Hike and Pause: What the Fed Decision Means for You

25:40So obviously, this will show up in the value of collateral underlying both on and off balance sheets, debt both in the banking sector, but also in the insurance sector and in the pension fund sector, etc. I actually consider it an issue that the Federal Reserve does not have a direct line to those in trouble in case that we should see spillovers to insurance companies and pension funds. It makes it a whole lot more difficult to throw money at the problem. And the only solution should push come to shove is basically to just add a lot of liquidity to the market and hope for the best, exactly as Bank of England did once the pension fund sector started struggling back in November last year.

26:26So ultimately, we know what happens should the insurance sector and the pension fund sector get into trouble as a consequence of this. QE will arrive again. Yeah, QE. And speaking of, there are an awful lot of rate cuts priced into the market. And Jay Powell didn't give any indication they were leaning that way. I think people think he's biatzing, but Mike, is the market mispricing or misjudging the Fed? So what I thought was interesting is as soon as Powell started to speak, right? I mean, you basically saw the initial dovish reaction to the announcement get unwound. So, you know, initially the dollar sold off, bonds were holding firm, gold sort of went on a run.

27:10And as Powell spoke, basically all that reversed. Oil, gasoline, none of those things really budged. They actually resumed their sell-offs on the day. Copper didn't really budge. Gold sort of gave up some of its gains. And then the front end of the curve, I mean, started to sell off. And then after Powell stopped talking, the press conference ended. It's like we immediately started pricing all that back in. So, you know, you look at like Sofer Futures in December of this year, and they were almost back flat on the day. And then after Powell stopped speaking, it finished up around 14 basis points.

27:43So, I mean, it had a pretty sizable rally in the last, you know, say half hour of the day. And so, you know, yeah, I mean, Powell made a few statements in his comments where he, you know, I thought the statement where they basically said, you know, determining if more tightening is necessary. And they didn't say anything about whether rate cuts would be necessary. And he even said, you know, if their forecasts are correct, then rate cuts are not appropriate. So he's certainly, you know, as much as people want to read that into dovish, I thought that was more of the hawkish aspect. But yeah, I mean, it seems like the market just kind of, once he got done talking, just went right back on their way to starting to try to price in some rate cuts.

28:25because you saw a slight steepening in the curve at the end of the day as well. Yeah, they're just convinced that he's not, either doesn't know or isn't saying. Andreas, on this point, John asking, can you ask the guys to comment on the fact that he, Jay Powell, sees moderate growth or small recession, very contrary to the market? Yeah, it is. I mean, the market consensus is a recession commencing in the third quarter. And ultimately that recession needs to arrive rather sooner than later to confirm the market pricing of rate cuts. Otherwise, we obviously won't get those rate cuts. To me, it's a matter of when, not if, we will see the first rate cut now.

29:08I ran the press release through a word matching model and compared it to the January 2019 statement from the Federal Reserve. And it felt very similar when I read the two And when I ran the word matching machinery, it also confirmed my vibes. January 2019 was the first meeting with the pause after the hiking cycle concluding in December 2018 due to the mayhem in equity markets. And the statement is very, very similar. In 2019, it took roughly six months before the cutting cycle commenced. Something similar to that would actually lead to a very hawkish repricing of the current outlook. So it's a matter of when, not if.

30:01And I'm not sure that the market will get the rate cuts as early as they expect them to. Yeah, yeah, that seems what it says. We've got Darius in the house. Hey, Darius. Hey, Maggie, how's it going? We're just talking about the fact that Jay Powell sort of sticking to his hawkish tone and at odds with the market, whether you're looking at him talking about moderate growth, very small recession, no need for easing, and then kind of completely skirting around the bank issue, just saying the banking system sounded solid and not really giving it much more steam. What'd you make of the whole presser and statement?

30:39So a couple of key takeaways. And welcome, guys. How's it going? Andreas, Michael, it's good to be back with you guys. So I'd say three key things, just to answer your question specifically. I don't know that he said anything that changes market pricing or the market outlook in a material way. I think the pause is pretty much well telegraphed. The continuation of balance sheet runoff is pretty well telegraphed. And let's be honest here, this is a Jay Powell-led FOMC that has been getting walked around like a dog by the data for the better part of two years now. You know what I mean? So I don't know that he's going to say anything forward-looking that's going to be especially revealing to asset markets on a day like today.

31:16So that's kind of our general takeaway. And then kind of secondarily, you know, it's kind of what wasn't said and what wasn't really focused on. Because I think the whole kind of discussion around the policy rate kind of misses the broader point in terms of the go-forward outlook for Fed policy, which is something we wrote about in our late-off-morning note this morning, which is the balance sheet is going to be back in focus. and not because of QT just remaining ongoing. You know, these folks would like you to believe that it's like watching paint dry or like watching grass grow. And for the most part, it has been, you know, going back to kind of late 2024, you know, this is a federal reserve that, you know, that's basically been doing toothless QT.

31:52And the reason I say that is because on a net basis, the U.S. Treasury hasn't really issued any debt, you know, since going back to November, December of last year, because they've been kind of bumping up, you know, against the statutory debt limit, which is obviously front and center for a lot of investors' attention. So when we get past June D-Day in terms of the debt selling, QT is going to get its teeth back. And that's something that, in my opinion, I don't think was discussed enough and obviously won't be discussed in that forum, but this is what we're here for. Yeah. Andres, I see you nodding your head.

32:21Yes. Well, I perfectly agree. If we look at the upcoming liquidity outlook for May and June, it actually looks outright disastrous. If you add a debt ceiling deal on top of QT, on top of liquidity withdrawals now that the FDIC has started paying back emergency lending on behalf of some of the banks that have folded, you probably get an aggregate removal of dollar liquidity to an extent of 500, maybe 600 billion in a matter of quarter. We can get to such levels. And let me remind you that the exact peak in equity markets back in November 2021 and into year-end coincided with that rebuilding of the Treasury General account after the debt ceiling deal was signed late 21 as well.

33:09So what's that mean for markets? And then talk about that time frame. So is that liquidity, are you going to see it come back? Is that a short-term situation or could that last? I guess if you listen to some of the members of the committee who actually care about this balance sheet issue, for example, Chris Waller, they expect to be able to bring liquidity levels down to roughly 10 % of the size of the US economy. That means 2.5, 2.6 trillion. They are roughly 700, 800 billion away from that target as of today, meaning that they have a lot of work to do to bring liquidity levels down to what they consider adequate levels.

33:55If they're able to bring them to such levels, I guess we should expect some pain in equities on the way there. I'm not sure they're able to get all the way to what they consider to be equilibrium levels, but they will certainly give it a try. And that means you should start to position in a defensive way, in my opinion. So, Mike, as we're, you know, U.S. markets closing here, and by the looks of it, the 10-year now, 3.358, do you think, I think it was Andreas before was saying, listen, even if there are cuts, if the timing is off, there's going to have to be a repricing going on in markets. Do you see that happening?

34:36Yeah, well, that's sort of, you know, that goes into sort of the thesis that I have right now that I talked about a little bit before with respect to Europe and specifically the euro with positioning. So we see the positioning and we see the sort of consensus thinking in terms of Europe being this winner from China reopening. And, you know, the ECB is going to continue to jack up rates after the Fed pauses, the Fed's going to pivot. And so I think that's the major, major risk and why sort of a rally in the dollar could spell trouble for risk assets. You know, because you look at those different factors, right?

35:12You have sort of QT is going to be ongoing. Whether or not the Fed pauses, QT is going to keep going. Then you have sort of this rebuilding of the Treasury General account. So that's a massive issuance of debt that's coming into the system, suck liquidity out of the system. And so, yeah, I mean, I think, and then the last aspect is sort of if the Fed just pauses, right, and they don't immediately start going to cuts in, say, September, or if they don't get, I mean, I think we're looking at 4.25, so almost, you know, 7 ,500 basis points of cuts by December of this year. If we don't get that right away, like the market's expecting, then that is where you could really sort of see this really sharp unwind of this consensus narrative that the Fed's going to pivot, they're going to cut rates, the dollar is going to weaken, that's going to be a major tailwind for risk assets.

36:01And so, yeah, I mean, I see a lot of risk building in terms of the U.S. dollar and sort of an upside surprise, given that everyone seems to be so bearish on the dollar. And then just to Andreas's point, I mean, I just think that the market recently has been trading recessionary, we're starting to see days where bond yields are falling and equities are ripping higher, right? I mean, everyone got so in tune to sort of that relationship between tech and yields last year. And that seems to be sort of reversing a little bit where yields are falling and equities are falling on bad data. You know, you see things like oil and gasoline and copper really starting to soften.

36:43And so, yeah, I mean, I think there is a very strong risk that the Fed doesn't move as fast to sort of react to a potential recession, which is the way the market's trading. And that could cause a severe repricing in risk assets and in rates. Darius, we have jobs number coming out. How are you thinking about the U.S. economy here? No change to where we've been since last summer. The U.S. economy has been in a very resilient to state. There have been a variety of reasons, whether you look at the private sector balance sheet, the composition of the economy, or just kind of the general growth in private sector leverage or

37:23in the data.

37:28We're lagging a little bit on Darius. Let me hop back on. I'll hop back on.

37:39I think he said he's going to hop back on.

37:44Okay, I think he's going to exit and hop back on. Are we, Andreas, when we talk about the death zone, I get a lot of questions about it from viewers. When we talk about it and we ask anyone who's a traitor, especially, they're like, it's a non-event. It's going to be horrible. It's going to be ugly politics, a dog and pony show, but at the end of the day, they'll do it. And so they kind of treat it like that. Should we be more concerned? Is there more risk around that? Someone asking about the fact that Powell was like, hey, listen, that's not our problem to solve. Well, I mean, ultimately, they will sign a deal to lift the debt ceiling again.

38:24I simply lack. I was wondering if it's unintended consequences. I think people are looking at some of the newer people in the caucus, kind of scorched earth policy, going to test the waters in a way they haven't. And is there an unintended mistake? I think that's what people worry about. Yeah, I mean, first, what will happen if we breach the crossover date, so the date where the US Treasury is no longer able to fund the operations of the federal government, is that we will enter a partial shutdown. And we've been in that scenario for a couple of times. and typically that is a pretty decent trigger event for politicians to actually sign a deal.

39:09Should we get past that stage, then it is obviously full mayhem. I would consider such a scenario very, very, very unlikely, but it still matters a lot whether the US Treasury will be allowed to refill its liquidity buffer at the Federal Reserve or not. And if they sign a solid debt ceiling deal, lifting the debt ceiling by a load of billions. The U.S. Treasury actually told us this week that they plan on refilling this war chest very fast after the debt ceiling deal is in place. And that is something that is of relevance to all of us because it means that we will see a lot of issuance of U.S.

39:49Treasuries. It means that the market will have to swallow all of these bonds again. It will have to swallow duration risk again, meaning that markets will mechanically have to take less risk elsewhere. And that typically makes equity markets suffer. Darius, we heard how, as they always do, say we're data dependent. We're going to be watching the data, which of course leads everybody to say, OK, what data? What do you think is key here for the Fed as they figure out whether they are going to pause or what would make them nervous? Is it still inflation? Is it employment? And is it really just what's happening in the banks and the reports they get from the loan supervisors as they come in through the regulatory side?

40:34What do you think is key?

40:41I don't think he's just thinking, folks. I don't think my question was that hard. I think he's having some connectivity problems. Mike, why don't you take that one? What do you think is going to be the determining factor? It has been pretty much inflation. What do you think it is now? I think it continues to be inflation unless we see a material deterioration in, say, the labor market. Or, you know, I mean, I would like to say more stress in the banking system. But I think they've kind of showed that, you know, with First Republic after SVB and Signature. I mean, if Andreas's prediction comes out that several more fail, you know, within the next couple of weeks, I mean, is that enough to get him to sort of start paying attention?

41:30I mean, I don't know. I mean, like I said, my feeling from today is it's kind of a head in the sand type of mentality. And so I think at the end of the day, it still comes down to inflation unless we see a major sort of resurgence in unemployment. But yeah, I mean, for now, it's still the inflation game. Andreas, are the lags still in effect? I mean, how much is in the pipeline and how much has already hit the economy? And now you're going to have potentially credit contraction because of the banking situation on top of that. How much wouldn't we have seen it? Or is it just working through all of that mountain of stimulus that was put into the economy and that equilibrium still there?

42:18When do we start to see the economy turn? I think we've added a new set of lags to the equation now, given that the liquidity crisis that we've seen through March and into early April in the banking system is likely to spill over to a conservative decision-making among loan offices, right? And that's another lag to introduce to an already very complex set of lags from interest rate hikes last year. and my base case is essentially that we will see the ramifications during the second half of the year but not before since an interest rate high typically takes between 14 and 18 months to filter through the system while a liquidity crisis roughly takes two quarters to show its ugly face in credit.

43:04And we know that the Federal Reserve already knew the results of the loan officer survey out on Monday next week And I actually noted a few interesting remarks from Powell in regards to that survey because he said that it was broadly in line with their expectations. And in the statement, they twisted the language around credit standards so that they now write that it is likely that credit standards will tighten, meaning that the survey released on Monday will showcase tighter lending standards. And if you look at lending standards versus actual bank lending, it typically takes roughly six months from tighter standards are being implemented at banks until you actually see the credit contraction.

43:52and on typical correlations as of what we know today, we should expect a credit contraction in between 5 % and 10 % of the total balance sheet size of the US banking system, which is quite a lot. Let me remind you of that. It sounds like it's kind of peanuts given that we've had a credit expansion of say 20 % or so of the balance sheet size, but every single credit contraction in history has led to a recession. It's very, very clear that in this hyper-financialized system, credit contraction will lead to lower economic activity. On her experience, we have the ECB meeting this week as well, right?

44:31Don't we have that tomorrow? What are you expecting there? Well, I think they will deliver a hike of 25 basis points, even though a hike of 50 basis points has been discussed. But as Michael has also alluded to, I think they're pretty scared of the banking stress spilling over to Europe. So, in a sense, they've had a bit of time to prepare for this scenario, right? Given that it started in the US and still mainly centers around the US financial system. Obviously, we've had the issue of Credit Suisse, but that's still outside of the Eurozone. So, I think they will play safe and deliver a small hike, even though the inflation picture basically tells them to hike by 50 or 75 base points.

45:14It's still very, very elevated relative to the inflation momentum in the U.S. Mike, if the Europe overperforming has been played out or over-exaggerated, or you think that's extreme, sounds like you're both saying that, and the U.S. is facing these headwinds, what does outperform here? What looks good? I mean, it's tough. I mean, I, you know, when I think through sort of the setup for both risk assets as well as fixed income, I mean, I struggle to get a really clear picture because while on the one hand, you know, I do think that the Fed is going to be forced to cut sooner than they want to. Now, I don't know if that comes in September or December.

46:05The timing of that is really difficult. Now, yes, there's a nice yield aspect to that that you can sort of get, you know, carry and sort of sitting in whether it's short duration fixed income. But I think the timing of that is really difficult, especially because if they just sit and don't cut rates, I mean, there is a very real risk of a material repricing higher in yields that could deal you some pain. And, you know, and risk assets, I mean, valuations are still extremely elevated. And so I struggle to see a lot of opportunity in those two asset classes. I personally have been spending a lot more time looking at things like, you know, we have a global liquidity dashboard that we're looking at that kind of just looks at policy rates versus inflation rates and money supply and sort of the trend in policy rates and their last changes.

46:55And I just think we're setting up for some real serious divergence in monetary policy. You know, one of the things I wrote about this week was, you know, if you look at Brazil, I mean, yes, Lula has been making comments about how he feels that rates are too high. You know, but if you look at sort of where their rates are, I think it's like 13.75 % versus inflation. I mean, that's a massive, I mean, it's almost 10 % real rate over inflation. So whether it's, you know, playing sort of fixed income and say like a Brazil or even the FX market, to me, I think that's where a lot of the opportunities and where we've been spending a lot of our time is much more on where sort of these divergent monetary policy decisions can come out and what that might mean for, you know, especially something like the euro where, you know, where positioning has been extremely lopsided and could spark a really nasty reversal if position starts to get unwind.

47:50Yeah, and George is saying, oh, don't leave out the BOJ as well. Darius, we also, I mean, this is a busy week. We've also got Apple coming out after the bell. We saw some of the big, you know, big mega cap tech names. I saw a stat somewhere, and I don't have it in front of me, that I think it was$2.5 billion flowed into QQQ last week. You know, what happens with all the money that's been chasing technology? How does that fit into the outlook based on what we just heard from the Fed? Yeah, so I mean, medium term, it's, you know, would I say medium term over the next, let's call it three to six months.

48:28You know, I don't know that anyone has a real foundational basis because on one hand, a foundational basis to make a strong conviction call, because on one hand, you're going to likely see the economy, at least for mega cap tech, continue to be relatively resilient. You know, recessions don't really start for every consumer, every business at the same time. So those kinds of companies are going to likely continue to outperform from a fundamental standpoint. On the flip side, we do have pretty severe inflection in global liquidity. Obviously, Andreas, Michael, and I were discussing earlier that, hey, you're going to have this pretty sizable inflection with respect to U.S.

49:02liquidity vis-a-vis the TGA. And these would be the TGA and quantitative tightening actually getting its teeth back. Brian, you could throw that slide four up there where we show kind of the components of our just now liquidity model, Fed balance sheet, emergency lending on the Fed's balance sheet, reverse repo and the Treasury General account balance. I will caveat that by saying we do have almost$250 billion in the TGA right now. And that thing's got to go to zero before we start bouncing up. So I think over the very near term, it's going to be hard for asset markets to crack, particularly on that factor alone.

49:32But I think we're kind of missing the point right now. And I do want to kind of broaden out the discussion and talk about global liquidity, as Michael was trying to do here, because I think global liquidity has kind of become in the driver's seat, particularly because we've seen such large deltas emanating from global central banks and global economies. So, Ryan, if you can throw up chart one, where we show our global liquidity proxy there, and how we get to our global liquidity proxy, what we're trying to do is amalgamate the influence upon liquidity. Again, it's a squishy concept, but the influence upon liquidity from both the private sector and the public sector.

50:06And we do this by amalgamating global central bank balance sheets. We do this plus global narrow money supply, plus world FX reserves. And that number is right around$94.4 trillion. It's up right around$2.3 trillion from over bottom in October. So that's positive. On the negative side, it's actually delta negative on a trend basis. So if you look at the trailing three months through April, that's that third panel in this chart here on chart one, it's minus 6.5 % on a three-month annualized basis. And when you look at it, you start to deconstruct the components. This is where I'm actually getting more worried just in looking at the actual overall trend in the time series.

50:39And so when we look at slide two here, we actually deconstruct the time series into the central bank balance sheet, into global narrow money supply and into world FX reserves. And what we can see is we had a basically a plus three point five trillion dollar impulse in global central bank balance sheet. That's now minus seven hundred billion dollars on a trillion dollar basis. That impulse peaked in January. We had a plus four point nine trillion dollar impulse in global narrow money supply. that peaked in January, and that's now almost minus$1 trillion on a trillion-three-month basis through April.

51:09And then with respect to World FX reserves, we had a trillion-three-month impulse of right around$850 billion that peaked in February, and that number has declined all the way to just plus 60. So we got a pretty significant kind of removal in global liquidity, and I think that's kind of coming at the same time. You have this kind of, you know, we're running out of scope to have positive liquidity dynamics here in the U.S. as vis-a-vis the dead ceiling and vis-a-vis toothless QT. So it could be quite a rocky summer. Andres, I know that you have been looking at liquidity as well. You did your stent of signals on that very issue.

51:45And if you don't have access to that, if you're not a member, you can scan the QR code so you can see that Andres drops them every week. What are you looking at? And do you also see this sort of lining up as problematic, sounds like, for the global economy? Yeah, I tend to agree with the assessment of Darius. And I think the interesting thing here is that we have a divergence between the East and the West when it comes to liquidity trends. China clearly added liquidity into the first quarter. Bank of Japan added liquidity to an extent that almost matched the pace of the Federal Reserve in March 2020, earlier this year.

52:23It was an extreme liquidity addition from Bank of Japan when they defended their yield curve control after lifting the cap by 25 basis points late last year. So what I'm trying to say here is that if you want to follow liquidity trends, it may be a good idea to add some equity exposure in Asia. I'm not saying that you should add direct equity exposure to mainland China. I get the reasons why you don't want to do so. But maybe Japan is a decent option if you want some equity exposure with less tricky liquidity developments. Andres, do you think that – I know we're going to start watching closely in June.

53:04Do you think that BOJ is going to try to raise – are they going to change their yield curve control levels? Are they going to try to raise that band again? I mean, they actually did quite a few changes to their communication at the meeting last week that, in my opinion, paved the way for policy action in June. But if they decide to increase the cap by 25 basis points again, they will ultimately have to defend the new cap, I guess, as they did in January when they lifted the yield curve control cap back in December. So what I'm saying here is that even in a scenario where they hike the yield curve control cap, they may have to print more yens to defend it anyway.

53:51Yeah, that's why I'm asking. Everyone pretty much assumes that the market's going to test their resolve if that happens. We're almost out of time. But Mike, if you're looking, if you think the dollar trade, it sounds like that's the one you're the most interested in. Are you waiting and watching for something? Are you starting to do anything now? How are you thinking about expressing that? So, I mean, it's a little bit of sort of dipping my toe in on a couple of different trades. You know, I have a sort of toolbox, if you will, of different technical signals that I use to sort of help me with my trades.

54:30You know, I have my sort of broader thesis and I sort of wait for my signals to start to fire. So, you know, yes, I did step into the euro today on the short side just a little bit. sort of in that post-release statement where the euro kind of shot up to the upside and it gave up a decent amount of that in the afternoon. At the same time, I don't want to add a ton of risks in case we get any sudden surprises from the ECB tomorrow. So for me, it's sort of dipping my toe in because I do think that technicals aside, You know, whether it's the Fed pivoting to rate cuts or it's, you know, everyone believes that once the debt ceiling impasse is resolved, that's naturally going to be a dollar net negative because of sort of the upheaval and and, you know, whatnot.

55:26people are going to be upset with the U.S. and lose faith in the U.S. because of everything that's going on, that's just become such an overwhelming narrative. While there's very real fundamental liquidity things going on that, you know, yeah, I'm comfortable stepping in from more of a fundamental and catalyst type situation. And then I'll wait for the technicals to start to turn more to add to those. Which makes sense in this environment. Darius, I want to give you the last word, but I got to tell you, as usual, we're getting a lot of love for your shirts, and Johnny Airport believes you should come out with a line of your own.

55:59So just a little entrepreneurial idea for you as we navigate this tough macro environment. But what do you want to leave people with? What's going to be on your radar? What are you looking at, and where do you, where's the risk that you want to keep an eye on? Yeah, so I'll end with three things. Number one, Don't thank me. Thank Tommy Bahama. Number two, just remember that the Fed is a reactive government agency. They're not going to spray the liquidity hose, get in the fire truck and spray that liquidity hose without a burning house to put out. And we have to ultimately have to get into that burning house process, which, in our opinion, has not been priced in the equity and credit markets.

56:40And quite frankly, it hasn't really been priced in the fixed income markets as well. if you look at the amount of rate cuts or the lack thereof that are actually priced in from a terminal of that funds rate floor perspective. And then lastly, zooming back out to this concept of global liquidity, it's definitely no longer improving. It's not sort of contracting the way it was throughout 2022. But you can make the case that it might actually start to contract the way it was throughout 2022. And I'll just leave you with two final thoughts on that, which is the Chinese economy is the part of the reason we saw such a significant uptick in global liquidity last year is we saw the Chinese economy kind of really struggling late in the year.

57:16The PBOC was very keen to give the Chinese economy kind of a fundamental boost in the absence of meaningful fiscal stimulus. Well, Chinese economy is now standing on its own two feet. We can clearly see that in the data. GDP and Q1 is 4.5%. It's well on its way to meeting that government target of 5 % for 2023. So it's very unlikely that PBOCs in the game are going to have skin in the game the same degree. And then I have a variant perception with Andreas with respect to the DOJ for two reasons. One, part of what we saw investors in terms of attacking DOJ's Yoker control framework and kind of forcing that speculation upon the policy there is part of the reason for that was we saw global bond market volatility as high as it had pretty much ever been, at least in recorded history on that time period.

58:01And now that bond market volatility is much lower, it's very unlikely we see kind of the attacks we see on the DOJ policy. But secondarily, Ueda has been pretty clear that he's not necessarily in favor of piecemeal changes to the policy. So that may kind of delay any big changes in policy kind of until next year. So in our view, this concept of global liquidity at the bare minimum is no longer improving, and it's probably going to get a lot worse vis-a-vis the U.S. economy and U.S. liquidity dynamics over the next, let's call it, six months. Fantastic. Darius, Mike, Andreas, so appreciate all of you coming on and helping us not only break down what happened, but really give us a lot of information and things that we really need to keep our eye on as we move forward.

58:43So appreciate all of you. Appreciate you, Meg. Thanks, Meg. We're going to be back on with George Gonsalves. George is on with us tomorrow. George Gonsalves is on with us tomorrow and we'll talk about UCB and look ahead to Fed. So we'll see you all then. In the meantime, take care and good luck out there.

59:09What's up, revolutionaries? Thanks for tuning in to the Real Vision Daily Briefing. For more content like this, head over to realvision.com and get unfiltered access to the very best, brightest, and biggest names in finance.

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