8 Hidden Signs Your Ego is Slowly Ruining Your Life | Ed Mylett

21:20Do things that are in congruence with who you really are. Do things that are the removal of your ego. You know what says you have no ego? You're willing to do the work every single day on yourself and in your business even though there's no result. That shows no ego. Ego is, why would I keep doing it? There's no result. Or ego is, I got it going, I don't need to do it anymore. You wanna know you don't have an ego? You wanna know you got your act together? You're doing the work right now to show how much you love yourself, how much you believe in yourself, knowing the delayed gratifications coming six months to a year or maybe longer from now.

21:54I'm here to challenge you to start living like you love yourself, living like you believe in yourself because you can't love yourself if you're not being yourself. And the real self, the real you takes all the steps to care for you, all the steps to improve you, all the steps to grow you. So you know you love you. You know you believe in you when you begin treating you like that. And treating you like that means you don't gossip about other people. You're not addicted to what other people think about you, right? You're not some victim. You know better than that You're not someone who needs everybody else's permission to win You're not waiting around for results and not doing the work You don't stop doing the things that help you win.

22:31So today start doing the things that improve you confidence wise listening to people like me Following me on social media listening to the right podcast reading the right books in your business doing the things You know you're supposed to do. Let me tell you what I know about you and your business You're not confused about what you need to do. If you're a school teacher or you're an entrepreneur, if you're a mom or a dad, if you're a pastor, if you're a young person who's studying and wants to get into college, you're not confused by what you need to do. There's no confusion on what you need to do.

23:00There's only the decision of whether you're willing to do it and to do it consistently and to do it even when the results don't show up. Even when the results aren't there, are you willing to do it? And if you are making progress, you are getting good grades, you are leading your church, you are moving your business forward, You are flourishing at work. Do you have enough lack of ego to continue to do the work required to get to the next level? That's the separator. Very short intermission here, folks. I'm glad you're enjoying the show so far. Don't forget to follow the show on Apple and Spotify.

23:28Links are in the show notes. Now on to our next guest. Welcome back to the show, everybody. The gentleman sitting across from me, I think, is one of the most talent comedians of all time. I was telling him off camera, he's just a tremendous storyteller. And I love his style. And he's been doing comedy for over 20 years. One thing about him that's always stood out to me, his inherent goodness as a person I think shines through in his work. Like you inherently know when you watch him, this is a good man. And that storytelling has transitioned now into three books. And his third book's out right now.

24:04It's called We're All in This Together, So Make Some Room. and there's so many great life lessons as you laugh your ass off in this book, but tons of great life lessons in the book that we're going to uncover today. Tom Papa, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me. It's nice to be here, finally. Yeah, finally. I think there's a way of really feeling blessed and that you've got some gifts yourself and not letting it be like a big ego thing. I had a friend of mine one time and I was really worrying a lot. He goes, man, you've got a huge ego. And I went, no one thinks I have a huge ego. That's not true at all.

24:35He goes, no, no, no, you're the center of the universe, man. And like your problems are way more important than everybody else's. Kind of to your point that you just said. Was he saying it in a derisive way? He was saying it like wake up. Oh, really? You know, like wake up. Like, hey, dude, like, yeah, you're not that big of a deal. And it's going to be okay. And other people have way bigger problems than you do. And like maybe start, I have this phrase I use that I got from him. He's just a friend. He's like, he goes, whenever you feel helpless, get helpful. Help some other people. And I've like repeated that like hundreds of times.

25:06People listen to my work. They're like, no, that's profound. I'm like, I got it from my buddy who told me I had a big ego. It's a good one. That's where it came from. But it's really true. But can I ask you a question? Sure.

25:16Without a little bit of that ego, do you think you would have been as successful as you are? No. Meaning. Like, because you have to. Depends on what you define as success. Would I have made the money I made and reached the people. Would you have made the money and felt that you've achieved something, which I think is very important. I think it gives you, I think, achievement and success in like, you know, that you're helping other people and people are buying your books and people are listening to your show. It's much easier to walk through the day and slap your hands and say it's going to be a great day.

25:49Yeah. When you have some things under the belt. Yeah. Let me tell you what I did. And you kind of need like. You do. You've got to have a lot of confidence. Yeah. A lot of belief. And you've got to be hungry. And you have to think. Yeah. I think confidence and ego are different. and I'll tell you what happened to me when I was young since you asked, everyone can listen in. I met Wayne Dyer really young. Do you remember Wayne Dyer? He was like a thought leader, kind of like a Tony Robbins guy back in the day. Okay. Maybe a little new agey kind of back in the day, but really profound guy. Yeah. Anyway, I met him and we got to know one other very well, became lifelong friends, and he said, Ed, I think you're going to change the world, you know, and gave me all this belief.

26:23And he goes, do me a favor and like, never attach all of your confidence to like your abilities because you'll always be chasing that tail. It'll never be enough. You'll never be good enough. And he goes, attach your confidence to your intentions. Meaning, he goes, Ed, you're a real good man. Now, God gave me some good voice and pretty good brain, and you're a hard worker, but attach your confidence to your intentions. And so, like, even before I speak, or even meeting you today or a business meeting I go into, my confidence booms, but it's like, I'm a good guy, and I want to do well. My intention, even probably before you walk on stage, I don't know that you go, I'm the funniest dude in the world, but I bet you there's a part that's like, I intend to make these people laugh.

27:05Yeah, and you need to have a little bit of I'm the funniest guy in the world because you need to approach things like, I can do this. Sure. That's the thing. It's not like I'm better than everybody, but I can do this. Yeah, I think that's me. And also, for me, there's faith involved, so I'm like, kind of whatever I'm good at came from God. I've worked very hard at it. Yeah. But I think all my life, like anybody, I probably struggled with ego slash confidence slash humility and where's that blend. My favorite people in my life, nuance, humility, and confidence. They toe that line very well. Yeah.

27:37Because my friends that are super confident with no humility, they make you sick. Yeah. And they wear you out. And they eventually burn out or mess up. Yeah. My friends with tons of humility and no confidence, they drain you. Yeah. They're always down. They're always complaining. And you're always picking them up. So it's those people kind of that toe the line, at least to me, that seem to be the people I want around me. Yeah. You got to harness it. Yeah. It's like you got to, like if you want to, if you want to be as good as you possibly can at whatever you do, you got to, you got to believe in yourself.

28:10Yeah. And that doesn't mean that you believe in yourself to the detriment of everybody you run into. You know what I mean? Yeah. You know, like just in the comedy clubs, like there would be guys who would roll in and cut everybody else on the lineup. You know, be 10 comedians waiting to go on. And they walk in like, I'm the guy. Right. And then like cut everybody and like do an hour. And then everybody's like, oh, it's with this guy. And, you know. Yeah. And some people would do it before they've earned it. Like some guys, you're like, no doubt you can do whatever you want to do. We're all happy you're here.

28:42And other guys like just got some success. And they start throwing that weight around. and you're like, ugh, that's gross. Because they didn't have what you're saying. They lost the humility part of it. Humility and some self-awareness, don't you think, too? Just a little self-awareness. Jay Leno on your show that I was just listening to on the 4th of July, I didn't agree with the way he said it, but I know what he meant. On your show, he goes, I think the key to success is low self-esteem. And then I went, that's totally backwards. But then he kind of elaborated. He goes, meaning I don't always think I'm the funniest guy in the room.

29:10I wanted the best lighting guy, the best producer. I surrounded myself with good people. I think what he really meant is the key is humility. Yeah, I think that's true. Which is not low self-esteem, but I thought it was a really good point. It is a good point. It's all a balance, isn't it? Because when you say the low self-esteem thing, I've been doing this 30 years, and I'm on tour now, and I have a new act, so I'm digging deeper and trying to come up with it. And it's actually scary. Yeah. I've been doing it 30 years. I have a thousand people in the audience waiting with their tickets to see what's going to happen tonight.

29:49But they don't know that I'm like, ah. Yeah. You know what I mean? And so I don't know if low self-esteem is the right word, but it's nice to feel vulnerable. It makes you stay working hard at it. You know what I mean? Like if I just thought, oh, whatever I say is going to be great, I probably would start to deteriorate. I know exactly what you mean because I'm speaking and I just finished kind of a tour of my book and I had a talk that I became very comfortable with giving and it worked and everyone liked it or I think most people liked it. Yeah. And I don't want to keep doing it. I want to do something new.

30:25That was a great conversation. And if you want to hear the full interview, be sure to follow the Ed Milet Show on Apple and Spotify. Links are in the show notes. Here's an excerpt I did with our next guest. All right. Welcome back to Max Out with Ed Milet, and I am really excited about today. Before we get going, I want to remind you all, we do this for free, and so all I ask from you is that you rank and review the podcast there on iTunes. Do me that favor, please. My guest today, I was thinking about it coming over here today, I think he's the most, I think he's the Dos Equis man of personal development.

30:56I like that. I do. He's the most interesting man in personal development. I did this survey with you all, and I asked you, who were the guests that you wanted on my program? and Lewis's name kept consistently coming up. So I've got him here for you today. Lewis, thank you for being here, brother. Thanks, brother. Appreciate it. So good to have you here. So Lewis, as many of you know, has the School of Greatness podcast, which is a top 100 podcast in the world. He's written a couple different best-selling books, including the School of Greatness. But the one I want to talk about today, if we can, is The Mask of Masculinity.

31:24It was such a great read, brother. I've never read anything like it before. Thank you. Yeah, it was so good. So one of the masks that Lewis talks about in the book is men, you know, with their masculinity, wearing the masks of different types of people, whether it's the material mask or the athlete mask or the stoic mask. And it's such a fascinating read. It is for men, but to be candid with you, I think it's a fascinating read for women to understand their men. Exactly. So many women are telling me that they finally understand their husband, why their father never showed them the affection, why their sons don't look them in the eyes.

31:56So it's like trying to understand men a little bit better, too. It's brilliant, man. And so there's this story in there that stuck out to me. And I could picture you as a little guy when this happened, but you talk about, and it's interesting, it could be a non-event for some people, but it must be this dodgeball game. It's defining, man. It was, because you end up being, remember, this guy ends up going on to become a college and professional athlete, right? And if you draw back all the way where that mask started, it started in a damn dodgeball game. Yes. In elementary school, you know, I was still trying to find my way and just have a couple friends, just try to fit in.

32:27And one day, the teacher of our class, there's probably 30 kids in the class, about 50 % men and boys, boys and girls. They say, okay, during recess, we're going to play a team dodgeball game. And we're going to split it up into two teams. So everybody's had that game at school, right? Right, yeah. Everyone's played dodgeball or something, right? And he said, okay, I'm picking you two boys as the captains. Pick one at a time. I don't think it was his intention to do this. He was just like, yeah, you guys split up the teams. Okay. So we're all waiting to be called out, right? Yeah. And these two popular kids, one at a time, start picking each boy.

33:03And I'm thinking to myself, I'm one of the taller kids. I feel like I'm pretty athletic already. They've got to pick me, one of the first people. So I'm standing up there in front waiting to be called, and they pick all the boys one by one until it's me and the last boy. And this boy, he was not athletic at all. Essentially, I'll keep it at that. And they pick him. And so now I'm the last boy to be picked. However, as you know in the story, they pick a girl next. And then they pick another girl, another girl, until it's me and the last girl. And I'm like, there's no way I'm going to be like, they're going to pick this girl before me.

33:38This girl has like zero athletic ability, right? She can't even walk. Right. And they pick her. And then I'm not even picked. I'm just by default. Yeah, no. You know, just go on the next team. They didn't even pick me as like, oh. What's going on here? Are you raging? Are you sad? I am raging. I'm already a kid that feels neglected, that feels like the youngest who doesn't get any attention. You know, I didn't have any friends. So at this point, I said, I'm going to destroy everyone on this team. Like, give me the ball. I'm just like slamming it in people's faces. You're already being viewed. Yeah.

34:08And I'm just like destroying people. And I go, never again will I be picked last. You can see it in me right now. I can see it in your physiology. Never again will I ever get picked last in anything. Right? And that's what I told myself. And I just become a training machine. every day after school, I would go to the playground, go to the gym, go play basketball, and train until my mom would have to call me in at like 9 o 'clock and say, you've got to come home. And you think that game has something to do with you end up being a professional athlete? I think it was one of the triggers of just like always feeling like I was abused, left behind, not good enough.

34:45It was just one of those triggers. It's interesting your face changed even when you just said that. It's interesting. You know, it's just like, it's one of those moments that I can remember. You know, it was many moments like that. Yeah. But that was a moment where I was like, okay, I just never want to feel this again. Yeah, it literally defined part of your whole identity. Absolutely. Right, it was one of these masks you're like, I wear this one well. And so I put, yeah, so I put the athlete mask on and I said, never again am I going to lose. And I also needed to be right. You know, for me, like being wrong was losing.

35:15And so I was like, I need to win at all costs. I need to be right at all costs. And anytime I lost in a game, I was the worst loser because my self-worth and my value was tied to winning or losing. And even when I won, sometimes I wouldn't be happy because I would beat myself up about how I could have been better. So I couldn't appreciate the journey. We just always got to get better, got to get to the goal, got to get to the goal. Yeah. Everybody that's listening, including me, frankly, a lot of us relate to that. Yeah. And we're going to talk about some solutions that too are those of you that are watching this, you certainly know someone like us.

35:49Sure, sure. And it's interesting because you have that event. You have a brother who goes to prison. I didn't know, but you go to a boarding school when you were 13. It's amazing that you end up becoming one of the most sought after people on the planet to improve people's lives. And yet you have these events that you didn't allow eventually to define who you were. There's a significant one, though, as you know. I think it's the genesis of the book, probably. Yeah. But if you don't mind taking them through this, you had some sexual abuse happen to you. And you were a very young boy. I mean, very young.

36:22So you had the 13. You had the brother go to prison. You had the dodgeball game. But the biggie. Yeah. When I was five, yeah, it was, here's the thing. When I was five, I was raped by a man that I didn't know. And for 25 years, no one knew about it. I want to ask you this because I have not heard you answer this. Are you telling me literally you didn't tell anybody? I didn't tell anyone. Not your... I told a professor my freshman year in college, I said, you know, something happened to me, but I didn't tell him what. Wow. So mom and dad definitely did. Parents didn't know. Friends didn't know.

36:52I never told anyone exactly what happened. Wow. I was too afraid to let people know. And so for 25 years, I'm 34 now. When I was 30, I went through a bunch of different challenges in my life with an intimate relationship I was in, a business partnership I was in. And just everything looked good on the outside. You know, people were like, man, you're crushing it, Louis. But I was suffering on the inside and I didn't know why. So I jumped on my boat this morning to get over here to the studio. Got a compliment on my shirt. Guess where I got it? Quince. One thing I love about summer is how easy everything feels.

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39:18And I don't know if you've ever felt that when your business took off, you're like, why am I not fulfilled? I absolutely do. You felt that before? Of course. And for me, I was taking all of this, I was just angry, constantly angry. I was doing great in my business, but angry because I couldn't figure out how to cope and understand my emotions. So I took all this frustration out on the basketball court. Every day I would go play basketball a few blocks away. And every day, it was like I was looking for a fight. You know in college when you're like, you're just like, I hope someone looks at me. Yeah, look at me wrong.

39:53Yeah, slap you. Running to me the wrong way. Like, I'm going to beat you up. You know, I was just looking for a fight. And I think that was the only way I knew how to express myself was through physical aggression. So many people are relating to this right now. That was my life. Football was my ability to just destroy people in a legal way without getting in trouble. I could get it out every single day. So when you don't have that anymore, it's like, I need to go play basketball and like rough it out. Yeah. because I didn't know how to cope with my emotions or what I was going through. I just didn't have the skills or the tools.

40:23So every day I would go out and play basketball, and I just constantly, someone would yap at me, and it was like I had to step to them like I was the alpha dog and, like, shove them and scream at them and just show them that they weren't going to mess with me until I backed down. It's amazing, just to tell you, because being in your presence and being around you. I'm not that way. Yeah, and our mutual friends, no one would describe me this way now. Exactly, exactly. Right. And, you know, I'm typically, I was typically not that way either. Like I'm always a very loving, like happy person. But there's a trigger.

40:50There's a trigger. Like if you cross the trigger, it was like, you're going to go down. Yeah. Or I was going to go down or something. Yeah. And so every day it was like waiting for someone to hit me and they wouldn't hit me. I would like push at them. I would scream back at them. I'd be like, don't talk shit to me. Don't do this. Don't like whatever to a no stakes pick a basketball game in West Hollywood. It's not like. Yeah. Right. And he's on the line. Yeah. It's like. And one day, after a few months of this, I'm guarding a guy who's much bigger than me, older than me. And we're getting in a heated battle back and forth.

41:24He's fouling me hard. I'm fouling him hard. But it's kind of like this is what you do in the street ball, right? You're kind of fouling each other hard, but it's all good. It's fair game. He's calling it. I'm calling it. It gets down to the last point, game point for both of us, both teams. He gets the ball down, getting ready to shoot the layup. I fouled him hard. You know, I grabbed his arm down so he can't score. I guess it was enough was enough for him. And he came at me and headbutts me. Now this was the trigger that put me over the top and said, Incredible Hulk is coming out. Snap city. Snap city.

41:56It was like, I can't even remember because I just put him in a headlock and just started UFC pounding him, throwing him to the ground on top of him, just like unleashing all this anger. It had to come out somewhere. Yeah. And this was the moment it exploded. Because I didn't know how to let it come out any other way. Now, afterwards, I remember it was shaking so much because it got up and there was blood gushing out everywhere all over the court. The police station was right across the street. It snaps back into me like, I have everything to lose here. I could go to jail. What if something happens?

42:30What if I actually hurt him really bad? Whatever. What if my whole life could be over from one moment? I know what happened to my brother going to prison from one drug deal that he was involved in. one thing he got caught which put him into prison sentenced 6 to 25 years he got out in 4 and a half in good behavior so all of a sudden I'm like how stupid can I be to allow my emotions to get the best of me to react after that point my friends were like you know you need some help man really you need some help it wasn't that bad but they were like why are you doing this that shouldn't happen right why are you allowing this to happen did you know why then do you think you knew I think I was just like angry at everything like no matter how successful you're still there's this angry piece of you because I would Achieve all these things that I wanted but then I was like angry right when I'd achieve them like it didn't fulfill me Yes, yes, so I was like I need to get bigger.

43:24I need to make more I need to like get more goals I need to do this like maybe then I'll feel good and none of it made me feel good I don't know if you felt that way like I need to get 10 million then a hundred million Then I'm just sell my company. Yes, and then I'm gonna feel great and maybe it felt great Maybe not, but... If it does, it's temporary. Yeah. And you're exactly right. Everybody watching this that's had any level of achievement that thinks, once I get something else or I get to this place, then I'll be happy, then I'll be happy, then I'll be happy. And it does, I don't know anybody.

43:49And you and I also both know lots of very wealthy people who are completely unhappy. Yes. They're like Tony Robbins talks about all the time, success without fulfillment is complete failure, right? So I relate to that level of failure. So do a lot of people. And those of you that are chasing your dream, you've got to find a way, and we're going to talk about this in a minute, to enjoy you now, celebrate you now. Because when you get to these different places, guess who arrives there? You. And if you're there with the same damage, with these same masks on, the amount of money you have just sometimes, frankly, magnifies the pain that you're in, I think, because you can act out different ways.

44:25So go ahead. So you have this event. So my friends start saying, and I kind of come to an awareness of like, I remember running back from those courts, like up into my room up here, like looking in the mirror, shaking, because I've got like blood all over me and I'm like, what am I doing? The last fight I was in was when I was like 15 or something. And I'm like, why am I doing this? Look at myself in the mirror, literally like, why? Why are you doing this? Who are you? And who do you want to become? I was just asking myself this over and over. And I started to say, okay, I need to take a deeper look at why I'm so resentful, why I'm so angry, why I'm so frustrated and why I'm triggered.

44:59Why am I triggered when someone steps to me or says something to me or leaves a negative review online or why do I always have to defend myself? So I started calling some therapist friends of mine that I knew, some spiritual coaches that I knew. I started going to workshops and I went to this one emotional intelligence workshop that similar to like what Tony does, where I had us address kind of our past. Past with our parents, past with girlfriends, past with friends, like childhood and just kind of addressing it all. We recreated and reenacted situations to face ourselves in those moments and recognize why we've come that way.

45:41And after I was in this five-day workshop and after the third day, we had done a lot, you know, addressing our past. I'd cleared with my parents internally. I'd cleared with like relationships. And the facilitator of this workshop, there were about 50 people in it, he said, okay, we're moving forward to focus on our vision for our future. The things you want to create the person you want to become. We've addressed everything in the past, but if there's anything you haven't addressed yet, now's the time to talk about it. Otherwise, we're moving forward. Like, get on the ship. And so I'm going through in my mind at this moment, like it's a pause in the room.

46:15And I'm going through, I'm like, my parents getting divorced. Yeah, like pretty much everyone has done that, right? Okay, I went through that. Feeling bullied and picked on. I talked about this. Feeling like insecure in school. My brother in prison. Like I talked about all these things and I was like, what about the time I was raped by a man? It just kind of came in my mind. And this was always in the back of my mind. You know, every week I would think about that moment. It would come up, like just kind of randomly pop in and out of my head and I would just push it to the side. And I remember thinking to myself, if I don't say this now, I'll probably never say it to anyone.

46:53Like the setting was perfect. I had gone through enough challenges and breakdowns in my life where I was like, I'm willing to figure out whatever it is, I'm going to go there. And so I just stood up, walked to the front of the room. I didn't even ask for permission or anything. I just stood up, walked to the front of the room. And I remember, Ed, that I couldn't look anyone in the eyes. So I was staring down the entire time at the ground. And I walked through for the first time, just looking down. You know, when I was five years old, I was at the babysitter's. The babysitter had a son who was a teenager.

47:25and I just walked through the entire thing. And I couldn't look up because I was so embarrassed and so ashamed of people knowing this about me. And when I was complete, I said it pretty calmly. You know, I just kind of said it very calmly. And when I went to walk down, it's like almost the moment I sat down, it's like I erupted of tears that I've never had in my life. And I just couldn't stop crying. I was just like crying over and over again. Thankfully, there were two women on either side of me that were holding me. They were crying. I was crying. I was embarrassed and ashamed of what I just said, of people knowing this about me because I wasn't perfect looking anymore.

48:01I wasn't this like all-American guy who had it figured out anymore. And I remember running out of the room outside. It was in a hotel conference room. I ran outside because I just needed some fresh air. I had my head up against the wall outside. And one of the most beautiful things that ever happened to me happened next. One by one, the men who were in the room came up to me outside and just gave me a big hug, looked me in my eyes and told me that I was their hero. One by one, they said different things like that. And the crazy thing, the thing that I was afraid of people knowing about me the most was actually the thing that when I shared it, people connected with me even more and trusted me more.

48:48And people kept saying that like, wow, I thought like something completely different about you, but now I trust you. Now I'll follow you anywhere. Like, they said these things to me, and I was like, what? That makes no sense. You know, everything that I was afraid of, that I was taught not to be a little bitch, a little girl, a little pussy, a little fag, whatever the words were that made you wrong, that made you different, that pushed people away from you. I was taught to, like, fit in by, like, being manly, having it figured it out, you know, winning, like, talking bad to people, whatever it may be.

49:18and none of those things served my heart. And it started to awaken everything in me. Like when I finally opened up about that, I just said, you know what? I'm going to open up about everything. How? Because the freedom it gave me to realize, wow, you still accept me for who I am or the things I've been through and you still like me. You actually like me more. You trust me more. I was like, what? Wow. This concept of like being real. not that I wasn't real but I think I was always like had a little bit of layer of a mask hiding behind we all do and what's amazing, sorry I'm getting a little choked but of all the I mean I read all these personal development books I listen to all these guys it's the most compelling story I've read I'm just going to tell you because the courage I think it takes courage when you're five but to carry it and carry it and carry it and then release it like this massive It takes a jargantuan amount of courage, right?

50:20Thank you. It does, brother. And I think for the people that are listening to this, because this is corny to say, but like often in our life our greatest test is actually our defining testimony of our life. Like that was the greatest test of your life and it's really the testimony of your life. Everything you're becoming was unleashed because you finally took your mask off. That was the big mask you were. Huge for me. The secret I was carrying around my whole life that I didn't want anyone to know. And here's the crazy thing. You know, the people in that workshop were like, you should tell your family.

50:53And I was like, there's no way. So even after that? I was still scared to let anyone. I was like, this is a safer container. You know, it's like confidential. Like no one's going to hear about this. Yeah. But I was willing to explore and see what I needed to let go of to see what I could create in my life. Eventually, I was like, okay, I'm going to tell my family one by one. And it was terrifying. But again, when I told them, they opened up to things about me that I didn't know. And we built a stronger relationship as a family. Then they were like, you should tell your friends. I was like, no way.

51:23My family has to love me. You know what I mean? But my friends, they're probably not going to accept me anymore. But I started doing it one by one. What was it like? Was it, would you go into them like, uh-uh? I think I went back to like just being terrified as a kid. Like, what if they don't accept me? Same thing. Same thing. It was like the fear of what if people don't accept me. But one by one, people accepted me even more. And they trusted me even more. And they were there for me more and had compassion. You know, humanity is a powerful thing when you show vulnerability. I truly believe that other people who have deep hearts, like, are going to open up even more.

51:54So do I. You know, there may be some people who are going to be so guarded they can't receive it. But usually most people have a great heart. You're right. And my friends started saying, you've got to share this publicly. And I was like, no fucking way. Well, now you're... Right, right. They're like, you should tell this on your podcast. I was like, no, it's going to hurt my business. Like what people are really going to think weird about me. Yeah. But after six months of me just saying, you know what? I need to continue to talk about this because it still has power over me. Because when I talk about it, I quiver, I palpitate my heart.

52:24Like it still owns me. And I don't want this thing to own me anymore. I want to own it. And so I finally had enough courage to just kind of tell all the close people in my life, my friends and family. And it wasn't a hard thing anymore to talk about it. You know, it's still a moment that I wish no one to go through. Of course. But it doesn't take over my body. And so I said, you know what, I need to do this publicly because I felt like I'd never seen another white, straight male, jock-looking guy open up about this. Yeah. I've never seen it. Maybe it's happened, but I just... Nor have I. I can't think of, like, some personality or athlete or business leader who has opened up about it.

53:06And one in six men have been sexually abused in some way. One in six. And yet it's not acceptable to talk about it. Whether it be to friends and family or publicly or whatever. I'm not saying everyone should publicly talk about it. Sure. But I felt like for me... I love what you said about it still owning you. It was owning me. Yeah. Yeah. And I was just like, I felt a duty, a responsibility to continue to talk about it. Because, and here's the thing that happened. And when I put it on my podcast, I talked about it on my podcast. I did a whole episode about it four years ago. I shared it out at night.

53:46I posted it out at night. Like 11 o 'clock. I was right here in this room. I posted it out, and I went out and sat on that patio right there. And I sent out one tweet, and I just said, I'm going to leave it up to the universe to see what happens. I didn't promote it anyway. I just put one tweet out. And I was like, I'm going to go to bed and see. Hopefully no one watches this. You know, I was like, hopefully no one saw it. You want to do what you don't. And the crazy thing is I went outside and it was like, it was 11 o 'clock at night, but it felt like it was daytime. It was the largest moon in the last hundred years that happened that night.

54:14It was a super moon. And it was like, I didn't know this was happening at that time. I just decided I needed to post it then. And it kind of gives me chills thinking about it. And I was looking up the definition of like, what's a super moon mean? And it's like, super moons like shifts the world. And I was like, this is crazy, right? and over the next couple of weeks I was getting hundreds of emails from men sending essays telling me I've been married for 35 years my wife doesn't know this is what happened to me I've been in this relationship for this long I've never told anyone you know this had this happened to me for years when I was a kid this had you know the craziest stories I've ever heard made mine look like a Disney movie compared to some of the stuff that men were emailing me yeah but it's like I gave these men who listened permission for the first time to talk about it.

55:02Because if a big jock looking guy like me. Yeah, right. Good looking, big jock athlete, successful. If I talk about it, then maybe someone else can talk about it. Wow. And the healing that started to happen from within of these men, where they finally started to talk to their partner about it, where they finally started to address it, where they finally started to not be so stoic or so driven by sexual mask or the material mask to make themselves feel better, they started to communicate in healthier forms and just show a little bit of emotion, show a little bit of vulnerability and heal from within.

55:36And they got healthier physically. Their businesses grew. Their relationships thrived because they were able to communicate. And I think as men, we've been conditioned not to share certain things, to be tough, to be these things, to not be weak, to not be soft, to not show emotion, to not show affection. You know, as a kid, I was always like pushed away from my friends when I would be like, it's so good to see you. You know, I would like put an arm around a guy. Not in a sexual way, just like buddy, buddy. Yeah. And be like, get off me. What are you, gay? Yes. It's interesting. I was going to tell you something because I'm that way too.

56:08I have touchy feeling. Yeah, yeah. Especially, it's funny, especially with, it's like when I see my buddies, I touch them. Yeah, exactly. I want to say something about what you said there because it was just, I think we all want people to like us, you know? And I think that when we wear these masks, I think the more honest we are about who we truly are, the more people actually love us. The real us. You know, and I think what I love, what I want the men listening to this, this is a real man. A real man is vulnerable. A real man is honest. A real man's transparent. And not all of us have big muscles and are big guys like that.

56:41But I'm attracted to people, and I think everybody is, who are their authentic selves. and you have this big, big story and I love what you said about more men came to you and I just want to acknowledge it, man I think it's made a huge difference in the world and I think those of you that are watching this I always advocate for somebody on my program but I think there's a I know when I'm with a genuine, good person who cares I think if Lewis is this honest about this imagine the kind of transparency you get if you were reading his books If you were, if you were part of his podcast, become a part of his community.

57:19Because I think when you're like this, I think you get this out of your guests. I think that you get it out of the people that you interviewed too. Before we start the interview with my next guest, just want to remind you all that you can subscribe to the show on YouTube or follow the show on Apple or Spotify. We have all the links in our show notes. You'll never miss an episode that way. Now on with the show. Welcome back to the show, everybody. So this man sitting across from me, I just told him if he was a stock, I'd be buying him. and I mean that he is already making huge waves in the world because his work is so profound so impactful so much so by the way that you know I do 52 interviews a year I'd say 50 of them are through people that have reached out to the show and then there's a few every year where I'm just persistent to find them and get them on the show and in this man's case I pursued him I wanted him here today because I believe his work can change your life and I think we can do that in the next hour.

58:11And so I don't even know what I'd call him. I guess I'd call him like a holistic healer of both the spirit, the mind and the body. And his work is very diverse. It's profound. It's made a big impact on me. We could go three hours today and we have to squeeze it into an hour. So Dr. Christian Gonzalez, AKA Dr. G, great to have you sitting across from me. What an honor, man. And what a beautiful intro. This might be the best one. I feel really full nourished open I'm ready to talk about her all man you shoot and I'm gonna be like an old western guy boom boom boom right from there all right good this is profound everyone listen really closely to this part I want him to speak on because he's awesome at this but there's this shame that can only be released by giving yourself some grace yeah right and those two words resonate with me.

59:00I think even in my case, I'm open with my ideas, I have shame about things that I'm not even sure what they are. Yeah. Meaning, I think growing up as a child, I had an alcoholic dad, as you know. There's a measure of shame that came with it that wasn't my doing. But I remember thinking, man, I don't want people to know our families like this. Yeah, yeah. And I would carry that to school with me every single day. Or when my dad was yelling, I remember thinking they can hear him down the street in their house. They must think. So there's a measure of shame. Like you can carry shame from things that aren't even your bags.

59:36And then, of course, there's your bags. You made a mistake. You didn't treat somebody well. You told a lie. You were human. And what Dr. G's work, you guys, is that this is stored in your body and your emotions, and it's going to show up until and if you give yourself some measure of grace. And it has shown up for me in different ways in my life. And I'm at such an interesting time in my life, and it's the reason that your work resonates with me, where I'm like, I do want to show up as me. The sexual me being more sensual, right? Absolutely. Just so whatever that is, right? And in my personal life like this, being more authentic and transparent and vulnerable with people feels good to me.

1:00:21It actually feels good in my body when I do it. Feels good emotionally. I feel good about me when I do it. So talk about that relationship between shame and then in the body, the heart, and then grace. Yeah. And thank you for sharing your background. I want everyone to notice when you feel awkward, that is shame. When you feel awkward, you're holding in, that's your shame being activated. Wow. Right? So think about it. How many of us feel awkward just when we see things, when we see someone expressing something that we want to express, but we judge them instead, right? Because we're triggered by them.

1:00:56Why are they dressed like that? I don't like how they're dressed. It's, oh my God, as a man or as a woman, you can't dress like that. The truth is, is that the part of you that feels awkward and disconnected and wanting to be like, just create distance and triggered by them the truth is is the inside of you the part of you that wants to express like that is being shown now i want you to think about it growing up in your household and feeling oh god i want the neighbors to hear i don't want the neighbors here is this too loud this is too loud ironically is giving your body the signal that i can't be fully big fully me and it's it's crazy because you've created such a beautiful brand for yourself it's helping so many people and you have this bigness to you but i wonder how much more personally you walking the streets you at a party you walking through the office is even wanting to be expressed more of.

1:01:43And I can't understate this. The fascia in your body has no linearity of time. It doesn't care about past. It doesn't care about future. Meaning that that's why we talk about inner child. We're talking about our fascia. Our fascia remembers just like it happened one second ago. That's how deeply it is evolutionarily to our protection. So if you grew up in a household that had an alcoholic dad or alcoholic mom or bipolar, it's just not safe. And you have not done any work around that. You are not going to feel safe in your own body because your fascia believes that it's still in the same moment as it was 40, 50, 30, whatever years ago.

1:02:28So this is so important to understand. This is why it's protecting you. The fascia is always protecting from the environment. This is why when there's someone raising their voice and getting loud and it's reminiscent of dad, there's a part of you that contracts. Jeez. Bro, can I interrupt? When I'm in a restaurant and someone's loud, it drives me nuts. Right. Nuts. And I'm always wondering, it doesn't bother anybody else at the table except me. Why are they being so loud? Because that sensitivity is in your fascia. Your body remembers as if it was yesterday. So any loudness is going to trigger you internally.

1:03:04now you're of rational mind you're a grown man and you're not going to go okay i'm going to shake and i'm going to cry or i'm going to be like hey shut up don't be so loud you're going to be rational and be like okay hey this is bothering me but let's get back to the conversation but guess what you can stop listening but your body's not your body's going to be contracted you're going to get in your car you're going to get home and be like i don't know my back is hurting again i don't know why i can't really breathe today it's because your body's communicating with you hey there's some things inside of you whether it's anger that wants to be expressed for dad or sadness and pain.

1:03:35Why were you like this? Why wish we could, that needs to be expressed out of you. And that's everyone listening. When you feel awkward or feel triggered by someone else, that is your body talking to you. And you have two things you can do. You can either ignore it and judge them and be like, them. Or you can be like, why am I feeling this way in my body? There's something about this person, right? For me, and you said, I've been very open about this. Like I grew up in a place where we celebrated like frat living, right? Drinking, partying, Jersey Shore. This is where I was. Like you've seen the show.

1:04:08That's real. Like that's what the consciousness is. Guys would celebrate sleeping with the most women at the end of the summer. I was in that tornado. And there was a part of me that felt so inauthentic doing it because I knew I was much more soft. I knew I was much more gentle. I knew I was much more of, I want a connection. and I've always been more romantic. I grew up like that, right? But it was so hard not being that. It was easier being just one of the frat guys, right? So it took many years for me to come back to that place and go, hold on, wait, that's not too feminine, right? That's not too feminine.

1:04:44I can be sensual. I can move sensually. I can be slower. I can make love, not just f***, right? Like, and this is, this is where so many men are, this is me. I got to get out of me. How do I, instead of going, hold on, take a moment. Like what's true for you. And that's, that's when we talk about the sexuality and sensuality, but shame is everything. You could be ashamed to just be big. You could be ashamed to take up space. You could be ashamed to, to do anything. You could be ashamed when someone's angry and you don't want to get angry. Shame. That's why shame is such a iron blanket on our shoulders.

1:05:21and it puts our tails between our legs. And ultimately what that does is it holds back your authentic expression, which is ultimately the state of health that everyone, I want the world to be in is authentic expression. Because when you're in that state of health, you've told your body, I am me. And when you tell your body that, your nervous system is in harmony, you're immune, your hormones, your gut, you're able to eat what your body wants to because you know what you want to. And on top of that, you're giving to the world what you're here to do. right when you're in your authentic expression just you being you shifts mountains just by you being you don't have to put in the work you put in the work but you don't have to push against the grain you can just show up and flow and be like this is me and the words that i say that are authentic to me why are they touching millions of people it's because you're you and people feel that this is what you said in the beginning of the podcast before we started you go dr g you say these like things but people feel you people feel me because i'm coming from my authenticity bro Your work is so brilliant and profound, and I'm going to share with you, I'm going to confirm with what you just said.

1:06:23This last week, I was at a golf tournament, a celebrity golf tournament. I brought my son in it, and I want to make sure I say this the right way, but the night before the tournament, I ended up in a long conversation with Caitlyn Jenner. And I've watched Caitlyn's life when Caitlyn was Bruce. I'm old enough for that, for the Olympics. all the way through to this day. And I've always had a genuinely good feeling about her. Same time, that issue, I haven't been able to navigate my true feelings about, first off, I always want somebody to be able to express them true selves, but all the way to men, biological men fighting women in sports, all these issues are very complicated for me, and I don't feel comfortable with that.

1:07:10And then does that mean I'm not supporting of trans people? You know, that whole dynamic. and so there's been a I don't know what I would call it there's a curiosity slash probably some assessment of Caitlin for me and I ended up taught we ended up talking for like an hour and I can genuinely say that it was one of the most enjoyable conversations of my lifetime and it's one of the people it makes me emotional actually to say this one of the people I have liked the most I have ever met in my life. Trans, non-trans, athlete, non-athlete, celeb, non-celeb. So much so that the next day we were at another event together and we ended up sort of just gravitating to one another.

1:07:54She says, man, you keep showing up on my phone and all this motivational stuff. And I said, it's probably because we were talking and now the phone heard, you know, but we had this visit the next day. And then I watched how everyone responded and people filming her and this or that of the other thing. And I remember, I think the reason that I liked her so much is exactly what you just said, that assessment judgment, setting that aside, this person is their authentic self. And that overrides everything else. That's the noise in someone's life. And I think that's a pretty extreme case of someone expressing their true selves who knew they were going to take enormous criticism, enormous blowback.

1:08:34And then even in the trans community, because Caitlin doesn't support all of the, you know, niche issues of trans people. And so, wow, what a gutsy person to come out as trans to change their, their entire life and look. And then at the same time say, and I'm not locked up and barrel with all of you either on some of my beliefs. It's like that, no matter if you, I'm not saying I agree, disagree with stances, positions, any of that stuff. What I'm saying is what overrode all that was this human being is their authentic self. Man, is that attractive. Man, was that interesting. So much so that I'm expressing it on my show right now, a week later.

1:09:12So I just want to make sure that I acknowledge you guys, there is something to this, just being you and expressing you and being free to be you. That is so attractive, so magnetic. And magnetic, that's the word. And in order to be you, You have to face the parts of you that are you that you don't want to look at. You have to go into the proverbial house, the body, and open that closet that is the angry you with horns and fangs and a tail. And you have to open up the closet and you have to see yourself on a fetal position crying the heaviest tears you've ever cried. Or in another closet, you shaking so scared of monsters when you were a kid.

1:09:51Whatever it is, you have to see that in order for you to fully be you. Because ultimately, you know, you hear so many people go love yourself. and I go, what the f*** does that even mean? How do we even do that? Essentially, when we were children, we are this full spectrum of expression. We were that as kids. We know that because we were the saddest of the sads and then a minute later jumping on the bed and the joy is to the joy and everything in between. We and self-help and motivation, we go, let's just look at the light and you got to be all of the loving, positive emotions. Negative emotions, you know, go for a walk or do some breathing, meditate through them.

1:10:31No, man, you have to embody all parts of you. Until you embody all parts of you, you cannot use the word love for yourself. Unconditional love, you know when people say it's a container? What does that mean? It means it's the container that holds all parts of you. The heaven and the hell, the dark, the light, all parts of you. And then once you hold yourself fully, you can hold another. You can hold a lover. You can hold your children. Then you've held so much of your deep grief and deep sadness for the shit that's happened in your life that when your child cries, they ain't triggering you. You don't have to say, stop crying.

1:11:06You can be with them fully open hearted. You know how many women I see and they go, I love my dad. He provided and protected for us, but I never had an emotional connection to him. Why? It's because that man doesn't have an emotional connection to himself. He's never looked at the pain that he's holding. And until a man does that, it's going to be very difficult to have a deep connection with your wife and your daughter. So this is our responsibility as men. This is our responsibility as humans. And here's the biggest superpower all human beings have. We know. We have this awareness. Even if it's so turned up and we think we're unconscious, oh, we know.

1:11:39We know when we're not doing what our body wants to do. We know when we're not being authentic. We know when we're putting on a mask. We know. And we definitely know when people are doing it. This is why people can only fake people out for so long until things just stop working out for them. You can't just fake it out. At some point, people are going to see through a b****. And this is why we buy stock in people who we go, that's the authenticity. I want stock in that. Whatever they're talking about, they're just being them. And they're radiating from internal, external. And the external is aligning itself as the experience to them.

1:12:14Not internal, how do I show up for the world so everyone likes me? you got to be you and whoever likes you will they'll find their way to you brother this needs to go everywhere when we're talking about i mean how profound what you're just saying is like even if you don't even agree what i was just talking about with caitlin like you didn't even agree with the person's position or stance there's something so attractive about somebody saying this is who i am and it's okay if you don't like me and what ends up happening is there's a magnetism and affection and attraction to something that is real and true to somebody, even if it is like I have friends of mine that, you know, are super political.

1:12:54I'm really not that much, but like super left leaning, like, oh my gosh. And then I got friends that are super right leaning and they're both really great friends of mine because I know who they really are. And there's something awesome about that. Even if I think they're both wacky. Yeah, that's a beautiful way to say it. And this is what was happening. Caitlin was only mirroring your authenticity. What you saw in her is you. So that shows you there's parts of you that are dying to come out. That doesn't mean it has to be that. Yes. But there's parts of her, the authentic, the I'm big, I don't care who sees me.

1:13:32Maybe that's something in you that even more wants to be expressed. I think absolutely you're right. This is why we're attracted. This is why we're attracted to people who are being themselves unapologetically, not hurting people, but being them from their soul out to the world. That was a great conversation. Be sure to follow the Ed Milet Show on Apple and Spotify. Links are in the show notes. You'll never miss an episode that way. All right. Hey, welcome back, everybody, to the show. Today's an honor. I guess she's an icon. I think I would say she's an icon. I'm going to say that out loud. At 40?

1:14:04She's an icon. She's iconic for sure. And she's just a really special being. She's an immensely gifted artist, and you all know who she is once I say her name. But I've just watched her. When I used to watch her when she was young, I thought she was this really young soul. And as I've watched her become a woman, I think she stepped into a space where she's actually like a very old soul. No, thank you. Very wise. She's gone through a lot. She's grown a lot. And she's just got a new album out, by the way, that I absolutely love. I cried listening to a song on there called How Much a Heart Can Hold with my wife.

1:14:38And her new album is called God's Work. And I'm really honored that she's here today to share some time with all of you that I love so much. So, Leanne Rimes, thank you for being here. Thank you. Thanks for having me. So you go away and you come back. and I'm just curious like does the anxiety manifest itself in any area like could even be like coming here today or yeah like it does so you'll still you'll still and what does it look like for you like I don't really want to do this or I'm not good enough to do this or how do I get out of doing this or like oh no I mean I yeah I definitely could manifest in all those ways actually yeah me too that's why I asked I um I think it's definitely kind of comes back to this like worthy worthiness wound.

1:15:19Um, I know it is pretty crazy if you think about it because of all that I've accomplished in my life. And, and I, but I do think that that's why I was so adamant about accomplishing so much because I felt like I had to in order to receive love and in, and when you really boil it down, especially for myself, ultimately at the end of the day. And so now it's, I feel like that's definitely quieted down a lot. And I, like I said, I can stop myself this morning and be like, no, it's all okay. Like you can have all the anxiety and all these feelings of unworthiness and you can still show up and you're still going to, for me, it's like, I just ask, like, you know, I trust that whatever needs to come through will come through me and thanks.

1:16:03And that's the thing. Like you just, for me, I've learned to kind of move that piece of me just to the side, not like out of the way completely, just move it to the side, tell it it can be there like you can have your space in me today like you can be right here and I'm also with you there's another part of me that's here too um so it's a bit of compartmentalizing and at the same time allowing it to be complete like I you know for me in the past like I used to never have stage fright never have anxiety like when I was a kid I was just I felt super human and until I once I started to see my humanity it changed everything all of a sudden I had anxiety all of a sudden stage fright at times like I realized about when was that my humanity it started I would say it started um right maybe around 28 yeah 27 28 um me too for me it was when other people started to criticize me a little bit completely that's exactly when it happened my husband and I have been married for 12 years but we went through you know a very public affair and um I mean the press is just brutal and especially for a woman and especially for a young woman who they built up to be America's sweetheart forever yeah and so it was like the ultimate story for them and that's when I started judging myself through other people's eyes and one day that did switch and like maybe 32 or 33 I realized wait these are people's projections on to me like I don't have that's not who I am you know my my mistakes um I'm not my mistakes and I'm not I'm not who they say I am and I think that it took me it took me doing a lot of soul searching to recognize who I was in order for that not to be projected upon me yeah same with me yeah it's intense it's an intense role yeah and by the way this manifest this projection from other people manifest in your life listening to this, maybe the same way it does for you, Leanne and I, Leanne and I, but maybe differently.

1:18:08Maybe you're living someone's projection in your life. Your parents projected a particular career on you or beliefs in yourself or what you are or are not good at. They projected that onto you and you've adapted it and that's how you live your life. And so a lot of our lives, there's this whole thing, are we living in some ulterior dimension? You know, we're not, but we are oftentimes just living other people's projections. and for me and you it was like wow we were sort of achiever achiever achievers and then criticism and then I started to sort of look at myself as if maybe I've been fooling myself the whole time you know maybe maybe I am that horrible person right maybe I am and maybe part of those maybe some of it was true maybe some of it was true for me too some of it I was like oh I can see where I was kind of an asshole at that moment in time you know like oh I didn't you know I didn't take other people's feelings into consideration when I did blank whatever it may have been I can and look back now and go, oh yeah, there were parts of that that were true, but that's not totally, that's not who I am.

1:19:05Me too. Yeah. My way out, I'm curious what some of your ways are. Let's talk about some tools out for you. Yes. What works for you? Ice baths. No, I'm just kidding. We were just, for everybody, we were just talking about how much we can't stand ice baths before the show. Yeah, it's definitely not ice baths for the two of us right now. That's so dang funny. It's so true. I, for me, the hardest thing, I'll tell you something interesting because I've been in front of people. I conflated two things too. I conflated like love with significance. When I did significant things, I felt loved. So if I would just keep doing significant things and sometimes in life, these things also work for you.

1:19:46Like one of the reasons you were so successful is because you did make this. And then you're, oftentimes in life, if something works for you a little bit, it's really scary to give it up entirely. because you're like, that's part of my recipe. If I don't have anxiety or worry, maybe I won't practice this. I won't be on my A game. And so there's a nuance to life. That's the hard part about podcasting or writing a book. It's like there's a nuance to something. But for me, the hardest thing that is now the most beautiful thing is what you just said earlier, me being alone with me. I realized like maybe it's different for a woman, but maybe it's not.

1:20:22But like for me, like I never even just stopped and really just like looked at me in a mirror. Like just not, I'd look at like, is my hair messed up or something? But I mean, just like, I love this man. I've like, I've never done, I had never done that. Like, I love this man. This is a good man. I never would stop. I was just doing life. And then this idea of like getting alone with myself and being quiet and like just being with my breathing and these were so difficult for me. And when they were difficult for me, I thought, well, maybe that's because it would be so valuable for me if I could do it.

1:20:56And so for me, forms of meditation have helped me a lot. Sometimes like actually writing for me can be a form of meditation. So what's worked for you? Like if you were to share with someone who says, I got anxiety, I got worry, I got fear, I got anger. What has actually worked most of the time? Yeah, I mean, I think that piece of creativity is super important. I mean, we're all creative beings. That is our nature. and I think until we nurture that nature um and find a way of doing that like and I think what's so interesting too is we are all so unique like what works for one person will not work for the next person possibly and you know it's just you have to find your own path with it so I I dip in and out of things all the time meditation is pretty much a non-negotiable for me even if it's five minutes during the day i just need to sit breathe um and you know i'll take in an inhale and like and do it like double time that double longer excel that usually will help my anxiety a little bit um but yeah i mean i've really gotten into recently um working a lot with my physical body like balancing my hormones like i've i kind of went from at the beginning meditation and breathing to now like going running the gamut of pretty much everything you can think of But, you know, physical, mental, spiritual, like emotional, it's all important.

1:22:18You can't leave one out. You really can't. Writing, I think, you know, has been such a big thing for me also creating. And I. Yeah, it's interesting that you just said because something clicked for me is you said that, you know, we get projected upon like the things we're good at, things we're not good at. I think leaning into the things I've been told I wasn't good at. Like I, I, I don't like to dance. Like it really, I do not like to move my body. And there was, I think that also has to do with, um, old, uh, religious programming too. Um, but it's, I had this whole thing around, someone told me one time that I was a better singer than I was a dancer and I stopped dancing.

1:23:00And which by the way, like I might've been a fine dancer, but if you're going to tell me a better singer, I mean, I'm like, I'm, I was exceptionally good at singing. So I couldn't dance that well, too. But yeah, I felt like I just stopped doing it. And so for me, finding what those places are that feel really uncomfortable. And even if it's for me, putting one song on and like moving my body freely is when I do that, I'll ball, like I'll ball and I'll have so much joy at the same time. and then I'll stop. I'm like, okay, that's kind of my threshold of how I lean into those things. But I feel like it's finding those places for people that are scary and walking into them.

1:23:47And you don't have to just run and jump off the cliff. Just dipping a toe into things to expand who we believe ourselves to be. Yeah. Like it just it opens our lives up in every other aspect, not just that one little space, but in every other aspect of our life starts to change. You're so right. That's where I want to go to. You're like doing the interview. But like I tied up my identity into everything outside of me all of my life. So like if I made money or I got a muscle or whatever it was, it was my identity was always tied to the external. man it worked for me for a long time yeah it does it works it works but it like when I got wealthy or whatever like I it never was quite what I thought it would be when I would get there and I think it was because I had I had tied it to the external instead of like like I I just love this work I love doing this work so you had to have had your identity completely tied up and being famous or being a singer and did you have you unpacked that at all like someone Your identity could be that, and stay with me, your identity could be that you're a mother.

1:25:01Yeah, absolutely. Well, someday, by the way, someday you'll be an empty nester. And then what? Right? So it could be anything out there. But did you, you must have had a lot of that. It's still tied up. And to a certain extent around my voice. I went through this few days the other day where I was thinking, like, what could I live without? And when I really. What could I live without? Yeah. Like, could I live without my voice? and that was one big one where I was like I don't want to but if I had to I guess I would have to and I just looked up at the sky I was like don't do that to me so you know this is not an invitation let's not prove it to test that theory right but I you know I there was like my wedding it was interesting things like my wedding ring like was really it's really important to me and yeah it's random little things that I was like it's a powerful question yeah it was and I was like okay well maybe that's because of how important like relationships I was told how important relationships were at a certain age you know like well how are these things how are why why are the the few things that I wouldn't really want to let go of why are they so important so I went through that for a moment and my my voice is definitely one of those weird things when you're born into this world with something like that and you know as you get older like things shift and change and I know that I'm not gonna be doing this my whole life you know I mean who knows but I mean I I at some point I I feel like I want a different experience that's been the new thing for me too is that that whole term different experience um especially when shifting things it's like oh I want a different experience what's a different experience look like so it's been something I've been playing with and I know for me like I will want a different experience one day than being on the road yeah so and i don't know i mean i've i've had moments like look covid you know gave us an opportunity to kind of untangle from all of those things that we were attached to and i did for a moment and i was i was okay with it i was okay with it i think look i you know i just released an album i um i haven't ever i don't even look at charts anymore like i don't know what what it did I really don't and I maybe part of that self preservation and also part of it though is not the reason I do it anymore like the reason I do it is to connect with people and help shift help them shift or help them question and it's really yeah it's so interesting how my reason for doing things has shifted it really has what was someone listening to this and they just said hey I'm curious to hear I saw you on a stage I don't remember whose event it was It was Louis's.

1:27:43Oh, yeah. It was Louis's. I swear I met you. Yeah. Yeah. And I had to go up after you, I think. You did? I think I had to go up after you. I was like, I'm not, I rarely have ever had that feeling in my life. I don't want to go up after that because the room was so moved. I just thought, she's going to be doing this too. Like, meaning this, meaning like leveraging this gift she has, but it was much more like direct approach. It wasn't like just enjoy my work. There was a message, spoken message, some chanting with it. I'm surprised you haven't gone further down that road. It's something I want to do.

1:28:20Maybe today's the beginning. Yeah, no, right? It is. It's funny when you asked me to come on here, that's what I thought about. And I remember you saying to me, you came up after and you were like, you've never done this before? Because I had such a, I was going through this whole thing with Louis. I'm like, I don't speak. I speak during my shows, but you're asking me to give a speech. and he's like just come do it for like 10 minutes and then you can sing and then we'll have a chat I'm like cool I can do that but it did give me this bug of this is another way for me to share yes and connect with people and when you asked me to do this it made me think of that I'm like you know what I need to do that I've been speaking for 30 years one time ever I went I would really prefer not to go up right now after that person and it was you I'm serious and it's not because you could sing better than me I think that's kind of a given I was like no something just happened in the room right now that I'm not so sure I can match or do anything better than.

1:29:11And I'm dead serious when I say that to you. It's the heart. It's the heart. I mean, I think that I was so open. I mean, I walked up on stage and just started bawling because it was, I was conquering. And that's what I talked about. I was, I'll cry now. I was conquering a huge fear. Yeah. And I know that that's also the reason why I haven't done more of it. But the reason, as I'm crying, the reason I know I need to. Which is rather remarkable that you of all people were uncomfortable getting up in front of a group. But the lesson in it, the reason I bring it up is the lesson. I made a post Saturday about this.

1:29:43Like, start a new hobby. You said a new experience. That's the pathway to bliss, everybody. That's the pathway. Is to do something new that you feel ill-prepared for. That's a bit scary. But maybe you have some potential proclivity for it. Like, I shouldn't decide that right now I'm going to start doing 360 windmill dunks. It's just not a lot of dudes that are my build that are doing that right now So it's got to be something that you have some proclivity for but create a new experience Like even if you're great at something to your point like you're you're the best at what you do But do you want that to be the entire experience of your life?

1:30:17Yeah, right? Like that's the juice of life And so why I was so proud of you not even knowing you that day and then to watch you just go wow But I remember thinking this is probably something she's gonna do a lot of and then really you haven't very much since that No, I haven't since then. Well, but also COVID happened along those lines too. Yeah, that's true. But it is something that I've, I just had this huge meeting the other day with my team and I'm like, that is on the docket of things to walk into. Well, you just got introduced to a couple million more people who wanted you to do it. So it's really good.

1:30:50I did a chant record during the middle of COVID because I felt like people just, people needed it, which was something new for me. I've never kind of branched out and did that. And then I think that kind of, you know, that informed this new record. And I'm also working on a chant too at the moment. So I'm wanting to create this whole like sound experience for people. You guys, when she does this, it's unreal. It's unreal. She did it that day. It's unreal.

1:31:31Auf Wiedersehen.