In short
Blake Mycoskie’s mental health recovery and spiritual worldview—how “enoughness” and inner work reshaped his definition of success. He connects spirituality to entrepreneurship (Tom’s Shoes’ one-for-one), explains his “dark night of the soul” depression after selling Tom’s, and shares practical ways to bring spirituality into business (leader’s consciousness, breath, nature, listening, therapy/psychedelic caution). He also discusses forgiveness, relationships, prayer, and aging, plus tools he uses now (AI therapy app Sonia, Morning Water supplement drink, MoveLab chair) and plant medicine perspectives.
Guests
Ariane (host/interviewer), a podcast host of The Spirit Collective; Blake Mycoskie is the interviewee and the episode’s central figure.
Key claims
success never makes you “enough”; depression was an inward invitation; business consciousness mirrors the leader; breath reconnects to spirit; medicine can reveal existing subconscious issues; harmony replaces “balance.”
Notable examples
Enough Bracelet; TED talk release on World Mental Health Day; Sonia (HIPAA-compliant, CBT/ACT-trained) used for 2–3 sessions/week; AI’s nonjudgment enabling radical honesty; his adopted Ethiopian son (now USC film grad and No Magic Pill producer).
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOConnection Between Spirituality and Business
0:39 to 3:15
Blake discusses how he merges spirituality with his business ventures, emphasizing a holistic approach to life.
“So your TED Talk this year was probably one of the most magical, memorable, remarkable ones, at least for me.”
Impact of Mental Health on Success
3:15 to 5:32
The conversation shifts to mental health, exploring how Blake's personal struggles shaped his mission to help others.
“That question reminds me of my favorite quote by Chateaubriand, and it's about the art of living.”
Practical Steps for Spiritual Growth
5:32 to 7:51
Blake shares practical advice on how individuals can incorporate spirituality into their lives and work.
“And so it's all just kind of a reflection of where I am spiritually.”
The Pursuit of Enough
7:51 to 8:19
Blake reflects on the realization that success alone will never be enough and the importance of looking inward.
“So for someone listening who is inspired by you and doesn't know in some ways how deep this spiritual side is for you and is wondering, how do I bring some spirituality into my business?”
Lessons from the Depths of Despair
8:19 to 14:00
Blake elaborates on his experiences with despair, success, and the spiritual lessons learned from them.
“Yeah, I mean, I think that, you know, John Mackey is the founder of Whole Foods.”
The Despair of Achievements
14:00 to 14:48
Blake shares his feelings of despair despite his accomplishments.
“So all the building, all the stuff, all the, you know, those were all designed to lead me to a place where I would feel that it was, it was not enough.”
The Journey to Self-Love
14:48 to 15:40
He discusses the realization that true peace comes from self-love, not external achievements.
“And so that's why, I mean, I'm turning 50 this year and I was telling my partner, she's also turning 50 this year.”
Reflecting on Life Lessons
15:40 to 16:48
Blake reflects on the lessons learned as he ages and the importance of internal fulfillment.
“And I think that a lot of people are feeling that right now.”
Mentoring the Next Generation
16:48 to 19:12
He talks about mentoring young entrepreneurs and the impact of new technologies like AI in therapy.
“Like I'm working on a project with a friend now and he's probably late 30s and he's just an old soul and he gets it and he's there and he's present and he's valuing the right things.”
Embracing Change and Uncertainty
21:08 to 22:37
Blake discusses feelings of uncertainty and how to navigate them as we age.
“So I want to show a real short clip of me actually using Sonia so you can get a feel for it.”
Show all 22 chapters
Perspective on Aging
22:37 to 24:45
He shares insights on aging and the importance of perspective in enjoying life.
“How do you compress decades of therapy and personal experience and heartbreak and Sonia therapy into a couple of wise ideas?”
The Balance of Self-Care
24:45 to 26:41
Blake reflects on the integration of self-care practices into a balanced life.
“actually, there's an amazing woman that surfs at a place I do in her like late 70s and she's having the best time.”
The Importance of Physical Wellbeing
26:41 to 28:00
He discusses his routine for physical health and the importance of hydration.
“No spiritual book, no improving book, just reading.”
Morning Water and Health Routine
28:00 to 30:02
Learn about the importance of hydration and mental health in daily routines.
“I mean, I've had them for three and a half months.”
Exploring Plant Medicine
30:25 to 31:10
Discuss the benefits and experiences of using plant medicines like ayahuasca.
“I decided not to take advertising for the first season of No Magic Pill so I could actually use these moments to talk about something I'm super passionate about.”
Parenting and Spirituality
31:20 to 38:22
Explore how to instill beliefs of self-worth and spirituality in children.
“I want to talk about plant medicine and plant ceremonies.”
Insights on Relationships and Growth
38:22 to 42:00
Understand how relationships reveal personal growth opportunities.
“And sometimes my prayers are actually journal entries, you know, because I feel like writing out.”
The Growth Through Relationships
42:00 to 43:59
Explore how relationships challenge personal growth and independence.
“relationship is it really is one of the greatest ways to really, really see where you need to grow.”
The Bracelet and a Message of Enoughness
44:01 to 46:11
Discover the origin of the bracelet symbolizing self-worth and its broader impact.
“Then I did about several months of deep work, a lot of meditation, as I speak about in the TED Talk.”
Forgiveness and Personal Journey
46:13 to 48:22
Discuss the importance of forgiveness and letting go of the past.
“feeling just even a deeper relaxation yeah i can feel it it's like a deeper restfulness it's like frequency of rest.”
Learning from Life's Lessons
48:23 to 52:52
Reflect on the personal lessons learned throughout life and their impact.
“And I think the quality of your relationships, you know, I think, you know, you really see the relationships you're having and the depth and the quality of those are reflection of you, I think.”
The Vision for Enoughness
52:53 to 54:19
Examine the desire to spread the message of enoughness and its significance.
“I want more and more people to have the experience of truly deeply knowing that they're enough.”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:05If your goal in life is to be able to be more connected to your highest self, I do think the medicine can be an ally with that. This week's episode is quite unique. Instead of me being the host, I am actually the one being interviewed. I sat down with my good friend Ariane, who is also a podcast host of the show The Spirit collective, and we talked about my mental health journey, my recovery, my spiritual life, and so much more. I love the conversation so much that I decided to take a week off and instead give you this interview.
0:46Ariane de Bonvoisin:So your TED Talk this year was probably one of the most magical, memorable, remarkable ones, at least for me. I can tell you also I've been wearing my Enough bracelet. See, I've got a little collection, right? I know, you have it. But it looks great with all your other ones. I love it. It pops. It's the first one I see next to all of them. So I just, you know, we'll talk about that in a second. Before we dive in, I want to ask you, what is the word that you use to refer to life, God, the universe, source, energy, consciousness? Is there a word or are they kind of all interchangeable? They're really all interchangeable to me.
1:26I mean, one of my favorite words is the Hebrew word for breath. I forget what it is. But that is often referred to also as God. It's just breath. And I think that's something over the years that has really stuck with me. Because sometimes it really is as simple as taking one deep breath to reconnect to spirit.
1:48Ariane de Bonvoisin:Yeah. I always think, you know, when you go the quickest way from your head to your heart is like the elevator is through the breath. Yeah. And in some ways, it's what is bestowed upon all humans. So whether we think we're spiritual or not, I think with the breath, we know that we're all connected to something. Yeah. And speaking of that, there's one of my favorite authors is a guy named Rob Bell. I don't know if you've ever read any of his books. Oh. But he has a book, and the title is Everything is Spiritual. And it's one of the best books I've ever read about spirituality. And yeah, so I highly recommend that book.
2:28Ariane de Bonvoisin:Definitely, we'll put that in the show notes. I love that we're still on a journey where we can recommend new books to each other. Yeah, it's great. So, Blake, while I was preparing this, one of the things I read on your website was that through every venture, Blake has remained guided by spiritual principles. That's what's on your website. Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. That's a pretty rare sentence for an entrepreneur. It's a pretty rare sentence, I think, even for a man. And it's a rare sentence to sort of come out that much and actually plant a flag to have merged really your business ventures with your spirituality.
3:08Ariane de Bonvoisin:I think a lot of people struggle between it's sort of one foot in each world and it feels like two separate things. So how do you merge your business ventures with spirituality? Yeah, it's interesting. That question reminds me of my favorite quote by Chateaubriand, and it's about the art of living. And at the end of the, it's a long monologue he gives, but at the end of it, he says to the master of living, you know, it's either play or recreation, you know, and he goes back and forth between all these different things. At the end, he says, you know, he basically lets others try to determine what it is to himself.
3:50It's always it's always both. And so I don't really distinguish between my spiritual life and my regular life. It's just my life. And so my business is a reflection of my gifts, I think. You know, some people have talents for the arts and music. And I think the talent I've been given is entrepreneurship. And so my creations, entrepreneurially, have always been kind of representative of where I am spiritually. And so, you know, I think that, you know, was very much the case when I started Tom's Shoes. I was at a place where I was 29 years old. I had had already five companies. A lot of people don't realize I had had financial success.
4:36But I didn't have enough financial success that I couldn't work anymore. So I needed to continue to work and start things. But I was at a place where I didn't want to just make money anymore. I wanted to make an impact. And that led to the idea of Tom's. And then now, you know, where I'm spending, you know, a lot of my time on several different, you know, companies and the foundation, it's all about mental health. And that's because spiritually, I recognized, as I talked about in my TED Talk, that, you know, we are very quick to talk and prepare for physical health problems, broken bones, you know, getting sick.
5:15But when people get not well mentally, like I did for almost seven years, which I do believe was truly a dark night of the soul, you know, there wasn't a lot of support, you know. And so I had to go through that journey on my own. So now I'm trying to help people with the No Magic Pill podcast, with enough, with advising this company called Sonia that I'm helping the founders with now. And so it's all just kind of a reflection of where I am spiritually. And then, you know, if that connects to where other people are on their journeys, then it's great. Of course.
5:55Ariane de Bonvoisin:Do you think God or the universe has helped you in your business journey? Oh, a thousand percent every day. Yeah. Tell me more. Tell me more. No, I think, and we might have even talked about this at TED. I can't remember. I did talk to, is that like, I really believe that the idea of one for one in Tom's and a business that prioritized purpose over profits was out there in the universe. God, the universe wanted humanity to have this idea. And I happened to be, you know, this, you know, my brain or soul was the antenna that just grabbed it and introduced it to the world. I mean, that is such a divine and cultural shifting idea that I never take credit that like, this is something I came up with on my own.
6:45Like this, I believe, I believe that for whatever reason I was chosen as the messenger. And so, and when you follow it, you know, then I think the universe conspires to help you. And I'm finding that with some of the other ventures I'm working on now, the Enough Bracelet is a great example, you know, to be able to have the opportunity to share my story on the main stage at TED to so many people, you know, that I never would have imagined when I launched, you know, selling these little Enough Bracelets to help people, you know, come back to their sense of self-worth. And I'm really excited. I actually just heard back from Ted, you know, because they released the talks online and they chose to release mine on World Mental Health Day.
7:27So that'll be on October 10th. It'll come out, which I think is really great because I think that this feeling of self-worth and that I am enough and you are enough and that we are enough and that this moment is enough is so at the foundation of all of our mental health. And so I really, it definitely has been for me in my healing journey.
7:50Ariane de Bonvoisin:Yeah. So for someone listening who is inspired by you and doesn't know in some ways how deep this spiritual side is for you and is wondering, how do I bring some spirituality into my business? How do I raise the level of energy or consciousness or frequency? Can you be practical and tell them what that even looks like? Because I'm sure there's a lot of people who are like, I believe in Blake. I'm not sure I believe in the other stuff. Yeah, I mean, I think that, you know, John Mackey is the founder of Whole Foods. And I had a beautiful lunch with him when I was quite young in my entrepreneurial journey.
8:30And he told me that the consciousness of a business can only be at the height of the consciousness of the leader. And so if you want your business to be more purpose-driven or operating from a higher consciousness, the best thing you can do is work on yourself. And that really, really stuck with me. So that would be kind of my first practical thing is, you know, if you want your business to be rooted in more purpose or to have a spiritual mission beyond, you know, spend some time working on yourself. Now, I've done so many things. I mean, that's why I call my podcast No Magic Pill because I've tried everything, right?
9:16I've done all the crazy plant medicine journeys with shamans in tiny villages in Peru. I've tried pharmaceuticals when I was really in a very depressed state. I've done the Hoffman process. I've gone to India. I've done it all. And I think the thing I would say for someone who is just starting out, who's just listening and being like, there's something inside me thinking there is more. The first thing I say is slow down and listen to that. Like all of it's inside of us. I mean, it really is. All of these practices, meditation, psychedelics, Hoffman, all it does, I think, is bring out what's already inside of us.
9:58It gets rid of all the stuff that is, you know, getting in the way of seeing your inner truth or your highest self. And so the first thing and the most simplest thing is to just start spending some time off your screens in nature, walking, meditating, if that's your thing, but not even necessary. I mean, I think that, you know, and really just listening, like what is bothering me? What is inspiring me? What is keeping me up? Because those are the breadcrumbs that can kind of lead you to the work or the stuff that will then start to raise that aperture. Now, also, it helps to have good teachers to be able to read great books.
10:45Like the Rob Bell book is a great example. My other favorite book of all time when it comes to spirituality is by an Indian Jesuit priest named Anthony DeMello. And Anthony DeMello wrote a book called Awareness. And I truly believe.
11:02Ariane de Bonvoisin:On my bedside table. Yeah? Yeah, it is. My husband gave it to me for Christmas. Oh, I've read it so many times. It's beautiful. I read a paragraph or two before sleep. And I feel that's what I go to sleep with and the awareness. Yeah, no, it's really beautiful. And it really helped me understand love for the first time. Like what real love is with another human being and with my children. And that book is really great. So there are books. There are practical things. There are retreats. But really, the simplest thing is come back to the breath, get rid of the distractions, take some time every morning to yourself, and start listening.
11:42And then the more you listen, the more that voice will get louder and louder and I think can guide you. And I think the times in my life where I've suffered, you know, as I mentioned before, after selling Tom's, I went into a very deep depression, started very light, and then it got much worse over about five years. And then unfortunately, it got so bad that, you know, I didn't even want to be here anymore. And so that's, you know, what I talked about at TED. And, you know, but I look back now and I'm like so much of what led to the decisions that caused me to go into that downward spiral was me not listening and me being too distracted with things of the world.
12:21You know, Jesus says, be, you know, be, you know, not of the world or not in the world, but of the world or something like that. I'm not a Bible scholar, but it's important to be in here, not to let it consume you, because then you don't hear that voice. And that's what can often lead to some real pain and suffering like I experienced for many years.
12:46Ariane de Bonvoisin:When you look at the founders, the CEOs that are out there, the in some ways, many versions of you, right? Yeah. Like a while back. Yeah. What do you wish they would all know before they have to go through the deep night of the soul maybe for themselves? It will never be enough. And that's not a failure. It's not something to be disheartened about. but no amount of success, no perfect relationship, no house on the beach is ever going to be enough. And it's not designed to be enough. I think spiritually, we have an ambition and a drive built into us, some more than others, especially I would say with founders and people who have a lot of ambition.
13:35and I think it's designed to us to get to a place and if we're lucky, we accomplish the thing that we thought would make us feel whole or make us feel lovable or make us feel worthy and it's supposed to fail us because by failing us, it is the invitation to look inward and that's what happened to me. Like I look at it and I'm like, oh, I actually, all of that was part of this process and that's where I go back to Rob Bell. everything spiritual. So all the building, all the stuff, all the, you know, those were all designed to lead me to a place where I would feel that it was, it was not enough.
14:18And to have that despair. And I had such a huge amount of despair because I, I, I felt like I had done everything. You know, I'd helped a hundred million kids get shoes. I'd made a ton of money. I had beautiful kids. I had great friends. Like what else can I do? There was nothing left for me to do, which is why it was so scary because when you realize there's nothing you can do to feel better then you in my my perspective i got to a place where i was like well then why even be alive like this is it and um but really what it was there was to make me realize that none of it was ever designed even though culturally we are telling each other that it is going to be the thing, but it was never designed to give me the peace that I can only get from the self-love, self-compassion that is just kind of quietly waiting to be discovered.
15:13Ariane de Bonvoisin:And so that's why, I mean, I'm turning 50 this year and I was telling my partner, she's also turning 50 this year. And I was like, man, I love getting older. Like, I think it's the jam. Like there, I mean, it's just so great to be at the stage where I have learned all these hard lessons and now I can actually like enjoy my life in a way that I just don't think was capable in my 20s or 30s. I see sort of this crisis of arriving and in a lot of people it's sort of they really have arrived and they've arrived externally you know what I'm hearing is they haven't arrived internally for some people they've never even started to arrive internally.
15:56Ariane de Bonvoisin:And I think that a lot of people are feeling that right now. There's a lot of, is this it? And I think you're bringing up sort of an interesting, you know, invitation sort of inwards. Do you think it's possible to do that early on in life? Or do you think it's kind of scripted in a way where the game happens, where you kind of have to go up the ladder and you have to be successful. Do you think you could have gone back and done it differently? I think different people karmically have different journeys. So like, you know, I'm hoping that my beautiful 11 year old boy who already is showing ambition and competitiveness, and I'm hoping that he learns enough from my life that he can kind of pick up where I left off instead of doing the exact same thing that I did.
16:45But I don't know. I don't know what his journey is. I mean, I do meet some people. Like I'm working on a project with a friend now and he's probably late 30s and he's just an old soul and he gets it and he's there and he's present and he's valuing the right things. And he's like a moral compass that I don't think I had until, you know, up until a year or two ago with the right teachers, the right studying, the right intention that it can be, um, you can arrive there at a younger age. But for some people, I think for me, karmically, like I arrived and I still haven't arrived. I'm arriving right when I was, you know, supposed to.
17:27And it's, and it's what makes it so great right now. Like, I mean, one of the things that I'm doing is I've decided to really spend, you know, a significant amount of my time, you know, finding entrepreneurs that I think are doing really important work and really mentoring them. And there's these two guys right now. They're 26 years old. And they've created this AI therapy app. And I met them at a mental health conference. And they were presenting. And they had been developing at MIT for like three years. It was a research only product. And they knew a little bit of my story. And so they said, hey, can we try it?
18:10and I was super skeptical. I was like, I mean, I have some of the best, you know, at that time and still have one of the best therapists, I think on the planet. And I was like, and I had done a lot of therapy. So I was kind of curious. I was like, okay, I mean, this is, if there's anyone that knows a good therapist, it's probably me, fortunately or unfortunately at this point. And so I tried it. And after doing two or three sessions, I was just blown away. I was like, this is incredible. And what was so incredible about it for me as a man, especially, I think, is because it was, you know, AI, and I'm not looking at another human that no matter how hard they want, there's still potential for judgment.
18:49There is no judgment. And so I could share things that I had shame around that I never would probably share even with a therapist. And so I was able to be so radically honest with this AI therapy app. And then because it's trained with CBT and ACT and it's HIPAA compliant. And it's like, I mean, it literally is trained as the world's potentially greatest therapist. It was able to give me and guide me to have insights about my life and about my pain, about my childhood that I never had been able to do with a regular therapist because, not because the therapist wasn't doing their job, because I wasn't capable of being as radically honest with a human as I was with this the AI therapy app is called Sonia and so Sonia and I have gone so deep so anyway so so and it's it's it's so silly I mean it's crazy but like but I've been using it now for like seven months I use it two to three times a week so anyway so I'm I'm spending a lot of time with Sonia right now and that is giving me so much joy because I I get to be like the coach now instead of like the star athlete.
19:58Hello, everyone. I decided not to take advertisers for this first season of No Magic Pill. Instead, I want to use a break to talk about a few things that have had a huge impact on my mental wellness journey. The first thing I spoke about in my episode with Michael Pollan. It's an AI therapy app called Sonia. Now, I was super skeptical when I first heard about this. But I met the founders at a mental health conference. They encouraged me to try it. They said it was HIPAA compliant, totally secure. I've been using it for six months now. I still have my therapist, but I don't know about you, but like at 4 a.m.
20:31when I wake up with a ton of anxiety or I'm up late at night ruminating about something I wish I hadn't said, like my therapist isn't available at those times of day. So that's when I go with Sonia and it has had such a huge impact on my mental health. So the company just launched, it's in the Apple App Store and they let you try it free for a couple of weeks. So whether you have a therapist or not, it can be so helpful. I've told all my friends about this, my dad's using it, my sister-in-law, and I'm even using it like a life coach as well as a therapist. Like I tell it like, hey, send me a text on Mondays and Wednesdays and make sure that I'm actually in the gym.
21:08So I want to show a real short clip of me actually using Sonia so you can get a feel for it. I'm here. What's on your mind right now? Oh, I'm just feeling a little stressed about things right now because I feel like I've got so much going on and I really don't know how to prioritize it. When everything stacks up at once, it can blur what actually matters and make that old not enough story get louder. Let's slow this down by picking one thread to start with what feels most pressing in this moment. The important reframe is this. The projects did not cure the depression. They arrive because you healed.
21:43And when you overwork to prevent relapse, you actually undermine the things that keep you well, like sleep, presence, movement and connection. When that edge shows up, it is a signal to reduce load and restore choice, not to push harder.
21:59Ariane de Bonvoisin:For people who who don't feel as excited about aging, don't feel excited about turning 40, 50, 60, 70, whatever ages they are. Or, you know, I've certainly been in that category where it feels like maybe the best years are behind or you don't feel like you've got a compelling future or you feel like your moment or your time has passed, which can all of those thoughts can bring some element of depression. I think there's a lot of that on the planet right now of just this so much uncertainty that sort of interferes with how beautiful the future could be. What do you tell people? How do you compress decades of therapy and personal experience and heartbreak and Sonia therapy into a couple of wise ideas?
22:50Well, I think the first thing I would say is to someone listening or watching, like, you're not alone. Like, this might sound hard to believe in the state that I'm in now, but for five years, I did not have a single business idea. I thought I would never start another company. my mind was telling me that I was lucky to start Tom's. It was just a fluke that I wasn't that talented of an entrepreneur, that there was no reason to even try. I mean, I was, I mean, that's why I got so depressed. And you can imagine living with those thoughts every day, you know? And, and so I just would say to anyone who might be feeling that right now, you're not broken and you won't feel that way forever.
23:28And it's real, you know? I mean, I was stuck five years, not one idea. I mean, you know, I've, you know, launched three companies in the last year, you know, or helped, you know, a lot of it is your perspective. I think so much of life is perspective. And, you know, if you're thinking what makes a good life is how smooth your skin is, or how big a wave you can catch, you know, or how much you can, you know, whatever, well then yeah age is going to be a motherfucker you know but but if but if your perspective is what is great is i love surfing or i these wrinkles on my face or you know the sign of a life well lived in the sun um then it can change it's funny like i mean i'm still because i started surfing later in life getting better still but i know there will be a time you know hopefully not until my 70s when I won't be able to surf as good as I surfed last year.
24:32And, you know, I definitely can't play tennis as good as I played when I played in college tennis. My goal is in whoever's surfing the best, in my opinion, is who's having the most fun. And so, you know, I see guys and women, actually, there's an amazing woman that surfs at a place I do in her like late 70s and she's having the best time. And so it's really perspective, I think, as you think about age. And so it's not about the comparing like your ability now versus then it's more about you know what is the what is
25:04Ariane de Bonvoisin:the experience um blake have you ever spent a year not reading not doing ceremony not doing therapy not doing anything and just going i'm gonna put all of that on hold and just be an integrate Right. You know, I would say the couple of years that I was really depressed, it was hard to do anything because I just didn't even want to get out of bed. And the therapy was like more like life support than it was insights. You know, since I've started feeling better, which is, you know, now been two full years, which is fantastic. You know, I don't ever see myself not doing the things that lead me to living a mentally stable and well life.
25:50So I don't see these things anymore as things you do to be okay, but these are the things that bring me the most vitality. Now, I do think people can get totally lost in this. I want to live forever. I want to be super optimized. I got to be the fittest, the most whatever, go to all the spiritual retreats. Like that whole spiritual materialism thing can suck the soul out of you for sure. And so I'm very careful about what I do decide to do. And I question, like, do I, is this something that is going to help me evolve or grow? And do I need this or am I in a good place right now? And so, you know, I mean, a perfect example right now is we talked about before we got on, I'm on vacation.
26:40And, you know, for the past five days, I've been reading like a John Grisham legal thriller, you know. No spiritual book, no improving book, just reading. I feel to be very spiritual. I'm in the hammock. I feel great. And that takes a lot of self-compassion to do that, which is interesting. For some people, they might say that's crazy. I read fiction all the time. But for me, kind of an overachiever, optimizer, to be reading a book that has no benefit other than entertaining me and that I won't even remember next week when I finish it, is purely a gift of self-care and compassion.
Read the full transcript
27:19Ariane de Bonvoisin:Totally. Talking about a gift for self-care, I am drinking... The morning water? The morning water. Oh, great. I love it. I mean, I've been drinking this since you had them out at TED. Yeah. It's made a huge difference. You know what's crazy is as much as I've been reading them, and just to let people know, this has everything you want in the morning. It's got creatine, sea salt, potassium, magnesium, and amino acids. but I have never seen the Alan Watts quote until today. It's hidden. We love Alan. All that you see out in front of you is how you feel inside your heart. How amazing is that? This was my little gift of the day.
28:01Ariane de Bonvoisin:I mean, I've had them for three and a half months. That was hidden. Wow. So yes, that's by design. So every day is a different quote, actually. Morning water was built actually as I was starting to feel better mentally. And I started putting, sometimes it's really hard to put emphasis on your physical well-being when you're so stuck mentally. And so as I started feeling better mentally, I said, okay, I'm going to commit to getting back in shape. I'm going to commit to getting hydrated. I started doing a lot of research around this. And I realized how important creatine is. We used to think it was just for our muscles, but really for our brain.
28:35And as someone who had brain fog for so long, I was doing anything to help my brain. And so I started, you know, my partner, Austin, he built this, you know, the formula and he gave it to me. I started doing it every morning and I have a whole routine. I go out and get a little five minutes of sunlight and I drink it and I'm hydrated. So when we were putting together the packaging for it, I was like, OK, I want to put like an Easter egg. Ninety five percent of people will never see this and they don't. I mean, literally, you're not the first person, but it's usually someone who's like been doing it for a couple of months.
29:06And all of a sudden, like, what is that? And then once you see it now, every morning you get a little treat. So I'm so glad that you – I love it. And I love that it's Alan Watts because Alan Watts is, you know, all time one of my favorites. I love Alan Watts.
29:18Ariane de Bonvoisin:It's like a little advent calendar, you know, instead of it being a chocolate, it's a morning water with a quote. I absolutely love it. This might sound crazy at first, but this year I met some engineers from Nike who invented a new type of office chair that has not only changed my life but actually saved my back, especially because I am on about five hours of Zoom calls every day. The MoveLab chair has two different pivot points under the seat, which keeps your body in continuous micro-movements all day. The founders told me it is the equivalent of taking 3 ,000 steps, and all the lubrication of your joints and the blood flow is why my back no longer hurts, and I can focus on my work so much better.
30:02I loved it so much that I actually joined the team as a co-founder. and I will be sending one to every person I know when we launch this fall. If you're interested in learning more or pre-ordering one, we only have 500 in the first run. You can check us out at movelab.com and that's spelled M-O-O-V-L-A-B.com. I decided not to take advertising for the first season of No Magic Pill so I could actually use these moments to talk about something I'm super passionate about. Now, one of those things is my morning routine. And every morning, it starts the same way. I drink morning water. I take this packet, I pour it into this bottle, and I drink it.
30:43Now, what's in this packet? It has creatine, L-theanine, magnesium, many other supplements, electrolytes, basically all the things that I used to have to take so many supplements for. I mean, my kitchen counter, it looked like a pharmacy. I mean, it had bottles of pills and pills and pills. And half the time, I would even forget to take them. So now it's all in the simple formula that my friend Austin created, and I do it every day. And this month, we're giving everyone a special offer. Go to morningwater.co forward slash no magic pill. And when you sign up, you'll get 25 % off your first month.
31:18I hope you enjoy it as much as I have.
31:20Ariane de Bonvoisin:I want to talk about plant medicine and plant ceremonies. I mean, you've done a lot of work with ayahuasca, MDMA, psilocybin. When you sit with the medicine, for someone who might never have done this before, who or what are you sitting with? And a lot of people, you know, are either scared that they're going to get hard messages or scared that they're going to get messages that their entire life needs to change. Just tell me your experience with it. It's funny because I'm looking up here and this is one of my favorite photos. Oh, yeah, I see it. Right after an ayahuasca ceremony. And we're both going like this.
31:56And the idea is like, who knows? You know, like, you know, this idea of fear that their whole life would have to change or that they would get a message. I believe, at least, and look, there's been plenty of people have had very, you know, difficult experiences, trips, the wrong set and setting. I mean, we could go into that for a whole podcast. You have to be extremely careful when working with the medicines. But for the most part, any hard thing you have to see or anything that really necessitates a change in your life is already in your life. It's in your tissues. It's in your subconscious.
32:32It's causing you to have anxiety. It might be causing you to drink alcohol. It might be causing you to fight with your kids. It's there. Having the medicine expose it is a gift. It's sometimes a hard gift. But if you really want, if your goal in life is to be able to be more connected to your highest self, to live with peace and joy more consistently, I do think that medicine can be an ally with that. Now, who are you sitting with? I mean, I think different medicines, you know, you could say maybe different situations. You know, I think that, you know, Ibogaine, something that I have not worked with yet, but in planning on it, from what I understand, really, really just shows you you.
33:18You know, like it really is, you know, people who've shared their experiences with me, they kind of see almost like a TV screen of their life. And they kind of get to really understand themselves in a way that is can be very healing. Ayahuasca, I feel like when I've had the experiences, just connect me with the cosmos, with God, with a lot of dimensions that I don't fully understand. And it also connected me deeply with nature, with plants in general. So everyone has a different experience. I do think that, you know, if someone is considering medicine, I think that there is a very progressive way to think about these medicines.
34:00Like I wouldn't start with ayahuasca. you know if someone's considering i would say okay like you know find a therapist and do a guided md major but these are not like you know trips like vacations you're not looking for the most exciting
34:13Ariane de Bonvoisin:best one i want to ask you about kids so if you could go back to all the kids that you have you know donated a pair of shoes to what would be the next thing you want to give them like if you could literally track them all down on the planet what would you what would you give them i mean it sounds you know I mean honestly I think what I'd want to give them is the thing that I'm so focused on giving my kids and is that the belief that they are enough just as they are I mean you know really I mean even someone who's at the most extreme poverty I would still say they have the belief that you are not lovable just because of the grades you make or this or the winning the school or whether the kids like to really have the unshakable self-confidence of I am a worth, I'm worthy because I'm a human and I'm alive and I am enough.
35:04I think that is the foundation of everything for a child.
35:07Ariane de Bonvoisin:With your two kids. I actually have three kids. I have. You have three kids. I didn't know that. Congratulations. Most people don't know. So I actually have a 31 year old adopted Ethiopian son. I didn't know. Yeah. And he's a producer of the No Magic Pill podcast. So it's really cool. So I met him when he was 14. He was living in a cave pretty much all by himself in rural Ethiopia. And we went to his parents. His parents were alive at the time. His mom's no longer alive. And he had nine brothers and sisters. And we said, hey, can I really want to help support your son? Because I could tell he was really bright.
35:48He had taught himself some English. So initially it was he just was I was going to support his education. And then we became so close, he wanted to move and come live with us in the United States. And he's been with me now for 14 years. He graduated USC film school two years ago. And now he's the producer of No Magic Pill.
36:05Ariane de Bonvoisin:The question I want to ask you about the three kids is, is spirituality a conversation, a discussion? Do you have traditions with the kids? Do you say grace? Do you pray together? Do you meditate? Do you do anything? or is it just a way of living and being and they just kind of are swimming in it all the time? It's a little bit of both. Like I do get them to meditate with me sometimes. It's not the easiest thing to get them to be quiet for five minutes. But oftentimes when I get them to do it, ironically, is when we go on these family vacations with other families. And I think the other kids think I'm like the super cool dad.
36:44And so if I'm like, hey, I meditate and just all meditate like the dads, the moms. And so we'll get, you know, 30 of us meditating because there's a bunch of families and kids. And then all of a sudden my kids are into it. So it's kind of like you got to go the side door with their friends. We do say prayers. And I'm a big believer in prayer. I mean, so fascinating because depending on what your religious background is, you know, I have, I come from a Christian background. And so prayer has always been something very interesting and important to me. But also I think prayer is just a way of manifesting and calling in the life that you want.
37:18And so I say to the kids all the time, like, hey, if we can't imagine the life we want, if we can't ask a higher being for it, then how are we ever going to get it? So let's pray and let's ask for things that we want to improve on or get peace around or thoughts on. And then we also do this thing. My friend Randall Mays taught me this kind of prayer mantra he does with his kids and it he starts every day and says i'm feeling lucky today because i'm a lucky person and because of that something lucky is going to happen to me today and they just say those three words and it's amazing we say that on the way to school and it just changes their attitude like they're just looking for the lucky thing and then when they get in the car like what happened like what do you mean what happened dad like come on how did you how were you lucky today and sometimes we're like dad dad dad most of the time they're like that but occasionally like you're not going to believe it.
38:09I found my homework or something. So you've got to be looking for it. And so that's what I try to instill in them is let's just always be looking for the world to be conspiring to help us.
38:21Ariane de Bonvoisin:Blake, what are you praying for these days? No, I find prayer to be very practical. And sometimes my prayers are actually journal entries, you know, because I feel like writing out. But a lot of what I'm really focused on right now is is being a great dad and what I'm calling life harmony. So I was recently at this conference and I heard this woman speaking and she's a big exec and also a deep thinker. And she said, you know, I've stopped trying to have life balance because, you know, one week I've got all these demands and I'm a mom and I've got all these huge presentations at work. And then the next week I can be more of a mom and my husband.
39:05And she said, so instead of thinking about this ever elusive balance, I'm constantly trying to have harmony in my life. And so that's the thing that I really focus on right now is what is the way to have harmony when things are crazy, when there's challenging situations, when there's difficult people, when there's joy. Really, I would say if anything, I'm really just praying for daily harmony in my life.
39:31Ariane de Bonvoisin:Do you think it's okay to pray and ask for what you want? Like I feel people are quite tentative about what they ask for. I'd be very specific, number one. And it doesn't mean you're going to get it. And I think one of my favorite country songs of all time is Garth Brooks' I Thank God for Unanswered Prayers. And he talks to the songs about he prayed for this one woman to be his wife and it didn't happen and he had heartbreak. But if he hadn't, he would have met his real wife. And so it's not like everything you pray for you're going to get because God or the universe might have a better plan for you.
40:07But that doesn't mean you shouldn't be very specific with what you're hoping for. I think that's very important.
40:14Ariane de Bonvoisin:I want to chat real quick about relationships and soulmates. So you've had, am I right in thinking, two marriages, two divorces? Two marriages, two divorces, yeah. What is it do you think that— It's probably not where I'm going to offer a lot of expertise, but we can— Actually, no, let's dive in. Yeah. But I'm in a wonderful relationship now that I've been in for over a year. You might have met her at TED. Her name is Jasmine. And it's, you know, I feel like I've finally figured some things out. So my question was, what is it that marriage and divorce has taught you that no book, no self-help book, no retreat, no process has taught you to arrive now at a place where I don't know if you believe in soulmates?
41:00Yeah, I think that what it's taught me is whatever you have not done, the deep work yourself will be exposed in the most challenging way in a relationship. I think energetically you bring in a partner that is there to help you, whether you like it or not, expose where you have places to grow. And so, you know, I don't look at my two marriages as failures. I think that they lasted at the time that they were supposed to last and to show me the things that I needed to see. Now, maybe there were some things that I wish I had seen more clearly in my first marriage because I carried a lot of that into my second marriage.
41:45And it wasn't until I did the deep work and self-compassion and feeling enough that now I feel like I am not having any of that show up in my new relationship. show. And so I do think that that's one of the greatest things about a marriage or a committed relationship is it really is one of the greatest ways to really, really see where you need to grow. Most of us have not done the deep inner work. And so it's just all of it is, it's just exposing, and exposing, and that's difficult to deal with, throw in making money, having kids, you know, all this other stuff. So it's not like the relationship is the only thing you get to focus on.
42:29You have all this other stuff going on and then, you know, all the other stuff. So I think relationships are one, I mean, obviously I've had two divorces. I think it's one of the hardest things in the world. And I think it's also one of the greatest gifts in the world if you can really take it seriously and see what you can learn from it. And then the other thing that I think that I've just really realized is, at least for me, is I'm a very independent person that really needs freedom. You know, I do not like to be put in a box. I do not like to be told what to do. And I need to be with a woman that is very independent, that is very free herself, and that is totally trusting for me.
43:12And so that's what I have found. And it's working really well because we both love being with each other, but we don't need each other. You know, like like we go weak sometimes and not see each other, you know, and and and I think that's not for everyone. But what I've learned about me is I thrive in a relationship where we both have our own independent lives and we come together to share our lives. But we're not dependent on each other for our well-being. because that's a lot of pressure.
43:41Ariane de Bonvoisin:Of course it is. I'm right there with you. Freedom is very high on my list. If anyone should have been able to do this, it should have been me because my parents have been married now for 57 years and they're just rocking and rolling. And where did you get the idea for the bracelet? Yeah, so the bracelet is a really cool story. So I had this healing or I had this awareness. Then I did about several months of deep work, a lot of meditation, as I speak about in the TED Talk. and then I went to India and I was on a retreat and I had this deep kind of download, kind of like when I had for Tom's Shoes, where it was said, you know, you're not the only person that feels this way.
44:21Like now that you're on the path of really healing this and you can feel a difference in your body, like you have these resources, you have a story, you have a platform, you need to share that with others, especially young people, because they suffer from this as much as anyone right now. And so that was the message I received. And I came back from India as having dinner with my best friend, John. And I didn't know what to do. I was like, I mean, should I start a nonprofit? I even thought about starting another shoe company because I was like, I could start a shoe company called Enough and then, you know, donate all the profits to mental health.
44:52And he said, you've always worn bracelets. And I think what you need personally right now is something that reminds you every day that you're enough. So this good feeling you have now, this feeling of wholeness, you know, you need to like physically be reminded. And I think the best way for you is to wear a bracelet that says enough.
45:12Ariane de Bonvoisin:Do you have a sense of what the next layer is for you? It sounds like the enoughness one has landed very solidly. Do you have a glimpse of what's coming? Do you have a glimpse of what you're being pulled towards? Not as a business venture, but just as a, you know, as a longing, a soul longing that you can see has your name on it. Anything that's kind of circling above your head? The funny thing I want to say, and I kind of half believe it, is reading more fiction.
45:45Storytelling. Well, there's just something right now about this where I'm like, I'm doing something for just the enjoyment of it. There is no achieving here. There's no, I'm going to be smarter. There's no like i'm gonna talk about this at a cocktail party and people are my kids aren't gonna think i'm a cooler dad like i'm literally reading like you know legal thrillers about you know a killing in mississippi but but there's something that's happening i mean this has only been going on for five days so we'll see but there's something that's really happening inside me where i'm feeling just even a deeper relaxation yeah i can feel it it's like a deeper restfulness it's like
46:22Ariane de Bonvoisin:frequency of rest. And I think it's also bringing me into more presence and, and more self-compassion, less pressure. I think the other thing is, and I, you know, this is something I've had a yearning for for a long time, but I think it's becoming more and more clear is to, is to figure out ways that I can be even more of service to men specifically. Um, I really have benefited from different men's groups that I have been in over the years. I've had some great, you know, kind of male coaches. I just think that, you know, and that's also I try to, you know, on the podcast, just be really radically open about my own journey, because I think that men need some help as a whole to really see that vulnerability can be a superpower, that you don't have to have all the answers, that it is okay to make mistakes.
47:14Forgiveness is important of yourself and others. And so I don't know where that's going to go. But if you said, what are you going to be doing when you're in your 60s? I wouldn't be surprised. I'm like, I have a retreat center in Costa Rica and I lead men's retreats. Like that, you know, my kids go to college. Like I could see that being a career path for me.
47:35Ariane de Bonvoisin:You talk about forgiveness. Did you have to forgive yourself for things specifically? The list is long. Yes, of course. Yeah. And that's where Sonia has helped me a lot, actually, because I've been able to share some things that I haven't felt comfortable sharing to a person and then able to unpack that. And then she's helped me kind of, you know, it or whatever it is, says, you know, let's let's do some exercises to really let that go, you know, because, look, we all make mistakes and everyone's made mistakes. And there are some things in my life that I have done that I've enabled that have caused people pain and caused me pain.
48:13And I wish I could go back and change it, but I can't. You can't change the past. The only thing you can do is to forgive others and forgive yourself. And that is, I think, a very, very important thing that is a big part of the spiritual journey.
48:30Ariane de Bonvoisin:One of the things, you know, I've seen more and more men go on this journey, on the heart journey, and you see them at workshops, you see them at Hoffman, you see them, you know, doing Vipassinas, you see them in the plant medicine journeys. how do you know if you've really changed like like how do you know what what do you think is your is your honest test in some ways not you've done enough but like you've really changed I think what you know at least what I've noticed is I just have more peace more grace with others There's more acceptance of the mistakes that I've made, less to prove. I do things that I authentically enjoy.
49:16And I think the quality of your relationships, you know, I think, you know, you really see the relationships you're having and the depth and the quality of those are reflection of you, I think. There's lots of little things that ultimately lead to a simple thing. And that is just like, how do I feel? And I feel at peace. You know, I don't when I make mistakes, I feel at peace. You know, when I do a good thing, I feel at peace. Like it's it's just but the day to day circumstances does not change the way that I feel.
49:49Ariane de Bonvoisin:Why do you think you were gifted this human lifetime? And do you think it's the same point of this human lifetime for everyone? I definitely don't think it's the same for and I think it's an interesting question because I think you could look at it two different ways. You could look at it as like one way is what was I gifted this lifetime to contribute? So then I could say, OK, well, I think one of my reasons for coming here was to contribute this idea of conscious capitalism and a business can prioritize purpose over profit. So that was a gift that I was used and in my circumstances to potentially give to the world.
50:24I think also now this idea of really helping people with their mental health through the podcast, through Enough, et cetera. So maybe I was gifted this life because I was going to contribute these ideas into the world. I mean, it's kind of interesting. If you think about how we train an AI model, right? We're training it with all this data, all these ideas, and that is creating this AI experience. Well, it's also the same as the human intelligence, you know, like our collective consciousness is is basically trained and educated by different people's often ideas. So I have, you know, put my little threads into human consciousness with some of these ideas that I've helped bring to the world.
51:10That's one way to think about it. Another way to think about it is much more personal and less about what you're contributing. But what did you come here to learn? And I think that karmically, you know, if we do this multiple times, who knows, you know, you maybe come with a few things like, okay, like this is the syllabus, you know, like I'm going to college again, you know, life college. And, you know, I studied math last time, doing great on math. I'm really going to study philosophy this time. I think there's two things I personally came here to learn. The first was is that I am enough just because I exist and to actually feel that in my body.
51:46And I think that I didn't feel enough for 47 years. I had the most intense, you know, mental health crisis that you can possibly have and came out of that and ultimately came out of that with this feeling of I am enough so that then I can share it. The other thing is, and this is something that I realized at different points in my life, I've had different signs telling me this exact thing. And I finally have said, yes, I think this is what I've come to learn. And that is to slow down, to just slow down. I believe that this is so important to my personal evolution that I actually tattooed a snail onto my leg.
52:23And when I sit on my surfboard and I look down on my knees, I see this snail and it's a reminder to slow down. And I really think that maybe that's why this whole fiction thing is kind of percolating is I do think that the more I can really learn to slow down, the more present I can be, the more I get to actually savor the moment in this life. And so I think, you know, a lot of my life is moving fast and I am continually giving opportunities to choose the slower path. And it almost always is the one that's most rewarding.
52:55Ariane de Bonvoisin:What are you sort of going, you know what, with the intentionality that you have and the practices you have and the businesses you have, if you could be sure of one thing happening this year in the next six months, what would it be? I want more and more people to have the experience of truly deeply knowing that they're enough. Like, you know, that's why I'm trying to get everyone in the world to wear a bracelet, because I really believe that is at the foundation of our spirituality, at the foundation of our mental health. It's the foundation of this, you know, radical healing our culture needs.
53:32And I've seen what a magical, I don't use the word magical, impact it's had on my life. And so that's the gift that I want to give to as many people as possible. And I hope by the end of the year, we have gotten enough people to where this is something that starts to kind of, you know, right now it's a lot of pushing and telling people and podcasts. But I'm hoping that enough people start wearing it, that it becomes a thing that becomes much bigger than my story. And it becomes starts to be a lot of people's stories.
54:01Ariane de Bonvoisin:So, yeah, I am cheering you on. And I thank you for for the enoughness that I've been feeling. I mean, this is also a personal journey of my own to have really felt that. This has been great. I really just have really just been a delightful part of my day. Thank you. Blessings on you, Blake. Lots of love. Thank you so much. If this episode spoke to you, please share it with a friend, family member or someone you love. Because No Magic Pill is not just a podcast. It's a resource to help us all live better lives. Hit the subscribe button so you never miss an episode and let us know what you think by leaving a comment.
54:39A quick note that this episode is for informational and entertainment purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. Always consult a qualified healthcare professional regarding any medical questions or concerns you may have.
55:03you
From the publisher
In this episode of No Magic Pill, Blake Mycoskie is not the host, but instead the guest. Ariane de Bonvoisin of The Spirit Collective Podcast sits down with Blake Mycoskie for a raw conversation about his TOMS success, the depression that followed, redefining self-worth, and how he found purpose beyond achievement. Blake reflects on the lifelong feeling of not being enough that drove his success, the struggles he faced after selling TOMS, and the journey that ultimately helped him build a life from a place of wholeness rather than lack. This conversation originally appeared on The Spirit Collective Podcast with Ariane de Bonvoisin
#NoMagicPill #BlakeMycoskie #ArianeDeBonvoisin #TheSpiritCollective
Enough Foundation's mission is to spread reminders in every form — bracelets, messages, actions, community — until feeling ENOUGH becomes the cultural default. To learn more, visit weareenough.co.
Produced, Directed, and Cinematography by Wubetu Shimelash / IG: Wubetu Shimelashcff
Disclaimer: No purchase necessary. While supplies last. Visit http://www.weareenough.co/rules for full terms.
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Morning Water
Morning Water is a daily hydration formula that restores energy, balance, and performance with essential electrolytes, minerals, and nutrients in one simple routine.
To learn more, visit morningwater.co and use code NOMAGICPILL for 25% off your first order.
SONIA
Sonia is a conversational AI companion designed for emotional support. Through voice and text, it offers guided wellbeing sessions, including meditations, journaling, personalized recommendations, and practical exercises.
To learn more, visit www.soniahealth.com and download it on the App Store.
MOOVLAB
At MOOVLAB, we bring health and wellness to your workday.
MOOVLAB - the answer to sitting is moving.
To learn more, visit www.moovlab.com
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Disclaimer: This episode is for informational and entertainment purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. Always consult a qualified healthcare professional regarding any medical questions or concerns you may have.
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