Celia Muñoz: Founder of La Coqueta

0:05Hi, everyone. I'm Hilary Kerr, the co-founder and chief content officer of Who What Where, and this is Second Life, a podcast spotlighting women who have truly inspiring careers. We're talking about their work journeys, what they've learned from the process of setting aside their doubts or fears, and what happens when they embark on their second life. Today on the show, I'm speaking with Celia Munoz, the founder of La Coqueta, a children's wear brand that infuses traditional Spanish craftsmanship and culture into beautiful clothes for little ones. Celia's career path didn't start in fashion. She actually majored in psychology.

0:45While she didn't end up going into the field, she did apply a lot of what she learned about people to a number of different jobs post-grad, from working retail for luxury brands like LVMH to recruiting for biotech and pharmaceutical companies. When Celia had her first child, she stopped working and actually went back to school to study psychology again to get her master's in mental health. But Celia's real passion was her side project. For years, she split her time between her studies and building her brand from scratch before officially launching it in 2013. It was a huge hit, so much so that Prince Louis of the Royal Family, son of Prince William and Princess Catherine, has been spotted wearing the brand.

1:30Over the last 12 plus years, La Coqueta has grown a global community and this year, they expanded their presence in the U.S. with the opening of their new Charleston and Palm Beach stores. I can't wait for you to hear about her journey. Now on Second Life, it's Celia Munoz. Shall we begin? Yes. So we like to start this podcast at the beginning. So what did you study in school? And much more importantly, what did you think you were going to be when you grew up?

2:06Celia Muñoz:I mean, I always wanted to be a war reporter. What? Or a forensic doctor. And my father wasn't particularly thrilled about that. So, you know, a few dreams shattered in there. I studied psychology. My father was a clinical psychologist. I was very influenced by what he did. And I felt in a way that I may be going to a war zone and give people emotional support. That was part of the dream. But I've always had very adrenaline-driven ambitions. I was a Spanish champion of taekwondo when I was 16. So I really thrive in those type of environments. You like stress. Okay. Positive stress. I like action.

2:52Celia Muñoz:Risks? Definitely. You have the perfect constitution for being an entrepreneur then. So that makes a lot of sense. So you studied psychology in school. And despite the fact that you did not go into psychology, I would still imagine that it would have great application to a number of other areas. So I'm wondering if you can tell us some of the things that you learned in your studies that might have application to what you do today or throughout the rest of your career. Obviously, being, you know, very tempted by the world of criminology or, you know, forensics, I thought that I may be able to apply my studies to that.

3:32Celia Muñoz:I mean, in the end, it didn't work out and I did something completely different. But for example, in retail, it's very useful to be able to understand customer behavior, customer choices, you know, when it comes to shopping or deciding to go for one thing or another. So I feel in every part of my life, I apply psychology. As a mother of five teenagers at the moment, you need a huge degree of understanding. Yes, I would imagine a psychology degree comes in extremely handy in your family. Absolutely. Well, you said that adrenaline is your thing. Yes, no, definitely. Clearly, you feel comfortable with it.

4:19Okay, so I read that you were born to a French mother and a Spanish father and grew up in Spain, but that after graduating, you moved to London where you were planning to stay for one year to improve your English, correct? Yes. What was that time like? What was that transition like? Were you looking for jobs? What was the plan in your mind when you decided to move?

4:41Celia Muñoz:So I have always been very adventurous and I always loved London. When I finished my studies, I decided to go to London originally for a year. And in a way, it was a huge change. I mean, very, very thrilling because it was obviously very different. I come from the South of Spain. And then, you know, I moved to London where essentially the biggest thing for me was the amount of choice that I had. And obviously, when you come from a traditional setup, the moment I got to London, at the beginning, it can be quite overwhelming. I mean, it was very motivating, but I would say someone in my situation at the very beginning, it was something that I had to work a lot on because I didn't know what to do.

5:28Celia Muñoz:I didn't have mentors. You know, I didn't have a network. So I really started from scratch. The first thing that you do is to look for a job. I started working in psychology, but it didn't pay the bills. And I decided it would be a very good idea to work in retail. and one of my first jobs was working for LVMH. So Loewe at the time was a completely unknown brand, like literally nobody knew it. And they opened their first store and I was in charge of representing the brand. And through that, I decided that I would start meeting customers rather than, you know, doing import, export, you know, because I spoke French and Spanish.

6:15Celia Muñoz:And I went to work in Harrods, which at the time, you know, for Spanish people, Harrods meant glamour. That was my experience with my first job. So in addition to obviously brushing up on English, I can't believe you speak three languages. That's so chic. What were the things that you were learning in this sort of initial period of work? What I learned about was resilience. I knew I had it in me because of, I guess, my dedication to taekwondo. You know, I trained very, very hard to win that championship. But, you know, in real life, it taught me about really hard work. I did learn a lot about meritocracy because in Spain, you've got your contacts, you've got your network.

7:01Celia Muñoz:And I would say it's a very different culture when it comes to work. And what I like about working within an Anglo-Saxon society is essentially can be very meritocratic. So no matter where you're from, hard work and talent is really always going to be applauded. And that's very motivating when you're very ambitious, you're very curious, you're starting from scratch. It's amazing to be able to have that type of landscape to operate in. So I read that you spent a couple of years in fashion and retail, but then you pivoted into the world of recruiting. Yes. Walk me through how that happened, because that feels like a pretty big shift.

7:47Celia Muñoz:It was in a way, and it wasn't, because both jobs are sales. It was just a very different type of sales. I became a very good salesperson at Harrods, but obviously financially, it was a little bit of a struggle to work in retail. I could have continued the route through LVMH, but I had a friend who presented me with an opportunity to work in recruitment. I didn't know what I was getting into because imagine a room filled with men. you know it was a very British white boy environment and then me you know it was very unusual although it was a very harsh environment it wasn't particularly kind or forgiving I think it really taught me about developing a very personal style despite the fact that it was quite unusual being quite recognizable and I'm working even harder because those were very very long hours.

8:51Celia Muñoz:But then I was rewarded financially for it, which for me at the time was very important. You spent most of your time recruiting for big pharma and biotech companies, which are very specialized, highly technical fields. And on top of that, you're doing this in a third language. So I'm curious about what part of that job, aside from the financial piece of it, what did you enjoy about it and what was most challenging? So from recruitment, essentially, I moved into executive search. And that was very interesting. I mean, I learned about the power of networking. You work quite a lot after your office hours in a way, because you need to meet all of those people.

9:38Celia Muñoz:And for some reason, when they recruited me, they just thought that psychology and healthcare had a lot to do with each other. And what I really enjoyed was to learn about something new. So I didn't know anything about cardiology or stenting. And then you end up meeting the four top people in the world who are interested in the top job at GSK, for example. I don't know. I thought that was very interesting to learn something new. And I guess, again, it reinforced that side of being very recognizable. You know, I was very aware of my accent. Executive Search, particularly at the time, wasn't particularly international.

10:22Celia Muñoz:So it was very British establishment. And there weren't that many people coming from abroad. And I guess what made me different then became a real strength that was very positive. Well, you would certainly stand out in a sea of British men. For sure. It's maybe the red lipstick. I love it, though. I mean, I think that ultimately you used it as a point of differentiation, and that's great. OK, so you mentioned earlier that you have five teenagers. Yes. Walk me through that portion of your life and how it dovetails with your career. I met my husband and we were both late 20s. I was working in executive search and he worked for a company that was connected to mine, but we met totally by accident.

11:12Celia Muñoz:And it all went very quickly. So we got married within a couple of years and I became pregnant very quickly. So I worked until the end of the pregnancy, but I developed quite a few complications. And then I stopped working and I had my baby. And you know, when you work really long hours, you fantasize about that week when you're going to be literally laying down on your sofa. And at the time it was watching America's Next Top Model. Yes. Well, that only lasted five days, I'm afraid. I had my baby. And then it was really part of the plan for my husband and I to have more children. and we were very, very fortunate because we had literally five children within four and a half years.

12:04Celia Muñoz:So every 12 or 13 months I was pregnant. Oh my goodness. And I'm very routine focused. And I think, you know, my background in taekwondo and just discipline and having a Korean master really taught me about my routines and resilience and just having a very predictable life. which you would need with five children under five. Absolutely. And it really deepened, I guess, my understanding of psychology, mainly because, you know, when you have five children, there's no book that prepares you for that. With my baby number two, I decided to go back to uni part-time and doing a master's in mental health at King's College.

12:51Celia Muñoz:Just because you weren't busy enough with two babies, pregnant with a third and I'm just going to go back to school part-time. Okay. Why did you make that choice? Yeah, I just felt I needed a little bit of that intellectual engagement, doing things outside home. I knew I couldn't really hold a job, but I felt that that was really fulfilling. And eventually I was really planning. I always knew I would work after having my children. And I thought it was in a way, a very good way to prepare the grounds for something else, you know, and to just keep active in other ways, not just physically and engaging with my children, but just more intellectually.

13:39Celia Muñoz:I love that. Did you have a plan for using your master's degree or was it truly more about the intellectual exercise? So I think eventually I wanted to go back into psychology because in Spain, what you study will determine what you do for the rest of your life. So I still have that little chip, you know, it's never too late. I thoroughly enjoyed studying at King's because the Institute of psychiatry is the epicenter of mental health in Europe. So I got amazing exposure. And yes, I guess I wanted to do something in the field, but it didn't work out like that, as we know now. Instead, you started working on a side project that would become your brand.

14:29So let's rewind. Like, how did La Coqueta become an idea? Where did it come from? Tell me about the very earliest days.

14:37Celia Muñoz:So the very, very early days, and again, it wasn't planned. I always had a love for fashion, but more to dress myself. So really it was more about vanity. I had a very superficial understanding of fashion. And I guess when you're at home as a mom, surrounded by toddlers, with my upbringing, you know, Spanish upbringing, coqueta means well-groomed. So in Spain, We do like to dress up our children in a way. And I guess I dressed them in the only way I knew, which was, you know, in the way I was brought up. And I started buying clothes in Spain. And I have a French mother. So it was a very continental European feel.

15:23Celia Muñoz:And in my neighborhood, people were very appreciative of the way my children were dressed. And at the time, I was pregnant all the time. So wearing pretty boring clothes. And yeah, I found it very, I mean, it's going to sound very cliche and very dull. But the reality is that for me, dressing up my children became a way of connecting with other mothers, you know, starting a conversation about something else. And at some point I just thought, well, what about if I start buying clothes in Spain from other brands. And I start selling them at my local church, local community center. This is how it all started a little bit, but it was very much a hobby.

16:10Celia Muñoz:And one weekend, I remember organizing like a mini sale at home and I sold, you know, about 6 ,000 pounds worth of clothes, including hoisery, which was very bizarre. And then I thought, okay, there's maybe something to it. And that is when I started thinking about maybe starting a business. And I remember the hardest call I ever had to make was to call my parents and to tell them that I was opening a shop. They went, sorry, a shop with a counter and a till. And I said, yes. My mother was saying, oh, well, don't you think it's better to do something a bit more altruistic like you were doing in psychology?

16:53Celia Muñoz:And I was like, well, I am, you know, working on people feeling good, looking good, you know, their children looking good. And I feel very fulfilled by it. So I read that you spent a couple of years doing market research before officially launching. What exactly did that look like? What were your findings? It was very basic. My only experience in retail was really at Harrods. And it was a very specific type of retail because it was obviously luxury working for Loewe. And what I thought would be good was to just really understand my market. And as I was having children and I was pregnant, you're going to laugh about this, but I had this massive questionnaire with lots of questions.

17:43Celia Muñoz:I asked quite a few friends. My husband was very helpful with that because he has a business background. And he really helped me to write the business plan. You know, I had no idea what a business plan was, and how helpful it would be. But I was always very good at connecting with people, speaking with people, gathering information. And essentially, I just took my whole neighborhood as my data, I took it as a job. So literally, I would feed my babies, you know, I had this double buggy and nobody says no to a pregnant lady with lots of children and that is how I mean I use it and people were incredibly generous with the type of information so I was interested about the type of clothes that people buy what do they wear I wanted to learn about the special occasion market as well because obviously you know Spanish clothes can be quite sophisticated and preppy you Do English people wear that?

18:48Celia Muñoz:I wasn't sure. And they weren't. But I definitely noticed that there was a gap in the market nearly 14 years ago when we started. There were very few people doing it. And I definitely felt that North London was my oyster. And I was going to dominate that with children's fashion. It's crazy, but it's all in your head. It's all about really thinking you can do it. And you just start. And then I turned up to be very good at it. I'll say. I personally am a huge fan of the brand. Long before we met today, I have been buying pieces for my children. My daughter almost exclusively wears your Velvet Mary Janes.

19:30She owns no other socks besides yours. She has a pink wool coat with velvet collar and pocket that she thinks is the greatest thing ever. My son wears your sweaters. every single school picture day. Like I cannot tell you, we own so many pieces. They are my favorite. These pieces are beautiful and incredibly well-made and heirloom quality and can be handed down. Well, it's lovely to hear that. Thank you. It's from the bottom of my heart.

20:00Celia Muñoz:You can check my sales history. So what was your initial vision for La Coqueta? What did you want to bring to the market specifically? Was it girls and boys? Was it a certain age? Like what was that initial offering that you wanted to create? So for me, obviously having an amazing demographic at home, you know, with my five toddlers, the first thing I thought of was of dressing my children on my own terms. So not having to go for other brands and actually trying to mimic that because that's what people were complimenting me about, the fact that my children were very well-dressed. What I felt as a concept, it was very important to me to create a brand that offered a whole look so that when mothers would come into my shop, they would literally come in, buy 10 dresses, 10 different pairs of socks, five different pieces of knitwear and mix and match.

21:06Celia Muñoz:So there's a formula at the very beginning, which I created mainly based on my own experience. And it turned out to be very good for basket size, you know, creating different looks. So not having always the same type of dress, but just when a mother comes into my shop, she feels that she's able to dress her child, boy or girl, for different occasions and actually is able to find everything there. So that was part of the vision. I mean, as a very creative person, which I didn't know I had it in me at the time, the first thing that you think about, at least in my own experience, when you're clueless, is your logo and what your bags are going to be.

21:49Celia Muñoz:Branding. And, you know, if you are to manifest, you think of your shop and literally having a huge queue of people. The reality turned out to be very, very different. It took me a really long time to master the sales routine in the shop to learn about retail. And I learned the hard way because I did completely the wrong way around. Instead of starting wholesale, no, you know, I decided to go all in. I happened to speak very loudly. And I had a hairdresser in the high street who wanted to retire. And she overheard the conversation because I was speaking to everyone. And that's how I got my first shop because nobody believed me.

22:34Celia Muñoz:I mean, they just looked at me with five children, you know, wanting to open a shop. It was the perfect recipe for disaster. But again, it's about making it your own. And I really love what you did because the vision was complex, but direct. You wanted to incorporate Spanish craftsmanship and heritage in the designs. You wanted to use high quality materials and make each piece feel like luxury, but at a more affordable price, which is a lot of boxes to check. So talk to me about your strategy for designing some of the initial pieces and how you found your Spanish suppliers. So I feel that my background in recruitment and executive search came very handy then because you do a lot of cold calling.

23:22Celia Muñoz:and I did extensive research. I mean, there was something that for me was unnegotiable, which was really bringing a product that was very high quality. And that is hard actually to find that because obviously people are very protective when it comes to a fantastic product and you have to look for it. And when you have no clue, you start from scratch and you're at the mercy of what you find and really where your conversations lead you. So all of that groundwork, I actually did it whilst having my children just when I finished my master's. So probably I had three children then. And whilst I was doing my market research, I did that cold calling.

24:07Celia Muñoz:And again, I was very disciplined. So for me, that type of research was a job. I woke up in the morning, had my routine, start cold calling, you know, my to-do list. At the end of the day, I had achieved so much because I took the making of my business like a full-time job and like a pretty serious one. So it was no hobby in a way. So to find my suppliers, I obviously, you know, did lots of interviews, spoke with lots of people and I went to meet them. And quite a lot of them come from pretty remote parts of Spain. And I went to see them. I had a little bit of a credibility issue at the time because I was pregnant with my fifth child.

24:53Celia Muñoz:No retail experience, no clue about business in a way. And I'm not going to lie, I did bring my husband in the first time, who is a very tall Dutch, very serious man. And I used it. Yes. So we started working together and we had agreed on financials and the terms because I needed to start very little. So I couldn't really start as a full blown designer. I mean, I had no clue on how to do that. So we agreed that 50 percent of the collection I was going to buy from them and I was going to label it with my brand. And then the other 50 percent was going to be, you know, my creations. it worked out really well because what sold was what I created, what I designed.

25:45Celia Muñoz:So they taught me everything. I started drawing things, gathering information. It just feels that when you're a designer and in my line of business, that design sensibility is very important. But that business mindset is 80 % of the job. And whatever you can't do, You just need to make sure that you need to find someone who can teach you. And if you're smart, you learn and you learn fast. So they taught me everything. I spent days with them in order to create collections. And they picked it up very quickly because obviously I had a passion and I later discovered that that is my talent. That is my gift.

26:27So talk to me about the launch. As you hinted at earlier, you didn't go wholesale. sale. You didn't go online only direct to consumer. You decided to launch a brick and mortar store and then launch the online business after. How did you decide on that rollout? How many pieces are in that initial collection? What were you doing?

26:53Celia Muñoz:Well, I'd love to tell you that there was an incredible strategy behind it, but I'm sorry to disappoint there wasn't. It was a little bit based on gut feeling, being a customer myself of other brands, doing extensive research on what other brands are doing and myself as a consumer of women's wear. And it is not difficult. You just need to make sure that you have a very big eye for detail, that you are prepared to learn and learn quickly as you go. So the concept of the store, I mean, first at the time, the reason I didn't start wholesale is because I didn't even know what that was. So I would have probably started like that before, but I just had no clue.

27:42Celia Muñoz:I am a big dreamer. And my dream was to have a shop, to have a little playroom at the back, have my five children playing with a little kitchenette and being there for my customers and learning from them, which was what I really loved. I mean, obviously the day-to-day was very different. And I made sure that I also learned about the best in retail in order to learn how to tidy up a stock room. I am a very organized person, but again, what does that process look like? And I spent the first two years working in my shop. There were things that were quite hard. I'm dyslexic. So operating a till when you have dyslexia, it's not particularly easy.

28:28Celia Muñoz:But you know, you learn as you go. And part of the dream was that creating a community around my shop, creating something very niche that people love and value. And I think it's a very heartwarming feeling. And then there is another side, which for me was very important, which was about popularizing Spanish clothing, Spanish fashion, Spanish craftsmanship. We work with very small producers, family-run businesses who focus on dyeing crafts like, you know, hand smoking. And you've got generations within the same workshop working on the same thing for 10 hours a day. and they have been doing the same thing for nearly 100 years.

29:15Celia Muñoz:And I think there is a lot of beauty to it. And my customers really appreciate that. And if I wanted to learn about what my customers wanted, I needed to speak to that customer, but I also needed to educate my customer. I needed to tell them firsthand. They needed to hear it firsthand. Why are these clothes so important, relevant, and special? You know, some of those hand-smoked pieces have eight hours of work behind it. That's pretty special. There are very few things that take eight hours, you know, nowadays. And it's incredible. I just keep thinking about how much data you were gathering in those early days, like from working with the customers, also from having five children of your own.