The Who What Wear Podcast: Makeup Artist Pati Dubroff on Blush Placement, Gray Mascara, and Making Press-Tour Magic With Margot Robbie

0:10Hillary Kerr:Welcome to the Who What Wear podcast. I'm your host, Hillary Kerr. And today we are in studio with the legendary makeup artist, Pati Dubroff. I am very certain that you are well aware of her iconic work with celebrities like Margot Robbie, maybe the Barbie press tour and Wuthering Heights press tour ring a bell. We're talking about some of the key looks from that. We're also talking about Patti's legendary work, like when she did Mary-Kate and Ashley Olsen's look for the 2004 Got Milk ad. Bet you didn't think about that lately, but you should because it's perfect. We also talk about the incredible bridal makeup that Patti did on Sophia Ritchie Grange for her wedding and so much more.

0:51Hillary Kerr:Patti tells us tips, tricks, techniques, exact products. It is a phenomenal episode, and I am so glad that you are here to listen and see it. It's all coming up on Who, What, Where.

1:09Hillary Kerr:So, Patti, welcome back to the pod. You and I have not sat down to talk on the record since 2001. No, 2001 or 21? 2021. Whatever. It's all the same. 2001 before we started to aware, of course. So I encourage everyone who hasn't heard that episode to go back and give it a listen because we talk all about your history. But just for the listeners, side note, we're going to put that episode in the show link so that people can go back and listen. But for anyone who isn't as deeply familiar with your career as I am, can you give our listeners a little background on how you first got started in the beauty world and what drew you to it?

1:49I was that 10-year-old kid who was obsessed with makeup and was at my mother's makeup table all the time, putting makeup on myself, then on her, then my friends. And then I was the person in high school who was like getting everyone ready for every party. Were you so popular? Every dance. I mean, I was also kind of a weirdo. But like I was a, you know, a weirdo who had a skill. So I would get everyone ready for the parties and the dances and whatever. As soon as I graduated high school in New Jersey, moved to New York City. And I'm like, I always loved makeup, but I didn't know it was a career.

2:24So I think when I was growing up, it was like 70s, early 80s, and it wasn't a known career except the ladies who sold makeup at makeup counters. So I went to New York City to do that because I wanted to be around the makeup. And then I started assisting, you know, and I assisted some really incredible artists who really showed me the ropes in the fashion world and the music world. I worked at MTV in the studios and, you know, the days of like House of Style. I was working on like the first shows. And then I kind of segued into Hollywood in the late 90s, early 2000s. And I've been happily painting movie stars ever since, as well as many other kinds of people.

3:06But, you know, that's just like the most condensed version I could give you in a nutshell.

3:11Hillary Kerr:Well, I love it. I have been an avid follower of your work for many, many, many years. I'm thrilled that we get a chance to talk about how you've created some of these really iconic looks from everything from literally last night all the way back to the early 2000s. So we're going to talk about some of that, including the Actor Awards, the artist formerly known as SAGS. And you did an incredible look on Kirsten Dunst. Could you talk a little bit about that eye and how you came to it? Because she was wearing Kate, right? She was wearing Kate. Beautiful black gown. Beautiful black gown. So the eye that I'm wearing right now is the same eye that Kirsten wore, lip a little different.

3:51I was looking at pictures of Kirsten and some favorite like red carpet moments. And there was one that really stood out where her eye was a little bit sooty. And the lip was like her color just brought up a little bit. I loved this one particular red carpet where she had a bit of eye and a little bit of lip. And it felt like very her. And it didn't feel like it would be too far of a departure. Sure. Just, you know, the dress also in no way read 20s or 30s, but it also it could use a little bit of something something. Yeah. And with her hair up really like kind of simple in a knot with a big velvet bow, she just kept saying she felt like herself.

4:29And like, that's all I want is for someone to feel like the best version of themselves.

4:35Hillary Kerr:Yeah. I mean, it was like iconic Kiki. It's iconic Kiki. Right. That's exactly what you know, what you want. Yeah. She can take a lot of different looks. Yeah. But that like that like eye that feels a little lived in, a little rock and roll. Yes. I mean, that's really that's the Kiki I love so much. Yes. So tell me, like, what are the key products or key techniques to achieving that eye similar to the one that you have on right now? Yes. So what I did was I used a creamy Rouge Noir Chanel, creamy pencil. Like so it's not it's like more like a thicker pencil. Like a crayon almost? It's almost a crayon.

5:13Exactly. It's the Stilo-y contour range. And it's a little bit purple. So I put that in the waterline and along the lash lines and then blended, blended, blended to create this like base. Do you blend with fingers or with a brush? I use a brush. On myself, I use my finger a little bit, but on someone else, I'll use a brush. And then I used like a matte kind of a stone color to then frame the eye some more. So matte stone. So it's all felt very kind of cool tones. Blended a lot of that matte shadow around to start blurring and blurring and blurring out the eye. And then a tiny little bit of like a stone color, but had it like light velvet shimmer in the center.

5:54Lots of mascara. Easy peasy. That is easy. It is easy. It can be very easy. You know, it doesn't have to take hours. I love that.

6:02Hillary Kerr:When you're doing a eye like that, how do you balance the lip so that it feels like there is balance and that's harmonious, but they're not pulling focus from each other? Yeah. I mean, sometimes you like really underplay the lip. So the eyes really stand out. But with this particular look for Kirsten, it was like she wanted the lip to look like her lip color. And when you like kind of rub lip balm and then rub it off on her lip color, there are a little bit like tone to it. It's not paled out. It's kind of got like a rosy quality. So I used a rosy tone, but matte and kind of pressed into the lip.

6:36Hillary Kerr:It's almost off, but it's still there. Exactly. Got it. It's like it's... Again, a little lived in almost. Exactly. Thank you. Like she'd been smooching in the car. Exactly. Exactly. Not perfectly like on there that it feels untouchable. I loved it. Well, it was a phenomenal look. Thank you. She's consistently great. The two of you do wonderful work together, but I loved it. It's been a long time we've worked together. It's been 22, 23 years. Once you know someone, you kind of know what works. And it's just, it's comfortable. It feels like family. Yeah. Yeah. Well, speaking of which, there's another one of your clients that I wanted to talk about at some length.

7:14Hillary Kerr:The one and only Margot Robbie. I want us to talk about Barbie. But first, Wuthering Heights. because I just really feel like your work together for these last two press tours in particular is a master class in just really understanding the character, in putting together a phenomenal press tour. My first question is, when you are starting out with a press tour, how do you start putting together what the looks overall? Because it is a significant number of dates. Yeah. These are world tours with many, many, many events. I was just going to say. So like the travel involved, I definitely want to consolidate my kit.

7:53Oh, God. You know, because just traveling the world, I don't want 100 pounds of makeup. Of course, there's so many references to Barbie to, you know, be inspired by clothing wise and whatever, whatever. But it was also like, you know, not the Barbie of the 50s, 60s, 70s where, you know, she had the blue eyeshadow per se. It was like, who's Barbie now? My wheelhouse was really about my color palettes that I kept and traveled with. And it was every shade of pink you can imagine. But then also like some coral. There was lavender in the mix and there were some reds. My wheelhouse of color is like kind of my foundational important piece.

8:35And then it's just looking at like what is the day? What is she wearing? What is the event?

8:39Hillary Kerr:Are you planned out for like every step along the way or is it more go with the flow depending on the day to some extent? For makeup, it's go with the flow. Interesting. For the big premieres, it's thinking about it a little bit more. But like for the day events, big photo calls, I don't want to over plan because then like what if there's a change? Then my plans are all, then I'm confused, you know? So when you're thinking about a tour, do you ever give yourself, aside from like, these are the products I'm going to take with me because it's a tour or this is the color palette that I'm working in.

9:12Hillary Kerr:Do you ever set any other rules for yourself? For Wuthering Heights, the look was very much inspired by her character in the film. Yeah. Which when we started the press, I hadn't seen the film. Oh. So no, I didn't see the film until the world premiere in L.A. Oh, my gosh. So. How do you plan? Well, you know, luckily, luckily I was shown some photographs from like, you know, they're, you know, some photographs that are sneaky peekies and conversations because Margot lived in, you know, that character. So, you know, she told me about what the choices they made in the character and and that she, you know, really wanted to lean into that.

9:53And so from there, then I just, you know, imagined what it would be like to be in the windswept on the moors on the moors. Exactly. And, you know, what would that what would the skin look like in that? The skin of longing. Oh, yeah, for sure. And then I saw the film at the L.A. premiere, as I said, and I was sitting next to Nana, who is Margo's makeup artist on set, who is her personal makeup artist, who did that incredible makeup on the screen. And I'm holding her hand, gripping her hand like, oh, my God. and that inspired me for the rest of the tour because then from there there were things I noticed that nana did choices that she made that I was like oh I maybe will incorporate red eyeshadow you know just a little tiny bit somewhere I'll bring that with me just in case it was very intentionally like an underdone eye and a windswept feeling you know blush being important obviously and then the lip looking like it belongs what are some of the products that are

10:59Hillary Kerr:important for an understated eye like is it are you still using product or is it just like concealer on the lid no i definitely use product okay tell me oh oh here comes the kit here comes the reveal so a couple of the things that i relied upon well here i want to show you for the freckles I used, you know, Christy Stryker. Oh, yeah. KS &Co. I used her pen. Her eyebrow pen. Her freckles. I love it. Yeah, that was that. It looks like she's wearing no mascara most of the time. But I did use mascara. But I used colored mascara. Oh. I used gray. Gray? Or taupe mascara. Oh, okay. Oh, my God. I'm obsessed with like, you know, when you say colored mascara, people think like, oh, blue or purple.

11:44Exactly. No. No. Gray mascara. Interesting. So gorgeous.

11:48Hillary Kerr:Oh, that is pretty. So that was on the lashes. Because the lash needs to have a little something. Yeah. So it's not too bare. You know, for editorial, you can, like, go with the nothing. But, like, for press, you want a little something. But I didn't want it to feel dark and overpowering. And then, like, on the lid, I would use, like, again, this is a Chanel Stilo contour. Is that the crayon? This is the nude one. So the lid would always have that kind of a nude base and then, like, a taupe. but indetectable. Okay. And then like a flash of like a matte shadow that was a really soft kind of tone that looks like flesh.

12:25The cheek. Yeah. Talk to me about the cheek. Yeah, this is sold out everywhere. Did you sell this out? I mean, it's sold out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just take it, take it. I wasn't the only one to talk about it.

12:36Hillary Kerr:What colors that our audience knows where to waitlist themselves? Well, this was the Berry Boost, which is Gorge. But then I brought a couple, because I didn't only use that one. Okay. I used some other ones. I used this Mario one. This one was really cool. This, like, red, what is that called? Pomegranate. Okay. Love. Okay. And then there was another Mario one that I used a lot. Dusty Rose. I used that one a lot. That's when, like, it was, like, not as, like, intensely blushed. Yeah. And it was softer blushed. And then the lips were, you know, in that wheelhouse of, like, looking like a lip color.

13:09Brought up a little bit.

13:11Hillary Kerr:It's like that. Easy peasy. Talk to me about the blush placement and the blush application. It's not high on the top of the cheekbone because there would be a little bit of a highlight on the top of the cheekbone just so the cheekbones would pop out. But yeah, it's like it's not just the apples of the cheek. It's like the apple of the cheek and then swept aside and then maybe a touch across the bridge of the nose. So I would apply with my fingertips. And then I would use various brushes to blend and blend and blend. and then concealer foundation brushes to contain. Yep. And then blend some more.

13:48And it was just a lot of blending to get it to just be visible enough, but not overbearing. You know, one of my big fears in this blushing of it all, the blushing trend is that people are walking around looking like crazy that they have too much blush on. They call it blush blindness. Blush blindness. Yeah. I hope to not be contributing to that. I think that everyone could try to kind of like blend their blush out a little bit and think about it's not thinking dolly. It's thinking like doll. It's thinking more like weather. So just like you would like if you were doing a bronzy look, you would kind of like do that.

14:26Like the sun hit you, but you turned bronze. This is like the sun hit you, but you didn't turn bronze yet. Yeah. You're just like flushed from whatever activity. From running.

14:37Hillary Kerr:Running. or whatever other activity you've been participating in. One of the things that I love about your Instagram account as well is the fact that you have such amazing, amazing tutorials and you really bring people into the techniques and demystifying it so that they can create some of these incredible and iconic looks at home. What are some of the key building blocks that everyone should know about their own makeup before they necessarily move on to more complicated things? Right. You're putting on a mask that you want people to react to. That's what doing makeup is. How do you want people to react?

15:14So really thinking about it like that, like, you know, yeah, you want to look like you want to do this something that's really like intense and tough, but knowing that you're going to elicit a reaction. And is that what you want? interesting it's so it's like that's the psychology of like you know putting on makeup a little bit more think about your audience as you think about your what also makes you happy some people don't care about the audience and just want to make themselves happy great okay i appreciate that

15:46Hillary Kerr:of all of the barbie looks and there were so many iconic ones do you have favorites the london premiere where she's wearing the vivian westwood and there's pearls and that one was all about a lash. You know, I don't love false lashes, but I understand when they can really make something wow. Yep. And that was one occasion where those false lashes really like made it a wow factor. And there was no like liner to connect the lashes. It was very like almost like clean and lash. Yeah. Yeah. So that was that was that was definitely a favorite. So I also want to talk about some of your incredibly creative, iconic looks that you have done over the years.

16:32Hillary Kerr:Knowing our audience, they will kill me if I don't ask you about the cover of Circus, Britney Spears' album in 2008. Oh, that was, I love that one so much. That was just like classic Britney. Warm, smoky eye and a pale, glossy lip and just make her look expensive. There's this like VizArt neutral palette that I have used for so many years. Now I use some of the Mario matte palettes, but the VisArt probably was that. And I won't remember anything else. I also think it's interesting in looking back, you use blue sparingly, but when you do, you do it in such like a really incredibly interesting way.

17:11Hillary Kerr:Like there's a Lily Collins moment. There's a Priyanka moment. But my favorite is when you gave Kate Bosworth this incredible slash of almost turquoise at the Met Gala in 2008 when she went with Chanel. Karl Lagerfeld was her date. And she was wearing that like sequin, colorful. Stained glass almost. And the theme of that Met Gala was superheroes. So I wanted her to look like a superhero. So a superhero has like. Something graphic. A strong graphic turquoise blue matte eye. Is it just like the same depth all the way across? That one was pretty monochromatic. I think it was like very dense and matte.

17:56So it would read strong and graphic instead of having any shimmer or anything.

18:01Hillary Kerr:I loved it. Yeah, I want to dive in and find some of those images. Yeah. Okay, I also want to talk about the Mary-Kate and Ashley Olsen Got Milk ad from 2004. Annie Leibovitz. Yes. I know that you did a tutorial at some point of an eye that I think you probably get questions about to this day. People still talk about. Everyone still wears that eye. It's the same. What is it? Tell me about it. I mean, it's just like using like a pencil, whether it's a cool brown or a warm brown, smudging it really like deeply into the lash line and then giving it some blend and then sculpting the eye with like a matte shadow that's not too heavy.

18:44And that was very them, you know. and it's like it's it's forever yeah I love that I mean I think that might have been the first day I worked with them are you serious I am serious yeah got milk was the first day I worked with

18:58Hillary Kerr:them talk to me a little bit about Y2K makeup talk to me about the late 90s like why do you think that look is having a moment again I mean similar to Mary Kate and Ashley it's like you know just like that perfect like blend of a pencil to smudge and frame the eye it's nothing too glittery. It's just like it all feels kind of lived in. Relax. Not so complicated. You know, just like that, there's like a healthiness to the skin and there's not this like kind of so much makeup that you're losing the person. Yeah. I also want to ask because we are approaching bridal season and we have a whole new crop of brides who are thinking about bridal makeup.

19:36Hillary Kerr:You did one of the most important bridal looks of recent years, which was Sophia Ritchie, now Sophia Ritchie range. So can you give us any key tips or tricks or things that brides should think about or ask for for flawless bridal makeup? Well, first of all, you want timelessness. Makeup can be timeless. You know, you're not wanting to like kind of have a trend stamp on a bridal look. You'll regret that. Definitely the health and well-being of your body, mind and spirit leading up to a wedding will enhance the beauty of the day for sure. It's not just about like only getting facials. It's like, is your mind well?

20:14Are you breathing? Like all of those things, because all of that shows on the skin. Some people think like it's a special day, so they want to like do all the things. Yeah. You don't have to do all the things for special occasions. And I think that that's where like a lot of our red carpets moments, like of late really show people that like you can have a beautiful softness for an important event. and it will be forever beautiful.