Paige Mycoskie: Building Aviator Nation Into a Billion-Dollar Brand

25:25So what happened and what did you learn from? Yeah. It's a big one. Yeah. Okay, so I was in high school. It was my junior year, and I was, I, since I think I was like in seventh grade, had been a hardcore volleyball player. You were amazing. I played a lot of sports, but I really loved volleyball. Anyway, I was doing great in school. I, you know, I did student council stuff. Like, I was a good kid. Like, basically, you know, just cruising. Like, everything was good. Yeah. junior year of high school, I got asked to go to the senior prom with a guy. And I was with this group of people. And basically, we went to the prom.

26:10And then there was the after prom party that happened at the school. And in between the prom and the after prom party, we stopped at my house to change clothes because we wore matching outfits for this after prom party. And one of the guys made drinks for us for like on the road. And I'm thinking, okay, like I'm not a drinker, you know, but like one little drink is like not a big deal, you know? So like on the way to the party, I drank this little cranberry juice concoction and we got to the school and I don't remember pretty much anything from that night. It's really obvious that something was put in my drink.

26:50And I don't know exactly who did it. One of the guys that was making the drinks, obviously. And I woke up the next morning in bed with mom and dad. And they were like, they told me, do you remember anything from last night? And I honestly, I just barely remember getting to the party. And so they told me what happened. And basically, I guess went to the bathroom and like passed out in the bathroom. Somebody found me. It was at the school. So like to be intoxicated at the school is obviously a big thing. They ended up, I couldn't even like walk. So I guess they put me in a wheelchair and wheeled me out of the building, of course, in front of all of my peers.

27:32Oh my gosh. And I don't, you know, remember any of this, but so mom and dad are like, well, like they were like, okay. They were surprised because I wasn't a big partier. I wasn't a bad kid. They were just like, this is so weird. Like we got a call from your principal and said they had to come pick you up and you were like literally completely out of it. Um, and so they, they figured that it was something fishy. And I was like, look, like, you know, we did have one drink on the way and I didn't think it was a big deal. And the next week we went back to school and I'm sitting in my class and I mean, first period, probably like 10 minutes in over the loudspeaker can Paige my Kosky come to the principal's office.

28:10Oh my God. Yeah. Oh my God. I know. See, I didn't know this part. Yeah. And so I like, you know, I go to the principal and they basically said, you're being expelled from school. Um, they escorted me out of the building. Um, they put me in an alternative school, which I had to walk through metal detectors to get in. Um, they, essentially they wanted to make a giant example of me. I was this like star volleyball player, whatever and um and they decided to make a big example of me it was in the newspaper page mccoskey got expelled like all the things oh my god and not only having i mean i was sitting there at this school called turning point um that was an alternative school and like kids sitting around me like like were telling stories about how they got in there and like they had like you know done some really bad things and i had i think that would have been like a couple months before school was out.

29:02So I was in that turning point for probably three months, alternative school. I would come home from school and, and friends would want to come over and visit me and stuff. And I didn't want to see anyone. I was just like, I became very ashamed and like, it wasn't my fault. Yeah, you did nothing wrong. But like, you know, like they made me think it was that I was bad, you know? And so then it was just like, because I think when you're that young, like, you know, you're just kind of like a sponge And you're just like, oh, my God, like, I'm bad. Like, I'm not going to, you know, all these things.

29:33And so I remember literally, like, just not leaving my room. I wanted it dark all the time. I mean, I just was battling extreme depression. I didn't want to see anyone. So anyway, the first day of summer after the alternative school, my friends are like, we're going to this, like, field party, you know. And we want you to come. You haven't seen anybody, whatever. So I go out to this field party and like 20 minutes after being there, and honestly, like I didn't want anything to do with alcohol. I was like, I really was just there to hang out with friends. Like 20 minutes or so after being there, the cops showed up.

30:13Oh, God. And so like we all run into the grass and stuff and like we're hiding. Like, you know, this is like a field party in Texas. I'm like, oh, my God, I can't believe this is happening right now. Like, what am I going to do? And so eventually we laid, I remember we laid in the grass for like a couple hours. And finally I'm just like, screw it. Like I haven't drank anything. They can give me a breathalyzer. Yeah. Like I'm, I'm going home. I've done nothing wrong. I'm going home. Yeah. You know? And so I went back and the cops are just waiting and they're like, well, there's a, there's a keg here at this party.

30:41So you get an MIP. Because apparently that was the law that like, if you're at a party with alcohol, you get an MIP, even if you haven't had any alcohol. Oh my God. And so I had them test me and everything and I had not drank anything, but they gave me an MIP. Oh, yeah. So, so then they, so, I don't know, somehow the principal of the school, even though it was summer, they found out about it. I got a letter in the mail like the next week and it said, just so you know, this is your second offense. You will not be returning to volleyball. You will be, you are allowed to come to school, but all your extracurricular activities are taken away.

31:18And so that little bit of hope I had that like I was going to have a senior year, it was just like, bam. How, I mean, like, as someone who suffered with severe depression, like, how as a teenager did you get through this? Like, how did you not get to a dark, dark, dark place? Oh, I mean, I like 100 % felt suicidal. I mean, I was thinking to myself, I don't want to live anymore. But your whole life was taken away from you. Like I'd worked my whole life to be in volleyball and I wanted to go to University of Texas and play on the volleyball team. And like everything was taken away. I literally was like, I'm done.

31:57Like I'm done. And so what was the support? Like, was it mom and dad? Did you have a friend? Did you have a therapist? Like I wasn't there. So I'm just like trying to understand like who was there to help you? It was a really, really terrible year. There was this assistant principal that actually came to me and was like, Paige, I know you're a good kid. And she was like, look, I need someone to come and file stuff and whatever. And we can make this one of your periods and whatever. And she kind of took me under her wing. and um and like to this day i'm so thankful for her because i think that she really she knew that i was a good kid and she believed in me and she just like you know just kind of reached out an olive branch and and i spent a lot of time with her and um and i gradually like you know i think that i didn't really want to be social i didn't want to be at parties um for for literally months um that i just felt awful but i would go and spend time with her and that and that helped me and then And honestly, like at the end of the year when I graduated, I could not wait to get out of there.

33:08I'm sure. I was like, I don't want to. Yeah. I can't believe you. I mean, I think I would just be like, I'm out of here. I mean, to go also, I mean, volleyball career was over. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So like that alone is so terrible. And so, and I was hanging on by a thread. I really was. Like up until, oh, totally. Like up until I was finished with school, I was hanging on by a thread. And I said, you know what? I'm going to go as far away as I can. I went and looked at schools in California. I did look at schools in Arizona. I ended up going to Arizona State. And I was like, I don't want anybody to know who I am.

33:43I don't, you know, I want to go somewhere that's all new people, you know, and all my friends were going to college together and stuff. So this was really a big thing. And so I left completely, went to Arizona State. And within like two weeks of being there, like I'll never forget, like I had this. So I ended up joining a sorority because it was like, you know, really hard to meet people and stuff. And that was an easy thing to do. And so I joined a sorority. And I remember like two weeks after joining it, they were like, okay, like we have this thing that we're going to vote on who is going to be of the pledge class.

34:17Kind of the, they called it star pledge. And that person was going to be in charge of like kind of speaking out for the group and all the things. And they announced it was me. And I was like, me? like I like because I went from being super like I was down major like insecure no confidence like I just kind of was like shuffling along and then and then all of these girls like a hundred girls that I didn't know like saw something in me wow and they were like we want Paige to be our person like we love like and they all like just loved me yeah and that gave me like the turnaround that I needed I was like and I stepped up and like I took on leadership I ended up being president of sorority for two years, like it really showed me like having this amazing support from these women in the sorority, just seeing something that like they hardly even knew me, that I just like it really got me back.

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37:02I wanna go back though, before you got to the sorority and you're hanging on by a thread, you graduate. like, what do you think looking back now, did you learn from that experience? Because I mean, of all the stories you've told me so far today, that one actually is even more intense than the seven years of not being able to come out. What do you think that, what do you think you learned from that? And then, and then how have you applied it to your whole life? I absolutely had something to prove. Yeah. Okay. I mean, so now I was back and I'm like, thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Because like now I have something to prove.

37:40I say thank you, depression. You say thank you, you know, wrongfully accused. I mean, it's just crazy. It's like I'm watching Shawshank Redemption or something. It's crazy because like, I really do believe everything happens for a reason. And I believe now that I'm supposed to be running this company and doing what I do. And honestly, I don't know like how that would have like transpired without this like craziness. Interesting. Because I, again, like, you know, I went through something that was so mentally tough. I had a whole different appreciation for everything. Yeah, well, I'm sure once these girls nominated you as a star pledge, and then you become president of the sorority, and then that must have had—I mean, it's kind of like me now.

38:22Every day I wake up, and I'm like, I'm here. I'm alive. Like, holy shit. It felt super raw because I think to go— to literally arrive, and they know nothing about you, and then they see something great in you. I think that, you know, like that just was like, wow, like I, it gave me this incredible confidence. Yeah. Because they saw something that I didn't see in myself at that time. And so the confidence was great. But then once I got the confidence, I was like, I'm going to run this. Like, you know what I mean? Yeah, totally. I mean, we started winning, like I've talked about this before. Your intramural sports.

38:57Yeah. I mean, I remember like at that moment, like looking at the wall in the sorority house and we hadn't won an award in like 40 years or something. And I was like, guys, what's going on? I was like, I want this year. We're going to win everything. And like I just kind of turned it on in like a way of like, you know, like I want to prove myself. And that was my motivation is like just like winning everything and just kind of like I had this fire lit. And it was really awesome because one, you know, one like success leads to another. Once you kind of get a little bit of success and you get it going and you have this momentum.

39:31It's like McConaughey says, and I had him on the podcast. He says, Blake, you just need one in a row. Just one. Yeah, that's funny. One in a row, Blake. Yeah, it's true. I was like, ah, McConaughey is pretty good advice. I like that one. Just go for one win. Yeah. And then you get another. And then you get another. these wins, which ultimately led to, you know, Aviator Nation. You started, you're working in a surf shop. Yeah. DJ's boarding house, right? Yeah. And you're like, I can make better clothes than these people. Yeah. I mean, that was kind of the idea, right? Yeah. And then you started doing it.

40:06Yeah. Which I love. Yeah. So tell me a little bit about like, you know, because there's so many Aviator Nation fans and I want them to get to hear this because it's so cool. Like you literally just started making clothes? So as soon as I, after college, I went out for an internship in California and I worked at Shape Fitness Magazine for a little while. And that was when I started surfing. And I was going out there just for the summer, but I started surfing. And as soon as I started surfing, I became totally obsessed with surfing. It was like huge passion. So basically I'm in California and I decided to not go back to school.

40:40We ended up doing the Amazing Race after that internship. And then I was like, actually, like I had a job offer from CBS. I'm like, maybe I should just stay here. So anyway, I ended up staying in California and I was surfing and that was my life. Um, and I got this job at ZJ boarding house, a surf shop, because I love surfing. It was my passion. And, um, and I was actually bottom, like I was doing data entry. Like I was like the lowest paying job that you could have in retail, data entry. Um, and so I'm doing this and I'm, and I'm putting the data in And I just kept like seeing things and I was like, this is not that cool.

41:15Like we should, we should like order this obscure thing that like, they, you know, like they were ordering like the black shoes. And I was like, no, we need like the red and the like neon and whatever. Anyway, the buyer saw that I was real particular about what we were bringing into the store. They ended up eventually making me the assistant buyer. They sent me along to trade shows and I was looking at trade shows to buy clothes for the surf shop. And I was just not impressed with what I was seeing. And one big thing was that when I would get done surfing, I wanted to be warm and I wanted to be comfortable.

41:48And I just like, I always felt like clothes were itchy that I had after the surfing and the saltwater and stuff. And so I would go to like thrift stores and I would go to flea markets and I would try to find the softest of the softest old sweatshirt and old T-shirt. And so that was what I was wearing. You know, I was wearing like basically old clothes that I could find that was super broken in. And then I, and then when I was going around to these things, I was realizing like, not like I have ideas for how I could make this look better. And like the clothes just weren't that comfortable. And so, and so my thing was that I was going to make clothes just for myself.

42:26I wasn't like doing this to start a business, but I wanted clothes that had this like look that I, it was kind of like this thing, but I wanted it to feel like I'd had it forever. Ah, yes. And they do. Yeah. And so I basically started studying fabrics and I did all the stuff in my home laundry. Like I was playing with different ways to make clothes soft. And so I started making clothes at night after work at the surf shop for myself. And then I would wear them to work. And it was just crazy. Everyone was like, what are you wearing? I'm like, oh, no, I made this, you know, like, and then I went to a trade show and everyone was like, well, what brand is that?

43:03And I'm like, no, it's just like, I'm just making it. It's my own thing. but it was really obvious that people and that's why in the tag of every garment it says people are going to come out of nowhere because they were like I had that experience and so so I was living that and I was making clothes but the thing is I was making them for myself but I realized I didn't I would go nights where I would not sleep I was obsessed with it yeah I remember it was so fun yeah and it wasn't to make money like you know it was literally because I had an idea for a sweatshirt and I wanted it to be a certain softness.

43:35I wanted it to fit a certain way. And I learned to sew and from literally like a book and like sewing for dummies. And, um, and once I was making clothes, I was like totally obsessed with it on a level, like you can't even understand. Like I realized that was my passion that I loved making the clothes. And I think that once I was wearing them around and so many people came up to me and were like, Hey, like, what are you wearing? I realized I could sell it because everyone wanted to know what it was. I made some clothes for my friends. They loved it. And then my first time to really sell it was when I went to, um, the Habit Kenny festival.

44:11So in Venice, they have a street fair and at the street fair, it's a booth is like$500. And so I paid$500. I spent like three months making as many clothes items as I could. I ended up making$8 ,000 in one day at the street fair. And I was like, okay, this is a business. It's a lot better than getting paid hourly at ZJ's boarding house. Yeah, exactly. And so that was the beginning. And it's been a wild ride and it's, you know, we could have a whole nother podcast and maybe we will do episode two of just everything you've learned in growing Ape Deer Nation. And most of it has just been just wildly successful, but you have had some hard moments.

44:50And so I want to go to that because this podcast really is about for people who might be struggling, having a hard time, feeling stuck. You know, one of the things in doing research for this that I actually didn't know about you and about Aviation was that at one point you met a couple and they said that they could help you with production. You were growing really fast and you needed help. And they said they could do kind of a flat fee for each piece and that you gave them a big financial deposit and then they disappeared. I didn't know this story until researching this. When did that happen? Like, I'm just like, as your brother, I'm like, why did I never hear this one?

45:26Like, when did it happen and how did you bounce back from that? Because that sounds like pretty traumatic. Yeah, it was just not too long after I opened the Abbott Kinney store. Okay. So it must have been like around 2011, like around there, I'm thinking. Like, I don't know the exact year, but yeah, it was pretty soon after I opened Abbott Kinney. and at that point my wholesale business I mean I might have been doing like 80 grand or 100 grand a year something like that like tiny super tiny but yeah this couple found me a trade show and they said that they could manage all of it and it just they seemed really nice and I went and saw where they were making the clothes and where they were going to make the clothes and they gave me this whole like thing.

46:13And I think I gave them like$38 ,000. Oh my God. Which was a huge amount of money. No, it was like all my money. It was like all my money. Oh my God. And then like they disappeared and like filed, you know, for bankruptcy, their company or whatever, it was gone. They were gone. The money was gone. And I never forget like sitting there on the back patio of the Abikini store, just thinking like, what did I just do? What am I going to do? It was like a moment where I felt so defeated that I wasn't sure that I could continue with the company. I agree. And I just felt like, you know, I think that I really trusted people.

46:53And to have your trust is like really just like it was a big wake up call. I mean, it obviously hardened me like major. Yeah. Um, you know, from then on, I had a whole different experience when I would meet a new supplier or vendor or whatever. Like, it was my wake up moment. Like, this is not easy and people are bad. And, you know, like, because I just was like kind of this like surfer girl, like everything's good, trusting everyone. Um, and things were going good. And it's, it's not just about how hard you work. It's about knowing when people are bad and like being careful and, um, contracts and all the things.

47:31And so anyway, it was, there's obviously like a lot of bad out there. And, you know, I had that experience and, you know, just had to really just gradually like crawl myself out of it. But it was horrible. Man, I mean, I can't believe that that happened and that you were able to navigate it. And then also what I think about when I hear this story is what a silver lining, you know, The silver lining in that was you are one of the most astute, you know, like smart business women I've ever met. I mean, the way you negotiate a lease, I mean, I never want to be on the other side of that table. You know, I mean, you are a boss and you do it incredibly well.

48:15You treat your employees great. Like you run a great company, but I mean, you're tough. I mean, you're much tougher than I was, you know, and I think that's one of the reasons why you've built such a great business. And you've, you know, created this amazing supply chain that you control yourself. And a lot of good came from it, right? Yeah. But that was a really, really hard moment. And I think that that's where I go back to is like, you have had some real challenges and you've done it all on your own, you know, without the investors, without the board members. And so I guess like where I kind of want to go here at the end of this is, because I always try to make sure that whenever we have these conversations with amazing people like yourself, that people can walk away and really say, oh, I learned something.

48:56I'm going to apply that to my life. And, you know, one of the things that I am curious about is you've had these moments in your life where you've gotten through extremely hard times, you know, whether the high school, you know, seven years of not being able to, you know, share your truth, these people basically stealing all of your money. And then now you had this huge company that you have a lot of stress around. I mean, there's just, there's a lot. I mean, you're opening stores, you're doing this, you're doing that. Like, what do you think has been the main through line of how you've managed these tough times and also just the recent stress that you've had that others can learn from?

49:37I think that honestly, realizing, I mean, it's funny because when I say things like what I'm about to say, of course, I immediately go to like, what does everyone think about that? No, say it. We just say whatever we want on this side. But I genuinely can connect every hardship in my life to something amazing that happened after it. And so now every little tiny problem, I connect to like, how can we make this great? And I do strongly believe that all of this has made me stronger. Yeah. And so now it's like, you know, I think that when something happens, And I think I'm resilient because I know that everything really bad made me so much stronger.

50:24And there's a lot of silver linings. Yeah. And so honestly, like anytime something like scary or bad happens, I really take time to sit back and reflect and be like, okay, like how can, like what am I going to learn from this experience? Yeah, beautiful. And even at times when it's like there's nothing worse than what's happening right now, like health problems with your parents. I mean, like the worst, you know. it's like okay but like what can i get out what can this be better maybe a better relationship with my parents like it's more you know more thoughtful or whatever like how can i make this like affect my life in a positive way and that is my that is my security blanket around any kind of hard uh problem that comes my way is that i know that there is a reason for it and it's going to make me stronger.

51:13It's going to make me better. And I'm going to learn something from it. And I do think that if you're not learning, you know, like you're just stagnant. And everyone that works for me knows that like things change all the time in the company because, you know, I believe that we're constantly needing to grow and get better and do things different. And you just not being stagnant. And I think these little ripples that come in our life that screw us up for a bit, you know, they actually really make us stronger. And so just trying to understand that and connect that as fast as you can. Yeah. I mean, I think that's such a great, great thing for all of us to think about is sometimes, you know, what we think happens to us is actually happening for us.

51:56Exactly. You know, and I look back at the seven years of depression I went through and getting so, you know, just losing myself. And I'm like, well, if I never had had that happen, then I wouldn't have the empathy to understand other people who don't feel enough. Of course. And then help other people with that. And I just look at your life story and I see so many of those moments where it might have looked like something happened to you, but ultimately you and that experience made it something happened for you. And I'm just so impressed. I mean, I'm such a proud brother. And this has been such an incredible, incredible, deep, real conversation.

52:34And so thank you so much for coming on the show and just being you. Thanks, Blake. You're amazing. Thank you. I love you. Love you too. If this episode spoke to you, please share it with a friend, family member, or someone you love. Because No Magic Pill is not just a podcast. It's a resource to help us all live better lives. Hit the subscribe button so you never miss an episode. And let us know what you think by leaving a comment. A quick note that this episode is for informational and entertainment purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. Always consult a qualified healthcare professional regarding any medical questions or concerns you may have.

53:21There's more No Magic Pill with Lemonada Premium. You can listen to every episode ad-free, plus subscribers also get access to exclusive bonus interview excerpts from select guests and special behind-the-scenes content. Just tap that subscribe button on Apple Podcasts or go to LemonadaPremium.com to subscribe on any other app. You can also listen ad-free on Amazon Music with your Prime membership. No Magic Pill is a production of Lemonada Media and the Enough Foundation. The show is produced by Wubatu Shimalash, Catherine Barnes, and Keegan Zema. Additional production by Ivan Karayev and Kristen Lepore.

54:07Post-production by Oranda Studio. Jackie Danziger is head of content at Lemonada Media. Executive producers are me, Blake Mycoskie, Jessica Cordova-Kramer, and Stephanie Whittles-Wax. Special thanks to Jillian Delorio, Jennifer Song, Maggie Wertz, Andrew Fine, James Johnson, Devin Robbins, Emily Ledbetter, Chris Orwig, Sean McGurk, Jasmine Burgess, and the entire Enough Foundation team. The Enough Foundation's mission is to spread reminders in every form, bracelets, messages, actions, and community until feeling enough becomes the cultural default. To learn more, visit weareenough.co. If this episode spoke to you, please share it with a friend, family member, or someone you love.

55:00You can help others find our show by leaving us a rating and writing a review. Thanks so much for listening and watching. See you next week.