House Republicans Block Hegseth Impeachment Push

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0:54Abdul El-Sayed: He's still on the couch. Astonishing. Sell your car today on Carvana.com. Pickup fees may apply. The White House win on Capitol Hill as one of its newest members, Democratic Senator-elect Abdul El-Sayed, is here for a live interview. I'm Caitlin Collins and this is The Source.

1:29Well, it certainly wasn't the outcome the White House was expecting tonight as House Republicans banded together and defeated that effort by one of their own to impeach the Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth. Sources say that both Republican leadership and White House officials were working furiously behind the scenes today to ensure that Congressman Thomas Massey's attempt to rebuke and potentially oust Secretary Pete Hegseth from the president's cabinet wasn't successful. As they voted tonight, Massey ended up being the lone Republican who voted with Democrats on this move. And although you saw President Trump tonight railing against Democrats in his response to what happened on Capitol Hill, as he called it an exoneration of a great American patriot, it was actually the absence of these 11 Democrats, including Congresswoman Nancy Pelosi, who might have helped save Secretary Hegseth from facing that vote on impeachment, even if they did so unintentionally by just not showing up.

2:29Abdul El-Sayed: On this vote, the yeas are 2-11, the nays are 2-0-4. The motion is adopted.

2:43Now, what this means is that their absences allowed Republicans to send those impeachment articles, all eight of them, to committee. And as you heard from Congressman Massey here last night, that means for now, this effort is dead.

2:58Abdul El-Sayed: The first thing Mike Johnson will try to do is refer this to committee. And I want everybody to know right now, a referral to committee is to kill this bill. It is not to move this bill forward, sorry, resolution, this impeachment resolution forward. It's to kill it. Now when it comes to this Congress and what's happening over the next several weeks, right now, Massey says this isn't going anywhere else. He's not going to try this again. We do know Democrats could try to revive those same articles of impeachment that he introduced or even file their own when they take control of Congress come January.

3:36Haven't had a conversation with anyone on the floor team about what may or may not

3:41Abdul El-Sayed: happened in terms of the Hegseth resolution, but this is not the end of it, it's just the end. Now, as far as what's playing out down the street at the White House, we're told that the new chief of staff, who is on day two of his job today and who is personally close to Secretary Hegseth, had reassured him that they have his back. And of course, as you've seen with President Trump, though, he said the same yesterday, though he does have a history of saying that only until he doesn't. Meanwhile, at the Pentagon, we saw Secretary Hegseth coming out to do something he has not done since May, hold a press conference.

4:16It was almost solely focused on this effort to potentially impeach him and his reasoning of why it shouldn't happen. And as you listen to this press conference and what he was saying to reporters at the Pentagon, I should note he only took questions from a prepared list of what appeared to be only conservative media outlets.

4:35Abdul El-Sayed: They impeached President Trump over a perfect phone call. And if standing with President Trump puts me in that company, I'll take that company every day of the week. President Trump ended that kind of wokeness and weakness. Biden had let it happen. President Trump said no more. President Trump is willing to do what no other president would. President Trump made homeland security national security because President Trump demanded it. Americans are lining up to serve in President Trump's Department of War. And not only did Secretary Hegseth liken himself to the past impeachments of President Trump, at one point he also sought to tie his own situation to the rank and file.

5:20Abdul El-Sayed: It tells them that a single rogue legislator loaded with personal animus for the president can attempt to veto national security decisions made by the duly elected commander-in-chief. It puts a target on the backs of American warriors by signaling that Congress will undermine their missions in real time. This is not patriotism. This is sabotage. Put the secretary on trial today and the men and women who carried out those orders tomorrow. If they want to come for the warriors, they're going to have to come through me. And we start tonight with some of our best sources here in Washington. Dan LaMoth is a national security reporter for The Washington Post.

6:08Jasmine Wright, White House correspondent for The Washington Sun. And CNN political commentator and Republican strategist, Shermichael Singleton. Dan, what's been the reaction coming out of the Pentagon so far tonight?

6:19Abdul El-Sayed: Some combination of celebration and gloating. up to and including a Pentagon account posting an artificial intelligence-enabled image of Thomas Massey crying. I mean, they're really kind of touting this. Are they surprised by it? I don't know that they're surprised by it. I think they're surprised by the way it went. The idea that this did not pass on the backs of 11 Democrats that didn't vote. I think that's unexpected. I don't know that anybody could have saw that coming. Yeah, I mean, the reaction among Democrats online so far, Jasmine, seems to be pretty upset. These are the 11 Democrats, as I mentioned a few moments ago, who were not there and are the reason that this was able to not be successful the way that Massey wanted it to go.

7:05It includes Stephen Horsford, Jonathan Jackson, Pelosi, as I mentioned, Melanie Stansberry, who was on House Oversight, Haley Stevens, Frederica Wilson, Marilyn Strickland. I do think among Democrats who have been, you know, in this week of total euphoria since their wins, it is a real question of how they're feeling about how this went tonight, even if it was led by a Republican here.

7:28Abdul El-Sayed: Yeah, it's a reality check that governing can sometimes be hard, as is keeping together your coalition. Democrats wanted to get this done this term so that they could focus on their other investigations that they hope to launch the next term. And so obviously this is a setback on that accord. But listen, the White House went to work on this. They called around because I think two things can be true here. It is true that Republicans in Congress and both the White House have concerns about Pete Hexas' leadership, feel that he may have a large part in the way that the Iran war is going, but also that the White House did not want to give Thomas Massey a win here.

8:01Abdul El-Sayed: They did not want to allow him to impeach Pete Hexas. And so they went around and made sure that their Republican offices and that their Republican congressmen stayed true to what the president wanted them to do. I talked to one source who said it was a real clarifying moment for the White House today. After really a week or so of kind of circular fire amongst White House aides, now they're really realigned with who they say the quote unquote enemy is, which, of course, in this case would be Thomas Massey and the Democrats. Well, and Thomas Massey was here last night. He said he wasn't whipping this personally.

8:32He wasn't sure if it was going to succeed. But I do think, you know, Republican leaders had at least expected that maybe some of their members would cross over and vote.

8:42Abdul El-Sayed: Yeah, that was some of the discussions last night. And then you had the White House, particularly Stephen Miller, who's pretty good friends and pretty close with the secretary of defense, making sure that they can preserve and protect him. I think he walks away more entrenched today, including the White House and even the president with trying to defy Democrats and protect HECS by pretty much all any means. Now, the question, I think, for Democrats going into this new session, and I think AOC stated earlier today that the priority is to still attempt this again. And so from Republicans, I can guarantee you that the messaging and the focus will be instead of prioritizing cost of living and affordability.

9:17Abdul El-Sayed: Democrats have a litany, a list rather, of people that they plan to impeach first and then eventually get to cost of living, which certainly I would argue is not what most of the American people voted for this past Tuesday. Well, I mean, for the secretary himself, I was surprised he hasn't held a briefing since May. Not that we have briefings that often at the White House either, as Jasmine knows. But sooner than May. Very well. But the president does make appearances at times, as he did yesterday. What does it say to you that he felt the need to come out this morning, first thing at 8 o 'clock to hold this press conference?

9:46He seemed to think that House Republicans might vote against him.

9:50Abdul El-Sayed: I saw two audiences. First and foremost, the president. I mean, I think he wanted to make it clear he was fighting, that he was coming out strong, that he was going to attack the media, that he was going to attack Democrats and attack Congressman Massey. In addition to that, I think there was a case in that message that specifically policy disagreements maybe shouldn't be litigated through impeachment in this way. And I think that was meant more for the lawmakers and keeping the Republicans together. One question is, what does it mean for Pete Hexeth's job overall? I mean, the president seems pretty firmly against him right now or behind him, I should say, because of this effort.

10:27He doesn't like when someone who works on his team is attacked in this way. What are you hearing about that? Yeah, the president is doubling down behind Pete Hegseth.

10:36Abdul El-Sayed: I did hear from one source who basically said that this was a lot of political capital for the White House to put forth just for Pete Hegseth to go through another impeachment process in just a few months. And when the dynamic is different, because you will have Democrats in both leading both the House and the Senate, meaning that that could actually be successful this time. So a lot of phone calls from the White House. But do they really expect to get Democrats, I mean, Republicans rather than the Senate to vote with Democrats to impeach him? I mean, how realistic is that? Well, the one thing that people were watching was Bill Cassidy, Tom Tillis, Joni Arons, who weren't saying we're definitely not going to do that.

11:13They left it open and they don't have anything to lose, really. But speaking of what this is going to look like come January, Jim Jordan is now going to be the new leader for Republicans in the House. He won that leadership election behind closed doors today. What do you think that's going to look like?

11:27Abdul El-Sayed: I mean, look, he came, rose in politics out of the Tea Party movement, right? He's perceived as a fighter. And I think right now when you look at the bloodbath that we just experienced in the midterms, the party wants someone who can not only draw a contrast against Democrats, the expectation is that there will be hearings after hearings after hearings. And while I certainly respect Steve Scalise and his incredible ability to fundraise, I mean, that's one negative. The question is, can Jim Jordan raise a lot of money to try to expand and grow our minority in 28 and beyond? We'll see. But you do want someone who can fight.

12:00Abdul El-Sayed: And the president, who has a great relationship with Jim Jordan, wants someone who can protect and defend him in the House. So this makes all the sense in the world why they would have affirmed him as opposed to Steve Scalise. Yeah, we'll see what that looks like. Great to have all three of you here tonight. Thank you so much for joining us. Up next, we have two winners who just made history in the midterms last week. Coming up first, Wisconsin's first black governor-elect, David Crowley, is going to join us. his first national television interview since his historic victory. And also, Michigan's Democratic Senator-elect Abdul El-Sayed is going to join me here on set to talk about what his party needs to do, and also, who should lead them.

12:53For the first time in nearly two decades, a majority of the nation's governors will soon be Democrats. Yes, come January, roughly 75 percent of all Americans will have Democratic governors. Across the map, if you look at those victories from last week, at least 28 states are going to be held by a Dem, five of which which flipped from Republican control, of course, including states like Texas. And Democrats could pick up two more if they end up winning in Kansas and Alaska. The races still haven't been called there yet, so we're still tracking those. But one of the biggest nail biters that we followed for Democrats as they were fighting to hold on to the governor's mansions that they already had this year was in Wisconsin.

13:33The former Milwaukee County Executive David Crowley defeated Trump-backed Congressman Tom Tiffany there. And once he has sworn in, he's also going to make history as Wisconsin's first black governor. And Governor-elect David Crowley is back here tonight. And thank you, sir, for being here. A big part of your message had to do with affordability and talking about how you understand the plights that people in your state feel firsthand. And when it comes to now what that looks like from campaigning to governing, what is your plan as soon as you take office? Do you have a day one initiative that you're going to roll out to address that?

14:10Abdul El-Sayed: Well, first and foremost, thank you for having me, Caitlin, and so glad to be joining you and your listeners this evening. But as many people may know, you know, when you're focusing on the campaign versus governing, campaigning is the easy part. Now it's our time to make sure that we're tackling the issues that we heard all across the Badger State, which is tackling the affordability. How do we make groceries? How do we make housing, child care and health care that much more affordable? And we've already started having those conversations. I just met with our assembly leaders and our Senate leaders just today to start those conversations.

14:44Abdul El-Sayed: But right now we are focusing on getting our transition team in place to make sure that we'll be ready on day one. And, of course, one thing that you have to do when you're governing is also work with the federal government at times. And we've seen Tony Evers, you know, he's clashed with President Trump before when it came to ICE, to tariffs that were impacting manufacturers and farmers in your state. We've heard some new Democrats here in Washington talking about ways they can work with the White House. What do you think will be your approach on that level? Well, it's going to be the same that I've approached governing even as a county executive.

15:18Abdul El-Sayed: It doesn't matter what side of the aisle that you're on. If you're willing to come to the table to make sure that we are making a positive impact on the lives that we represent, that's what I'm going to be focusing on. And when there are times that we have to push back, we're absolutely going to push back. We're always going to fight back. But what's more important for me and Democrats here in the state of Wisconsin is how do we push forward? How do we actually deliver for the six million residents that call Wisconsin home? Because they've been getting the short end of the stick because we've had a Republican controlled legislature for more than 15 years.

15:49Abdul El-Sayed: And so this is a great opportunity to make sure that we do exactly that. And so I look forward to creating an even better partnership with the federal government to make sure that we can do that. And the fact is, is that, you know, prior to this election, we only had two congressional members and now we just flip two more. So now we have four congressional seats, and I want to make sure that we're partnering with them to bring back as many resources as possible. So you think that there could be some ways that you could work with the federal government? You know, I think there are ways that we can work with everybody.

16:21Abdul El-Sayed: You know, and I know that there's a lot of rhetoric, a lot of pushback, particularly that comes from the Trump administration. but I have been excited at the fact that, you know, we have flipped so many congressional seats across this country, as well as senator seats, which lets you know that we're going to have Democrats who are going to be on the offense for the first time pushing back against the Trump administration. But again, we have to push forward. And my goal is to make sure that we can partner with the federal government to make sure that we can fill many of the holes that were created by this Trump administration with the fact that we have a brand new Congress coming in.

16:54Well, one thing that we're going to see going into effect quite soon here across the nation is a result of the so-called one big beautiful bill, which are these big federal Medicaid cuts and work requirements that are coming into play for that. They're set to take effect in January, of course, right when you're taking office. What impact is that going to have on your state?

17:16Abdul El-Sayed: Well, we know that this is one of the reasons why I ran for governor, you know, because I know what families are going through. And when you take a look at the state budget, there's going to be many gaps, many holes in this budget due to the cuts that we have seen from the big ugly bill and from this Trump administration. And so I'm looking forward to working with our brand new Democratic trifecta legislature to make sure that we can do exactly that. And the way that we do that is, one, we have to increase our revenues and we can do that by finding new ways. For example, you know, legalizing marijuana.

17:50Abdul El-Sayed: You know, we are one of the very few states in the Midwest that has not legalized it. And we're even losing tens of millions of dollars to our neighbors to the south in Illinois, Minnesota and Michigan. And so our goal is to make sure that we can grow our economy, grow our business. But at the end of the day, we have to take care of our people. And we have to make we do that by lowering their costs no matter what they're paying for. Well, some Democrats have been skeptical of what you've wanted to do to expand Medicaid and your promise to do so on the campaign trail. That includes the chair of your state's Democratic Party, who said that he thinks you were clear eyed that while we want to expand Medicaid, that may not be the expansion that has often been talked about previously.

18:31Can you tell us what your definition of expanded Medicaid is?

18:37Abdul El-Sayed: Well, we know that so many families have seen their premium skyrocket. You know, we are seeing rural hospitals that are closing. And we have to make sure that we're partnering with the health care system to make sure that people aren't falling through the cracks and they can get access to health care whenever and wherever they need it. And I'm looking forward to working with Democrats here in the state of Wisconsin to move forward. But let's just be honest. Like this is an issue that is affecting the entire country. And we're going to have to continue to lean on Democrats in Congress and in the United States Senate to put pressure on this Trump administration to actually fix health care.

19:12Abdul El-Sayed: But at the end of the day, we have to figure out what is best for us, and that's what we're going to do throughout my term. We've also spoken to other governors, including Josh Shapiro. This has been an issue that he's dealing with in his state and now in Wisconsin. Last week, for people who weren't following, an infant in your state died in connection with a big ongoing measles outbreak. It's the first measles-related death in Wisconsin in more than 35 years, which might be hard for some people to fathom. In terms of that and working with the CDC and the health secretary, RFK Jr., what do you plan to do?

19:50How do you plan to handle that as governor?

19:53Abdul El-Sayed: Well, my thoughts and prayers are not just with that infant, but with everybody who has been directly impacted by the measles outbreak that we have seen in this country. And it is unfortunate that we have a health secretary in RFK who is not doing right by the citizens. And so we need to step up. You know, we need to follow the science. We need to make sure that we are properly giving people as much information as possible so they can have trusted conversations with the health care providers about making the best decision for themselves and for their families. You know, I am vaccinated. All my daughters are vaccinated, as well as my wife.

20:28Abdul El-Sayed: And we need to make sure that we continue to promote that. And so here in the state of Wisconsin, we're always going to keep health first. The more and more that we can become a healthier state, the more people the more people have access to greater opportunities. And for me, it's always looking to the social determinants of health. You know, health is much more than just mental and physical money in your pocket is health. Access to housing, transportation, all these things contribute to our overall health. And we're going to focus on making the great state of Wisconsin the healthiest state in the Midwest.

21:00Abdul El-Sayed: But we are going to do whatever we can to work with our local municipalities to make sure we're getting as much information, trusted information out to the public here in Wisconsin. Governor-elect David Crowley, thank you for joining us. Thank you for having me. And up next, I mentioned another newly elected Democrat is here to join us. Michigan Senator-elect Abdul El-Sayed is here. Democrats are back in Washington. What's going to be first that they plan to tackle come January?

21:42Tonight, despite those historic Republican losses that happened last week, Senate Republicans today stood firmly behind the majority leader, John Thune, and re-elected the South Dakota senator to lead them when they are in the minority in the next Congress. Meanwhile, on the Democratic side, Chuck Schumer is now facing a growing mutiny while he's still fresh off that blowout midterm victory. His push to be the next majority leader hit a roadblock today, as the most prominent progressive in the Senate said he's not going to back him. If this campaign was about anything, it was about change.

22:19Abdul El-Sayed: and the need for the Democratic Party, in my view, to move in a new and bold direction. I personally have known Chuck Schumer for over 30 years, and I like Chuck. Nobody who works harder than Chuck Schumer. But in my view, the time is now for change, and I will not be supporting Chuck to be re-elected as the Democratic leader. Of course, Senator Bernie Sanders isn't independent, but he caucuses with the Democrats. He didn't say exactly who he plans to back over Senator Schumer. A few moments after that, though, Chuck Schumer himself brushed off the suggestion that his shot at being the next leader is at risk.

23:06Abdul El-Sayed: I'm confident I will be elected majority leader. We have great unity in our caucus, and I'll be proud to lead it as majority leader. Right now, no other Democrat has officially announced they are going to challenge Chuck Schumer. But one name that is being thrown around here in Washington is Senator Chris Van Hollen, who is appearing to entertain this opportunity. The Maryland Democrat said today that he is, quote, actively calling his colleagues as he's considering throwing his hat in the ring. My next source is the Democratic senator-elect from Michigan, Abdul El-Sayed, who was the first in his party to publicly call for Chris Van Hollen to actually lead Senate Democrats.

23:43And thank you, Senator-elect, for being here. Has Chris Van Hollen told you if he's running?

23:48Abdul El-Sayed: We've had a lot of conversations, and I just want to step back. This is somebody who's made his bones in both the Senate, but then also in Congress, and also in his state legislature. He is a legislator's legislator, extremely well-respected by different groups in the Democratic caucus, and somebody I think would just be an incredible leader for the Senate, which is why way back in the summer I was talking about why I thought he'd be the right choice. Have you talked to him directly about this since you became a senator-elect last week? Well, to tell him that I thought he'd be a great choice. You know, obviously he's heard me say it, and in person I told him I just think he'd be a refreshing choice.

24:27Abdul El-Sayed: And I don't want to take anything away from Senator Schumer. He's put a lot of effort into helping to architect the majority that we are going to enjoy in the next two years and obviously has just a wealth of knowledge and capacity. But I do think that this moment calls for a different kind of leadership. You know, when my state spoke up, they were asking for money out of politics, money in your pocket, Medicare for all. They wanted action. And I think this is just a moment for us to be able to pivot with what our collective states have been telling us that they want. And what do you think Chris Van Hollen will do differently?

25:02Abdul El-Sayed: Well, I think, number one, I think he understands that this moment calls for just a very different kind of leadership. rather than the kind of omnibus bill packages, things like the Inflation Reduction Act, which had really, really great legislation inside of it, but was almost impossible to message because it didn't brand on all of the incredible pieces of legislation inside of it. We need quick hits that really allow us to go out and talk about what we are going to deliver, what it is, and then force the president to decide, does he want to veto legislation that's broadly popular, that's what the American public voted for, or does he want to actually work with us to try to address the challenges that people are facing?

25:39Abdul El-Sayed: Across the state, I was meeting people who were talking about, look, my kid's getting priced out of playing baseball. I can't afford a second bag of groceries. I don't know if I fill up my tank, if I'm going to have enough to be able to go grocery shopping afterwards. American public needs answers. They need action. So what we need to be able to do is address every single piece. And I've been very clear. That starts with addressing the nuclear bomb that is about to go off in our health care system and reversing these Medicaid cuts that are about to go through. And then we need to end this ridiculous war that we have no business fighting.

26:09Abdul El-Sayed: It's illegal, immoral, and unethical. And finally, the tariffs that we're all paying huge amounts of money for that make no actual economic sense. We need to be able to hit those in quick succession and to lead the caucus in that direction to deliver for the public. And despite praising him for this new majority, you don't think Chuck Schumer can do that? Well, I think it is a moment right now for us to be thinking about new leadership. I mean, I just look, you know, we've seen the past. And like I said, Senator Schumer has led ably in the past. But this is a moment for a refresh. You know, I spent the last two days with a freshman class that, you know, just represents America in a real way.

26:42Abdul El-Sayed: And each of them has spent the last 18 months or so crisscrossing their own states. when you get the kind of majorities that we saw in Texas, in Kansas, in South Carolina, and of course in Michigan, what that says right now is that we are so frustrated with the leadership of the Republicans that we are willing to give you a chance. We haven't earned our mandate yet though. And that is about what we do next. And if what we do next is too much like what we've done in the past, I just think we might not be meeting the moment. And I'd like to see leadership that willing to do that. Chris Van Hollen has been in Washington since 2003.

27:20I believe that was the year you graduated high school, actually. He's 67, Schumer is 75. Do you think he's the generational change that some in your party are pushing for?

27:28Abdul El-Sayed: Well, like I said, obviously a lot of the new members represent a real generational change, but there's also something about the way the Senate works. And so I think he strikes a really great balance between the kind of generational change that we're asking for in new leadership, but also somebody who's been in and around the Senate and the House to understand how to shepherd legislation through the process. And I think, you know, he just represents that unique ability both to have earned his statesmanship and have earned his stripes as a legislator while also being really attuned to what folks now, and I'll just point to one now, I'll point to one instance of his leadership.

28:06Abdul El-Sayed: You know, his work when it came to Kilmar Abrego Garcia, his willingness to go and fly down, take a real risk, to raise the issue and force the conversation, that's the kind of action I think people want now. So you couple that with his legislative acumen, his time in Washington, and then also the fact that he represents a real departure from the past. I just think he'd be a phenomenal leader. You mentioned the things that you think Democrats need to address on day one, tariffs, the Medicaid cuts, the Iran war. Hegseth, Secretary Hegseth, was on the verge of potentially facing an impeachment vote today, but Republican leaders were successful in killing it.

28:40Is that something you want to see Democrats revive?

28:43Abdul El-Sayed: Can you imagine being Pete Hexeth right now? Like, why are you still in your job? I mean, it's an open question. Like, Pete, like, really, just open question. Why are you still doing this job? You are really bad at this. You are failing your responsibility. You have mishandled this war. And nobody really actually understands what it is you're about. Every day you're talking about fighting a new cultural war, but, like, you're supposed to be waging an actual war that is actually illegal on its own terms. So just resign. Make it easy for everybody instead of, in the end, getting taken out because that is clearly what's happening.

29:13Abdul El-Sayed: So, Pete, just take it from me like you're not good at this. I mean, you're talking directly to Pete Hegseth. What do you say to those 11 Democrats who didn't show up to vote tonight? You should show up and do your job. I mean, it's kind of surprising that Democrats are the reason he's not going to face that vote, not Republicans, really. Look, I mean, look, there's no question. everywhere I went in Michigan, the big questions were, why does it cost me$80 to fill up my truck? And why can't I afford a second pound of ground beef at the grocery store? And that goes back to one issue, which is this insane war that we have no business fighting.

29:46Abdul El-Sayed: And it's not just that, but it's that every step of the way, Pete Hegseth has aided and abetted a president who we all know is way out of his league. And so, you know, I think it is important for us to be recognizing that Pete Hegseth himself is the tie to the affordability that all of us crave when it comes to this administration. So look, you know, obviously I'm not going to be in a position to vote to impeach, and I will assess any impeachment that is done on its own merits, but it's really quite clear that Pete Hegseth is failing his responsibilities as Secretary of Defense. There are Democrats who say it's not just Hegseth that they want to go after and potentially impeach and potentially remove RFK Jr., others in the cabinet.

30:31Do you believe that there are other cabinet members? And can you do that and also balance the other priorities that you mentioned?

30:36Abdul El-Sayed: You know, the question of whether or not cabinet members are doing their job well is a secondary question to how do we address the crisis in folks' life. Right now, people are really struggling to be able to afford a tank of gas. They're really struggling at the grocery store. They're struggling to see a doctor. A lot of that goes back to policies that have been perpetrated by folks like Pete Hegseth or RFK Jr. But if everything we're doing does not actually address the problem in people's life, I think we're missing the mandate. So it's really important for us as we investigate to make sure that every investigation that we pursue actually ties back to the goal of making somebody's life a little bit easier out there in a place like Detroit or Escanaba in Michigan.

31:13Well, you know, Medicare for All has been a big platform of yours that you have pushed and you've said that you want to get it passed. You've said that you would even call it Trumpcare for all, if that's what it took.

31:23Abdul El-Sayed: Donald, if you're watching, we can put your name on it. I know you like to put your name on stuff. You can finally meet the unmet promise in America to guarantee everybody health care. So it's on the table if you want to do it. But are you being serious or are you being funny? No, I'm absolutely serious. You would totally vote for that. I don't care what it's called. I want people to have health care in this country. Really. What you call it is a secondary issue. If we're able to guarantee everybody cradle-to-grave coverage without a copay, a premium, or a deductible, the security of knowing that whatever happens in your life, you're going to be able to see a doctor without getting hit by a bill that is going to put you into arrears, where you're going to have to worry about medical debt,$225 billion in this country already.

32:02Abdul El-Sayed: I think that would be a win. So if he wants to call it Trump care for all, I'm game. Do you think with Democrats having control of the Senate and the House that that could actually get passed? You know, I'm really interested. I haven't talked to the president. him. But I'm really interested in understanding. He said that he has made peace with the outcomes of the election. He understands that they lost. Now, the question is, do you want to actually try to get some things done over the next two years? When I look at his moves, appointing Stephen Miller as White House chief of staff, it doesn't much feel like that's the direction they want to go, appointing Jim Jordan in the House as the next minority leader.

32:42Abdul El-Sayed: But he said that he's willing to take a posture to work with us on the things that we can work on. Right now, Americans are struggling under the weight of very basic things that they cannot afford. Healthcare is one of those things. People right now are about to step into or already have started to make their selections for insurance. They're noticing premiums that have gone up double digits. That's on top of double digits last year. One of the most important things we can do to both address affordability and then the ability to see a doctor is to guarantee every single person public health insurance in this country.

33:12Abdul El-Sayed: That's what Medicare for All is. So again, what you call it is secondary. What it does in your life, that's the whole point. None of us ran to name things, except for Donald Trump. Most of us ran to actually solve problems in people's lives. You need Trump's signature, but to get it passed, you need Democrats to lead on that. Do you think that your party can lead on that? I bet if the president came out and said, you know, I'm going to sign this, if you call it Trump Fair for All, I think we might be able to do it. You know, I understand that this is the end goal. And I understand that not all of my colleagues might be there.

33:40Abdul El-Sayed: And part of my job is to have the conversation both broadly with the public about why this is where we need to go. And then also more intimately with my colleagues, both in the House and the Senate, about why we need to be doing this. I've been working on this question for my entire career. But I do think that this is a moment right now where the public really is demanding some real answers to their problems. We saw that in an electoral outcome. And what better way to answer the mandate that the American public gave Democrats, but to say, hey, look, we can finally, once and for all, solve the challenge of American health care in this country.

34:12Abdul El-Sayed: We can undo medical debt. We can address the challenges that people have so often when it comes to just simply getting sick and being able to see a doctor. You referenced the vice president the night you won. For people who've missed that, given your speech was quite late, I believe it was like two or three o 'clock in the morning, wasn't it? This is what you said about J.D. Vance. J.D.

34:39Habibi, there is this delicious irony in the fact that you're constitutionally obligated

34:46Abdul El-Sayed: to swear me in in January.

34:52What do you plan to say to him when he swears you in?

34:56Abdul El-Sayed: I'm going to take my oath of office and swear my allegiance to the Constitution. and you know that is about as much as we need to talk about. You said you can work with President Trump. Can you work with the Vice President? I'm a professional. I'll work with anyone to get work done. When he swears me in he has one job which is to swear me in and it takes me saying the oath and that's about as much as I'm going to say. Senator-elect Abdul El-Sayed, thank you for joining us here on SEP. Thanks for having me. Appreciate your time. Up next we have new reporting on what and exactly when the President was briefed on that intelligence that NVIDIA's CEO was having a relationship with an alleged Chinese spy.

35:42Tonight, CNN has new reporting that answers at least some of the questions about what President Trump knew, what he was told, and when he was told this about NVIDIA CEO Jensen Wong's relationship with an alleged Chinese spy. A source is telling my colleague Kristen Holmes tonight that back in May, Secretary of State Marco Rubio was briefed and had briefed the president on intelligence about this matter as they traveled to China aboard Air Force One. That discussion happened before that layover in Alaska where Jensen Wong joined the president for the last leg of that flight to Beijing. Yesterday, when the president made that surprise appearance in the briefing room and he was questioned by reporters about what he knew.

36:23This is what he said. When you went to China earlier this year in May, did you know about these alleged ties with the Chinese by then?

36:33Abdul El-Sayed: No, I didn't hear about it then, but a lot of people have heard about it and Jensen totally denies that. Now, as for Secretary Rubio, this was his response to questions on Monday before this new reporting was published. How important is it that there's a thorough investigation in your view? I'm not going to comment. It's an internal corporate matter for them, so I'm just not going to comment on that topic. Will he do just the president's office? You have to ask the White House. I don't handle that part of our operation, but I just can't comment. I'm not going to comment at all on the NVIDIA thing.

37:10Abdul El-Sayed: You don't view it as a national security concern? I'm just not going to comment on it. Jensen Huang was initially not on that trip and then joined Air Force One kind of midway, I believe was in Alaska on the way to China. Do you have any recollection of why he was initially left off or why he joined or any of those details? No. I mean, I have a lot of jobs, but the White House travel office isn't right. So I just, I mean, I don't want to give you bad information. Now, a White House official responded to this reporting tonight and said, these sources have no idea what they're talking about. My source tonight is Garrett Graff, who is the national security journalist and historian, and also the author of the new book, another one, America and 25 Revolutions, the story of our imperfect nation's 250-year quest to become a more perfect union.

37:54It's out today. I'm in the middle of reading it. I'm on the third revolution so far. It's really good. But before we get to that, our reporting is contradicting basically what the president said yesterday. What do you make of what we know so far about what the administration knew about this.

38:11Abdul El-Sayed: Yeah, so I think that this is actually shaping up to be one of the largest counterintelligence scandals that we have seen in the 21st century, that this is a moment where we see the U.S. government apparently having pretty deep knowledge and concerns both about Jensen Wong, his relationship with the Singapore-based executive, her company and what her company in Singapore was doing, potentially sort of funneling some of these chips, these advanced AI chips back to China. We've seen reporting from Bloomberg that says that a U.S. audit that NVIDIA conducted of this Singapore company found 50 ,000 missing computer chips.

38:56Abdul El-Sayed: That's a big number. That's a big number in a very important geopolitical calculation right now of this AI race with China. I mean, it's like a huge coup for China. It's a huge coup for China. They had access to the biggest tech leader in the world. Exactly. And as you know, I'm a Watergate historian. And I think one of the big questions that Democrats are going to be asking in January, what did the president know and when did he know it. Well, and I thought it was notable that when the New York Times reported this tonight and then CNN confirmed that Secretary Rubio did brief the president on this on the way to that trip where they then picked up Jensen Wong in Alaska and he and a few other executives flew with them.

39:38I mean, the president maybe doesn't remember this, but the New York Times and CNN reporting seems to suggest that he pretty clearly did understand what he was being briefed on.

39:47Abdul El-Sayed: And what you have to remember is the extent to which Jensen Wong has been lobbying President Trump over the last year and a half to loosen the Biden era export controls around these advanced Nvidia chips being sold overseas to companies like this Singapore one that Alice Wong, his alleged extramarital affair and possible Chinese intelligence asset worked for. Well, and he's so close with the president. I mean, he put him on speakerphone at that one event when he called him up. So we'll see, obviously, where this goes. And as we look at this in a historical context, you mentioned Watergate. Your new book talks about America and 25 revolutions.

40:29And I just started reading it over the weekend. It's really good so far. But it's really interesting in terms of how you look at how we think about our history as a nation, especially as we reflected on the 250th anniversary and birthday, and what you found as you were reexamining these key moments in our nation's history.

40:47Abdul El-Sayed: Yeah. So what I try to do in the book is tell the story of America's 250-year history, not as a single beginning point, not 1776, but as the story of revolutions, plural, that we have had so many moments across our history when we have seen people that the founders would not have considered citizens, either legally or morally, write themselves into the American story. and that our story, our history is so much the story of progress and retrenchment decade across decade, generation across generation. And you see it even in this week's midterms that you saw, you know, the previous guest, Abdul Al-Sayed, the first Muslim senator of the United States, elected as part of this incredibly diverse new class of leaders at the state and federal level after two years of incredible white supremacist politics at the federal level.

41:46Well, you also wrote about how once progress is made in the U.S., that doesn't always mean it's guaranteed. And then actually, as you were in the middle of writing this book, some of that was taken backwards.

41:58Abdul El-Sayed: Absolutely. My sort of very dark joke is that of the 25 revolutions in the book, some of which are familiar, Reconstruction, women's suffrage, the Civil Rights Movement, some of which are less so the Americans with Disabilities Act, the passage of the Jones-Safiroff Act of 1917, and Puerto Rican citizenship. We've actually seen the U.S. government just in the last three years really reverse three of these revolutions in a major way, including the rollback of some of the original pure food and drug acts. Yeah. Garrett Graff, I love all your books. I read all of them. Thank you for joining us here tonight to talk about this and all the news tonight.

42:37The book America and 25 Revolutions is out now. You can read it with me up next. It is time for source code tonight. Our source code is two thousand eight hundred and fifty one. We'll be right back.

42:59Tonight's source code is two thousand eight hundred and fifty one. That's how many votes right now the Democratic candidate, Scott Colombe, in Mississippi is leading, the incumbent Republican Senator Cindy Hyde-Smith. Right now, that race is still too close to call, yes, one week after Election Day. But today, we actually heard from Senator Cindy Hyde-Smith, who doesn't normally answer questions in the hallways of the Capitol, and really has mostly avoided the cameras since the election on Tuesday night. But she weighed in on this exceptionally close race and told my colleague Manu Raju this.

43:59Yeah, and we feel confident. She says she feels confident. Scott Cologne tonight is dismissing that optimism and told CNN his lead he believes will be, quote, insurmountable once the ballots come in from a Democratic stronghold. We're watching those returns closely. We will, of course, bring you any updates as we get them. Thank you so much for joining us here on The Source tonight. CNN Newsnight starts now. Starting a business can seem like a daunting task, unless you have a partner like Shopify. They have the tools you need to start and grow your business. From designing a website, to marketing, to selling and beyond, Shopify can help with everything you need.

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