Is financial advice worth it?

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28:17So do you think there's been a regulatory shift then in terms, you said that there was a big change when you first got in. Has there been changes recently? Yes, there has. And, you know, ongoing, this will just keep, keep happening. We had this big initiative, treating customers fairly, which seems like the most obvious. You've got to be nice to them. You've got to treat them fairly. It seems mad, doesn't it? The latest one is consumer duty, which is basically the treating customers fairly piece, but on steroids. They've gone, they've taken that piece that they did a little while back and bolted on a load more stuff.

28:50And it came at loads of criticism in the industry because it's loads more work on us. There's extra things we have to do, fair value statements. In fact, I've just done one this morning to confirm. So every product, every platform, every wrapper, every fund, every advice firm has to have a fair value statement that justifies why they think that service or that product or whatever it is represents fair value. So there's all these extra things that are always coming in. And they often get met with criticism because they're more work for us. But ultimately, it's only to try and drive better outcomes.

29:25Whether they're perfect solutions is a different conversation. Did these come down from the FCA? Yeah. How often do they kind of come into your industry? This consumer duty is the most recent one, but I would say, you know, every couple of years, there's something else that gets bolted on, something else we need to think about. But in the end, do you think it's benefiting the industry? It's like, obviously it's more work for you guys, but it's protecting the consumer or do you think it's just loads of like paperwork? I think the idea behind it is right. The idea behind it is right. You know, we should be making the industry.

29:54I'm here today sort of airing, you know, what some of my criticisms or concerns would be because it's a great industry and it needs to do better and keep moving in that direction. The challenge is, is that it becomes ever more costly for us. So I have to pay the regulator to be regulated. I have to pay professional indemnity insurance and all these various costs just to exist. So just to stand still as an advisor and have all the regulations, I have to pay a lot of money every month. And every time these things get bolted on, those costs just seems to keep going up and up. And you pass those on to the consumer.

30:23And that's the challenge. Yeah. And then you'll become more expensive. Yeah. And then we wheels keep spinning, you know? So that is a challenge we need to find a solution for. And, but do you think the regulator do a good job of looking after the industry? Generally, yes. Generally, yes. But I think, you know, I was just reading an article on the way down here today about the Neil Woodford saga, because that's still rumbling on. And it looks like the regulator are finally coming out to say, actually, we are now going to seriously do something about it. And there's another, the wheels have turned a little bit further on that.

30:54So when you look at sagas like that, you can't believe, So long that's been going on for a decade? Longer. And how, if the regulator was doing a fantastic job, how did we ever get to that place would be the argument, right? So is it perfect? Probably not. I don't know. The intent is right though. Yeah. Yeah. I look at them and that view of my space, you know, the space that you're involved in as well. I'd be interested to hear your opinions on what you think on it, but I know that they take a dim view on influencers. And I think that they look at that 80 % that are probably absolute shysters on TikTok and YouTube or whatever.

31:31But then they don't look at the social good that's, you know, like sensible creators have done. And I do worry that they'll be a bit heavy handed. And do you think the YouTube space is a good space within, alongside your kind of world? Well, look, I mean, I entered the YouTube space a few years ago, which is where we met. because I was trying to find a vehicle to get sort of, you know, tips and guidance out to people that won't ever get to see a financial advisor or planner. Those people that get left behind that gap of people that otherwise would. It's like 90 % of people. Yeah. You know, so how can I find a way?

32:05Because I can't serve everybody and the advice industry probably can't serve everybody. That was why I entered the space to try and, you know, do a bit of that. I think you're absolutely right. Sadly, you end up getting tarred with the brush of the majority. It's the same in financial advice. all the regulation that comes on me from the FCA on extra things to clean up your act is actually then regulating the portion of the market that's not doing what I've always done. And yet I get dragged in, you know, everybody gets dragged along that same journey. I think it's the same thing. Because the problem is, you know, from an incentives perspective, you've got 90 % of the UK population who have, they don't understand investing, they don't understand the benefits, whatever.

32:42I know it's not that high, but let's just like blunt examples. You then have advisors who have that information, but their incentive is to collect assets under management or to speak to rich people. And there's enough rich people to serve the small portion of advisors that they never need to speak to the other lot. So you basically say by having this heavily regulated industry where you can only give advice if you're an advisor, but the advisors only want to speak to rich people means the majority of the UK get nothing. Yeah. And I think that's still true. And that's still a problem that I haven't solved the riddle of.

33:14I've had loads of first sort of phone calls, discovery meetings, as I would call them with lots of clients over the last few weeks. Not one of them is right for me to take on in that full, you know, my new business and that financial planning mantra, mainly because they're at the start of the journey. And, you know, they're not there yet for that full suite. I always try and impart as much guidance as I can and give them best practices and tips on where you might go to start and all that sort of thing. but it's still, is that enough to get them on that journey? You know, there's still, I guess, a bit of self-serving to do.

33:47They need to find the best resources. Yeah. And this is like, you know, I hope the regulators look at the space and realise that a million people a month watch my YouTube channel and those are like 18 year olds, 20 year olds, 30 year olds, whatever age they're at that have never started, that if they walk into an advisor, the advisor is going to be like, look, I just don't, I'm going to charge you so much money. It's not worth it because you're going to want to invest a hundred pound a month and I'm going to want five pound of it or whatever. And I hope they realise that, you know, there is some good there and getting people from zero to one is in a way a rich a client with a million quid walking into you is going to be some level of okay you know whereas the 18 year old if they don't do something that the outcome will be bad yeah and also that person with that million quid at some point on their journey will have started at some point so how did they how did they start what did they do differently that the other people aren't doing um yeah it's and i think you know i see lots of financial planners now doing a bit of you know the americanism bit of pro bono work you know doing a bit of as much as they can youtube was my version of that um you know if i could find a way of putting that out then it's not advice but there's there's guidance involved that is you know free for people to consume as much or as a little of um is that enough to get people investing well you would you know look at your channel how many people have started investing that may not have done based on the content a lot i would say yeah so it's probably a couple hundred thousand yeah so that's a pretty good go at it right i i think you know in the end they make the right decisions and they're trying to protect the consumer.

35:10And I'd rather it be regulated heavily than not. What's this core advice? Does this thing, is it core advice? Yeah, so I don't know much about this, but this again is about trying to find a vehicle to serve that end of the market, isn't it? That otherwise would never get any kind of advice. Damien talks money. Available on all major platforms. You are core advice. No, God, no, no. I did that right now. Cuts. Core guidance. Yeah, core guidance. FCA come in the window with SWAT teams and stuff. Yeah, yeah. We've been waiting. We've been waiting. I had dots all over my T-shirt. It was him. Yeah. So do you know much about it or what?

35:48Genuinely not. I don't know much about this latest thing. I know that's the intent. It's to try and find a solution for that end of the market, but I don't know the ins and outs of what it entails. I like that the advisors care and they're doing the pro bono work, but you can't blame them because no one can work for free. You know, and the incentives are just not quite there. And I think that is the job of the regulator. but I think by expanding guidance and advice, they kind of are, I think they're making good strides there. This whole guidance piece seems to have potential to be like people, someone like you in your situation would do this rather than it all be like, I can't say anything cause I'm not qualified.

36:21And you know, I don't know your individual circumstances. But it needs to go further, right? And earlier, you know, education, you know, start, we need to go right back to the whole, you know, I leave school and I can work out what the third side of a triangle is. I've got, I've no idea about living on less than I make and saving money and invest. but Pythagoras, I'm all over that. I mean, what world is it where that's the skillset you come out with? Or Henry the Apes, like marriage history, divorce, beheaded, died, divorce, beheaded, survived. Why do I know that? 3.1415, but how does that help you when you're trying to make money?

36:51Exactly, really, exactly. What age do you think, what age do you see most people coming to you? Cause like Damien was saying, 18 year old comes in with a hundred quid a month and then obviously millionaires come in when they're 50s. Like what age do you normally see people coming to you? I suppose, you know, my typical client, my ideal client, if I was to say to you, who is my ideal client? It's, it is really those people that are probably on the lead up to retirement. Cause that's the big thing where most of the value of the stuff that I provide is on that hinging around that big decision with other bits either side of it.

37:19So you, you know, most of the value, because when you sit down with someone who's 30 and if, like, if I said to you now, when are you going to retire? I mean, it's so hard to answer that question because it feels so abstract. It feels so you're just getting started. You're just building you know it's so that's really hard but if you speak to somebody who's 45 or 50 and anybody with any early retirement aspirations they've definitely thought about what that looks like and when they'd like to um so yeah typically that's when people come to me and that's where most value can be added from the planning i would say so if i came if someone came to you like 31 and they had nice well-paid job wouldn't wouldn't you see that as oh i could have them as a client for longer yeah yeah and i've got plenty of those as well the accumulators i would call them so i My sort of bad clients are either accumulators or decumulators.

38:03Oh, okay. Interesting. So yeah, you do get plenty of those as well. And they're the future retirement solutions, but they still benefit from a planning conversation. And still, you know, use all the tax allowances. We're still building the pots and there's still a place for it there for sure. That's the one thing in my mind that's changed of like, I can see myself at 55 sitting down with someone like you and going, can you just make sure that I'm where I need to be in terms of a planning perspective? in the past maybe advice was i know the stock market you don't so i'm going to show you how i'm going to pick for you whereas your thing is i know how to make sure that you live your life that you want and get the dreams that you get and the stock market tools and the accounts they're like the vehicle that we get there but what we need to do is set out the the route the plan yeah yeah like one thing that i think the financial advice industry doesn't realize is most people don't know what the hell they get from the service.

38:56They walk in there blind, kind of like a mechanic going like, you know, your flange and eight is broke, seven grand. And I don't know if that's the case or not. Whereas you can portray this clear value of like, yes, you'll get the investments. Yes, they'll be tax efficient. Yes, all of that technical stuff. But most of all, you'll know exactly how much money you'll need and you'll know how to get to the life that you want and what that looks like. Like, can you tell us the story about the lady and the church? Because I think that's a really good example of this. Oh, yeah. I'd forgotten about that.

39:30Yeah. So longstanding client of mine, lovely, lovely lady. Used to look after her and her husband, wealthy couple. He was like some NASA scientist, really interesting guy. And as a result, earned great money and he had a whopping great pension. So really good clients. He sadly passed away a few years ago and he did all the finances. So it was one of those scenarios where, you know, his surviving spouse, she is now burdened with all of the stuff she's now got to work out. He did all of that. And so, you know, my role has changed a little bit and has been much more frequent. And one of the things that she said to me, and a bit of a throwaway comment, actually, was this idea of they were religious people.

40:10And one thing that he'd always liked to have done is repair. they talked about this church organ at their local church where they go and it was in a right state and apparently can you believe this to repair the organ would be 50 grand that's the bill to fix this thing up to the state that it should be in and so we got talking about that and the idea of she would love wouldn't it be great as a legacy to him to carry out that exercise and almost have a little his name by a plaque to say this thing was restored by but obviously he's no longer here. And so I said, well, why not then? Instead of, it was just a fairly casual conversation.

40:47And I said, well, why not do it? And it was a huge sum of money. I can just give 50 grand in one. I can't write a check to the church of 50 grand. So I said, why not? Of course, this is your money. If that's really something that, so let's have a look. And I was able to do the planning bit. And this is why it's so important to still, to be able to show her you can do it and you'll still be fine you know you have the capacity to do this so she did and and what an amazing thing to be able to have said you know that was a real huge emotional moment for her and something that probably without my input without kind of blowing it may probably never have happened giving her the confidence and the peace of mind to say you can make that gift if you want to you can do that and you will still be absolutely fine your retirement plans aren't derailed you're not going to cause yourself a problem further down the line by making that now and so as far as i understand it work is underway how do you how do you make that decision how do you give them that confidence like what's the technical process so it's cash flow modeling okay so it's you know i use a really intelligent bit of kit that basically plots the ins and outs every year so you put in this is the lifestyle you want to lead here's the events along the way a big holiday you know sending the kids 50 grand for an organ so let's go into your plan what you're spending what life costs what you've got in the part what's coming out and look at that graph and i'm going to pull 50 grand out of it today and see if you know what that does to the graph in later years and if we're still all right then why not and is that based on like a percentage probability or something of like yeah there's different ways to do it but yeah of course these things are full of assumptions you know and assume growth rate and you know there's different ways of doing it so they're not perfect which is why a whole point of setting up these plans is that we revisit it every year because I'll be wrong every year in terms of what I put into that vehicle.

42:33It will never be right. So you revisit it every year and keep nudging it on. And one of the, you talked about accumulators and decumulators. How do you manage someone moving from accumulation to decumulation? And how do you think people should spend their money when they're in retirement? That's a great question. This is the biggest problem people have is that switching mindset. I see it all the time. And it doesn't matter whether somebody's got loads of money in the pot or small. And, you know, anybody listening to this that's at that stage, I think will relate to this. It's really hard to go from working your entire life, saving, investing, building, accumulating, to somebody then saying to you, you've now got to start spending it.

43:18And to be comfortable with spending it and to enjoy spending it. You asked me what's the most important thing to do is to enjoy it, right? I think people get far too wedded to the idea that money is the important thing. It's not important in itself. It doesn't do anything. It's what you can swap it for that's important. I always joke that they're fun tokens. And unless you're going to make that distinction, then what was it all for? If you're going to retire and stress and worry and be really frugal, what was it all for? So again, one of the things I find myself doing a lot of is telling people to spend money.

43:51you know enjoy it if the plan works i'm not saying do it recklessly but with a plan that shows you you'll be fine if you say that actually do you know what we'd love to go on a couple more holidays a year if we could afford it let's have a look yes you can do it enjoy it who's going to spend the money it's be one of three people it's either going to be you your beneficiaries after you're no longer here so the kids or whoever that might be or the state in one form or the other who do you who do you want that to be those are the only three people that are going to spend it i love like your view of it around happiness and joy.

44:19One thing that you said to me that I've been passing it to my mom is like, you know, think about inheritance planning before you're dead in the sense of get the glory. Sit at the table with him and be like, look how much of a legend I am. Here's your inheritance. Do you know what I mean? You don't want to be doing that, definitely. For your son, it's like, you know, you want to be there, be like, look how much - I've already planned it for like different stages of his life. So 18, he gets a little bit. Yeah, and I'm paying for it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's putting it into his junior ice every night.

44:46He's a good partner. So yeah, he puts in every month. I put in every month. My missus puts in every month. So yeah, when he's 18, give him something. Then when he's like 21, give him something else. And then, you know, later just give him little pots and be like, this is for your first deposit. This is for - Because how good that's going to feel to make you feel great. Keep investing into this so that like, I've got you so far, there's 20 grand in here. If you keep putting it in, you can make this 100 grand. So yeah, things like that, different pots. And that's what I mean. That's proper financial planning, right?

45:10That's what you want to do. So you would say that to me, you know, as a planner, and I would show you that you could do that and that it would make sense. And yeah, and you'll get to see him enjoy that. From this conversation, I'm thinking, you said like you might want to go see someone like him when you're 55. I think it'd be more useful like 40 just to like do the like cash flow. You're pushing that as well, aren't you? Yeah, cash flow. Yeah, no, no. Because it's like, make sure you're tax efficient. I think that's really helpful because I mean, I just did my taxes as self-employed and taxes are so confusing.

45:38I think everyone finds taxes a little bit confusing. So make sure you're tax efficient, make sure you're planned, and make sure you've got worst case scenario, best case scenario, all these things. It'll be, I think it'd be good to do. I think this like, I worry about money a lot and I probably sit down with someone like you and you'd be like, chill the hell out. Like you don't need to be worried about money. It's kind of crazy. The more I earn, the more I go on, the more I save, the more I'm like, is it enough? Like it's like a, and it's, I asked the question about accumulation to decumulation cause I can see that coming.

46:09like I struggle to spend now let alone when I'm like 50, 60 or whatever you'll still be accumulating when you're 70 I'll be accumulating in the grave he's got a he's got a direct debit going into a passive fund still I mean I look at my nan who's still with us and plenty of money and you know sits there with her toes hanging out at the ends of her slippers and I say to her nan what's going on down there you know not that she can hear a word I say but and there's you know 15 pairs of slippers that we've all bought whatever the years in the cup you know these are she's come from a war generation yeah there is no way she's not throwing you know throwing those slippers away there's still life in them left and and that's what i mean that mindset you'll never get that out of her trying to change your mindset now and said to you don't mean you're done you've got to spend it's like it's really hard emotionally yeah like one thing that's like um is this idea of like they call it coast fire but it's this idea that you might actually get to a point at some point where you can stop saving because if you just let it ride and let the markets do its thing, you'll be okay.

47:12And that's probably a conversation that at least I should look at because what's the point in saving into oblivion so that at 70, I can go on a holiday when I should probably be doing that right now. Yeah. And sadly, I see this all the time. You know, people end up not as healthy as you thought you might be in the later years and you miss the opportunity. Those early years of retirement, let's say you do get to retire early, whatever we mean by early, what do we mean? You know, 50, 55, whatever. That's still considered early. You know, I know lots of us would probably want to do even before that, but those are your years.

47:41You're fit and healthy, probably, all fingers crossed. Those are the years to enjoy those holidays. So you spend big in those early years. Yeah, so you see a peak. If you spoke to me, you probably would. You'd see a peak in spending then because I'd be here going, come on, let's go and see that auntie in Australia. Let's do it. Because who knows, 10 years time, you might not feel up for that long flight, for example. You know, I'm the most counterintuitive financial advisor in history, I think, in this regard. I spend much more time saying, come on, you know, let's, all this work we did to this point, let's make it for something.

48:08And I come back to that point. I get most job satisfaction out of that moment where I can see something that I've added in the conversation has made them live a better life than they would have done prior to that conversation. And this is why, so the three questions I ask people when I'm trying to pull out, what do you really want? Is if you had all the money that you needed in the bank right now, how would you change your life on how you're living now? This is from the, I'm going to say his name wrong, George Kinder, George Kinder Institute of Financial Planning, American chap who sort of coined this over there.

48:39So you give somebody all the money in a scenario and say, what would you change? And they'll say things like, well, I'll probably go on a few more holidays. I'll probably go and see that relative I'd never really seen. I might go down to four days a week or three. All of a sudden you start to get, okay, so we're starting to talk about what you want to do with your time more than what you are currently doing with your time. and then what you do is the more awkward part of the conversation is you take away the biggest asset we all take for granted which is time you say to them if you went into the doctors today and the doctor said to you you've got between five and ten years left to live the good news is you won't feel sick you'll feel as healthy as you both do right now but you know that is your limited time right might be five might be ten you don't know when you're going to die but that is your prognosis what would you change about how you live now if you knew that was the story what difference would you make and that is normally the one where people go wow that's made me this just made my heart drop because the answer is i would just spend every minute with my son yeah do you know what i mean and like i go to work to provide him a life and in reality i could just do you know what i mean like it makes you think yeah it makes you think what's important real quick you know because everybody's answer to that question and you hit the nail on the head It always centers around the idea I'd spend more time with the people that I love doing the things I enjoy doing.

49:56That's basically what it boils down to, right? So can I show you a world where financially I can push you more in that direction? The third part of that question is even worse to say, what happens if you only had six months left to live? You know, the prognosis was really great. We're going Vegas too. Yeah. Vegas, then I'd be third. It's going to be big. Yeah, but it's, you know, asking people who haven't you become that you want to become? What are the things that you want to achieve? You know, I don't know, I want to write a book, but I need six months off work to really see. I've always dreamt of, I don't know, whatever.

50:28Okay, well, can we find a world where you could fund a period of not working for six months to write that book? I don't know, I'm coming up with silly stories, but this is what drives me. Yeah. What advice would you have for someone who's younger than, like 30s or just starting out as a financial advisor? and what kind of, you know, if you could advise everyone, what would you be saying? I always start, because I get this a lot. And on those calls that I have, I mentioned earlier that they're not right. You know, I can't take them on as a proper client. And so we ended up having lots of these conversations.

50:55I think the best thing that people can do is understand what good foundations look like before you start to invest. I think that would be the biggest takeaway I could have for anyone at the start of the journey is before you start thinking about investing, make sure your house is in order in terms of things. I know you guys talk about emergency fund in place, get rid of high interest debt, you know, get things to a place that you are ready to take that step for investing. Because I can tell you, if you try and skip that stage through impatience, because I know I did way back when, because I've always been horrifically impatient, it'll probably fall over at some point, because something will bite you.

51:30If you haven't got an emergency fund, you just know that your car will blow up on a day that you don't want. And then what are you going to do? Sell those investments of a short term when you might, you know. So that's the biggest thing I tell young people at the start. Before, just make sure you're ready. You know, that I think is probably the biggest takeaway. Yeah. People don't realize that an emergency fund is an investment in your investments. Totally. Because it stops you from crystallizing. It's your buffer. It's your buffer from a bad choice. That's the thing. I have been investing for well over 10 years, but I don't have the money that reflects that.

51:58Why? Because in my earlier years, I was putting money in and then taking it back out again, making that mistake of like not having that buffer, the emergency fund. People see it as like, oh, it's not producing a return. That's it. But it is producing a return. And the return is you not locking in a loss or - Exactly. Especially because things go wrong when things are going wrong. It seems like the market's down 20 % and that's the day your tire goes. Your body goes, oh, hello, what's that market's down? Time for a cold winter. That's what happens, exactly. And I think people have bought in, and it's right, you know, the earlier you start, of course, that makes a massive difference to the journey.

52:30We all know what compounding looks like and so on. But that's true, but not in favor of, you know, not getting your house in order. You've still got to get that bit right first. You want to start investing when you're ready. That's the biggest thing. So there was a moment where, I hope you don't mind me sharing this, but we were talking privately and you said, Damien, I'm done with the world that I'm in, but I've got two choices. I can go work for a financial advice firm and they've offered me great money, you know, like good money a year. And I can just work there as an employee and I can get my money.

53:01Or I can do this thing that I think is like really risky. I hope will revolutionize the financial advice space, but I'm not sure it'll work. And I said to you like, you know, first of all, you're speaking to a guy who'd give up his job to make videos in his spare bedroom. So, but you should do the thing that like, about legacy and this kind of import, like something that makes you feel like you're doing something that's worthwhile. And I don't think the job was that. Now that you're in it and it's like, you're in the throes of that decision. Like, do you think it was a good decision that you've made?

53:37my soul says yes my soul screams yes actually um and like you said it's about building something you're proud of right i mean i could have gone down that path and financially been fine and i could have done the stuff that i want to for my kids and that story would have played out probably fine but i'm a big believer as well in you know the whole regret thing would i what would i regret more am i going to look back in 10 years and think bloody hell tom why didn't you knew what it should look like you just needed to be a bit more brave and it's like the conversations we have many years ago you know when you're thinking of quitting your job to go in your spare room to make videos and you think what are you going to regret more damo never trying could it work full time and here we are how do people hear more about like your firm and what you're doing is it a firm is that what you call it yeah i guess so so orca wealth it's called like the killer whale oracle i mean i'd love a better story on where orca came from um somebody asked me yesterday i need to come up somebody give me some uh what is it abbreviations for orca but yeah they're not all great orcas eat sharks right yeah there you go you're eating right yeah right yeah you eat the sharks i don't want to say i'm the killer financial services this is why i get the big bucks this is why i get the small bucks you should uh yeah you should see like you're eating all the other sharks the sharks are the they're not so good financial advisors and you're the orca eating them all up i mean if you want to call me the killer way financial services t you call me blimey but yeah that's a good caption for the yeah yeah free willy so oracle well free willy for everyone that's not on the brochure that's why i get cancelled yeah i think i'll come to tea for marketing yeah and like the thing i want people to take from this conversation is like the advisor works for you not the other way around and i think for the last few decades it's felt the the relationship's been the other way.

55:28Challenge them on the services they offer you. Make sure that they do what you want and they invest in the way you want. And the key thing is the planning. The planning is the value. The ability to go, like what are you saving for? And have you got enough? These are the questions that we should be asking ourselves because otherwise what's the point? We're just throwing money into a pit. It's all about value for money, isn't it? You look at the fees and they're not insignificant fees that I get paid and I totally understand that. I'm not the cheapest that there is out there to employ. I'll absolutely say that.

55:56The FCA did a study. The average cost of a client that's got an advisor involved, the average cost of their investment portfolio is about 1.9%. Mine are way below that, mainly because of all the cost savings I'm driving through the vehicles that I'm using. Because you're not paying the active management fees. Yeah, because most of them are still built on this idea of active management. So you're paying close to 2 % is kind of the industry study. So I'm not the cheapest. I'm by far not the most expensive, but it's about value. What are you getting for that fee? And I would argue what I'm doing is a whole different kettle of fish for my fee than what many advisors will be being paid for doing, perhaps not so much.

56:30Yeah, because time's the most valuable thing. And if you give someone an extra few years, then that's probably worth a lot of money, right? Exactly, exactly. I'm working on one at the moment where they've said 60 is their planned retirement, which is still early retirement in terms of, you know, state pension age and all the rest of it. I've challenged them to look at 55 and I've started to build the model. and it has problems at 55, but I'm able to run some different... So how can I solve... If you were to retire at 55, I've got a problem. I can see the problem. There's not enough in the pot.

56:57But I've got 10 years left of their working life on that 45. What can we do in that 10 years that's different to what you're doing now to solve that problem? And I have a solution, which next week I'll be going out to say, look, if you did this, we could... Forget dreaming about 60. We could dream about 55. You know, I mean, what price do you pay on five years extra of retirement? In the years when you're fittest, most healthy. Yeah. Amazing. Yeah. You fucking pull it off. You're amazing, mate. Honestly, we connected over the thing because you slid into my DMs and you were like, can you give me some tips?

57:27I was like, here's another bloody chancer asking me for my chain sequence. Ignore me for three weeks. That's the first thing he did. Yeah, I did. I did. I did. I did. And then I told you not to bother. Yeah. Yeah, I was like, you know, because I'm a shark. Yeah. Take your little willy and fuck off. And that's why I stopped making videos. I've been gobbled up. Oh, God. Oh, God.

57:51If you want a bullet point summary of this episode, you can sign up to our newsletter using the link in the description. And don't forget to subscribe to the podcast and leave us a review. It really makes a difference and lets us know that we're doing a good job. And remember, this is not financial advice. The reason it's not financial advice is because it's not tailored to you. We can explain the principles of building wealth, but if you want personalized advice, it's worth speaking to a financial advisor. As with everything financial, please do your own research. We really encourage that because no one cares more about your money.

58:28I'm Damo. I'm T. This episode was recorded by Jack Hobbs. Music is by Felix Taylor. It was produced and edited by Ruth Edwards. Johnny Hunter is in charge of marketing. And it's all brought together by Will Stollerman.