Jess Jacobs: CEO of Coterie

20:39Jess Jacobs:Okay. So you moved into personal care, specifically joining Lola, which is a great brand, as the VP of Creative. For anyone who doesn't know Lola, it's a female-founded period and sexual wellness brand similar to Apple. It has a very clean aesthetic. Everything about it is smart. Talk to me about why you decided this was the right place to go, what it was like when you joined the team. Tell me all about it. Yeah, their brand was already pretty set and in place. What I was trying to do was actually bring more consistency to it and just a very deep understanding of our customer and how to build community there.

21:19Jess Jacobs:I love that it was so chic because I feel like a lot of women's personal care products in general, let alone period products, it feels like it was designed in a lab in the 1950s by men for women. and it's just like not it. So it's nice to hear that there was already that look and feel, but then the idea was is that you would make things consistent and refine it and keep pushing it. Exactly. And it gave me this real appreciation for transparency in clean ingredients and why that matters, the ripple effects it has, what customers really deserve to see and have trust in. And it set the course, I think, for this personal care journey that I am now on.

22:02Jess Jacobs:Was there a learning curve to working for a personal care brand or not? Just because it is a different industry in so many ways than some of the other brands you had worked with, did you feel like you had to figure things out in a different way or understand the industry in a different way? I think my advertising background honestly made it second nature to jump into different brands from one day to the next and just envelop myself in them and really understand the customer and build from there, that wasn't the learning curve. I think it was more so just operating within a true startup. Yeah. You had a little bit of startup, it sounds like, in hospitality working with Danny Meyer, but startup culture is different.

22:45Yes. And with Danny, we were selling a service, not goods. So this was about products and it's just a whole different ballgame in that sense. But it was an amazing learning experience.

22:59Jess Jacobs:How was it transitioning to being the in-house creative for one brand and being in that decision-making seat in a different way? I much preferred it. It brings its own challenges, though, right? Nothing's perfect. Pros and cons, absolutely. But I didn't feel the need to then go to outside agencies. I liked still doing what I always loved to do, which is building with my own teams and working with an in-house team. So I feel like we got kind of the agency experience within a startup. So how long were you at Lola and what made you decide to make a move after that? So I was at Lola for about a year and a half and I gained a lot of clarity actually from becoming a new mom.

23:48I think that transformed the way I thought about what I wanted to do, where I wanted to be. My husband and I, we have two girls now, Penelope and Quinn. They're almost five and almost two. And then before joining Coterie, I was using one of the giant diaper brands with Penelope as a newborn. And it was just kind of going along with the motions and didn't realize the importance of a diaper and didn't realize there was a better option out there. And I got connected with the founder of Coterie, Frank Yu. And the first thing he had me do was obviously try the diaper. We did that. And I don't know if it was divine intervention or what, but it was Penelope's first night of really sleeping through the night dry.

24:34So she slept through the night. We got up in the morning. We went to her crib and it wasn't wet. And I just thought, oh, it's, you know, you change the sheets every morning. That's just part of it. And, you know, it doesn't have to be actually. I was just, you know, not using coterie. And then a couple of days later, her diaper rash was gone. So I was really experiencing the benefits firsthand. And it was like a shot of adrenaline for me. It was so exciting to be using and thinking about a product that is so superior. You know, when you're creating a brand around a superior product, it makes it all the better, all the easier, all the more fun and real.

25:13So it had all of the ingredients for what I thought could be an incredible opportunity.

25:18Jess Jacobs:So you fell in love with the brand and then decided to go and work for it? Honestly, I fell in love with the product. I did not fall in love with the brand necessarily, but the product was exceptional. And the founder was open and trusting to let me come in and change every single thing about it except for the product. Which didn't need to be changed. So great. Exactly. Exactly. So it was kind of a perfect combination of incredible product, open canvas and landscape with a trusting founder who wanted me to come in and do my thing. There was already an amazing team in place. A lot of the senior leadership team that we still have today was there when I joined.

25:56Our president today, Grace Weingart, she was there. I lean on her every single day, but I was able to hire a lot of amazing people. We've built out this team. I brought over, you know, friends from old places that I trust and I love to work with. Our creative director, Elena. I've gotten to work with her at Kettle and now here, and she's just unbelievable. It was a recipe for success from the beginning, I would say.

26:19Jess Jacobs:We've given some broad strokes around Coterie. Talk to me a little bit about what the brand proposition is and how it's different from those industry standard giant brands. Coterie was started because we believe that the status quo in the diaper industry wasn't good enough. The diaper industry is a big business. It generates over 8 billion in the US until last year, yet it isn't closely regulated. And that was really, really surprising to me. And the diaper and wipes business together, that's about 12 billion a year. So we're talking, you know, big. And the diaper is really the closest thing to your baby.

26:58If you think about baby's skin, it's so delicate and sensitive and they're wearing that diaper 24 seven.

27:03Jess Jacobs:It really made everyone wonder, you know, what is in a diaper exactly? And we just believe parents shouldn't have to compromise with harmful ingredients for performance when it comes to their babies. They deserve to have both. So Coterie products are always hypoallergenic, dermatologist tested, formulated without fragrance, parabens, chlorine bleaching, latex, phthalates, dioxins, BPA, rubber, optical brighteners, VOCs. I could go on and on, say from, you know, over a thousand plus chemicals. And the goal there is really just to relieve that mental burden of choosing safe products by being as transparent as possible.

27:37And the majority of our team are also parents. So we're just basically engineering products that are safe enough and powerful enough for our own kids. And that's really what it's about. We were also the first diaper brand to publish our safety reports so parents can see exactly what's inside of our diapers and most importantly, what's not in our products. And we retest the performance and safety of the ingredients every six months with third-party labs. That's amazing. Yeah, we're constantly trying to raise the bar there and we're supportive of other brands that do the same. We want the whole industry to just get better.

28:09Jess Jacobs:So you initially joined as the SVP of brand and creative and product management. That is a very long and hefty title. Can you break down what exactly that meant and what the day-to-day work was like? I got to work with the incredible team members that were already there and just build out these teams. We wanted to keep it all in-house, building out brand and creative and product marketing. And I just started leaning into product and product marketing even more so than ever before, overseeing parts of that roadmap as well. So it's a big, weird title, but it was early days, I would say, also for the brand.

28:52And it made sense to bucket all of those functions under a single leader. Got it.

28:57Jess Jacobs:So the brand had been around for a couple of years when you joined and that when you came in, the founder and the team was very open to you changing branding, rebuilding, rethinking things. What were some of the early initial things that you did once you landed at Coterie? Yeah. So there was a brand in place that, you know, they had launched with maybe a year previously. It's not what exists today. And I remember being in a team meeting and just saying to everybody, you know, everything is going to change. We're not going to be yellow anymore and this and that and the faces and surprise. But I just saw an opportunity that didn't exist at the time to just create a brand that spoke to me as a parent in a real way.

29:38Not just highlighting the joys of parenting, but also acknowledging the struggles. And I wanted to create community brand digital experience that was differentiated for the baby care space. And that's what we set out to do.

29:50Jess Jacobs:When you're creating something like this, what is your process like? Does it start with the words? Does it start with the visual? How does something creative become something tangible? It starts with a mood board, I think. It's like, what do you want people to feel? What should evoke deep within them? And just sort of building it out from there. And again, I mentioned her, but Yelena, my creative director, we really did this hand in hand with our in-house team. And I'm so proud of the work because every detail was just so, so deeply thoughtful. And it took time and patience, but it's so beautiful.

30:25It's something we're so proud of. And we especially didn't want to pull from any references in the baby care space. We wanted to kind of really create our own playbook and show up in a really unique and delightful and surprising fashion. And I think we've achieved that.

30:39Jess Jacobs:I think you are very right in all of that. How much testing is involved? like from a brand and marketing and aesthetics point of view, because so often I think that you have a gut feeling, you have an instinct about something. Do you feel the need to test it? Or is it more of like a, if you build it, they will come sort of situation? Like how does that process work? I am the biggest proponent and believer in testing when it comes to all things product. And even when you're getting into sort of, you know, shelf and obviously pricing, like commercialization, testing is necessary. When it comes to design, copy, brand, I don't like testing.

31:25I never have. I'm sorry. I don't do it.

31:29Jess Jacobs:Well, I always talk about this within content and data. Data is incredibly important, but data tells you where you've been, data doesn't always tell you where you're going. That's exactly right. And sometimes it takes a minute for something to sink in and be beloved, especially if it's not a reference to something that already exists. So it's a gamble always when it plays out that way, but you have to go with your gut on these things and trust your POV. That's the thing that you have that no one else does. That's the thing that AI can't replicate. That's your view. That's your vision and your taste.

32:04And that should always come first and foremost, I think. How do you know when you've gotten something right? It's funny. As much as I do not believe in testing in those beginning phases, I think the way you know if you've got it right is data because the numbers will then come through and confirm that you did get it right. It doesn't happen overnight, but there is and must be a correlation between the two. Not immediately. I still don't like to measure any type of brand activations. You know, I think those are not the immediate ROI initiatives. Those are the rising tides that lift all boats, in my opinion.

32:48Jess Jacobs:So speaking of boats being lifted, according to Ad Age, Coterie saw an 83 % awareness growth increase in 2023. quote unquote, driven by strong marketing efforts led by you. That's pretty nuts. Can you share anything about some of the specific campaigns or strategies that you feel like really moved the needle? Yeah, of course. And I want to just say it really all has been a team effort. The team is unbelievable, but it was really important to us not to feel like another goo goo ga ga pastel brand. Anything we did needed to stand out from that sea of sameness, even if it was really distinct. And just being a new mom at the time, I know how parents are going to each other for advice and referrals.

33:35And I knew that really modern discerning storytelling around incredible products would move the needle in that way. So we just were able to craft things in the way that we as parents would want to see things. And, you know, one example of that is the You've Changed campaign we did with Karlie Kloss, who is an incredible partner to us. We really leaned into the emotions of motherhood versus, you know, just coming out with another ad showing a dancing baby in a diaper. I don't know. But we played with the duality of you've changed, like changing, actually diaper changing, and also the changes in the transformation that happened for a mom as their baby grows and they sort of take on new identities and layers as well.

34:20And it's all a beautiful and enlightening and sometimes scary process.

34:26Jess Jacobs:So after about two and a half years, you were promoted to chief brand officer. What does that mean for your workload? Like what was different? Yeah, I was the first C-suite title, you know, next to our founder. I think I've just cemented my role more than anything else, gave me maybe even more agency perhaps to say, we want to do this brand moment and nobody can measure it, things like that. But it didn't feel like a huge shift, honestly. And it didn't stick for very long because just seven months later in 2024, you were appointed CEO, which first of all, congratulations. Thank you. Second of all, as someone who had primarily worked on the creative side of things, which obviously there were tons of metrics still involved in that.

35:13Jess Jacobs:Did you ever imagine yourself in this role? Not that creatives can't be CEOs, but it's not always like the standard trajectory. It is not. It's not typical. I wish it was, and I think it should be more so, but yeah, it's definitely not. And, you know, I am a creative person at heart, but really just being a part of an extraordinary team is the thing that I love most. And leading a business, being a CEO, it feels like it's this, you know, single position, but it really is a team sport. And the people around you are what make all the difference in what you're able to do or not do. And you can't accomplish anything without that.

35:50And you need to trust that amazing team in every direction. I'm someone that is aware of my strengths and that I also am not the smartest person in the room. There's so much that I don't know. And that's why I think giving a lot of trust and agency to these expert team members I have is the right move and it's continued to work for us. And that's part of our culture, too. It's really a lot of trust and empathy. I'm definitely an emotionally led problem solver. And that's how I like to make decisions and keep things focused. But I want to just create environments that people want to flourish in because I think when your team is happy and feels taken care of, they can then, you know, bring their best selves and do that for the customer.

36:34Jess Jacobs:Talk to me about being not just a manager, but the big manager. I feel like that was the steepest learning curve for me over the years. What parts have been easiest for you? What parts have been hardest? The people stuff is the stuff that does come easiest and the stuff that I enjoy the most. And that is what you're spending the most time doing as a CEO, in all honesty. But I see my role as someone who's really here to set the vision, get things out of the way that are in any form kind of hindrances or barriers to people completing that vision and then just sort of cheering people on and, you know, helping them get there in any way I can.

37:13And putting it in those terms, it takes a lot of the pressure off of, you know, needing to be the one to do it all. I'm not, and I'm very honest about that. It feels more vulnerable and real, and that's just, you know, who I am.

37:30Jess Jacobs:Talk to me about Coterie's expansion, both in terms of product lines and retail strategy. like how do you know when to launch something new? How do you know when to develop something? Newness is my favorite piece of any business. So talk to me about that side of it. I love newness too. The reality is we have such high bars for developing new products. And then continuing to test them. Yes, exactly. It takes forever, but as it should, right? If something is coming to life overnight, I would absolutely question it. And that's kind of how things started too. You know, we took the time to really understand what was missing from diapers in the market and then just carved out that premium category that didn't exist in the U.S.

38:16prior. And we invested in quality materials, improving the quality of life and comfort of our baby. And for parents, everybody's getting more sleep. And our first product, the diaper, just a single diaper, but with superior clean materials that actually work. And, you know, that's been the guiding light for products thereafter. After, we have incredible wipes that are just essential for cleaning sensitive skin. Our soft wipe, which is, you know, if you're looking for extra skin caring ingredients, it's incredibly gentle and soft. And then the flush wipe, which just launched in June, it dissolves in 30 minutes.

38:52It's perfect for potty training support or for everybody. So we're in septic safe. Oh, oh yeah. Oh yeah. Very important. Very important. Yes, yes, yes. We have our pants, which is an incredible sort of pull up, pull down, resealable waistband, which is the first of its kind. And we actually won a fast company design innovation award for that, not even in the baby care category, just in general. And we have our swim diaper, but that's it. So we don't have a million SKUs. It's not about that for us. It's about sort of the best in the categories that we want to be in. And that's it. I think skew proliferation can really bring a lot of businesses down, honestly.

39:31It's a quick way to sort of lose focus and try to be everything to everyone and potentially end up compromising on your standards, which is, you know, for us, it's number one. It's what we would never do. So we do have newness in the works. We've been R &Ding this for over two years. That's launching later this year. So I wish I could say more, but we're excited. Okay.

39:55Jess Jacobs:So Coterie has been a D2C brand since the beginning, but you've also entered Erewhon, Whole Foods, and Wegmans. So talk to me about how retail has changed the business. I feel like Omnichannel is just sort of like the way that we think about product now, but are you planning on being in multiple places? Or do you think that it will always be a small percentage versus the primary D2C? What do you think the mix is going to be as you look to the future? Right now, retail partnerships are more marketing opportunities for us and we're really selective. We want to work with partners that Maricotter is brand ethos.

40:35And we're also able to drive 10 % of new customers from those retailers to our D2C channels, which is really cool.

40:42Jess Jacobs:It's an awareness opportunity or to get someone to try something and then convert them. Trial. Exactly. Exactly. And we're the number one on every shelf we enter. So that's fun too. So as you've grown along with the brand over the last four years, what makes you excited about continuing to work in this space? Because it's not driven by novelty. Like to your point, you're not interested in losing focus and being everything to everyone. No. You have this very clear brand vision and proposition, But if everything worked out perfectly, where would you want Coterie to go in the future? Yeah. So our goal is to overall just relieve that mental burden of choosing safe products by being incredibly transparent.

41:29And the most exciting part of my job is to create those products that actually help parents and to see them out in the world. There's nothing more exciting than that. As I said, we're really intentional about only launching products that are truly exceptional. So we won't release a product if it doesn't meet that highest safety and performance standard. So there are really exciting things in the pipeline, but they're not coming to life for years from now. And that's OK. I want us to be patient and know that we're going to always deliver the best so that our customers know that when we launch something, it's as good as it could possibly get.

42:06Jess Jacobs:So we like to talk about mistakes on this podcast because everyone makes them. but we don't always talk about them. We tend to give the highlight real version of our careers, but I think it's important to talk about the mistakes because it shows that you can recover from them and women need stories about resiliency, or at least I do. So tell me about a mistake that you've made at any point in your career and what you've learned from it. I am really grateful for every experience that's gotten me to where I am today, for sure. I look back and I really remember resisting developing new skills outside of my core strengths, mainly because I have awareness and I know that I'm not good at certain things and I wanted to succeed.

42:52And why should I attempt that when I know it's not my thing? But I think I missed out on early learning by doing that. The fear of rejection, all of that. I wish I had stepped outside of my comfort zone earlier because now I'm doing it all the time. And I think that if that was a muscle I'd worked from early days, I would be in an even better place. And it would just have been so valuable all the way through.

43:16Jess Jacobs:I sometimes have this weird theory that I think that men are more comfortable with doing things outside their comfort zone because they face so much more rejection so early on because they're the ones who are like asking people on dates and asking for this. And because women have not always exercise that muscle as much. And we are more used to being like the good student who's called on and then rewarded for doing the work without having to ask for it. That it's almost like we are not conditioned in the same way to try other things. And I think about all of the social and societal things that go into that.

43:52Jess Jacobs:And I hope that we continue to break some of that apart too, because the earlier you can get comfortable with failing or messing up or trying something that's scary and not being attached to the outcome, I think the better for all of us. Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. And I was always the type, and I still am to be the first to say, I wanna defer to you on this one. That's not my strong suit or, you know, and that's just the way I've always done things. But I think in the past it was, I wanna defer to you on this one. And then I would sort of pull myself out of it. And now it's, I want to defer to you on that one, but can I see how you're getting there and work with you on this and help in any way I can?

44:33And something I think about is when I joined Coterie, going through all these steps up to becoming CEO at one point. Before being CEO, I was really honest with our founder about my lack of accounting acumen, basically. He said, I'm not trying to make you CFO. He did, but he also gave me accounting courses and had me work with a coach, like a CFO. And in being honest with that and saying, but I want to figure this out and learn, I got to do so and didn't shy away from it. And it's obviously made all the difference to me today. I'm so grateful for that. But I think you can still be you and honest and also not exactly like pull away from those tougher challenges.

45:16Jess Jacobs:And I think the other part that I personally realized is like, I don't have to be the best. I don't have to lead that department. I just need to understand it. And that's freeing. Exactly. And I think that's when there's questions around a creative becoming a CEO, you could say the same thing about a more common trajectory, which is maybe a CFO becoming a CEO. I don't know that that CFO has a deep understanding of brand and customer and vision, building community and creating a vision. Exactly. Maybe they do, but maybe they don't. And in the cases that they don't, they're hopefully leaning on a really strong team and leader there to do the work.

45:51So I think same goes for me in other categories.

45:54Jess Jacobs:So a lot of the folks who listen to this podcast are in their first lives and they know that they want to make a change, whether that is staying in the same industry but doing something different, changing industries entirely. But they're scared. They haven't made that leap quite yet. But as someone who has pivoted in her career, what advice would you give someone who's sort of standing there and thinking about it, but just hasn't made that leap quite yet? Yeah, I think we've talked about this in the beginning, but that right place at the right time, I feel like it's always very easy in hindsight to see what that thing was, that right place, right time thing.

46:34It's harder when you're in it. I think really taking a macro look at what's happening in the landscape and how you can use it to your advantage and how you can almost create that right time, right place for you. I would say, if you want to make a change, start acting as if you already did it. Act as if you're there. Network and build your vision as if it's real. Start creating it as a passion project and take advantage of all of the free tools that are out there to make it happen. I was talking to a founder the other day, building something really beautiful and brilliant. And I said, you know, who's going to develop your site?

47:08And she said, Oh, me and chat GBT. And it's unbelievable what you can sort of do without needing to jump in maybe all the way and then get it ready so that you could take that leap. And it's all kind of set up for you to go.

47:22Jess Jacobs:I do think about that all the time, like the way that technology has changed so many things. And I mean, even just talking about like from a Shopify aspect of it, like so much of this stuff didn't exist a handful of years ago, there's so much opportunity. There's so many tools that make especially building a digital first brand possible in a way that it just simply wasn't 10, 20 years ago. Lean into the tools, because the hard part is the idea. And if you have the idea, you can figure out the tools to make it happen. I couldn't agree more. So my last question is also my favorite question, which is if you could get into a time machine and go back in time and speak with your younger self and give your younger self some advice, what would you say?

48:10I used to believe that I had this very like limited time to achieve something meaningful. It's simply not true, obviously, but I would just like kind of sprint towards these quick finish lines, like these quick wins. And I wasn't really thinking about running the marathons and having patience for that bigger race and those bigger achievements and what those kind of larger possibilities could be that would take more time to get to. And I think I would tell younger Jess, the more life experience you'll gain and the more you'll go through, the better leader you'll become, actually, the sharper judgment.

48:44And that also, you know, becoming a mom will only propel your career. It will clarify your vision. It will give you more empathy and you'll become an expert at compartmentalizing and be able to prioritize more effectively. Being a mom has actually been my secret weapon for being a CEO. It hasn't been in any way a hindrance. It's been the thing that's made it all the easier. I don't know that I actually could have done this before.

49:12Jess Jacobs:Well, I look forward to all that you have coming up whenever you feel like talking about it. This has been such a pleasure chatting. I just want to say this is pretty full circle for me. I would fly out to Cupertino a lot for Apple and listen to you along the way and the amazing people that you spoke to. And I would dream about taking that pivot and making my second life happen and what that could be. So this is quite emotional for me. And I just wanna say thank you because you are planting those inspiring seeds for a lot of people out there. Well, it's truly my pleasure. This podcast has been an endless source of joy.

49:49Jess Jacobs:So thank you for taking the time. Thank you for listening to the pod and thank you for your candor. I really appreciate it.

50:03Jess Jacobs:That was the CEO of Coterie, Jess Jacobs. For more inspiring interviews with women like Jess, head on over to secondlifepod.com, where we have so many more for you to peruse. If you like today's show, please subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. And don't forget to rate and review us. we love seeing you spread the word on social and now you can tag us in your posts we are at second life pod on instagram twitter and facebook we always want to know who you're interested in hearing from on the show so send in your requests to hello at second life pod.com or you can dm us on instagram i'm at hillary kerr the show is at second life pod our dms are always open.

50:48Jess Jacobs:I'm Hilary Kerr, and you've been listening to Second Life. This episode was produced by Hilary Kerr, Summer Hammeris, and Natalie Thurman. Our production assistant is Raven Yamamoto. Our editor is Natalia Perez. Our audio engineers are at Treehouse Recording in Los Angeles, California, and our music is by Jonathan Leahy.