How China, Myanmar & The US Connect To Manipur Violence | Major Digvijay Rawat | FO531 Raj Shamani

35:28So, they said that we don't get justice until we get like there was you heard there were women who were paraded naked in Manipur and there are a lot of other murders and you know so until we get justice then we will not hold any talks. They, according to them like a lot of people who committed those crimes are still roaming freely according to Wookiee Zoo so they should be punished and then only we will talk with like the CM. So, cookies are saying that they need justice. Because Maitiz has said that with their women and people. Yes, basically, there are so many deaths. And what does justice look like for them?

36:05Basically, they need to get rid of them. I'll tell you, there are such things, if you can see in Manipur, that people are killing on record. Like, we are making a video, we are playing. People are killing them on record. Like, people are, there was an individual who cut a person's hair. And he is, he is like a hair in his hand. for him. So that guy is still roaming free. Like, until the time, someone didn't hear whether he was arrested or not. Then there is, there is a guy, there was a cookie guy who was basically cutting a head. A farmer was a mate. He was a farmer. He has been arrested by NIA.

36:39He was arrested in Guwahati. So like, there are videos which are on record. You can see people record videos. It was a, it was a, it was a mad show. Like, it was a mad show. Like, people are making videos of them entering somebody's house then killing those people you know there are such videos you know there are such videos you know there are such videos in Zeribam you have seen a small child of a child I was in the family so they went there in Zeribam so they went inside the house you kidnapped the whole family and killed after that they had dead bodies so the child's little body was floating in the water like so there's a tribe there in Ziribam so they killed and their bodies were floating like the violence I don't think people even know about people say exactly nobody knows all of this but it is like they are at the point of no return like people say conflict will be resolved but the way there are crimes there and I mean if it would have been my family I would also thought the same you will remember how he did it even if he is not my family he is not my family he is going to be a whole colony against exactly so I mean this has been targeted like I remember there was a case when a was retired someone So he took him to a bead and then he was killed.

38:21And then he got his body. So there was a very unfortunate incident in our country. How do you identify that he didn't do a cookie, or Maiti, or Naga? Is that easily identifiable? Yes, very much. I mean, if you stay in that place, you can tell you that Naga is cookie or Maiti. There are 1 % of people who look a little similar. But otherwise, majority, you can identify it based on their face, height and you know kind of tone and language so you can know it's easily identifiable but like crime you can't identify which state I am from which city I am from there are some features like maithis have very distinct features cookies have, nagas have such features we can identify easily so it's easy and locally they will be able to identify much easier very obvious if a cookie is dead obviously maithi is dead If they die, they are obviously killing a cookie.

39:16So it is also that kind of thing. So now, what is government doing there? What is local law and order? What are the people doing? Look, the unfortunate part was that the absence of law and order. Why did that happen? Because police was divided on ethnic lines. The state police was completely divided on ethnic lines. which was the Manipur Police, which was in the infall, they were properly acting as a mighty police. which was the Cookie Police, they were properly acting as a Cookie Police. So they were not acting as a Manipur Police, first of all. What happened there was that the protests and attacks were leading in the police.

40:01People were leading with the weapons, they were leading with the weapons. They were leading with the Cookie Police. They were also leading with the Manipur Police. The Milterns were also coming back. So that's the way that... Police are fighting us. Exactly. So how many people in this conflict have been dead in this conflict. Like in this conflict, we have lost a lot of good police persons in this conflict, which otherwise would not have happened had they stayed together during the conflict. And I think this is also one big thing. I think that heads should have rolled. Like actually, those who were hired, those who allowed them, or those who have taken a decision, that no, they'll send them there, they'll send them there.

40:39say here. If you have an organization, if you have an organization, if you have an army like me, if you have an army like this, if you have an army like this, then how bad is an example, it is an example that you divide in ethnic lines when you have a time when the country has a need. Exactly. So, in the army it's not been happened. In the army all the cookies are staying together, the mighty's are staying together, they are fighting the same anyway together. Everybody was, so how come the police was allowed to do like this first of all? You have been in the police, so this law and order is not finished.

41:06end is what law and order there was no law and order when you divided the police what law and order are you talking about there was no law and order they are acting as good as mighty this is religious extremist groups tribal extremist groups it was totally you divided in ethnic lines so you become part of that fight you have no religion not based on any reason or rhyme they are just based on your ethnicity and on that basis you are taking all the decisions and all the action and those who are there central people there for example chief minister what are they doing authorities there are a state authority state government what were they doing they were not able to actually take control and they couldn't do the police from the top order from the top order until the police they couldn't do it nothing they were absent they were absent totally absent were they okay there are two things were they absent that they didn't do anything because they didn't want to do it they were pressure So they chickened out.

42:06Was that the thing? That they were talking and they didn't listen to anyone? Two things. That they were talking and they didn't listen to anyone. Secondly, there was a lot of pressure on them. For their community. If I talk about MLAs and CM's house was attacked. Like CM's house was fired upon not by cookies. CM is a mighty. So mighty is themselves fired on CM's house. Saying that you're not doing anything. So like I was the one we were called overnight. When it happened, we were living there.

42:41there was a there was an MP whose house was already burnt like his house was already burnt so as a local politicians say they were also under immense pressure from their own people like from their if you talk about cookies their MPs are also burnt like MLS's house they are not burnt so because they were feeling like they are not representing or they are not doing anything. so, we went a lot of places when the protest was going from one line that people were going to go Like their home, I think their home minister, somebody's house was burned and there was a minister that was going to go to his house and then he came to his home and then he came to his home.

43:19So, they were being attacked. So, they were also under, I would say if anyone was going to go to that time, I think he would have been in the same situation. I don't know what to do. it is a rule. there was no rule of law it was all mob like mob acting mob deciding what to do what to do militants said that the local militants militia was standing there they said we want all MLA's at this place at this time so everyone came here everyone there was a fort there they came here they apologized to them that sorry whatever and when they were going MLA's there was a Congress MLA who was beaten like beaten by the mob like thrashed badly and then he was left so this is the same thing then there was even that Biren Singh he was also linked to certain violence right his call recording or something exactly exactly so he was I think it was some mighty MLA only who leaked his because whatever he spoke he spoke in a closed room with mighty's only why would he speak about that to an Aukuki individual so there were many people who were already against him already against his way of governance and all those things so someone made a video and gave it to NIA and all the authorities and he can be heard speaking that like bomb and home minister said why are you hitting the bomb so he was heard saying so that audio recording has gone to FSL and the case is still there going on so there are like chief minister of state saying that bomb that's what that happened like mob کو ھوکنے کے لیے ھوکو کسی بھی طرح ھوک و کروک اور it's like کسی community against community against مار so دیکھئے آپ ایک چیز دیکھئے وہاں پہ جو weapon چوری ہوئے تھے جو police station چوری ہوئے تھے وہ ایسا نہیں کہ ایک دن چوری ہوئے کیونکہ police was not

45:28period of two months, in a separate date thatisch твоi iphone beamer is roux in a police state. There are weapons like you were from policeит station. When you are participating, only one civilian살 has got to work. What really do to it do most of people feel clearly visible. Keep the man has the words for the union. But it was fairly visible that state was complicit in all the looting of arms. In fact, police were also not doing anything. If had police, like they were also under pressure from politicians or whatever I would say, the local CM or whatever. So they were also under the pressure. Like everybody was working under somebody's pressure.

46:15CM is working on community pressure. Police is working on CM pressure. They're not doing... I mean, if I'm in my forge, if I'm in my armory, if I'm in my armory, then we kill our guns. Armory is your last thing. if your weapon is gone your existence is gone you are as good as a civilian so if someone is coming in your armory you are taking 200-100-300 weapons and you don't have one bullet fire in it so it was all well planned and well orchestrated and then it was 1-5-5-7 exactly different dates same thing happening and you know where your battalion is you are not increasing security if it's done one time it's done one time justifiable.

46:56Chalo, given. They were not aware. Bede came. You didn't understand what to do. After that, after that, there was a few decisions. No one made SOP that someone will come and fire how much distance to a fire or put a center in a centralized location or put a Assam Rifle camp in a deal. Or somewhere like when we were in the beginning so all the cookies came to IGR. Assam Rifle played a very big role. Like, had they not been located inside Imphal, the casualty figures would have gone drastically high. Because that was the only safe event for them. so where the night 50-60 ,000 cookies they stayed there later on they were transported so if you had so afraid if you had so afraid you would keep the weapon somewhere where you would go, you have pressure send those weapons but you have told me that you have so many times so you have set up a lot of police stations so you have set up an example a very bad example for other states also where you have normalized there was no consequences for everyone there was nothing you didn't normalize on the date if you were in Bihar or in any other state or in Punjab which are sensitive states they are all sensitive states if there are such things that based on their religion identity or ethnic identity they do the same thing you will accept it or not if there are these things in JNK just imagine the same thing being done in JNK what happens there the same thing was done in Manipur nothing has happened.

48:23Like nothing has happened. I haven't seen a single case where some police or anybody was, you know, convicted or something held accountable for or something. So you're saying that local government was purely involved? Defunct. They were totally defunct. They were totally defunct. So they were not even aware of which course the state is going. They were just going with the emotions and, you know, pressure from locals and everything. So that's one side. now when it's so rampant local government failed, defunctioned locally there's no rest there's no rest, it's been a few days the government of India shouldn't they interfere at what point, like what is the line where the government of India feels like now the army will start all of it forget police, we have taken care of the local we want to protect our citizens we want to maintain law and order in our country we will enter Honestly, honestly, if you ask me, I've been brainwashing and some people ask, why is PR why is PR why is PR why is PR why is PR why is PR why is PR why is PR why is PR technically when it happened it was 1 month it was PR at least Forge could have taken control of all the weapons 10-15 days like just 10-15 days we're talking a lot honestly I tell you that the conflict is controlled 2 days I don't think that you have all the weapons that you have and you have to pick and arrest I had been in J &K When Article 370 revoked I was in thick We could know What we had to do After morning午後 nominations People Pnot really take our

50:10Biden Turning this This effer scientists claim that if weNo that if we No and 4 months people have made an example so that the other 40 people don't think they don't think they don't think because when there was conflict in the country people think that we will go to the local police station so we will go to the local police station and help us because since I am fighting for my own tribe and religion and everything so that myth is broken like the government has broken it then it's the day of article 370 and it's the day of today one stone is not made in the chain forge is not made in any way this is the kind of will and fear psychosis you have to create among them.

50:48So, that thing happens there too, if it happens, that, brother, you are on record people who have made weapons by using videos, you take it immediately, just transfer them, do whatever. Very much control. I don't know why I didn't understand why we were waiting for this long. Like, I mean, presidential rule is not so fast. Exactly. So, let's say that if the local government has 2-3-4 days in a week, for the benefit of doubt, you give it to one month. After that, you should put in and build it. So, why not happen? That is question for, you know, like some people were trusting, like maybe government of India was trusting that not, they will probably get better.

51:25They will probably get better. But, okay, if you look at dynamics, Maitis are majority there. So any decision which goes against their community would have gone against the central also, like the BJP, if you talk about. So they were very cautious about, you know, taking any decision against any community for that matter. Like if we take a decision like this, So we might not get a majority vote or we might not get a because finally we will decide the votes to decide which seats are going to be who will support the center and what will do But vote and everything is secondary First is Don't know, stop it Exactly That's what we do In the favor of the votes in the cookie in the favor Everyone Everyone We don't give a fight We don't give a fight You don't have any community You have the rights Reservations Land rights You will have the rights in the future Now

52:43Now, let's put a curfew and stop. and then they took it and they were doing what they were doing, they were getting hurt to the Maitis. They were doing extortion, there were so many killings there, those who were old, they were all in the old world, they were all doing their own. The government, the land, they were all doing their own. So who did finally suffer? People did not. And then, do you think that what is the role, is there any role of China or US or any other country? Look, initially it was very clear, I have told you, it was a high-code decision and everything. but when it comes in such a chaos situation so it is like free waters all opportunity all opportunity whether it's China whether it's US whether it's any country everybody will see opportunity in this like maybe who doesn't know anything he will see opportunity they know it's just happened that in this beach there are many people there are different ways there was a guy whose name was Daniel something he was an ex-marine or something so he came in there he came there he got the cookies he started giving them drone training he started giving them there was a climate activist so called Lisi Priya she started collecting money internationally for buying weapons and you know thermal drones for many militants so you will see she was putting it on social media distributing thermal drones blankets and military hardware and equipment to militants which I will say it was free for all it was free for all but she is putting it in social media that I will give it all see this is thermal drone this is thermal drone I am distributing it to the militants and these are the blankets so she was so much internationally so what stance is she is openly talking about it because of her tribe because she is her tribe she is supporting her tribe so she was against Indian government those people who gave it thermal drone which is RMB Tengol they have fired on the Assam rifle we have lost a guy because of them who has given the weapon is in the wanted list that guy who has the head he is in the wanted list and she is distributing drones to her openly on internet and nobody is doing it and he is getting funds on his other world you don't know whether these funds are coming from which country it is a kind of modus of paradise for her like she she's like her father if you talk about he's a frost like he's a big time fraud like he was caught by police he was going on a lot of cases if you see the very young age they started collecting funds and all those so it's a kind of you know pure economy which then she started saying that we are against a lot of you know my community is being targeted and all those so we need funds so people started giving money from different different parts of the world like she keeps traveling for all climate activities and all those things and she received fund openly.

55:41If you see, you can see her being escorted by armed militants. There are videos like in the open, like I can show you 10-20 videos of her being escorted by the militants who are wanted in an IA list. So this strategy means what you think about it. Initially I was like then I'm going to think about it. Why am I thinking so? like if people are sleeping let them sleep like if authorities don't want to do anything and what are we doing about it I mean where why is there not going to be arrest when they are openly in social media nothing nothing has been done with weapons and guns nothing nothing has been done like status quo like people are thinking that state is not doing anything or central is not doing anything no NIA has done NIA has done many operations NIA arrested many people there whether they are Maiti or Kuki they arrested multiple people there but what happened was that when they were arrested so they were very much protested like locals also got to get to the militia if you see in open media they are giving an IA and there are a lot of things in that way we have also faced a lot of resistance if you talk about a child and a girl was a girl they were I think 11 or 12 years old they were very small children Okay.

56:59So, they went in a cookie area and they were killed by basically cookies that they killed. So, now I have I have also thought that because look, adults, men, dying, I feel like men, but when it comes to kids, women, you know, little children, they feel very emotional that why are we, why did, I mean, why are we, we are just watching. Okay, that happened there, they killed, and they didn't get their body and then they started pulling out videos and they were basically I think they were kind of good friends so they started putting videos and they started putting out and they were kind of torture for family they didn't get their body they were missing and then they were pulling out their videos so then that was so sensitive that in that like you said CM was a home minister even Amit Shah gave a statement that day that CBA director is coming next day to solve the case and our team we had already information that we had already in which area who has done it who has done it so we because we like that because they all have liked it so how can we kill it so someone told us that there are militants who have executed it so we said just keep them and watch and we are here just let us know the moment you told us that we are here and we are here and we are going so we said just keep our watch jaisy aayenge so we said apni hierarchy ko bula we have said this is what it is and jab yeh hua home minister gave a statement cbi director was about to land in infal to that day morning madhah madhah honestly so nigh paara thah kyunki aise chijay jabh apko patah hai ki ye culprit hai boom ra khula boom ra hai kahi pe kisi gaon mein baitha wa hai so aapko lagta hai salah mahi kiyo ni jara hao madhah why am I waiting for a day or maybe just hour or maybe a minute why am I waiting why am I not getting ready and going to exactly that you are an Indian army you are against something and that there is openly evidence we should actually go either arrest him or if there is crossfire execute so at that time 3 or 4 o 'clock usually I sleep but I was restless because I knew that Jake will do something he has to do it so then morning 3 o 'clock we said I think they are planning because he has asked him to go I think he is planning to move out from the village because he knew that people are going against it so he's not trying to run away from here so he's planning to move to Myanmar so he'll run away from the village so we said okay and I took it and we said to him leave everything he said that this is this is this is this is we'll never get it once he crosses Myanmar forget about him we will never find him so he said okay let's permission and everything and then we went there the moment we went there we went to the village so before the village there was resistance that because if you go to the forge there was no one who was looking at the forge like a mighty side or a cookie side so we were in a little civil interest and in a civil interest we were like as a labor kind of we were like without a weapon we were like whatever it will be it will be like but we will not know we will have to get it somehow we entered that village and in a place isolated place it was a car we got hold of him we didn't know we didn't know

1:00:26we took them the moment we took them the moment we took them there was a nearest COV there was a nearest COV we went inside so So thousands of people came there. They had the whole COV, the Assam Rifle, that was the ship and everything. So then we had to take it out there. So then we called, we need a HEPTER. As I was saying, our aerial effort doesn't get so easily. So we said, there is no way we can take him by road. Because our cars will fly and we might not have to fire. And there might be more civilian casualties. So we need a HEPTER. So immediately, everything was decided. Then there was a HEPTER which came.

1:01:17and then we took them from there and we directly took them to the airport and went from the airport. Before CBI director could land, we just did the thing. And what happened in that day? That night, like this arrest happened, they burned DC office, they burned SP office. This was the gravity of, you know, kind of, that they did operation. Because they were not looking at any logic that that person has killed a small child. They just want to protect their people. like because of any reason. So that kind of, you know, this kind of thing was going on there. So, everything that's happening is happening every day.

1:01:54But you took that guy? Yeah. In jail? Yeah, in jail. He's in NIA custody. Okay. That's the person. Today too? Today too. I don't think they will be ever left also. I think so. So now, my point is, what was the whole game in this whole game? You were already there. There were numbers. There were weapons. You were, you were watching and there were atrocities and there were information because we have deployed so much in North East. What were we doing every day? Look, I'll tell you something. Now I'll give you another example of Maiti side. So there was a militant. There was an ambush in North East.

1:02:32In which we were around 20 soldiers. Six Dogra, there's a unit. 20 soldiers. 20 soldiers were killed of Six Dogra unit. There was an ambush. So what happened in that? Basically, what was the man who executed? His name was Uttam. he's a matey guy now what happened to him he's input he's inside India Myanmar inside India because here people support grow so he's like safe he's coming when he's coming when he's coming when he's coming to the house he's coming the village the village basically he's coming he's coming he's coming and he's coming so he's coming to the village and he was arrested. But there was a local politician along with a mob and everything and then he pressurized Fawj to say, let him leave him, he will be very interested here.

1:03:27Civilians are going to die for him. Civilians are going to do this for him, that for him. Now, conscious agent or whatever you say, now just imagine that there is a person who has killed your children and you are pressurized or you are forced to leave that guy just because local politician and mob are trying to make you know that kind of foster situation that we will get here and we will kill and you know FOS don't want to no one wants to no one wants to everyone wants to take it and go so there was so much that he had to leave that guy was left a politician did he? not politician but local pressure local politics local politician and mob obviously politician political politician has pressure you guys absolutely if it will So, you can imagine that that politician is the same politician who was arrested by CBI from Delhi airport for giving the sensitive data of army installations along with two militants.

1:04:26And now he's a leader, elected leader in that area. From which party? He was initially in Congress and then now I think he's in coalition government. So, he is a politician. like a guy who was caught with in Delhi airport along with two militants along with a CD and locations of all military camps and he was going to Nepal from there he was going to Kaatmanu and he was meeting ISI guys there So this is like on recording. Now you are arrested with militants. You are going to Nepal. You don't have anything to do. I say that they have something to do with them. But if you don't have anything to do with them.

1:05:09And that was a leader. That too is not a... Small guy. They are leaders. So what he did? Explain me about him. Basically, he used to get government... He was a school teacher. He started getting the contract, government contracts. And that's how he started money. Then he was a money poor house in Calcutta. He was a contract. So, you know, that's how he started collecting money. And after that, he fought in the election. Because there, the armed group who supported the election, he would win the election. So, that's how it works. So, that's the thing. and now what so you are saying ki army technically waha pe full-fledgedly aapne operations nai kar sakti because of obviously politicians like lot of politicians I mean if you talk about they they don't want like agar waha pe asam rifle ke against protest hotte hain ya kuch hotte hain they are the ones who are you know kind of sponsoring ya piche se push kar rahe ha anti army or anti you know kind of agent does and everything just because they know that they can do anything anytime and what's the role of now you were telling me that now this whole chaos created as well there will be many many people and I'm sure now there will be 3-4 tribes now there will be multiple extremist groups and militants who have been they will be born again everything will be the foreign agencies will be seen this is the right moment they are doing China is doing who will do it like if you see now those who have taken care of they were all working in Bangalore Delhi they were normal living their normal lives now just to protect their village or just to protect and they come back now they are picking up weapons and now you see they are the kids who are working now they are in rotation just outside their villages and all other places so that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's which was not required also if there is law and order and things like that.

1:07:22So I mean, if you don't think, there was a little time before there was a special power act in Manipur. And just a few months back it was removed from that area. So basically, officially we don't have any, we cannot operate in that area without if government say, or Manipur State Government or Government of India say, so us to do so. So we cannot operate there. Why? What is the act? Basically, it is a, like say, JNK, we have ASFA. So there are certain disturbed areas where the army is given a special power that they can act at their own and, you know, they can conduct operations. They don't need to ask or take permission from district authorities and everything.

1:08:04So there are laws there. Just to, you know, if a state government is in this case, they became party to the conflict. They were also, you know, kind of party to that conflict. So then government can decide, Central can recite here, let FOS take control of things and let them do the thing, their job. there was a time before that he had gone and said, everything is okay so, let's go and take AASFA and take AASFA and see him as the one who wanted and now again we have the same situation so, AASFA came and now again they are under AASFA and now again so, that could have been done in the initial phases itself because after that, people know that the force will not be biased like police is.

1:08:49Like police have given you a weapon, the force will not let you loot a weapon. Or the force will not let you do whatever you are doing. So, technically, it became like, they started anti-forge protest, that the force is coming from here, the force is not going to come from here. If the force is CRPF, the base of for that matter, is where it was deployed, then the deployment of people started questioning. They are a neutral force. like that's why they have been deployed there because they are neutral force from some UP, Ariyana, from somewhere else there is no cookie here there is no money but they are not biased like you know the state police became divided so people started protesting that also because they thought they were not so there are many players in this conflict like multiple players you know multiple players and working in multiple layers I would say still they want you know kind of situation to stay fragile in that state.

1:09:46Some because of power, some because of relevance, like all the militant groups, they just want relevance. That in such a time, because they have become because they have become, now they are deciding where they decide that the contracts will get to get FCA's which will be going to go or PMGSI's contracts will be going or the big contracts which will be going to go where they will get so they will get to the relevance to get to get the best and now so tell me now is there you said we will talk about the China angle where is China involved in this somewhere initially now we are back because now China has started supplying drones to NACN again to Maiti militants again if you see there was a drone attack on Assam Rifle Post last year so they have made a video also and during that attack so China is providing them logistic again tech and weapons which was completely finished now China feels like again we can do we can provide them logistic and they can do something disturbing and people can make volatile so they are trying to invest now they are again trying to you know invest on these people and what is Myanmar's role in this what is Myanmar border what is Myanmar what is Myanmar what is Myanmar Myanmar Myanmar has made a vassal estate.

1:11:12There are multiple regions in Myanmar. What is mainly Sagayang and Chin. There are two regions which share the boundary with India. So Myanmar is very rich in rare earth minerals. Look, Myanmar's fight, US, China, it is only because of rare earth minerals. If you look at the R-T-Rate, even US cannot produce their jets or engines or anything without getting the raw materials from China. So China said, we are not supplying raw materials. Even during the war, Russia, Ukraine war, US was buying rare earth minerals from Russia also. And in fact, China also. Like, they're running the same thing. But they are getting their minerals from there.

1:11:53Because they cannot survive a day without, you know, that dependency. That's why they have recently signed PAX Silica, if you remember. India is part of it. Basically, it is for the rare earth minerals. Those countries who lack the rare earth minerals, so we'll invest in you know kind of uh uh jis say that we will invest in such reasons for the process purification process how to process how to process it is another technology which US does not China doesn't have anyone how to process you have taken it but how to process how to process your engines so China has done China has done their proxies so they have a region called UWSA so that united VA state army like that there is a Chinese currency it is a Myanmar state but there is a Chinese currency that is a military China controls China comes to every day the Republic has been the days China has been giving them APVs tanks China has been doing it it is their proxy state now that same UWSA is the biggest supplier of drugs in whole Myanmar so China what does China China has the insurgents game they have very beautifully played without announcing it or without saying it loud or anything.

1:13:08You can see China is such a big country. It's like the wrongs. Nobody talks about it outside China. People say but in which tone. Even Islamic countries don't say about wrongs in China or anything about it. Incidency, you can see all the incidences that they have sponsored in Myanmar, maybe in India. But in their own country, there is no incidency. There is no one who can pick a weapon against the state and everything. And they are doing the same things which basically the US basically in different regions kind of you know trying to cut off and trying to manipulate the government and everything they are also doing the same thing but in a very secretive manner so they have what did they do in Myanmar a region called UWA basically where the whole drugs are going to go weapons are going to go and in a area called Kachin where they are training all the militants of India like ULFA PLA, Cookie Groups Chen Groups so they have but they are not doing their own area they are doing it in the Burmese land that whatever disturbance whatever repercussions will fall back that they will figure out so Kachin same this area Kachin is very rich in rare earth minerals like Kachin supplies China it's 50 % of rare earth minerals so it's so important and unfortunately as India being neighbor to Kachin we are very close to Kachin but we have not been able to you know get our supplies from them but what we are doing is selling from China is buying that thing that is in our bagel.

1:14:32So I would say it's a very it's a diplomatic you know failure I will say if we could not from these many years get our rare earth minerals from there. So China Myanmar basically is a battleground for US and you know China because US also want the same access to rare earth minerals. It knows that I why I buy from third party when I can approach the source. So if you will see the whole Myanmar basically and then China want access to bear Bengal also. They are planning a pipeline to bear Bengal in Bangladesh which they were wanting and they have not been successful because Arakan army and different rebel groups and India also has a very big project, a Kaladhan project, which we also want to connect to Bangladesh and everything.

1:15:16So, it has also been halted because of all these kind of disturbances. So, it is a kind of battleground for all the parties involved. Now, what is China's interest, it goes against America's interest also and it goes against India's interest also to be very honest it was the Chinese who funded Arakan Arakan who are militants that our Kalaadan project will fail and honestly our Kalaadan project it is not going ahead we invested a lot of money Kalaadan is gone for now so now Americans are doing the same thing if you see the recent arrest of seven Ukrainians and when US that van guy who runs a group called Soli so they are training Chin groups so you will see Kaladhan they are training Arakan and other groups also so they also now and it is not like couple of them there are thousands of them who have entered who have trained, who are fighting along with the rebels the local rebels against the Junta and against China so US is trying to make that solid base for themselves like ta ki China can not expand to Bay of Bengal, they can get access to rare earth minerals and everything.

1:16:30So it's a big game happening there. And we are just watching. Honestly, if you can see, China has also their boots on ground. America has also their boots on ground. We are not doing anything. We are just like, we are just like, we are just looking at what's happening in our endeavor. Like, if you can see, in the years, the rebels there, the anti-India groups, groups are, which are who in India attack, which are ULFA, PLA, which are all groups, they are all under shelter of Myanmar army. They are all under shelter of Myanmar army. They are in Myanmar army. Like, in Pakistan, there are Jais and Al-Qaeda in their camps.

1:17:08They are in their camps. Same here. Myanmar army support them fully. They don't have strength. They don't have control over those areas. They are very remote areas. What do you do? The anti-India rebels are in their support. They do weapon and they help Myanmar army. mean written. So, India for a situation is coming to be that neither Myanmar army is with us, neither those rebels are with us. In fact, what is void because what is the rebels that will give them resources and will give them weapons they are gun for higher kind of people. You know, you have stolen money, you have stolen this, they are yours.

1:17:41You have stolen anything, someone has stolen money, they will do it. So, already that region is very desubilized and there are many multiple players. But India is looking after its own and all those things suspension of ops honestly if you ask me this is the biggest failure policy which you can say which you can say when you are weak or when you are weak when you are weak if you are if you are the you are proving that you are your demands that you can say that you can say acknowledge is different but you are I'm talking about NACN, which is Seasfair. I'm talking about Ulfa, Unilef. You've got suspension of ops.

1:18:26But what are they doing? They're extortioning. If you talk about NACN, IAM, if you talk about a particular group, if you look at extortion, which we do with highways, which we do with people, it exceeds one or two crores in a day. Like, one truck with 18 ,000 rupees. 18 ,000 to 20 ,000 rupees. All trucks go there. Thousands of trucks go there. I'm talking about one highway. I'm talking about the highway. wiki-bath-karra-hung. So, 18 ,000 1 truck se lethan eek dhin mein kum se kum liht to 1000-2000 se up a truck jatat यह se basuli hai यह basuli hai यह extortion hai हाँ उसके alaवब वो sare school teachers se government employees se सब se lethan to sochi वो जो group haa bäťa tha जिसके बास koji fund nai thay kuch nai tha loog usko paisé nai hi dhe rathay kyunki loog bhi thay kya manwar why do I give money?

1:19:08Now he's in the middle. Now he's getting stronger. Financially strong. He's showing power in the election. He's showing presence in the election. So ideally we should never we should never get in talks with such groups. You finish them. You finish them. But don't do negotiations with them. I mean this is where we go wrong. And they take it for I mean they take it for granted. Like these groups like many of these groups were like pointing weapons on us like army or for meaning, those who have been finished here, you take them inside, inside they are carrying weapons in the city, where there is police, where there is army, and we can not do anything to them, just because they are under suspension of ops with government of India.

1:19:48So, you have done the rule of, meaning, you have done it, you have also diluted them inside, you have given them the control, they have given them indirectly, that they can decide what they want to do. So, I mean, we should not allow actually to, you know, you have been a Milton group, finish it. If it comes to talks, Just live as a civilian. Why do you want to give them a camp? Then they tell them to keep their equipment. Then they tell them to do this. I mean, this ISC personally see as a big failure and we see it on a daily basis. Whenever we want to do something, we cannot do because next call they'll just give it to Delhi that it's like this because it's a war.

1:20:27But Delhi will not tell them that you're going to go out with the camp. Or why are you extortion? Or why are you doing something? why are you doing something? So it's an unfortunate situation, kind of situation. We should not entertain this. But now India has arrested these people from the Northeast region. Five, six Ukrainians, one or two Americans. What is it? Who are these people? Do you think they are CIA agents and being sent by people? Look, these people arrested basically. There are six Ukrainians and one is a US guy. This US guy is a proper mercenary who have been to Libya, who has been to Syria who has been to all the conflict zones so basically he's a proper PMC private military contractors and he's very vocal and very against Donald Trump and Pete Hicks their defense secretary like he's very vocal against him if you watch his entire career or Twitter feed he's totally vocal against so that theory that he's working for CIA is out of question and I don't think US is going to spend a penny on him for his release from India like I don't think personally I don't think they'll just discard him and so so what is it that you will see lately Russia has shown a big interest in Myanmar like if you will see a very big military help Russia is giving it to their troops so where Russia went there Ukraine obviously they want to counter the Ukraine so and this is not people people started to say that this input of arresting them was given by Russia no it was never Russia like we like our agencies NIA, RAW, they have already arrested foreigners from Mizoram who also came before, after that we have already arrested multiple of them but this guy was a kind of big shot and big name in all the rebel regions and everything so he was arrested, so what is it that they are going to all their areas like Chin, Arakan and then they are training the locals in drone, like why are they training mercenary?

1:22:27again to counter China because what is it? in a day, this is from which country in a way? They are doing it like free. I will tell you that in the US there is a concept of PMC. If today India says that PMC Blackwater or someone does contact that we need 200 people there of yours in North East, you come and fight They will go there. So they don't have any affiliation or affinity to do. But somebody is paying them, right? Yeah, somebody is paying them. So this American PMC is paying them. Now I will tell you that the government is there, the rebel, the basically rebel who is fighting the Myanmar Army.

1:23:02That is an NUG government, National Unity Group. So that is an umbrella organization which is controlling all the rebel groups against Myanmar Army. Now, that chairman, everything, where is he? He sits in US. He sits in UK. So they are sitting there and they are collecting funds and they are trying to help the rebels and whatever way they can. So they are collecting funds internationally and then they are sending people. I have seen a Kurdish fighter, a Kurdish fighter from Syria who went from Miserum to across he trained them and then came back so what is it that they are giving money to anyone that go there, go there, train them NUG people have given money that NUG people train them this is my hypothesis yeah this is my theory of this whole thing and it parallelly it justifies the interest of US also obviously there is a group so they are all US war veterans and who are going there, the man-mar-army who are also attacking civilians, they are treating them, they are establishing hospitals and everything.

1:24:08I mean, it is a kind of pattern that you can see everywhere. It is the same thing that in the beginning there is medical aid and then there are some other people coming. So, I'm telling you that they are very good at it. They read the ground and this is the best way that you, those victims, you have to be with them at night at night so tomorrow, after 5 years, you will remember that it had my tongue fracture and it had my child saved me, he did this. What can you give me from this? And ideally, India should have also done it. Like we should have also done it. At least we should have sent medical aid to all the rebels.

1:24:38Like all the rebel groups. You will see there, you will forget Gaza. Like if you see, nobody watches, like follows Myanmar as people follow Gaza. So small children, like they are, I have seen such lashes, I have seen myself in my eyes. Like 40-50 people, kids, kids, ladies, they died. Burned to 400-500 ton they delivered a delivery and they died. There was a graduation ceremony there for rebels and they bombarded. So, there's something there. No, no, no. Myanmar army didn't do it. Myanmar air force didn't do it. This was run by Myanmar air force. So, ideally, we could do it that we would also send the medical aid to them because it is a humanitarian.

1:25:25We are not trying to do a regime change or something. But, look, these are the times that are as time, but if we are not helping them, so, they will say, that India doesn't even care about us. But, a third country, which is a thousand kilometers away, they are coming, they are giving you a medical aid, they are providing you all the logistics, you know, and they will be faithful for them. I still didn't get the angle, that the guys, six Ukrainian and one American mercenary, this is America funded or Russian funded or independent energy funded from my angle if you say they are energy funded okay because if it is it seems that they are against other rebels, other army, China America all active are so they have to be strong and that's why they have hired these PMCs rebels are against Russia and Manmar Army so they are against so that's why Ukrainian got involved yeah Ukrainian got involved because you can see drone technology recently there is a we have been accepting optic fiber now we have been accepting our our own Myanmar rebels already are using optic fiber from like last 2-3 years I have seen them already using optic fiber they have more advanced that's why because they are getting trained from people who are involved in active zones in Russia, Ukraine and all those they are learning much faster we are doing our time because it is not our necessity for them it is a necessity right now so as fast as it can and they are doing the work so there is a big problem and I think India should also have stakes somewhere like it cannot happen but we should do our state that is the biggest thing that is the biggest challenge for us our population is so huge exactly and after that how America and China has this thought process that someone will be and not be India's.

1:27:29They can't do it with their own Exactly. Even though you have any trouble tribal or group or anything you do. Indians are blatantly going to do it. You would know this way more than me. I'm going to say that you're a militant and you know but you don't know if you don't see weapons so you can't beat it. And the US is a little like. It's open. If Intel is exactly now conflict people are going to you are going to go to the you are going to the people you are going to the fire why not so we have told that they are people who are people this conflict has been to take care for them that they are that they are that they are that they are not reasonable but still there are own people yesterday that person was in the merchant Navy he was in the merchant Navy and he died there was a guy who was working in a hotel industry somewhere.

1:28:22He came here and died. Now, how do you justify he's against country? We also see the reason of conflict and the reason is how many people involved. So, it is very hard for us even also to justify ourselves before firing a bullet that we have to kill it or not. Where do they get these many weapons? Police, armory, police armory. Police is the same group. 4 ,000 weapons were looted. 4 ,000 from police. So you had to give one group to another group? No, all of them distributed to each group. So it's not that one place to be destroyed. This tribal is destroyed. There are different people who are destroyed.

1:29:03There are different people who are destroyed. There are different people who are destroyed. We have heard so many things that the Adhar card that the weapon was destroyed so that the Adhar card was taken to the other so that the weapon was back to the other. That was the way accountability to keep the weapon that we had to do. the other card go and go and work and give it back so that there is accountability that there is no weapon but unfortunately now these weapons Indian weapons they have traveled all the way through Myanmar if you look at Myanmar there are a lot of Indian weapons being used because these rebels they come they go so a lot of Indian weapons are not traveled to Myanmar also so Myanmar there is a lot of smuggling right Right?

1:29:46By doing that place, that's the border point, right? That's the border point and that's a kind of Bombay of North East. Bombay of North East. Economic capital. Economic capital, there's a lot of smuggling trade. Everything. There's a lot of things. And we want to develop it. Yes. Why do we want to develop it? Because we know that that place is India. And it's a gateway to Southeast Asia. Right. There's a lot of drugs, weapons. There's a lot of smuggling. Right. There's a lot of trafficking. from the beginning. Absolutely. Look, India has a look-ice policy. Look, we will make a highway here. And this highway will connect us to Myanmar, Thailand and everyone.

1:30:24So, we will use this as a trade. And we will make more of a mini Bombay kind of thing. And it was also needed. Like, the way there is nothing much there, scope, income, so you will use it. But what happened? Wherever you have money, you will see there, there are weapons, Milton groups, also that kind of thing. Because the biggest collection is happening here. So if you look at Moray town, there are 90 % population that are here. There are all militants there. So if someone is coming in one truck, then that one truck gives 4 or 10 groups money to go to India and then they enter. And similarly for the drug trade also.

1:31:03So it's a very lucrative business for people who do not have any employment. That they have taken their own packet and they have sent it here. and just dyn ka 1000 rupaya ghan ka liyah ab log yaha pere subayza sham mehnat karta hai clever field mein he hardly earned 600-700 rupies aur woha pere iisay kar raha aur uski cost china mein manwar me kuch nahi hai like they you know drugs are more dangerous than even the weapons anything for that matter click jab Punjab dekh lije pura youth is destroyed similarly you you north 30 whole youth is destroyed it's a sasta nasha you have in sastay in a daru ki bottle drugs or YY tablet or something there.

1:31:44So that's why they are latching on to, you know, these cheap drugs and it's a demand. A tablet is cheaper than alcohol. Yeah. A tablet comes with a small YY and they say, world is yours or something. It hardly cost them like 4 rupees or 3 rupees and if you eat it once, you have a whole day that means you are a manashim. So people don't buy drugs, those who have a bottle of 40-50 or something, they don't feel that they have why they are addicted to it. So that is, drug menace is a very, I mean, if you will see the entire area, Mizoram, Manipur, and all militants involved. Like NSCN, MISOs, like cookie groups, everybody is involved in this drug trade.

1:32:29Because it's a big money for supporting their organization. So everybody is involved. Yeah. And that's how they smuggle it to India as well then. Yeah. Every other day like, But then why, when it's so much, Syria doesn't block it. Why do we want to make it more developed? Exactly. Now, I'll tell you. Bad things happen. Like bad things happen. But the thing is, we are trying, Government of India is trying to fence all the border. Because now it's what is, you will go there on the border, you will not know when you are going to Myanmar and when will you be in India. There's no demarcation. There's no boundary.

1:33:00There's no physical boundary. There's no stone, nothing. So you can always enter. Look, we thought that this area, since it is, we are getting, where there are many drugs and many people. We don't develop it. We are throwing those people more into darkness. So the government said that it's a legitimate town to make it. That you can buy the products here. You can buy the products. The government has taxes, the GST has everything. But it doesn't happen. People want to... India has a lot of things. Illegal things come a lot. There is timber, drugs come a lot. and you have a reka net that is a supply chain.

1:33:40But India also has a lot of things. Like, the basin is a lot of much. The basin is a lot of much. So, trade is huge there. But then, it's a filter. Because it doesn't work in particular, the truck trade is not. You think that if everything is in the moore, then it doesn't work in the moore. What is happening is, all the other villages, which are along the border, it's a huge border. If you talk about deployment, practically, it's not possible to cover that area. cover it's a huge area and huge area without fence if you talk about JNK there is a fence there is also everything else then the militant comes in just imagine that boundary that huge boundary without a fence without anything and then you have your own family members on the other side so it's a it's a very difficult border to manage and then very easy to actually then get you know camouflaged in a forest yes it's a whole system how densely forest area is there it's quite dense there forests are very dense there and the borders as well so then it's easier for them to just disappear if you can see if there's a area in one kilometer you can make 4 routes just imagine how many thousand kilometers is the border until you know the source from where somebody is coming we do intelligence based operation so we know there that this person is coming so people are going to get there so someone doesn't think that you can sit and operate is not easy and any border for India any border which is completely safe and then economic trade is good with people and infiltration is less like Nepal for that matter Nepal in Utrakhan I have never heard drugs being found from Nepal or any weapons or consignment being there are a lot of things that ISI is trying to nourish that water but because of ethnicity because in Nepal there are also many Hindus they have also love and proximity to Indians this side, that side so that thing that protects them because Bengal has a problem exactly Manipur has a problem your JNK is very problematic and Rajasthan side is clean Rajasthan side is not so much Rajasthan side also because there are border areas there are no population there are so many people if you compare Jammu here you can see that the population is very small so it is very easy for them to find a help or somebody there is no case there are such cases there are Fawc's presence BSF but there are drones lately you can see a lot of drones they are dropping consignment since they have started using drones which can go 20 km 15 km they have started using in Punjab they are dropping weapons drones, drugs is it safe?

1:36:37is it completely no you can see every day there are weapons in Punjab you can see crime how many times you can see people are doing RPG fire so all those weapons are coming from there RPG fire in police station there was RPG fire recently if you remember there was RPG fired in the police station so RPGs also they are getting from Pakistan only so they have elements there there is a little Punjab in radicalization is the Khalistana and then youth drug addicted so the most vulnerable are these people who are drug addicted they can do anything for any small amount of drugs that you can give money you can get a grain or you can kill RPG so this is the scene is bad now yeah I mean Punjab is pretty Arab not Punjab I am saying Punjab we know we have made an entire series podcast on it so Punjab is not safe Northeast is like drug menace is one which we honestly will see how US is addressing their drug.

1:37:40US also has a big issue of fentanyl drugs huge. Mexico and we are very low in the US like US to pump in drugs in US they have gone to an extent to use submarines also they bought submarines from Russia and then they were smuggling and you will see a lot of things similarly they are doing like lot of places in such places these people are doing this work so we also are now recently you will see they have deployed their seals like navy seals green bears their special forces to conduct operations against drug warlords similarly we also need like the way we see the weapon militants from with the same eye we should see the drug which are enablers which are sluggling with the same intensity with the same thing we should address the same situation because it is as bad as weapons यह कुछ भी मुलो आपको मतलब मैं आज एक area मुझे एक area को destabilize करना है वहां drugs भेज़ हो कल की date में सारे ललगे dead मिलेंगे आपको मतलब they least care about anything कोई फौजी बठीया में नहीं जाएगा जैसे आभी बोल्गे लिसका लगे पंजाब में

1:38:59benefited from this. Like, if you have a small case in a small case, you have to take a house for$50 ,000 to take a look. I have seen in Manipur, like, Uttarakhand, my state, we didn't even hear the name of drugs in the country. There is also this. Like, people are arresting and arresting a case. Family colleges are$50 ,000 to take a look. $70 ,000 to take a look. Police are also selling drugs. There was a constable who was arrested at my place, where I am. There was a constable who was arrested there, like, with selling drugs. Why was he selling? Yes, he was selling. So, it's a...

1:39:59So all drugs we are getting from, now I know, a layman knows where the drugs are. I know that the drugs are coming from here. I know that the drugs are coming from here. This guy is the place. He doesn't know what the police is. Obviously. But then, the argument is that these people are also crazy, peddlers too. So, getting to get a lot of drugs is more important. Exactly. That is what I am saying. But Narcotex is doing something, right? For that. Yes, they are doing it. But see, Narcotex can do it on the ground. They can do it on the ground. can do it. But we should address this situation from the source point.

1:40:33That, VAS state is coming from the state, Shan state is coming from here, who are the enablers, who are the people who are doing it? Target them. If you can do the operations. If you can do the law, if you can attack in Islamabad, you can do it.

1:41:02It's a big mental. You'll see as a refresher drug cocaine. It's a college drug. like it's a it's so common that yes everyone has cocaine so it has gone to that extent that people are scoring so easily so that's why it is happening now if you see the images in philadelphia just if you google it is that cocaine is a big thing right? cocaine is not like that easy obviously you have to get a lot of drugs it's getting a lot of openly but it's not like it's a college drug now look at how many tunnels you have made how many kilometers even somewhere here people are making tunnels because it's a lot of money resources they don't care about you know money they don't have dearth of money they can because it's a cheap process it's very cheap but just because of scarcity and demand it is being sold at higher prices so they make tons of money yeah tons of money they don't know if they're using plane or submarine use how is cancer treating you safety is it a little bit like some cities it is honestly very pathetic like Kansas is a little now but lately gunfights it's everyday in any club anywhere it's an everyday thing it's everyday Chicago just type google type gunfight in Chicago you will see everyday 6-7 people dying killed like on streets everyday South Chicago we were in Chicago before this.

1:42:44So, we were not Chicago just by lakeside. So, South Chicago doesn't even go through it. Like, the people told me that through South Chicago we said no. Why? Grubby. Then, black population. Then, migrants. Like, Venezuela, Mexico's gangs from MS-13 and all this. So, they have established themselves very well in the US now. So, they are extorting all the drugs and it's good. And, mara raha hai ye normal citizens ko mara raha hai ki apas me apas me, gang, rivalry, wou main gangse hai, ki aysa nigh ki jaysa agar aap udher se chale gaya os area se so aapko looted thing hai, trains me, new york Chicago, it's a very common thing it's a very common thing to be based on your economic, economically how well you are, to look aysi communities me rathat hai, to bauthi achha segregation, there is a jaysa Kansas me, there is a truce true street so right side all blacks will be poor communities banks will loan they will go down and you will that banks will loan they will grow grow inequality same with Chicago and all those places you know how everyone says something happens whether it's any brutal crime people compare that you look at America look at how law and order has been big I seriously tell you this is the point if you talk about just see the figures data is in figures how many people are killed in Chicago in a day in any Indian city that many people are dead because of gun crime and everything just you randomly google now you can see that today will be how many gunfights will be what you're talking it's a everyday It's an everyday affair.

1:44:42So you're telling me, you're telling me that gun, low gross, purely violence when they die. They die. But city wise, if you track data, there are American cities where you die more than Indian cities. Obviously, you type Chicago. Just type gunfight in Chicago. We're still in the city, so we've downloaded the app. Like where are gunfights, they're all updated. So like, usually to avoid that location, Gun fights where his app comes from. Yes, this is an app. The US has made his app. Obviously for safety of citizens. Don't go to that area because there is something going on. Everything is going on.

1:45:22Of type, gun fights in Chicago versus Mumbai. A number of people that die every day because of violence crime. Daily average is 1.1 murder a day in Chicago and Mumbai is 0.4 murders a day. Exactly. And Mumbai and his whoa. Okay. No, you type in Google. Population difference. It's very low. Chicago is not in Mumbai. Chicago is most densely populated after New York I think in US. Population doesn't stand in Mumbai. Chicago is very small. So, Mumbai is safer than Chicago. Let's our Should we compare Delhi with the population? No Indian city can match. Delhi is higher. But population wise if you do it, it's very low.

1:46:17It's like Chicago is 11 times more dangerous than Delhi per person. Obviously. So if population according, if in Delhi every 100 for example, 1 ki death hoti so Chicago mein har sao mein se pandra ki death hoti gun violence is like motha gun kisi se lena kisi ke liye kahin pe bhi jaana gun leke firing is like ap dhek raha ho ga kitnye schools mein firing hoti ya US mein wo bhi kubhi ap data check kanna like joh mass killings hoti hain like everyday you would have heard about US apne agar you follow so like 40 people killed 14 killed in school abhi recently Texas mein hota kia university where an Indian girl was also killed so it's a very we accepted that yes okay but you can avoid going to such places but why is it what do you think is your issue parenting parenting then it's a lot of difference like class in the poor and the poor there's a lot of difference but what you go to school assuming that all the poor and the poor the poor and the poor the poor and the poor the poor and the poor the poor and the poor there's a concept government school charter school private schools not the police.

1:47:33When we call the CVD-C-A-D-E, it sounds gun. Where is this gun? He talk 10 minutes to this one with our hands. Okay. Don't be said you've asked that gun. School district where you go. The crime is how high집 strength is how low. You have yr CAR broken down. One who jeep parking garage and open and run and run and they did not reply to me for like 7-8 days same condition 7-8 days 7-8 days the police didn't reply in small things you didn't reply you didn't do that these things you were killed you were killed you were killed you were killed you were told if there was emergency something died something was killed something was killed then they will come for a half hour or 15-20 minutes they will come priority

1:48:43What do you think society wise? Is that America right now better than India? Not at all. What is the charm of America? Money. It's all about money. They have a lot of money. Lot of money. That means infinite money, like we say. If you're talented, you can do anything. So, there's talent that if something is in you, you have vision, you have foresight, they will identify that here, this person is right, let's go. That's why, we don't have to learn about this in such things. We don't have to learn that. Indians are going to be a startup for 10 years, for 5 years, everyone is here. nobody want to keep it for long like everybody Indians got a trend now that they built and built and built and built and built and built and then we will see like that when you go to joint exercise to go to the US compare it to India and US in arms how do you have weapons in the US and how do you have India and how do you have they have options there are multiple options and all over the world somewhere there is no best weapon they will immediately go by it they'll not think about it that yes it's like our we don't import or not we don't import we don't import with their military there's zero compromise like if you see HK German like they got it from there like being themselves capable of making anything still they bought HK from them because it is good so it is good what is HK?

1:50:18Heckler and Koch gun so they got it from there so similarly if they got it in India they'll do it they'll do it they don't care about third country like they say that yes, it's a country poor country, if they're good they're good, they're good they value, you know, as I said, talent product and everything but compare, US what happens to the army? what happens to you? what happens to you? what happens to India? give me proper comparison between India versus US you were in Paris and you were in Navy Navy SEALs basically we trained with green berries over there so green berries are like they are as if they are deployed in the green berries we trained with they are deployed in okinawa so it was one sfg so their permanent deployment is okinawa in japan so when we spoke to them and then like there were sergeants and other people who were deployed in iraq and before afghanistan and so they keep telling us we talk to them in general how are your operations how did you chase that guy how did you chase the militants over there so they keep telling us so their first thing started that our drones went there then we had a heptor induction then we had these many like you know aerial support aerial support is so heavy that I think their plan surety 100 % is still there there is no way for the individuals who track to escape ground invasion ground invasion we will go to the ground troops physically occupy them it's for names that yes we have to click a photo click that yes this is a person so this is dead so it is for that but they can ensure through aerial vectors and everything that any plan they are planning like if you are watching Iran conflict right now they are using their air assets and they are using air force and everything right now similarly with Israel also if you see the kind of scud missiles and although they are very precise and everything so they depend very heavily on you know aerial vectors like very much like ground like you are watching when they were going to Gaza so there are landmines so why do they lose actually they value each and every soldiers life it is better to lose an aircraft or a billion dollar or something than to lose a soldier life so that way they are very technologically heavy we rely on a lot of aerial and this is not all of us.

1:52:50If you will see a comparison, like when we talk about aerial vector, if we talk about the fact that we are planning, that we will be using it in combat roles and everything. So we are in that phase, we are now inculcating, we have not crossed that phase, we are actively using it, like in our CIA operations, or in our Nuxal areas, like in Nuxal areas, I know that this is a village, this is their camp. so you will hear news in the 1936 that our soldiers go CRPF soldiers 10 of them get killed then after that we go and reach then they are operations so if we know that these camps are and we use first first we utilize it in aerial vectors so it makes a lot of difference morale of troops you are going to an unknown territory we have drones like surveillance in this clay presently so they are head-ons all bought from israel we are currently buying mq9 reaper we are buying it from u.s like navy and they have a good endurance and to guard indian ocean so that type of things are coming from us so now we have an aerial we have eyes in the air when we are doing operation so we know somebody is there that this ex-man is in his house

1:54:17So we know people that we can alert our troops. So usually we were initially we were like that we were tactically blind. We know that something is in one place. But in that situation, how the situation is changed there, we don't know anything. So like in case of US, in case of Israel, they rely very heavily on their surveillance. Humanity is one aspect. Then they look at their signatures over the pattern, like over the years, like they were tracking Osama, if you talk about, if you talk about Luckfi which also they have like random car neutralized that in a desert that's going to go to a car and they have killed it so they you know that kind of analysis that kind of pattern analysis that kind of technical analysis that matters in the operation and that is actually your success is decided like kind of like when we have some operations we were very surveillance like we were watching them from drone we were watching them so we are rest assured that yes this pattern is like we are following it from six months so yes Saturday Sunday people have to come in this town they don't come usually Monday to Tuesday they are in their camp so when they come that time we can plant something there so it gives you you know kind of an edge already so that is that makes a huge difference so what are what will be let's say two or three on ground sound.

1:55:53Do you have any kind of weapons or gear that they don't have in India? I would say that now we have to come. Like, let's say communication equipment. Like, we were carrying Motorola's and in a squad we used to have maybe one or two satellite communication. Like, if Motorola's are not working or so we use the SATCOMs and everything. Now we have purchased, like initially there is a company called L3 Harris. So we are buying it for SF. So we already have those kind of, you know, communication systems which are coming. What's happening? Basically, it enhances your capability for like, communicating with the other troops.

1:56:34And there's a lot of clarity as compared to, if you talk about the previous kind of Motorola's and weight and everything, and compatibility here, like with the whole chain of command. So these are the things which we were lacking initially. I mean, we were just relying on mundane equipment which we use in the motorway, which we use here in concerts. Like music concerts, you can buy online. And it's a basic equipment which we use. But now we are realizing that we need to... Like a lot of things are coming up. Like you, if you talk about surveillance drones, So we are, we are, we recently purchased a surveillance drone from US for like, we bought it for a crore, like one crore and it's a small bird.

1:57:25Like it is like, it can hover. Like if I send it like 100 meter, it will be on your neck and you will not get to know that it is that bird is watching you. So it is a bird shape. So it's a very small, doesn't make any noise or anything. So now in an SF squad, we have those kind of things. if we want to see something in front of us we'll just send it and we'll see it quietly rather than getting into that situation where we don't know what's going on so those kind of equipments what's the cost of 1 crore? yeah it is 1 crore so the whole crew will get 1? no usually currently in a team like I would say in a team we have 2 or 3 okay that's good that's enough I don't need anyone.

1:58:13But when you're going to the squad, you give one squad, they're doing their surveillance, coming back. And then via communication, we are sharing with each other that we can transfer the pictures and everything from our set to different set. So those kind of things we are having. So more or less, we have things. We have everything. Like we have a decent weapon now. We have communication, good communication set, which is required. And for endurance, we have equipments and pouches it has to be a little bit tailor cut like what happens now it's just one size for all it's just one size it's just small or small it doesn't matter like when I was talking about when we spoke to green bearers so what happens now you have gone so they take your measure like you have a whole body measure with that they will make a tactical vest for you so like the plate is covering your critical parts cover her we have a lose so we have little thing so those kind of things you know but matter in long time obviously so

1:59:31those kind of things are little things that are coming so they are coming here and in terms of night gears so I would say night vision in SF if I talk about SF every soldier has a night vision every soldier has a night vision like at night we are like day and night we are much capable of executing operations at night also as we do it so more or less we have good amount of night sights the only thing is battery endurance and small things that are frequently going to fall and break that quality thing so that quality thing we are improvising it is all feedback we give them feedback that this happened like we went and it was out of IPC so like everyone has secured it from tape and has a little update on our own so that's a little slowly slowly I think we will achieve it like the quality of these products and it matters in long term and guns what gun do you have now?

2:00:33currently we have Tavor okay it's an Israeli weapon 5.56 so slowly I think we are now progressing to 7.62 also and that that's what I've heard that we are buying HK like one of the best so we have specialized unit like our SG units and our Vikas so they have those kind of weapons and SG's they are also purchasing so we are also purchasing I mean it's in the process right now HK's yeah India's guns are also made in India as me yeah Ask me, there's a left-hand colonel who was in infantry school. So, it was his project in Maohu who raised him. So, it's a carbine. Bansod sir. Yeah, Bansod. So, it's a carbine.

2:01:14It's a 9mm basically. So, assault rifle, as of now, we have a company which is like Triple S Defense which is based in Bengaluru. So, they're also doing wonderful job. They've also started getting orders from different like police academies and they're also pitching their weapon. So, as I said, like we are getting, we are slowly, you know, based on rather than relying on like third country or some other country, we are also making our own kind of infrastructure that based on our demands, we can procure weapons and everything. So it's happening. It'll take time. Yeah. So that part is getting sorted.

2:01:49You were talking about green berries. Yeah, green berries. Green berries. Yeah. What's the specialty in them? Why are they green berries? I would say like infantry usually, like just like in India infantry wears a green bearer so there is no concept that infantry will wear green bearer and maroon bearer so like their 82nd airborne division so they all wear the maroon bearers so but with the green bearers it's a their bearer green that's one thing that's why they are called green bearers also but then their tasking is very different see what is the US whole military deployment if you go it is for just one cause that the world order in the US should be there.

2:02:34Okay, they want to maintain that thing. The day that thing that is the danger to that thing. The world order challenge. So why are Green Berries sitting in Okinawa? Why are other SFG units sitting in Germany or different different bases around the world? So it's the same for the same reason to secure that one important thing which they care about. So Green Berries specifically if you talk about their region specific like Asia Pacific or something or they like when we talked to them they all know Japanese I said like 100 % of you guys know Japanese yes they all know Japanese so this is the kind of you know so over the period they get into everything they get into economics of the country they get into the culture of country they get into politics of the country so you know some other day if US has to interfere in Japan.

2:03:30So they, all the troops, they have all the analysis, they know where to, what to address first, what to address last. They can prioritize their targets. They can, you know, if the regime has to change like all other places, they can do. Like they have their everything. They say, they do all their homeworks. So that's what they do. But isn't that CIA's job? It is. So, what happens, like in India, there are multiple agencies. So we cannot rely on one agency. So there are like it's something called corroboration. Like it will be their own but there are layers of corroboration. If CIA said this okay Green Berries also said this thing.

2:04:12Okay there was an ambassador who said the same thing. There were other people who said the same thing. So you know it's a kind of INT is a INT is all about corroboration. Like INT's game is also corroboration. Like 10 people have said go ahead there is something wrong there. If one has said so everyone doubts that if he was the last time maybe there was no input so I cannot rely on him so like when input comes to me like X person has to say sir this is the input there are terrorists there so I'll not only rely on his input and just go there it might be a trap also it might be a double edge source also so then I'll latch on to my technical guys hey this person you have to discuss this area and they'll say okay yes he was there for this long duration and everything then i'll speak to some third guy who is more loyal to me uh he'll say yeah so then when aisa corroboration hota then i can go full-fledged like i can go with conviction ki ha there is because as a as a as a leader as a commander of my escort this is my job this is my primary job when sure ki jahan mein ja ra ho i'm going with the whole conviction and i can also convince my escort this is a confirmed thing and we have to go with you know full we will have a contact there and we have to address those kind of things but have you ever spoken to them Greenberg as to what are they doing in Okinawa they are the friendly nation friendly nation ally look they will save Japan I mean more or less kind of it's a security also kind of for Japan like by giving the base to US Japan has also kind of a security guarantee security guarantee lay liya in US if China in some late part of does something so dhekhe US ke or China ke interest or US ke conflict or China ke conflict they all run parallel if you talk about Middle East if you talk about Myanmar if you talk about South China Sea so they all conflict because where one step is ahead the other is to try to do one step back so that is the reason they are there they are not there for Japan they are there for China and basically that whole region like South China Sea when you see that there are a lot of confrontation between Philippines and their naval ships and China's ship they are fishing big time in different waters just to challenge them so those kind of their presence is mostly because of those kind of tell me if in a hypothetical situation if para SF a soldier versus a Navy SEAL one on one who will win I would say one on one in any matter you want to say one on one combat you are talking about combat one on one combat between two I would say physically like Indian troops SF troops are very very rugged like we were trying to you know we said we will have a competition so we said we will have a competition we will have a competition next day endurance run we will have run we'll have chin-ups, we'll have everything.

2:07:27So, he keeps on getting it. He said, yes, we'll do it tomorrow. Then he said, okay, then he'll do it tomorrow. Then the third day, he said, we won't do it purely green berries, purely SF. We'll mix them. So, you know, those kind of things. Our people are like, they have to show them, they have to show them, they have to do it, they have to do it, they have to tell us how to do it. Because all our guys are pumped up for these kind of things. In such places, they have a lot of fun. that we have to do it. So, we have to do it. We have to do it. We have to do it. When we have to do it, we have to do it.

2:08:01We have to do it. We have to do it. What do we have to do it? So, those kinds of things. But physically, trust me, our troops are like, our grooming is not very hard. It is very hard. It is very hard. When the child is in the house, when you have seen the background here, like the mountains, or the rural areas, how they have survived. I will say, it's a big survival. Like, school is going to go 10 kilometers and it's not good. Food is not good. Water is not good. School is not good. Still, he has survived and he has reached there. So, think about that his training before the force has been taken.

2:08:39And after that, he has gone further. If you compare to other troops, like, they have been sitting in ACs, they have been having all good food, good life and then you know so there is a lot of difference if you talk about physically or mentally there is a stark difference our survival stings and struggle in general Indians if you talk about currently I am in US so I see a lot of difference like our weather is warm let's go brother if you don't have a big time if there is no big deal or there is no central heating or there is no work there so here is no concept you can see in Himachal in Utrakhand our women are going to go 15 kilometers no clothing so that kind of toughness it does matter like grooming true I was speaking to somebody in Britain and one of the chief one of the kishi troop commanding onse I nai ee poochha tha about comparison he said ki here there is there is a problem today is a big struggle how can you compare them with Indians it can't happen I tell you a basic example they came to green bears training to the buckler in our training where SF training school is now we night sets of night before.

2:10:15So, they said that don't use your night sights and we'll navigate without night sights at night. So, they said that how do we go without night sights? They said that our troops are going. So, you go ahead and go out of night sights. So, they said that okay. So, when they started going, they're going down here. They're going down here. They're going down there. So, they're going to enjoy it. Our people are used to like that kind of, you know, they can sense that this is a tree, so how will the road be? There are rebels here. how much they can go down here. So, they're going through the fun and they said, no, we have to put our night set.

2:10:51And it was a training. It was a training exercise. Not even a live operation. So, you know, that's what I am saying. They are very tech dependent. They are very equipment heavy military. They have, like, what do they have? Like I'm saying. But our people, like I'm saying, they are groomed to survive in any kind of environment. They don't even drink water of another country, right? Their water comes in bottles, right? Random taps of pani No, they're very particular about water, food and you know, it's so pure and so clean. We go to operation, so we're sitting in a place. So it was 4-5 days, it was a lot humid.

2:11:29Myanmar and India water, it was a lot humid. My JCO was a food poisoning and he was vomiting and everything. Our water was almost done. We didn't expect that it was a problem. So in front of us, it was a food. It was like this. And it was very bad. When we were water, we thought that if we were to die, where will we grow? Everyone said that it's very bad water, we won't grow it. In the 4th or 5th day, everyone went to that. Everyone drank water. Everybody drank that water like, that it's the pure water here. So, it's like this condition. But I'm going to say that kind of stuff. And the same thing, we won't do it until they get back to death.

2:12:07They say, let's do something else. and we will go there. So that kind of, you know, toughness is a lot in our people. That I can vouch for. Like, it is unmatchable. True. That spirit, that kind of, you know, survivability is unmatchable. Our survival instinct is much more superior. Exactly. Okay. Training days, do you ever train with blindfolded? Yeah. I mean, multiple times. As I said, like our weapon training, had to be weapon assembling, training had to be and we were doing a lot of things like in general ragaaga also had to be killed ragaaga was like that so it was like that sometimes blind footed that we were going there and you told us and you said that you didn't know where you are north or south you didn't know anything after that you are given stakes and everything you have to hit somebody so that kind of you know but training also training you even without night sights our troop can sense like ground vegetation that yes how the sound will be there or somewhere there is a vegetation that yes the terrain is good so those kind of sense because we have a lot of troops from that particular area like you know people are in that area like my troops and mostly Northeastern tropes.

2:13:38So they were very, they were so good, like they can smell a plant, a tree, a freshly cut, and like we had a operation in the trees, in fact. So we went to the surveillance before. Somebody said that they are using this track very often. So my troop is in Manipur, so he went with me. So we went to the civil trance before. Like as a surveillance. So he saw, he said, look at this, there are no trees here. There are no dew here. like there's a dew drops and he's gone from here but he didn't go from the middle he didn't go from the road but he's gone from the side so that means that people don't get confused so that was one big sign that we understood that there was a movement and next day there's a place so we had a contact also we had a firefight in the same place based on just his one observation and his one observation as i said corroborated the technical input which he had that there's a movement So that's kind of sense that our young people is very amazing.

2:14:40And it comes with, you know, because he has grown up there. He has been doing his own life and he has been doing his own life. So he has been taking his own dogs, and he has been taking his own life. So he can sense everything. True. I mean, that kind of training you cannot impart. They are in birth. I have seen in North East that a 6-year-old child can be taken to himself.

2:15:10tell me about your training days I was bullied in the Fawc. What happens in the training? This is what happens. Because if you are hungry, you eat in your plate. Like we had a towel in our plate. Now, how do you bully a senior? He said that it's a towel. So, you fall in the 8-8 line. Like 1-2-3, like a towel, you fall in the 8-8 line. Then you eat one-1. And we had to eat in our food, as a first timer you only get 30 seconds to eat as a second timer you get like one minute to eat as a third timer you get one and a half then two minutes to eat these are the privileges which are given to credits when we go into some mess as a first timer we had to say that because you can eat any toast you can't eat anything because you have to cut proper you have to follow the etiquette you can't do anything so that's how we get out of bounds kind of that we don't see these things which is the same thing that we can see that we can swallow and eat quickly so that's how we would fall in in the chowel 8 or 4 and it's like the buzzer that's how 30 seconds are over you are out so many times you have not eaten and you have to go on your whole routine so many times you have to go on your whole day so many times So, I mean, we feel proud in training that we are bullied.

2:16:43Let's go, we got a raga, we don't get food, let's go, it's okay. It was a normal. The most fascinating raga job you have. Training was one time. Like, this is one thing, when I was in the field first time. So, this was my first time in SF. Okay. Like in SF Special Forces, first time, I was preparing for a team. So, we were preparing for a team. So, what happened? that I was sitting, I was like, I mean, where I have a target, where I have a target, like, this is the target, I am standing here, and there is a target in my bagel, and then another target, and further, your troops, they are firing at those targets, they are firing at this target, and they are firing a target, which is between your legs, so that one day, I thought that I was like, is it really worth it, that somebody, If you were standing there and there was a target here.

2:17:38So, as if there was a fire coming there, I was telling him that your shot was 8 mm there. Or in this circle, I was telling him. Then they were firing. So, this is for basically confidence building. So, what happens? So, what happens is that usually all the Tavor are. Like Tavor is still an accurate weapon, I would say. So, as many people are firing, they were firing on 8 shots. zap sommes sur le He was 32. 32 was my shoulder. So, 32 circle is bigger. Like 8, 16, 32. So, he hit the ball here. So, the ball was here, I saw it. So, I said, who is there? So, I said, is he firing from Tavor or who? So, I saw that he was firing from AK.

2:18:19So, there was a new paratrooper who had to train. So, I didn't know if anyone had checked there. So, he hit AK instead of Tavor. So, that bullet was so close to me. So, I said, I said, these are like these are like situation I mean what I'm saying in training these were you know in which you really thought that yes really scared that yes this day can happen and then like like like you could feel like like it is a real experience that actually in firefight you will get like it was a bit close so that is kind of experience you know Basically target is the two sides. So you have a correction. They are firing and you are saying, yes, your gun is here.

2:19:08And the other one who has hit the 32, they have given him the whole day. Because he didn't tell him, he started firing. Because he has no accuracy. As compared to if you talk about war and other weapons. So they are not very accurate. But he is a new paratrooper. but he didn't do zeroing the weapon. Whatever the weapon was fired, everyone was zeroing. If you fire four or five times, then you have accuracy and you give a correction to your weapon. He took a weapon that was not zeroed, and then he fired. It was not accurate, it was zeroed. That's why my senior JCOs complained about 10 places, that's the new parrot.

2:19:51And the guy was like this. It was part of training, but it was fun. I mean, I was like, I was scared. But it happened, it happened. Then we thought, yes, we did it. But it's risky. It is risky. I kept it all day rolling, rolling. But honestly, But you didn't give it? I didn't give it. I didn't give it. I was like,

2:20:17I don't know. I don't know. Basically, we have stress firing. like you have a lot of rolling front roll back roll then you have to round and say it's fine so it was part of a kind of culture you know training and coming back to a topic which you have to say tank Mr. Tank why? this name was like this basically I was doing commandos when I was doing the course in the commando wing so I was standing so I was feeling a little I was feeling a little so the instructor was like he said he said he said he said he said he passed will you be able to pass your test I said yes sir I said what is it? So he thought that I am unfit type and so on next day BPD was our first test and I was leading and I came first so then he was like I was like 4 times and I was like so people said sir you have given him and he was like as if what is happening then he started saying and there was a word that he can run oh so it's a tank not that no not a mission nice and then then it's a name in Parasaf

2:21:37it came on later on but it's still nicknames nice you had a briefing call that it was a hostage situation where but you were gone and neutralized two terrorists but then you were not able to save a kid so what was that situation what was that situation basically there is a place in Hajan in North Kashmir Hajan is a place where basically it was a hotbed and Hajan's significance is that it started a moment from Hajan like one were the terrorists who trained Pakistan but somehow India was able to cultivate them and they they start like they worked with government of India and on advance basically the Pakistan terrorists they started to neutralize so what happened that the first rebellion was Pakistan terrorists that started from the village so the elite the elite the elite the elite that we never left this village we never left this village we have kind of our presence made our so there the terrorists all the Pakistan terrorists were like locals hardly 1 or 2 or something and and the youngest militant was there too.

2:22:50I think he was 14 years old. So, he also my unit has neutralized it. So, what happened there? Basically, there was a house. He was a very big businessman. There was a lot of apple orchards. So, people came to his house. So, he gave a shelter. So, usually, what do we do? Like family members, they call them, they tell us about something outside, or not. So, his daughter also came there. So, lately, he started eloping with a daughter. He started talking about it. He called it and then he exploited it. So when she got depressed and she told her parents that she is over, I don't want to take it anymore anymore.

2:23:24So what did she say? She took her from there and sent her to a different house. She told her that she was there. And as it was, she told her that she had done this. So she told her that she will not come back. I will not leave the youngest kid, the child, and the father. So she made her hostage. So she told her that she will not come back. So the parents and mother told her that she will not come back. is that he will kill me but my daughter will not come back she will never come back she will never come back she will never come back she will never come back she will never come back this is all the things this is all going on a month and we didn't have the idea initially didn't like it because family wanted to close because there were people open the moon when we were hostage but later we went to a place somewhere else so we went we went boredon who pass i do i had boredon that was done up you

2:24:31Howard are

2:24:36who is How did the family come out? The families left the other. The other people left the other. But the parents and the child were the top floor. Father and the child. They left the other floor and the other floor. The other floor was the other floor. The other family left the other. The two two components were left. So, they came out and said, how many days ago they came out. They told me that they were both in the same way. They had a lot of motorola set. and they have a lot of time. So, these are our houses. And we have all these things. So, we have said that we have all these things. Why are you living here?

2:25:13Basically, there is something that happens. If you look in Kashmir, if you look in the future, if you look in the shelter, you will live in one house, and then you will live in another house. So, we will go home. Why would the family allow? We have to do it. Like, if someone comes to gunpoint, you have to do it. So, we have to do it. And then, there are some obligations. Some people say that, if you come here, then you have to keep your house. Now, Now, what happens now is that 99 % of the input of the house is also given to the people. If they become the power of their power, they give it to the people.

2:25:44So, it was like this at home. Then we announced that we had called Malvi. We had to call Malvi, you have to fight, you leave the child and leave the father. You cannot, it's an unethical thing and all that is. After that, many people called him. It was a live operation and it was a holy day. When holy was running, it became a live news. Everybody was there and everybody was recording. Hostage was even aware. And in his satellite phone, there were a lot of calls from Pakistan. He left it. He was like, I'm going to go to this way. And all the things were going on. But he was sitting on the set. He was sitting on the satcom.

2:26:24But he didn't have ego. And he was like, I'm going to die. So he was trying to negotiate but it didn't happen. Then we had lately his mother to send his mother to him. His mother said before you do something, I will try to convince them. So we didn't go to him.

2:26:45Which militant has been made? Yes, he was made. Terrorist? Terrorist. Terrorist. So he was mother. He was mother. He said I will go inside. I will try and I will try to convince him. We said no, we don't need anything. He might take you also as a hostage. The first situation was going to be and then we have to do the thing. So after a long time, a conscious call was taken. We said that you are going inside and you have to get these guys outside. So then we took a call. We saw everyone who said that just keep observing. And everyone asked what you are seeing and what can you observe. So after a situation we thought that we are going inside.

2:27:27So we have to clear the floor. Because the hostage situation is very critical. Because we are going inside. Milton, the terrace, knows that this door is and this door will be open. And there will be no place where it can be. So they will be so good to guard. They will know that the door will open. But our way is that we have 20 doors before clear. Then we know that one door will be open. Which door will be open. So, it's going to be a very sensitive one from 20 doors and we have to take that sensitivity to every door. That yes, it can happen. It will come here and then it will come here. So, this is a very critical situation.

2:28:04Especially when we are not going to be top down, we are going to go down. Which is very unconventional. It doesn't happen. It is always top to down. You are going to search. Because if someone has thrown a grenade from above, you are going to be there. There is a lot. But the situation was such that it was not allowing us to do such thing. and then we have to take a conscious call that we have to assess and clear a room and we will go up. So we made a stick. Our whole parties came. We took our shields and everything and then we started moving. We started clearing one house. We started clearing second house which basically was the floor.

2:28:38Then we went to the third floor so we didn't know the top. We didn't know the top. So he is in the top floor. So as we went up, as the shield was up, as the first person went up, he fired around. So as he fired, our people also fired. So, what is it that they tried to shift the room? So, the father was the father. He shifted the person to the person. So, the father got saved. Like, the father was the one who went down from a small height. But then he was saved. Like, he had injury. But then he was saved. So, we could save. But the child was very small. So, he took it and gave it to the camera.

2:29:10So, then we could not move to that. We could not move to that. So, we had given it a little while. We had given it a little while. We had said, father is safe. So, people are clear to father. Now, after that, he is a child. Now, let's give us a call. If we will open the fire. so the kid might also get killed and Milton then let's go die Milton was not even a call but our priority was that kid that the child should be able to die so we thought okay slowly we will progress but we were not able to find exactly where the child is like the child is with it so we took a call when his father came out his mother had a little bit

2:30:18that he grows that the child is gone and she's saying, take it. So how does the mother take it? Because obviously, she came out and said, that it's like this. Then we thought, there's nothing scope here. There's nothing now. So what to do? Then we neutralize both of them and both terrorists are dead. But unfortunately, we could not save that child also. The child was a critical... If he would have been saved, I mean, if the terrorists are running, بھی جاتے تو شاید ہمیں اتنا فرق نہیں بڑھتا honestly اگر میرے سے پوچھے کوئی but then we could not save that kid I mean that was a big but you didn't try to negotiate یہ تک جانے دیں گے ایسے try or something ہم اسے بات کرنے کی کوشش کر رہے تھے but he was not replying کیونکہ اگر وہ reply کرتا تو ہمیں پتا چل جاتا کہ وہ کہاں پہ کہاں ہیں so he was not تو اس کی مدر نے when we told her that she was in this room, they were also, you know, she told her, she said, she didn't have a child, and she told her, so my mother saw her, she told her, she said, she took her here.

2:31:18She could not, because, you know, she was terrified, so then, we took a call, whatever it is now, so let's, it was then same, like we were having, we were having, we were having, there was another unit, three para, who were having, same operation in Sopor. there was a same situation there was a senior of mine so he went inside and he got a shot also but then it was like you know it was a successful operation but there was no civil casualties there and then do you feel sad about these things then sometimes it's like that kid how was it he didn't have any wrong like he was not even and just because of a girl like you made an ego issue because of a lady if you are a fighter or you want or whatever so that girl was immaterial for you so you fight no, fight why are you making them do you feel sometimes when you come home like now that you are retired this haunt or personally it haunts many things like I have told you the children of Manipur who were killed and the children of Zeri Maam who was preparing and these I mean you cannot sleep without you know sometimes you feel like I should have come you should have given a culmination or you should have given a term or you should have taken a terrace or you should have taken a terrace or you should have taken a terrace it is always a thought process like now I will get a chance I will go and tell someone where it is now I feel like it is very easy because there are a lot of restrictions now I feel like these Ukrainians and Americans are going to Myanmar I think you've given an opportunity I would love to go there obviously I mean that is much easier like here you have to be diplomatic diplomacy you have to be diplomatic in your actions there is no diplomacy you go there do your thing come back I mean it's a kind of I mean these are not for like we should you know incigency or militant terrorism there is no diplomacy left I mean, we should just, just, because you are setting an example for another generation that they can do this too.

2:33:37And after that, they can use weapons, and kill them, and then they can, you know, bring down government in their knees, and government will come, and government will entertain them, call in Delhi, they will also have tea, they will also have a seat in the AC rooms, they will give them importance. So, you have set a bad precedence, you know, by giving leverage to these people. So, like, there should be no mercy to them. Like, no, there should be, this is the might of government this is government of India's region that if it's over then it's over there are a lot of countries who do not negotiate in a hostage situation they don't care about how many people are dying they just go in and this is a strong message which you send but by getting them you are proving that you are also weak it is not giving a message to the rebels that you are a strong you have a strong you're giving a message that you will you will raise their demands so I think we should not we should not actually avoid these kind of diplomacy in these situations it will never help like Pakistan you've seen so many years what's it getting nothing so and maybe because we are little soft it's good for us also as a nation it has nothing to do with government or which government or what I think as a nation which is a little humanity that we have a lot of hope from a lot of people of course there should be a limit and that limit cross you should take strict actions but till a limit which is a little soft that we don't have a life that we don't have a hostile situation so let's you also said before that the terrorists were going to die so that that impact which is in our everyone that empathy it's a good thing as a nation?

2:35:27Empathy, I would say, and that softness, it was a bit of a feeling. But honestly, humanity, when we talk about it, you know, this humanity is restricted to us. It does not apply to Israel, it does not apply to US, it does not apply to Pakistan, anyone. And it affects a lot of our decision. If you talk, if we prioritize humanity over military decision making or anything, so it, you know, our youth's morale It has to be very effective. When there is an ambush, and we are going to go, we are saying that everyone is so good that we have to finish. It has to be... And then people say that we don't do this, or that, or that, when we have restrictions, so people...

2:36:10We also get demolished. We say that who has helped him, he is as good as a militant. Who has given him a shelter, he is as good as a militant. Who has told him he is as good as a militant. Who has told him he is as good as a... You know, something too, if it was for a month or two months, but then they should have you know there are ways and means to tell so I mean humanity nobody cares about how many people our kids are dying in Myanmar nobody cares about people dying in Israel hospital bomb bombarded in Afghanistan these many people died you know

2:36:43and if you talk about who was in China who is talking about them they are a gone story like so but it what are the people doing their situation is bad exactly people don't even know that that area exists actually they have deleted the conversation from the world exactly so see and this is what strong message they have sent like that was the messaging but how strong message comes that if you go against you know you have to follow the rules you have to follow the rules if you don't follow the rules nobody is going to save you nobody no islamic nation no turkey no nothing nobody talks about it no one talks about it exactly and that's islam body that they're all exactly and that's a big they all follow that religion and that's what they're doing today exactly and they're a big population big chunk of population they're not like 2000 3000 people like they're lacks of ugar muslim and they have been converted like now they're not they have been you know converted into they're trying to follow the Han and all other religions like they are converting them very slowly like radical is trying to finish it and forcefully say whatever you say so their Islam is getting finished right?

2:37:59they are all converted they don't look like mosques so they are slowly you know kind of inter-caste marriages the conversation is already finished humanity with our your own people but somebody like a Pakistani coming in or a Burmese or where there is a militant or these things are so I think we should focus more on messaging strong messaging rather than you know showing humanity or something like that well yeah that's it's a decision which is way above my pay grade everyone is on my pay grade but I agree a part of it not like fully but a part of it makes sense but thank you so much sir it was a pleasure having you nice thank you for explaining me the the problems that we are facing reality of our country thank you for giving us so many details thank you so much there's one last question which we ask these days is fill in the blank so India will only grow when dash when India will grow only when dash like what will happen we will start growing so far civic sense I think that's the biggest thing that's a very big thing I personally feel if people start caring about each other more you know it's not like we are becoming very selfish if you talk in general localities or if you talk about anything like our industries everybody is very self-centered and very you know so we have to be very we have to have that kind of as a community we have to live as a community we have to grow and that's a big thing so that is one thing I feel like India needs to work on yeah perfect thank you so much thank you so much for watching this episode now you have to do three things Number one, this channel subscribe to us so that we have more valuable guests to you and ask them questions which you want to.

2:40:11Number two, tell me in comments that you are any guest who you want to watch our podcast so that we have to ask them and ask them which you want to. And number three, this episode, you must have to share with someone which will be a positive change because one conversation enough for someone's life change I'll see you next time until then keep figuring out