Howie Mandel: Comedian & TV host

30:05But I said, okay. And if I had to analyze what I was doing, you know, I said, okay, and it'll be fun. Maybe some people will show up and it would be funny for them at a comedy club. There's no reason in hell that somebody should be saying, ladies and gentlemen, Howie Mandel. so therein lies if there is a joke that's the joke the joke is Howie Mandel's coming up he's not a comedian he doesn't want to be a comedian he's never done this before he's not prepared it's just funny I can't believe you did that and that would be the joke that would be the joke that's as much thought as I put into it so I remember being in the back hall and somebody goes ladies and gentlemen, Howie Mandel, and I walk out, and I, you know, ta-da, and there's a big applause, and I'm just looking, and when I walk out, if you've ever been on a stage, it's blinding.

30:58It's blinding. It's not like you, you can't see the room. People think you could see them. You can't see the room. So these lights are in my face, and all I could see is the foam on the microphone in front of me, and I'm standing there like this, and at that time, you know, smoking was, you know, in small places was not frowned upon, and especially in clubs, so it's billowing smoke in my face, so it's this haze, and within seconds, the applause stops, and people sit and wait, and then I'm there, and I didn't have a plan. I didn't have a plan, and I looked down, you could see the front row, and there's people smoking and looking up at you like, okay, funny boy.

31:50And the adrenaline, the embarrassment, the fear, the terror, just going, oh, my God. Like, I should have thought of something. And that's when I started going, okay, okay, okay, all right, all right, all right, okay. And they started giggling at my adrenaline and fear, and they started giggling, and I didn't really under, I wasn't in tune enough. They all started laughing and I went, what, what? No, tell me, tell me, tell me, what? Okay, well, here's something, here's something. You want to hear something? And I heard myself say, you want to hear something? You know, I'd make a noise. Or I would do things like, just like, bad dad jokes.

32:33I'd go, it's an inside joke. and I used to carry a bag that was in the shape of a hand. It was a handbag. So I thought, it's a handbag, and they laughed at that. And then I didn't know what, I was terrified. I put my hands in my pocket, and because I have OCD and I'm afraid of germs, I was carrying always rubber gloves that I would buy at the drugstore, latex gloves. I pulled out one of the gloves, and they're just standing there. Okay, okay, okay. And I don't know why. I just pulled it over my head. I'd never done that before. I'd never done it at home. I'd never done it anywhere. I pulled it over my head and over my nose, and I started breathing in and out from the nose, and I didn't realize.

33:12The fingers were going up and down, and I heard the audience laughing. And then I realized, oh, it's breathing. So I started blowing it up more and more and more, and I kept blowing it, and they were roaring. And then I popped it off my head, and everybody applauded, and my natural instinct went, whoa, this is a closer. Good night. And I ran off stage, and Mark Breslin was standing in the hall, and he goes, you've got to come back and do that tomorrow and I go do what? He goes do what you did. I go what did I tell me what I did. Tell me what I did. He goes you just be you and that was the beginning and again that's another recapture like we talked about in about Candid Camera.

33:53It felt so good. I didn't know what it was but that adrenaline being in the moment having that thrill it's like being on a roller coaster and having, I think it's 150 people fit in that room. And it was packed because it was the age of the boom of stand-up comedy. 150 people that I didn't know. It was so loud, so joyous. And now that feeling that I had with my mom and dad and in front of the camera was all coming at me, for me. And it's the first time I felt collective engagement. You know, a wonderful, bright, glorious, you know, kind of joyous engagement. And I chase that all the time. You were concerned, I think, about not being able to replicate that feeling again.

34:44But you end up, I guess the rest is kind of history. At some point you end up at. But that's why, you know, I am worried about not replicating that. And that's why I don't mind. And now what I love and I go for that adrenaline is going up, trying something I never tried before. You know, now I have to get past to when somebody goes, ladies and gentlemen, Mandel chance, Howie Mandel. There's a there's a chance that there's a few people there who have some expectation that know me, that recognize me. So they're going to applaud and enjoy. And for a couple of minutes, they'll give me, you know, easy laughs or whatever.

35:20but I like when I'm trying something and it's not going anywhere, that's where that adrenaline starts again. I go, oh my God, it could be embarrassing. You still feel that? Yeah, I crave it. And I go, oh, this is bad, this is bad. And then if I can pull myself out of that and win that, there's that joy again. And an example I give in my book, I didn't do it purposely, but the joy is, and every comic will tell you this, you know, you can have a room of 5 ,000 people roaring in laughter and loving. And if you see one person sitting there with a look of disdain, not enjoying it, it becomes all about that one person.

36:14You know, all that noise goes away and it's all like, what the hell is wrong with you? Like, why don't you don't like me? So I remember specifically I was at Radio City Music Hall and in the front row, there was a guy not even looking in my direction. And not, I didn't think he was laughing, you know, just kind of like rocking a little bit and looking in another direction. I thought, like, he just looks like a guy that says, the person next to me brought me here, and I cannot wait to get away from this, whatever this is. So much so that, again, in the moment, I was doing great. I was killing. I was doing great.

36:59And, you know, on paper, you shouldn't do this. You should keep the rhythm going. But it's just who I am. I went, what's with the guy in the blue sweater? I don't know if that's what it was, but there's a guy in the blue sweater up here who won't even look at me. And he doesn't seem to be laughing. But at least if you're not going to laugh, you came to a show, look at me. And the person sitting next to him mouths to me, he's blind. And as I do, just out of habit, anything that is said to me or mouth to me, just so that I can take in and process. I repeat loud. So the whole audience, just because you're in the second balcony and I'm talking to somebody in the front row or is doing something, you're going to know.

37:47And she went, he's blind. And I went, he's blind. And then in unison, it hit me and 6 ,000 or 5 ,000 people in the audience. They went, ooh. And I went, oh, that kind of, I just made fun of somebody who has special needs and he's blind and it's probably not good. It's probably not good in the realm of, but I do have a question. I do have a question. And she said, what's your question? And I said, why, why on earth would you buy a ticket to a front row for a blind person? What a waste of money. This blind person could be sitting in the second balcony for half the price. And the show would be exactly the same.

38:43And that got a laugh. You know, but it was like, why would you buy? It is more to sit up front. Why are you paying more for this person, for a blind person? And that got a laugh. And that one, out of that, no pun intended, dark moment, you know, authentically found a way kind of out of that. And that feels better than the constant wave of laughter. So you moved from Canada to L.A. at some point for a period of time, your life revolved around the comedy store. But why was a professional low point for you the three weeks you opened for Diana Ross? Oh, my gosh. So here I am at Caesars Palace. You know, I don't have much of a...

39:37I'm not seasoned, you know, as far as I haven't spent much time on stage. I don't have a lot of experience. I've never been to Vegas. here at Caesar's Palace. And the voice of God, as they call it, the announcer would go, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to Caesar's Palace for an evening of Diana Ross. And it was deafening. The roar, the excitement, the anticipation was deafening. If you listened really closely in the midst of that roar. But first, the very funny Howie Mandel, which nobody heard. And I would come out in front of the curtain. You know, she had like, I don't know, a 30-piece orchestra and everything.

40:25So the stage was set, the lighting's a smoke machine. And there was a curtain that closed in front of that. And then there was like three feet of lip left in front of the stage. And I'd come out. Nobody knew me. I hadn't popped yet. I'd only done the Merv Griffin show and the Mike Douglas show. That's where, and make me laugh. and then I got a call from Gene Simmons. Kiss was at its peak. I don't know how he got my number and said, I saw you on Merv, you're a very funny man. Would you like to be an opening act for my girlfriend? I went, yes. Who's your girlfriend? And it was Diana Ross. That's how I got that job.

41:04I remember like even on the first night because we were playing at Casino, they told me I had to do like 20 minutes or 30 minutes. I can't remember exactly what the time was, but say it was 20 minutes. And the guy said, do you understand what I'm saying? And I said, yes. you said to do 20 minutes and he said no I want you to understand I go what am I supposed to understand and he goes not 21 not 19 20 and what I learned at that time you know the key is no matter how big the star no matter who was there the show was perfectly timed they they hired and paid Diana that huge money because they wanted all those people in the building to go out and play in the casino that's where they made their money they didn't make money promoting shows they I made money, you know, having people play games.

41:49So if I was doing great and went on for another 10 minutes, that's 10 minutes that those people are not in the casino. So I couldn't go a minute longer. Her show was perfectly timed. So that was that. And I remember I told somebody to tap behind the curtain when there was three minutes left because I knew it took me three minutes to take my glove out. My clothes, there was always the glove. but I would go out to silence everything I said, silent. I remember a lady in the front row would be hitting my, hitting my, and get, get off, get off. Or they'd start chanting, we want Diana, we want Diana, like in the middle of my act.

42:30And it's so embarrassing, I'm standing there with a glove on my head and it's silent. I remember one time, so I hear the tap and it couldn't come fast enough, I'm soaked. and I pop the glove off and I go, ladies and gentlemen, Diana Ross. And they roar at that. And I turn around and somebody's supposed to page the curtain and he's holding the curtain shut. And I'm standing there and the applause dies down and I'm standing, I'm trying to get out. I'm trying to get out. And I go, I go, what's wrong? And they go, you have another five minutes. So I, he didn't tap. I was just hearing and I wasn't allowed to leave early either because Miss Ross wasn't ready to come out.

43:09so I it's just like it was horrible and I turned around I didn't have anymore and suffered again and then said now Diane Ross but I went every night every night two shows a night for a whole week 14 shows dead dead silence and they had hired me uh for two weeks and they uh they said Miss Ross would like to see you in her dressing room before the show tonight sir And I said, okay. And I've never been more happy in thinking that I'm about to be fired because this definitely, there's nobody in their right mind that could think this was going well. And she just said, I just wanted to say hi, and I just wanted to say how funny I think you are.

43:55You are so funny, and I'd like to hold you over for another two weeks. I went, thank you. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. and she held me over i ended up doing uh three weeks of two shows a night 42 shows with her it's crazy she always loved me and always supported me i just went to her 75th birthday party um but they like one night i think sony japan rented out the room you know to see diana ross she's an international star not a soul spoke english in the room and i still went on That was probably my best night. People were giggling. They didn't know what I was saying. They didn't know that I did better.

44:40I wanted to leave the business after that. I thought that was the end. I know you once got paid$150 for headlining nine straight shows, but one moment that I think you felt you were most grossly underpaid was when you got$25 ,000 to perform at a bachelor party. I got more than that. Oh, did you? Yes. I had already started doing St. Elsewhere, and I had already been playing to 10 ,000 people. So I get a call from the comedy store, and they said, would you do a live show at somebody's house, a house party? And I went, no, I think I'm past house parties at this point. And they hung up, and then they call back, and they go, there's got to be a price that you'll do a house party for.

45:32and I said well there's a price for everything and I threw out a crazy number more than what you said which I think what you said is crazy you know for to come to a house party but I threw out a lot more than that and then they call me back and they go okay and then I thought no this is a joke I go well okay it's got to be cash before I have to have the cash before I even show up at this party. They said, okay. They call me a couple hours later to go to the comedy store, and I go pick up bags of cash. And I go, oh my God. And Saturday night at the top of the canyon in Hollywood, they tell me the directions to get there.

46:16And then I get scared. I think, like, are they trying to kidnap me? Maybe I'm on TV. Maybe I don't know what they're going to do. I mean, like I say to my wife, would you like to come? You know, because it's a surprise party. And she goes, no, I'll stay home. But call me. She didn't want to come. I didn't know it was a bachelor party. So anyway, I get in the car and I drive up. It's a dark canyon. I know I'm really close to the address. There's a scantily clad woman who flags me down. I stop. She goes, are you Howie Mandel? I said, yeah. She goes, this is the party. I'll take your car. Just go in through these hedges because you're a surprise.

46:57And there's a little pool house right here. you'll hear the party just hide in there until you hear ladies and gentlemen howie mandel like okay and at that time still i had a lot of props i was the carrot top of that time so i had like my gloves and my handbag and i'm putting on these this weird nose and things like that i'm standing the door opens i'm in the bathroom and some guy walks in totally drunk out of his mind and doesn't say anything to me. It's just a room, like there's a toilet and just a sink. And I'm by the sink and I'm putting things on in the mirror. He doesn't say anything and he just stands there and he's using the toilet and I'm just standing there.

47:41And it's just uncomfortable. And then he leaves. And then I hear somebody go, ladies and gentlemen, Howie Mandel. And I walk out with my handbag and my goofy and I go, okay. And I look, it's 15 naked guys. I don't know, maybe eight naked women doing things that you usually, you know, had to rent a tape to see or in a hotel room. And anyway, it was like happening right there. I didn't know, did I walk through the wrong door? Like, is there a party? No, this was the party. And there's a guy right mid, mid being entertained going, do the Bobby voice, do the Bobby voice. You can't even talk. Do the Bobby voice.

48:35You know, I'm standing there and I do like a half hour with all this going on and go good night. And I leave.

48:46two three weeks later i'm in a mall and a woman comes up to me says you're howie mandel from saint elsewhere right and i go yeah she goes oh i'm such a big fan and and my husband told me they had you perform at his friend's bachelor party and i look way in the back about 40 feet and he's going And I realized they paid a fortune so men wouldn't be lying to their significant others about. So what would happen at the bachelor party? Oh, we had Howie Mandel do an act. And that's what I was. So I'm a cover. I was a cover. It was the CEO of a big corporation. I don't want to say. Yes. Yes. That still exists.

49:27You mentioned, you know, your wife not going to the party. We obviously talked to both of you yesterday. And I kind of asked a variation of this then, but like you've said she's the key to your success. Absolutely. Why? Because I am, I feel, constantly surrounded by, and I don't mean this in a bad way, but turmoil. You know, it is. It's tumultuous. You know, whatever it is. Bad decision. They want you over here. You've spent the day with me. It's a busy... When I need anything and when I am distressed, when I'm confused, when I don't know where to turn, when I'm nervous, just turning to her, she will give me the words and the strength and the path to go.

50:28And always has. more in personal life, but equally in professionally. You know, the first time I, my philosophy is say yes to everything because everything's an opportunity. And even if it's not an opportunity to be successful, it's an opportunity to learn something, even if it doesn't work out. The first thing that I opposed, no, the one, the biggest standout in career-wise is that I said, no, this is stupid, this will not work, this is, she made me do. It's also the biggest success of my career. There's no bigger success in my career than Deal or No Deal. Up until Deal or No Deal, I had a very segmented career.

51:17The people who knew St. Elsewhere and when it was huge didn't know Bobby's World. The people who watched Saturday morning cartoons and knew Bobby's World didn't know that I was a stand-up comic. You know, the people who watched HBO and cable at the time and watched those specials and loved that, weren't the moms and the five-year-olds that were watching TV, the people who watched St. Elsewhere were watching serious drama, you know, stories at night, weren't the people that were necessarily watching Saturday morning cartoons or stand-up comedy. My inbox was always flooded before the Internet. with, I don't think a day went by when somebody didn't ask.

51:59I have a bet with my wife or with my husband that Fiscus, which was the name of the character on St. Elsewhere, is not the same guy that blows the glove up on the head. Or Howie Mandel is not the guy that does the voice for Bobby's World. They were really, when I did Deal or No Deal, and it was the first time I was just myself, I wasn't being funny, I wasn't reciting lines, I was just showing up and hopefully, you know, steering people to a better life. It was the first time that all those audiences, they were all the same. There was family viewing, you know. People were watching with their kids, the people that watched, the mothers that watched Saturday morning, people who watched St.

52:38Elsewhere were watching Deal. Nobody didn't watch Deal or No Deal. You know, everybody knew who it was. So much so that it has even become a vernacular now. You know, when you watch anything, When you read anything in the paper right now and there's some negotiating going on internationally, they go deal or no deal or we need Howie Mandel for this. There isn't a month that goes by where I don't see it quoted somewhere. And she is partially responsible. Totally responsible. If she didn't make me do it, make me do it. Because she didn't. She said do it. And I said, no, I don't think it's a good.

53:11She would not hear of me not doing it. So, you know, talking to both of you guys yesterday, you've been married 46 years. I think at one point you were concerned if the marriage would last. But I mean, I said this to you yesterday, you look like kind of giddy school kids. Why do you think the relationship has lasted? Because I don't analyze. I don't think I don't analyze anything. Why do I think it's lasted her? She is the strongest, most level-headed person I have ever met. She's my best friend. Any relationship is tough. It's always tough. Your relationship with your own children, work relationships, marriage, employment.

53:58It's tough, and there's ebbs and flows. But we are both incredibly committed to whatever we take on in life, you know? And then ultimately under that, which is mine and her panacea to life, is the ability to laugh. you know and you know life's not always easy and in my darkest moments we have had the most guttural deepest hardest laughs and not everybody's into that I think that more people live for how they think they should live how they think they're going to be perceived, how they were told to live, as opposed to we share this innate ability to kind of live authentically. I don't know what the word is.

55:05And I think that shows itself by laughing when most people wouldn't laugh. Well, so I was talking to Terri, and she said the kind of hardest thing that you guys have been through as a family is your grandson's leukemia. And I'm curious if you had any reflections on the conversation I had with you and Jacqueline yesterday. You're going to air it, and you'll air it. I felt guilty last night. Because you asked very professionally and honorably and nicely, because it is part of my life, if you can ask us about it. We have not talked about it. And I felt guilty as a parent. The reason she's on this show is because of me.

55:56You know, you're doing a piece on me. And I felt guilty for being part of the equation that put her in the spot where you're asking her questions that are upsetting. And as a child, as a parent, you don't want to see your child upset. So I felt guilty at the end of the day that I told you when we were talking, you just want every moment for your child to be happy, comfortable, and wonderful. And I said, you know, Graham is doing a piece on me. He wants to talk to you. He asked if you could talk about your son. And I'm asking you, and she went, okay. But why is she in this position? And, you know, there was a moment yesterday when you were talking to her that wasn't fun for her.

56:58And why is that? Because I'm doing this. You shouldn't have to feel. I actually feel that there is some upside to people knowing just because of how it's worked out for me. And people knowing that I suffer and I have mental health issues, people continuously come my way and say thank you for being open about it. And many people are suffering with a family member or an ill child. And maybe, and I know, it is good for people to hear that they're not alone and other people are, you know, are going through the same thing. So it's important for people to hear it. But then there's also a side. It is the main side.

57:41I'm a father. Before I'm a comedian, before I'm, you know, a host, before I'm anything, the only thing, the first thing I am, the first thing, even at this point, even before I'm a husband, I'm a father. You know, you're always a father. You don't always, the bond, I feel it in my heart, of being a husband, you know, you can decide not to be a husband anymore. You could leave your wife. You can never not be a parent. You're always a father. And that is my blood. That is my soul. That is my reason. So, you know, I don't want, when she hurts, I hurt. What stands out to you most from that Hawaii trip?

58:31It's paralyzed, you know. It's just paralyzing, but you have to function. You have to make decisions. It's paralyzing. It was the most unexpected...

58:50It's a paralyzing moment I would imagine in anybody's life. Us. I was in the room.

59:06It was just me and Jackie. We took him to the hospital thinking he had the flu. You know, and then we've been on this dark roller coaster ever since for years now. What were the key steps in getting through that? Well, you know, you have to make decisions. You are called to ask to make decisions that are, you don't know if you're making the right decision. Most people, like what we were in Maui, and then they had to air vacuum really quickly to Oahu. And the people in Oahu, who were tremendous and wonderful, had a plan of action. And the plan of action did not include flying home, because he was not in good shape, not good enough to fly.

1:00:09But then we wanted to come home. Their plan of action was for us to stay there for six months and begin. In fact, it was so drastic that he had to, within 24 hours, he had his first shot of chemotherapy. I mean, boom, bang. They wanted to attack it right away. and his levels weren't great for flying, so we thought we couldn't come home. And then we called some people here

1:00:44and they had a different plan of action. Now you have conflicting plans of action. It's up to you to make the decision. And that's a really harrowing on so many levels, you know? How did you figure it out? I don't know if I figured it out. I just, you know, I was so torn because we all don't know what the right answer is. You know, if I have an opinion, it's scary enough to think that your opinion is wrong. If I have a different opinion than my daughter, do I talk her into something? And then it goes like, then that's my fault. Should she make the decision? I don't know. I don't even know. I can't even revisit it.

1:01:39It's just, it was the most harrowing, mind-boggling, paralyzing horror show I've ever been part of. But you know there's probably somebody watching this who's in a similar sort of situation. and from kind of your experience having been in it, like what would you share in terms of how to navigate it? I think that you try to inform yourself as much as possible. Like I don't know all the experts and I don't know that. I just, I live here in LA. I know people connected to, Children's Hospital here is wonderful. I called friends, you know, people like Byron Allen and Jimmy Kimmel, who have both dealt with that hospital and were incredibly open and helpful.

1:02:43And I know that people watching going, well, I don't have those. But it's not even about the celebrities. It was just about just talking to a different oncologist and say, if these are the facts, how would you deal with it? And then you talk to that oncologist and you go, if these are the facts, how would you deal? And when two people. Because for a moment you thought he might not make it. Well, that's always a. Yeah. The lesson that I take away is you have to be your own advocate. And that is try to collect as much information as you can without unbiased information. So I have that. They said this.

1:03:26This is what they do. This is why. this is what they do. This is why everybody's intention is really good. Everybody is probably capable, but there's always another path. There's always another path. Know the paths and then make your decision based on the information that you have. Don't ever make a decision based on no information. Yeah. Or because they told me or because they're a doctor. do things that it'll make sense to you and have them make it sense make sense to you i personally advocated and and pushed to to bring him home here only because i don't say it's better than there it's they're busier here they do it more you know so i felt like the expertise just because that's what they do, you know.

1:04:29On an island, they do it. It's the best place they have, and it's probably good, and he probably would have done great there. But I felt like I wanted to get him to a place where they do it 10 times more. And there's a path to recovery and all of that, and obviously you wouldn't wish it on anybody, but Terry did tell me the beautiful thing about it was the family coming together. You've obviously had an endless amount of good fortune in your life, and I don't mean to be indelicate with this, but you've had a bit of a rough go recently. Your mom has Alzheimer's. How has that been for you navigating?

1:05:12That's devastating. I'm not navigating it. It's devastating. My mother is, you know, I lost my father in 1989. My parents were my support system. Before I even knew I had, or could articulate that I had mental health, that's where the laughter came from, that's where the support came from, that's where the love came from, that's what everything I did, and they were the biggest fans, always. And my dad would come to every show, and when he passed, he passed at 63 years old, I wanted to leave comedy, and I ended up, I kept going. Because he'd be on the side of the page. On the wings. I still look at the side after, get a laugh to look for him.

1:05:55And I never missed a day, up until two years ago, of speaking to my mom. Every day of my life, I called my mom. And she's had Alzheimer's for about 15 years. Yeah, but it's been about the last two years or three years, she doesn't know who I am anymore. It's hard. You know, your mother, there's this woman sitting there who has no idea who I am. She can't talk anymore, but, you know, it's just really hard. I call my brother every day, and he's over there, and he visits her every day, and I fly in, and I see her. You guys will often go together. Yeah, I sit with her. you know but i could tell she doesn't recognize who i am sometimes scary for her to have this man here you know for years when it began i tried to find the humor you know that got me through there were some funny stories when she first you know i i had to put her in assisted living because she wasn't taking care of herself.

1:07:11She loved roses, flowers. I remember her birthday. She had dementia, but we still talked every day, and that was it. And I remember for, she's like 93 now, but I think for her 90th birthday, it was like three years ago, four years ago, I sent her a bouquet of flowers or a dozen roses every hour on the hour. I did it for like 10 hours, so she had 10 dozen roses. And she didn't call. Nobody called. Like, she could still call me. She could press a button and dial. I'm sending her these flowers, and she's not even acknowledging me. I called her at the end of the day. And when you have dementia, she's not the same as she was.

1:07:58She was always, I mean, she taught me, if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all, you know. And she was always pleasant, even if people weren't pleasant to her. And she was a brilliant woman. She was the number one real estate agent in Canada for a few years as far as selling condos. And she's very successful. Even my friends had a problem. They would go and talk to her. And this woman is now living in assisted living. And I called her at the end of the day. And I go, Mom, how are you? And she said, you can bleep this, because she never talked like this. She said, get me out of this f***ing place.

1:08:34And I go, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, why are you, what's wrong? She goes, the gardener seems to be storing all his flowers in my apartment.

1:08:49So these kind of moments kind of negate the pain of dealing with whatever you're dealing with. You had said after your father passed, you didn't believe in the afterlife until that moment. No. So he passed. I have no belief system in, you know, ghosts, life after death, cult, mediums. You know, people don't know what to say when they encounter somebody who just lost one. So people are giving me their condolences. I said, somebody handed me this book. It's called We Don't Die by George Anderson. And said, read this. This will make you feel better. And I thought it was a really nice gesture. I wouldn't read it.

1:09:39I put it in my nightstand. About a month after my dad had passed, I couldn't fall asleep. I was up at night, and I tried to bore myself by reading a book. And I found this book in the nightstand, which I never opened. And I started reading it, and I was fascinated. Fascinated by his stories. He had encephalitis when he was a kid, and he went into a coma, and the doctor said if he should survive, he'll be severely paralyzed. Miraculously, he came out of his coma, and the only thing is he heard voices. And then the kids would bully him at school because he would talk to things that weren't there, and he got diagnosed as schizophrenic, and then they went and tested him and he was with like a Jewish doctor or something like that.

1:10:31I'm trying to remember the story because this is like 35 years ago. And then the story was that the doctor tested him and he said, do you always hear these voices? No, only when they're here. Is there anybody here? Yeah, there's somebody behind you. And she's going, and the doctor turned white because this kid would have no way of knowing, this Catholic kid, but his grandmother had just passed and she always went, which means crazy. She always did that behind him and then they did brain scans and it would light up and then certain cops would call, like he got known in the area and he could find bodies.

1:11:04So I said, my entrepreneurial spirit took over, I called my lawyer and I tied up the rights to the book and I was going to sell a series. And this is before Sixth Sense. This is before The Medium was another show. This is before all those. And I wanted the rights to George Anderson It had nothing to do with my father. I wanted the rights to George Anderson to this book, because I thought it would be a great series, and somebody who's a victim of doing this and solving crimes. That was my idea. And we went and took him to a meeting. That day, I was having stomach aches. This was before the meeting.

1:11:47I went to the doctor. The doctor told me that I was eating, it might be gluten. You just don't eat bread. I went, okay, I won't eat bread. I don't want to eat gluten. And that's it. Anyway, I went back and I had these meetings. I flew him in. He didn't know it was me. I did it under another name because I didn't want him not to do it because I'm a silly comedian. And I was going to take this pretty seriously. Not that I believed it, but I thought it's a great story. And we go out for dinner. And, you know, I go to take a piece of bread. And he goes, your father is mad at you. And I go, why? He goes, he says, you know why you shouldn't touch the bread.

1:12:26I go, what? He goes, your father is talking to me and saying, you were told not to eat bread. Who told me that? Your father says a doctor told you not to eat bread. And I, I went, are you kidding? Are you like how? I believe in coincidences. I believe I'm a public person. You can maybe find things. there's no way that somebody was in my doctor's office or my doctor called my doctor wouldn't know i had a meeting with this guy it'd be ridiculous information to exchange that was the first time i realized are you kidding me and now i feel him around me all the time my father i'm aware of it and then when i think about things that happened up until that point which i clocked up to coincidence, hope, weirdness, science.

1:13:22We're not that. It's, you know, science says energy cannot be destroyed. It can only change forms. And there is an energy in each and every one of us. I don't know how many times you've been sitting in a room doing work and you feel like somebody's looking at me. You turn around, your wife's there. She didn't make a sound, but you knew she was there because her energy this is electrical we are energy she's there well where does that go when this shell fades it's really weird and I tell the story about I was in the room and my father passed and uh they left me with him for a little bit and uh then the nurse came in after maybe 15 minutes after he had passed, everything went flatline.

1:14:10And they told me he had passed and the nurse came in and they were removing all the hoses and wires and lines and everything. They're removing that. And for whatever reason, and I thought up until this George Anderson thing, I thought like, I've never been around somebody who died, but you know, and it's just my imagination, but he's here. He's here. He's not dead. He's not dead. He's here. and I knew that with the in the core but I believe that that's just my hope my dream he's here and the nurse went no no no he's gone he's gone honey you just don't worry he's no I go he's here and for whatever reason I screamed dad and he was in the he came back into his body and he went oh like that.

1:15:01And I went, no, no, no, you can go, you can go, you can go. And he did the last breath, even the nurse who had been taking out the hoses was taken aback. And even after that, I thought, okay, here's, here's my explanation for what that was. We have scientific arguments all the time. What is death? Is it this when your heart no longer beats? Is it when there's no brain function? Like, we don't know what that, I would imagine that for, you know, you know that after you bury somebody, their nails still grow, cells still die, and you still grow, things still happen, you know, biologically. So I thought, okay, so maybe in the hearing way, you know, he's gone, but that was the last little bit.

1:15:46They just weren't able to monitor that. It wasn't the occult. It wasn't him floating over his body and coming back in. That was it. But then when I heard about the bread, I went, okay. I felt him in the room, and he was trying to give me a sign. You know, don't worry, Howie, I'm here. You said about your father, he was the greatest, most optimistic father anybody could have ever had. Yeah, man. My whole family, my dad particularly. particularly, but optimism was also our fuel. Always trying new things, always investing in a new business, crazy ideas, and just having fun with life, just playing games, playing tennis, buying a new album.

1:16:35You got to hear that. It was just the feeling in my house was always upbeat. Why do you think you got your entrepreneurial spirit from him? because he was always trying things. See, I remember we would be in the living room packing envelopes because he started this company called Zip Grip, and Zip Grip was a clothesline where you didn't have to use clothespins. And it was basically a two-line pulley system, and when it went like this, the lines would cross, and you could put your sheet. You know, when I was growing up, the backyard was always filled with clotheslines, right? Your mother would do the laundry, and then there would be, like, sheets and everything hanging out to dry in the fresh air.

1:17:15Not the winter. In the winter was the basement. But we didn't have a dryer, so clotheslines were really big when I was a kid. He came up with Zip Grip, and then he had invested in a company that had soft water. Then he invested in a bar in Stratford, Ontario, Canada, which is well known for the Shakespearean Festival. He decided that counter-programming would be great, So he hired a stripper, Princess Glow. And Princess Glow was a 350-pound naked dancer who would take a bath in a bubble bath and then get out of the champagne glass and walk around the room and drop her soapy giant on bald men's heads.

1:18:05It was always like bizarre and fun and he liked games, he liked toys, he liked not sitting still. He loved comedy. He would hang with my friends longer than I did. You know, when I was on the road, he came on every date with me. Well, you know, all the dates that I played. And I'd go to bed, you know, one, two in the morning. And if we were in a casino, he'd stay up another hour with all my friends. And, you know, he was like a kid. He was a kid. Perhaps there's connectivity between that positivity and perseverance, because you've obviously had to demonstrate that repeatedly throughout your career.

1:18:45In the example, there's connectivity to that in Johnny Carson. The first time his chief booker, Jim McCauley, saw you do your set. He told me I will never. Not only am I not going to put you on the show, you will never be on the show. You are not what Johnny likes. You are the antithesis of what I would put on. You know, they wanted monologists. I was just this crazy... He said, there's no way. You can show me a different set of what you do. You're not going to be doing our show. And you're thinking what at the time? Devastated. You know, because that was, I told you before, that was the litmus test for making it as a comedian.

1:19:29You could be on every other show. You could do an HBO special, a young comedian special. You could be on St. Elsewhere. I like, and even to this day, if you wanted to title this, Today We Talked to Howie Mandel, I would say, I want you to say, if you could only say one, Today We Talked to Comedian Howie Mandel. I don't want you to say we talked to host Howie Mandel. I love being a comedian. That's what I am. And I'm a comedian, a stand-up comic, who happens to have hosted shows, acted in shows, bought real estate. I'm a comedian. And that's what I am. And so to be told that at that time, what would mark you as a bona fide comedian in the eyes of the public will not give you that mark, will not give you that badge, was devastating.

1:20:29When you walked around and somebody saw you and they said, what do you do? And you say, I'm a comedian. I do comedy. And they would go, well, have you been on Johnny? And if you said no, then, oh, okay, you're trying to be a comedian. The moments that were most impactful to you personally of Joan Rivers changing everything for you? So Joan Rivers started guest hosting on The Tonight Show and became even more popular than Johnny. that on those nights when she guest hosted, the ratings were up more, more than just the general ratings of Johnny Carson. So I thought, okay, so I'm never going to do Johnny, but I could do The Tonight Show if, you know, one of the other hosts likes me.

1:21:18And how am I going to do that? So Joan lived in New York, and anybody that was hosting The Tonight Show would come into the comedy store to work out their monologues and their sets. And Joan would come in every time she was going to do the Tonight Show for the week or for the day or for whatever. She would come before that to the comedy store. So my great plan was maybe if she sees me, if she sees me, I'll go on like right before her. And if she likes me, maybe I can say, hey, can I get a spot on the Tonight Show? She was coming in one time. Good plan. What? Good plan. Good plan. Not stupid. And so, and I called Mitzi and I said, you know, she's coming in on Thursday night.

1:22:02Can you put me on right ahead of her? Is there any way you can put me on right ahead of her? Mitzi being the legendary owner of the store. The owner of the club. Polly's mom. Polly's mom. Yeah. And she said, yeah. As luck would have it, that Thursday rolls around and I wake up with like 104 fever. I have the flu or something. And I couldn't move. I mean, I'm cold sweats and I'm shaking and I feel nauseous and I can't move. What is the luck of the draw? And I go, hopefully by that time I'll feel better. As luck would have it, I didn't feel better. But I go, this is my one shot. I get into the car.

1:22:41Terry's trying to tell me not to, not to. Now she's saying no, you know. But I get in the car and I drive and I'm shaking through Laurel Canyon in my car. and I get to sunset, and I'm standing there, and I'm feeling so sick, and then, I don't know how I'm gonna do this, but they go, ladies and gentlemen, Howie Mandel. And I walk up on the stage, and as soon as I walk up on the stage, as soon as that light hits me, it's adrenaline, you know? I get excited, and I just do 10 minutes and crush. I do great, I do great, I'm so happy. She walks by me, because she's the next one that's coming up. And as she walks by me, she goes, Chronic migraine.

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1:24:47Stitch Fix. Get started today at stitchfix.com. I want to hug you. I'm going to hug you. I'm coming in for a hug. Very funny. You're very funny. Thank you. And I walk off, and I'm going to wait, and then I'm going to confront her after. So she goes on, and she does her set, and then she finishes, and then she comes off, and she's sitting and talking to comics and Mitzi, And I'm outside in the stairwell, and, you know, the adrenaline of my show has worn off. I start to feel all shaky again. I can't even stand anymore. I'm dizzy. I sink down onto the—I'm just sitting against the wall in the steps like I'm going to die, you know.

1:25:28And it takes forever, forever. And I'm just sitting there like I think I'm going to die. And I don't know how long. It's like a half hour after she finished her set. I'm just lying on the stairs. And she comes out through that curtain. And I go, hi. And she goes, you were so funny. I go, thank you. She goes, have you ever been on The Tonight Show? And I said, no. And it's my birthday this week. She goes, call Billy Samoth tomorrow and give me a number. And I called. That's her manager. I called Billy. She goes, she loved you. Will you come on this week? And I said, this is it. So now I can say, when somebody says, have you been on Johnny?

1:26:08I'm still going to say, yeah. But I've been on the Tonight Show. I go on the Tonight Show with her on panel. I do great. The morning after, I get a call from Jim McCauley, the guy who said, you'll never be on. And he said, Johnny watched the show last night. See, I'm sure that Johnny was watching because Joan was getting these crazy-ass ratings. He goes, Johnny was watching the show last night. He loved you. Is there any way you can come on next week? I went, yeah. Now, here's the thing. Jim McCauley was very protective of his boss and the thing. So he went over, step by step, everything that I would say.

1:26:50I would do the panel. I want you to do this. I want you to do this. I want you to do this. And I felt like I'm not good when somebody's trying to control me, you know, or I have to think about what order I have to talk in. Like, even now, people do pre-interviews. You know, I'm not... I'll have Rich do the pre-interview and he'll give me the, the, but I'll go off and I'll, I'll talk where I want to, because I need to be, I'm not good when I'm totally scripted, unless I'm on St. Elsewhere. I can't be Howie and be totally scripted. So he gave me a bunch of things to do. And I said, you know what, this is it.

1:27:27I'm doing Johnny. I'm going to break the rule. So I'll do those things, but I'm going to do one thing that's not planned. I'll do one thing that's not planned, and this thing will either solidify me or I'll never do it again. But you've got to take these big swings. You've got to go for a home run. And it's like it was yesterday, because I could feel that energy, that fear that I had the first night of yuck yucks, that energy, that fear that I have the first night of doing anything. I was on. It was great. He introduced me. I walked through the curtain. I'm sitting there. It's Johnny Carson. There's Doc Severinsen.

1:28:07There's Ed McMahon sitting beside me. I'm there. And it's going well, and they're laughing at things that I'm saying, and I have a bag of stuff like I always had. And I say to him, do you like 3D movies? And I see Jim off to the side going, what's this? I didn't plan this. He goes, yeah. So I had these 3D glasses and I give him 3D glasses. And I reach into my bag and I pull out like a little stuffed animal and my heart is just dropped into my stomach. And in real time I just go, whoom, and I whip it. I'm closer than I am to him to you. I whip it right at his face. He's wearing the glasses and I throw this thing right in Johnny Carson's face.

1:28:51And it seemed like an eternity. It's almost like you're going to hear a heartbeat. Like, is he just gonna... And then I go, doesn't it seem like it's coming right at you? And it seemed like one, two, three, and he almost fell off his seat laughing. It was like crazy. And that solidified me. I ended up doing it 22 more times. And then I pulled something like that again. And you didn't get the reaction you were hoping for. And you never went on again after that. With him. Did you guys ever talk after that? No. No. It wasn't like that. There was never a repartee. I did it 22 times, and it wasn't like we weren't close.

1:29:36We weren't. I don't think we talked during the commercials. I don't think it just he really he was amazing at his job. You know, he was amazing at setting you up. He was amazing at reacting. He was the consummate host. What did you think of him personally? I personally think he's great and loved him. But I don't, and maybe my brethren comedians disagree with me, I don't think he was a great advocate for comedy, for stand-up comedy. And the reason for that is I revere comedians, all of them, anybody who does this. and I know what goes into it. And I'm the champion of it on AGT. And I always, and maybe this is just personal, resented the fact that the comedian always went on at the end of the show, like the clown in the circus.

1:30:39And it was a big deal to be called over or to get a thumbs up. You would have, I won't even mention names because I don't want to be disrespectful, but you would have the third tier of somebody from a sitcom, an actor who happens to be on a sitcom and it's not their sitcom, any cast member from the Bob Newhart show, you know, on, and they would, they'd even be the second guest and they'd sit down and regale Johnny in the audience with stories. And they, you know, and he feigned interest in it and whatever. A comedian who writes their own material and has so much at stake and needs to elicit a laugh every 30 seconds from an audience, comes out and sometimes they got a thumbs up.

1:31:28Sometimes they got called, they were allowed to sit down and then they'd throw to commercial. To me, that seemed almost disrespectful. I mean, that's the artist, the person who is on the sitcom is reciting somebody else's lines and pretending to be something and that's okay. I'm not negating that, but I just never, because it was thought of such a platform, it was a platform because the shot on that show meant a lot to each and every one of us, but I felt like it wasn't really, the milieu wasn't respectful. You ever tried reaching out to him after stuff went so? No. What about when you were hosting the daytime talk show?

1:32:18I read an interview you gave then about how he would be your, like, holy grail guest. He is. I think he was great at what he did. He was great at what he did, and he is the holy grail for late night hosting. And I wanted to be like him. I wanted to be able to give people a platform. I would have never, personally on my own show, I would have never had a comedian on to do their act and say goodnight. You don't come on and goodnight. That's like, come and deliver me a great meal, but don't eat with me. Go home. I wouldn't have done that. And any comedian I had on sat down and talked. And I had interesting and said, do your act sometimes from the couch.

1:33:01My act was always from the couch. You know, the stories that I made up. So I wouldn't do that. I don't have to agree and have the same system as him, but I revere him and I revere the show. But because of how stuff ended, you did not want to reach out about having him as a guest on your show. He wouldn't do it. I wasn't going to reach out for a definite. No, he wasn't doing anything. He appeared once on Letterman. You know, he walked away and he did it incredibly gracefully. And everything he did in his career was done to the nines. And, you know, that's who he is. I'm just saying that the show was a great platform to launch from for a comedian.

1:33:43Was he a good advocate of comedian? Was he an advocate for comedians? I don't think he was personally. So we were talking about Deal or No Deal and your wife's influence and you, you know, doing, agreeing to do that. the period from the cancellation of your daytime syndicated talk show to Deal or No Deal was brutal for you. Well, because I did the daytime talk show for a year. When you're doing a talk show, it's a full-time job. Right. It really is. So I was relegated for a year and a half because I started a half a year ahead of the airing working on it. to not doing these 200 stand-up dates?

1:34:28Not doing stand-up. That you were selling out leading into the show? Not appearing on television. I wasn't doing anything. I was building my show. Whether I was staffing it, whether I was going and having meetings at affiliates who were bidding to carry the show, the business behind the scenes, whether I was sitting down and meeting producers and directors, and whether I was shooting test shows and figuring out what I wanted to do. I'm sitting a year and a half aside from the show. I was out of it. And the daytime audience is a very different, it is a specific audience. The daytime talk show audience is not the nighttime show, is not the club-going show, the concert-going show.

1:35:17They're really not. Unless you're like a huge success. I think Oprah and Dr. Phil, you know, burst beyond that bubble. But very few daytime. So that's what I was doing. You know, so out of sight, out of mind. The stand-up comedy concert world kind of dried up. I wasn't acting. I wasn't getting the offers that I was getting after St. Elsewhere. I mean, this was 13 years after St. Elsewhere. And so what are you thinking at the time? So when it was taken away from me, it wasn't like the phone was ringing. So the, you know, I still wanted to do stand up. So I do some dates. I get booked in clubs and, you know, selling 65 tickets, 100 tickets.

1:36:06Like, oh, my God, the audience is gone. You know, people don't want to spend money. When you were selling out. Selling out. I had been selling out like, you know, little outdoor venues of 5 ,000 to 10 ,000. I'd been selling out multiple days at clubs, and now I'm trying to get 100 tickets. And I can't. And even acting. Maybe I can get on another series, and I'm reading for five lines and under, and I'm sitting in a folding chair in a casting office with five other unknowns that look like me. And I'm just going, this is ravaging for your self-esteem. and I don't need it. I don't need the money.

1:36:53I don't even need to be more famous. I don't need people to know me. Enough people know me and that's not what I'm chasing now. I just want to work. I want to do this. So to be told no, no, no, no, I said to Terry, I'll drop in, and I was dropping in two, three times a week to comedy clubs. I just drop in without telling them, not hired, and doing a set, and that feels good. That's my, you know, they're 15-minute sets, so that's my 15 minutes of light during the day. And I'll find something else to do. I have investments. I don't need money, you know. I've kind of set myself up, so I don't need money.

1:37:35So I'm not going to pursue because it's just negative. I don't want to pursue it anymore. So I'm quitting show business. That was about 2005 when I totally, 2004 when I totally stopped pursuing anything, when the call for deal or no deal came in. That five-year period, or whatever it was, you had, you know, talked about being depressed, among other things. When you're in those places, where does your mind go? Not good places. You know, everything from my own personal health, thinking I'm dying to self-doubt, worry, terror, OCD, all those things light up. It's just so dark and so, and you know, it's really by virtue of just not being busy.

1:38:35I mean, you've hung with me for a couple of days. My days are full. I'm not good if my day's not full. so I could make you know a good decision to not pursue something like I did my career but I had all I and I have investments but those investments it's not like a day-to-day job when you invest in a piece of real estate like what is that so you know it's throwing off money because it's a rental property like so I'm just sitting at home and when you get up each and every day with no purpose and nothing exciting happening like you know it's just I didn't have babies in the house I didn't even have to take care of babies you know I didn't have anything to do but turn inside out like the black hole of a star was my mind.

1:39:32Ever suicidal? I think that, um...

1:39:40It's, you know, I'd be lying if I said it didn't, it never crossed my mind, but I never got to the point where, you know, what do you call it? Where you were gonna follow through? Where you have a plan. Okay. When you get to those places, what are the tools you use to get yourself out of it? Distraction. Give me something else to think about. Give me something else to do. Give me some place to go. You know, whether that's my wife saying, come on, let's go get a lawn chair. You know? Yeah. Because you said if everything's going your way and there's nothing wrong, but you're sad, that's almost harder.

1:40:28Because we're taught, you know, what's supposed to make you happy? Like, what are we taught? What is our society? When you come into this life and you become aware, what's supposed to make you happy? Having money?

1:40:47Nice clothes? Having a nice car? Good family? Having a career? having your, well, first and foremost, your family, health. If you have all that, if all that exists, and you're in a dark place, that's more painful. Then you go, I'm drowning, I don't know. So then there's nothing that can get me out of this, because everything that's supposed to battle this, every reason to not be depressed exists, and I'm hanging on, and I'm still drowning in this darkness. That's helpless. That makes you feel helpless. You've talked about when you were growing up and the bugs under the skin. Your perspective as to the impact that had was what?

1:41:38I'm not a psychologist, but, you know, I do remember vividly the feeling I had when they discovered that, you know, I'd been bitten by a sand fly and it laid its larva in my, in me. And when I had these itchy little bumps and you scratch them and then you watch that itchy little bump crawl away under your arm to another place. I mean, it's like a horror film that you, that you're, you are the horror film. And the horror film didn't stop. So my mom took me to a doctor, and that doctor decided to put me on display. There was a dermatology convention in Toronto because we didn't know what the answer was, and they hadn't seen this in humans.

1:42:27I think cattle get it. So they put me on a table. I remember I was in a, I think it was a lecture hall. There was all these doctors from all over the world. It was a, it seemed like an amphitheater of like 100 people. And they put me on a table in my tighty-whities on a table. I was a little boy. And the nurses would hold me down, and then they would show them these bumps, and then the bump would move, and then he would take liquid nitrogen and put it on the bump. And liquid nitrogen is so cold it burns. And I'd watch my skin sizzle and bubble, and then it would open up and obviously kill the larvae, and I was screaming.

1:43:10They did one. And then my mom, who didn't know what they were going to do, took me, unstrapped me from the table, and said, your animals don't do this, and carried me out, and I went home. And then every night, we would pick one, and then she would take a rough washcloth and alcohol and just rub it and rub it and rub it. First, it felt good, but keep rubbing it until the skin broke and it would bleed and it opened until she got them all. so that was that was when I was I think I was about six or seven I don't know I can't remember exactly how old I was but that even talking about it holds so talking about it holds what it's hard to you know it's traumatizing even today sure I had things living under my skin so and and and so I have like an ache factor.

1:44:04And your mom too was afraid of germs. Yeah, and her mom. I remember her mom, I'd go to my grandmother's house and my grandmother would be outside waxing and polishing the porch, the concrete porch. I remember my crib, somebody would come over and touch the crib and when I was a baby, I couldn't even speak, but I remember that when they'd leave, my mom would like windex it or or whatever she sprayed on it and wipe it. So, you know, all these things, not that this is her fault. I just, I have OCD. I do have OCD and that's not because of anything she did, but maybe that informed the thought process, my germophobia.

1:44:47But if it wasn't germophobia, it would be the need to be afraid of the number six. I gotta do things in sixes or whatever. You know, it would be something else. So it's not, that's not the, go ahead. What would happen with the warts on your hands from? Well, I was the, before everybody knew about all these antibacterial things, I had, it was during the talk show, I had, I knew that on this talk show, no matter who came in, I had to shake their hand. So my friend is a surgeon, and he gave me, I had a tub of that, whatever the surgical scrub is, he gave me that. I had that under my desk. So I would, all day long, I would just have that surgical scrub.

1:45:33What I noticed is I started getting warts on my hands, and I later learned that I had disinfected my hands so much that I had actually killed the good bacteria. So if I even touched a door or I touched anything, that bacteria, there was nothing to fight the bad bacteria. We have bad bacteria on us all the time. That's just part of being a living organism. So I lost that, and that's how I got it. A ward is like a virus, you know? So I'm not negating the use of antibacterial, but in moderation, not even moderation, use it normally. I just soaked in it. You still have a particular scenario you go through when you get to a hotel room?

1:46:18Yeah, yeah, in a hotel room. I'd have the comforter off the bed. I won't touch it or touch anything it touches. If there's carpet, I put down towels and make a path. I stopped using a blacklight. I used to use the blacklight. I know. I was using a blacklight, but it just makes me crazy. If you use a blacklight in a room, it's like a crime scene. It's like there's so many things light up. I have no idea what it is, and I don't want to know what it is. And so I stopped carrying it. I don't have a blacklight with me. And you're okay with kissing and hugging? Right? Certain people. Not everyone. Yes.

1:46:59Yeah. I have children. What about the Aviator movie scared you? It didn't scare me. I use it as an example. You know, Howard Hughes was probably one of the most productive, brilliant.

1:47:16Everything from aviation to filmmaking to creating the bra. You know, here's a guy that could do it all. And OCD overtook him to the point where at the end of his life, he's in the fetal position, lying naked, locked in a room, peeing into a cup. And I've said to people, if you don't understand, you know, how close I am to that, and that's what I fight every day, it's not. Do you really feel that way, though? Yeah. Yes. Yes. I could go down that little rabbit hole or wormhole and make myself not wanna touch anything, anybody, and you know, I get the comfort in retreating from the world. And what prevents you from doing that?

1:48:11Terry, medication and therapy. And in what ways have you found the medication and therapy helpful? I wouldn't be on medication if it wasn't for Terry. I wouldn't have been diagnosed if it wasn't for Terry. And you resisted medication for a long time? I did because I was afraid that it would... I have a certain amount of success because of who I am, and medication alters who you are. You know? It can alter who you are. I am, I'll be honest with you, and my family makes fun of me. I'm kind of, which is easier for me to live. I'm numb. And that means what? Because I've heard you say that a bunch before.

1:48:51I don't have that much emotion. I have, I don't have fear, which is nice. But Rich told me 32 years, he's never seen you cry. No, I don't have fear. I don't have emotion. I don't have, I'm numb. I look for those. That's why I look for thrills, to feel alive. I love roller coasters. I want adrenaline. I want to feel scared. I want to feel something. I don't have that. I don't have that anymore. But that's okay. That's like, you know, if you wear a life jacket on a boat, you know, if you're out on a sunny day and you're in a boat and you wear a life jacket, you're safe. Are you comfortable? You know, you don't feel, you feel like kind of like, and this is my mental life jacket.

1:49:43So my mental life jacket, I don't have the same, you know, if you weren't wearing a shirt and you were in a boat, it's a lot more, you know, you feel the sun burning your shoulder. You feel the spray of the water on your skin. You feel wind, right? But you put on a life jacket and you're kind of, so if you take the medication that I'm on, or at least the way it's affecting me, I don't feel anymore. But what's been good is it hasn't curbed my desires. I have enjoyment or satisfaction in creating something, in producing something, in making something happen, in discovering something that I've never seen before.

1:50:28Are you happy? That's a good question. I think for the most part, I'm content. Happy is a hard place for me to get to. I think it's a hard place for anybody to get to, depending on what your definition of happy. I have moments where I'm really happy, you know, but those are flashes. You know, something happens, you go, wow! You know, like winning a lottery, you know. If you win a lottery and you find out you're the winner, they're probably happy for a moment. And then deal with how your life has changed and how the people around you change. I don't know if you're still, you're not happy all the time.

1:51:11So I got moments of happiness. I spend a good amount of time in contentment. And I fight off darkness. Always. It's a fight. This episode is brought to you by State Farm. Listening to this podcast instead of doom scrolling? Smart move. Another smart move? Getting help from one of State Farm's 19 ,000 local agents when you choose to bundle home and auto. Bundling, just another way to save with the personal price plan. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings, and eligibility vary by state. Did you know Sam's Club isn't a store?

1:51:51It's actually a club with cool finds and, like, a whole community. It's a club. Of course, Jason. It's in the name. Sam's Club. Oh, yeah. Come join us. Sam's Club. How's the health today? Physically? I think I'm better than I've been in the last few years. COVID knocked me for a loop mentally, which kind of showed itself physically, too. Well, then the booze and the drugs. Booze and drugs and eating. You know, I gained about 20 pounds, which feels, doesn't feel good. I ate really unhealthily, which doesn't feel good. And, you know, when you're 15 years old and you, you know, the only thing you've eaten is, you know, a bunch of Pepsi and a chocolate bar for the day, you're feeling okay, right?

1:52:51It doesn't affect you. When you're my age and you're just having sodas and chocolate, it doesn't feel the same. But you want sodas and chocolate because you're not feeling okay. So right now I'm really healthy. I've taken up swimming. You have to feel like a new man. I do. I feel I've lost 20 pounds. I feel, and more than the weight, I feel like I'm not living on energy drinks and I'm not eating sweets. And I'm not, not only for weight, but your whole metabolism is different when you're older and it hurts. Just like you can drink when you're young and go to a party and wake up the next day and have at it, you know.

1:53:37When you're older and you drink heavy, it hurts more in the morning. It just hurts. And all that hurt all the time. I know we've touched on briefly over the past couple days some of your non-showbiz related work. But how about the best investment you made not connected to show business? Well, I would have to say this building that we're sitting in. I made a little fort for myself, this little man cave, you know, that happens to, you know, be inhabited by other people who are creative and tech companies and other creations which cohabitate together. and happens to be a good investment from a real estate point of view and a really good investment from a creative point of view and a really good investment from my career point of view.

1:54:32Did I have it right that you pretty much forexed the investment in this over the past decade that you've owned it? I would think so. I'd have to really. I haven't sat down because I have no inkling in trying to sell it or flip it or do anything, but it's a lot more than I paid for it. But I bought a crappy little warehouse with no, this was a printing company, this whole thing, was a printing company and it was a mess. And I've added value to it just physically, you know, physically added value. These walls that you see, all this soundproofing that you see, the ability to

1:55:19put totally vastly different areas in the same building that can complement each other but also live. This was all like one thing, you know, and now it's this cordoned off kind of. How much real estate do you have? Enough to survive. Not enough so that I don't have to work anymore. Residential, commercial? Residential and commercial rental. properties. I always saw it as, I'll give you an example, when in the early 80s, when Vegas was the biggest growing city in the world, you know, Steve Wynn kind of created that. And what was happening when he was building these big hotels, the trades had to come there to, you know, the electricians, the plumbers, the landscapers, the people who built.

1:56:12So So they all came there. So the first thing we did, we go, because I was in the carpet business, me and my partner said, well, how do these people move there and then do their business? So we bought a lot of dirt around the airport and we built these little, we called them commercial condos, but they're just little warehouse with a warehouse door and an office in front. So a plumber could have an office. He can get his shipment of whatever his things are in. And traditionally, they rented those out. They were already happening, but there was people renting commercial space, just like you see in this area where we are now.

1:56:55You know, we're a plumber or an electrician or a tile guy or whatever. So I said, well, why don't we sell them as condos? So we bought the area for nothing. It's not where anybody wants to live. These are just tilt-ups, little concrete squares. I couldn't build fast enough to sell them out. Because all these trades and all this building was going on, and because of the tax benefits of Nevada, people started moving there. So then there's these companies like KB Homes, and there's these big development companies in America that bought dirt way out and subdivided to build 2 ,000 homes on a plot like Summerland and Henderson.

1:57:35and none of these places were developed. And this is where people who now work on the Strip, this is where they all live. And so they were building 2 ,000, and because it was so good, people were bidding on these houses. They were selling these houses like huge in the 80s and 90s. So I saw that and I said, well, I see where this is, and this is like 20 miles from the Strip and 20 miles, and the reason they were able to build like they did, it's so cheap, they're buying this. So I would buy like two acres of dirt leading. I'd go see where the land was subdivided before the houses were built. I'd buy two acres of dirt that would lead into whatever the main artery into this new subdivision was.

1:58:18So I'd buy two acres of dirt and people would say, for what? And I'd go, these are 2 ,000 families. Where are they going to get gas? Where are they going to buy their groceries? So I'd put on my two acres a little strip mall of a gas station, a little AM-PM store, a little store, a car wash. I knew that I was going to be serviced by 2 ,000 homes. So I got to a point where I had a bunch of gas stations. I ended up getting bought out, and my partner went into another business. How many do you have? Strip malls, I had about eight, and gas stations. The gas stations became the big business, and not for what you think.

1:59:03What do you mean? So in Nevada, gas was the least money you made. People go in and buy sundries at a gas station. But even more importantly than that, you rent out, you know, in every gas station, they had like a poker machine, you know, an electronic poker machine. they would come in these poker machine companies they'd say we'll put a poker machine in your in your gas station and we'll pay you like thirty thousand dollars a month rent wait if you're paying me thirty thousand dollars a month how much are you making you know so on all the gas stations and then not as much but the post office come in so you have a stat machine there like when you go into these places and you see stores are real estate that's the way people do business now that's alta and sephora's whole business now is you know i always thought like i'm looking at this giant sephora and i'm always thinking and i'm interested in this kind of stuff this kind of stuff lights me up i'm interested i say to uh i look at sephora you know i'm talking about the cosmetic so i go like even if somebody comes in and buys eyeliner and lipstick and lip gloss how how are they paying the rent on this?

2:00:19Because I've owned retail and I know what it is. How are they paying the rent on this? Sephora. Sephora is making money because they're taking a piece of that sale. But more importantly, they're charging L 'Oreal or Lip Kits by Jenner's rent. That's real estate. So they're charging rent for that. If you want to be an end cap or you want to be on that shelf, they're paying rent for that, right? And that's why when I get into the hologram business, I say, well, you know what? If you're paying rent to have your product here or you're paying for the signage, let me put my hologram machine in there.

2:00:55And now anybody who walks by has access, not only to you, but to everything you sell and more than you can ever put on a shelf. And that's just as exciting as doing a show, producing TV, doing stand-up comedy, just finding a new way to do business. You once said, what was important to me in my 30s is not important to me now. And you realize that things you chase don't matter, and it's just the ability to get up and even chase something. It's the chase. If you want to get up and do something, if you want to get up and talk Walmart into saying this is the new way to display everything you have in the store and get Walmart to say yes, and we're going to buy 2 ,000 of these machines, that's kind of exciting, isn't it?

2:01:47You know, I did 22 Tonight Shows. But does that really matter? Does anybody even know? Does anybody remember anything I did on The Tonight Show? No. But if this becomes the way of people doing business, the way a doctor can reach somebody who can't get to a doctor, the way somebody can see a 3D image because they can't, the way Christie's is now doing business, or at the same time, you know, somebody can walk in here to do my podcast, but they can start playing League of Legends and somebody like T-Pain wants to join and they create a world league. I don't play games online, but I'm fascinated by the amount of people that that engages.

2:02:31And I want to be part of that. You know, it has nothing to do with me, nothing to do with me, but I've given them a roof. Okay, and lastly, what motivates you today? I want to be a blank slate and I want to wake up and find a motivation. And every day, sometimes three times a day, there's three different motivations. Whatever I'm motivated by right now is not what I will be motivated by tomorrow. You know, like. And I don't know if it was clear in watching me work, but, you know, just I'm motivated by watching a bunch of things happening. I love walking around and watching, you know, in the other room.

2:03:16There's three other shows going on that I have nothing to do with. And nobody who sees those shows will ever know that I have any connection in any way. But there's something motivating about the energy of creativity and weirdness and fun and tech and information that is going on around. Because I said, how much is this building? You know, and that's a motivation to just keep doing it or showing up or showing up here and doing that. When I finish talking to you right now, I'm getting on a plane and going to New York. And I'm going to be touring with my buddy Brad Garrett. But, you know, that's kind of motivating.

2:03:55We're going to have fun. I love the guy. I love hanging with the guy. And we're going to have fun. And we kind of don't have a plan. No plan. He called me the other day. He said, so what are we going to do? Who's going to go on first? Are we going to do stage time together? I go, I don't know. Let's see how we feel. And that's what, it's not, it's that easy. And tomorrow I'll be motivated to, you know, to go to Jackie's house and sit there and play for three hours with my grandson. And, you know, I'm always motivated to do that. But I'm just saying I like that motivation and I don't want to be held to a plan.

2:04:29Life's too short. The only thing I have is moments. Moments are my currency. Moments are everybody's currency. And just enjoy it, know the value in it, or hate it and know the value in it. You know, but I just want to be open to these moments. And I don't want to steer myself away from a moment that's coming my way. Because it comes at you. You don't go at it. It comes at you. And it's what you do with what comes at you that makes a difference. Thanks for doing this. Thank you. Really appreciate it. It's over. Thanks for listening to this week's podcast. Don't forget to leave a rating and review.

2:05:07And for more in-depth interviews, visit GrahamBetsinger.com.