The Return of Monoculture and the Rise of the Creator Box Office Hit

0:00Hi, everyone. This is Scalable, a weekly show about the business of the creator economy. I'm Kaya Uriyev. And I'm Jasmine Enberg. Every Thursday, we take you beyond the headlines to tell you what's happening, what it means, and why it matters. YouTube filmmakers are having such a moment that headlines are going bananas for them. CNN went as far as to declare that YouTubers could change the future of moviemaking, while the San Francisco Chronicle wrote that, quote, YouTubers may be saving Hollywood. Okay, CNN, but no. Creators aren't, quote, saving Hollywood. They're not remaking the box office, at least not in the way that you might think.

0:35There is a catch to all of this success. All of them are horror films, and so is nearly every other YouTuber-led box office hit. And that's not a coincidence. Backrooms originated from viral creepypasta and YouTube shorts by Kane Parsons, which cultivated millions of fans before filming had even started. So if you're not familiar with what creepypasta means, I asked Claude to help me explain this. It likened it to scary campfire tales for the internet age, which I thought was like quite a nice way to describe it. Yeah, go Claude. The first thing I thought of was that old Nickelodeon show from the 90s, Are You Afraid of the Dark?

1:12The Wall Street Journal wrote a whole piece about the return of monoculture this summer. I actually don't think this is the beginning of another era of monoculture. I think it simply shows that hyper personalized content has its limits. People still want at least some shared reference points and some shared experiences because the trade off is becoming really clear. I think it also means though that our feeds probably aren't as different as we like to think. We all like to think that we're so unique and there's nobody else out there that's anything like us. Besides like the obvious differences, I honestly think we're probably mostly into a lot of the same stuff.

1:46It was also Hollywood's first $4 billion summer since 2023 when Barbie and Oppenheimer revived movie theaters. I was 100 % team Barbie and Ken. Do you remember that clip of Ryan Gosling, who played Ken in the movie, performing the song live at the Oscars? So I have not seen that. I'm just kidding. Everywhere else I'd be here. I also still haven't seen Oppenheimer, but I especially loved all the contrasting memes and kind of fun conversations around both films. Creators obviously operate in the digital and social media world, but I think they're recognizing, especially since the pandemic, the power of being in person.

2:26It's really hard to visualize a million followers or 50 ,000 followers or 10 million subscribers, right? But if you have a thousand, you know, of your true fans in a room and you see that enthusiasm and excitement. Over half of Americans went to the movies between summer 2024 and summer 2025. And it's not just boomers or families with kids. 67 % or about two thirds of 18 to 29 year olds in the US went to the movies during that time. And that was ahead of any other generation. And I think that just goes to show that there is a real appetite for the cinema, even among young people who everybody associates with just being on TikTok or YouTube.

3:10hi jasmine hi kaya so summer is sadly coming to an end and we are hearing a lot of talk about how it's been the summer of monoculture returning we had the world cup the biggest summer box office since the pandemic with films like spider-man and the odyssey plus the knicks won their first nba championship in more than 50 years which united new york city and fans well beyond the Don't forget Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey's wedding at Madison Square Garden, which I think also united all of New York City and all the Taylor Swift fans out there. I am here to support Taylor Swift and her wedding ceremony here at MSG.

3:48I hope she has the time of her life, no matter how it looks to us or how it looks to other people. I hope that this is her day and she soaks it in and it is truly an enchanting experience. The more I think about it, the more I really put some thought into it. I actually kind of love that Taylor Swift's getting married at Madison Square Garden. I thought you were going to say you're getting Botox. It really needs to be studied that we have not seen a single photo from Taylor Swift's wedding, like, inside the venue, anything. Not one. We haven't seen their kiss. We haven't seen them together. Other than that one, like, leaked photo that we don't even know is real or not.

4:23Like, we have not seen one photo of Taylor Swift's wedding. But yes, I mean, it feels like everybody has really been following the same events this summer. Today, though, we are going to focus on the summer blockbusters specifically because two of the unexpected hits, Obsession and Backrooms, were actually made by YouTube creators. After years of saying that creators were going to destroy Hollywood, these two movies changed media headlines to creators are, quote, saving Hollywood essentially overnight. But there are a few things that these headlines were missing. Yes. And then when you add on The Odyssey's stellar summer and the fact that five movies have grossed over a billion dollars, none of which were creator movies, it's pretty clear that reports of Hollywood's death were a little premature.

5:06But we're getting ahead of ourselves. Later in the episode, we're also going to talk more about the convergence of the movie industry and the creator economy in our conversation that was recorded earlier this year at the Cannes Film Festival. We also talk about the challenges that creators are facing when they're breaking into the film industry and how both of these industries could actually benefit and learn from each other. But first, let's talk about this cultural moment that we're in. Yeah, I mean, for years, people in the media have practically treated this as settled science. Monoculture is dead.

5:37Yeah, I mean, you hear it literally everywhere. I mean, algorithms have fractured culture forever. Everybody's attention is so fragmented. Everyone has their own feed. They have their own fandom. They have their own version of what's trending and what's not. But I think this summer has really pushed back on this idea between the World Cup and Erling Haaland's hair, which he just cut, by the way. I saw it on Instagram, I think, last night. So many people sent me that. People were outraged. I was one of the ones who sent you that. No, I know. It's crazy. I mean, I guess now that the World Cup is over, he can.

6:10But still, it's like, it's such a huge part of his identity. But anyway, it's not just Erling Haaland, not just the World Cup. There's also so much hype around the Odyssey, Kaya, which you mentioned, the surprisingly successful creator-led horror movies, Obsession, and Backrooms that we've been following. And it just seems like people are doing a very old fashioned thing, which is looking at the same thing at the same time and talking about it together, sometimes even in person, meaning in a movie theater, not at home on their sofa. So this obviously raises a lot of questions about where attention is going and what companies should be doing about it.

6:45Yeah, the Wall Street Journal wrote a whole piece about the return of monoculture this summer. But I actually don't think this is the beginning of another era of monoculture. I think it simply shows that hyper personalized content has its limits. I mean, there was an interesting quote in that journal piece from Hunter Harris, who writes the hung up newsletter. And she said, it feels like we're finally having the same conversation in a way that really hasn't happened since COVID, which if you think about it, I mean, that's six years, it's been a long time. And before COVID, I can't even remember the last time.

7:12But it really shows that most people still want at least some shared reference points and some shared experiences, because the trade off is becoming really clear. Now. I mean, we have more content than ever before, but fewer things feel culturally important and unavoidable. And I think as humans, we just need those common reference points and big moments to come around together. I mean, the World Cup was just such a uniting moment and just so much fun, too. Yeah, I think it also means, though, that our feeds probably aren't as different as we like to think. I mean, it is a really nice idea to buy into because we all like to think that we're so unique and there's nobody else out there that's anything like us.

7:48And of course, the social platforms and other tech platforms really have pushed this idea of personalization. And I'm not saying they aren't personalized. I mean, there are, you know, there's a lot of personalization that is going on on these feeds. But besides like the obvious differences between different demographic groups or stages of life, I honestly think we're probably mostly into a lot of the same stuff. And personally, I think that's a good thing. I mean, just look at the new Spider-Man movie, which has long been a very reliable franchise. Spider-Man, Brand New Day, surpassed a billion dollars globally in almost record time, starring Tom Holland.

8:24It reached that milestone just six days after its release, which in the words of Variety was a, quote, mind-boggling piece. The film also earned$407 million in North America in its first four days, which is the fastest film to surpass$400 million domestically. And it did really well overseas as well. Yeah. And then there's the Odyssey, which I went to see and loved, though I do take issue with some of the framing of the story as like a huge Greek mythology buff from high school. I learned new things about you. I learned new things about you every podcast episode. I'm sharing more on this podcast about myself than I initially attended, but that's okay.

8:59But anyway, the Odyssey was another big winner. It also surpassed a billion dollars at the global box office. And overall, the summer box office hit$4 billion, which is only the second time it's done so post-pandemic. It was also Hollywood's first$4 billion summer since 2023 when Barbie and Oppenheimer revived movie theaters. I'm sure you all remember Barb and Heimer. I was 100 % Team Barbie and Ken. I mean, do you remember that clip of Ryan Gosling, who played Ken in the movie, performing the song live at the Oscars? I mean, that lives rent-free in my head. So I have not seen that. So we're going to play the clip in case others also have it.

9:40I'm just kidding. Anywhere else I'd be a tank. Is it my destiny to live and die a life of blind fragility? I'm just kidding. Where I see the love she sees a friend. What will it take for her to see the man behind the tent? and fight for me. I also still haven't seen Oppenheimer, but I of course watched Barbie and I loved it. And I especially loved all the contrasting memes and kind of fun conversations around both films. So even though I didn't go see Oppenheimer, as many people did, I very much enjoyed the content around it on social and felt like connected to other people as well. I didn't see Oppenheimer in theaters, but I did end up watching it later on.

10:29I mean, I love that period of history and that story. I find it so fascinating. But what I also loved, like besides the memes and all the social commentary, was that the actors and the movies, like the people behind the movies were really playing into it as well. I mean, you had Emily Blunt and Ryan Gosling presenting together at one of the award shows. It was a really, really fun moment where again, it felt like everybody was in on the same thing. Hello, Emily. Wow, a bit of a frosty hello, didn't it? Not at all, no. I'm just happy that we can finally put this Barbenheimer rivalry behind us. That's right.

11:05That's right. Here's Ken and Kitty just leaving all that fodder in the dust, guys, right? And the way this award season's turned out wasn't that much of a rivalry. So just let it go. At the same time, though, the summer of monoculture also could have just been a perfect storm of things that were always going to be massive. So a Christopher Nolan movie based on, an iconic book, Taylor Swift's wedding, I mean, the World Cup, it's not surprising that people were tuning into these things. A hundred percent. But I also think it just shows that there is so much more appetite for these shared moments, these shared experiences.

11:41And that really just has been lost in the conversation recently. And somewhat ironically, though, it is creators who have been some of the biggest beneficiaries of this summer's monocultural moments. So we mentioned those two creator movies, Obsession, that was directed by YouTuber Curry Barker. It just surpassed$500 million in the global box office. That makes it the first original film of the 2020s to hit that milestone. It beat out Pixar's 2023 film Elemental. I mean, that is just an enormous, enormous milestone for the movie. Then there's Backrooms, which was directed by 20-year-old YouTuber Kane Parsons.

12:21That one grossed$118 million worldwide during its opening weekend in May. So notably, both of these movies were actually made on ultra low budgets, true to creator style. Obsession actually also holds the title of the highest grossing film with a budget of less than a million dollars. And we'll talk more about that in a second. Earlier this year, of course, we also had YouTuber Markiplier's horror sci-fi movie Iron Lung, which he self-funded, starred in and directed. That has grossed more than$50 million worldwide since debuting earlier this year. Just as a side note, this is a completely new trend this year.

12:57There have been other creator movie successes before. So for example, Talk To Me from Danny and Michael Philippou, who are twin YouTubers, better known as Raka Raka. They had a supernatural horror film, which was released in theaters in July 2023, and that grossed about$92 million. Yeah. And with Obsession and Backrooms, I mean, both were getting people excited about actually going into theaters. Most of the viewers were also young, bucking the narrative that, you know, young people or Gen Z doesn't want to go to the movies. Nearly 85 % of audiences were under the age of 35, and more than half were 25 or younger, according to post-track data.

13:33And that's because these moviegoers already knew these creators' work. So both Backrooms and Obsession dominated the box office by bringing an audience with them that they had spent years building from the ground up. So they leveraged those built-in fandoms, which also allowed these creators to kind of bypass the traditional Hollywood marketing pipeline. They relied a lot on word of mouth and kind of these unique aesthetics that resonated with their fans rather than kind of expensive studio marketing. So for example, Backrooms originated from viral creepypasta and YouTube shorts by Kane Parsons, which cultivated millions of fans before filming had even started.

14:09So if you're not familiar with what creepypasta means, Like me, I am not. Please, please explain. Allow me to explain. So it basically just means internet horror stories that go viral. And they're usually short. They're kind of these spooky posts or images that people want to kind of reshare over and over online. So when I asked Claude to help me explain this, it likened it to scary campfire tales for the internet age, which I thought was like quite a nice way to describe it. Yeah, go Claude. Go Claude. You never know. Sometimes you get really weird answers. But it's funny because when you explained it to me, the first thing I thought of was that old Nickelodeon show from the 90s, Are You Afraid of the Dark, which is literally just like a bunch of kids sitting around a campfire telling scary stories.

14:52It was really terrifying. Anyway, all of this is to say that these movies kind of came from already well-known IP on the internet that is recognized by young people. Yeah. And to your point about sort of the marketing strategy, I think one of the other things that struck me as we were researching this episode is that these YouTubers definitely had their marketing hat on as they were writing the scripts and filming. So like if you take Obsession, for example, there are so many meme worthy moments in that movie. Like they have those awkwardly long shots, they have the close ups, then there's Indie Neverette's really terrifying smile.

15:28So those moments to me really were made for social media. They were made for virality to get people excited to get them talking and really just get them into these movie theaters. And it's really hard to imagine traditional studios, at least historically, you know, thinking this way. So yes, and YouTube filmmakers are having such a moment that headlines are going bananas for them. CNN went as far as to declare that YouTubers could change the future of moviemaking, while the San Francisco Chronicle wrote that, quote, YouTubers may be saving Hollywood. Okay, CNN. But no. Creators aren't, quote, saving Hollywood.

16:04They're not remaking the box office. I mean, no matter how you want to put it, it's just a no, at least not in the way that you might think. And I will preface this by saying, and I think we've already said this during this episode, like these are major successes for digital creators in traditional cinema and Hollywood. But as we've talked about in the newsletter and in a previous podcast, actually, there is a catch to all of this success. I mean, all of them are horror films, and so is nearly every other YouTuber-led box office hit. And that's not a coincidence. I mean, horror doesn't require massive budgets.

16:35It doesn't require A-list actors. It also doesn't need expensive visual effects for it to find an audience and succeed. Again, this is not us trying to talk down the genre or to talk down creators. There's really no shade to horror movies or horror creators. I think it just explains why horror has been such a popular and a more accessible route for newcomers who try to break into Hollywood, including more traditional filmmakers and creators, and why it's also just such a massive stretch to say that creators are saving Hollywood. I mean, there's so much more to the industry than horror movies. Yeah, and these creators didn't make these movies alone.

17:13They had some help from kind of the traditional Hollywood playbook. So James Wan, who is one of the biggest horror filmmakers of our time, produced Backrooms through his production company Atomic Monster. Wan is behind the Saw and Insidious franchises. Obsession also starred several famous actors and A-listers, including Mark Duplass, which surely helps broaden the movie's appeal as well. So instead, I think this is really just a great example of Hollywood and creators converging, which is something we talk about all the time. Like it's not one or the other, meaning Hollywood versus creators. And there are some studio execs that agree as well.

17:44Juan, for one, is really excited about this new generation of YouTube filmmakers. In an interview with Variety, he said that the YouTube generation grew up creating their own content with no money and just by being as creative as possible. And the big advantage of that is that they have platforms like YouTube where they can just upload their work and get instant feedback from viewers. So this allows them to kind of react instantly to what works and what doesn't and kind of hone their skills and craft better in a way that, you know, didn't exist for filmmakers pre-YouTube. A hundred percent. I mean, there's so much the traditional film industry can learn from creators.

18:17So let's start by talking a little bit about the production budgets, because Obsession had a budget of$750 ,000. Back rooms cost about$10 million to make. I mean, this sounds like a huge difference, and it is, but both of these are actually a fraction of the budgets for major studio franchises, which can cost upwards of$200 million. And other horror films are also much cheaper to make. So obviously, this was a great return on investment for both. And that's why everybody in Hollywood was raving about this and why these films garnered so much attention from entertainment executives. Production budgets are under pressure.

18:55And these really do offer a compelling example of how some films can be made a lot more cost effectively. At the same time, though, where is the average creator getting$1 million, let alone$10 million for an independent film? That is a huge investment for an individual creator to make. And the reality is that most creators or YouTubers are not going to be able to produce a film for movie theaters. And one of the biggest obstacles is funding. As an added challenge, unlike most other countries, the U.S. doesn't have any government funding for independent cinema that creators can tap into. Here's what Reese Feldman, who is a film-focused creator who's known online as Kai with a Movie Camera, told us at the Cannes Film Festival earlier this summer.

19:35He talked to us about what is holding him back from making his own film, which is one of his goals. Money? If I had, you know,$5 million, let's say. That sounds like a lot of money, but most movies released in theaters are a lot more than that. I would love to have$5 million. That would mean I can make a movie very comfortably. But if there was a million dollars,$750 ,000, that can make a feature film that is good. So to fill the gap, there are some private companies that are now moving into the space. Dolphin Entertainment and Kinetic Media Ventures have launched Gravature Studios, which is a new venture that aims to help produce modestly budgeted movies and TV projects for creators.

20:19So these projects are budgeted in the$1 million to$10 million range. And the hope is that Gravature will be able to help YouTubers as well as other creators produce films and TV with deals that also help them retain, you know, ownership and control. And that's according to a Variety article on the deal. What types of movies are they interested in funding? Well, it's comedy, young adult, sci-fi, sports, and you guessed it, horror. Another challenge that creators who produce horror movies have struggled with is critics and recognition. I mean, most horror films simply don't gain the critical acclaim that you see in other genres, which makes it harder to kind of get funded by traditional studios.

20:58And why this fund is also focusing on horror, among other categories. There are obviously some exceptions like Silence of the Lambs, which won multiple Oscars, and others like The Exorcist and Get Out. Reese had his own theory for why creators are drawn to horror. Here's what he said. I think horror is one that is often disrespected, and I feel like digital creators can be looked down on. I think there's an art form to storytelling. And I think telling a story in under 60 seconds is just as big a beat as telling one in 60 minutes. So I think there's that chip on the shoulder kind of thing that's maybe underlying a little bit that ours very often disrespect it and written off, similarly to digital.

21:38I mean, I kind of agree with him, right? Markiplier said something similar when he explained like every studio passed on Iron Long and then he just decided to release it himself. And he also tapped his fan base. So he encouraged his millions of followers to write to their local cinemas and request that they carry the film. And, you know, he thought it might play in, you know, a few hundred theaters. But after this massive fan campaign, it opened in more than 4 ,000. Yeah. I mean, what MarketPlier did actually sounds very similar to what Creator Camp did to market its movie to Sleepy People. And we talked about this in a previous episode with Creator Camp CEO Max Reisinger.

22:13But if you haven't seen that, basically what he said is that they did not have a big marketing budget to spend on ads. So instead, they used social media. I think it was Facebook in particular to gather email lists of people who were interested in the movie. They also got, you know, their location so that they could take those lists then to theaters and pinpoint specific demand. They then showed the names of these people who had given their emails in credits in the movie, basically to encourage people to attend in person. and they did. And as we said then, I mean, this is another thing that I think big name studios could actually learn from the creator economy.

22:49I mean, you can build an audience first for a film before you release it, especially, you know, if you're trying to attract younger audiences. And if you think about historically how films have been made, you develop the film first, and then you hope that it finds a buyer or an audience. Obviously, it's more complicated than that. But you know, in a nutshell. The creators have a lot to learn from Hollywood, too. It's so different to do a 15 second video or even a long form video, that type of storytelling, the production, the massive sets, like even Reese, right? He goes onto these sets and creates content from them and like the sheer scale of the behind the scenes, what goes behind this production.

23:24But one other big open question is whether creators will be able to replicate the same box office success outside of horror. So far, most attempts by creators in other genres have not hit. So if you look at top kids YouTuber Ryan Kaji, he released Ryan's World the Movie in 2024 with an estimated budget of$10 million. So modest budget in Hollywood standards. But the film flopped. I mean, it grossed just over$624 ,000 worldwide, according to data from box office Mojo. Dude Perfect, the comedy group on YouTube, also saw small earnings from its theatrical release of Dude Perfect the Hero Tour in 2025.

24:01It grows just shy of$6 ,000. The movie was only shown across 18 theaters, though. But still, I mean, we have not seen huge successes kind of outside of the horror ones. Yeah, and I think a big part of that is that it's not just about the money. It's also about the skill set. I mean, Kaya, you started talking about this a little bit. It is a very different thing to make a 20-second TikTok or even a 20-minute YouTube video than it is to make a feature-length film. I mean, I think The Odyssey was like almost three hours long, which is insane. It's too long. It's too long. I'm sorry. What happened to movies being like 90 minutes?

24:35Like that is like the perfect amount of time. Anyway, even like beyond the length, though, like not every creator knows how to write a script, produce, do costume design, do set design, like all the things that go into making a film like these are really intense productions. And we've talked about this with creators in the past, too, who have, you know, been on TV sets and sort of like what the differences are between them. And they're always, you know, really taken aback by just how many people there are and how big of a production this really is. And that's, you know, hard to go from being just you and a smartphone to, you know, trying to make a movie of this scale.

25:13So I think that's also why you see some of these YouTubers, these creators that want to make movies like Backrooms, for example, really soliciting help from traditional Hollywood because there's a lot that they can also learn from, you know, these traditional studios. It's played out in TV as well, right? Like Mr. Beast totally could have pulled off with funding and his own resources Beast Games or could have just run that on his YouTube channel. But he decided to do that with Amazon and Prime Video. I can imagine because it could just go so much bigger than they had the crossover episode with Survivor.

25:46It also puts him in front of an older audience, which is something he talked about at the Dealbook Summit. So there's a lot of reasons and benefits for creators as well to work with, whether it's a streamer or, you know, release a movie as well. I'm sure we will see more and more creators trying to make movies for theaters. As more people try, there certainly will be plenty of flops. But one that we are excited for is from Feldman himself, the creator we talked to at Cannes. He told us that his ultimate goal is to create a film himself. And of course, the genre he wants to create is... Horror.

26:19What else? So now let's take a deeper dive into how these two industries, the traditional film industry and the creator economy, are increasingly overlapping. We also give our predictions for what we think the convergence is going to look like. So here's our live discussion from the Cannes Film Festival earlier this summer. So just for a little context, we spoke at the first ever Creator Economy Summit in May, which was part of the Marché du Fume, the business conference and film market that takes place alongside the Cannes Film Festival each year. It's also really interesting to revisit this conversation now, given everything that's happened since, right?

26:52When we were having this conversation, Backrooms and Obsession hadn't come out yet. So it was quite prescient of the Marché du Fume to put this on and to host this, given how the rest of the summer played out. I am also very glad that our analysis stood the test of time. Like it's only been a few months, but things move so quickly. You never know. No, it did. And that's how we decided to run it because we're like, this still stands. But we also interviewed a meta executive, Louise Holmes, on stage. And then we wrapped up the festival by giving our predictions for what happens next. So here is the full conversation.

27:23We really want to kind of wrap up with some of the themes and big takeaways that we've heard over the past few days and today, as well as kind of give our predictions for what we think is happening next. Yeah, so a lot of what we've heard today has to do with building bridges between the creator economy and the traditional film industry. And I think that relates really nicely to the first theme that we've been following and that we wanted to talk about today, which is legitimacy. And what we mean by that is that social media creators still really want recognition from traditional film and entertainment industry, even as they've built massive audiences on YouTube and other digital platforms.

28:01And we're seeing this in Hollywood. So many creators now are campaigning for Emmys. Many of them are showing up on the red carpet, either to film interviews or to create content. YouTube, of course, nabbed Oscars rights starting in 2029. A lot of that, of course, has to do with the ad dollars. It is obviously a monetary play, but it's also a play for legitimacy and approval. And this is something that we heard Markiplier talk a little bit about today on stage as well. Yeah, he spoke about kind of the stigma that YouTubers still face in the industry and talked a little bit about, you know, initially being rejected right from film festivals.

28:37So I think so much of, you know, on the award side is creators want the recognition and they also want to celebrate their accomplishments. We've seen podcasters, for example, do Emmy campaigns to try to win Emmys. You know, a few YouTubers have been nominated for Emmys this year, but they're still very much getting snubbed from the Oscars and some of these kind of big award shows. So what we've seen to fill the gap is these very niche awards shows popping up. So social media platforms have done them. There's so many of them. There's so many of them. So we'll give a little flavor. So TikTok and Snapchat have hosted them.

29:09And we're not talking about like a little rinky dink kind of award show at their office. We see someone shaking their head here. It's, you know, productions, musical numbers, physical awards, black tie, the whole thing. We've even seen an awards show just for marketing podcasts. So you can kind of see how niche this is, this is gone. And it really is because creators want recognition for their work and they're not getting that from traditional entertainment right now. Yeah. I mean, I went to the TikTok awards in December in LA and I can attest to the fact that it was not a rinky dink award show.

29:39I mean, they had some technical issues, but that aside, I do think with so many of these awards now being given out, it does kind of feel like a participation trophy. And winning a TikTok award or a Snappy just is not the same thing as winning a Palme d 'Or. And I'm pretty sure that anyone in the audience will agree with me on that. And if you think more broadly about the film industry, I mean, movies and the Cannes Film Festival in particular really is the pinnacle of prestige. So it just makes so much sense that that creators want to be a part of it. On the flip side, though, we do see that, you know, the film industry to some degree still looks down upon creator content.

30:17Again, you know, thinking back to the comments that MarketPlyer made. But going back to the award shows for a second, you cannot blame the social platforms for doing this, though, because it is just such a good way to build loyalty with creators. It's also a good way to build loyalty with their audiences because, you know, who doesn't love to see their favorite creator win an award, whether it's a Snappy or a TikTok award or whatever else? No, definitely. And I think there isn't the same path for creators. And I think we're seeing career paths across the board get shaken up. I mean, both with the rise of AI and with the rise of the creator economy.

30:47But as we discussed with Louise, I mean, we're seeing more convergence right now on the TV streaming and creator side. I think with the film industry, we're still at the very beginning of it and it'll come. But, you know, it's taken a while, I think, for even streamers to warm up to creator content. But we've seen a lot more of those kind of deals getting done. I think the question that we've had is, especially with younger generations, how long are we going to differentiate between these worlds? I think if you look at the younger, you know, Gen Alpha, Gen Z, they don't really differentiate between creators that they follow or celebrities.

31:19Well, creators are the new celebrities for them. And I think, you know, the lines have really blurred. So they just don't have the same association with traditional Hollywood or movies or TV. And the example that I always gave is Scarlett Johansson. And it's actually very fitting, considering that she had a movie premiere here last night, Although apparently she was not on the red carpet or at the premiere. I saw that on Instagram this morning that she did not pick up a FaceTime call from the director of Paper Tigers during the standing ovation, which is kind of funny. But anyway, I mean, to me, Scarlett Johansson is probably like one of the most famous people in the world.

31:52But if you ask someone from Gen Z or Gen Alpha, they may not have any idea who she is, but they're definitely going to know Mr. Beast or Mark Rober. And I think that just speaks to the fact that it's not just attention that has shifted to digital platforms, but also, you know, this idea of celebrity has changed. Yeah. And I think it's just going to take time. I mean, for us, right, like these A-list actors are still, you know, very exciting. I remember I was at VidCon, which is a big conference in Anaheim, California, which is kind of the original creator conference. And this was in 2019. And I was asking creators, like, would you rather see like Brad Pitt or like Dude Perfect?

32:28And they're It's just wild to me. It's really crazy. Even covering the space and believing in it, it's just crazy to me. Yeah, and I think we've seen this play out online, too. There are creators who will ask people on the street, like, they'll show photos and be like, who's this person? Who's this person? And often people are guessing the creators more often than the A-listers. And it's not just actors or celebrities. I mean, I've seen videos, for example, of somebody asking someone from the younger generation or showing them a picture of Tom from MySpace. And they don't know who Tom from MySpace is.

32:55Such an icon in the digital world. And it makes me feel very old when I realize that the younger generation has never seen a photo of him before. OK, our second theme is marketing and distribution, which we've also heard a lot about today. I mean, what's so interesting is that creators obviously operate in the digital and social media world. But I think they're recognizing, especially since the pandemic, the power of being in person. And we've seen an uptick and roaring back of in-person events. I mean, it's really hard to visualize a million followers or 50 ,000 followers or 10 million subscribers.

33:24Right. But if you have a thousand of your true fans in a room and you see that enthusiasm and excitement, I mean, it really helps both creators, but also kind of the loyalty and bonds between those two parties. And I think creators are really starting to recognize that they're hosting more events with their fans. You know, podcasts are going on live tours. And we've also seen so many studios recognize that power. And yes, they're tapping creators to promote movies and post about it, but they're also inviting them to the premieres as well to get their audience excited. We've seen so many creators on red carpets, but creators are also now bringing their own movies to theaters as well.

34:03Yeah. I mean, we've heard from a few of them today, but another really good example of that is Two Sleepy People, which is a film from Creator Camp. And if you don't know Creator Camp, it's a production firm. They were here earlier. They were here earlier, yes. founded by YouTubers. It actually started as an events business for creators, but they've since expanded. And when we spoke to Max, who we saw earlier, he's the CEO of Creator Camp. And what he said was that the issue that movie theaters have today isn't that they're dead. It's really a content and a marketing problem. And I 100 % agree with that.

34:34I'm a little bit biased because I love going to the movies, but it can be very hard to find something to watch. But the data also supports that. So we saw some research from Pew Research Center recently, which showed that over half of Americans went to the movies between summer 2024 and summer 2025. And it's not just boomers or families with kids. 67 % or about two-thirds of 18 to 29-year-olds in the U.S. went to the movies during that time. And that was ahead of any other generation. And I think that just goes to show that there is a real appetite for the cinema, even among young people who everybody associates with just being on TikTok or YouTube.

35:11But the trouble is that the movies that are available to them either don't match their interests or they're not being marketed well. Yeah. And I think Creator Camp is a really great example of that as well. I mean, they didn't have a big marketing budget. They couldn't spend, you know,$10 million or more on meta ads or stuff like this. So one of the creative things they did is they made this interactive map. So obviously all of the founders have their own social media followings. And basically what their fans could do is sign up for this map. They would give their email address, location, and name.

35:40And if they signed up, their name would show up in the movie credits in the theater. I mean, everybody wants to see their name on the big screen. Exactly. So this encouraged people to actually show up at the theater because they're like, oh, well, I want to, well, one, I want to see this movie, but two, I want to see my name in it. And this worked. I mean, within a week, Creator Camp had roughly 20 ,000 emails, and then they could take that list to movie theaters and say, look, we have this list of 20 ,000 people. XML are in this location. And that helped them get on an initial 30 screens and then more after that.

36:10Yeah, it's a really smart strategy. But I do have to say that even as we're saying all of this, we do not expect a huge influx of creators to suddenly start premiering films and theaters. I mean, there's a lot of reasons for that, including the business models of movie theaters and the film industry at large, but don't have time to get into all of that today. It's a discussion for another time. But another big problem and a reason why we're not going to see this is that there is a pipeline problem for creators right now. So there was a recent report from spotter which showed that only 0.02 percent of all social video made by creators is fit for tv right now and they used several different characteristics to define what that means including length it had to be about 22 minutes long it had to have about 100 ,000 viewers as well as production value among other things but if that's the amount that is fit for tv that means that the percentage of creator content that's fit for the cinema it has to be way lower than that, probably almost zero, although 0.02 % is not that much higher than zero to begin with anyway.

37:12And that makes sense, right? It requires more funding. It requires more resources. It requires more skill or at least a different skill set in order to make full length films that it does to make a 22 minute YouTube video or, you know, a short video for TikTok. And we heard Markiplier talk about that on stage today too. Yeah. And I think even just in general, I mean, short form is still dominating social media. It's still dominating the creator economy. So for creators to even make the leap from 15 second, two minute videos to 22 minutes is, is challenging. So to do that for a film is also hard, not to say, obviously we're starting to see examples of that, but you know, and yes, some YouTubers post hour long videos, but it really is kind of a small percentage, but that's also why studios want to work with creators because they know how to capture attention online.

37:57Yeah. I mean, I think studios recognize that they need to generate buzz. They need to generate attention in order to get audiences excited about the movie, but also to get them into the theaters and actually watching it. And there just really isn't a central place to reach people anymore. I know this is one of the most overused sayings within marketing, but there are, you know, entertainment actually too, which is that monoculture is dead. And in many ways it is. But if you think about a film trailer, I mean, that really is monoculture. It's intended for everybody, but everyone's attention is now so fragmented across different channels.

38:29It's also so personalized. And the reality is that people want to get recommendations from people who they trust and who they like and who they think are similar to them. And for better or for worse right now, you know, that is creators. Yeah. And we're starting to see some success stories. I mean, I think everyone uses Markiplier as the example. I mean, we have to a million times already today. It is like such a prominent one. And if you weren't here for his session, I mean, he self-financed, directed, and starred in his horror sci-fi movie, Iron Lung, which debuted earlier this year. And it grossed$50 million worldwide.

39:03So obviously this is possible. I mean, if you look at his following, he has more than 38 million subscribers on YouTube. So that is a huge audience that he can then excite and generate excitement for and then have them show up in theaters. And he's not the only one. I mean, yesterday we heard about a Swedish creator who had released a movie in theaters called Seed. Also a horror film. Also a horror film, which is interesting, in 2022. But then apparently, and I will have to fact check this, but apparently he tried again and it wasn't quite as successful. So clearly there are still some stops and starts happening here.

39:33Market player success though is also coming at a time of broader recovery for the box office. So movie ticket sales in the US generated about$2 billion in revenue between January and April of this year, which actually made it the strongest start to the year since the pandemic. And that's according to data from box office Mojo that again, I think speaks to the fact that people really do just want to go to the movies. That said, now a lot of the sales growth also comes from increasing ticket prices. So according to some estimates that we found, the average cost of a movie ticket in the US was about$16 last year.

40:06In some places, like New York, where we both lived for a long time, it can cost over$20. And so just think about taking, you know, a family of four to a movie, that's not a small sum. But compare that to 2022, when the average ticket cost about$10.53. And that was up from or up by 15 % from 2019. So you can see that it just really has continued to grow at a very rapid rate. Yeah, okay, we have one more theme. And then we're going to get to productions. And we're going to do it all in two minutes. So the final thing we wanted to touch on is kind of the money side of everything and funding, which is very important.

40:39I mean, I think for indie filmmakers, in general, funding is always a challenge. I think in the US, you have the added dynamic of there isn't, you know, a government fund or support for indie films. So that is where the question, where do creators get funding and resources? I think the biggest challenge is their income is so unpredictable, right? One month, they may get amazing brand deals. And the next month, their income can really slow down. So to commit to, you know, bootstrapping and self-financing a project, you really need to have kind of the scale and career success of someone like a Markiplier or a Mr.

41:09Beast, right? Yeah. And it can also make it really hard to sell it to investors or to other backers because they really want to mitigate some of those risks, you know. And ultimately, I do think that's probably why you see so many creators self-financing their films at this point. But what's really interesting is that we've seen creators get really creative, to kind of use the same word, with how they finance these movies. And I think one of the things that makes them so different from traditional filmmakers is they aren't so concerned with having the money and the art very close together. They've seen it all on social media.

41:42Many of them monetize through brand deals. They They may make brand films, all that kind of stuff. And so now many of them are using that work in order to finance their longer form projects, including movies and theaters. I think they can get more creative with product placement and integrating brands and all that kind of stuff because they do that on their channels all the time. And they know how to do that creatively in that way. OK, should we go to predictions? Let's do it. OK, so where is this all going and what do we expect to happen? I mean, I think the studio portion of this is only going to continue to grow, right?

42:15There's going to be more and more studios and films tapping creators for promotional value. And you're going to start to see more creators dabble in making their own films, but it's going to be slower. Yeah, I mean, I think ultimately, if you think about the relationship between the film industry and the creator economy, I think mostly it's going to be on the marketing side where you see this convergence to your point about studios tapping more creators. I do think we'll ultimately see, you know, more creators be cast in traditional TV and movies and films. But again, I think that's a smaller percentage.

42:48I think part of that also has to do with the fact that not every creator wants to be in a movie or making movies. I mean, we hear this all the time from creators. There are so many different paths to success. Like some want to have a product line, for example. And then the other part, which we talked about before, is that, you know, it's incredibly difficult. It's also very different from the type of content that they're used to creating. And, you know, there is a long runway to get there. Yeah, I think it's very sexy to say, you know, AI is going to take all of our jobs and the creator economy is going to take over and no one's ever going to go to the movies again.

43:23And that's just not the case. I mean, I think more the reality is that all of these are just going to continue to merge, right? Yes, studios are going to do more promotion on social media and with creators. but you know more creators will star in films and produce films for sure and then you know speaking of merging we're also going to see more traditional actors and studios behaving like creators i mean we talked about sandra bullock with louise a little bit joining instagram but one of the things that i've heard repeatedly here over the past couple of days is that studios need to start thinking more like creator economy businesses in that they're building the audience first, really putting the marketing front and center and being really creative about it versus just making a movie and then hoping that somebody buys it.

44:10And I think that's one of the biggest shifts that we're going to see over the next year or so. I think these industries have a lot to learn from each other. They do. Absolutely. Thank you so much for joining us at the summit today. Thank you. Thanks so much for tuning into Scalable and we'll see you here next Thursday.

44:32Thank you.

45:00Thank you.

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