don't that this thing of that you have to give it a go that kind of tunes into who you are that enables you to pick yourself what's been the big thing for you that you've that you've done something that you've done where something that you've done where you saw a return for it and it just felt and it just felt really really good it doesn't have to be bigging people up on linkedin bigging people up who work for us across the three companies and saying she was she's been unreal everyone she came on board she was working in a a chicken restaurant and she was a waitress and she was so good and at the end of it i said here's my number come in for a chat come and work for Bournemouth 7s come in for a chat I'm not saying there's anything there she comes in for a chat the following day she was buzzing I said there's nothing here for you but she was so good the following day I went back to her restaurant got a table for one he'd be on the menu she come over and said have my help you I went bang I went Kira just to let you know you're amazing I'm gonna offer you a full-time job with Bournemouth 7s those little things I love doing I love I love promoting people I love looking I love seeing the best in people.

23:26I love believing in people. And that's the buzz that I get. And people say to me, why do you promote your staff so much on LinkedIn? They can get poached. If they want to get poached, they're going to get poached. But I get such a wonderful, warm feeling of someone doing really good for you and being an entrepreneur of your business, that they've got that spark and they're running it like their own business. They're keeping the cost down. They're getting good value for money everywhere. The things that business is all about. and what I want them to go on and do after that, like my four directors have worked for me.

23:59They've all gone and set up their own companies. They're entrepreneurs now. That's an interesting way of sharing it because you're saying like you start something because you have this something that you believe in and this thing that you don't need permission from anyone to do it. And then you make that space to make other people feel a part of it too. So it builds up exactly what they're doing. It builds up trust, Mark. For their next ventures as well. I guess that thing you trusted in someone else to give them the gusto to say I'm going to give this a go now and I just I hadn't thought about that that's an interesting thing you you you you back yourself to the hill to which you back others to enables them to have a spring in their step to grow and just to kind of have fun and enjoy what is supposed to be in front of them there will be there will be many many people out there who have worked with me over the years have gone thank you Dodge for giving the opportunity and believing in me.

24:54They've gone off and working maybe for other companies or set up their own companies. They will do the same to young people coming through and give them an opportunity. And the people who give you the opportunity and believe in you, you will remember them for life. When you're looking after people at the end of the year and you've done a great job and giving you that bonus or giving that so, everyone buzzes. And that's one thing over the years, over employing people for 28 years, is that I've constantly looked after people because I know if you look after people, you're going to get looked after back and you get a lot of trust you get a lot of loyalty you get people who stayed with you for 11 years, 10 years, 9 years, 8 years and then once people stay with you and they're earning more and they get more freedom they're building your brand and your company to become stronger and stronger and stronger which essentially is building a moat around your company to get you to the 10 years to get you to the 7 years to get you to the festival coming into year 19.

25:51Like, it all just works hand in hand, and it comes down to just being real, honest, and straight talking. And I guess as well, is building that back-in-yourself idea we're talking about helps you then to build that powerful, independent space that other people can be a part of, isn't it? Because I guess the crux of this show that we're talking about here is around, one, independence. I'm doing this for myself not anyone else or there is a backer or someone else that has to get their dividend at the end of it and this thing around interdependence where you've built that space where other people rely and support each other to big each other up it starts with a little seed on ourselves where no one else is looking at us and and we were talking about that that maybe no one knowing who you are is actually a really good thing because then you have the freedom as we talked about at the start to build something that we become familiar with over time that when other people join in that it means that we're making this space like we're protecting each other as well as kind of making our own is kind of making ourselves do well from all this along along the way as well there is nothing better go on than being in a room with entrepreneurs and other founders why because you have the most amazing conversation because everyone's going through the same journey and going through the same shit and when you break through the back of it this is what happens but your entrepreneurial journey will be that first start you're excited excited excited building website building that you then get to a point maybe eight months in you're looking left and going i'm too i'm too big to be small anymore you look right and saying i haven't broken the back of it i'm too small to be big you're caught in this like desert you're in this desert area going what am i doing am i safe is this business actually going to work am i going to earn money I've walked away from a job which was three grand a month guaranteed and I'm not earning any money for the first three years you all live like a student it's what happens here's a talk there about support unless you've got a load of money behind you and you go and set up a business and money's okay but majority of bootstrapping all the bootstrapping that I've done that's the feeling that you get where does it all start from by the way what's that you said you've bootstrapped all this stuff all the stuff that's gone on where does it all start from Does it start from just thinking, I want to give it a go?

28:14Just an idea, mate. I'll have a conversation. By being curious and asking people questions all the time and understanding what they do and why they do that, and then going, is your industry, is it competitive? What do you do? How many people are there? Is your business, is it good? How many staff have you got? And I'm thinking, I've got seven or eight staff, and then you understand more questions. And if nothing comes about that, you've shown an interest in someone. And there's nothing better when someone shows an interest in you and asks you lots of questions. People will then feel good about themselves.

28:42But you've also got information to then pass on to someone else. And I might have a mate who's in the industry and I go, Marky, can you get in contact with you two? Off you go, set up a WhatsApp group, ping in there. Once you've, I've done the intros, I'll take myself out there and hopefully you can create something. And by you two creating something, something good will come around for me because you'll open up a door elsewhere. It's the supportive space that you're building and feeling a part of. one to support uh and be there for other people but as you kind of mentioned there being a room with other people this ability to talk like you have to let off steam and just and talk to people about it i know that we talk a lot about ideas and things that you want to do and everything else the worst thing you can do is boil it all up and just kind of plow on ahead you do you agree or disagree with that what do you mean as in like i'm going to make the i'm going to give this a go and you are but you're not talking to anyone and you're just going by I'm the opposite if I've got an idea I talk to as many people as possible I want feedback I need feedback I need feedback from people who are straight talking with me I know who's straight talking with me my best mates my old man my wife my sister ex-directors who have been around I go can I have your idea what are your thoughts on this but I don't send them to them in a group I send it individually and if I know there's about five people I really really trust in business if I've got an idea or I need something signing off or what are your thoughts about this idea or can you ever watch this sort of 60 second clip?

30:08Is that okay? And if they're all coming individually, you're going, yeah, bang on, bang on, I know I'm onto something. But if there's three of them going, yeah, it's good. And two of them are going, you could, I know, stop, tweak, tweak, tweak, tweak, go back, improve it, send it to them and go, yeah, they like it. They all like it. Fantastic. We're away. So I have good sounding boards of people I trust. But you can't have people who are just going to both smoke up your backside and go, yeah, fantastic. Because those people, they don't really care. They're just bigging you up because they don't want to tell you the truth of, I'm not too sure about that, mate.

30:41But feedback is your answer. Feedback is your only answer. Like feedback on this. Like if people are listening and they will give feedback, we're going to get a little buzz. Like, do we carry this on? Are people enjoying this? Like all we want is some feedback because we're going to go through many, many, many different topics over the coming weeks months because this is the interesting thing when we're coming back full circle then by looking at choosing yourself and choosing yourself as i highlighted at the top is not about confidence it's just about that we don't have to be reliant on anybody else but the more that we're talking where we're talking about not being reliant on anyone else but it's real realizing we need the right people on our side to help make help us with judgment and progress and what we want to do with our own work so it but it does start from wow i'm going to give this a go that means that we can build that environment or that ecosystem when you talk about staff and people that feel a part of something and feel associated with it so they can feel a part and contribute but it's that contribution from the right people around us that makes everything everything feel safe everything that you've shared is all about support and building that space for ourselves and for others is in fact extremely important yeah agree i think another thing there this would be for another topic but really understanding people go i've got old friends i've got a friend understand who are acquaintances and put them in a category and understand who are friends oh that's a good way to close wouldn't you say your acquaintances and your friends maybe that's another topic another day looking forward to it Cheers, Marky.

32:49Right on and right we are there for two different reasons. which is very interesting just because we felt that this really값 troop is nothing more to take to it but they can act as it Ingalls from