Jev Is A MASSIVE Deal for Marketers

0:00Eric Siu:You know that feeling when the strategy is done, the brief is written, everyone's aligned, and you realize someone still has to sit down and actually create all the content? That someone is you, and it's due tomorrow. Breeze Assistant can help. It works right inside HubSpot. Drafting campaign copy, blog posts, emails, all in your brand voice. All grounded in your actual customer data. So you don't just create content. You create content that converts. Check out HubSpot.com, the agentic customer platform for growing businesses. So Neil, I want to pull this up for you real quick just to give also you some ideas for how your team can use this whole Jev thing.

0:38Eric Siu:Have you ever heard about Jev yet or no? Yeah, you told me about it. Oh, I did? I didn't even remember. Okay, so here, let me show you some Jev use cases here. All right, you see my screen?

0:48Neil Patel:Uh-huh.

0:49Eric Siu:Okay, just so you guys can see the screenshot here, this is Doodoo, okay? So Doodoo is working. And then when I asked -

0:54Neil Patel:Do you want to explain what Doodoo is? because people, if they don't listen to the last episode, they won't know.

0:58Eric Siu:Yeah, Dudu is my MetaMuse bot, okay? And it looks like this. And this is just the MetaMuse icon, actually. So earlier I had mentioned that I wanted to classify. So I have about 116 ,000 followers on Instagram. And so I was like, hey, I want you to do a call and see who's actually influential and who's a founder, who's an investor, who's an entrepreneur, just like who's in travel, who's in hospitality and all that stuff, right? to see if we can somehow collaborate or whatever. So Jev said, hey, this will cost 116 ,000 stage one calls to$2.34. And they would do another run, which total would be$3.35, right?

1:36Eric Siu:So what am I showing you here? What Jev is, just to back up a second, is Jev is a classifier, okay? So when you have, let's say, Neil, you have like 1 ,000 people apply to work at MP Digital. Do you want to sort through all those people? And even if you had a human sort through all those people, it wouldn't be that accurate, right? It was just, one, it would take forever. two it wouldn't be that accurate because at a certain point as a human like i would just start to try to game it right because i don't want to review all of them what jeff can do is it can say oh uh you know let's only talk to people that's only shortlist people that have two promotions at two different companies and have an average uh you know three-year tenure for mid-senior level people or you can just say what i said earlier like hey have jeff scan all the people who follow you on instagram founders investors influencers recruits hell even use it for people that you want to date right maybe there's someone really interesting that follows you right based on the values that you have.

2:23Eric Siu:You could have Jeff classify that for you, right? You could have it scan all the stuff that you bookmark on Instagram and scrape all the hooks to offers and creatives that they use. You can use Jeff to scan all of your external content to determine your best content spikes, then draft the best, then have Jeff evaluate the content quality, enforce content guidelines, and avoid duplicate content. So to me, this is a major unlock from a quality AEU SEO scaling standpoint, right? Because the problem with AI is like, if you're just creating a bunch a slot, you're not actually comparing it to what you've already published and what your quality guidelines are, right?

2:56Eric Siu:So that's a big deal to me, especially considering, Neil, we spend all this time creating this content, right? We already did this before. Hours and hours a week, we spend time creating this content, but we're not maximizing it. This can help us maximize it, right? Scan all your customer calls for case studies, objections, churn risks, et cetera, right? And I mentioned this earlier, just scan all inbound and outbound recruits, run them through your talent evals to shortlist people at lightning fast speed. So anyway, that's the power of this.

3:21Neil Patel:Have you ever used Muse to connect to your email and start sending out emails for you? Yeah. So I've been doing it with all of our M &A deals. Because if I look at almost every single M &A deal that we've done, it tends to be deals that we've talked to two, three years ago. We couldn't get a valuation that made sense for us back then. And then two, three years later, they accept the valuation terms that we're willing to offer. And I don't blame people for this. every entrepreneur believes in their company. And if they have a bad year, they can fix it. And the next year is going to be super amazing.

3:56Neil Patel:And they did all these things. As an entrepreneur, if you don't drink your own Kool-Aid, I don't know if you're meant to be an entrepreneur. I hate to say that, but it is true. You really need to have some sort of delusion. It's called naive optimism, Neil. There you go. And I like people who have naive optimism. So I had an issue in which, this is just me. I'm not saying I'm right or wrong. I never really trusted Anthropic and OpenAI. I still don't. I trust a Facebook, a Microsoft, a Google. I'm not saying some companies do evil things and others don't. Just for me, Meta was in a lawsuit for child stuff.

4:33Neil Patel:I know the settlement was in 11 digits, so over 10 billion or something like that. I know it was under 20. It was 16, 18, 14 something. I know there was some caveat if they can get some of the other platforms to join along and make the changes, the settlement's cheaper for them, whatever it may be. Either way, it was a lot of money. I trust Facebook more with my data and Google more with my data and Microsoft more with my data and even Amazon than I do with a lot of these up and coming startups, even though OpenAI and Anthropic aren't really startups from a valuation perspective. I just don't trust them with data.

5:07Neil Patel:This is just me personally. I trust Facebook. Facebook being a publicly traded company, There's more regulation. It's global. They're going to get their butts sued if they do some funny business. And I'm okay willing to take that risk with Facebook, but I'm not willing to take that risk with OpenAI or Anthropic. Definitely not like a deep seek or anything like that, but I will for Microsoft, Facebook, Google, and Amazon. But this is just my personal two cents. I don't know how you feel with that.

5:37Eric Siu:So wait, were we talking about trust? I'm trying to figure out where you're trying to go with that.

5:41Neil Patel:No, like I'm now having it do a lot of my follow-up emails and I'm getting a lot of responses from it. So it's actually working out well, but I'm able to do so much more with AI these days than I was months ago due to the fact that I trust Facebook and I'm allowing it more access than I would with the other AI platforms out there. But that's just me. That's fair. I trust NVIDIA. If NVIDIA wants to do something and get access to my data, I don't have an issue with that. But for some reason with Anthropic and OpenAI, I can't. On the flip side, if Grok wanted access, I also trust him for some reason.

6:18Neil Patel:And I'm not saying Elon's better or worse than any of those people has nothing to do with it. It's just for me, corporate trust, Apple's another one. I would actually put Apple at the top of the list. If Apple had a Muse, I would let it have access to my bank account. Straight up, I wouldn't be worried about it if it was Apple. So let me say - I wouldn't trust Facebook with my -

6:34Eric Siu:If you're building an e-commerce brand, you should check out DTC pod hosted by Ramon Berrios and Blaine Bolas on the HubSpot podcast network. They speak with founders, marketers, creators, agencies, and platform experts about what it actually takes to grow a direct to consumer business from paid ads and influencer marketing to conversion, email, brand building, and consumer trends. I particularly enjoyed their conversations around scaling a brand without losing what made customers care in the first place. Listen to DTC pod, wherever you get your podcasts. All right. So I wanted to take a moment to tell you about my podcast co-host, Neil's agency called NP Digital.

7:09Eric Siu:And they work with a whole host of global companies or a global organization. Also, Neil has SEO tools such as Ubersuggest and Answer to Public. All you have to do is go to npdigital.com to learn more, and we'll see you on the other side. So let me make a prediction here. Okay. So all of these, Google, Apple, they will all have their own version of Muse. Because remember back in the day, Neil, when I was talking about earlier this year, when I was talking about OpenClaw and Hermes, This is just OpenClaw and Hermes. In fact, the Muse architecture is built off the OpenClaw architecture, right? Like a lot of the ideas, like they call like a soul.md file and all that.

7:42Eric Siu:So here's the thing, and there's no right or wrong here, right? Like remember guys, early days, I was like January, I was on OpenClaw already, right? And then Hermes came out and I was on Hermes, right? And so it's not saying that there's a right or wrong here because there are no solutions, only trade-offs, right? So the trade-off here is if you use Hermes and OpenClaw early, you're taking a lot more risk because you're setting it up yourself and you don't know what's gonna happen. but it could delete all your stuff, right? And I've seen that happen, but that was a risk that I was willing to accept, right?

8:07Eric Siu:It was the uncertainty piece that we're talking about a little earlier, right? Now with Muse and GrokBot, you have a lot more certainty. And I think people should certainly be using both Muse and GrokBot because I'm just using both those now. I just getting stuff done. And the funny thing is, Neil, we had a conversation earlier this week talking about M &A, right? Almost a lot of the stuff that we talked about, I built it in and I'm having Jeff just classify, you know, M &A deals that I might be potentially looking for. But keep in mind, Neil has some different patterns that he's talking about here, where he's like, hey, What he typically sees is like for his deal sizes, usually he's not going to get a deal done for two to three years.

8:38Eric Siu:So he can observe and he can probably make lookalikes off of that using Jev. And so the world is his oyster now by having a Grokbot and a Muse plus a Jev to classify everything. And you know, all I do, Neil, when I wake up, I have anxiety. You know why? Because I don't want to talk to anybody yet. I need to get the agents going first and then I'm good for the rest of the day. I just need to make sure to get everything they need because I know they're reliable and they just get shit done now. Pardon my language. I still use Hermes, just not as much anymore. but GrokBot and Muse, man. And like once Google comes online, Apple comes online, I'm just gonna be on those things all day.

9:08Eric Siu:And you're probably gonna need like a super meta agent managing all of those.

9:11Neil Patel:Dude, I didn't tell you this. So if I'm not mistaken, OpenClaw did a deal with OpenAI, right? And I actually forgot about OpenClaw. Like literally I forgot about it until you just mentioned it. But yeah, Muse is pretty much alternative to it, right? Like when I thought about Muse, it never hit me about OpenClaw. But there was something interesting that, I interacted with yesterday. So I was at Social Next, which was a conference in Vancouver yesterday. Okay. And you saw a lot of startups, you saw a lot of midsize businesses, even some enterprise businesses. Someone came up to me and they were complaining about their, someone on their marketing team.

9:51Neil Patel:Someone on their marketing team was selling, this company is a large company. They're also based out of San Francisco, but they have offices throughout most of the parts of the world. And they were complaining to me how they were using AI to help them manage their ads. Okay. And the AI spent a hundred, I think they said 112 ,000 Canadian. So I don't know what that is in USD. Call it like 75, 78 ,000 USD. I'm rounding here. and it only brought in three to four thousand Canadian dollars in revenue. So call it, let's just call it 3000 USD. Okay. I know it's probably a little bit less than that, 2000 something, but either way, you know, they were blaming the AI for this, like no joke.

10:40Neil Patel:They were blaming AI for their failed ad campaign and they were pissed and they had an internal meeting. They told me he met up with his boss and they're discussing what AI solutions they should use instead because it messed up. And he said, what would you do? And I said, do you want my honest answer? I don't want to be, I don't want to come off as rude. Or do you want me to just sugarcoat it? I'm like, what do you want? He's like, no, I want the real answer. I'm like, I would have written you up and potentially fired you. And he's like, why? I didn't mess up the AI mess up. I'm like, no, you're the one who told the AI to manage the campaigns.

11:14Neil Patel:You set it up. It's your responsibility. No one held a gun to your head and said, you have to use AI to help you do this. You could have done it manually. and no one said you shouldn't use AI, but if you're in charge of it and you didn't keep track of it, because I said, in reality, when did you check the campaign to see if it was performing? He's like, after we spent over$100 ,000, I'm like, that's the problem. You could have checked the first day, the second day, the third day. I'm like, how many days did it go? And he said, it went for roughly 40 days. I'm like, this is your problem. You didn't supervise it.

11:47Neil Patel:You didn't check. I'm not saying AI is good or bad. you could have caught it early on enough and realize there's something wrong but you decided not to pay attention this is your fault it's not hey how do we uh what ai system should we use instead in the future it's how'd you use the ai and why did it do it wrong what inputs did you give what instructions did you give and i'm like this is all the person who's behind the technology and i'm like this is the problem i'm like you either need to learn how to use it right or you need to go into a different role or don't use the technology at all and do it manually.

12:23Eric Siu:I'm actually curious, how did they react to that?

12:27Neil Patel:They went from, they first asked me for advice in a picture to they got my advice and they walked away.

12:34Eric Siu:Yeah. So it went from, they were so excited to meet you, get a picture to, hey, I would fire you.

12:39Neil Patel:Yeah. Well, I told them the truth. Like, I'm just being honest. I wasn't trying to be mean to them. I'm like, I know I sounded mean at that moment, but if I tell them a bullshit answer, like, yeah, dude, the AI is wrong, I hate to say they're not gonna learn and improve in their life. I think I gave them the right response for them to improve as an individual and do better in the workforce. I think it would be a disservice if I lied to them and be like, give them a pat, I'm like, it's all right, dude, next time. You know, I'm like, no. And this is a billion plus dollar organization, not a market cap.

13:10Neil Patel:I'm talking about a revenue. They're much more than a billion dollars. But of course their boss is, pissed off and I would be pissed off too and I would fire the person. Yep.

13:17Eric Siu:Because you know what? It's the boss's fault now. It is the boss's fault. The boss looks bad. Yep. And then guess what? It rolls all the way up to the CEO for permitting the boss to make a hire like that and to tolerate. So everything kind of goes up, right?

13:31Neil Patel:Eric is right. Normally, yes. But at this size of organization, when someone does like six, seven billion in revenue, it's too small to roll up to the CEO. But either way, they're looking bad.

13:40Eric Siu:Yeah. Well, I'm just saying that everything that happens is because of the CEO's decisions downstream.

13:45Neil Patel:Yes, you're totally right. So even though it doesn't roll up to the CEO, the CEO put this mindset in an organization, use AI. And this is why they were all AI forward and AI pill like, yeah, use it. We're all AI pill. Look how much we do with AI. Being AI pill does not mean you're actually creating good outputs. It just means you're using AI heavily and you're all about AI, but it doesn't actually mean you're effective and productive with AI. There's a lot of people who use AI and actually get less done or sorry, they get more done in the day, but they produce less results because they're working on crap that has nothing to do with their main KPIs.

14:19Neil Patel:But it does start with the top because that came from there, but I still don't blame the top. The top never said, don't check your work until 40 days later.

14:26Eric Siu:So this goes back to the same thing I was mentioning earlier in this podcast, right? Like, even though I pushed the AI nativist at my company, I'm finding I'm spending more time today talking about things like slop cannons and slop grenades, right? And having to create workflows to kind of fix that. And the good thing is, by the way, I can have Jeff again. Here comes Jeff again. I can evaluate all these things before I have to review it. And by the way, if it keeps calling out the same people over and over, that's not a good thing, right? And so the other thing I've been saying, Neil, is think about this.

14:54Eric Siu:Let me ask you a question here, right? If you apply leverage to a poor real estate investment, what happens?

15:01Neil Patel:You owe the bank money and then you're screwed.