Messages from Dying Mothers

0:00Through 25 seasons, 4 ,561 episodes, I believe The Oprah Winfrey Show is one of the greatest classrooms in the world. I really never thought of it that way. The aha moments, the breakthroughs, the connections, the occasional ugly cry. I miss him so terribly. I miss him every single minute. The LOLs. The moments that matter. Daddy! The eye-opening life lessons. Never allow them to take you somewhere else. I'm bringing them back. It's time to open the vault. I've personally chosen these classic episodes to share with you again. Every single person you ever will meet shares that common desire. They want to know, do you see me?

0:47Do you hear me? Does what I say mean anything to you? You are listening to The Oprah Winfrey Show, the podcast.

1:01Well, our first guest came all the way from England for their first visit to the United States. Back home in Britain, they've captured the hearts of millions who have followed their extraordinary story. The headline read, Could you be our new mom? Children in a heartbreaking plea. A British newspaper featured a very unusual appeal. Kids and dog for hire. Life term contract. Sad gets need not apply. Ten-year-old twins Lauren and Ashton Mills, whose 43-year-old mother Toby is dying of cancer, were advertising for new parents to care for them after she dies. Toby, who is a single mother, is desperate to find her children a new home.

1:40She has no family of her own, and although friends are rallying around her, none are in a position to adopt the twins. Their plea received an overwhelming response. Thousands of potential families have come forward. Please welcome Toby Mills to our show. Toby. I think for any parent who recognizes that there is a potential for them not being here to take care of their children, that the great horror is, who will take care of my child? Panic. Panic. Panic. And when you realized you were sick, is that one of the first things you thought of? Yeah. Mm-hmm. When I was first told about the liver cancer, my immediate response was, I hope I'm going to live to see them grow independent of me.

2:25But it soon became clear I wasn't going to be able to do that. And the cancer is in your liver. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it's getting worse gradually. You say you sometimes dream about dying. I do. Yes. Yes, I do. And you think it's your subconscious preparing you for? Yeah. It's quite a peaceful dream. Really? Yeah. Do you fear it at all? No. No, I don't fear dying. Because it's a gradual thing, I think I'm going to get there slowly. It's a journey, a long journey. Do you feel in some ways that at least you have preparation time? Yeah, I'm pleased about that. I would hate to be knocked down by a bus.

3:05Because at least now you get to think about. Yeah. Why the idea of putting an ad in the paper for the children? Basically because we were running out of time pretty quick. I was told I only had three months if I didn't have treatment. So I had the treatment to buy me some more time, and we needed to move on very quickly to find somebody appropriate. We said in the tape piece, there are friends who are rallying around you, who support you. You do have people to do that. Yeah, I do have them. But they say, I can't take your children? No, that's right. Nobody's in a position to do that. And so what do you want for your children?

3:37I want a family who parented before, but hopefully the children have grown up and left home, so they've got time to spend with Ashton and Lauren. Probably somebody of an academic background that can support them into what they want to do in the future. And somebody who's really going to listen to them because they've got a tough job ahead of them, a really tough job, and they need people around them that's going to hear them. What do you think you've given them in the ten years you've had? The opportunity to say what they feel and don't hold back. And understanding of other people and being able to listen to other people where they're coming from too.

4:20And being able to express how they feel. That's one of the biggest things, I think. Before the show, I talked to them, to 10-year-old, their twins, Ashton and Lauren, who have shown tremendous courage as their mother nears the end of her life. And here's a little bit of what they had to say. So what do you want your new family to be like? Somebody that can cook mama's spaghetti. That can cook your mom's spaghetti, yeah. And... that cares about us, really. And that cares about you. Give us independence when we need it. And give you independence when you need it. And help when you need it. And help when you need it.

4:57So we can talk to when you're feeling unhappy. And someone you can talk to when you're feeling unhappy. Would there be other kids in the family? No. No. You don't want any other kids? No. Just the two of you? No. Okay. Well, if they were like 17 or 18. If they were older. Yeah. Okay. But you don't want younger kids. Don't want to deal with that. No. Okay. So you want somebody who just wants to take you guys at this age, Lauren and Ashton, and you're 10. Yeah. And someone who will accept your dog. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. Yeah, because the dog's a part of the family. Yeah. Yeah. What kind of dog?

5:31It's from a spaniel. Name? Lacey. Got to have Lacey. So it's Ashton, Lauren, Lacey. Yeah. You come as a package? Yeah. That's the deal? Yeah. Okay. Got it. But do you think you'll be okay? Well, I don't think you'll be okay, but I don't think we'll manage, I suppose. You think you'll manage? Yeah. You think you'll be okay? Yeah. You will? Yeah. Well, I hope you get a new good mom. You'll never be able to really replace the one you have, but I hope you get a really good one, somebody who really cares about you, adores you, just adores you, hoping that happens for you. And you're hoping the same?

6:17Yeah, of course. Yeah. What have you learned from this experience? I heard you used to be a big procrastinator. Oh, terrible. I would always put off till tomorrow if I didn't have to make a decision today. I don't do that anymore. I still give myself thinking time, but I go for it very big now. I heard you gave up small talk, too. Yeah, yeah. I haven't got time for that. There are... I want to get to real issues and real, real feelings with people. I haven't got the time to mess about. And you recognize, too, that you're never going to hear any worse news than you're going to die. No, not really.

6:53Uh-huh. So you then make the best of every other day. That's right. Because that's as bad as it gets. That's as bad as it gets, yeah. There's no point in wallowing in self-pity, though, because that's a waste of time. It's like hate. It's a negative emotion. You've got to look for the positives in it. When one of Toby's last wishes made the front page of the newspaper in England, Richard Branson, the millionaire owner of Virgin Records and Virgin Airlines and many others, stepped up and paid for her dream to come true. And what was that dream? To swim with dolphins. Really? Yeah. Yeah. I had to do that before I died.

7:29It was a wonderful experience. That's so big. Really? Yeah, I was really surprised at how big dolphins are and the feel of their skin. It's like touching a wet welly. And did it fulfill the expectation? Oh, yes. Yeah. There was one guy called Fonzie. He was an alpha male, and he just kept kissing me all the time. Really? Yeah. You said that you went bowling. You'd never been bowling before. That's right. And I said, well, if I only had a few months to live, I don't know if bowling would be on the list of things to do. And I said, did it live up to the expectation? You're just trying new things.

8:06Just trying new things. Yeah. Yeah. I've got to do it all. You're going to do it all? Yeah. Are you going to leave like a memory book for the children? Yes. Yes. I have memory books that need filling in rather quickly, but I want some help doing that. Yeah. You wanted to start a parent organization. I do. Yes. Yeah. I mean, one of the reasons I think that everybody's been touched by the story is that Ashton and Lauren and I really communicate. And I want to bring that to everybody else if I can. And where I live in Blackbird Leaves, it's quite socially deprived. And parents don't really know how to listen.

8:42So the legacy I'd like to leave is some communication classes. And we want to call it Who Said Kids Were Easy? Right, right. You said to them the hardest thing that you have to do, that you don't fear dying, but you regret having to leave them behind. Of course. That's the hardest job I'm ever going to do in my life. Yeah. I can prepare for me, but I can't prepare for them. That's out of my control. And so you all are doing what families say they want to do, is that is spend more time together. Quality time. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, we do that. We talk a lot. We laugh a lot. We cry sometimes, too.

9:22And they don't like it when I get grumpy. You found a parent? Have you found someone? Yeah, we found... It's looking good. It's looking good. It's very early at the moment to be too optimistic, but it feels right for us, and it feels right for that family, too. A single parent, or you hope? You're hoping? Yeah, she's a single parent, yeah, and she has children of her own that are older. That are older, which is exactly what she was looking for. Well, we wish the most, the best, the highest for you and your children. And thank you for sharing this. And hopefully somebody will hear your story and be moved to become closer with their own children.

10:02Because the truth of the matter is you've been diagnosed. You don't know if the doctors are right or not. You really, we never really know how long you have to live. And nobody really does. And that's the message that I hope people will get from your story. Thank you very much. My guests today were enjoying the good life, happily married with successful careers. a beautiful one-year-old daughter, Peyton. But on January 20th of 1994, during a ski vacation, Erin made a discovery that would change their lives forever. And that discovery was? A breast lump, breast cancer. Just self-exam? Self-exam.

10:39Did my self-exam. Went home, had a mammogram. It didn't show up on the mammogram. The lump didn't show up on that? No. Younger women had trouble with that. Then it later progressed to the spine and metastasized there. and then through treatment there I had a near-death experience. And then after that it metastasized to the lung and to the liver. And what do you mean by near-death experience? Well, the doctors all... Said you were dead. Yeah. Close. Close. Didn't go all the way. Was that the moment where, I think I remember reading this about you, that you had the near-death experience of seeing the light and no longer being afraid of death?

11:17Yes. I didn't get to go through the light. The light came at me and then exploded, but ever since that, the peace and serenity I found in that hospital room was unbelievable and just did a 180 on my whole life. Really? Tell us about that. It was before that experience. As you mentioned, we were just working. I was both of us working hard and busy in life. And then in cancer treatment, I focused on it like in business and just tried to get through it and keep my head down and go through it. Well, not until the near death, my stomach had exploded, not exploded, but had enlarged to over nine months, pregnant with the outie belly button and everything.

11:59And the doctors told my parents and my husband that I only had a few maybe hours, minutes to live, and ended up two weeks later turning the corner on Easter morning. You did? Yes. And the doctor came in that morning. the blood work miraculously changed and that I was going to live. Wow. So you lost your fear of death then? Absolutely. Really. It was God? It was. It was God. I came from a very loving family, and I have a loving husband and a loving daughter and friends, and I'm saturated in love. But the love I experienced in that near-death experience was indescribable. It gave me such peace. And I didn't want to leave the hospital room afterwards because of that, that incredible love that you just, it's magnified 10 ,000 times you could ever expect.

12:50And can't describe it? No. In human terms? No. All right. So that changed you. And you came back wanting to do what? You still weren't healed, though. No. Mm-hmm. But prior to that, I'd been trying to figure out what my purpose was in life. Mm-hmm. And that experience, I had several conversations with God, and it was able to get away my feeling of unworthiness, religious dogmas that had kept me having a relationship with God prior to that, and clearly set my purpose was just to allow God's love and light to flow through. It was simply that, because I was worried about what I was doing. I was a venture capitalist, and I thought, oh, I need to go work for Mother Teresa or give my money away.

13:31I just kept that calling and conflict, but that experience brought it down that it wasn't matter what I did, and I think you've proven this in your industry, but it was how I did it. And that your purpose was? Just to allow his love to flow through, integrate the spirituality into my mental body, my emotional body, my physical body. And what she's doing today, not trying to go off and just, you know, just be spiritual per se. She can finally make her purpose happen wherever, whatever she was doing. If you don't have to go to a mountain top and work for Mother Teresa. Exactly. Exactly right. That it comes from what you do every day in your life.

14:08I could be a janitor. I could be the surgeon in the hospital. It was how I did it, not what I did. Well, Erin has been fighting to live, but has also been preparing to die in an extraordinary way for hours and hours. She has sat before a video camera, recorded all of her motherly wisdom to guide her daughter, Peyton, who is six, when she is no longer here. I'll be watching over you. I'll be with you. you'll feel me on your wedding day I'll be there watching you I'll be watching there with you with your firstborn your children your family your husband it's your children baby

14:59I'll watch over them as well. Never.

15:07So when did you decide to do this? The first time that we were diagnosed with breast cancer, we... We. I immediately sat in bed before the surgery and thought, I have so much to tell her, I can't leave now. And so I had to figure out a way to get it out, because you want to tell them all 18 years' worth of advice to a one - or two-year-old. It doesn't work. So immediately got up the next day and just started... I had to find a conduit. And that's what I wanted to do. So you started videotaping. And now you have, what, volumes of videotapes? I don't know. Divide it into different sections. Girl talk.

15:41And the volumes of hours of videotape Erin has recorded, she's covered all the bases important to a young girl growing up. Even after her death, Payton will be able to turn to her mother for some girl talk. Just listen to this. These are things that maybe Daddy can't teach you. And hopefully I'll be around to teach you. But if I'm not, you got information or some of it. Try to pick up makeup that makes it look natural like you're not wearing any makeup. It's a trick where you have to work with a makeup artist and make sure you work in natural lighting and make sure that the makeup doesn't look like you're wearing much.

16:14Never get your hair cut if you're going through a difficult, emotional time. That's what my mom always said. Or your grandma. If you're going to buy clothes, try to buy timeless clothes. don't try to buy fattish clothes because the fattish clothes go out of style and so you end up spending more money over the years than if you just bought like a classic blazer type thing or a classic dress that you know is going to be timeless. Let's see, getting guys to like you. Well, first of all, just being yourself, they're going to like you. But if you want to make a good first impression or what have you, listen to their stories.

16:48Be a good listener and use full attentive eyes when you listen, like really, you know, look in their eyes, just like be affected by their stories and be excited by their stories, genuinely though. Now, does Peyton know that you're doing these? She does. I do journals and videos and Doug does them well. We've really looking at prepare to die. In my preparation, realized everyone needs to prepare to die because we all are going to die. Right. And so Doug started doing them as well and we actually looked at all aspects, not just the videos. I know, you talk about spirituality and God and everything.

17:27I mean, you've covered it all. Virtual and mental. During her recordings, Erin has been very candid about cancer and its effects on her body. Hi. Hi. Mommy's hair is falling out. It's okay, just helping it. She took special medicine and made her hair fall out. Who did? I had to hook up to chemotherapy. And I have these portable units that I can take home. But it makes me kind of tired.

18:00Three hours in the middle of the night, just thinking about how much I love you. I couldn't stand it. I couldn't sleep. So finally I decided, I'm just going to get up and record how much I love Peyton more than infinity. That's what we used to say to each other. You are the most... I'm going to cry because I just... You're so special. You're asleep right now upstairs. And I was going to go upstairs and just call him when he was asleep, but I'd keep you up probably. I love you, Peyton. I love you, dear.

18:43What did the doctors say about how long you have to live? It's weekly. It depends on what the week is. We just found a new chemotherapy treatment that is extending me to now. So we just now just take it day to day. Month to month. And so all these volumes of tapes have become a book. Or are you going to write a book? We wrote a book called Prepare to Die, Expect to Live. It's breaking out how to prepare to die because we realized, you know, if a doctor tells you you've only got a day, we all are sitting here with maybe just a day. And so to prepare with the end in mind, mentally, we walk through physically, during your funeral arrangements, everyone is a responsible parent or a loved one should do that for each other.

19:29Erin has prepared Erin and Doug for the end of her life with the attention to detail and efficiency she used during her high-powered career as a venture capitalist, because it's divided into sections. Physically, plan your funeral, where you want to be buried, what music you want played, the whole thing. Right on an obituary and a will. I had a will, but after Princess Diana, that woke me right on up, really. And I redid the whole will and, you know, paid better attention to it. Took some people out, put some people in. That's so true. It's true. Emotionally, tell loved ones how important they are.

19:59That's what this is for. And the tapes are, you've devoted a lot, a great deal of the tapes, of course, to Peyton, but also to Doug. Yes, well, actually, I was doing it And Doug goes, I want one. Really? Absolutely. Because if, as a single parent going forward, he wouldn't have a confidant like he has now. And so I just went through the issues. But you also talked about how you blessed Doug in remarrying. Yes. Because you wanted her to be able to accept that and know that it was okay. Correct. And also to Doug to know that. Because you wouldn't, at first he was totally against it. And said, can't imagine, but now he's open to the concept that if it happened.

20:36because we believe in the love on earth. And if you're blessed twice, that would be wonderful. Okay. So it's physically, emotionally, mentally, spiritually. Spiritually learn and take time to meditate, you tell her? Yes. And find a spiritual mentor. Read inspiring books. Yes. What do you tell her about God? Integrate it into our discussion on death. Our number one priority as parents, when we started writing this book, was to realize what did we want for the end in mind for her? And it was a strong relationship with God and self-esteem. And what we told her about God is that He's a loving God, and we tried to focus on the circle of life as opposed to...

21:16So she...for us, we believe in a heaven and that we'll all be together afterwards, and we were all together beforehand. I just thought that that was such a profound and magnificent thing you shared with us in the beginning about your near-death experience was recognizing that your purpose was to let the love come through you every day in every way. and that you didn't need a mountaintop experience to do it. You all just celebrated your 10th anniversary? Yes. A lot of times when there is illness, serious illness in the family, it tears people apart. Was there ever a moment where you suspected that might happen?

21:48We've been really blessed. That is very common. It's really common. It's common. And for us, I guess it kind of drew us together because it, the challenge of it made us rethink so many things about ourselves, about our spirituality, about our relationship and for Peyton, too. And the challenge actually brought us much closer. We got even down deeper than we normally would, exploring issues of purpose and the like, and the fact that we both have gone down those paths and found deeper purposes for ourselves and then understanding what we want for Peyton. It's been an incredible exploration. And what we've said is really over the past four years, I mean, we've started to live life for the first time.

22:28Even though we've had it, quote, unquote, kind of had it all or were getting there, we really didn't start our lives. until four years ago. We would not change the last four years for anything, except for maybe having the realization we have right now without having the trial. Yeah. And it's sometimes often hard to have the realization without the trial. Exactly. And that's what we respected about the trial. We were honored to have the trial because we knew without that, you're not having growth. You're in heaven already. There's no reason to have a trial. Would your parents say the same thing, though?

22:58Yes, I believe so. Would you say the same thing, parents? I believe she's absolutely right. Without that trial, you don't have the realization. And I think one of the, I don't know, I always think there's a positive spin, but see, now you use your life, millions of people hear you. Out of the millions of people hear you, some will get it. Even if just one gets it? Well, I'm expecting more than one. I'm expecting more than one will get it, and then without having to have the trial, we'll get to see, you know? That would be beautiful. Oh, it's going to happen. Absolutely. Don't you think? Yes. Absolutely.

23:31Erin has also done her best through videos to prepare Peyton for dating and marriage. When it comes to your husband, pick a very, very nice guy who has a lot of background. A nice guy cares about you, wants to protect you, wants you to be happy in life, wants to encourage you at what you're good at. But make sure he also has backbone, that, you know, when something might hurt you, that he'll stand up for you or stand up for himself. He won't get trampled on. So it's a fine line. But your daddy, you know, if you marry someone like your daddy, you'll be all set. Well, she was raising eight children, ages 17 months to 16 years, and she was dying.

24:19And her last wish was to keep her children together. a near impossibility since she had no family who could take them all. She was a desperate mother who accepted the ultimate gift from strangers. This is no ordinary family. This is a family brought together by a dying mother's fierce love for her eight children. Blanca Enriquez turned to strangers, Rose and Al Malavolti, to love and care for her children after her death. We were told that the mother was dying of cancer, that there were eight children that needed a home, and that the children loved each other very much. The Malavoltes had four children of their own, but always dreamed of adopting more.