911: AI Changed the Rules: The Secret to Launching an Online Course That Sells in 2025

26:49I can promise you Sunday morning. I'm like, what is my story going to be about? I I have no stories. This is not possible. And then somehow or another, a story, I figure it out. And every week I have a new story to tell. So getting into the habit of creating stories, writing stories, just in a casual way, doesn't have to be written perfectly, getting into that rhythm and starting to tell them on social, inside your course, on your webinars. That is one thing that the listener has that story that nobody else has kind of goes back to that perspective. So that's one thing. I know you have a few others, so let's keep going on this, but just, I wanted to punctuate the point.

27:28Storytelling has become more important than ever before. Yes. Let's take a quick pause to thank our sponsors for making this show possible. As you're listening, I want for you to reflect like, what is your story? What moment mistake or breakthrough could become a powerful part of your course or your content? And when we come back, Amy and I unpack how storytelling can make your message stick and why in the age of AI, facts alone just don't cut it. This podcast is brought to you by Mercury, banking that helps entrepreneurs do more with their money. Okay, I remember in the early days of my entrepreneurship journey, clients would literally mail me checks and then I would have to drive all the way to the bank to deposit them.

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28:47Visit mercury.com to apply in minutes. Mercury is a financial technology company, not a bank. For important details, check the show notes. You know, I only share stuff I'm genuinely obsessed with. And so when I kept seeing Bolin Branch sheets all over Instagram, I was like, okay, are these actually worth the hype? Drew and I have been using their sheets and duvets for over a year now. And honestly, our bedroom feels like a completely different space. The moment you touch these sheets, you'll get it. They're incredibly soft to start, but they literally get softer every time you wash them. They're made from 100 % organic cotton, so they're super durable and they're breathable, which is perfect for piling on cozy layers without turning into a furnace at 2am.

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30:53Sign up for your$1 per month trial and start selling today at shopify.com slash gold digger shopify.com slash gold digger. I agree. And there's that stat that like people remember stories six times more than facts. And so again, it's like we can consume information until we're blue in the face, but that doesn't actually inspire us into any sort of action. The other thing that I think is really, really important as a course creator is staying close to who you were when you were going through that transformation. That's good. Because there are steps to everything, right? You could learn X, Y, or Z to do anything.

31:38Like I could learn how to go change my transmission on my car if I wanted to check out the steps. But I might not have somebody being like, okay, I know you're scared to pull this wire out, but I promise you this wire is the wire you need to pull. And here's how it's going to work, right? Having somebody actually guide you through the information and help you overcome your own objections and fears and make you feel less isolated or alone in the information alone is truly what leads you into action and keeps you in action, right? Because there are so many people listening, myself included, where I used to be the girl who I'd be like, come Monday, I'm eating clean and I'm working out and I'm doing this.

32:22And then it was like Wednesday, it was like, okay, starting over again next month. Right. And it's like, if you have somebody walking you through it and saying, Hey, you might be feeling this way. You might be sore today. You might be saying, there's no way I'm going to be able to do that. Just show up, just show up, just show up. And I think that that is what is so powerful is like oftentimes courses come from people who have been through the depths, right? They have honkered the fears. They have overcome the mindset objections. They've made the mistakes. They've spent the wrong money. They've wasted the time.

32:54They know how painful all of that is. And so their promise is so clear because they have literally been there and they will guide you through it. And so that's where I think it gets really exciting again. And I think that it just connects and resonates with the way that we want to make an impact on people's lives and the way that we want to show up and create that transformation. I think that so many course creators should be singing from the rooftops right now, because now more than ever, we have needed other humans to walk alongside of us. And so I think it's really exciting. So I would say the big things are like story, objections, pain points, and just like implementation and like guiding them through it.

33:42You know, one other thing in all of my courses, and I teach my students how to do this as well. I always bake in pep talks and you really hit on this where I know that when you create your course outline, you're going to look at that and you're going to put way too much at it. At the end of creating your course outline, you have put way too much in it and it's going to be very overwhelming. And at that point in my course, when I'm teaching it, I'll say, look, I know how you're feeling right now. You're looking at this thinking, this is way too much. This is going to take me forever. Oh my gosh.

34:14And I'm going to tell you right now, you have too much. So here's what I want you to do instead. Take a deep breath. Know that I'm going to guide you through this. But if you're feeling this way right now, I understand. And here's how to move past it. Those little pep talks along the way is what keeps people in it to get to the finish line. That's the human touch that every digital course should include so that you are on the journey with them. Yes. Amen on that. Okay. So one of the things that I'm excited about, and I actually think it really answers the call to a lot of the things we're talking about is you do a bootcamp every year and you actually inspired me to do my first ever bootcamp this year.

34:55I can't believe it. Oh my gosh. I was obsessed. It was like the best thing ever. If anyone was a part of our Pinterest bootcamp, like, oh, it was so good. And so let's talk about course confident. Let's talk about the bootcamp in general, but also like, how is this kind of the solution that takes somebody from idea to clarity? Because honestly, I think it is the answer to a lot of the things that we're actually talking about. And for so many listeners, they want to see what we're talking about in action. This would be how. So every year, once a year, I do a live bootcamp and it's one of my most favorite things that I do.

35:31And it's for anybody who says, I've wanted to create a course forever. I don't know if this is the time I should do it. I don't want to waste my time or money. I'm not sure what my topic is, but I see everybody else doing really well with courses. I see what Jenna's doing, Amy's doing. I want in, but I'm not sure if it's a good fit for me. Get into course confident. You will answer those questions. And so here's what I'm going to teach you live. Number one, how to choose a course topic, especially as things have changed over the years. This actually is something incredibly important and easier than you might think if I take you through my framework.

36:06So the first thing you're going to do is choose a topic and kind of learn how to validate that topic to make sure that your audience actually really wants it. And then the second thing I'm going to teach you how to do is create a digital course offer. What goes into an offer that your audience can't resist buying? And also how do you price it to be competitive, but also make sure that you're getting what you're worth. So we go over how to create an actual offer, how to price a course offer, so that you can do some course math to see what's possible with this course that I want to sell. And then from there, I teach you how to grow your audience while you're creating your course.

36:45I want you to do the two at the same time. One thing, I share a lot of examples, and you do not need a big email list. If you have 200, 500, 1 ,000 people on your list, and I'll help you get there. You have enough people to market a course to. Gone are the days that you need hundreds of thousands of people to make this successful. So I'm going to show you what it looks like to grow your email list while you're actually creating your course. And then I'm going to end it all. I'm going to wrap it all up with what it looks like on a big scale of creating and launching a course. What are the key steps so that you really understand, oh, this is what it's going to take.

37:25This is what I need to do. So you have a great understanding and clarity at the end of the bootcamp. I go on the journey with you. I do live Q and A's. I'm in the community. It goes by really fast, but it will give you that course clarity that you're looking for to see if there's something that you want to jump into and actually make it happen. Yeah. I mean, I love a bootcamp for so many reasons, but one of my favorite reasons is that it forces people to actually sit down and do the work. And I see more progress in days than people have made in months. I agree. It is crazy. Like it is like people, it is contagious.

38:06People get their first wins and their second wins and their third wins. Like if you are someone who you have listened to this podcast for years and years and years, and you've heard us talk about this and you're like, this is not the year. This is the joint. It's$47. And it is, you will get more out of those days than you've gotten in hours of listening to podcasts about it and not taking action. It will force you into action. And that$47, it not only includes live video from me that will be recorded in case you miss it, but every single training comes with a step-by-step PDF. I'm known for my step-by-step training.

38:44We do really valuable PDFs. You get one for every specific training I do. So you'll walk away knowing exactly what to do. That's the thing that my students want. Amy, just give me the plan. Tell me exactly how to do it. So for those first few steps of creating your course, I'm going to give you a PDF plan so you know what to do. Okay, we're gonna move on to the next question, but if somebody is listening right now and they want to go join the bootcamp, jennacutcher.com forward slash bootcamp. I'm also throwing in basically our Pinterest bootcamp. It's our Pinterest kickstart. When you join absolutely free, just so you can see Amy's take and my take on it.

39:20It's literally like a case study waiting for you to consume it. JennaKutcher.com forward slash bootcamp. Okay. So the reason why I think that this bootcamp solves a lot of the things we're talking about is it puts people into action. It puts them into community and it holds them accountable. all things that are not possible just with AI. And so it is literally, we are doing what we're talking about in real life and you get to join. Okay. So for somebody that's listening right now, and I know you have a lot of these folks in your community and also in mine is maybe it's someone that is an expert in their area, right?

39:59But they do not consider themselves a marketer. what is their next step, right? We know so many people that are like brilliant. Think like doctors, lawyers, accountants, et cetera. And they're like, they are geniuses, but they are like, I don't want to do this social media thing, or I don't know how to grow my audience online. What would be a good first step for them? This is not talked about enough, Jenna. This is something that we've been talking about in my, and my internal team a lot as well, that when people get stuck with the marketing, you've got to look at them just like you said and said, they're a doctor.

40:35They weren't taught marketing in school. I was going to say in doctor school. I'm pretty sure that's not what it's called. Medical school. Yes. They were not taught that. Or even someone who is a leadership expert or a mom that teaches you how to get your picky eaters to actually eat. You know your craft so well. And many people listening, be honest with yourself. You know your craft so well. Where you often get stuck or feel like you're not enough or doing the right things is because you have never been taught how to market online. So the first thing is to give yourself a little grace and know I'm not supposed to know this.

41:13Amy and Jenna have been doing this for many, many, many years and we've made it our career. But if you haven't done that, give yourself some slack. You're not supposed to know all of this stuff. But what's smart is your listeners are listening to a marketing podcast with someone who's gone before them. So it comes back to that plan. Number one, find someone that you trust that is willing to show you each step you need to take to build a marketing plan around selling your course. But also make sure you're following someone that will strip it down and make it simple for you. And so to answer your question, one of the ways to make this simple is the first thing I want you to take a topic that maybe you'll create.

41:53If you join the bootcamp, I can help you solidify that, but maybe you have a topic. You're not sure if it will work. Let's just take that topic. And I want you to then do five bullet points. What are five different stories, experiences, or ideas that you could talk about that are aligned with that topic for your course? And with those five things, I want you to think about what social media posts could you maybe create? What kind of freebie, a cheat sheet, a guide might you create that's aligned with your bigger topic? I want you to start to create content around it and just put it out casually.

42:28It doesn't have to be some big formal thing, just to start getting that exercise of sharing your ideas into your body and out into social and out into the world. So that's the first thing I would do. It will help you grow your email list, but also help you get into the habit of talking about this topic naturally. Yes. Oh my gosh. One of the things that I feel like people, like, it's like a lie that people believe is like, I need to get the audience first and then I'll start talking about the things I need to talk about. And it's like, you won't first off, they're not going to come if you're not serving them.

43:04But second off, the way you get the audience is by putting the things out there, right? It's like this weird, like what comes first and the cart or the horse. And it's like, no, no, no. The more you put the content out there, the more people will come and they will be aligned with what you will eventually offer. And so you have to start doing the reps, like Amy said, and getting comfortable and do it while there aren't people following, like make the mistakes while there aren't people following so that you start to like put your cringiest stuff out there and just get it out there. And then as people start to follow, you get better.

43:42Like that That is the only way to refine it. And I saw something the other day that was so beautiful. And it was somebody was challenging those brilliant minds out there. And she said something like, I'm sick of scholars and researchers and doctors and all of them saying like, you know, I don't need social media. I'm not made to be on it. And she's like, we need those voices now more than ever. we need the voice of reason, the voice of truth, the voice of honesty, the voice of transformation, you sitting yourself on the bench and saying, I just, that's not for me is actually a disservice to humanity.

44:20And it is really impacting your ability to change the world. And so I just love that because it was like, there are so many echo chambers on the internet and unqualified people teaching the things that you are qualified to teach. And so if you belittle this idea that social media isn't for you, you are literally holding back your ability to make impact with the things that you study and know like the back of your hand. And so I loved that where it was like, yeah, you're not too good for this. We need you. Please show up. Give us your voice. What a great way to think about it. Like this is your opportunity to make change, show up on a platform that maybe you don't love social media.

45:03Most of my audience doesn't love social media, but it is an opportunity to transform now more than ever. So I love that you said that. And here's a little tip for anyone that's like, I got an idea. So let's be honest. Many people listening right now, if they're being honest, you don't have to admit to anybody. But if you look at something online and someone's teaching your expertise, I know you've had a moment that you've said, I could teach this better. Actually, that's incorrect information that they're giving. I can give the information in a better way to make a change. If you've ever had that moment, you are ready for a digital course because you need to get your experience, skillset, and knowledge out there.

45:45But coming back to the content part of it, here's something really easy you could do and something I've absolutely done. I want you to go to Jenna's social media, let's say IG and mine, and I want you to find just one post that you like how we did it, whether it's a carousel or a reel or a story or whatever, copy it with your own content. So if you got your topic, maybe a topic for a course, you've got those five bullets I talked about, take one of those bullets, see something that Jen has done, maybe a carousel post, and then model it for your own. So you don't have to come up with a new idea, just model it.

46:19Let's start at least getting some stuff out there and you don't have to start from scratch when you have other people that you can follow like that. Yes. I want to pause for a moment to say a big thank you to our sponsors for making this show possible. If something Amy shared today gave you clarity or sparked a new idea, take a second and send this episode to a friend who's thinking about starting an online course. Coming up, I'm sharing a pro tip for starting on social media from scratch and how to get traction when you're building from zero. We'll be back in just a minute. Anyone who knows me knows that I'm all about creating spaces where people actually want to be.

46:57So when we started hosting on Airbnb, it honestly felt like the most natural thing in the world. And it's turned into one of the best decisions we've ever made. Over the years, we've hosted hundreds of couples in our little spaces. We've had so many repeat guests come back and we've created this incredible community, not just with our guests, but also with the people who help us care for our space. Whether you've bought properties as an investment or have unused rooms waiting to be shared, hosting on Airbnb is a practical and profitable choice. And just think about it. If you've put a ton of time, effort and work into your home, someone out there probably would love to experience it while they're traveling.

47:34So next time you're planning a trip or want to make some extra income from your spaces, you should definitely host on Airbnb. Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much at Airbnb.com slash host. Okay, here's my pro tip for somebody listening. If I were starting social media from zero, I would create a new account and I would go onto the like explore page or whatever they call it. I think it's explore. And I would type in because now social media is more search based. So you can find like more content. And I would type in the main keywords that describe my offer. and I would scroll through and I would save a hundred posts.

48:17Now this sounds crazy, but I would go through all the time. Yes. I would literally go through and I would look at what posts got the most views, the most interactions, and I would save a hundred of them. And then I would analyze them. What was the hook they used? What was the content? What would be my hot take on that? Where do I think they got that wrong? What is an unpopular belief that I have about this? It is easier now than ever to grow an account because of the search based nature that is social. We weren't able like hashtags kind of sort of did it, but not in this way. And so you can literally see what is working and put your own spin on it and put your own personality on it.

49:00So I'm like, you know what? I'm not going to use that as an excuse anymore. Go out and do the reps. And if you need to see cringe, just scroll on back to my account. You'll see lots of cringe where I showed up. So just know we all went through those cringy phases and that's how we grew initially. And you have to be kind of willing to go there. Okay. My last question is this for somebody that's on the fence about jumping into the online course world, like what would you say to them? I would say to them first, what is your why? If your why is I want to create an online business so I don't have to work in a nine to five anymore.

49:36Great. If your why is, I want to have more freedom and time with my kids, so I want to call my own hours, great. If your why of building something of your own is that you just want that independence to make the decisions of what you want, when you want, how you want, wonderful. Get really clear on your why. And then I want you to really hear me. One of the easiest, best, most effective ways to kickstart an online business or to grow an online business is to have a digital course. It puts you on the map. You become known for something. The way you actually start to get success in an online business is when your name starts popping up for a specific topic.

50:21Courses do that. So if you're saying, Amy, I want to cut through the online noise. I want to be able to get my knowledge out there to the audience that needs it. And I want to be known for that. it's a digital course. And if you've ever worried, I don't want to waste my time, my money. I'm not sure if this is a good fit for me. That's where you try something like the bootcamp just to dip your toe in the water. So then you can come to that conclusion. Is this the direction I want to go? But I want you to hear that many online businesses have been built by starting a digital course and becoming known for something.

50:55Actually, can I give you like one quick story that I love, a new story in my audience. So I like to share stories that recently happened to show you that courses are thriving and working for people all over the world, not just in the U S all over the world. And I have a student and her name is Wajma and she is a Muslim mother and she wanted to help other Muslim mothers become confident and empowered in their parenting. Now take that for a moment. That is very specific. Not all moms, Muslim mothers. So that's something that she knows well. She was homeschooling her kids. She had four of them. She wanted to help other mothers thrive, wasn't sure how to do it, but she thought there's got to be something here.

51:39So she started to figure out what a course could look like. I helped her along the way. What could a course look like? And she started to grow her email list. Now here's the deal. She only had 1000 people on her email list. She started with zero and she started to put her content out there, 1 ,000 people. And she created her first course. And here's what's crazy. The first time she put it out there, she got 45 students. She made$12 ,000. $12 ,000 can be life-changing, especially in the world we live in now. She made$12 ,000, only 45 students teaching something that she does every single day. Were other people teaching it?

52:20Absolutely. But this is something that she leaned into. She went on to launch again and again, and she was able to make over$30 ,000 with the course based on what she does every single day. Don't discount something you know well, just because it comes easy to you. Other people, it is not easy for them. So don't discount what you already know. It can absolutely be a digital course. I love that so much. I had this moment yesterday where I was really just thinking like, we're about to enter this new era with the kids, both being in school. Like I have the house quiet for the first time in seven years.

53:01I might cry if I think about it too hard of just like not having a kid home constantly. Look at this. I'm going to cry. You know me. Amy's like, I know. Yes. These are the moments that really get Jenna. I know you get all of me, but I think about like my life, if I were still a wedding photographer, and God bless all of you wedding photographers out there, if I were still sloughing gear every weekend, leaving Saturday mornings, getting back late Saturday nights, being so sore on Sundays that I can't even get out of bed, if I was editing all week long, like if I was still in that nature of a business, my experience of motherhood would be incredibly different.

53:42And I like look back at these last seven years and I'm like, oh my gosh, like what a gift that I got to serve the world that I got to be home with my kids. Like, it's just crazy. And so I just like, you know, I love you. Um, but you changed my life. And I think that when we see that we know something valuable, we show up differently, right? Like when we know we have something that can help somebody else, it changes the energy of how we show up. It literally changes like the frequency of like where we are like shining in our lives. And I just think like my kids got the best of me because I was still able to serve the world, not in a one-to-one way, but in a one-to-many way that allowed me to be one-on-one with them.

54:29And that's like, man, that's the creme de la creme. Like I can't, I can't imagine. I was like thinking about it the other day because I saw my cameras out and I was like, dear Lord, this is like, you know, me like in the summer, I'm like, I am not leaving Minnesota. You cannot get me to leave Minnesota. Like I have waited all year for this, but there was a former version of my life where I was gone every single weekend, sometimes double headers and shooting multiple weddings in a weekend. And I just can't imagine that life. And so I want to encourage people that like, Maybe it's not to make a million dollars.

55:04Maybe it's to afford your mortgage or to buy groceries or to get your kids new clothes for school. Maybe it's to be able to pay the tuition for that Montessori school that you want your kids to go to or to buy your parents a car that's reliable. I don't know what that is, but I feel like there is so much beauty in the way that you can share something that you know and that you've experienced that can help other people. But that also pulls you out of that rat race of trading time for money because your time is so valuable and your time is your currency. And I have been able to live the fattest minutes of my life with my kids because of this.

55:49So just thank you, Amy. So beautifully said, my friend. And I just, I know Jenna so well, and all of that is so true. Like that is exactly how she lives her life and what she focuses on and what means the most to her. So I love that you can explain it in a way that sure, we want to make money and we want to be successful, but a digital course is as much for you, the creator to change your life as it is as much for the people that you serve. And so the win-win is what makes it so powerful. Amen. All right. Well, I can't even blame my period because I don't even know when it's coming, but Lord help us all.

56:25Here's what I'll say. Amy does this bootcamp once a year. If you're listening to this episode and it's much later on and you miss the bootcamp, that's a-okay. We'll make sure that page is going somewhere of value for you. But jennacutcher.com slash bootcamp. The bootcamp starts on September 11th. Amy and I will be in there. I promise you, you will make more progress with this idea than you've made in five months. And I have a really good hunch that you're going to meet people that you really enjoy. If you have ever looked at mine and Amy's friendship and been like, is that really real? Are they really friends?

56:59How did they become friends? It is through communities like this and putting yourself in Facebook groups like this. I mean, it was literally from me investing in Amy and promising myself that I'd become her greatest success story of all time. And so like get in the rooms where the people are doing the things you want to do, get led by the mentors that are doing and walking the walk and talking the talk. And it's$47. It's like less than a DoorDash. So you could definitely do it. JennaKutcher.com bootcamp. Amy, I love you. Thank you for changing my life. I'm so excited to just continue evolving and seeing what's next.

57:38And I can't wait to guide people through it with you. Love you so much, Jenna. This has been such a treat and I can't wait to really pour into your community. So I hope to see him in the bootcamp and thanks so much. Woo, I did not expect to get so emotional today, but I'm also not gonna apologize for it. I have been doing so much reflecting as my kids start school, as I enter this new era of a working mom who is used to having kids at home and facilitating lunchtime and quiet time and nap time and all the different things. And I really am in just this state of pure reverence for what I have been able to build and the way that it has changed my life.

58:20And Amy has really been just the person in my life that has taught me and led the way and gone before me. And so I'm just so grateful for her. And I really want for you to take advantage of this opportunity to learn from her. JennaKutcher.com forward slash bootcamp. I will be in there. She will be in there. We are literally answering a lot of the questions that we talked about today on this episode. You will get more out of these days than you've gotten in months, guaranteed. And also if you just want to do almost a case study on what we're doing and what we're teaching, this is how to do it. JennaKutcher.com forward slash bootcamp.

58:54If you know somebody in your life who is a genius, who you want to learn from, send this episode to them, do it together, create a little accountability pod and jump on in. and just thank you so much for listening to this podcast. I hope that it touched you. Until next time, Gold Diggers, keep on digging your biggest goals. Thanks for listening to the Gold Digger podcast. I hope today left you inspired and equipped with something you can put into action as you build a business that truly supports your life. If this episode resonated with you, here's how you can help the show reach even more entrepreneurs.

59:27Hit follow, share it with a friend who's building something meaningful. and if you're feeling generous, leave us a review. Those reviews help other listeners discover these conversations when they need them the most. This show has become so much more than I ever imagined and it's because of listeners like you who show up and share. You are helping build something that will inspire entrepreneurs for years to come. For show notes, links and resources, head to golddiggerpodcast.com. Keep digging your biggest goals. The world needs what you're building. Please note, this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements, and individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in the episode.

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