709 - Live at the Austin Film Festival 2025

25:44I'm sad to say I missed a few or was late to a few entrances because I was engrossed in my script backstage. and that was my sign that oh, maybe maybe it's time to leave you know, time is always working on scripts backstage, it's not and when you said like okay, I taught myself how to write TV to a degree how? because I'm sure a lot of people are like well, this is the early aughts and late 90s and there are screenwriting books but TV writing books and books about the TV business, but not as many as there are now. And so I was able to get my hands on a couple of books and I read them, you know.

26:32And I started just dissecting TV. I started watching it. At the time I thought I was going to be a comedy writer because I had written this satiric play that was getting some attention in New York City that I would put up on my days off from Stomp. I was young and had a lot of energy and was glad to say that I used it. So just sort of the fact that you had to come at it from a structural standpoint. I knew dialogue, I thought, from theater and plays. And I knew the feeling of structure, but I didn't know structure, you know, to the extent that you go into a writer's room and you're able to, you know, actually contribute to story advancing.

27:14And I would say that's a process is probably never a team for all of us. Sure, sure. But I mean, I suspect that it wasn't an accident that you were the person the director was relying on on stage to change things. I'm sure there were quite a few people on that stage that the director would be like, never, ever. You do the bang that lid there then. And you had a sense of it already. It's just that you needed then to kind of figure out how do I get this instinct? Yes. from instinct level to craft. It's a perfect term. Absolutely. And I can't say that that process was complete because is it ever, right?

27:55Because otherwise the same person who won an Oscar last year would win this year, right? Because they just repeat it. But that's not, there is an X factor to writing. But in terms of like fundamentally sort of understanding story, that process, so I was able to write to the point where I was able to get into fellowships. I was in New York. and at that time there was no TV writer business in New York. There is somewhat now. And I was applying to the Warner Brothers Fellowship, a writer's program. I was applying to the Disney Fellowship from New York, getting close but no cigar in some cases until finally I got one.

28:32Let's pause there for a second because I suspect a lot of people here have gotten close but no cigar. I'm sure that's a feeling you've all had and it's a bad feeling because you don't know if maybe there will ever be a cigar. Absolutely. What keeps you going in the hopes of a cigar? Wow. That's a deep question. Yeah, man. What keeps you going? You know, I think there are some people who will go for those fellowships because they're really hard to win. It's like 1 ,000, 2 ,000, 2 ,500. It feels like a crapshoot, and on some level, it is. I know plenty of writers who never got those fellowships who are king and queens of the world in TV and film.

29:12but I also have met a lot of people who applied once, didn't get it and was like, ah, you can't win anything it's like, it was one you wrote one script maybe you think it was great maybe it actually was but a person read it after they had a bad tuna sandwich and took it out on your script it happens but if you're a writer, writers write and you can't stop after one script you just cannot even you just can't writers write so you keep putting the coins in the machine and for me I applied once to Warner Brothers I just got married I married really young and I just got married and I applied and I didn't get in but for whatever reason they were having this one day workshop on a Sunday in Burbank where they were like going to talk about what we're really looking for.

30:07You know, I don't know if that particular batch of scripts that year was really bad or whatever, but they were doing this outreach. And I said to my wife, you want to go on a working vacation to LA so I can go to this workshop on this talk in Burbank. And so we did. We literally turned into a working vacation. We flew out here and I went and sat in the audience and took a bunch of notes. And there was hundreds of people there, asked some questions. And I went back and I took that back and I wrote a new script and I got it in the next year. And there are hundreds of people here who are going to be asking questions.

30:42Anthony, one thing that really impressed me about talking with you is that you worked really hard. You get knocked down, you pick yourself up, that's fantastic. But I think you also constructed a life that if your writing career never happened, you still had a lot of very meaningful things you were doing. So can you talk to us about the decisions? I know you got staffed on a show, but then you also got into a PhD program and you're balancing those two things. Exactly. And so now you're a doctor. So talk to us about that decision and what you're thinking as you're going through all this. My bio to some degree on a good day looks like I had this master plan for my life.

31:18And indeed I did think a lot about, my wife and I called it composing your life. It was something that when we first came out here to LA we went to go hear Maya Angelou speak and she spoke that. And I don't know, for some reason we were very impacted by that phrase, compose your life, which means just try to be intentional, try to put some things together. But I am mostly a product of just being hard-headed. I should have quit my PhD program like five times. So you're not a good doctor.

31:59as several as a few professors was like you know you can leave you know i was like no i'm pearly mays boy we don't quit you know um i am i'm i'm a hard-headed south side of chicago by the way a mississippi kid because those things don't normally go together There's only 24 hours in a day. You know, the day that I almost dropped my baby daughter because I was so tired was a moment where I was like, I'm quitting. Like, I'm doing too much. I'm exhausted. This child is three months old. I almost just dropped her on a concrete ground, you know. They bounce. They're fine. Yeah. Yeah. It only takes five seconds.

32:41She did call. She did call.

32:46Although there is a text chain today about these migraines that she's having. Will stress, almost, but did not drop his daughter. Right, I did not drop her. So, what was the question? Well, so I started finding balance. It's getting back to finding balance. So there's a moment where you're like, okay, I'm trying to do too much, but I also, I love that Ian choosing to do this PhD program and finishing this PhD program, you are giving yourself many opportunities. You're giving yourself many opportunities just to see it on many different things. All your eggs are on in this one basket and your identity is this because your identity is as a professor you're teaching but you're also a showrunner and you're a father and a writer who does his own things as well.

33:28You are composing your life like Maya Angelou suggested you do. The only thing I knew to do was to try it. I mean, I'm the son of a mom who had a sixth grade education and so it was very hard for me when USC offered me funding for five years to the total of about$300 ,000, like the little kid from the south side of Chicago, I'm like, I got to try and make this work. Like win one for the ancestors, like seriously. And so when my show unexpectedly got canceled, so the thing that happened was I got staffed, I got the fellowship, I said no to the fellowship because I'm going to go right. My show got canceled.

34:09And I was like, does health insurance come with that? You know, so there was a practical side to it. And so I said, well, I'm going to start because I noticed my first year on the show that I was on as a staff writer, I noticed I was in my office a lot reading. And I was like, I could be reading a book and getting credit for this. And so I didn't know that that's not how all shows operate. And I said, so I went with the, I have been the beneficiary or what results from saying yes to the door that happens to be open at that time. I think that's a wonderful thing. And that's certainly something that I think people who don't come from privilege feel.

34:48The open door is not tempting. The open door is necessary because the doors are usually closed. and what I love about your story is you took away some of the innate fear that okay I finally got I made it I made it I broke in people are always asking us how do you break in the answer is there is no breaking in you get broken and so you think you got broken in and then show's cancelled lol right but you had something else to do you were not you did not go aha I made it I've arrived the end because it is not a smooth path. And I do think that it makes you a better writer when you're not writing scared.

35:33Yes, yes. And just sort of, I mean, and it was a scary time. This happened because, you know, I said earlier today, I was like, I got staffed and I was like, hey, let's have a baby. And we did. Yeah. And then the show was canceled. Yeah. and you can't take her back. But also, you weren't stopping your decision to have a family based on like, well, if I get writing success, then it will start the rest of my life. You started your life and I think that's a crucial lesson to learn as well because I think sometimes we fall into, we write heroes, we write protagonists and we assume they have to go through this arc and do all this stuff and have a plan for how it's all going to be and if you're not exactly on that plan, then it's a disaster.

36:20That's not real life. and so what I like is that you are just like, no, I'm starting now. I'm starting at things that are important to me now. You got married young, you started having a family young and that's awesome. As we wrap up though, I want to talk about teaching because Craig and I, people who listen to the show, sometimes have opinions about university screenwriting programs which can be challenging. As you should. I'm really curious, what do you get out of it? What as a professor do you take from teaching? Because you don't have to, but you do it because you want to. I do it because I want to, it certainly isn't the money.

36:49I am a product of a serious succession of teachers who just kept giving me shots, creating opportunities for me, believing that I was worthy of them. And so it did kind of get into my bones that that is what you do. You educate yourself, you learn, you earn, and then you return, as Denzel Washington once said. and so that is part of me genuinely that's sort of the Pollyanna part of me the other part of me is that is a very practical way for me not so much with money but just in terms of the I'm always engaged in story I'm always I don't walk into rooms desperate because I've built out these other areas of my life without compromising my commitment to what it is that we all get to do it also is practice for me as a showrunner when I'm not running a show.

37:49I have to break down story and teach it to people who are in a very different place than I am. I am a better, better, much better writer since I started teaching. Amen. And listen, if everybody had your resume and your validity and your experience, then I would say everyone rush out to go to school. But there are other ways to get me. We do this. and there are other ways of course to do that but one thing I love about what you're saying is I feel like doing this over the course of all these years made us better because we have to think about it there's no way many of us make our bones writers write a lot by instinct and you can be a great writer who writes by instinct but I think at some point when you're writing and it's your profession like no one's waiting for you to feel the muse coming and that's where craft kicks in to get you from those moments of inspiration to inspiration which lifts something to a new level but in the meantime it's grinding it out it's craft it's thinking about absolutely i mean i've listened to your podcast and i mean i'm trying i'm trying to be i'm ear hustling i'm trying to be cool and not like be seen taking notes but i'm definitely taking notes

39:10everybody up here is you know is worthy of being up here for lots of different things and being a writer is a little bit of a lifetime student thing like even when you do it well and you've had these accolades hopefully you're always at the end of the day staring at that blank page going fade in oh shit yep Anthony thank you very much for joining us here thank you so much Great. Now it is time for one of our favorite but also potentially terrifying segments where we invite the audience up to ask some questions of us and our panelists. Hello. What is your name and what is your question? My name is Jason.

39:48You can all answer this. What is the first thing you do when you feel stuck in a script? What is the first thing we do when we get stuck in a script? Pamela, what's the first thing you do when you get stuck in a script? Well, I complain. I complain about it. I complain about it. I walk around the house with this face. Everyone thinks I'm mad at them. I'm like, I'm thinking. I have my thinking face. And then you try to figure out why you're so irritated because you think, I know how to do this. Why don't I know how to do this right now? And what that is is why you're stuck. That's the problem you're solving.

40:24So then you go talk to someone else about your problem, and then they tell you their problem, and then you help them with their problem, and then they help you with your problem. I mean, yeah, getting an outside perspective, You know, when we're writing, we're making a thousand different decisions that we hope will somehow add up to something that is compelling and believable. So sometimes the outside perspective. If I can't get that, I will sometimes step back and simply ask myself, what is the logical thing that would happen here? And try to, because I can get overly whatever in my head. And so break it, like what is the simple thing?

40:59Not what is the interesting thing. That comes after. What's the logical thing that this character would do or feel or say in this moment to at least make the dots connect? And then I can go back and try and find a way to make it. I sometimes will say when I'm leaving a room, like, let's do the boring expected version, get it up on the board. This will in no way be what's in the script. But let's at least make it make sense. And then we can go back and make it interesting. That's great. Both of you. Great advice. I sometimes feel myself trying to solve the problem. Then I stop myself because you're not going to solve it well if you're trying to solve it because you're thinking about it like a problem.

41:40So then I just go, okay, I'm going to forget about the problem. Let me just think about my characters. Let me just put them in different scenes. Let me play around in my head. Let me take a long shower. Let me think about this. And let me also, and I've gotten much better about this, look at this as good news. It's actually good news. We tend to think that if we're stuck, we're dying, we're not. It just means we don't see it yet. you will. And you will because you know you don't have it. That's how you know you will see it because you'll know it when you know it. It's coming. You just gotta let it come.

42:08It's the puzzle lover in you. Although I try to remind myself this is just a puzzle I haven't solved and if this was a crossword puzzle I wouldn't be this mad. Exactly. For me, I make a deck of cards called Rider Emergency Pack which is sort of for this purpose. So it's a thing that like the little things I do when I sort of get jammed up in a thing. So you can find it in stores or Amazon or wherever. But the philosophy behind it is sometimes you just really need to change your focus. And so a card will be magnified. What if you were to zoom in super, super tight on this thing or on this character or zoom all the way out?

42:39What if you were to change genres? Imagine this is a spy thriller rather than this comedy that you're writing. What would be the solution to that kind of movie? And just getting yourself off this track that is jammed into this place and realizing there's a whole range of possibilities I'm just not considering, that tends to help. The other thing which is true for all of this is that when you have hit a problem, rarely is the problem right where you're at. The problem was a while back and you probably just need to lay some different tracks to get around this thing that's in front of you. You may be imagining a perfect solution to this problem that really does not exist.

43:14Really it's to create a different situation that doesn't end up in this place. Great question, thank you so much. Thank you. That was honestly a paradigm example of an actual question. It was a master class in asking a question. So no pressure now. What's your name and what's your question? Hi, I'm Imte. As an actor by training, I was taught that acting rests on a three-legged stool of imagination, relaxation, and concentration. Wow, great. So I was wondering if there is a similar kind of philosophy when it comes to writing. If so, what's the hardest leg for each of you and how have you worked to develop that?

43:51So remind us of the three things that you were taught. So imagination. imagination, relaxation, concentration well those are really great principles I haven't articulated something like that of what those things are but those are all crucial things as we're sort of putting ourselves in a place and sort of watching what happens which to me is what writing largely is to capture the true moment I get that relaxation part is so important because I was like writers have an 18 leg stool and then we were like I think I have too many legs but that key I think is the relaxation to let the moment come and to breathe with your script and to just be like okay honesty is somewhere in there and are you being honest to the moment are you being honest to these characters are you trying to force a thing that's not supposed to be there and so relaxation is probably part of that but really is the scene true is the moment true or is it fake does it feel fake within the context of this script that's a crucial thing for me too because sometimes we're talking about problem solutions, there's a fake solution, there's a thing which is just not honest to the thing, and you're always going to hate it because you know you lied to get there.

45:03Yeah, I wish I had good stool legs for you. I think ultimately there is, in acting, those are three great things to consider. None of them will help you if you're not a good actor, and all of them will help you if you're a good actor. there is something that is instinctive to artists and craftspeople and so sometimes the answer is to say okay, I'm not good at everything as a writer what am I good at? what is that telling me right now? let me listen to that because that's what I'm good at follow that the rest is absolute mystery to me I gotta be honest I don't know where I go I don't know how I do it when I read things that I've written in the past I'm terrified because I don't know who wrote that and I don't know how to do it again.

45:51Yep, don't remember it. I was gone. I'll read something like, oh, that sounds like me, but I have no recollections. I don't know who these characters are. Yeah, and that's terrifying, actually. So there you go. It's like an upside-down stool with one leg. Think of it that way. That's what it's like. That's writing. That's crazy. Yeah, yeah. Thank you so much for your question. Yeah. Good question. Hello. What's your name and what's your question? My name is Joe. podcasting and screenwriting are clearly two different mediums what is something you have learned about yourself either as a podcast host or a guest that is something you would not have learned during the creative process oh and that kind of ties into what we were saying earlier about you know educating is education well I know that I have had to think a little bit more clearly about some of the things that I do believe philosophically so it's different than you know what is an inspiration in a moment when you sit back and you go, okay, there's artsy-fartsy Craig, but then there's also outline Craig, who's got a job to do and understands it needs to fit within a certain amount of time.

46:55It needs to achieve certain things plot-wise. There has to be surprises and all these nuts and bolts things. I think doing this and being forced to talk about those things helps me codify and make some of those a little bit clearer in my own head. It's like forced organization. And I would say, I'm always ribbed at being like, segue man I'm always like moving on to the next thing but what that really is is recognition of being very present in the moment but also always knowing where you're headed and where you need to get to next and that's also writing that's also what a scene needs to do is like you need to set a sense like we are fully in this moment and yet we're going to the next thing and so just that way a scene can just die and just like people are just sitting there and nothing's happening you don't feel any momentum you gotta keep the momentum there while still letting it be present for the characters who are in that scene Yeah, that makes sense.

47:46Great question. Thank you so much. Thank you.

47:51Hi there. Big fan. Sorry, I'll be a little bit farther. My name is Silas. You guys did a podcast episode relatively recently. I don't know how well in advance you record these, about short films. I'm a sci-fi writer. I'm a sci-fi fantasy writer, genre writer. And I sometimes have a really hard time balancing the line between being super obnoxious and explaining everything way too heavily. You know, the whole Star Wars scroll thing, whatever. and people asking me, why are they doing that? What is happening? And that's a huge problem to have in short films where everything is super compact, needs to be super tight.

48:24My question is, how do you balance that line between exposition and mystery? Sure. I'll turn that over to you guys because we all deal with this one. Everybody needs to know things. Also, you don't want them to know things. You want to spend a lot of time spending the things. What are some of the things, I think about an animation again, a million dollars a page. what are some of the tricks you use? Yeah, well, you know, the story in Frozen is there were all these backstories and all these minutes they had to get rid of and it changed into the line, was she born with it or was it a curse? You know, so I think, and that's an interesting question.

48:59It gets answered and now we know everything about why we're here. So trying to find a way to take all of that that you think they need to know, you think they need to know it, they don't. Like, they don't think that. they want to know what do I care about I don't care about the backstory until I know why they're not in love why do they hate each other then I can start to learn all the worlds and what your currency is and why it's a patriarchy or whatever it is that the sci-fi world wants you to know that stuff is interesting for you to know what your tone is but we don't need to know all of it to care about your characters Salas, thank you so much thank you Salas Thank you.

49:41Hello. Hello. Hello. My name is Brenna Kwan. My question is, what is your opinion on, let's say, sizzle reels or proof of concepts from, let's say, emerging filmmakers that's created out of AI? Do you consider that as a red flag or like? Hey, it's a good question. It's a good question. Girl. I think everybody in here is going to be my answer. But let's see what you say. So let's talk about sizzle reels in general. So sizzle reels, we're cutting together stuff from other movies that give a sense of what this thing feels like. For directors who are putting together a project, sometimes it's a really helpful way of showing what it is that you're trying to do and sort of do this thing.

50:22Where I get a little bit frustrated is when you have to do a sizzle reel for just a script that you're not trying to direct, just to get someone to read the script. That's really annoying. I really wish we could stop doing that because I think it's a waste of time because you're here to be a writer, not to be a sizzle reel maker. and so whether you're cutting it out of other films or using AI or whatever to do it I just don't think it's a good practice for us to be in so many strong opinions on use of AI and what things feel like okay well it's a person using that thing to do the job they would otherwise be doing to do I don't have problems if a visual effects artist is using some new tool that uses some of the stuff in there I just don't want it to replace their job and I do feel like using a scissor reel to do that kind of stuff it's just putting more of that slop out there in the world and I'm really frustrated about it.

51:08I think it's an indication maybe of lack of commitment or even, dare I say, laziness. Because remember, Sizzle Reel is already taking what other people have done and putting it together to go, it's kind of like what these people have worked really hard to do, which is already sort of a cheat code, which is fine. But then to say, and also I just asked the slop machine to barf out somebody with seven fingers to help me. It's indicative to me that maybe the heart isn't in it. I guess here's my concern. I see your thing and I feel like, this was done with AI, and then I'm going to read your script and it's like, did she really write it?

51:47I don't think it reflects well on you. Where does it stop? That's why I'm going to say no. I'm going to say no. What do you guys think? Big pro? Oh, Pam Ribbon loves AI? Is that the headline here? No. I was trying to get controversial. people listening. I am not nodding or excited. No, AI makes me feel scared. When I watch it, I get uncomfortable. You know, what is it called, Sora? My husband will be like, look at this. And I'm like, that's a cyborg. We must run. We must run away from it. And so I would worry that when you think this is going to explain how it feels, you have to worry about how it feels.

52:26Like when it's not real. You might not feel the way you want it to feel. And why are you, is it budgetary? What is the reason behind why one would do this? So I'm trying to recreate my pilot into a webcomic or a webtoon and to perhaps advertise for it. I was playing around with Sora, so that's where the question stemmed from. I can understand what the instinct is behind that, but I would say look for what webtoons are doing. The things you actually like that are webtoons that you enjoy. and also I'd say don't turn your script into a webtoon just because that's a thing you can do unless you really love that as a medium.

53:04Because I feel like so often you say like, oh I couldn't sell it as a movie but we're going to do it as a dramatic podcast. It's like, well do you actually love dramatic podcasts or are you just spitting your wheels because you want to do something? I hope that the robots don't listen to this later and come after us. There's that whole thing where you will be the one that they're like, well you live. Right. Thank you so much for your question. Thanks for coming out tonight. All right, let's do two more questions. So these next two, and then we'll be done for tonight. Two more. Hey, guys, I'm Jordan.

53:35My question's a little specific, but maybe we can make it a little more universal. But say you've got a great adult animated pilot that you're taking out, and you've gotten a little bit of feedback. You're leaning towards serialized, but everybody's telling you, well, we want episodic. Do you go and do you rejig it? And you could go either way with it, really, but you're leaning towards serialized. Do you go and adjust for the market, or did you write the thing that you want to write and just wait for it to be the right time for it? I think you know your answer, but let me make sure that the rest of the crowd understands this.

54:03So you have an opportunity, people like the thing you've written, you could make it serialized where you're supposed to watch all the episodes in order, or episodic where you can watch them in any order whatsoever. You're going to have a sense of what is more fun and interesting for you to write, do that. But if the buyer says, no, we really want it this other way and you had a chance to do it, do that. you have to both be steadfast and adaptable in this business you have to be true to what's important to you but also flexible to actually get things done and get things made we both know filmmakers who just they made a great film and they were so steadfast I'm not going to compromise a damn thing for my second film they're not making films anymore there is no second film and I believe that there will be another thing so I never like to think that whatever I'm working on now is it a little bit like don't put all your eggs in the wrong basket.

54:53Yeah, that's a really great thing to remember. I think the business will go on without any one individual. And that's really horrible to say. Even if Ryan Murphy were no longer making all his things, we would still have a television business. Economically, we would take a hit. We would take a hit, but yes. And so, you know, sometimes people have to remember that. You know, what can you do that feels like is not absolute betrayal to the center of what it is you're writing that you can collaborate on, you know? And also, why not try? Because then if it doesn't work, you can say, this is why I really wanted it this other way.

55:38And I can see why you asked me to do this, because the Simpsons or whatever, like, they're all, you know, they're all episodic. But BoJack worked for a reason. so once you try the way that they think they want or they need maybe they need it, that's the mandate so try for the job that you can get always Good luck Tim, we'll see you at a future AFF as it is Alright, bring us home Who are you and what is your question? My name is Emmett Farnsworth-Guzman Emmett Farnsworth-Guzman is a fantastic name Thank you, my parents gave it to me Did you invent television? Actually, that's my great-great-uncle.

56:16Is it really? It's Philo T. Farnsworth. That's actually your great-great-uncle? That's amazing. Yeah. What is happening? This man's great-uncle invented television. Yeah. Philo T. Farnsworth. Really? Philo T. Farnsworth. Why is he here? I know. Are you hiring? I feel seen right now. You feel seen. That's when we come back to relationships. Your love language is validations, feeling seen, feeling heard. Yeah. We're giving it to you right now. Well, I wasn't expecting that. Yeah. So, yeah, I wasn't expecting that.

56:50Really? You're shooketh. They really did. They really did. So the thing is, is I've listened to an inordinate amount of you guys over the past year, starting from the beginning. Incredible. You have very terse words for people selling books. So why do you decide to write this? Thank God someone finally asked a question. Yes, yes, yes. night. I can't believe none of these first words. It was an open goal. None of you took the shot. It's a great question. John, can you explain why we have a book? I would say our listenership kept saying like, hey, you should make a book or you should put a book of your transcripts out there.

57:30And so we literally did the math like, well, what if we just did a book of our transcripts? It was impossible. It was bigger than this entire room to do our transcripts. And so it was like, oh, well, what if we could do sort of a best of, like sort of the synthesized version? Because the thing that happens to me and Craig constantly is like, hey, so I have a question about blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's like, okay, we talked about this on episode, I don't know, like 346. And so you can send someone to say, oh, go back and listen to episode 346. But if I could just give you a book, this is what we've talked about.

58:00And so Natalie and Luke, who have the galley's here, you can track them down and look over their shoulders and see what's in the book. But the book is very specifically sort of synthesized versions of what things we talked about over the course of the podcast. and it's not like how to write a screenplay. There's like one chapter. Called How to Write a Screenplay. How to Write a Screenplay. Literally. Which is mostly about finding Nemo, really. But people love it. But the book consists of distilled versions of all the things we've talked about. So like stuff about relationships and stuff like that.

58:33But it's not like here are the plot points and here's all the Sid Field stuff. It's not that kind of book. It's a book about screenwriting and not a like how to write a screenplay. I'll give you, this is why I was very, I mean, John and his team, of course, did all the work. You guys know I suck. But what I think is great about it is, and I'm going to, I don't mind sounding like a jerk. We know what we're doing. This is our jobs. This is our careers, our lives. We have spent decades working in this business as professional writers. And we are still doing it to this day. You know, sometimes we have hits, sometimes we have losses, but we are still here.

59:08after breaking into the business in the mid-90s. We're still here. We must know something. And that is actually a perspective that generally doesn't exist in the 4 ,000 other books. They're written by people that don't. And I'll also say that the stuff we don't know, every other chapter is interviewed with one of our guests who's come on the show. So it is Christopher Nolan or Greta's coming in. We're talking to everybody, Aline and everybody else, about their experiences that are very specific and that are not our experiences. They're not just us. Yeah, because we don't have the hubris to say we actually know everything.

59:45We know a lot, but we actually have guests who know a ton of stuff that we don't know, which has been great, too. So it's honestly so people don't... But I'm glad you asked that. Yeah, I'm glad you asked that. Thank you for the question. And also, this is a time, a show of hands, who has pre-ordered the script notes book? Oh, my God. I had to be informed, you know? Thank you. Thank you for that so much. Thank you for the softball there. Thank you very much, Mr. Barnesworth. It's like he was sent by the publishing company. Oh, my God. That is our show for this week. So if you want to hear this as a podcast, you can subscribe to Script Notes, and you'll get this in the feed on Tuesday.

1:00:21Script Notes is produced by Drew Marquardt, who's over there. He's a superstar hero.

1:00:30This show will be edited by Matthew Czilelli. God bless you, Matthew Czilelli, for making us sound better and smarter than we are. Our intro and outro, he also wrote all our music. He's so fantastic. Thank yous to Emily Locke and everyone at the Austin Film Festival. Who here is the Script Notes premium subscriber? Oh, my God. Thank you so, so much. You guys don't realize it, but you keep the lights on at Script Notes. You pay for all the stuff. Craig, where can they sign up to become a premium subscriber? Well, you can sign up to become one at ScriptNotes.net, where you can get all the back episodes and bonus segments like the one we did not do tonight.

1:01:03Yeah, so the Q &A will be the bonus segment. when you listen to it. So no one else has to hear those great questions there at the end. This was our 11th live show. Not a bad one. Not a bad one. Not a bad one. Really, really good. I'm loving it. You're a great crowd. Thank you. Thank you so much. Have a great night. What a great time. Thank you guys for coming out.

1:01:36Thank you.