Episode 197: Amy Lee

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1:56Sophie Ellis-Bextor: hello i'm sophia de spexter and welcome to spinning plates the podcast where i speak to busy working women who also happen to be mothers about how they make it all work i'm a singer and i've released eight albums in between having my five sons aged between seven years old and nearly 22 so I spin a few plates myself. Being a mother can be the most amazing thing but it can also be hard to find time for yourself and your own ambitions. I want to be a little bit nosy and see how other people balance everything. Welcome to Spinning Plates. Can you hear me kicking up the leaves? I'm walking home from school and autumn is in full pelt.

2:38Sophie Ellis-Bextor: I have to say I absolutely love the colours this time of year. So pretty. I have noticed it's getting quite cold though. So this week's episode, I'm determined not to ramble so much as usual. Although look, hey, you must be able to, I suppose you can just flick through this bit, right? Just be like, oh, it's that bit where she just chats a load of rubbish before the episode starts.

3:08Sophie Ellis-Bextor: um i this week's episode is a lovely guest actually amy lee uh lead singer of evanescence and i was so fascinated to talk to her you know how much i love talking to other singers uh amy's got a beautiful voice a lot of power in there but also a story to tell and so it was glorious to really talk to Amy about her relationship with music and singing and how it's entwined with a visible and safe space to explore her relationship with grief. She lost her little sister when she was only a little girl herself and her sister died when she was only three and Amy was six and her parents could see that music became a safe place to be the full messy hugeness of loss and grief sadness yes but also love so much love because by grieving that's how amy is also her sister sister it's also how she channels her grief for her brother she lost her brother as well a few years back and she talks about that in our conversation and how he's still present and how his humor has lived on through her kids uh through her kid i should say she has a son uh he is same age as my fourth uh so he is 11 turning 12 and i want to thank amy as well not just for being so open and so lovely and easy to talk to but also for the fact that she allows me the space to talk to me on a level with music despite the fact that Evanescence have sold so many more records than I ever have I um it's funny because I was chatting to her about everything and then after I hung up from our conversation I thought oh you know I'm just to remind myself how many albums Evanescence have sold.

5:20Sophie Ellis-Bextor: It's 31 million. 31 million albums. That's a large figure. They brought out an album called Sanctuary not long ago, early this year, and they've been touring that record. And yeah, times are good, times are interesting. This is Amy, and I will see you on the other side.

5:49Sophie Ellis-Bextor: so this is our home studio so love it just the other side of this of the of the door there's um a door into like the kitchen where my kids are about to have supper um but it's nice and it's nice and quiet in here mine's like mine's above the garage and i have always had like a dark vibey you know red or black whatever like studio room and finally a few years ago i was like i need to be in here a lot and i'm in a cave too much like it like drains my energy somehow and like i'm gonna make everything white i'm gonna do the opposite of what i've always done and just like have light from the outside come in and be able to have the windows open and feel like i'm not like completely disconnected from the world and my family when i'm in here because i'll be in here for like you know six hours and then you're like i'm just a troll yeah it can't make make you feel a dark yeah totally i'm not you know no insult your studio looks way cooler than mine but i'm explaining why mine doesn't look like the gothic um basement dungeon that you would expect from me i don't know what i expect did you write a lot of sanctuary in there yeah um this is a new room but um yeah on this gear and and in my house yeah hey well whatever you're doing it's working um and congratulations on your sixth album and i gather i'm talking to you in between bits of your touring um so have you been fine you've just been in europe right yeah just got back like uh almost a week ago so less less than a week it was great yeah and i bet um when i was listening to the album i just think it's so built for live it's so powerful such a broad landscape it's got a really arching horizon and i thought god it must be so fun to do it live it has been and i feel like we all just had a really special feeling about this music and this album um and just went for it for the live production too it's like you know what let's actually create this visually let's like take it all the way bring in the effects and the huge like screens and the pyro elements and the confetti and just like make it the biggest coolest total sanctuary from the shit show like Let's have this moment be the release that we feel, you know, when we listen to the album.

8:15So it's been such a beautiful thing to be up there every night and just like living in it.

8:21Sophie Ellis-Bextor: That's so cool. And you know what I really hear in your voice when I've been listening to lots of interviews you've been doing? I feel like you've got so much energy and positivity around your work. and I wondered if you feel like because I found as an artist in my 40s that this is such a powerful time like I've absolutely been loving this decade yeah me too and I wondered if if you've got that feeling where things feel almost like the most exciting the most powerful that they felt I do I really do and you can't like predict or expect that you just can't that's not we've been trained to believe.

9:02Also, life can bring anything your way at any moment. Like, there's going to be chapters that feel excruciating and exhausting. And there's going to be chapters that feel so victorious. And I think if you just know that life is going to keep on lifing, and you never know what's around the corner, and look at that in a positive way, but also just in way of like hey like i am more yolo at this point in my life than i ever have been like who knows what's happening next like we are going for it all the way now let's go let's do this um because i in my heart like at least in in the music and in the band and in what we've been able um to be a part of with fans around the world like to bring in people joy like the feeling of that right now which is honestly bigger than it's ever been i know that's not forever and i'm like i know that it won't be this moment of like wow cool forever so it's like we need to live in the moment like we need to look up from our phones and we need to keep creating we need to make the next music video like the best one ever you know because there's going to be another time where for one reason or another you know eventually we can't do it we can't do it this way you know or or something else you know whatever life whatever life brings your way so yeah it's true and I

10:24Sophie Ellis-Bextor: think there's something about the serendipity of you know look you it's obvious that whatever you get out of music the kernel of it has been there that's part of what who you are that's not something you know that's like a channel you have to have that release that catharsis that escape yes but then as you get older and have the experience of time that builds up, there's an unexpected power in those foundations being so solid. Yeah. Yeah. So true. Yes. Yeah. And the ability to see it all like you see it all and recognize the big picture of life and go, wow, I'm so lucky to get to do this today.

11:04Exactly. Look at it like that.

11:06Sophie Ellis-Bextor: Yeah. It's really it's a lovely feeling. It's a lot more energizing and I think also you know I I don't know for how far ahead that stamina continues but it's been a lot more juicy than I was expecting yeah same same and I'm very um jealous of the fact that it sounds like your little boy who's been coming on tour with you actually really enjoys watching your I can't get my children to watch my shows Amy All of them? None of them? They've had, like, moments. But as I was reading you talk about a little boy, Jack, who is 11. Is that right? He's 12 now. He's 12 now. Okay, happy birthday, Jack. Well, so I've got some kids that are on either side of him, so I've got a 14 and a 10.

11:56Sophie Ellis-Bextor: And, yeah, they're just, the excitement of watching me do what I do is just sort of over, I think. for the time being maybe they'll come back but it sounds like jack is really really into it and comes and sits down and and loves it well he kind of hit a place a few like just kind of recent like a couple years ago where it like he's always been around this like we took him on tour when he was a baby like it was actually easier before school really started because there was nowhere for him to be and he was little just like come on do this and bathe you in the cooler um so since before he can remember he's been around it so in the beginning you know it's like it was fun it was great it was his life but it wasn't like he thought it was special does that make sense and then he hit this kind of place a couple years ago where it hit him like oh my mom is a big shot famous rock star and that is cool and like the like kids in his class like started to know who i was very funny because i'm pretty i mean fairly active at school like i will go you know i would be there at the halloween parade i'm going to the like the the stupid like parents come like fun day activity community night junk so uh there have definitely been there were these funny moments like just really a couple years ago where like his friends know so they're like hi amy hi amy lee like i'm i have to do the thing where it's my turn to grab the baton and like run and i was absolutely dying in this particular activity running around the center and the one kid he was totally heckling me too it wasn't it was like yeah he thinks it's cool but he's also kind of making fun of me low key and he's like evanescence evanescence go evanescence i'm like you little son of a i can't look like i'm out of breath now like i have to like make it cool and like i literally just like ran my head off and after it was over i stood there cool for a minute and i just sort of slowly phased over towards the bushes and had to like sit down by myself and like pull it together so it's like but he's so proud of me like because he gets what it is and he does think it's cool i think part of it's the fact that it's kind of metal you know it's kind of yeah you know darkness and touring with metallica doesn't hurt like it's cool to a little boy kind of music yeah so he he thinks it's cool because he's also at that age where he's he's deciding like he's a rock kid like he said i'm into rock like i want to play guitar like this is the kind of music that i'm into so at least for the moment he's super in and like proud of me and brags on it and stuff which is hilarious it's like i had to get past the embarrassment of like that like when we meet his new teacher it's like by the way i don't know if you know my mom is she's the lead of this cool band called Evanescence.

14:44Have you heard of that? And they're like, yeah, I've heard of that. And I'm like, at first it's embarrassing, but then I have to like, don't look embarrassed and be like, yeah, mm-hmm. That's definitely sweet.

14:54Sophie Ellis-Bextor: That's definitely lovely. It's precious. I'm sure there will be a day when it's not like that. There will have to be a day. I don't know about that, because actually now we're talking it through, I'm thinking, you know, look, if you take a young person where music speaks to their core, then the genre that speaks to you is definitely something that will pass down. I mean, it's such an instinctive thing, isn't it? I know what you mean. It's so healthy to allow all of that out. My dad's type music definitely got into my head and is sweet and nostalgic to me. Yes, well, I'm really intrigued in the relationship you have with your music because I've been thinking a lot about it.

15:37Sophie Ellis-Bextor: And firstly, I think the fact that this album's called Sanctuary couldn't be more perfect, actually. And I'm surprised in a way it's album six that has that title, because to me, this sort of sacred space of what it provides and what it celebrates, you know, what it offers in terms of protection and channeling and community and preserving that space and giving it the validity. It's like, it's so, to me, when I hear you sing, that's what I'm getting as well as a listener. So I think that's really powerful. And I've also been so intrigued in the world that's created in that landscape and how when you were first experiencing, you know, the first big flush of success, I know that, you know, you've been making music since you were just, you know, barely into double figures.

16:25Sophie Ellis-Bextor: But when it kind of went global and you felt like you almost had this sort of caricature of your front woman status. And I was really thinking about that and about how it's interesting, especially. And I do. I hope it's OK. I know this is your lived experience. So I say this completely respectfully and full of love. But I think if you've grown up with the childhood that's got an accompaniment of grief and the absolute sadness of that, then having this space that can give you that world and acknowledge that you need to let it out and not need to make it palatable all the time, but have that fullness.

17:08Sophie Ellis-Bextor: I was thinking maybe knowing that about you tells me a lot about you, just as a first thing to know. That's beautiful. Thank you. Well, I hope I've kind of worked it out accurately. Yes, I'm sorry. I was just listening. Yeah, exactly. I relate to that very much. I think that grief is really the first thing that made me make music, like in a serious way. Like I've always loved music. I grew up around music, my family's musical. um but in a way that was me creating um poetry and music and and art like just drawing painting sketching like I was into that world big when I was a kid too um just any outlet to like create and it doesn't need to be and can't be really just like a rainbow like make something that but expressing, you know, somehow expressing.

18:09And I did feel the freedom to express myself as a kid. My parents, like, were good parents. They encouraged that. Would ask questions at times, like, why is this scary, you know? Yeah. But, like, recognizing that that channel and that outlet was really good for me. And I wasn't, you know, a super tormented person growing up. I was both I was balanced you know yeah because I always felt like having an outlet I don't know it it drove me and finding finding this specifically like evanescence honestly like my band and the idea of it and whatever we were doing as a teenager like that was so good for me to have yeah because then I became obsessed with it like it was just this complete obsession you know how it just like takes this beautiful place in your heart it's like falling in love and and it's it keeps going like we can keep keep playing with it keep going to that world keep building it keep expanding it you know um it gives me a ton of joy yeah yeah and look what it does for other

19:19Sophie Ellis-Bextor: people as well you know this is um this is part of what it is to be human and for people listening you know just that you know I'm a mother of five um my heart really uh was hurting when I was uh you know understanding when you were only so small and you lost your little sister the magnitude of that and as you say good parenting from your folks to understand that you needed some place to put all of that that could actually keep it in the visible because yeah I've actually been reading a book at the moment um it's a comedian she's called rosebud baker and she came from a really one of the snl writers okay she's yeah and she's um she's uh from a big family and they were very republican very uh conservative and she too lost her sister when she was little and her grief was sort of not really dealt with so she became this very messy very reckless person and she's very open about a book and actually quite funny about it too but I think it's it's such a thing that they could see the value and the freedom of it because if something has been such a it's not even just such a fundamental part of your childhood it's also your relationship with a sibling it forms like a keystone of how you love it's entwined from the get-go yeah the two things mean the same in your in your heart right so giving those things space and then i don't know i think over time there's such a gift to the empathy that follows from being able to understand your heart in that way and if you're an artist a creative person then being able to be open to the human condition on that way is probably exactly why you've been able to do what you do for so long because you've become, you've learned it, you've got the wisdom of it from when you weren't even double figures.

21:21Yeah, but so, I mean, it just feels like the most relatable thing. Like at this age, at this age, most people I feel like have touched it.

21:32Sophie Ellis-Bextor: Yeah, absolutely. Like have been through something in their life that they've had to experience death on some level. Absolutely. And it feels, I don't know, like there is so much love in grief like to grieve someone is to love them as to not forget like i don't want to lose the memories of my brother or my sister like so i'm going to keep talking about them and i'm going to keep diving into all the parts of it not just focused on the sadness of their loss but like on who they were as people and it does bring some sad feelings to remember just because we can't have them now you know but but like the memory that puts love in my heart every time like to talk to jack about his uncle who he only knew for a few years and um to talk to my sisters we have a little i have two sisters um and we have a text chain sort of between us that's just for like if there's anything we ever would have texted robbie we texted to each other like on a little group thing and it's just I mean he was all comedy my bro like so it's this just a certain brand of dry humor usually that's pretty hilarious so in that way it's like it feels like he's still on the texts like it's like we're still you remember him I remember him like let's let's always still go back there yeah and I'm I'm very aware that when people are gone um you don't want to just talk about the fact they're not here you know no their life is about you know the time that they were here on planet earth and how they existed and how they affected everybody and that makes total sense to me and it's also exactly the way that my family um have dealt with loss too so i i totally get that and it's funny only on the way to school this morning i was talking about it with the kids because they were thinking you know why do people have to die you know it's yeah it's one of the hardest things when your little person starts to understand that it's like it's like i wish they didn't we all wish that that's part of what makes us human but that's yeah that's just life and as a mother how how have you navigated having your son go through these ages because that brings with it its own thing too for sure um yeah he's right at those crossroads like between being a kid and being an adult like just beginning like he'll be 13 next year so there's a lot a lot of just this I think the struggle too I think right now of like self-awareness like you just I remember god hating being 12 13 like suddenly comparing myself a lot to other people and like just seeing through a lens of criticism that you don't think like that when you're a kid.

24:20You're just free. So that's the part that I hate. I'm like, oh, don't lose your innocence. You're great, bro. Don't think about that stuff. It doesn't matter.

24:28Sophie Ellis-Bextor: Yeah, that is actually one of the hardest things for sure when they suddenly get this. And also as a parent, you know, the things that normally would soothe things away start to lose their magic touch. Not works. Like, yeah, you'd say anything because you're my mom. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So that part's hard. Yeah. but i think you know allowing him to grow up is important too so like letting him have some of those struggles and let it be okay and there isn't always a fix and also you know he's learning so much all the time like he'll hear a word and be like what does this mean and i really don't want to explain it but i will because if i don't like he's gonna figure it out from somebody else he already heard it somewhere it's like okay here's what this is and you know here's when you don't talk about it um but you know it's just it's just growing up and it's sweet it's it's a really really sweet thing we we're friends like i'm his mom but like we love hanging out together i like regressing i love doing creative kid stuff i love cartoons i've always loved animation so none of that's a problem for me it's gonna be hard we doesn't want to watch any of that stuff anymore like we'll go through and we had a we've had a big binge on uh oh now i'm gonna forget um one piece oh yeah one piece is brilliant so yeah so but it's my 10 year old read all those books he loves yeah one piece is big here too we got big into um the old avatar the last airbender from the and then uh we got into this and that's like his thing now and yeah um it's fun to be able to do that together and i really sometimes i have to remind myself like don't pull out my phone and like open up instagram wild because it's all about you're sharing an experience together if it's going to be watching something at least like watch it together uh but now more fun now i've been gone and that is really hard um he didn't come with me to europe um so there was a full month apart and i what my rule usually is like three weeks is the absolute max of a stretch like two is better like if we have to be away for two weeks okay then we have some kind of a time in the middle where we're together and then if i need to keep doing stuff um but like the u.s tour was cool because it was all in um summertime so he was on it almost the whole tour it was great he had a blast i mean that's adorable but then for europe it was the start of the school year so it's like he had just started school and i gotta go and that sucks and then i'm gone for like a solid the month because to pull him out right now i thought about it for a minute i could have brought him to like the last week be all jet lagged miss a bunch of stuff just to be dragged around between like four different countries you know um it's just was too much physically for honestly both of us because he's gonna be exhausted and we're sharing a bed and it's a whole thing no yeah it's really tough it's probably the hardest bit of what i do is when i have to leave the kids it is and i I think also because we get to do something we love, you feel like you're framing it like it's a choice, which obviously it is to a point.

27:36Sophie Ellis-Bextor: But I think they pick up on that sometimes, and then they're like, oh, well, then you could just say no. Yeah, you don't have to go. Exactly. I'm lucky that he is in a place, at least right now, where he's really, really proud of our new album. He listens to it and is excited for it and wants me to go on tour and play this amazing show my kids he's not gonna be like i'm telling myself this is not gonna be like this forever and i don't want to be gone like i don't want to be away for a whole month that was too long like i came home and i literally was like okay to my manager i was like so that was too long like as we look at like the next things we're booking we have to make sure that there's a week in the middle or something like that the timing of it isn't right now or whatever because that's just too long stretch but anyway all that said it was great and he was supportive about it but then I it's just not right it's like I missed a month of his life like how long his life we don't know like that's that's too long um so anyway for you than him actually and I think you know look you you love you love what you're doing but I think when you're on touring life each day is its own world isn't it especially if you're traveling from place to place to place so if you travel through a lot yeah five countries in a week it's not the same as him doing his Monday to Friday of school and then seeing his mates at the weekend you know i guess that's true i guess that's true differently it does move differently he he's just started a couple different clubs he likes to and like has things that he's into he wasn't sad but it's an adjustment when i come home yeah it's like hey i'm back and like also like i'm your mom and like don't talk to me that way or you gotta go to your room uh which is hard that's the hardest coming home and then like anything goes wrong it's like but uh now it's gonna be halloween and i'm here for halloween which i'm not always and uh i'm excited about that so we went to the store yesterday and bought like all this like like styrofoam rectangles and we're just like shaving off the tops and turning them into like tombstones we're turning the whole front of our yard into this awesome graveyard and he has been like writing all the catchphrases for the tombstones and uh they're really funny it's all just comedy it's just totally roasting people in the afterlife um amazing so we're just having fun yeah maybe got a little bit of his uncle drips through into that too exactly yeah yes that is one of the like texts to my sister is I was like um who wrote this but yeah having fun with that and like making the time that I that we are together now like really count like spending some good time like it sounds great facing each other yeah and making fun Cash Now More Later from Opendoor gives you cash up front for your home, plus all the profit later.

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32:35Sophie Ellis-Bextor: And what was going on with your career when you were having him then? Did you always want to be a mom? Did you find it easy to make space for it at the time? I did always want to be a mom. And I was happy for the break in the album cycle and tour thing. It kind of came at the end of a time that had been exhausting for a lot of reasons. in the band and with our behind the scenes management etc it was just kind of an exhausting time um and i don't know i was just like ready for a break anyway and it's like you know what i'm ready and i feel like in my heart when i went into okay i'm ready i want to be a mom now if that'll happen to me um i was ready to leave it all behind if that is the way that my heart felt what happened and I don't I don't know why I I kind of always imagined that's how it would be like I couldn't envision this I couldn't envision being able to put my whole self into my art the way I do it is an obsession um and be able to be a great and present mom like it just sounded like way overwhelming like that's too much to possibly do at the same time um but then i you know fortunately we did get pregnant and i was excited about that and going through that and during that time ended up in this really weird indie film score project with some friends and just felt super inspired and making music that didn't sound like anything i'd ever made and like just having fun with it i think it came out like the week after he was born oh wow and it was just like i wasn't expecting it it was sort of like well i don't have to tour this or anything it's just being creative and then of course you know i had jack um and it just it just the whole experience was so emotionally inspiring to me like i felt new feelings i felt deep big it's just such a huge moment in your life to make life you know and to see a baby human and and be in charge of it and i don't know all of those things that carry it in your body and feel like i felt like we i felt like we shared emotions um just to have that kind of a brand new experience like just set my mind into a blast of technicolor and new thoughts and new ideas and inspiration i couldn't help it like so like within i i didn't make music immediately like we're being parents staying up all night and exhausted and all that but like you know a year in um all the little silly songs that like my husband and i would like sing through the monday and tasks and we're just those kind of people started kind of turning into little catchy tunes and it was my dad's 60th birthday and my dad's a musician and loves kids teaches all of us kids to play some instrument teaches the neighborhood kids how to play the drums like he's that guy um and he'd like never been in a real recording studio and i remember hearing that and be like you haven't like to record he's like no and i was like that doesn't let's go make some kid songs you know like it'll be fun like i've got some ideas and my dad and my uncle it started out just the three of us went and had a little session um and it was really cute and then that expanded to like well why don't we get you know like my sisters and my brother you know get everybody in here um doing like vocals together and playing something and we made this really cool family kids record it's called dream too much um sort of like for jack but also like honoring my dad and like the guy that my dad the dad that my dad has always been for all of us kids um man that was so precious but it was like it came i guess like everything for me like has to come from an organic quest like let's do this because of these beautiful reasons and like lean all the way into music like none i've ever made before let's make kids fun like also what'll make jack laugh and what's cute like through the eyes of a child and also what what's fun things that we can do like with my with the three sisters voices harmonizing um family project but then that you know just a couple years later just i allowing myself to go down those roads just naturally like new music in the world of what would be evanescence like again like just start coming to me and I start craving it and there's a show offer and like, well, why don't we go do it?

37:21And guess what? The boots still fit. I don't know. You just realize that you don't stop being who you are. You're just like the next level version and you have to just work harder. Like I, you have to want it a lot, like always, but like, you just have to want it enough that you have the energy for both. And I mean, I saw your husband helping you set up the studio before we started. Like I I couldn't do it without him and all his help. He's back here with Jack while I was on that tour just now.

37:49Sophie Ellis-Bextor: Yeah, and I love the fact that with your project that was inspired by your new baby, but also a tribute to your own family life and the dynamic, and then it's given you this moment in time that probably gets more precious with every passing year. Totally. and I love the fact that it has dream in the title because so much of your work seems to be inspired by that sort of liminal space between asleep and awake yeah and how fruitful that that bit is yeah um and how liberating and it's lovely as well to have an artist who's so led by instinct everything you've done feels very intentional and not second guessing that well I think it's great I mean, not everybody is as free like that, actually.

38:37Sophie Ellis-Bextor: I think some people get very caught up in, I don't know, what they think the expectation is, and they lose the joy. But look how it sustains you if you just bother to be selfish about it. Yeah. It's important to be selfish. And ultimately, I do think, you know, look, that makes you the mum you are too. You know, it all feeds into it. And you can't really extricate one from the other. they all become part of the same thing. Totally. I was thinking when you said the word quest, how I've become very invested in you doing this Zelda soundtrack. You really know me. Well, yeah. I mean, listen, if you consolidated my notes, there'd be three things on it probably.

39:22Sophie Ellis-Bextor: Zelda, Bjork, and Cats. And I'm wearing a Bjork shirt right now. There she is. Oh, that's sweet. What a great album that is. Yes. I mean, I absolutely love Bjork as well. That's awesome. Big inspiration for me. Oh, I bet you do. That makes sense. Yeah, but just someone so themselves. Completely. Such an intense, you know, flavor of Bjork with everything she does. But also the voice. I mean, they're ridiculous talents. That's right. But then your talent too, Amy. I mean, goodness. How do you look after your voice? Do you do vocal rest? Like full vocal rest? I feel like that has become more and more important in my routine.

40:00like on tour um and like why at least being out there without the family can be helpful for the singing because i feel like having it we have our show it's intense it's an hour and 40 minutes um and it's non-stop and it's great and we got it but then what i want to do when i step off stage is go yeah and turn up the music backstage and have a little bit too much wine and everybody talk really loud and i you can't say no i can't have that anymore but you have to limit it big time so it's like all right i can have one glass of wine and talk to everybody and hang out about the show for 30 minutes yeah and then i gotta go to the bus yeah it is is talking and singing and because as hilarious as it is like i i love my band like we're our friends uh lifelong friends who enjoy being together so it's really hard when you're in this moment where you just did some really cool amazing thing with your friends in another country and we're all together and there we are like come on we want to like crank up the tunes and sing like that's that's how we hang out like we're laughing and joking and singing and like eating chips

41:23but anyway so i have to limit that more than i want to um and make an effort to just go be quiet in my bunk or like go to bed uh sometimes but then kind of scheduled in my head of like okay like we have a show this night but then the next day is day off and if i that's the one i can have time tonight to hang out as long as I'm not out of control you know as long as we keep it cool and then and then I'll have to just really be good the whole next day no drinking tea I'll drink tea all day um I'll kind of stay in my room and do homework maybe go to the gym um and just be really mindful and then the day of the show too you know we used to do a sound check meet and greet um all that stuff we don't do that anymore and i know i know that that's a bummer a little bit like to some fans like that we can't organize like a meetup like and but honestly not having to sing and talk at like three or four o 'clock and then get back up on stage at like nine o 'clock yeah and do it again even though it was short it's still like this intense high energy full volume hour in the middle of the day by eliminating that and really having the day up until the show be quiet you know not silent but you know quiet and mindful and tea drinking and soup for lunch like yeah just keep it steady yeah just gotta be you know it's a balance it's all a balance because the truth is all that said you have to feed your soul like it's true if you completely deny yourself everything that makes it joyful and fun and any celebration then that's not the right thing either because your voice ultimately comes from your soul that's where it all comes from so you have

43:12Sophie Ellis-Bextor: to feed that too the energy and the adrenaline of just coming off stage and you need a little bit of the punctuation a little bit of steam yeah exactly so it's a balance it's just a balance yes yeah i think um i've done it before as well when you'll do the sound check with people there and then you get a bit, oh, this feels quite nice, actually, and you slightly overdo it. Do too much. Yeah, basically give them a proper gig. Well, how am I going to soundcheck half-ass? These people are coming in there like, oh, my God, there she is. I'm going to not do it all the way. Of course I'm going to do it all the way.

43:45I don't care if there's 10 people. Yeah, I know.

43:50Sophie Ellis-Bextor: Amy, I know you have the re-release of your second album coming up as well on vinyl. So that's 20 years. Yeah. How do you feel about the passing of time and how it is now to look back over a properly long career? That's a big question. To feel really proud. And I definitely feel like, I think about, that album is special for a lot of reasons, but I think about the whole thing starting. Fallen came out when I was 21. Um, and it was so much so fast and I was too young to fully appreciate it. Like I appreciated it. We were winning Grammys and stuff, but I couldn't fully appreciate it. Like it hadn't been hard enough yet.

44:44I don't know how to explain that, but like we just didn't have enough road behind us. We just kind of formed a band and it was one of those things where it's just all happened really, really fast. And I feel like so much of my career has been in the aftermath of that moment and like what what to do with that gift, you know, and and going through plenty of like ups and downs of like what level we're at for a certain moment in time and never like expecting a really big mountain climb like to this point at this time in my career. um so like the reception the new album is having and the way that these shows have been in this moment um i am able to all of us i would say this for every one of us we're able to appreciate that in a way that is like so beautiful i fully get it like i fully get it fully know the work that we put in but know how much you can't no matter how hard you work expect it and our plan for it it's just one of those things like we're we're really really blessed like really lucky and it's just cool because i feel like i feel like there is there is some higher purpose in it because we make people happy it's the best job in the world to go make so many people happy every night because it makes me happy just making the music and listen to it back totally makes me happy but it makes me so much more happy to see it and know that it exists in other people's lives that I don't even know and it gives them some amount of joy in a dark world you know like just a little tiny spark of light and it took you know people and time and thought and money and work to like make all that happen and it all just feels totally worth it yeah so yeah I just appreciate

46:45Sophie Ellis-Bextor: Yeah, no, I totally, well, you can hear it when you speak about what you do, and it's present in the music and in this album. And I also think when you start out, your first album, second album, there's so much pressure around it that the album's success also means, okay, now we get to make another one. Yeah, we get to continue. Yeah, so you're setting out your stall. So actually, there's, in a way, you can't really, it's not like you can kick back and go, yay, you know, pass around the cigars. It's like you're too in the doing and you're thinking, okay, we've had that. How do we follow that up?

47:18Sophie Ellis-Bextor: What happens next? What's the next bit of this trail or the Jacob's ladder or whatever it may be? So I think when you get to this point where, you know, you know your work as an artist, that's secure. That's not going to go anywhere. You'll be singing until the end of your days. So it's more just about, oh, now this has become powerful. And as you say, that sort of lovely feeling of like what you take from it, Like what it means to you and how it makes you feel better and recalibrates you and, you know, makes your veins feel good and powerful. It's like, that's really like, OK, I get it now. Yeah.

47:52Sophie Ellis-Bextor: And I get when I get plugged into that board, you know, when you're on stage. Good way to put it. Yeah. It's how it feels. And I think as well, I don't know how you'll feel about this, but when I was listening to you talk about a lot of things, I was thinking you talk in quite a humanist way, I think, because it's about the significance. and the legacy of art and how the people you happen to be sharing the planet with at the time when you're here is of such significance and there's such beauty and all trying to connect and unite and find those common themes. Like what a rich source of inspiration, you know?

48:27Sophie Ellis-Bextor: Completely. Completely. Yeah, it's kind of lovely. Well, it's exciting. And I wish I could come over to America and see you. I'd love to see the gigs. I know. I wish you could have seen me when I was just over in your neck of the woods. I know. Well, I just finished my bit of touring. I've been whipping around. I've realized, by the way, that part of the reason, when you sing about Jack listening to your album, I was thinking maybe I built a tiny wall between me and my young sons by calling my last album Perry Menopop. It's not like... Like, Mom, I'm not allowed to like that. What do you expect?

49:04Sophie Ellis-Bextor: With headphones on, what are you listening to over there? oh yeah I'm 17 and it's a new album called Perry Menopop it's not it's not I'm basically paying to them out of the target demographic yeah yeah well you got time you got time the next you know the pendulum swings both ways yeah so the next one's gonna be your metal project yeah there we go um how are your cats I have three cats do you still have two cats we have two oh my god they're so cute I wish they would come in here right now um yeah I got a big giant gray Maine Coon. Oh, I love Maine Coons. I'm a bit obsessed with them, actually.

49:38Me too. I'm a Maine Coon girl. We had a Maine Coon before him.

49:41Sophie Ellis-Bextor: And you have to have a special size cat flap. Do you let them out? You know what? No, but we have a little screened in porch that they're obsessed with now because they're not really out, but it's like they're out. Are they supposed to go out? Maybe they're not supposed to go out. I don't want them to. His hair, I mean, his fur is like six inches long. Like, I don't want him dragging around in the bushes and bringing that junk in and sleeping but he's beautiful what's he called uh simon simon yeah and then i got a little we have a little like for contrast a little tiny runt calico short hair kitty our name is so good actually i wonder this is a theme with main coons because the only other main coon i know is um a songwriter a friend of mine who's got one and he's called scott it's gone it should be a name you just gotta have these like very like human names Jennifer, come here exactly it's been such a joy to talk to you Amy and thank you for sharing all your wisdom and I'm so happy to see how I mean I know you're such a woman's woman as well so I was really looking forward to talking to you because it's lovely when someone's just got so much generosity about what they do but also is so enjoying the the sisterhood out there too yes ma 'am all the good stuff thank you for having me in though yeah i'm jealous as well but i need to get on the bloody styrofoam tombstone graveyard you know halloween you americans know how to do halloween take heart like this is not me every year we're doing this and we're setting up for the future because now they're going to be made and we're going to have this to just whip out well i might follow suit i think it sounds very cool i'd like i got some great slogan ideas for headstones my way perfect right well take care and good luck with the rest of the touring you too cheers amy thank you bye sophie

51:37Sophie Ellis-Bextor: ah thank you so much amy lee i'm going to keep this brief because it's sunday and i've just landed back at heathrow but i want to send amy all the best and hope that she had a great halloween i'm walking the wrong way jess sorry i'm walking out of heathrow and i'm going the wrong way because I'm talking to you yeah here's hoping that Amy and her partner Josh and their little boy Jack had a great Halloween here's a thank you to her for her generosity and her openness I really appreciated our chat and I loved hearing what music means to her and it's so clear what she gets from her work so I wish I were with the rest of the tour touring the Faber New Album Sanctuary in front of all those big big crowds and I'm heading home on Sunday now Richard is literally in the studio as I speak to you so he's waiting for this bit of the audio so he can finish the edit so thank you darling so I'm handling my homework in late again thanks to Claire for reducing the pod thanks to LMA for the artwork thanks to Richard for editing and his patience in waiting for me and he's on the middle of a tour as well feeling on the road at the moment so it's all systems go Jessie, my 11 year old and I have just landed back from Italy where I had a gig there last night.

52:54Sophie Ellis-Bextor: You know, family life, musician life. Have a wonderful week. I'll be back next week with another one. Take care. Thank you. Bye.

53:38We'll see you next time.

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55:11Here's a show we recommend. Previously on Sister Wives. Wait, didn't you hear Cody and Robin quit?

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