The Brutally Honest Cost of Success | Ep 962

24 Oct 2025 · 43 min

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Notes on Podcast Episode: The Brutally Honest Cost of Success | Ep 962

Podcast Overview

  • Host: Alex Hormozi
  • Theme: Insights on entrepreneurship, customer acquisition, and lessons learned from personal experience in business.
  • Episode Focus: The cost of success and the necessity of doing "more" for achieving exceptional results.

Key Themes and Discussions

  1. The Reality of Sacrifice for Success
  2. Friendships and Lifestyle Changes:
  3. Success often requires giving up old friendships, hobbies, and a typical lifestyle.
  4. As you progress, not everyone will understand your journey or support your ambitions.
  • Support System:
  • An exceptional life leads to rejection from those who don't understand your goals, but this must be accepted for growth.
  1. The Importance of Doing "More"
  2. Core Principle:
  3. Every entrepreneur must address the question: "Why can't I do more?"
  4. Achieving more is linked to sheer volume and effort, which often leads to breakthroughs.
  • Napoleon's Quote:
  • "Quantity has a quality of its own," emphasizing that doing more often leads to better results.
  1. Anecdotes of Success Through Volume
  2. Sharon's Experience:
  3. Increased a business's value from $200 million to $1.2 billion by participating in 260 events in a year, showcasing the power of volume in generating demand.
  • Personal Fitness Journey:
  • Hormozi increased his muscle mass significantly by committing to a high volume of workouts, showcasing personal insight into achieving goals through more effort.
  1. Mindset on Quality vs. Quantity
  2. Pottery Class Example:
  3. A class focused on quantity produced better quality pots than one focused solely on quality, reinforcing that quantity can lead to quality improvements.
  1. Cultural Ethos in Business
  2. Acquisition.com Philosophy:
  3. The culture encourages asking, “How can we do more?” and emphasizes the value of leverage in increasing output.
  • Achieving Exceptional Results:
  • To be in the top 1%, individuals must enter competitive environments and consistently outperform others.
  1. Risk-Adjusted Returns through Increased Effort
  2. Maximizing Returns:
  3. Rather than focusing on optimization (getting more from less), focus on maximizing inputs to achieve greater outputs.
  4. Example: Investing more money to generate a larger absolute return rather than worrying about diminishing returns.
  1. Challenges of Change in Business
  2. Fixed Costs vs. Variable Rewards:
  3. Changes in business practice often lead to initial performance drops, making it critical to discern when to implement changes.
  • Prioritization:
  • Small teams should focus on one significant change per year due to limited resources.
  1. Consistency and Decision Making
  2. Consistency is Key:
  3. The effort must be consistent; without sustained effort, success falters.
  • Decision to Go Pro:
  • Individuals must decide to fully commit to their goals, understanding that recognition for hard work often goes unnoticed.
  1. Final Thoughts
  2. Hormozi emphasizes that success is a product of deliberate actions over time and that the journey will often be lonely and misunderstood by those around you.
  3. The challenge lies not in the desire to do more but in the commitment to executing consistently at that level.

Key Takeaways

  • Success Requires Sacrifice: Expect lifestyle changes and understand that not everyone will support your journey.
  • Volume Matters: Doing more can often lead to breakthroughs and better outcomes.
  • Prioritize Projects: Focus on significant changes that will yield the best returns.
  • Consistency is Crucial: Daily commitment to effort is vital for achieving success.
  • Maximize, Don't Optimize: Focus on maximizing your efforts rather than getting bogged down with trying to optimize every small detail.

This episode of "The Game" with Alex Hormozi provides valuable insights into the necessary mindset and actions required for achieving significant success in any endeavor.

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Transcript

Automatic transcript. May contain errors.

0:00Do you think that you can keep the same friends? Do you think that you can keep the same hobbies? Do you think you can stay up late and sleep in on weekends? Do you think that you don't have to sacrifice what average people care about? Do you think that they will support you when you start to pass them? Do you think anyone will think this is healthy, balanced, or logical? No. And they're right.

0:24Yeah, I went white shirt today. It's been a little wild. So as you guys are hopping on I told you that my two kind of themes for this year are Live and interactive for my media and so I'm telling you guys right now you guys make content I'll tell you my cards like we just started and so we're gonna be doing this more I'll tell you why a couple reasons and then I'll get into the stuff. I want to talk about today. I think that fundamentally we have to Do stuff we like which sounds kind of obvious And so if you want to do a tremendous amount of volume of anything like it's very hard to do it if you don't enjoy it.

0:54And so I've kind of taken the perspective yet again, and I think this is like a calibration thing. Like you do stuff you like, you find a portion of it that works really well, you do a ton of that, and then you kind of go off over here, and then you're like, okay, I don't like this anymore. And so you kind of come back to center. And so I enjoy talking to you guys more than anything else, which is why that's kind of the center pillar of what I'm gonna be doing for media strategy going forward. As a result, though, I think we'll be able to put out like a huge amount more volume because me trying to think of like, hey, you know, what's a really interesting topic that I can bring on today or riff on today is different than just like helping you guys solve your problems specifically.

1:25And so the way that today is going to be structured is same as last week. I'm going to do a quick kind of top of mind thing that I've been thinking a lot about. And then I'm going to be answering questions from y 'all. All right. So to do the job, your love thing, Sammy, by the way, hilarious. And like everybody knows what she's saying, but there is some hilarious meme accounts on that that are just like S tier. All right. With that being said, I'm going to do a quick YouTube intro so you guys can actually see this in like real time, how we do it. and then I'm going to get into my little mini topic of today.

1:54All right? I have used one strategy to win repeatedly across 13 years in business and also outside of business. And it's one of the biggest reasons that we had a$105 million launch for$100 million Money Models in 72 hours for my latest book. And I'm going to explain why it's the highest risk-adjusted return move that you can make to win more in business or just win more in life. And so if you're not sure what to do right now within your specific business, no matter what industry or size business you're in or whatever goal you're pursuing, this will help. I talk about more, better, new, a lot. But I want to dive into the one that is near and dear to my heart, the one that has made me the man that I am, which is more.

2:34And I want to talk about that because the fundamental question that every single business owner needs to answer and even every person pursuing any skill or endeavor needs to answer is, why can't I do more? And for most people, doing more is the answer. And it's far more common than it is more. What's very sneaky about more is that you get to a point and then you say, there's no way I can do more. And at that point is where the big unlocks in volume really occur, right? And so Napoleon had this really great quote back in the day, and maybe it's misattributed to him, but he said, I'm sorry, quantity has a quality unto itself.

3:06Meaning like if you do so much volume, you do so much work, and in the military sense, if you just have so many people, at some point it almost takes on its own quality of the amount of work, the amount of people, the amount of volume that you're putting into something, whatever it is that you want to break through. I wanted to give you a couple cool little anecdotes to reinforce this. So some of you guys know about Sharon. He was on the live with me. He's our president at ACQ. I'll tell you two stories about Sharon that really drove this home. And I can tell you so many of them in my life. But one of them about Sharon that really like, I'll tell you the moment where like we went from being friends to me being like, man, I really want him to be, you know, president of acquisition.com.

3:43So he was talking about how he was growing real. And so real is a $200 million or was a$200 million per year business after a$200 million market cap. So they're publicly traded. And he was talking to me of the business. And he had grown it from$200 million to$1.2 billion in less than three years, so like 30 months. And I want to put that there as a moment for you guys to think about that, how insane that is. $200 million to$1.2 billion, less than three years. How does he do it? We're having dinner. And he says, I just did 260 events in the last 365 days. And I was like, what do you mean? And he was like, I flew around and I did every single real estate event.

4:21I spoke on every single stage. And that's how I generated more demand for our platform for realtors. And when he said that to me at dinner, I was like, this guy, he gets it. Now we've been friends for years, but seeing him so tactically involved in the business and being like, that was the thing that took a$200 million business to$1.2 million. Just sheer volume. Now, most people might hear that and think, well, yeah, I speak on stages one time a month. And I'm on stages all the time. It's like, no, no, you're not on stages all the time. You have no idea what being on stages all the time actually means.

4:57And so most business owners wildly underestimate the amount of volume, one, that is required and two that they are capable of. All right. And the thing that is required is almost always higher or sorry, your capability is always higher than what is required. But the thing is, is that you might not know it yet. And so I've had so many times in my life that has become my de facto operating principle. Like I got stuck in trying to grow muscle for a really long time. And this is before I took testosterone. All right. So to be very clear, I've taken testosterone, exogenously injected inside of me and gotten all the man juice.

5:30But this was before that. And I was able to put on like another 20 or 30 pounds, like seven years into lifting. And the main thing was I ended up saying, well, I wonder what would happen if I made it my job to lift all day. And I was like, well, what does that mean? So I lived at a gym, obviously, because I had my own gym. And I set a timer to work out every 45 minutes. So I'd set up three exercises. And every 45 minutes, I'd go in the gym and I'd hit one set on all of them. And I'd go back to work. And I was doing nine or 10 sets every day, right? Which is a lot of sets. And I did it every day.

6:05And so what ended up happening is that like in a matter of four weeks, I put like 15, 16 pounds on. And I was like, holy, and it broke me through all these plateaus of size and strength that I had been stuck at for years. And so then later I was like, let me see if I can do it for six weeks and do it even more volume. And that's what ended up happening. Now to be clear, some people have different genetics. Some people have, you know, their joints can't take it, whatever. But the point is, is that the solution set we have to think about is like, how can I do more? And the answer to that question, the thing that's stopping you is the constraint of the business.

6:35All right. And so many of you guys have heard the story of the pottery class where you have a teacher, he signs two classes, you guys, you will get graded on making the best pot. So the quality of your pot is what I'm going to grade you on. And the other class, he said, I'm going to grade you on the number of pots that you make. And at the end of the semester, quality team had made one pot and it was decent. And then the team that had just done sheer volume of pots, not only did they make way more pots, their pots were better. And so the thing is, is that kind of like the Napoleon quote, quantity takes on a quality unto itself.

7:05Like you get better by doing more. And so that is why there's this tied relationship between the two that's massively linked that people underestimate. And so I want to read you this. This is from my internal sales handbook that I have for my sales team. Because I want to set, like this is the culture of acquisition.com, we ask, how can we do more? How can we do more? Now, leverage is a part of doing more inputs and outputs. If we can get more output with leverage, let's do it. Let me read this to you because I think it'll frame how we think about this. Many people say they want to be in the top 1 % or 0.1 % or even 0.01%, but saying that has zero bearing on whether it happens.

7:42Achievement comes from actions, not aspirations. So let's get real. To be the top 1%, you need to enter a room of 100 people and leave number one. To be the top 0.1%, you need to enter a room of 1 ,000 people, like a local high school, and leave number one. To be the top 0.01%, you need to enter an arena of 10 ,000 people and leave number one. Think about it, a stadium. And in a battle to the death in that stadium, you have to come out on top. You beat everyone. Not almost everyone, everyone. And so if you have the goal to be in the top 0.01%, do you think that you can live a normal life? Do you think that you can keep the same friends?

8:25Do you think that you can keep the same hobbies? Do you think you can stay up late and sleep in on weekends? Do you think that you don't have to sacrifice what average people care about? Do you think that they will support you when you start to pass them? Do you think anyone will think this is healthy, balanced, or logical? No. And they're right. But it doesn't matter. When you want to be the 0.01%, there's no greater waste of time than explaining stuff to people who actively don't support you. It's normal for people to not understand why you do what you do. I say this because you cannot make yourself exceptional and live a normal life.

9:02To make yourself exceptional, you must live an exceptional life. And an exceptional life does not always mean better. It just means that it's so different that most people will reject it and you. And when that happens, you must reject them as well. Oil and water do not mix. That is what it really means to be exceptional. You must become the exception. So I routinely get asked the secret to success. And it just comes down to this. Number one, get better. Number two, never stop. If you do only those two things, you will win on a long enough time horizon. The problem is people convince themselves they no longer want something once they see the experience of how hard it really is.

9:43So I want to set this expectation for you as you head off to practice scripts, mark your calendar and set your alarms. The work begins when your motivation ends. Just win. That's from our internal handbook that we have at ACQ for our sales guys. And it's one of the ways that we welcome guys on. And I want to read that to you because I want to frame what I'm talking about today. It seems like a very simple thing, just saying, just do more. But like, it's almost become an art form and something that I have like a deep passion about, which is very odd to say. But more actually has the highest risk-adjusted return move that you can possibly make within the business.

10:16The reason more has the highest risk-adjusted return for a business or for you is that it's so hard to get something to work, right? Many of you guys have tried anything. You have a new marketing channel, a new sales script, a new offer. You try a bunch of things, and then finally something works. The likelihood that you're changing that thing and that next thing working is actually statistically very low. Think about how many different things you had to try before something actually worked. And so the idea is, okay, I have these limited resources. I can allocate them to take a risk and roll the dice, or I have this thing that I know works, and I need to jam more into that machine, which is why it's the highest risk of just a return move.

10:55Now, one of the other misconceptions, I think, is that there's a huge preponderance of people who talk about optimization, getting as much as you can for as little as you can. And I don't think there's anything wrong with that. The difference is that there are optimizers and there are maximizers. maximizers try to ask the question, how do I get as much as I possibly can? Optimizers ask, how do I get as much as I can out of as little as I can? But when you're looking at returns, maximizers win. So what's the difference between first place, you know, gold in the Olympics and second in the Olympics?

11:27Silver, right? A tenth of a second in a race. But what is the realistic difference, the real world or pragmatic difference between being the best in the world and second best? everything. And so when you're talking to an Olympian, you're talking to somebody who wants to be the top 1%, 0.01%, 0.00001%, diminishing returns are still returns. It's you need to do more because you're trying to win, not be cute about saying that you had great return. And I say this as somebody who was a converted optimizer. So in the earlier part of my life, I really prided myself on doing school with as little work as possible.

12:04I was like, you nerds, I was like, you guys needed to study, I can walk in and hit a 91 with no studying. And I'll tell you the story that really, really changed my life. So this guy named Kemp Knott, I gave Kemp a hard time. I did when I was in high school. And he was a kid who didn't catch on to stuff as fast. And you know, Kemp's a successful guy, now he's done great. But this thing happened. So all of high school, I kind of gave this guy a hard time. And when we went to go apply to colleges, I wanted to go to Duke. So Duke's a top five school in the US. And I didn't get into Duke. I ended up going to Vanderbilt, which is also obviously a great school, but I wanted to go to Duke.

12:39And guess who got into Duke? Kemp Knott. And so what was really interesting is that this whole time, like Kemp would go to study hall. He'd be like, teacher, you forgot to assign his homework. Like he was that guy, right? And I honestly just really disliked him, but mostly because it probably just reminded me of my own inadequacies of like, I was just unwilling to do the amount of work that he was. And I shamed him for doing the amount of work that he did. I was like, you have to work so hard just to try and just try and come close to me, right? But in the end, he got into the better college. And so it was this really humbling lesson for me that it was like, none of the colleges cared that I worked less than him.

13:17They just cared about who had the best applications and who had the best grades. And it was this really like very eye-opening experience. And so when I went to college, I had a different frame that I was like, well, I'm not going to lose. I want to go here and I want to maximize. I want to study all the hours of the day that I'm not in class, at the gym, or at the cafeteria. I'm in the library. And you can ask anyone that I ever went to school with, if you ever meet them. Like, that's where I was. I was in the library 12 hours a day because I was like, well, if I just study more than everyone, I'll get good grades.

13:47And that worked out pretty good, right? And so that's just kind of a, just a little bit of framing around why I have such a, such a strong affinity for more. Now, I'll give you a second, kind of a little bit more heady reasons. So I talked about how more is the highest risk adjusted return. I talked about how diminishing returns are still returns. They're still at the end of the, they're still output, right? The next piece though, is that change has a fixed cost, all right? And a variable reward. All right. So let me explain what that means. So if we have this thing that's working, right? So I want you to imagine that this line right here, Ooh, nice and wet.

14:22Oh, I like it. My markers, Calm down, guys. Okay. So I've got this line. This represents your revenue or whatever your current level of activity or output is. Okay, this is output. Whatever your thing is. Okay. Now, what happens is most entrepreneurs, they say, you know what? I'm going to change something. All right? And guess what happens? Because they think they're going to change something and things are going to get better. Right? You tweak something. You mess around. You change your page. Change your script. Change your onboarding process. Whatever. Right? So then what happens? Well, if there's people involved, typically output will go down.

14:51You have to retrade the team. They have to practice. You know, this variable affected two other variables you didn't know about. And so you get, and this is completely based on my observation, you typically get about a 20 % decrement or decrease in performance, okay? And so what this has created for me is my minimum rule of 20%, which is that if something is going to give me a guaranteed 20 % decrease in output by me changing it. Now, this is initial. What ends up happening after that is it might not work, and then you stay here, or it might be worse, and it goes here, or it might get better, and it comes back up eventually, right?

15:29And then maybe you have a 5 % higher output here, and now this is now your new baseline is a little bit higher than it was before. Now, here's the thing. If you have a 20 % guaranteed decrease, and you have the potential for a 5 % increase, do you take that bet? No. But I see entrepreneurs every day, myself included, for many years, taking that bet over and over again because I was like, I just have to get it better. I just have to get it better. But it was a fallacy. It's not true. Your business will never be perfect, and you have to accept that back. It will not be perfect. You will always see things that you could.

16:04And the thing is, you don't even know if it's going to get better. You just aren't sure if it's, quote, good enough, and so you just want to change it. You want to mess with it. But the magic is the compounding returns you get when you do the same thing over and over again. You get this depth of understanding, this depth of skill that happens with repetition, right? If necessity is the mother of invention, repetition is the father of skill, all right? So coming back to our 20 % here, right? This is cute, right? But let's look at what entrepreneurs will normally do. Maybe they'll start seeing some increase here, but what do they do next?

16:34They say, you know what? I've got this other idea I have. And so then they get another 20 % decrease. And so they're constantly living significantly below their output means or your revenue or whatever your thing is below what your potential is because you're constantly changing stuff. And I want to be real with you for a second. If you're a small business owner, you've got maybe 10, maybe 20 employees, or if you have anything less than that, then hear me right now. The amount of resources that you have to implement change are so limited. They're so limited. I pick one big thing a year that I do.

17:10Like one. And what happens is when you realize how limited your resources are in order to deploy successfully a new change or a new experiment, what happens is it forces prioritization. It forces you to focus on what things, if I only had one thing that I could do this year, what one thing would I be like, this is the bet I'm going to take? Well, it certainly wouldn't be a 5 % thing, right? Well, maybe if we write handwritten cards, we'll get a 5 % increase in referrals. Maybe, right? But given those resources, what else could you do? And so when you look at the whole thing, the whole spectrum, and this is how I want to frame strategy for you around this.

17:48So most people think about business strategy. I got this from Sharon. I love this. I'm using it all the time. It's so good. Most people think about business strategy like they think about making dinner. So they go to their kitchen. They open up the fridge. They look what's inside and say, what am I going to whip up? That's how they think about business strategy. But the question that we should be asking isn't, what am I going to whip up from what's inside the fridge? we should ask the question, what the fuck do I want to eat? And then go get the ingredients and go make it happen. And so when you have, when you're saying, I'm only going to take one bet or two bets this year, they're going to be material.

18:20Then it forces you to be like, it's got to be worth it. Because here's the part that no one else knows. Assume this is still the same output, right? You've got your output. What happens is that if you change nothing, believe it or not, people get better at their jobs. People just keep getting better. They get more skilled. And so you'll typically have one, two, three percent increases that happen kind of month over month from you just not changing anything, from just leaving it alone. And so this has taken me so much time because I'm a natural, I'm a yes hinge, right? I'm like, let's do it. Let's shake it up.

18:51Let's change things. Because the thing is, is I have this need from my business. Like earlier days, the business satisfied multiple needs and I didn't satisfy the business's needs, meaning I had cravings for novelty. I wanted to do new things. I would get bored of doing the same thing over again. And so because of that boredom, I would say, let's shake it up. But why? Because the times I've made the most money in my life have not been when I've been changing the most. It's actually when the business has been really boring and we're just blocking and tackling and doing it over and over again. And so this is something that some people never learn.

19:25Honestly, a lot of entrepreneurs never learn this. And the hard question, the hard problem to solve is not the new idea that you want to try. It's how can I do more once I've already exhausted my existing way of doing more? I'll tell you a story to illustrate this. So I went and spoke at this personal training thing, God, I don't know, eight years ago, long time, right? So I was still successful gym once at this time. So I was like considered an authority just within the fitness space. And so I go there and I give my whole, you know, I give my whole presentation or whatever. And so then a girl raised her hand and asked a question.

19:56She said, hey, I currently do outbound DMing from my Instagram to get customers, but I want a more scalable method of acquisition. And I kind of looked at her. I was like, what do you mean? She's like, well, outbound doesn't really scale. And I was like, in what world do you think that outbound doesn't scale? Of course it scales. Some of the biggest companies in the world do exclusively outbound. The problem that she had an encounter was how do I hire, onboard, and train another SDR or another outbound route or another DM setter, right? And so some people get to like five and they're like, there's no way I can have more than that.

20:31But that becomes the complex problems that we then get to solve rather than saying, I'm going to do something new, right? And so I bring this up because, and I'll circle back to this 20 % real quick. So for me, the minimum rule is that it's got to be over 20 % if I'm going to get a 20 % loss guaranteed, right? Of course. But I don't even know if I'm going to get this 20 % because we have to analyze this through. This is an investor frame, by the way. It's called ICE, right? Which is impact, which is like how big, right? Confidence is how likely. And then ease is what are the resources required for us to make this thing happen, right?

21:09Now, the perfect world is something that has gigantic impact, gigantic competence, and super easy, right? That would be the best type of thing. And so when we have a risk-adjusted return move, we think, okay, I think this could double the business. I have super high confidence, and I think it could be easy. Then those are the types of bets we want to take. Because said differently, if you know that somebody could double your business with one move, why would you do three, right? Just because you have this compulsion to be busy, to mess with your team, doesn't mean it's what the business requires.

21:43Real. And so a lot of people use the business to satisfy their own ADD, to satisfy their own need for novelty. When the business thrives on same, it's very rare that you're Kodak and you need to adjust to the digital world. It's very rare. We love to tell these stories, but what we don't tell is the guy who just said, you know what? I've got three levels of my membership and we're doing a million dollars a year. How do I 10x my traffic and get to$10 million a year? And then once I'm there, what do I need to do to get to another 10x of traffic, to get to$100 million a year? We don't ask those questions, right?

22:18Because one of the fallacies or the pains of small business owners is that we, and myself included, right, we consistently think small. We don't think big enough. And so let me give you an example on this, right? So let's say this is where people get obsessed around optimization. They get obsessed around relative returns rather than absolute returns. So let me tell you, let me give you two examples of this. So let's say that you've got a marketing campaign where you put$100 in and you get, call it, let's say you get$1 ,000 out, okay? So this is 10 to 1. Amazing, right? Cool. But as soon as you scale to$200, let's say that you now are getting 6 to 1.

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23:03So you get$1 ,200, which is pretty bad. you know, you spend twice as much money and you only made$200 more, right? Most people would say, oh, I should stop doing this. The maximizer says, we made more money. Net-net, we made 900 here, 1 ,000 minus 100. Here, we made 1 ,000. This is still more. And this is what people miss out on. And so people think, and what happens is when you're a small business owner, you get obsessed with these relative returns. And there's a point where you do want really high relative returns. You want a big high LTV to CAC and we can get into some of that stuff. But I want to just put a pin in this from a larger thinking perspective because I will see people stay in these optimization loops for years, right?

23:49They're like, I got it. You know, my opt-in page converts at 30%, right? This is my opt-in. And they'll just keep testing it, trying to get it to 35 or 40 or 45%. But the thing is, is like, you will never 10X your business by getting this 30 % will never go. It will never go to 300%. It's never going to happen. But you can 10x your inputs. You can do more. You can do more and you can send more in and then that will for sure increase your output, even if your relative return goes down. And so if I had the choice between spending$10 ,000 and making$100 ,000 back, 10 to 1, or spending$1 ,000 ,000 and getting$2 ,000 ,000 back, two to one, I would take a million in to get two back every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

24:38Why? Because it's more. It's still more. It's absolute returns, absolute output, right? And so when you're thinking about yours, and I'll bring this to business now, right? I mean, I've been talking about business, but like more to business, more tactical. We have our core four, right? We have our four ways of getting customers. We've got our warm outreach. We've got our cold outreach. we've got content, and then we've got paid, right? We have paid ads. These are the only four things that you can do. And so the magic is answering the question of how can I go from one piece of content to 100 a week, right?

25:16And I'll tell you this, you know, I'll tell you a quote from Elon, and then I'll tell you a story that I just had. So Elon, he talks often about like, you know, figure out your 10-year goal and then ask yourself, what would it take to get this accomplished in six months? You might not accomplish it in six months, but you'll get there way faster than the guy who accepted it was going to take 10 years, right? And so I do love the frame of like, they're going to capture your kids, they're going to capture your wife, they're going to capture the thing that you care the most about. What would you do if you actually had to get this many people to start working for you for AppRind or get the sales stream trained up or actually make 100 pieces of content when you're currently making one a day?

25:47What would you actually do? Like, what would you actually do? And then, and it's worth answering the question, not saying I couldn't, You answer the question and you say, this is what I would do. And then, this is the trick, then you say, what kind of resources would be required to make that happen? So what would it take in terms of what would the actions be? And then secondarily, what are the resources required to make that happen? And you'll often find that it's far fewer than you expect. So I'll tell you a story. This happened literally yesterday. So guys here at one of our workshops, he's doing, I think he's doing 10 minutes, six, six?

26:26I can't remember. I think it was$10 million a year. It was$10 million a year, and he's got a healthcare-related business. So he's got workers that do health-related stuff, whatever. And so he's got 38 of them. He's got unlimited demand. His phone's ringing off the hook. He can't deliver. So he's supply constrained. And so I say, all right, so if you could get twice as many people on your staff, your business would double. I said, is that correct? He said, yes, that's correct. I said, okay. And I said, what are your current channels? And he's like, I've got these two recruiters. They send me one good candidate a month that I end up hiring.

27:00And then I've got this education program that I work with the colleges, and I get another one person every quarter from them. So he's got 12 plus 3 that are coming in a year, roughly, or 12 plus 4, so 14-ish people. He currently had 38 to 40. So that's a 30 % growth rate. And there's nothing wrong with that. But that growth rate is going to diminish as the base gets bigger, unless you find a new way. And so I said, all right, how much do you make in gross profit off of a new provider? He said, about$100 ,000 a year. That's what he makes. I said, okay, that's what you make. I said, what are you currently paying a recruiter to go get this?

27:37$5 ,000. I said, okay, could you imagine a world where you'd pay$25 ,000 and you'd spin up 10 recruiters and you'd say, I want you to give me five people and you have to give me a guarantee for six months that you replace them as many times as possible because that was the big risk that he had. What if I hire somebody? They're not good, right? And I want you to also add in a guarantee that if in six months I don't keep them, you replace them at cost, right? And so I'm willing to pay you more, but I want this guarantee and I want it over this period of time. If you did that, right? And this business I think was doing around$2 million in profit a year, all right?

28:12Only is 10 million. And so I said, okay, for$1 million, half of your current profit, right? $1 million, 25K, what does that get us? It gets us 40 new providers, which is the exact size of his current business. And so for$1 million, that investment, you double the business. Now, partially there's incremental margin that there, so it should probably be larger than doubling the profit of the business. But here's where this gets really interesting. Let's say this business, I'll give you the math here. So$10 million top line,$2 million dollars in profit. All right, this business probably trades at around 8x, which means right now it's a 16 million dollar business, okay?

28:52Now, when he has his two million dollars in profit, he's got two options. Option one, he just pays taxes on it, and he lived in California, and so he's only going to have one million dollars after taxes, or more realistically, if you live in California, nothing. I'm kidding. You'll have 17 dollars after taxes. You will have a lawsuit and to high five. The alternative here is that he can invest it. Now, let me explain how that works. So if he invests it here and he gets his 40 guys, number one, he takes his tax bill down and he cuts it in half. So now he only pays$500 ,000 in taxes, right? He has 500K left off the million that's there.

29:28But here's where it gets interesting. If he doubles the amount of providers next year, what does that mean to his enterprise value? He's going to be at$4 million in profit, right and that four million dollars in profit then turns into 32 million dollars in enterprise value and so he made an extra 16 million dollars six to one 16 to one excuse me on the one million dollars that he invested and he did it tax-free that's how you get super rich that's how it works okay not a promise of course your results will vary because most people do nothing and this is not it's as an earnings claim, of course, you are watching a YouTube live stream.

30:10So I have no idea what you're going to do, which will probably be nothing, because most people do nothing. Now, that being said, for each of the different ways of the core four, the ways of the warrior, the ways of the marketer, right? We have our, I'll redraw this for everybody. We have our outbound, we've got outbound, we've got paid, paid ads, and then we've got organic or content, right? we've got organic. Okay. Now, how do we do more, right? So from an ads perspective, we'll start here. More can simply mean more money. It could also mean more creative. It could mean more platforms. All of these things are versions of more.

30:48And so I will typically do this in reversed order of risk, right? And so that means that I think that if I'm going to put this in order for paid, it'd be like, okay, well, the first thing I'm going to do is make more creative. If I have More creative. I have a higher chance of getting more winners. If I have more winners, then I'm going to get better ROAS and I'll be able to scale to more markets, more avatars, more segments. Great. So that's the first more I'm going to do. The second more I'm going to do is I'm going to say, I'm going to spend more money on ads. How can I take my$100 a day and spend it for$1 ,000 a day?

31:17What stops me from doing that? And then third, if I do step one and step two and I make way more creative and I spend more money, then at that point I say, okay, now that I've built this machine that can create 10 times the creative volume, how do I do this within the context of Instagram? Or how do I do this in the context of TikTok? Or how do I do this in the context of X? Each of these platforms. So some of you guys don't know this, but for the launch, for the Money Models launch, this puppy, right? So for this guy, the reason we were able to do 105 point whatever million at the launch is because we didn't just, like we advertised so much, right?

31:56So we did, I think, 2 ,000 plus ads before the six weeks out began. We had banked those 2 ,000 ads. 2 ,000, like count to 100 and then do that 20 times. And if you counted, you'd be like, wow, this is really boring. That's how long it takes to count to 2 ,000. We made 2 ,000 ads, which takes significantly longer than counting to 2 ,000. And so this is what people dramatically misunderstand is the amount of work it takes to do more. Because then I can say, well, I only have five editors and they can only do five ads a day each. And that's 25 ads a day is all we can put out. Well, if I got to 2 ,000 ads, do I think that I would have a higher likelihood of hitting this big goal?

32:40Yes. What would it take? So it turned out, we did the math, it took 15 editors. And so that means that we had to contract 10 more to do the editing. What does that cost? A lot less than$105 million. So we did it, right? So we figure out what would it take to get this big goal in terms of volume? And then what are the resources required to do that? And then is it worth it? And most times the answer is a resounding yes, not a small yes, a big ass yes. And so then we say, then what's stopping us? And the answer is almost always nothing. Just do more. Now, that's how I would attack paid from a more perspective, right?

33:17From a content perspective, it's the same thing in terms of scaling editors. Now, one of the interesting things about doing more is that doing more is so painful, right? It's so much work. It's a lot of work to do more. But that pain forces another forcing function, which you don't need to try to do. It will occur on its own, which is you will try and minimize how much work you're doing. Or at least you will try and get more. If you have a fixed work, like I'm going to do 100 calls no matter what. I'm going to do 100 minutes of content no matter what. What do you think happens? you think man it'd be really nice if I got higher pickup rates so then you start looking at your time and saying you know people pick up more in the afternoons for my market or they they pick up really hot between 5 and 7 a.m in this particular market whatever assuming you you know follow the law whatever you start getting better you start looking at the data you start saying go like if I'm going to do all this work I might as well make it worth it right but you have to put yourself in that pain, that pain of the lack of leverage, the pain of it being inefficient.

34:15So if there's massive inefficiency that happens, but you have to keep it there because what happens otherwise is like the weak minded, the weak of will will do a hundred for one day or two days in a row. And they'll say, I didn't get the result I wanted. So it's like, duh, of course you didn't. You didn't do nearly enough. And so the reason that your businesses may feel volatile or erratic, you're like, I don't know why. Sometimes we have high sales. Sometimes we have low sales. It looks like this, right? Let's walk through an example. Let's say that you do one sale on Monday of this week, and then you do one sale on Thursday of next week, and you do one sale.

34:47I'm going to make, I'm not going to draw on the whole thing. So let's say one sale on Friday of the following week, and then one sale on, you know, Tuesday of the week after that. So you're doing one sale a week, and they're kind of happening all over the place. So your sales look like this, right? That's what they look like. Let me give you the realest take I possibly can. There is a level of advertising that is occurring that is generating four sales per month for you. There's a level of letting people know about your stuff that is happening. If you want to get to one sale a day, you would have to 7x that level of advertising.

35:24Period. And you might even have some inefficiencies because you might not get the same out of you doing 7x. So you might have to 14x assuming your efficiency drops. And so what? How much would it take for me to do this 14x? And is the amount that it takes me to do the 14x less than a 7x for my business? If the answer is no, then what's stopping you, right? And so this thinking pattern is why I think people stay small. They get obsessed with the margin. They get obsessed with the relative returns. They get obsessed with the optimization. But sometimes you just have to do a violent, unreasonable amount of work for an extended period of time because part of volume is the consistency associated with it.

36:08We couldn't make 2 ,000 ads in a day. We had to make 25 or 50 ads, and we had to do it every single day for hundreds of days in a row to get to the point where we could make 2 ,000, right? And that was before we started. We ended up, what, with 3 ,000? 2 ,800. We made 2 ,800 ads. But we're like, man, I can't scale my ad spots to certain ones. You don't have enough. We spent 500 ,000 a day per day at the end of the launch. Last few days. And you can only get to that level of scale with an equal amount of scale in terms of the inputs. And so this is probably my favorite volume story that I have because it was so real for me.

36:45But I'll tell you two. So one was I paid somebody who was way bigger than me at the time in terms of content and all that stuff early on in my career. And I was like, hey, what should I do to grow? And I got basically no tactics from this. But it was incredibly valuable for me, which is why I'm trying to do this for you. I can't sit down with every single person because it'd be physically impossible, right? And so I try to do these instead as my best, my second best attempt to do this. And he was like, dude, he's like, he said, pull up your LinkedIn. And I was like, okay. He said, pull up my LinkedIn.

37:20And he had made 10 posts that day and I had made one. He was like, okay, pull up Instagram. Pull up your Instagram. He had made three. I hadn't even made one. And then he said, pull up your YouTube. Pull up my YouTube. And once we did this two or three times, I was like, I get it. I get it. I just need to do way more. He's like, yeah, dude, like way more. And so we as humans so often think I need to do twice as much. I need to do three times as much. We can't fathom what it would mean to do a hundred times as much or a thousand times as much. But if you want to beat every fucking human being in the arena to the battle of the death, right?

37:53Wouldn't you want to leave no doubt? Wouldn't you want to make fucking sure that you were going to win? Because here's the thing. if you see someone ahead of you, a lot of people get triggered by this. They see someone ahead of them, they throw rocks at them because it makes them feel bad at themselves. I strongly encourage you not to do that. If someone is doing better than you, they are better than you in some way. And in that, you can learn of them. Real. So when someone's doing better, if you're like, I got to beat them, you look at their volume, right? And let's say that someone's doing three times this volume that you can see, right?

38:27What do you do? Do you do three times the volume? No, because now you're just matching them. You need to do 10 or 20 or 30 times the volume because not only that, they're doing volume that you can't see. You're just judging on the volume you can see. And so if you want to leave no doubt, it's like not only, if I did the same amount of work as that guy, I'm always behind. So I got to do more work to catch up. But that's just based on what I can see. I might have to do more and more to make sure that I accommodate for the things that I can't see. I said I would tell you my, I'll tell you another Sharon story.

38:57This is two years ago, I think. Maybe three years ago? Jeez, it might have been three years ago. He's, at the time, he was making content. He was like, it's not really popping. Like, can you help me out with it? And I actually had a repeated story. I literally had the flip, reverse conversation with him where I was like, well, how many times do you post a day on Instagram? And he was like, one. I was like, how many times do you post a day on TikTok? How many times do you post a day? And by the time I got to literally just the third one, he was like, I get it. I get it. He just stopped me. He was like, I get it.

39:24I need to do it. and remember, this is the guy who got on 200 plus stages. This guy understands volume, and so to land the plane here, we were having dinner. He told me about the 200, you know, the 200 plus stages, 260 stages, or whatever that he was on that year, right? And after he said that, he just looked at me. He was like, no one gets it. He's like, no one gets it. Everyone thinks that I've got some magic trick that I've got the most, the highest converting presentation that I'm some amazing guy on stage. And it has nothing to do with that. He's like, no one understands the volume. No one gets it.

40:00Because it's not doubles, it's not triples, it's not 5x, it's not 10x. It's 100x the volume. And so that is my word du jour. I'll close on, I'll give you a second close. We're closing twice, all right? Consistency is the rarest of traits. And I think the reason it is so rare is because you cannot observe it without at least having some level of consistency. Think about that for a second. How can you observe consistency? It's very hard to do, right? You can't see somebody coming. Like you have to be at the gym every day to see someone at the gym every day, which is why like when people come to acquisition.com, all of a sudden they get this gigantic boost in their skillset, their productivity, their output, because they're around everyone.

40:46Like when you show up at acquisition.com at 5.30 in the morning, the parking lot's full. Like we're here to win, not play. We want to win. And so I think I would ask yourself the question, if I knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that if I could do 100 times more than I'm currently doing, I would hit the goals that I have, then I would then ask the question, great, what resources are required? And then following up to that, is it worth it? And if the answer is yes, what's stopping you? I'm just so passionate about more. And you can't even do, like, more for one day is not enough. like we had to be consistent with the amount of ads we're making for a very long time to get the volume so you can make five posts on all the platforms in one day but you got to wake up tomorrow and you're at zero again right one of the things that i think is so magical and so amazing about like sales teams is you have a week and everyone's trying to up the tally and win the week, but what happens on Sunday morning?

41:46Back at zero, baby. Back at zero. You have to be consistent. You want to win the quarter? You got to bring it every day, right? I don't pretend to know what it is that separates people from the people who can and from the people who can't, but I would say that one of the biggest ones is like, it's a decision. It's a decision. You decide that you want to go pro. You decide you want to make this, you want to be legit. And the thing is that you have to do it for you because no one will see the amount of work. Like if you want credit for the work, you've already lost. You can get credit for the outcome, but you will never get credit for the work.

42:21Like you have to accept that. Real. You have to accept that. You will never get credit for the work. If anything, you will get criticized for the work. The people around you say you work too much. They'll try and pull you away from the work. But the work needs doing.

From the publisher

Welcome to The Game w/ Alex Hormozi, hosted by entrepreneur, founder, investor, author, public speaker, and content creator Alex Hormozi. On this podcast you’ll hear how to get more customers, make more profit per customer, how to keep them longer, and the many failures and lessons Alex has learned and will learn on his path from $100M to $1B in net worth.

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