Why MasterChef Was the Perfect Storm for My Autism & ADHD | Vanessa D’Souza

0:00Talk to me about the MasterChef experience. Quite honestly, horrendous. Did you know that you were autistic and ADHD before going on MasterChef? I had my autism diagnosis a year before filming the show, but I had no understanding of what that actually meant for me. MasterChef UK semi-finalist Vanessa D'Souza stepped into one of television's toughest competitions. What happened behind the pressure, the competition, and the kitchen chaos is the story you haven't heard yet. What kinds of comments were you getting on social media? Awful comments. They don't see the amount of work that's needed to mask to show up.

0:36Society has made me mask so hard that my autism isn't apparent to most of the population. Were the judges understanding of your situation? I don't feel like they were supportive at all. If MasterChef was to ask you on today, would you go?

0:55talk to me about the master chef experience quite honestly horrendous i probably wouldn't do it again if i had the hindsight that i have now it was a period of four months of my life of very intense high masking every day long hours 18 hour days and then i went into extreme burnout and i'm very very grateful that I left the show when I did because I probably would have hit extreme burnout that I wouldn't have recovered from and we got on a plane we flew to the Maldives and I said I do not want to cook or see people for the rest of the year and it worked that's the only thing that pulled me back it's also difficult for me because I have a photographic memory that along with the lack of synaptic pruning that autistic and ADHDers have, everything is there for life.

1:48It was a lot. Did you know that you were autistic and ADHD before going on MasterChef? Yes, not ADHD. I had my autism diagnosis a year before filming the show. But I had no understanding of what that actually meant for me. You know, you're handed this piece of paper to say, yeah, congratulations, you're autistic. What does that mean yeah you know like where is the manual that teaches you this is how you need to unpick this diagnosis yeah what next yeah the one thing the one thing that I'm very grateful my postpartum experience has allowed me to be more honest about things so before I used to still mask in situations where I'm like I think because I've learned via experiences and pattern recognition that this is not socially acceptable.

2:36But now postpartum, because I don't have that capacity, I will call people out on things now. I will say, I do not understand what you mean. People don't like it. No, it's like the most insulting thing. It is. It's like you're attacking them. It is. But it works. I need plans. It doesn't need to be structured, but I kind of need some sort of loose plan. And actually, it's really quite liberating when you call people out on things now. And I say, this doesn't work for me. I don't have capacity to do this. I don't know what you mean. I'm being honest. Accept it or don't accept it. It's fine. Do you feel like MasterChef would have been accommodating to you had they known?

3:17I mean, they did know, but I think they were as accommodating as they could be in a competition. I also didn't know my needs in order to ask for them back then. I also didn't want to feel like I'm at a disadvantage. I also didn't want to feel like I'm cheating. So I put myself on the same level playing field as everybody else. When I, in reality, I'm not. What accommodations did they offer you? In reality, not many. There were many challenges where you don't know where you're going. You don't know what your challenge would be. You don't know anything, but it gave me a platform to talk about autism and ADHD.

3:57So many people felt validated by me going on and being honest about my sensory issues when it comes to food. You know, the fact that I will go crazy if some foods touch. What else did you talk about? It's not all food that's touching. It's just certain ones. So for example, rice and curry. Culturally, I've been brought up on rice and curry. I love rice. I love curry, but only I can let those meet. If somebody puts the curry on top of my rice, it's game over. I need them separate and I need to mix them in a ratio that works for my palate. So often I will use a small spoon. Spoons are also very important to me as a neurodivergent person.

4:39There's only one right spoon for people listening. There's only one right spoon. Exactly. And yeah, that's the only way I can survive. I'm very lucky that in Indian culture specifically, there are so many kind of like divider plates are the norm. Tiffin, separated things are the norm. So I had so many coping mechanisms without even realizing there were coping mechanisms. But yeah, my husband, he is a mixer. Yeah. And that doesn't work for me. Yeah. As you say that, I'm like, as you said, oh, in Indian culture, I'm like, yeah, it was actually at an Indian restaurant was the first time I saw the metal dividing plate.

5:17And I went and found them online. That's so interesting. I didn't make that connection until just now. So you're on MasterChef. You're like, I don't like my foods to touch. What other things did you share with people that felt validating for them? I was very honest about why I was putting certain things together. So I deconstructed a lot of things. And deconstruction is like the number one no on MasterChef because it's like, why are you deconstructing things? You're meant to put the meal together. But actually, sometimes deconstruction is the only way I can eat. So I made an apple crumble where I cook the apple and the crumble separately because I hate that layer in the middle where it's mushed.

5:55But actually, people found that my tips were very helpful because, for example, I can't eat salads. They're too much of a sensory issue for me. Wet lettuce, wet tomatoes, the seeds popping out, etc. But I make things tolerable by adding crunchy. crunchy foods are very safe for me and so finding hacks like putting bombay mix or crushed up crisps into foods that aren't great textures for me works because there's some form of familiarity and just saying that on national tv I think was validating for so many people out there and really helped parents understand what their children might be going through because they don't at this moment and sometimes their children can't communicate I explained why I preferred eating with spoons sometimes over cutlery sometimes why eating with my hands was more appropriate than using cutlery because it gives my brain a heads up as to the textures and the sensory beforehand um and it's wild because in the UK that episode was aired and it was a brief that was you know cook any food that you eat with your hands and to most neurotypical people that meant pizza canapes hot dogs for me that was rice and curry culturally that's very normal for us yes to england it wasn't and that blew up as a whole cultural thing that no one understood you can't eat rice and curry with your hands yes you can yeah so it's just a lack of understanding um and it i guess the cross-section of people that watch master's chef for uk was not very neuroaffirming at all, unfortunately.

7:38So it resonated with the people it needed to, but not the majority that watched MasterChef. Did you get backlash? A lot. Really? Yeah. Like what? I mean, I didn't go online for about a year after MasterChef. What? Why? Because you had the audacity to eat with your hands? Yeah, just people didn't understand autism and how it was presented on MasterChef because for them, it's very stereotypical. Well, she can't be autistic. She's going on TV, you know? Or it's the whole wokeism. You know, she's talking about autism because it's cool. You know, it's fashionable now. And it's almost, to some, it was a tick box.

8:14It was like, oh, she's brown, she's autistic. That's why she's on the show. That's why she got as far as she did. And in reality, it was hard work and, you know, a lot of strain. But also you have to have skill. And the skill is evident on TV. But I think it's always easy for people to see somebody rising above their disability and then be like, well, you must have not been disabled because, see, you're able to do this. And yet this doesn't happen with physical disabilities, disabilities that you can see. This only happens with invisible disabilities. Do you feel like things could have been done differently on MasterChef, like in retrospect, to shine a more positive light on this?

8:57Or do you think it would have been received the same either way? Yes, I think though I was the first person to be open about their autism on MasterChef UK. So I'm not sure if production really understood how that would land with their audience. So I was almost the litmus test. And then they realized, actually, this is a great thing. And so then contestants every year since have been very honest. And I won't be surprised if there'll be a Neurodivergent winner very soon that actually really is open and honest about it. Because I think there have been autistic people, ADHDers in the past, that have not disclosed their neurodivergence because they thought it would hinder them.

9:37What kinds of comments were you getting on social media? Awful comments, especially from parents of neurodivergent kids that may be level three of it's not the autism that they see in their house. So therefore, it doesn't my autism doesn't exist. Yeah. And to your point, they don't see my accommodations. They don't see the amount of work that's needed to mask to show up in the level one way that they are seeing. But also, they have no sort of recollection of my childhood. I was not a level one child, that's for sure. society has made me mask so hard that my autism isn't apparent to most of the population yeah let me ask you with master chef you undoubtedly were making your own accommodations without probably even realizing it what kind of accommodations were you making for yourself so that you could show up and mask because that takes a great deal of energy i would use every single ounce of time that I could to be alone even whilst filming in the toilet quiet spot in the corner I would then have to have a strategy or multiple strategies for every single episode or what I thought would come so I because I have a photographic memory would study every single past series and then work out what I think is going to happen how many people are going to go do I think that there's going to be a surprise challenge in this if there is a surprise challenge will it be a larder challenge where there's a whole room worth of stuff and I have to pick things and cook them do I have something in terms of a strategy prepared for when I go into a room that I don't get overwhelmed that I just pick one corner and I pick only three items from that corner because I know I can cook so it's almost better for me to have a cloche where you pick up and we all have the same items and they're picked for me.

11:33It's almost worse when you have a room full of ingredients and you've got to pick this, right? So it's strategies for everything. And then I just needed a lot of downtime in the evenings. Not that you have much of an evening after filming, but to decompress, sit in a dark room with no light, have a takeaway. My diet in the four months of filming basically was living on takeaways. it was the worst you're cooking amazing food on the show and you're coming home and you're eating a domino's pizza yeah one thing i hear from women all the time is that they're struggling with symptoms like hot flashes sleep disruptions and brain fog but aren't sure where to turn to for help menopause is inevitable but suffering through it isn't that's why i want to tell you about alloy alloy is a digital health platform that connects you with a menopause specialized doctor who can create a personalized treatment plan tailored to your needs, all from the comfort of your home.

12:34Join the 95 % of women who tried Alloy and saw relief in the first two weeks. Head to myalloy.com and use the code Dr. Brighton. That's myalloy.com, M-Y-A-L-L-O-Y.com, and the code Dr. Brighton, D-R-B-R-I-G-H-T-E-N. Share your symptoms and you'll get a fully customized treatment plan and unlimited messaging with your doctor. Plus, you'll get$20 off your first order today. That's M-Y-A-L-L-O-Y.com, code Dr. Brighton. Do you feel like the other contestants were understanding about your situation? No, I actually think they thought I was a psychopath because I needed like there was one episode where it was obvious two people had to go because of the amount of people that need to be in the next stage.

13:35And they were like, do you have inside information? Like, how do you know two people? For me, it's so obvious because I've already done the calculation, but it's wild to me that contestants are going in and they're literally only focusing on this current challenge because that's how their brain works. I can't live like that. Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, I probably only am in touch with two people from the whole of the show because they're the only ones that really understand my brain. Were the judges understanding of your situation? Well, I'm not sure if you'll know much about this, but we had two judges at the time.

14:15One judge was very very um he received a lot of complaints uh i complained about him he was extremely ableist uh and it's ironic because he had an autistic son he's then fired from the show and now it transpires that he is autistic and now he's coming out saying oh i should have been more understanding i wish i understood how my brain worked but actually in reality when i was saying this you didn't care i don't feel like they were supportive at all you shouldn't have to be the collateral in their inability to be honest with themselves. Indeed. Yeah. So that judge got fired. How was the other judge around things?

14:50In fairness, he was great. But I mean, you don't you have very little interaction with the judges other than judging. And then how about like the producers, the staff and everything where there, you know, where there are times that you feel like they kind of forgot you were autistic and like, we're just like, no, just plug through, keep going. um no I think that's mainly my fault because I masked so hard that I didn't show anyone that I needed help because that was easier that was easier the journey of unmasking and unpicking that late diagnosis it's not even years like I'm five years in now and I still feel like I haven't got there so um I never thought that I'd be on that journey or I'd be anywhere near it a year later when I started filming but um I think it would be a very different story if I was a Master Chef now.

15:40The level of awareness that I have now for my needs is much better. What would it look like now if you were on MasterChef? I'd be very honest about these are things I need. I need to know where I'm going. I'm not at a disadvantage by knowing where we're going. I'm not asking for the cheat code of what this challenge would be. But I just felt like I couldn't be a burden. And I feel like a lot of late diagnosed autistic women will probably say the same thing. I don't want to be a burden. I don't want to, I have to make myself smaller and make the accommodations so somebody else doesn't have to. And that mindset has shifted.

16:14And what made you decide to go on MasterChef? Well, it was always a dream. I love cooking and I wanted to be on the show before I thought, you know, everyone has goals. And my goal was to maybe be on the show before I was 40. And I didn't expect to be on the show the first time around. So I thought it would take many years of applications because it's a tough process. It's very competitive. Like thousands of people apply. I didn't think I'd be successful. And I don't know whether that's just like, you know, the RSD and me thinking, oh, I'll never get it. I'm not good enough. It all happens for a reason.

16:46Was there ever a time when you were on this TV show that you were, you said something that was received wrong or you look back and you're like, I really wish they had held grace for me being autistic before I had made that statement. Actually, no, I was so highly masked. I didn't allow that to happen. Yeah. And I think that's why I hit such severe burnout after feeling after filming, because you can't live your life in that state for a prolonged period. It was three and a half months. And after that, you jumped on a plane. You said, I'm not cooking for a year. But what did burnout? Well, let's start with what did burnout look like for you?

17:22And then we'll talk about the recovery. I couldn't see anyone. I could not see anyone. I didn't want to talk to anybody. I took time off work for the rest of the year, actually. So that was almost a month where I didn't see anyone. I didn't talk to anybody. I just needed to be somewhere that was by the sea, that was calm, that had sunshine. I needed vitamin D and somebody to bring me a pina colada and to bring me good food. And then from January onwards, I just took the time to be kind to myself and it worked. It was a six month process where it took a lot to get back to myself. I didn't know how to regulate myself after such a bit because I historically I would always stop before I could let myself get to that level.

18:10But in a competition, you couldn't unless you just walk out and leave. And I haven't worked and masked this hard to just leave of my own choice. Yeah. So I had to just push past it. And what is being kind to yourself actually look like? at the time honoring my needs um obviously don't have that luxury anymore because uh a little gremlin is ruling uh my schedule but um baths for me help me regulate even though i have sensory issues when it comes to water baths help me regulate you know weighted blankets and me time alone time not seeing anyone not leaving the house pajama time you can relate to that that's that's how I regulate.

18:55Sometimes the most productive way to heal is to do nothing. Yes. Yes. If MasterChef was to ask you on today, would you go? No. Oh, really? I couldn't do it to myself with the knowledge and the hindsight that I have. And is it because of just how deteriorating the whole process was for your mind and your body? Or is it also because you're a mom and you're like, I have someone else to be providing for? I think it's both. But I think if I wasn't a mom, I would still say no, because I don't believe that production of television for that period of time, you know, long time, is set up for neurodivergent people and the accommodations that we need.

19:38Do you regret doing it? No, I don't regret it because it has changed my trajectory. I talk about autism and ADHD now, which I never did before. When I have capacity, I will talk about food sensory issues a lot more because that's so helpful to so many parents on my page um I have been part of many documentaries where just being honest about those sensitivities have helped thousands of people I had 10 ,000 emails to say thank you to my website when I was on a show that explained why fruits don't work for me like raspberries and the seeds and the hairs because I can feel each hair. It's gross. I want to ask, as a chef, how have your sensory sensitivities impacted your relationship with food?

20:25There's positives and negatives. There's some days where I can't touch certain ingredients, like raw chicken is just a no from me on some days. Chicken is my nemesis. You're speaking to the right person. It's honestly one of the worst textures known to man, but I also have a lot of tactile. I need to wash my hands. like anything anytime I touch something I need to wipe off that sensory feeling and that slows me down a lot but having heightened senses makes me a great cook I am a super taster so my food is so full of flavor has so much nuance to it it makes me a great chef in that perspective I also think the balance of the ADHD and the autism where you need some sort of like ad-libbing from the ADHD perspective but you also need some sort of structure from the autism it's one it's a wonderful combination for me personally um along with the fact that that's my hyper fixation I love it could I do it as a full-time career and have a restaurant absolutely not I know that would send me over the edge so having it as a hobby a chef that dips in and out is is something that works for me at present.

21:35I saw that with MasterChef because MasterChef gave me the insight to work in kitchens that I would never typically do coming from a corporate background. And I realized very quickly that was not the environment for me. I think it also goes back to being kind to yourself and kindness can come with letting go of that all or nothing mindset. Well, thank you so much for taking the time to sit down with me today. This has been a fantastic conversation. Is there anything you want to leave our listeners with? Thank you for listening to my story. I think hopefully this will start the conversation for more women in the UK in particular to be more honest about their postpartum experience.