913: When Science Meets Spirituality: How to Trust Your Gut and Grow Into Who You’re Meant To Be

27:19I've been quite quiet, you know, with my work. Obviously, this book's coming out soon. And yeah, it's all the research that I've been doing in the last few years, including experiments on myself and my own consciousness. You are speaking to me, girl. Let's take a quick pause to thank our sponsors for making this episode possible. Isn't it wild to think that we might have senses we don't even fully understand yet? that we could be walking through the world only half aware of what we're capable of? When we come back, we shift into intuition, ancestral wisdom, and what it means to reconnect with the parts of ourselves we've forgotten.

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31:11My grandma just had her 90th birthday. And like I, when I was writing out her card, cause she loves her cards and she just reads them over and over and over again. And I was just thinking about how so much of my life right now is almost like a circle back to all of the wise things that she knew and taught that almost didn't skip my mom's generation. But my mom's generation was when women were entering the work field and now they're juggling parenthood and mothering. And, you know, it's just a different era. And so it's almost like this return back to that, like wisdom of like gardening and we were talking about how we have chickens now.

31:52And my mom was like, oh, I remember my great grandma had chickens. And it's this return in a lot of ways to a lot of that knowing. And on her 90th birthday, I was just writing down all of the things that it took me until this point in my life to really appreciate and understand and come back to. But there is so much wisdom in there. And I often get really concerned about younger generations, mine included, that we aren't leaning on our elders and learning and asking enough questions because we come at it from this like all knowing, well, the information is accessible. And it's like there's just so much benefit to learn from people who have gone before us.

32:36What would you say? Totally. I mean, I feel like science is really only catching up with with our grandparents now. Truly. For instance, when you were saying, because you've got young children who do a lot of art and painting and craft, that you're enjoying that and you've learned through your kids that it doesn't matter if it's perfect. Well, there's a new area of research called neuroaesthetics, which is about art and beauty and nature, sort of the awe and wonder of those things. And it's about both making and beholding. And one of the things that that area of research has proven is that the benefits on your mental health, your physical health and your longevity of making art, there's no relevance of whether it's good or not.

33:20The act of making it improves your mental health, makes you live longer. And it's nothing to do with how good you are. So, you know, it's kind of like I want to encourage people to dance around their living room when no one's watching. Yeah, truly. Not just the quotes, actually do it. Exactly. Oh, I love that. One thing that we've kind of touched on that I really am so curious what your take is, is that a lot of people that are listening and I have come to learn and have really come to like back home to myself in that, like for me, success is a calm nervous system. And it's something that I didn't understand, and didn't appreciate, didn't get it because I felt like I was always in this like high stakes win or lose zero sum game of entrepreneurship.

34:06But for people that are maybe in that zone, and for the past version of me that really didn't even see a way out of it, how can entrepreneurs start like tuning in more to their nervous system, to their intuition, to signals and signs? Like there was a time in my life where the only thing I saw was the cracking of my laptop and the closing of it, right? Like there was nothing, my eyes were not lifted. And so what would you say to somebody that's in that stage of their journey? Yeah. And like, I, you know, the first thing I would say is we've all been there and, you know, it's a privilege when you actually have some time to not have to be like that all the time, but there are lots of small things that you can do to alleviate some of that stress.

34:49The first one I would say is time in nature. Even if it, you know, ideally that would be a long walk in nature, but if it means stepping away from your laptop for five minutes to listen to some bird song outdoors, it's better than nothing. So again, for ancient wisdom reasons, birds would not sing if predators were around. So when birds are singing, we feel safe. And it actually lowers our cortisol levels and our blood pressure and our respiration, our breathing rate. So it's a small thing that can actually reset your nervous system. Breath work can quite quickly reset your nervous system. But I think people need to be really aware of how does it show up when you're in the sympathetic fright, fight, flight state?

35:32And how does it feel when you're in the parasympathetic rest and digest state? Just having an idea of how that changes your rate of breathing or your heart rate, if you can feel it or whether you're sweating or not or how anxious you feel it's good to kind of understand how that shows up and then like I said time in nature bird song particularly any type of breath work just you know movement like we've already discussed or looking at some beautiful art or listening to some you know really relaxing music there are so many small things you can do obviously there are bigger things you know and I've outlined them all in in my book which is actually called the signs the new science of how to trust your instincts so it's very much about going back to trusting yourself understanding yourself and then and I would say I've been where you've been and kind of thought you know a nervous system that I can regulate well is like the biggest gift but I would say now in my last few years of research that feeling in tune with nature and the universe is the next level of that.

36:37You know, it's, it's, it's kind of going from, okay, I'm okay within myself to how in tune I am with what's around me has changed my life. I mean, it's, I, once you live like that, you could never go back to just looking at the laptop all the time kind of thing. Oh, I, I couldn't agree more. I feel like we've been on parallel journeys in our own little way. It's wild. It'll be so fun to listen back to our old episode. But I, I laugh, I almost laugh at the humor of my life and maybe the whiplash that people who are watching it are like, wait, what is going on? Because I mean, even last night I got the kids to bed and I went and sat outside in the grass, watching our chickens walk around with our dog in front of our garden.

37:26And like, it just, I, I couldn't agree more. I have to touch grass every single day, multiple times a day. And I was talking to somebody the other day about how our kids aren't in the stage of life yet where they're super involved in like sports. Like we don't, we would like to keep our calendars open for possibility is how we like to present it. AKA I don't want to be like trapped down yet by tournaments and things like that. And I was saying, you know, like every day the kids go out to the garden. And this morning, my six-year-old ran out to see if there was an egg laid by the chickens and we have bees and like they are getting an education and experiences in such different ways that I, as like an achieving athlete and someone who is striving, it was just a different experience.

38:16Neither one is better or worse. It's just different. And it's just really interesting because I do absolutely feel connected to the land and nature. The other day I was like talking to one of my friends and I could tell she was like really in her head and stressed out. And I was like, go outside and just like look at leaves for like five minutes. Like literally like go lay on the ground and like just look at the wind and leaves. And like it's just there's so many beautiful lessons and things. And it's like such a gift to almost feel small in this beautiful world we're in. It's just wild, isn't it?

38:54Oh, I love the way you've said that. I just, yeah, that idea of feeling small is what it's actually saying is how amazing and awe-inspiring and huge like the universe and life and love is, you know, and that, yes, we're a tiny part of that. But there's actually, I guess, more so in the audio book, because I have read out my own audio book again, like, why do I do this to myself? Yes. No, it's the best though. It is better. I know. But I've got some sort of mini meditations, I would say for each of the senses. So, and so one of them is actually go outside and stare at a leaf for a minute. Yes. I love it.

39:31I love it. But it's yeah, you're right. We've been on very parallel journeys. Yes. I want to know just like from a personal level, because I mean, the you that came on the show many years ago, like neuroscientists rooted in, in all, you know, facts and information and all those beautiful things. What has it been like for you to really embody and evolve with having all of that knowledge, but tapping into something that maybe wasn't as easily accessed for you? Like, what does that felt like? Because to me, that is almost like not a shedding of an identity, but the evolution of who you are, what you are known for and how you show up.

40:13How has that been? Yeah. So, I mean, it's interesting, even with the source, I felt like potentially that was a bit of a professional risk. You know, I was a professor at MIT and, you know, very much like you said, it sort of basing all of my work on hard science. I'll be really honest with you, Jenna. I've had a very tough few years and it's made me have to rethink things personally. So I've been on that journey of investigating what kind of spirituality could help me as a human, just trying to navigate life. But I've also had, I guess, the privilege of stepping back as a neuroscientist and watching myself go through this journey.

40:52I'm thinking, oh, this is interesting. This is something you never would have done before. And really kind of in this really meta way, being able to both navigate what I've had to personally, but also see the benefits as a scientist and kind of try to explain some of the science. And that's really what I've tried to do in the book is say, look, this is the journey that I went on. It's probably not what you would expect from me. And, but because I've had so much benefit of hindsight, I want to share that with you, but I know you'll need some of it backed up by science. So I've tried to do that too.

41:29I just want to say for a moment, just like how beautiful and brave it is. And I think that for my listener, we are all reinventing ourselves, we are all evolving. And I know that there have been times in my life where it's like the brand or the persona no longer fits. And it is, it feels like a risk, it feels like a diversion, it feels confusing, it feels like people aren't going to understand or get it. And that's not always the point. right? That isn't the point in fact. And I also, as you were talking, I just think that one thing as humans, we have to remember is like, we are taking all of our past experiences with us.

42:18All that past journey is serving you in this current journey. Like that you are still leaning on and taking so much of that with you. We're not like fully abandoning anything. You're carrying it all with you. And I just think it's beautiful. It's an invitation. And so many women are probably listening to this and in some way, shape or form in their life, they are clothing themselves in an identity that doesn't fit or doesn't resonate with them or doesn't feel right. And so I just want to honor that because it is scary and it can feel hard, especially when you do it publicly. and so it's just beautiful.

42:57Thank you, Jenna. You and your family are so lovely to me all the time. Love you. If this conversation is stirring something in you, if it helped you feel seen or reminded you of your power, take a quick second and think of someone in your life who might need to hear it too. I'm going to send it over to all of my mom friends because what Tara is sharing is just too good not to pass along. So while we take a moment to thank our sponsors, send this in your girls group chat because coming up, we're getting into the simple practices you can try today to start reprogramming old thought patterns and beliefs.

43:32Anyone who knows me knows that I'm all about creating spaces where people actually want to be. So when we started hosting on Airbnb, it honestly felt like the most natural thing in the world. And it's turned into one of the best decisions we've ever made. Over the years, we've hosted hundreds of couples in our little spaces. We've had so many repeat guests come back and we've created this incredible community, not just with our guests, but also with the people who help us care for our space. Whether you've bought properties as an investment or have unused rooms waiting to be shared, hosting on Airbnb is a practical and profitable choice.

44:06And just think about it. If you've put a ton of time, effort, and work into your home, someone out there probably would love to experience it while they're traveling. So next time you're planning a trip or want to make some extra income from your spaces, you should definitely host on Airbnb. Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much at airbnb.com slash host. Okay. One thing I'm curious about, and this is something that will tap into some of the things even I'm dealing with in my life is I feel like there's always this kind of tension, especially even in what we're just talking about between like the strategy of things and kind of surrendering, right?

44:43Like as entrepreneurs, as business owners, as even just women, like we love a plan, right? We love a good, well-executable plan. But sometimes life is calling us to like follow breadcrumbs. Sometimes life is forcing us to pivot. How have you learned to kind of hold both structure while also leaving room for the magic or the intuition to play into your life and your professional being? I would say I'm still learning. Okay, same. I have a couple of, I've never called them this before, but I'm going to call them magic tricks. Okay, love it. But when I'm in the moment of stressing and doubting, sometimes it takes me a while to remember that I have these magic tricks.

45:34So I can spend days. But what I've learned with the repetition of this is that when I stress and I get anxious about something and I try to force it to go the way that I want it to, and I doubt that my own resources or the universe is going to get me to where I want to be, I delay it by doing that. I delay the outcome that I want. As soon as I realize if I surrender, every time I do that, it somehow magically works out. That happens. Now I can't explain that with science. I can only say that I trust myself. I back myself. I've had so much evidence of that happening. I just need to get better at remembering quicker that that's what I need to do.

46:18Yes. It's like a muscle. We got to put in the reps of that. I love that. And I think too, it's like, I've tried to learn how to hold things with a loose grip. Like there is this meditation that I would listen to where it was just talking about like, imagine a stream and your hand is open in the stream and you can feel the water flowing through it, but you're not trying to like trap the water or hold it tight. Like it's moving. And I feel like that is life. And I also feel like that's business where it's like, how do we just loosen the grip? And for so many of us, like I am such a control freak.

46:52I love being in control. It's like, come on, A, B, C and D let's go. But I feel like loosening the grip leaves room for magic, leaves room for possibility. I don't know, but it is, it's something that where I think you have to put in the reps of like doing it and, and recognizing it when it's worked. Right. Cause I think oftentimes we just move through things so quickly that we don't take time to be like, Hey, when I actually was open, something awesome happened. Right. Not interesting. That's actually a really beautiful visual analogy for something that someone said to me. So this wasn't a close friend, but it really stuck with me.

47:34So I can't remember what it was about now, but I said to her, I'm really stressing about X. And she said, how is stressing going to change anything? And that really hit me. And I was like, okay, that's totally true. So I will now stop. And that's when, you know, something magically changed, like I said. And I thought, oh yes, whenever I do that, it happens. And I think of your analogy, if I think of my hand with water running through it, and I try to close my hand and hold on to that water. That's not going to work, is it? And it's not going to be the same water in your hand anyways, right? Like it's like, let it flow.

48:08It's so funny without hesitation every single time. So every single time before I have like a big interview day or a webinar day, my kids will wake up in the middle of the night. Like Drew and I just now joke about it. It's like, what the heck? So last night at midnight, my three-year-old starts like calling out to me And we kind of almost just laughed because I was like, here we go. And I ran into her room and she's like, mom, I'm worried about the umbrella. We had an umbrella in our yard and she was thinking about this umbrella in the middle of the night. And she didn't know that her dad had picked it up and put it into the garage and the umbrella was safe.

48:44and I was rocking her and she was crying and she was just beyond herself. And I said, you don't need to worry about anything. Like let mommy do the worrying. And like, I, I've got this, like you do not have to hold on to worry. I've got this. And I was like, whoa, what an analogy for us as adults. Like when we trust in God or source or the divine or the universe of like, worrying is literally keeping us up at night. It is stealing your energy. And And it's not even necessary. The umbrella was in the garage. And it was just like a holy cow moment of like, your little body does not need to worry.

49:23Like, I've got this. And we also, as adults, we are also, we are held, right? And it's like, man, wow. Thank you for this little nugget at midnight on the night before a busy day. And it's like, wow, isn't it just, it's fascinating. So I don't know. So beautiful. And I just, I think I want to acknowledge that people might listen to this and think that it's easier said than done. Yes. And it is. But once you start trusting it, and you gather that evidence of it working, it really can change your life. So that's what I would really encourage people to. Absolutely. Okay, so before we wrap up, you on the last episode we did, you did this visualization exercise that has changed so many people's lives.

50:05We were joking that my friend Mallory listens to it every single day. I'm like, Thank you for the downloads, Mel. But you have a mini meditation on quieting the noise and just an exercise on how to kind of tune back into your head, your heart and your gut. So can you walk us through this before we wrap up? Okay, so what I'm gonna do is I'm going to do a short version of this exercise so that people can take their time to do a longer version when they listen to the podcast episode. So of course, we usually start by making sure we're seated or lying down in a comfortable position without our arms or legs crossed and we close our eyes and first thing to do is to just focus on your breath not try to change anything just notice how long you're breathing in for how long you're breathing out whether they're of the same length or not maybe which one's longer and then to take three really big deep energizing breaths just to clear the brain body system so inhale one exhale inhale two breathe out breathe in three

51:30and breathe out, maybe releasing the last breath with a bit of a sigh.

51:38Now I just want you to turn your attention outwards and focus on the loudest sound that you can hear around you and try to tune out any other noise apart from that one loudest sound.

52:02And now this may be the same or not, I'd like you to focus on the sound that is closest to you. And again, try to tune out anything other than that particular sound.

52:24Now you may have to search around a little bit with your ears and your environment, but try to focus on the sound around you that is the quietest.

52:39And see if you can focus on it so strongly that you hear nothing but that quietest sound.

52:55And finally, try to use your senses to locate the sound that is the furthest away from you, or feels like it's the furthest away from you.

53:14And just focus on that for a little while.

53:21and then I want you to turn your attention inwards and notice that there is sound or noise all around you, whether it's close or far, loud or quiet, but there is always stillness within.

53:44and you can come to this place of stillness within at any time for a rest and a break from all the noise in life that is around us

54:01now i'd like you to think of a dilemma that you have or a question that you have or something that you're anxious or doubtful about. So I'll just give you a little while to think of what that might be.

54:23And then I'd like you to place your hands on your head and take five breaths in and out, counting in your head from one to five.

54:53And when you are ready, ask the logical part of you for the answer to your question or dilemma or doubt.

55:08This answer should come to you quite quickly from your head. And just try to remember what the answer was. And then move your hands down to your heart space. And take another five deep breaths in and out to clear away your logical mind and get in touch with your emotional self.

55:42And when you have completed the five deep breaths, I want you to ask the same question to your heart and to your emotions and wait for the answer to come. It may be the same or a similar answer, or it may be quite different. There's no right or wrong.

56:11Again, this should happen quite quickly. It doesn't matter if it doesn't. You can repeat this exercise at any time. And we're going to end it by moving our hands to our belly, keeping our eyes closed. and asking the question again for the last time to our intuition or gut instinct.

56:36So take the five deep breaths and ask the question for the last time and see what answer your intuition comes up with.

56:49And when you're ready, just shake out your hands and flutter your eyelids open. I'm curious to hear, did you get similar or different answers? I got similar, but like from a different angle. Like again, I'm so good at logic. And then I feel like with my heart and my gut, it's more feeling like it's less thinking, more feeling. Like, I feel like I've shifted so many of the questions of like, what does success look like in your life to like, what does it feel like in your body? right and so it's like when I think of even just like where do I want my business to go or what do I want this stage of life to look like as the kids are in school and I have more time it's like I could feel it I could do this and then it's like my heart and my gut is like slow down like rest and so so good you're so good where can everybody find you check out your new book connect with you.

57:49Give me all of the places. Thank you. So I'm most active on Instagram where I'm Dr. Tara Swart, so D-R and my name. And I've actually put links up to all the different places that people can pre-order or order the book or the audio book. So I want to be really fair to all the retailers, you know. And so from September 16th, the book will be available in all bookshops in the UK and the US and all the places online that people regularly buy books. Thank you so much for having me. Thank you for coming back. Finish the book. It's so good. And I am just so grateful to have somebody like you in my life where like we get to keep growing and evolving and almost reintroducing ourselves like what a gift that is.

58:34So thank you for coming back on the show. Yeah, it's a really significant change for both of us. And it's making me very excited for the next one. I know, right? Let's wait and see. Thank you. Oh, that episode and that exercise, I just, I feel back in my body after a busy day. And I love the opportunity to be a part of and follow somebody's evolution. I feel like I have learned to welcome who I've been and who I'm becoming in so many different ways. I know that I have changed a lot and maybe there are different versions of me that you've connected with and maybe you've questioned what is going on in Jenna's life.

59:15But I feel like Dr. Tara literally outlined a lot of the things that I feel like I've come home to and I've learned in recent years and hearing about her own transformation and journey and just how she's taking the nerdy neuroscience with it all is just absolutely beautiful. So I hope you love today's episode. If you haven't, go back and listen to her episode in 2021, especially if you love manifesting or you're curious, like does manifestation really work inside that episode? She does this incredible visualization exercise that is so good. It's called the portals exercise at the end of that episode.

59:52And it is absolute gold. And thank you so much for listening to this episode. If you know somebody who would benefit from it, of course, please send it their way. Let it be your gift to them. And thank you for being a part of this community and for tuning in until next time, gold diggers. Keep on digging your biggest goals.

1:00:36This show has become so much more than I ever imagined. And it's because of listeners like you who show up and share. You are helping build something that will inspire entrepreneurs for years to come. For show notes, links, and resources, head to golddiggerpodcast.com. Keep digging your biggest goals. The world needs what you're building.