Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD: Chief Medical Advisor at Nutrafol

21:28Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So I had experience in that Amazon space. From specific? From specific beauty. And just in general, Amazon was something that I was familiar with and had interest in. And this is many, many years ago. This is over 10 years ago. And then my daughter was very interested in these rubber band bracelets. So when I went to go get the rubber band bracelets, the person who was checking me out said, oh, do you want to get charms for the bracelet? So I saw these charms. I said, oh, those are interesting. And we also had this conversation how this type of rubber band bracelet had become so popular and had increased in popularity.

22:02Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:And don't ask me why. But I was like, well, let me just see, you know, where I could get these. And somehow I was able to get the charms. And it was a really fun little business. It wasn't stressful at all. I said, let me just list them on Amazon. And I remember I listed them in the morning and I took my daughter to a birthday party because she was probably eight or nine years old. And when I came back, they had sold out. What? Yes, because the rubber band bracelets were very, very popular. So parents were looking for the accessories for the rubber band bracelets and I had these little silicone charms.

22:33Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So it was just fun. Like me, my mom and my daughter would sit around the dining room table and package these little butterflies. And that was kind of a trendy product at the time. So the kind of trend peaked and went away, but it was really fun as a family business just to have us sit around the table and do something fun together. So I really, really enjoyed it. That is amazing. I also have to ask, are you still seeing patients in the background during all of this? Yes. Okay. So that's a lot. So walk me through what sort of like your day was like in terms of how much time was spent on different things.

23:08Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:Well, the good thing is that I wasn't seeing patients every day, all day. I've never really done that in academic medicine. Traditionally, it's changed a little bit, But traditionally, attending saw patients anywhere between three to four half days a week, you know, maybe five or six for a very busy attending. That is changing. But way back when, that was typical. So I've never been in a job where I saw patients every day, all day. So that's one thing that allowed me to pursue all of these other interests. That's kind of amazing. Yeah, lots of flexibility. Again, I had a chairperson, Dr. Eagleside, who was very forward thinking.

23:45Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So we had lots of flexibility, definitely did. And when I created the skincare line, I left as full-time faculty and became part-time faculty. So at that time, I was probably seeing patients three or four days a week, three or four full days a week, but I still had two days to do all of the other things. So it was a perfect mix and it allowed me to pursue other things while still seeing patients. I love that because I feel like that has to be the best of all situations. because you have this like steady data, steady income, and then also enough free time that you can go and like layer in additional things.

24:24Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:That kind of feels like the dream. I agree. And I always tell the students and residents and young physicians that I mentor, we're very fortunate in dermatology because it is an outpatient-based specialty. We do have some flexibility in our schedule. And I do tell them, you know, when I'm mentoring or, you know, talking to young derms, do exactly what you want to do. Like really, you have the power to do that. Don't feel like you have to do things a certain way because you don't. And that is a little bit unique to dermatology, but I think it can expand into other areas. But I really think it's important.

25:00Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:If you know that you have this interest, go ahead and pursue it. And maybe you have to see patients less and you might make a little less money, but that's okay. It allows you to do something else that you're very passionate about. And also I would imagine prevents burnout. Exactly. The thought of being able to build your own schedule and that way to focus on the stuff that you love feels great. Yeah. I think it's very important for people to feel that you have options, that you don't have to follow the rules that you think you're supposed to follow. I love that. Okay. So let's skip ahead. We're going to fast forward to 2020, and it's still relatively the early stages of TikTok here in the U.S., and you partnered with the platform as a Learn on TikTok creator.

25:42Talk to me about how this partnership came to be. Were you a big TikTok user prior to that? What did the job entail? Tell me everything.

25:51Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So what happened was I loved making video content. It was just my thing. way back on Instagram, I was one of the rare people who did IGTV, if you remember that. So when TikTok, I think first kind of was becoming very popular, they were looking for creators who were experts in their field to create educational content because their goal was to be basically a search engine and they needed content. So someone found me on Instagram and I think there weren't a lot of people creating video content back in 2019, 2020 on Instagram. That was before Reels even existed and told me about this program. So it was really fun.

26:29Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:Also, it was the beginning of TikTok. I had not used TikTok. I didn't have the app. I literally joined the app to participate in this program. And it was a great learning experience because it was volume. You had to create like 60 videos in 45 days, and it was a lot of content. So it forced you to become really good at creating educational content. And that was such an invaluable skill. I was always good at it and enjoyed it. But when you have to do a high volume, just innately will become better. I love that you're getting your 10 ,000 hours right out of the gate. Exactly. So at that point in time, we were obviously seeing an enormous uptick in influencers and beauty content.

27:12And by the way, I follow so many science-based communicators and I love learning from TikTok. I feel like there's so many great folks who are so educational and inspiring, but it's such a talent. What were some of the things that you learned early on? Was it like this format works or no one understands what these things are? Oh, wow, this audience knows less than I thought. So I have to start at a more foundational level. What was that timeline like for you?

27:39Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:I'll never forget. Whenever we first joined the program, we had our first meeting. they told us that the ideal video length was 17 seconds. So at that time, we had to create educational content that was valuable in 17 seconds. Can you imagine how much you really need to master the camera if you have to communicate something in 17 seconds? So one of the things I really learned was how to be succinct, to the point, jump right in, no dilly-dallying. So that was great because it was a skill that is very much needed. Now, thank goodness, videos are longer and people generally create videos that are around a minute long.

28:19Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:But back then you really needed to teach someone the common causes of hair thinning in 17 seconds. You could write an encyclopedia on that. Exactly. And you have 17 seconds. Cool. Exactly. So it was an immersive experience where I learned very quickly by doing. Got it. Okay. So that same year, you also earned a second board certification, this time in lifestyle medicine. Can you walk our audience through what exactly lifestyle medicine is and also how it helps support your expertise in dermatology and why? I'll tell you the why. That's probably the most important part. A lot of my family is in healthcare and my mother was really into preventative medicine.

29:04Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So I grew up in the eighties and nineties in a house where there was no junk food and she was really into meditation and being connected. And she, as a nurse, definitely took that very holistic approach to health and wellness. So that was like a big part of my identity. Like I was definitely a big picture person when it came to health. And then I learned about the specialty of lifestyle medicine, which is a specialty that focuses on evidence-based lifestyle interventions for overall health and wellness. So things like a plant-predominant diet, not being vegetarian and vegan, just eating more plants, basically.

29:44Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:getting enough sleep, exercise, 150 minutes of moderate exercise weekly, managing stress, maintaining strong positive connections, avoiding risky substances like smoking, for example. Those are the six pillars of lifestyle medicine. And it really focuses on how those evidence-based interventions, like very specific interventions, can help to manage many common conditions. So it was something that very much resonated with me because of my experience growing up in a household that really embraced lifestyle medicine before it even existed. So when I learned about it, I was so intrigued and it was during the pandemic.

30:24Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So there was a lot of downtime. I mean, the offices were completely closed for six weeks. And then when we reopened, we saw limited patients because they didn't want people in the waiting rooms. And it was a very specific time. So I did have more free time. And I studied for those boards and it was completely different because dermatology is its own specialty. So I had to kind of go back and relearn things from many, many years ago, but I loved it. And that's one of the reasons why I became board certified in lifestyle medicine. I love that. Can you tell me like, what are some of the direct impacts of lifestyle medicine on the skin?

31:03Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So one of the times in the lifestyle medicine literature, where they mentioned the skin is when it comes to stress. So stress, as we know, always makes our skin worse. So stress makes acne worse, psoriasis worse, hair thinning worse, eczema worse, itching worse. So if you're under stress, it definitely manifests itself in our skin. And everyone knows that. It's an accelerant. It's an accelerant. I always tell patients, it's not caused by stress, but stress makes it worse, whatever condition I'm talking about. So I do talk a little bit about stress management in my practice with my patients. And, you know, I might recommend meditation.

31:39Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:Every patient almost always asks, are there any foods or anything I'm eating that could be making this condition worse? So I really go out of my way to be up to date on the data because remember lifestyle medicine is evidence based. So on the data that show what types of dietary changes may help improve someone's skin or hair condition. And then, you know, sleep, beauty sleep is an actual thing and sleep does impact our skin and even in very objective measures. So they have studies that show if you have restricted sleep, your skin barrier is compromised. So you have increased trans epidermal water loss, which means you have more water evaporating from your skin.

32:19Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So sleep really does impact our skin. So what you're saying is you look older if you're not sleeping well, because your wrinkles are more prominent. Yes. Yes. They have done studies that show that. So I try to integrate it into my practice. It's very relevant in dermatology with hair thinning stress is a huge deal. I never say that stress causes the hair thinning, but stress can definitely make it worse. And I've seen that in my patients. To dial it up from a two to an eight. Absolutely. I had one patient who came in and she had a chronic problem with hair thinning, but had a massive shed. And I kept saying, you know, did anything change?

32:56Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:You know, what happened? And then halfway through the visit, she said, oh, you know, I'm getting a divorce. And I said, oh, I think that's it. And it's so wild because I would also imagine that like, especially with women, especially with hair loss, that like the stress of the hair loss then becomes a stressor. So it's like you're worried about the fact that you're losing your hair, which is then causing more stress, which is then turning it up. So it's like you're almost exacerbating the problem unintentionally by being stressed about the problem in the first place, right? Right. It can definitely be a cycle.

33:27Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:I have patients who say they're scared to brush their hair because they're scared more hair is going to come out or scared to wash their hair. So there's so much fear and hair thinning really impacts quality of life tremendously. And I can't emphasize that enough. So I spend a lot of time, first of all, validating my patient's feelings, saying it's okay to be angry and frustrated that you're having hair thinning. And also, as I mentioned, you know, obviously there are many ways to manage hair thinning. And I discussed that in my practice with my patients, but also add in those lifestyle factors too.

34:01It is amazing how some of these like lifestyle changes can really impact how you're feeling on like a holistic level.

34:10Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:Yes. I'm a big believer in that. It's seen in all dermatologic conditions. You definitely see it with hair thinning. And the one thing I didn't mention is that sometimes after a major stressful event, that thinning can occur three to six months later. Like shock after the fact? Yes. And that's because hair grows in cycles. So most of your hair is in an active growth phase, but after a major stressful event, like a breakup or a car accident or hospitalization or really bad flu, it can push the hair into the resting and falling out phase, but that takes around three to six months. So people three months later can have massive shedding and not connect it to the stressful event.

34:50Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So you're a detective as well. I am a detective. Like I love when people come in to ask the right questions to get the answer. Well, also now I would think like in this post 2020 world, the COVID would affect that too, right? Because I remember hearing early on, people were like, why is my hair falling out? It's like, oh, well, it's on that timeline with COVID. We definitely saw an uptick then. That makes sense. Okay. So in 2023, you founded Derm Friends as a resource to offer simple solutions for common dermatologic problems, including skin, hair, and nail concerns from an expert perspective.

35:26Why did you want to expand your reach beyond TikTok and social media? And what was the process of getting Derm Friends up and running? Well, Derm Friends happened when I was on spring break.

35:37Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:I was actually on spring break. I was very relaxed and I had this idea. That's when all the best ideas happen. Exactly. When you're totally relaxed. And when you're a dermatologist, you get called constantly. I get sent pictures of my friend's cousin's daughter has a rash. My friend's hair is thinning. What do you suggest? Like all of these things. And so I thought I'd like to create a resource where people can find things that most dermatologists would recommend because we all kind of have similar recommendations for different skin and hair conditions. So I created this website while on vacation.

36:18Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:I literally found someone who could design the website and it was crazy, but it was so much fun. I was looking at the ocean the whole time. I love it. So it was really fun and it kind of evolved from the website. That's a part of it, but really a huge part of it is a weekly newsletter that keeps people up to date on what's new when it comes to skincare. And I love that because social media is a little bit like drinking from a fire hose. It's just like so full on that sometimes it's hard to process like what's what and what the real takeaway is. And I love that you did this. It kind of feels like along with the rise of Substack and the return to newsletters as an antidote to that.

36:59Like I love social media, don't get me wrong, but sometimes you just want like the calm, thoughtful version of content.

37:05Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:And there you are with Derm Friends. I love that. Right. What's new? What's the evidence behind that? Is there any evidence at all? So that's what I try to focus on. In 2024, you received a presidential citation from the American Academy of Dermatology for your contributions to skin of color and education, which is so major. I love that you went from discovering a passion for this topic as a young person in residency to being recognized as a trailblazer in the space. I'm curious, as someone who was living and breathing this and obviously cared about it so much, what did that level of recognition mean to you at that point in your career?

37:47Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:Again, I was shocked. I was very surprised and very, very honored. It was really nice to be recognized for the work that I had been doing for the last 20 years. So I loved that the Academy thought of me and thought of me in that light. It was a big ceremony and those of us who got presidential citations walked up and it's kind of like graduation all over again. I mean, that's really meaningful. That's so cool. So I've read that you've said that some of your favorite aspects of working in dermatology is the continual challenge. I would imagine that there's always so much newness and some of it is very hyped and some of it is a warning or a horror story about to be in terms of like a device that doesn't really do what it says it is or an ingredient that we think is great, but maybe not.

38:35What are some of the most rewarding challenges that you have overcome or that you have seen thus far?

38:41Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:I would say the most rewarding thing in Durham is learning, like always being up to date. Beyond even skincare and hair care, there are new immunologic treatments for things like psoriasis and eczema. And really trying to stay up to date is a challenge and I love it. But it is a challenge because there's so many new medications that work on different cytokines and work through different immunologic pathways. So staying up to date and really being on your game is a challenge in dermatology because there's a lot of newness in dermatology. I think in medicine in general, but specifically in derm.

39:18Yeah. Cause I feel like you would hope that any doctor in any field would really be paying attention to the latest and the new research and what's going on. But also I could see how it's like that could be overwhelming because there's always something. And especially, you know, because on the derm side, the skin side, they're also, I mean, this is true of all medicine, but like there's so much emphasis on product and development of product and making sure that like those things are actually efficacious. It just feels like a lot of information coming at you because it's such a huge industry.

39:51Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:Yes, it's a huge industry. And as I mentioned, the things that you see online, which is all the skincare and so forth, dermatology is a medical field. So there's a lot of medical dermatology, new discoveries, new genes that are associated with certain things. In the area of hair thinning, there's a lot of new research. And so if you want to stay up to date, you actively have to try to stay up to date. So speaking of hair, just last year in 2025, you joined Nutrafol, the number one dermatologist recommended hair growth supplement brand as their chief medical advisor. As we can tell from this conversation, this feels like a very organic next step and clearly speaks to an area of your expertise and interest.

40:35But I'm curious, were you specifically looking for something outside of your dermatology practice? Did you get bored only having two or three jobs and just wanted another one on top of it because you do so much? Why were you so interested or why were you interested in the first place in expanding your remit in this way?

40:53Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:You know, Nutrafol sought me out and I had naturally been using Nutrafol in my patients for years, really from the very beginning. We had offered Nutrafol in our office and it's something that I had been recommending to patients. A huge part of my practice is hair thinning and it has been an incredible tool for me as a dermatologist. The company's ethos is really that whole body approach. So looking at all of the key root causes of hair thinning and creating formulas that address key root causes of hair thinning. So for me, it was a perfect fit. And again, I was honored and I was excited to join this team because it really does work so perfectly with what I do as a dermatologist and as a specialist in lifestyle medicine.

41:40So for anyone who isn't familiar, what are some of like the hero products or what is Nutrafol really known for?

41:48Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So Nutrafol is a hair growth nutraceutical that really addresses the key root causes of hair thinning. So things like metabolism, hormones, stress, all of the things that can influence hair thinning. And the other thing that makes it unique is that it has formulas designed for specific life stages. For me as a dermatologist, the type of thing that I would recommend for someone who is postpartum and having hair thinning postpartum would be very different than the type of product I would recommend for a woman who is perimenopausal or experiencing hair thinning due to menopause or perimenopause. So Nutrafol has different formulas for these different life stages.

42:28Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So the postpartum addresses the issues that are much more common or the key root causes that are more common in that particular life stage. And for people who are perimenopausal or postmenopausal, there's a women's balance formula that helps to address those root causes for that population. So for me as a dermatologist, I love that because it really is how we practice as dermatologists. We do recommend products specifically for our patients. And the other thing I absolutely love about Nutrafol is that it has incredible amount of clinical research. So there are 26 published trials looking at Nutrafol and its effectiveness in hair thinning, and three of them are randomized control trials.

43:10Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:And I know you know what that means, but it's basically the most rigorous type of clinical trial that you can do to show that a product works. So it's something that I feel very confident for that reason, recommending it to my patients. And it's one of the reasons why it is the number one hair growth nutraceutical recommended by dermatologists. Can you walk us through a little bit of postpartum hair and like what's going on? because you're not shedding during that time and then you do versus perimenopause and why those formulas would be different. So for example, postpartum, you've just had a baby, right?

43:47Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:And we talked earlier about how a major stressful event can push the hair out of that active growth phase into that shedding phase. And that's exactly what happens. So people actually usually, when they're pregnant, think their hair is longer and thicker because the estrogen and the hormones during pregnancy promote hair growth. And then around three to six months later, you can have this shedding. So for postpartum thinning, the ingredients help to address stress. So those formulas really are focused on the root causes that are unique to that population. Now let's think of the woman who is perimenopausal.

44:24Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:That's a little bit different. When you're perimenopausal, you have a drop in estrogen. And what you have is a relative dominance of male hormones or androgens and that can drive that hair thinning. So that formula can contain ingredients that help to address those hormonal changes like soft palmetto and maca and things that help to address that key root cause in someone who's postmenopausal or perimenopausal. So that's why I feel like Nutrafol is so unique in that it really does create formulas for that specific life stage. And that's how we as dermatologists practice. It's not a one-size-fits-all solution.

45:05And I love hearing this from you too, because to be totally transparent from the outside, a skeptical consumer layperson might look at it and be like, what are all these formulations? It's all the same stuff in a different package. And you're like, absolutely not. That's not the case. These are really truly formulated for these life stages, which is fascinating and so cool.

45:26Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:Yes. Different ingredients, different combinations, because everyone is unique. I mean, that's exactly what it's like being a dermatologist. You don't give the same thing to every single person. You choose what you're going to recommend based on that person's specific needs. Love it. Okay. So since you've spent the majority of your career in clinical practice or running your own business, I'm wondering what it's like working within a larger company and such a big corporation. I'm wondering if you had to adjust in any way, if there were any surprises, like every corporation has its own, for lack of a better word, etiquette, like ways of working and ways of communicating.

46:04Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So what has that been like? Well, I will say I absolutely love it. I've had a wonderful experience. So there weren't any major surprises, but what I do think that has been impactful to me is the opportunity to kind of work on a larger scale. So when I'm in practice, I'm seeing my patients one-on-one, but when you work with a larger corporation, you really can have a greater impact when it comes to education, raising awareness and advocacy work. Big microphone. Yeah. So that scale of impact is what has been most impressive to me and something that I really enjoy because we've mentioned this before, but hair thinning really does tremendously impact quality of life.

46:44Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:It is a huge part of women and men's identity. And it's something that people are often ashamed of and don't want to talk about. So raising awareness and increasing advocacy is important for me. And in this environment, it's so much more easy to do that. So you have said that your role at Nutrafol is to help advance their mission to lead in hair health through science, education and advocacy to empower people to feel confident in their hair at every life stage. What is the most impactful thing that you have done for accomplishing this mission in practice or things that you have implemented that are having a direct impact on folks and how they feel about their hair?

47:25Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:I think the education piece is huge. So as I mentioned, it's so important for people who are experiencing hair thinning to know that they're not alone, to know that there are options, that they're validated and feeling upset and angry. And it's okay. We understand that. And also to raise awareness. I think in my practice, a lot of times when people come in with hair thinning, many times women might be wearing a wig and they're so embarrassed to just take off their wig because they don't want to show their hair thinning. And that is something that I see and I understand why it exists, but it's important for women and men to know that they're not alone and that there are options to help manage it.

48:08Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So that is probably the thing that is most important to me, really raising awareness and validating people's frustration with their hair thinning and letting them know there are options. Well, making people feel seen and heard and taking away stigma, like that is literally game changing for folks. Like it's so, so important to be able to do it on an even larger scale. Hell yes. Yeah. It's so important for people not to feel alone. Absolutely. So I'm curious about what you have learned from this experience of expanding your career in this way, because obviously like you come to the table with all of this experience, but I'm curious about like, what have you learned from the Nutrafol team?

48:51Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:It's a much larger corporate environment. Luckily, I did have a business before. So I do bring a lot of personal experience with running a business and the personal care space. So it's not completely unfamiliar to me, but on the scale, it is a little bit different. So just learning about when you're running a much, much larger organization, the responsibilities that come with that. Right. But it's been an incredible experience. I've absolutely enjoyed literally every second. On my very first day at NutraFall, I said, this is the most excited I've ever been for a first day at work. I love that.

49:31That's so cool. Okay, so we like to close the podcast with the same three questions that we ask everyone who joins us. And the first one is about mistakes because everyone makes them, but we don't tend to talk about them. We tend to give the highlight perfect version. But I think it's important to talk about the missteps and the mistakes because women in particular, I think, really need to hear about other women showing resiliency and showing people that you can have a mistake and still move through it. So I'm hoping that you can tell me about one that you've made in your career at any point and what you've learned from it.

50:07Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So I first will start, and I know everyone probably says this, but I think mistakes are good. Anytime I make a mistake, I'll say, oh, that's good that happened because that is how you learn. And I tell people that. That's how you learn. But I will tell you about a little story. When I had the skincare line, we were looking at manufacturers, and we chose a manufacturer because it was spotless. And I'm very neat and clean and detail-oriented. And the facility was spotless. You could literally eat off of the floor. They seemed so organized. Everything was like tip-top, you know, checked every single box except one.

50:43Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:So we ship all of our raw materials over there. We were going to actually have coupons inserted inside of the boxes. So the coupon person said, hey, there's a padlock on your facility. And it says that it's closed. and it ends up that that manufacturing facility had not been paying its rent and so the landlord closed the facility completely and our raw materials were inside of the facility. No! Yes. So we had to find a new manufacturer. We had to go and have everything moved. It delayed launch obviously and it taught me and it taught us that even though you know things look great on the surface, you do have to dig a little bit deeper.

51:25Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:And we could have done maybe a little more due diligence when it came to that manufacturer. And it was a very expensive mistake. But definitely, I learned from it. I'll say that's horrifying. Oh, my God, I would have been panic mode. It was very panicky. So my next question is, a lot of the folks who listen to this podcast are in their first lives. and maybe they want to stay in the same industry, but they want to expand or pivot, or maybe they want to change industries altogether. Who knows? But they haven't done it yet because they're scared as someone who has done that. What advice would you give someone who's standing there sort of on the precipice of making change, but just hasn't done it quite yet?

52:13Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:I would say, I'm sure everyone says just do it, but that's really the right answer. And it's because you don't know unless you try. You have to try. And I always think, what's the worst that can happen? You know, the worst that can happen is that you're not successful and you move on to something else. It's not the end of the world, especially for people, as you mentioned, in the beginning of their career, you have decades ahead of you, decades and decades and decades. If you're early in your career, it's a good time to take chances. It's a good time to try something new because, you know, you can always pivot.

52:46Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:If things don't work out, it's a learning experience and you move on. And I guarantee you, if things don't work out, whatever you learned from it not working out, you'll apply in your next career. So it really is important to just go for it and not be afraid and not feel like you have to follow the path that was set for you. As doctors, we go to undergrad, then we go to medical school, then we go to residency, then we get a job. We're used to checking these boxes and thinking that you have to go a certain route. And you don't have to go a certain route. You can make a left turn and a right turn, and that's okay.

53:19Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:And then you could go back to full-time clinical medicine. If I wanted to, I could do that. It's when you're young, it's important to understand that you have decades ahead of you. Martha Stewart, I think, started her business when she was 50. Yeah. So I always think about that. And I mentioned that to the young people that I mentor. Yeah. And I also love what you're saying of like, ultimately, everything is a learning. And that's the key point. The outcome doesn't always matter. it's the learning that you're taking from that situation and applying forward and applying forward and sometimes things that don't work are actually like the best learnings because then you're like I'm not doing that again or I learned x from this or like it didn't work but I still learned y yeah I always say every mistake is a learning opportunity so I never get mad at mistakes I'm always like okay that's good that happened that's how my friends said all the time Okay, so my last question is my favorite question, which is, if you could get into a time machine and go back in time and give your younger self some advice, what would you say?

54:21Heather Woolery-Lloyd, MD:I would say, don't be so self-conscious, be an early adopter, and take more risks. I love it. I also love hearing take more risks from a Virgo because we tend to be somewhat risk-averse. I know, I know. So I'm going to try and really metabolize that. Yes. So thank you. This was such a pleasure. Thank you so much for your time. I have very much enjoyed our conversation and appreciate all of the insight that you have shared with us today. So thank you. Thank you so much for having me. This was fun.

54:57That was dermatologist and chief medical advisor at Nutrafol, Dr. Heather Woolery-Lloyd. For more inspiring interviews with women like Dr. Heather, head on over to secondlifepod.com, where we have so many more for you to peruse. If you like today's show, please subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. And don't forget to rate and review us. We love seeing you spread the word on social. And now you can tag us in your posts. We are at secondlifepod on Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook. We always want to know who you're interested in hearing from on the show. So send in your requests to hello at secondlifepod.com, or you can DM us on Instagram.

55:40I'm at Hillary Kerr. The show is at Second Life Pod. Our DMs are always open. I'm Hillary Kerr, and you've been listening to Second Life. This episode was produced by Hillary Kerr, Summer Hammeris, and Natalie Thurman. Our production assistant is Grace Ingram. Our audio engineers are at Treehouse Recording in Los Angeles, California, and our music is by Jonathan Leahy.

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