Trump’s economic policies hit Iran, Canada and U.S. workers

0:01WBUR Podcasts, Boston.

0:10Today we are launching Operation Economic Outcast to foreclose every other option available to the Iranian regime. Treasury Secretary Scott Besant declares Economic D-Day on Iran.

0:33It's Monday, August 24th, and this is Here and Now, Anytime from NPR and WBWR Boston. I'm Shiko Theuri. Today on the show, the trade war between the U.S. and Canada is escalating. We can't control the storm that blows in from Washington. We can, however, chart a new course by building Canada strong at home and diversifying our trading relationships abroad. And more tariffs means more pressure on the U.S. economy, adding to the heap of problems farmers are facing. Labor has been a challenge for years, and it is only getting worse. But first, Treasury Secretary Scott Besant unveils new economic measures against Iran.

1:18Nagar Murtazavi is a senior fellow at the Center for International Policy. She's also the host of the Iran podcast and joined Robin Young with the latest. Just a little while ago, Treasury Secretary Scott Besant announced the highly anticipated plan for Iran, something he called economic asphyxiation of the regime. But here's what he said, for instance, about countries that do business with Iran. Every country has a defined timeline to shut down activities we have identified. If they do not take action, we will do so unilaterally through Treasury authorities. Secretary Besant added the clock just started ticking, but some thought time had already run out.

1:58Nagar, we spoke earlier today waiting for these announcements. Did you expect more action than continued threats? What did you hear? Not really. I mean, it's very much a continuation of the rhetoric of presidents, senior officials since before the war, the beginning of the war. but I don't know how this is going to achieve any goals in action. I mean, military supremacy, U.S. has military supremacy over Iran, and they haven't been able to make Iran surrender or capitulate with that kind of absolute force. So to think that more economic force is going to bring the Iranians to some form of surrender, I think is just a mirage.

2:40Well, at least one reporter at the press conference felt this was less than the D-Day promised. Here's that exchange. You described this as an economic D-Day, but D-Day wasn't a threat of an invasion, and the U.S. didn't give a timeline to Germany. So why not impose the sanctions today? Well, we are giving everyone the opportunity to remedy bad behavior. Why would I want to blow up the global financial system? Does that make sense, too? Because some would say, but if that's what you think is going to happen, why this avenue? Right. I mean, I think that's a question for the administration. I just saw a former State Department official basically called this a nothing burger.

3:26I mean, it seems like that's what it is, more threats, but it's not very clear if there's an actual strategy behind this, if there's a path to a goal. And what is the goal? You know, again, this was a war that started with a set of goals, very high grand goals, regime change in Iran, destroying their army, navy, air force, their nuclear program, which supposedly was already destroyed last year in the Operation Midnight Hammer. And then this war not only didn't achieve any of those goals, it created a whole new problem, which is the Strait of Hormuz. And they turned this turn to be a main point of leverage Iran has because of the advantage of geography, which you can't change with more economic pressure, even if we assume that there is going to be immense economic pressure.

4:15So I'm just not sure if there's a strategy for this administration. And this also, I think, speaks to the frustration because I think President Trump entered the war assuming this will be a quick and easy win. Some compared it to Venezuela and that this would be a similar model. And it didn't happen. And I think now the frustration is why can't the U.S. be the absolute winner? And the Iranians have shown that they have some cards to play and some leverage. Well, Iran has said that if, you know, other countries side with the U.S. and adhere to the sanctions, that they will stop every drop of oil from making it out of the region, including, you know, closing other waterways besides the Strait of Hormuz.

4:55But Secretary Besson said the president is making phone calls, you know, trying to twist arms, getting other countries to side with the U.S. Your thoughts there? And by the way, might one of those calls be to China? Yeah. Very possible. So when we talk about Iran's leverage, look, there's the Strait of Hormuz, which is a very strategic waterway that Iran has the advantage of geography. You know, Iran is this vast coastline that's basically hugging that strait, if you look at the map. That's never going to change. And so for the U.S. to assume that with force and more pressure or phone calls, they can somehow reverse Iran's access, I think, is a mistake.

5:32And then talking about other waterways, Iran has allies across the region, including the Houthis, which have access to another strait, the Bab al-Mandab and the Red Sea. And that's going to be potentially another theater or another front that Iran can open in the war. So basically the way Iran has resisted this military supremacy against the U.S. and Israel is in what they call an asymmetric war. They have opened new fronts in this war in Lebanon, in the other straits, and they have essentially escalated horizontally. And they're showing that they're willing to do that even more. I just have to ask you to be brief here, but I'm curious.

6:08The president says Iran is completely collapsing. To the extent that you are hearing from people inside Iran, you host the Iran podcast. What are people there thinking, bracing for this? And again, we just have a few seconds here. Sure. So the reality is the economic pressure is real. And it's, you know, the main burden is on average Iranians, working class, middle class. Inflation is high and prices, you know, are going up rapidly. But has that produced any policy change as far as the government in past decades of U.S. sanctions? And, you know, this is a bipartisan policy. It just never brought policy change for Washington.

6:43And I don't think it's going to do it now. Nagar Mordazavi, senior fellow at the Center for International Policy, host of the Iran podcast. Check it out. Thank you so much, Nagar. Thanks, Robin.

6:59Coming up next, the U.S. slaps new tariffs on Canadian goods, and Canada promises to hit back. That's after the break.

7:13Support for this podcast and the following message come from Made in Cookware. President and co-founder Jake Halick shares why he was inspired by his family's fourth generation kitchen supply business. Growing up in a commercial kitchen at home really opened my eyes to bringing what was cool in restaurants into your home. And when you think about what we do today, we are asking these chefs for product ideas. We are designing products together with them. that we then realize a home cook can use as well. Learn more about Made in Cookware at M-A-D-E-I-N cookware.com. About$20 billion worth of Canadian goods will now cost even more.

7:52Negotiations between the U.S. and Canada crumbled last Friday evening, and the next day, President Trump's new 50 % tariffs went into effect. Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney now promises, quote, dollar-for-dollar retaliatory tariffs on the U.S. Here he is addressing Canadians over the weekend. We can't control the storm that blows in from Washington. We can, however, chart a new course by building Canada strong at home and diversifying our trading relationships abroad. Border states like Michigan will be impacted most. That state has a unique relationship with Canada through manufacturing and cross-border commerce, which author Elaine Weeks knows a lot about.

8:34She's a community activist and has written several books focused on the border cities of Detroit and Windsor. Here's her conversation with Scott Tong. The prime minister says he is standing up against Washington. About three out of four Canadians think he was right to end these talks. That's according to the Angus Reid Institute. From where you sit, why do you think most Canadians are behind him? It's a matter of principle and economic sovereignty. and we want to save our country as it is. We don't want to become the 51st Strait or a colony or any of the things that the Trump administration has planned for us.

9:14And to some degree, you and I talked about this about a month ago, we met in Windsor, about the president's words, that this is more than just about plywood and autos and stuff. Oh, definitely. It's all about taking Canada over as a resource country, essentially, because we have many things that he has his eye on. We're already providing a lot of energy products. But we have a lot of other things like critical minerals, land, water. You know, I think one of the next wars is going to be about water worldwide. So we have a lot of fresh water. Right. And indeed, in Alberta, Canada has a lot of crude oil that it sends to the lower 48.

10:05And yet, I mean, as Windsor knows well, a trade war hurts everybody. In Windsor, it has seen, since this trade war began in the second term, it's seen temporary shutdowns and giant auto plants, several thousand laid off in the auto and auto parts industries, unemployment in Windsor, much higher than the country of Canada as a whole. So, I mean, for all the resolve, it seems this is going to hurt more. It's going to continue to hurt. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we're like the canary in the coal mine down here. We feel economic impacts pretty well before anyone else in Canada, especially because we are so reliant and we are so integrated with the Detroit U.S.

10:51economy here due to our auto sector. And, you know, we make cars here, we assemble cars here, but parts go back and forth across the border up to eight times. And with new tariffs of 50 percent affecting, could really affect that in a dire fashion. So everyone's nervous here. But we're also really proud of the fact that our prime minister recognized at the last minute, he read the fine print and understood, hey, there's more to it than tariffs. And we're not going to let that happen here. Now, Elaine, your father used to be the mayor of Windsor. His name is on a waterfront park facing the Detroit skyline.

11:38He brought a big American auto plant to Windsor, Canada years ago. So do you yourself have mixed feelings about this moment? You're so close to Michigan. Yeah, it's really complicated. The feelings I have are my resolve not to go across the border has just deepened. I haven't been across since February 11th, 2025, because the fact that, you know, I don't appreciate the way we're being treated. And I can get everything I need here. But it is really hard to look across. we're only we're less than a mile away from Detroit and we can see everything that's going on we can hear things that are going on over there we can hear the music from the concerts etc so it's difficult it's difficult to um you know realize hey that's a basically become a wall again like it did during COVID when the border was shut down and we couldn't cross for quite I can't remember how many months, almost two years, it seemed like.

12:38So it is. And of course, I do love Detroit and I love the people there. I have a lot of friends there. I enjoy going over there for all kinds of things, sports, concerts, just enjoying Mexican food, for example, that we can't get here and so on. Now, the prime minister, Prime Minister Carney, has talked about, you know, Canada trying to find new partners. A few moments ago, he said Canada is now the best connected economy in the world. So kind of hedging, finding different partners for trading things. Does that make sense to you? Of course it does. Diversification is a strength. And every city, let alone, well, our whole country should be pursuing that avenue.

13:21Because if you rely on one country as a trading partner or one type of industry, you're going to be susceptible to anything that can potentially harm that relationship or that status. So I remember my dad was extremely concerned about the fact that Windsor has, and still has to this day, because it's difficult to get out of a one industry setup. And it's very hard to diversify our economy here. I understand, yeah. Elaine Weeks in Windsor, Ontario, Canada. Thank you so much once again. Oh, you're so welcome. Thank you. Coming up, tariffs, war and immigration policies are putting a lot of pressure on the U.S.

14:09economy. And now farmers are wondering if the juice is worth the squeeze. Stay with us.

14:19Support for this podcast and the following message come from Made in Cookware. President and co-founder Jake Halick shares why he was inspired by his family's fourth generation kitchen supply business. Growing up in a commercial kitchen at home really opened my eyes to bringing what was cool in restaurants into your home. And when you think about what we do today, we are asking these chefs for product ideas. we are designing products together with them that we then realize a home cook can use as well. Learn more about Made in Cookware at M-A-D-E-I-N cookware.com. Have you had to make some difficult choices while grocery shopping this summer?

14:56Maybe you've had a little sticker shock looking at the price of beef, which is inching closer to $7 a pound. Between immigration crackdowns, the war with Iran, and a globally harsh tariff regime, the American economy is feeling the squeeze of President Trump's policies. Farmers in particular say they're struggling to find workers. Scott gets perspective from Matt Teagarden, who's the CEO of the Kansas Livestock Association. This administration is pausing or halting a number of legal immigration programs for student visas, visas for family members of citizens, attempting a travel ban on a number of countries.

15:34Is there evidence of a shortage of agricultural workers that your members hire? There is. And we've been in this situation for several years. We just don't have enough workers for all the work that we have. And many of our members operate in rural Kansas, and from a population standpoint, generally declining. And so labor has been a challenge for years, and it is only getting worse. Matt, tell me about the timing of the shortage of workers that you see. That is, is this tightness in labor supply specific to this particular administration? Yes, yes, it is. We've seen this for a number of years, but certainly over the last 18 months or so, it has become more difficult to hire the workers that we need in animal agriculture in rural Kansas.

16:39Yeah. Do you know, is there a particular visa restriction under this administration that is causing this, or is it simply a matter of your members saying, we're really struggling to find workers now? Yeah, I think it's more the latter, but you see kind of a domino effect in many areas of Kansas. We've seen that. We've also seen some slowdown in processing of H-2A applications, and that has become more difficult. So it's just a number of things that... And just to pause here, right, the H-2A, I started to jump in, that is a particular kind of visa program that brings in a lot of agricultural workers.

17:24Is that right? That's correct, yes. The H-2A would be temporary ag workers, and so here for a season, a program that's really important for agriculture and important to be timely when those workers are needed. They're needed for harvest purposes or other specific jobs that are very time-sensitive. Matt, at least in Kansas where you are, is there an impact on production that is, you know, the supply of dairy, pork and beef for the American public? Yeah, labor workforce issues are a limiting factor. I think we have members who would expand the number of cows that they're milking if they felt like they had adequate, reliable labor force that they could count on for those additional cattle.

18:23I wonder, Matt, if you have any visibility into what is happening with regard to workers with legal status. That is, some of them perhaps, you know, their visas are being processed at a much slower rate or no longer being processed. In some cases, do you have any indication that they are just nervous about applying for these jobs, working these jobs? They're concerned about immigration rates, even for those who are legally authorized to work in this country? Yeah, I think we have seen over the past year, year and a half, when there have been, I can say this, when there have been enforcement actions in the region, that has had a chilling effect on the rest of the workforce, including those that are fully legal and authorized to be here.

19:23And briefly, Matt, the president late last week announced that the administration would lift tariffs on ground beef imports, you know, meat coming from outside the U.S. in an attempt to lower prices for American consumers. How is it's just happened? But how is that landing on domestic producers like your members? I think that has frustrated our members. Announcements like that, eliminating tariffs or reducing tariffs, will not encourage expansion of the cow herd. And so it really is sending mixed signals from the administration and is frustrating to our members, to livestock producers, cattle producers across the country.

20:11So what you're saying is, just to make sure I understand you is it sends a signal to domestic producers, why would I invest in more production if more is coming from overseas? That's correct. Okay. Okay. Matt Teagarden is CEO of the Kansas Livestock Association. Matt, thank you so much for the time. Much appreciated. I appreciate being with you. Here and Now, Any Time comes from NPR and WBOR Boston. Today's stories were produced by Jill Ryan, Hafsa Qureshi, and Kalyani Saxena. Today's editors were Mikaela Rodriguez and Here and Now's executive producer, Alan Price. Technical direction from Matt Reed and Nick Dusalt.

20:50Our theme music is by Mike Miscato, Max Liebman, and Chris Bentley. Our digital producers are Alison Hagen and Grace Griffin. Thanks for listening. We'll see you tomorrow.

21:08Thank you.