Dem Lawmaker Mike Levin: This Is What Democrats Must Do—And Not Do—Following Massive Midterm Victory

0:02Hi, everybody. I'm Brittany Lewis, a breaking news reporter here at Forbes. Joining me once again is Congressman Mike Levin. Congressman, thanks so much for coming back on.

0:11Mike Levin: Thank you, Brittany. Always good to be with you. It's always great to be with you. And I can only imagine how busy you must have been this week. It's a big week for Democrats because Democrats won decisively this midterms. They made history, especially in deep red districts and red states. Democrats took back control of the House and the Senate. And I'm curious, to start off the conversation, as a Democrat yourself, as someone who was reelected handily yourself, how are you feeling in this moment? What are your takeaways and reaction to the election results? Well, I'm feeling really encouraged by everything.

0:51Mike Levin: and I always believe you don't want to get too high or too low in politics because politics is cyclical. American history is cyclical. And overreach by this president, the extremism, the chaos, the corruption, the cruelty that we've seen from the administration, it has all led to this moment. And I think all of that overreach should not be met by similar overreach by my side of the aisle. I think rather than that, we have to deliver results. We have to actually focus on the needs and concerns of the American people. I think they are sick and tired of the extremism and the overt partisanship coming from Washington, D.C., and specifically coming from this president and the Republicans in Congress who enabled his every move over these past two years.

1:49Mike Levin: And I think they want actual common sense legislating. They want us to deliver for them. Everything's too expensive from groceries to gas and utilities to childcare and healthcare and housing. We've got to have concrete results on all the above. And just the same, we have to hold people to account who have broken the law or who have, you know, undermined the norms that our system rely on. Whether it's the president's family, whether it's the president's business associates, whether it's corporate executives engaged in malfeasance, whether it's, you know, members of the administration, we have to ensure accountability without fear or favor.

2:34Mike Levin: And we have to walk and chew gum at the same time, Brittany, meaning we have to be results focused with affordability at the core because that's what we're being sent to do. Make no mistake. But at the same time, accountability is critically important for the survival of American democracy. It seemed like Democrats across the country were running on two C's, right? Costs and corruption and how to battle both of them. And I'm curious, you're saying, you know, we can walk and chew gum at the same time. How do you do that? And when you say you don't want your own party to overreach, what does that look like?

3:12What does that mean to you specifically?

3:14Mike Levin: Well, costs and corruption or affordability and accountability, both alliterative devices with the same meaning, which is you just can't lose sight of people that are really hurting right now. And so, you know, I was asked by Leader Jeffries to co-lead the Gas and Utilities Working Group to come up with a plan of things we could do in Congress in 100 hours, 100 days in a year to be able to actually reduce energy costs. I know others have the same exercise with regard to housing, childcare, healthcare, and groceries. And so you're going to be seeing a lot of concrete legislating being done in the House and I think in the Senate as well along those lines.

4:01Mike Levin: And when it comes to gas and utility prices, I think you just look at the war in Iran, unauthorized, never voted on under the War Powers Authority. You look at the tariffs, some of which have been declared illegal by even by the very conservative Supreme Court, but others, you know, never were authorized by Congress. So war on tariffs will help dramatically reduce those gas and utility prices if you can put an end to the war on Iran and if you can reverse those tariffs. and also stop kneecapping all of the clean energy projects that would have driven costs down and would have helped with domestic production and manufacturing.

4:40Mike Levin: For whatever reason, the president has decided to end a lot of those projects using taxpayer dollars. And you and I have talked about this before, Brittany, actually using taxpayer dollars to kill projects, to stop building projects, as opposed to using tax dollars to build things that actually help people. let's talk about that other a or that other c whatever way you want to go here accountability or corruption because you're the co-founder one of them of the end corruption caucus and an exit poll that was uh taken by a bunch of different news outlets it found that government corruption was either a crucial or major factor for 91 percent of voters this election and the day after the election, this is what you posted on X.

5:25The American people have spoken, subpoenas, investigations, actual accountability, a work in Congress. Get ready, my friends. You demand a change and you gave us the power to deliver it. I cannot wait to get to work. What does that work look like? What do you want to investigate first?

5:43Mike Levin: Well, as part of my work on lowering gas and utility prices, we actually provided Leader Jeffries with a list of things directly related to those areas that require congressional oversight. And that's just in that one subject area, Brittany. But as I mentioned, all of those deals to kneecap wind projects and solar projects using taxpayer dollars, using the judgment fund, I think it's borderline illegal what they did. Just the same, the cancellation of Department of Energy grants, not just energy grants, but health grants, scientific research, education grants, anytime that Congress authorizes and appropriates funding, and I'm on the Appropriations Committee, so I take this seriously and I take it personally, anytime that we appropriate those funds, all the president is constitutionally empowered to do is execute those laws to apportion the money as appropriated by the Congress.

6:42Mike Levin: The president of the United States does not get to withhold the funds, and the president doesn't get to spend money on stuff that we haven't authorized and appropriated. I hope that makes sense. And they're doing that on a daily basis. So Russ Vogt, the OMB director, is going to be a frequent visitor to the Appropriations Committee testifying under oath about his repeated violations of federal law, whether it's the Empowerment Control Act, the Anti-Deficiency Act, he needs to be held to account and my Republican colleagues have refused either because they're afraid or they for whatever reason who knows they have refused to bring this director, director vote who is out of control before the committee in any sort of meaningful way just the same Pete Hegseth talk about out of control Brittany this is a guy in my view he's violated the War Powers Act a number of times, but the War Crimes Act as well, he needs to be held to account.

7:42Mike Levin: So those are just two members of the administration. Plenty of others also need to be held to account. I do want to touch on Hegseth because if you look back to history, 20 years ago in the midterms of 06, voters were not happy with the war in Iraq and it showed in the results. Republicans lost control of the House and the Senate. And soon thereafter, a defense secretary, Rumsfeld, was out. Are we going to see the same thing here? Are Defense Secretary Hegseth's days numbered? Well, I think his days are numbered as secretary one way or the other. And I've heard the rumors just like you that Marsha Blackburn, the governor-elect in Tennessee, by the way, by a very small margin, supposed to be a huge margin for Blackburn, she barely won, that she may appoint him to that Senate seat in Tennessee.

8:32And if that's the case, you know, that's obviously up

8:35Mike Levin: to her. I think Pete Hegseth as a national political figure is a disaster. I think he's been a horribly incompetent secretary. He's done tremendous harm to our service members and I hear the real world stories from our service members and their families about what he's done and I think he leaves a legacy, a disastrous legacy of incompetence and arrogance for the department and we need people who are serious and somber, who are trying to keep our national security in mind rather than, you know, blow stuff up because it makes him feel a bit better about himself or, you know, do pushups to show how much testosterone he has.

9:19Mike Levin: You know, it's just, it's disgraceful what he's done. And he deserves to be impeached. I don't say that lightly, Brittany. You know, I think impeachment is a tool that the founders gave us only in very exceptional circumstances of high crimes and misdemeanors. I personally believe that Hegseth's violations of the War Powers Act and the War Crimes Act, specifically around some of the boat strikes, are sufficient conditions to meet the high crimes and misdemeanors standard laid out by the Constitution. I would have voted to impeach Hegseth, but as you'll recall, before the election, the last thing that happened seven weeks ago or eight weeks ago, Mike Johnson sent everybody home because Tom Massey's privileged resolution on the impeachment of Pete Hegseth was supposed to be voted on the next day.

10:03Mike Levin: So he avoided it. Hegseth avoided it for now, but we'll see what happens. When you're talking to your Democrat colleagues there after this monumental win for your party, how much, or if at all, is the word impeachment coming up here? Because there's a lot of talk about investigations, but what about impeachment? Is there much appetite amongst congressional Democrats to go down the impeachment road again, specifically with President Trump? Well, I, you know, look, I voted to impeach Donald Trump twice in his first term, and I stand by those votes. But I think that our first priority needs to be to use the investigative tools that we have, the subpoena powers that we have to, you know, uncover any sort of wrongdoing that may exist and to establish the facts.

10:53Mike Levin: And that's where we have to start. And we need to, you know, then follow where the facts lead us. I think Leader Jeffrey said it right. We're not ruling anything out and we're not ruling anything in. We have to follow the evidence wherever it leads. And we have to focus on the most effective ways to hold this administration accountable. But in no event can we allow that to sideline the affordability piece, which is the first piece of what we must focus on. How are you planning to focus on that from day one? Because this has been a top issue for voters since really the dawn of time, right? It's the economy stupid.

11:34It was that way in 2024. That's why Democrats suffered those losses. It is in 2026. That's why Republicans suffered those losses. So how do you make life affordable for everyday Americans?

11:44Mike Levin: Well, I think there are certain things we can do right away and then other things that are going to take time. Right away, we can vote to restore the ACA tax credits that kept care affordable for millions and millions of people. And, you know, if you recall, we tried to do this, a clean three-year extension of those credits. We actually had a number of Republicans on board. Now, some of those Republicans have since lost their seats, Brittany, so we'll have to reevaluate with the new majorities that we have. But I look at the ACA tax credits. I look at reversing the cuts to Medicaid. I look at things that we can do to expand clean energy.

12:23Mike Levin: I look at some of the things we need to do around data centers to make sure that the average rate payer isn't footing the bill for these massive data centers being built out. I look at our war powers resolutions. I look at our tariff votes that we've had. And when you look at it, you have to overlay the new majority that we have. So hypothetically, Brittany, let's say there's 260 House Democrats and 56 Senate Democrats. What that would mean is if you wanna get a bill to the president's desk, you need half of the House and 60 % of the Senate to avoid a filibuster. But if you want to avoid a veto, remember the president, he put out a big red hat AI image the night of the election with veto on his hat.

13:11Mike Levin: So if you want to overcome that veto, what do you need? Well, you need two thirds in both houses to overcome the veto, which means you need 290 in the House and you need 67 in the Senate. Now, those are huge numbers, right? But if you start with 260 House Democrats and you can keep all those House Democrats together, that means you need 30 House Republicans. And if you start with 56, assuming we win in Mississippi and we win in Alaska, 56 senators, Democratic senators, then that means you need 11 Republican senators. So I don't think that's as far-fetched, nearly as far-fetched as some. and I think we ought to try.

13:53Mike Levin: Just the same, we ought to be able to get 60 senators in the coming months on a wide variety of things. You only need four Republican senators on a wide variety of things. And I'm really encouraged by all of it. And when you have 260, that means you can lose some Democratic House members because you only got to get to 218, right? So let's say you have a proposal. There ought to be all sorts of proposals, Brittany, where you can get 60 U.S. senators and 218 members of the House of Representatives. And let's focus on those ideas across all these areas of affordability, and let's get it done. Your tone is much more optimistic in this conversation than in past conversations.

14:38That's for sure. And I want to talk more about this new majority that your party has, because Democrats, like I've been saying, they saw wins in places they typically haven't for decades. And you saw all different types of Democrats win, right? You saw more moderate Democrats, more progressive Democrats, establishment Democrats, Democrats who were either backed or Democratic Socialists of America members. And I'm curious, do you feel a divide in your party amongst those DSA-backed or more progressive members versus the more moderate members? Is there a divide there when you're talking amongst yourselves?

15:13Because I know the former House Speaker, Nancy Pelosi, she was asked about this, and she said that there's tremendous consensus in the Democratic Party. She obviously was pushed about that, and she was asked about those divisions, and she said that Democrats just differ about timing, how quickly you do this or that. What do those divisions look like to you? Do they exist? How big are they? Talk to us about that.

15:37Mike Levin: I think most Democrats agree on most things. And I think we should focus on the big picture here, which is showing that we can deliver for the average American, that we care about their life, that we care about how expensive everything is, that we want to see their life improved. and just the basics of being able to retire with dignity, being able to get a great quality public education, being able to have health care when you need it, not having ICE agents going after people who are trying to raise their families and do things the right way. Just the basics, I think. Start with the basics and build consensus on those things that are broadly popular, not only with Democrats in Congress, but with the American people.

16:23Mike Levin: A ban on members of Congress trading stock would be fantastic. That's something that is supported by 86 % of Americans. A real ban, not a fake one like Mike Johnson wanted to do. Just the same, Supreme Court reform. The Supreme Court is the only court in America that doesn't have basic ethics and accountability standards for its members that are enforceable. And we need those. We need transparency. So there are so many things that we agree on as Democrats that a broad majority of Americans want us to achieve. We need to focus on those things and, you know, allow the to the extent the D.C. press corps wants the narrative to be Democrats fighting with one another.

17:09Mike Levin: They're going to write what they're going to write. But at the end of the day, we have to deliver for the American people. And my last question to you is, as a Democratic lawmaker, this we must feel pretty good, right? It's been described as a blue tsunami, a Republican bloodbath. You're seeing, like I'm saying, these historic wins over and over in various states across the country. However, the Democratic Party's approval rating is still underwater, less so than Republicans, less so than President Trump's. But Democrats, as a brand, that brand is not very popular by any means. So I'm curious, does that concern you at all going into the next two years?

17:47And how do Democrats become a party that's not just the anti-Trump party, especially as we go into a lame duck presidency with President Trump?

17:56Mike Levin: Well, I've seen the word mandate misused or overused my entire life in politics and long before running for office. I remember George W. Bush running in 2004, winning narrowly against John Kerry and claiming he had a mandate. I heard Mike Johnson say he had a mandate. I heard Donald Trump say he won in a landslide and had a mandate. None of those things are true. At the end of the day, this country is still very divided and very polarized because of, you know, many politicians over many decades who saw the opportunity to use fear and division for their own personal political gain, perhaps none more than Donald Trump, who is still the president of the United States.

18:38Mike Levin: And so I think we as Democrats need to be very careful, not to say we have a mandate, Because as you correctly stated, Brittany, the last I checked, the Democratic Party was below water by a lot. It's not like we're at, you know, 49 percent waiting to get to 50. We have a long way to go to restore trust and confidence with everyday Americans. And just because they did not want to see any more of unchecked Trump administration extremism, we should not take the wrong lesson and think that all those voters agree with the Democratic Party on every issue. We need to meet people where they are. We have to rebuild relationships of trust and confidence, not only in the Democratic Party, Brittany, but in the ability of government to deliver anything of value to the average American.

19:27Mike Levin: That has to remain our focus always, our North Star. Congressman Mike Levin, I always appreciate our conversations. Thank you so much for joining me. Congrats on your win this week, and I hope to speak with you again soon. Always happy to chat, Brittany. Thank you so much.