161. Building a Wellness Resort WITHOUT Bringing on Investors - Interview with Brian Hatcher

22:38you don't speak to the same person for every single region. So, um, but I think as we continue to be a good partner in the places that we are, it opens up more doors for us.

22:49Natalie Palmer:So have you guys had, I'm sure this has been a good way to grow, but like if you get in with like a chain in like Hawaii and then they also have whatever, a Puerto Rico and a Mexico like resort, like, is that usually an easier way to get in like across chains or are you doing like mom and pop resorts or like how does that work? No, these are very big companies. Most people would be familiar with Wyndham, Worldmark, Hyatt, Hilton, Marriott Vacation Club. These are timeshares that most people are very aware of and familiar with. And kind of like I was saying, they have existing customer bases of people who know about the different locations and have probably stayed there at some point in the past.

23:27Natalie Palmer:So for the resort, what's in it for them is like, okay, we have these predictable times where we're unoccupied and it's too expensive for non-members to pay. They call you up and then they just say like, this is like the availability of when you can list these, the following units and for whatever's booked, pay us X amount. Yeah. Essentially we're just allowing, we're giving them more occupancy than they probably would have got before and they're still getting paid for it. So they're happy about that. Gotcha. Okay. Okay. Very cool. So from that, so that's kind of been like your, your jam and like the business you've really been working on and building.

24:02Natalie Palmer:And now recently, you've also decided to build your own micro resort. Can you go through this with us? And this seems like, I mean, I hope you get the payout for sure, but this seems like it's more of like a passion project, like just something like you've wanted to do and you've had a vision for this. Absolutely. You have no partners on this? Not currently, no. Okay. Okay. Walk us through this deal. And this is in, you still live in Atlanta today and this property that you're now working on is in Georgia? It is. It's in North Georgia in Dahlonega, the North Georgia mountains or Blue Ridge mountains, right?

24:35Kind of at the end of the Appalachian mountains. But yeah. So as I continue to grow and scale on the short-term rental side and I purchased more properties and you kind of get a feel really quickly once you're in the industry of like where things are headed and how to remain competitive. And I realized pretty quick that you were going to have to continue to compete at a higher and higher and higher level every single year if I wanted to remain relevant on the platform and still maintain the level of revenue that we were getting. And so I thought about like years down the road of like how sustainable that is.

25:18And I was like, well, I want to position myself in a way where I'm not playing that same game and that competition is less of a factor. And I didn't necessarily know if that was boutique hotels or I saw people doing like these really crazy, unique Airbnbs. You know, you saw like the woman who built one with like an acorn or like the water towers and all these kinds of things. And around this time, Airbnb had also shifted their website to be focused more on experiences and unique kind of stays. And while I was kind of researching this, I had ran across Live Oak Lake, which was built by Isaac French.

25:56I'm sure many of your listeners are familiar with him.

25:58Natalie Palmer:Yeah, yeah. We had him at Level Up and he's been on the podcast before. Yeah. And so seeing that, I had this like aha moment. It was like, that's it. That is, you get the benefit of a commercial project where you're rewarded for how well you can operate the property since the value is based on the net operating income. You also have your check in the box off of having something that is a more of an experience versus just a stay. And most of the time, these are going to be more unique than what is traditional in the short-term rental space. And so I saw that kind of checked off the boxes and I was like, that's the realm I think I want to dive into.

26:37But during that timeframe, there wasn't a lot of people I would I mean I don't wouldn't even say that industry was like birth yet because it was still in kind of the process of improving it and so there wasn't many places for like education or communities around like how to do it and so I just again went through a whole trial by fire and started to look at land and that was a very interesting time I lost a good amount of money over the course of around like 18 months of looking at land getting land other this timeline this was 2023 okay yes over like 18 months well yeah it started i would say end of 2022 into 2023 when i started looking at land um and how did you lose money just like put deposits

27:28Natalie Palmer:on properties that didn't pan out or what so this is and for everybody listening up this is will be really good but the when it comes to land and even like doing developments a difference with when you're buying a house is a lot of your due diligence can happen after the fact or i wouldn't say after the fact almost like before you really have to commit uh whereas with land a lot of the due diligence associated with it is costly for you to even know if what you want to do is possible So depending on what the piece of land is. So for example, you might find a great piece of land, you get it under contract, and then you have to negotiate this time of due diligence because you don't know how much you do and don't know.

28:10And there's a lot of checkboxes. So some property, if you're really fortunate and you're getting land that is already what they would call like improved land, where someone's come in, added utilities, cleared things out, gotten surveys, soil tests, et cetera, which typically that land is a lot more expensive because someone has come in and done a lot of the dirty work for you. But some of the best pieces of land most of the time are unimproved. They're just raw pieces of land. And so you have to do things like a lot of times they might just have a survey, but maybe you need to get a soil test done.

28:41And depending on how big that piece of land is depends on how much you're going to have to pay for that soil test. And so, I mean, it could run multiple thousands of dollars. And that's very important because the soil test is going to let you know where you even can put septic, which is also going to determine how many buildings you can build and where you can actually build. So if you don't know that, but you see you have, and this is a real story, there was a 15 acre parcel of land that I got under contract. We got the soil test done. And realistically, there was only about four ish usable, buildable acres.

29:18So even though the land is super big, you can't build half of what you think you can build on that piece of land. So it makes it the numbers and everything in your head that you've done on paper don't actually pencil out. So now the land.

29:31Natalie Palmer:So, and this is why, why was it not buildable wrong soil? Like what? I just don't know anything about buying land. Give me a crash course in this. There's so many variables. It can just, it can be the, um, density of the land or like the soil under it. Maybe it's not, It's too soft because of maybe it's in a certain area where drainage or, you know, with how it rains, it doesn't run off good enough for the land to be stable for things to be built on it. Sometimes it can be the topography, like the slope of the land or how it's graded. And if it if the slope is too bad, sometimes it's rocks that are deep into the ground under the land.

30:08So you can't dig deep enough for maybe septic in that area. So you just can't build it all in that area because there's just too much rock. Like there's so many different things that go into why you may or may not be able to build in a particular area. And then another layer on top of that is it's also dependent upon like specific county regulations. So you have all of these like hard standards that you have to pass, but then you also have these local standards that also have to be passed before you can even get a potential yes or no.

30:37Natalie Palmer:so brian something like that like okay that one property that you bought thinking you had 15 usable acres and then it was four um in a case like that is there like an opportunity to pivot like i would think like a tree house might not need to be built the same way you don't have to go as deep into the ground and like pour a foundation it's more like on stilts like could you repurpose things or decide to just build like wooden decks and put like a year on there or Or if they determine the land is just not buildable, does it kind of remove every opportunity? The answer to most of these is always going to be, it depends.

31:19Part of that comes back to county, right? So within a specific parcel of land in a county, they might have covenants and restrictions to where for this particular area, you can only build things with a solid foundation. So then that would make it so that you couldn't. Or they might say you can build tree houses or these other things, but only if the land is zoned a specific way and it's not zoned that way. So then you have to go through the process of changing the zoning, right? Which is a whole nother can of worms. So there's a lot of these other pieces that go into that that make it difficult to just say, oh, I'm just going to pivot or I'm just going to do this now.

32:00Another issue I'd ran into is a specific parcel and area. It was a great piece of land. And then we found out that the minimum build code requirements in that area was 1 ,500 square feet. So if you weren't building a home that was 1 ,500 square feet in that specific area, you essentially couldn't do it. And what I was building was they weren't going to be 1 ,500 square feet. They looked at them as like tiny homes or smaller homes. So there's just all of these random things that can be at the property level, county level, city level that affect what you're going to do, how you can do it, and if you can do it.

32:35Natalie Palmer:Okay. So obviously you were like new at this. So it was obvious, like you were going to make some mistakes and have to learn along the way. But hearing all this, how does even a seasoned land hacker know all this? Like if every county, if every area is going to have their own rules, their own zoning, and you almost don't even know what questions to ask until you get these soil tests done, which you can't even do until you're under contract. Like is everyone out here that's building on raw land, just like going through these ups and downs and we just see the finished product and we don't know the shitstorm that they've been through along the journey.

33:10There definitely is a lot. And once you start doing it and you talk to more people who are doing it, you realize just how much like people actually go through. Oh my God. And it comes to building. I think it's a lot cleaner if it is something I would say that's like more of like a residential home and a residential area. Sure. A lot of those areas are already scoped out. The covenants and everything are already, you know, very clearly outlined. And the people who build in that area have relationships with the cities and the counties. So it's kind of like they're just rinsing and repeating. It's not their first time.

33:40And most people I would say who are building and who are builders are not building for the first time. But when it comes to this specifically, and you're trying to build for an investment or a micro resort or something unique, it's natural. You're going to run into a lot of unforeseen challenges because it's different and new. And most of the time, the county era where you're trying to do it at probably hasn't seen it or experienced it before. So, I mean, one of the things that we did is we met with the county multiple times on the front end to really go out and explain and outline everything that we were trying to do, what we wanted to look like top to bottom so that they could work with us and that we weren't constantly running into these crazy roadblocks so that we could actually make it happen.

34:22And we more so went into, this is what we would like to do and we would love your support on it. And we also want you guys to be realistic with us about what it would take. And if something's not possible, you know, that you guys let us know.

34:33Natalie Palmer:So in your experience, do you find that the counties have been pretty like friendly to this or is there thought of like, who is this investor? Like we don't want them coming up and messing with the land or I don't know, as long as you're transparent, are they more open to working with you? What's been like the, I don't know, that relationship? So in the beginning, I will say I definitely felt a little bit of maybe friction. I think what turned is when we were, a lot of it in the beginning was emails back and forth. When I had my first PRC, plan review committee meeting, where you really, you sit down with pretty much all of the heads of different departments in the city, environmental planning and zoning, the fire marshal, public safety and health.

35:16And because a lot of these people are, who are going to have to approve and grant your permits for all aspects of your project. And once I kind of went in and we sat down there, you could feel there's like a little bit of a like, okay, there's this young kid in here who is saying he's going to build.

35:33Natalie Palmer:They're testing you out. Right. And you can kind of like, you know, you could feel the tension. And, but I think coming as prepared as possible will always ease that. And so I think once they realized, like, I spent time reading the actual, like, county land codes and I could call out very specific things and I knew top to bottom what questions I needed to ask and those kinds of things, I think they understood that this was something serious and that I wasn't just kind of trying to waste their time. And so I think if you can do that on the front end, people will then lean in typically and be like, okay, because you are being serious and we know that you're not just, you know, wasting time, we're going to definitely work with you.

36:13And so I think that as well as documenting the journey and showing them that, I think that was also part of it because we've been trying to record this for the last couple of years and document as much as we can to share. And so we showed that with them and asked them to before we even came if we could even record like our meetings and stuff. And they were very open and receptive to that. And I think when they realized, OK, you're kind of putting it out there and really trying to make this happen, that they were more willing to work with us.

36:43Natalie Palmer:And this is with the one in the project you ended up starting. So there were a few that failed before maybe the soil test or whatever, like didn't come back in your favor and you pulled out of those contracts. Mm hmm. Yeah. And I mean, one of those, I lost my earnest money on top of that because we got past the due diligence window, which is when I learned I needed to make sure I could have a very long due diligence window. There was a lot that went on over the over that time. how many pieces of land did you like go through to find the one that worked i probably looked at over 20 different parcels of land i think and looked is like you took a trip out there walk the land like yeah okay yeah um and then i probably i had three yeah three different parcels that i had got under contract at one point and then this last one is it was the one so pulling out of the first two where it just wasn't going to work like what was that what were the emotions like like was there any part of you that was like i can't believe i'm like giving this up again like i've gone this far and had the test or was it just like was a thought like when you know it came back that it just wasn't zoned or you couldn't use the land the way you wanted it made the decision for you yeah the a lot of times the land is what helped me determine that it wasn't the one in but it definitely was hard like emotionally and financially because it's like how long do I want to kind of keep playing this game and how much do I believe in this vision and I mean transparently there was a time where I was like I'm pretty sure it was like after the second one where I was like maybe this just isn't for me like maybe there's a reason this keeps happening maybe I need to just continue to grow and scale what I'm doing and And luckily, I have good friends and people in my corner were like, no, like, you know, keep trying, keep pushing forward.

38:37And I'm glad I did at the end of the day. But it definitely was really it was really difficult because there wasn't a lot of I didn't really know many people I could reach out to for help, which was different from the short term side where I had like a whole mastermind and groups of people that who, you know, were doing a lot of the similar things that I was doing. So if I needed help, I had a strong community I could reach out to. So luckily during that timeframe, uh, communities and more information started to pop up. And I think that's really what helped me kind of push through because I started joining, uh, different groups and masterminds.

39:12I joined a land mastermind and then I ended up joining like a small developer mastermind. And so I, I felt like I started to kind of like actually get the tools, the pieces, the relationships and the knowledge to start approaching these, um, in a more strategic way that helped me actually like get it done.

39:29Natalie Palmer:Yeah. Okay. So finally, so it was the third one. And were there any points with this one where like you did the land test and you were like, oh no, like we're running into the same issues again? Or was this one like pretty much smooth sailing, like meant to be? to be completely honest this one has been the like hardest of all of them um but i think the way i went about it was better and so part of me has like this numbness too now to like issues and problems like i expect them instead of just like not so i feel like now when stuff comes up i'm way more calm because I'm just like, nothing can, nothing can hit me like it's already has.

40:13Um, this particular piece of land actually found it at the end of 2023 or in the middle of 2023. And that was the first time I ever walked it. And I knew then when I walked it, it's very, I feel like you ask any real estate investor, they know exactly the feeling of when you step into that home that you know is going to be the one after you've looked at a ton, you know pretty quickly once you walk in you're like ah this is it this is what i've been looking for and that piece of land i knew when i was walking it it has incredible 270 degree mountain views it's on a mountain ridge uh it's it's very big it has perfect build sites it's in prime location it's near all like all the perfect things it checked off all of the boxes and so So we started to go down the due diligence route after getting it under contract, had gotten a little bit far, and then we ran into an issue when it came to utilities because there was a small strip right in front of the piece of land where the drive is that technically was owned by the next door neighbors.

41:16And that means that we would need to have some sort of utility easement if we wanted to actually have access to power and water on that piece of land. and we reached out well say reached out it took months to actually get in contact with those owners because they were absentee owners with a large investment group and ended up owning hundreds of acres up there so they really just hold land for like investment purposes and they're hidden behind tons of shells and anonymous you know LLCs and so on and so forth so we had to play like FBI detective and try to find someone that we could speak to to even submit this easement proposal to to ask for that access.

41:55And initially it was denied. And so I was like, wow. And at that point, I continued to look at other land, but every other piece of land was compared to that piece of land and nothing gave me the feeling that that one did. And so after about six to eight months, there was nothing that I was willing to say yes to. We went back and revisited that piece of land and started to look to see what could we do realistically. And similar to squatters rights, where if someone is in a particular home and, you know, using it for a long period of time, the landlord or homeowner doesn't say anything or remove them, they do get some portion or some right to ownership.

42:35Not saying that that's necessarily correct.

42:38Natalie Palmer:So basically, you were the squatter here, like... No, not me. ...coaching on their easement? Not me, but fortunately, the previous owner of the cellar, she had built a gate on this property right at this entrance point and had been using it to enter and exit the land for almost a decade and we were able to show proof of that and file for what's called an easement by use which is very similar to like squatters rights to say hey we've been using this and operating and acting as if this is our piece of land for this long and have proof to show that therefore we're asking you to grant this easement from a court standpoint So you weren't even trying to like buy any of the land, buy that strip of land, just allow the easement access.

43:23Yeah, just the, and it's when I, if I'm going to send you after this, a photo, it's literally like 150 feet. It's like the smallest strip that you could think of. And you're like, there's no way, but I mean, it didn't make any sense. and so they weren't trying to really budge or bend on anything once we brought that forward that's when talks started to happen because they realized that we kind of did have a little bit of

43:45Natalie Palmer:merit what to get the you know right i have always like in my head when i've heard like squatters writes horror stories i've always been like this is just the most who came up with a law where like you can just literally squat in someone's house and then somehow get rights to the property, but you may have just convinced me that there is one case because if you're such an absentee landowner that you've got 15 shell companies and like anonymous LLCs that you can't even respond to a question about your property. And then for a straight up decade, they've been using it and you were unaware, like maybe there's a case there where a little sliver can be used for easement purposes.

44:23Natalie Palmer:You may have just convinced me that there is a very special use case for this where maybe squatters rights are okay no i agree i felt the same way i was like you know what this is where it makes sense there you go but um we ended up to make a long story short we ended up being able to agree to a land swap and so instead of actually getting an easement pass which was so much better because we basically swapped a small piece of land on the other side of the parcel for that piece so that we would completely own it and we wouldn't there would be no easement and nothing and so they would essentially retain the amount of land that they owned and i would now not have to worry about access that process took from 2023 until the end of the middle of early middle 2023 until the end of 2024 and so i'm sorry what 18 months to sell 150 foot strip of land not even sell it just swap it yeah oh yeah okay so september october is when things like actually pick back up because now it's like wait a minute this can happen were you like paying like on this did you own the property yet or you were okay okay you weren't like making payments or anything during this time correct so i'd had it under contract and then we terminated the contract but stayed in touch uh because i was kind of the driving force behind trying to like really make this work um and the seller and the seller's agent knew that i was very serious about trying to make it work.

45:58And so we remained in contact throughout that process. And then they kind of gave us a heads up once everything was done. And so I agreed, like, I would still purchase the land. And so once I got back, then we re-got under contract in, I would say, October. Yeah, I think like October or November. And we were able to pick back up where we left off in terms of due diligence.

46:21Natalie Palmer:So at that point, it just basically resumed. You still had to go through the due diligence process but at least that had been sorted out you now had a relationship with the neighbors had gotten contact from them okay yeah so then from resuming the buying process things went smoothly from there or still no of course they didn't spoiler alert things still aren't going smoothly but even today but they're going and that's all that matters, right? So we ran into other very small blips and hiccups along the way. That land swap actually caused more hiccups than I thought would, mostly because when it comes to land swaps, there's a lot of, it's a huge domino effect.

47:08And when you think about like your parcel of land at your home, it's tied to a deed, which is tied to like county records, which is also flows to like title and title insurance and so many other things and in most situations a parcel of land is not shifting or changing it is that parcel that unless is and even when it does most of the time it's being subdivided and then all new documents are being created versus new documents or old documents needing to be amended and edited and so that land swap ended up causing a lot of problems i won't necessarily say problems but new steps that had to be done and as a result of closing on the property and so we had to get new surveys recorded we had to get new deeds drafted we had to get all like the due diligence process became like double basically as a result of that um which

48:02Natalie Palmer:ended up and you're paying for all of this like you have to pay for like a deed change like these are things i'm sure like you needed to get lawyers for and go to luckily i was working with the seller and we did shift a little bit on the purchase price as a result of some of those fees. But technically, I wasn't the owner. She was responsible for those payments. But of course, she knows she's selling it. So she's like, well, you're going to have to absorb some of this kind of, you know, in some way, somehow. Yeah. So some of those things I didn't have to directly pay for other things I did. But yeah, it ended up just being a lot more time, cost and people and hoops to jump through until we were finally able to close the top or not even that long ago like I would say a month and a half ago so oh my gosh okay and so finally um design has started construction has started construction has not started uh I was hoping construction would be started i know but as a part of and this process honestly has been really it's been gratifying because it works on you and it just teaches you so much more at the same time because when it comes to ground up development you don't know what you don't know and you you have no idea what new stones are going to have to be unturned and so once we did a lot of the design site work and everything virtually and digitally when we went to the city and we're saying okay we're almost we're pretty much ready to start submitting everything.

49:35Well, then it came up that based on our landscape design and plan, we're going to need a land disturbance permit because we need to move over an acre of dirt to make this happen. So that's a whole new process that also requires a new land or soil erosion plan and water runoff plan and all of these other various dominoes, right, that start to fall. And so then that's more cost and that's more time and more hoops and more people. So that's what we're kind of in the process now. But we have a path to completion. We have the right people now. And then once that's done, then we can actually start submitting for permitting, which will allow us to break ground.

50:16Natalie Palmer:Oh, my gosh, what a long process. So do you have a timeline right now when you think you'll break ground? I used to. Now I kind of just say things will happen when they happen. I'm the hopefulness in me says we can, we'll likely break ground for the end of the summer, probably in late July or maybe early August at the latest. And then we should be able to have our doors open by top of next year. Can I ask, did you buy the land in cash or finance this? Like, are you making payments right now? Just even though nothing's happening? I mean, it is happening, but all behind the scenes and yeah no so I did buy the land cash and I did that strategically because the land has to be subdivided to execute the it the exact way that I want and you can't subdivide a piece of land that has a lien on it so if I were to get a loan to purchase the property I wouldn't have been able to subdivide it and I would have had to build in a phased approach with like one unit at a time versus being able to do it all at one time.

51:25Natalie Palmer:Okay, got it. And then what about construction? Do you have loans out for that? So the capital stack is mixed with private money, hard money, and I have a bank as a backup, but I'm going to try to not have to use the bank financing. Of course, you typically have to just jump through so many more hoops and red tape with a bank and they require a lot more even just from a cost standpoint. um to work with them and so luckily relationships and operating in the industry you know you're able to reach out to people and um you know get a little bit of capital and create some deals so that's the route that we're mainly going to get this thing built i don't even think you told us what's like the vision for the property why this piece of land what spoke to you what are you building yes it is a japanese inspired wellness resort uh it's going to have five total units It's three one bedrooms and two two bedrooms.

52:21And it's also going to have a wellness center on site. And each of the cabins are built right on the edge of this mountain ridge. And it wraps all the way around. So everyone will have sprawling mountain views from whether you're at the wellness center or in one of the cabins. And it pretty much goes up the entire ridge. And so they're all built off, hanging pretty much off of the edge of the ridge. And it was inspired by my trip to Japan. It was during a time I'd, it was towards the back end of a year, the back end of 2024. I'd spent a couple of weeks in Japan and it was very timely. I had just launched another property.

53:01I had been growing my other, my arbitrage company and I'd launched another property earlier that year. And I was just feeling massive burnout where I like mentally needed a break. And it just felt like the pressure of everything was way too much. And so when I got to Japan, I was able to experience this sense of peace that I hadn't had. I couldn't even remember the last time I had. And part of it, I think, was due to the culture and the scenery and the specific locations. we went all over we started at the bottom in the islands and went all the way up to the top in Hokkaido in Japan and so we got to see all aspects of it um not just kind of Tokyo which is I feel like what most people think of when they think of Japan like bustling city but uh Hokkaido specifically was what gave me the most inspiration when I was in Japan because it looks nothing like what we think Japan looks like it was very rural and mountainesque and quiet it's where a lot of the like natural hot springs and onsens are where you it's much more calming and relaxing and that's where I just felt I had the most like creativity the most inspiration and I wanted to bring that feeling that I had of being able to just kind of like disconnect rest and relax back to the U.S.

54:23and so that whole trip is what inspired the design the guest experience and pretty much everything around this resort.

54:31Natalie Palmer:So the wellness center, this is going to be available to all guests there, or do you have to like reserve it ahead of time? Like what will that look like? Are you going to have like full-time, like, I don't know, masseuses there or just the amenities? Yeah, there'll be amenities there. It's only available to the guests who are on site. We will have the ability for you to book things like masseuses, different sessions. I don't want to give too much away, but we will have opportunities for unique experiences at the wellness center that will be available for the guests. We'll also have a gym there and other unique things for people to enjoy.

55:07Natalie Palmer:So exciting. Once you break ground, do you have a timeline in mind for construction or have you also just given up on that? So my builder thinks that we can do this because we're going to be building pretty much simultaneously in around six to seven months. My designer, which you know, of course, Tatiana, who works with you. Yeah. Things that will take longer, probably eight, eight to nine months. So I'm hoping we land somewhere in the middle of around seven to eight months. But who knows? And that's for everything. You're not doing like a one unit launch at a time. Correct. That's for everything.

55:44Build it all at one time.

55:45Natalie Palmer:So five units plus the wellness. So somewhere between six to nine months once you break ground, which could be God knows how long. Correct. All right. Wow. This is just such a, I don't know, just hearing all this is so interesting. Like I think a lot of people see properties like this and see the micro resorts and just think like, yeah, you just find the piece of land and, you know, get, get, get your designer and start building but hearing just how much goes into it gives you a whole new appreciation um brian what's the like long-term plan for this do you plan to just hold this forever and this is like your your baby or is there an exit planned with this and selling it as a business selling it at a cap rate what's what's the longer term plan for this um i think at some point i feel like everybody has a number right so if if the right people come along at the right price it could be sold but uh i think i will hold it for a while at least um i know because it's the first one it's always going to be special to me in our place uh and it's what i see is kind of again my my training wheels and where i got my my knowledge because now i feel like going through all of these things this time, the second time I know will be much more smoother.

57:09I can come in much more prepared and I'll have the right people, the right teams, the right knowledge and information to be able to hopefully go start to finish much quicker and at a larger scale.

57:19Natalie Palmer:Especially because you want to do the same style resort in multiple places. So you wouldn't even be like reinventing the wheel, right? It'd be similar design, similar branding. No. Oh. Yeah. Okay. Why not just make it harder for yourself? Yeah. Well, you know, going back to what we were talking about, ultimately, I know people want unique experiences. And so I think even with putting this, you know, Japanese-inspired micro resort in the North Georgia mountains, that's intentional because it creates this almost juxtaposition of culture and style and location. Most people in North Georgia have never gone to Japan and have never experienced that and don't know what it's like.

58:04And so putting something like that there creates and piques a certain type of interest to attract more people. And so we do want to maintain that style with the different resorts. We want to create very striking differences between the location and the experience of what you're getting with future resorts.

58:25Natalie Palmer:okay so you're gonna try and like do a whole new aesthetic and approach each each go at this yes wow most of them will probably be inspired by my trips um i take an at least one international trip every single year to just try to reset and um just relax and so i already have a couple i actually have two planned this year i'm not necessarily going to give those away that way i I don't give away what feature resorts could look like, but I'm being intentional about where I'm staying and what type of inspiration I might be able to draw from it while I'm there so that I can bring it back and recreate that here.

59:05Natalie Palmer:Well, what a perfect excuse for a business expense for research purposes. Brian, this is so cool. I can't wait for you to break ground. And I know you've been documenting this whole journey on Instagram. So if anybody wants to follow, your Instagram is Hatch Capital. They can go back and see. There's already so many videos of you like walking the land and making plans there. But oh my gosh, I can't wait for your content once we actually like break into the dirt and start seeing structures come together. And yeah, like you mentioned, Tatiana Taylor Tate is your designer. So when this place is open, I will absolutely be booking a trip there.

59:42Natalie Palmer:I can't wait to see it. Brian, it was such a pleasure having you on. and any other links you can share. Do you have like an early signup list if people just want to get on the wait list to see this resort come together? Yes. So people will be able to go to Ukiyo Resort, which is U-K-I-Y-O resort.com, which is the name of the resort. U-K-I-Y-O resort.com? Yes. Okay. And that is where they'll be able to not only follow along with the journey, but also be the first to know when we're going to launch, keep up with everything, and also have the opportunity to be one of the first people to book a stay.

1:00:25Natalie Palmer:So cool. What does that mean, Yukio? So it has kind of a dual meaning. One of the word-for-word meanings is living in the moment and detached from the bothers of life, which is the experience that I had when I was in Japan. And then the other side is the floating world, which kind of still ties into that. And it also aligns with the property because the, each of the cabins, including the wellness center, they're all built off the edges of the mountain. So you genuinely feel like you're floating when you're in them. That's so cool. Okay. So yukioresort.com, I'll put that in the show notes as well as the updated link to your other company, the Elite Escapes or whatever that might be rebranded to.

1:01:13Natalie Palmer:Cool. We'll put your Instagram too if people want to follow along. Thank you so much, Brian. Thank you. And with that, it is now checkout time. Thanks for listening and I'll see you back here next week. Lastly, as Airbnb hosts, we all can appreciate a good five-star review. So you already know a great review on this podcast would mean so much to me. Please subscribe, review, share, and connect with me in the show notes below. Bye.