Cincinnati - Is tennis losing a generation?

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1:36Matt Roberts: Well, hello and welcome to the Tennis Podcast. It is Tuesday morning, Tuesday the 12th of August, So no Friday night disco vibes on this show, but great vibes nonetheless. The sun is shining. Taylor Swift is releasing new music. The US Open starts in a week's time. All is well with the world. Matt Roberts, how are you doing?

1:59Catherine Whitaker: Very well. Yeah, what fun news to wake up to this morning about Taylor Swift's new album. As you said, the sun's shining. We're in a good place. I'm still getting through Springsteen's seven new albums they are feeding us

2:17Matt Roberts: yeah what a time what a time to be alive and most of it is going over David's head but he's happy nonetheless yeah delighted for you both and for the wider world who are apparently into this kind of thing I'm still trying to get my head wrapped around how do you produce seven albums in one go I mean how long did that take him?

2:40Catherine Whitaker: oh well those were lost albums from sort of where'd you lose them over the last 40 years he'd he'd written and produced songs that he hadn't put out

2:53Matt Roberts: and now he put them to be fair to bruce like those seven albums did take 40 years yeah

2:58Catherine Whitaker: okay yeah also katherine a big week to be uh to be sports podcasters because apparently that's where you now announce a new album. I was hoping you'd make that connection.

3:10Matt Roberts: Yes, we are. I mean, we shared the Time 100 list with New Heights, didn't we? How many months away do you think we are from having a global superstar on the podcast to announce a new album? It's a natural progression.

3:30Catherine Whitaker: Is she going on her boyfriend's podcast or is she working her way through the top 100? We are available, Taylor.

3:40Matt Roberts: David, who would you have... I might get into it if she does that. Who would you have on the Tennis Podcast to announce a new album?

3:51What, like an artist?

3:53Matt Roberts: Yes. This is like Carlos Alcaraz, name a woman, isn't it? David Law, name a current pop star. Well, my favourite one's dead. Don't bring the mood down, David. David, a current pop star, name any current alive pop star. I like this one my son's got me onto called Banner or Banners. I don't know, but I like the music. And I'd like to go and see that live as well.

4:17Catherine Whitaker: David's come and get me, please. Apparently it's a person. Not quite sure of the name, but please come on the pod.

4:23Matt Roberts: Or if it's a person or a band. That is all true. Yeah, it's the weekend all over again. Right, let's talk about some tennis, folks. We're going to head to Cincinnati. We're going to start with the men's event. We've had wins for the usual suspects, Yannick Sinner, Carlos Alcaraz, although very different kinds of wins, certainly in their opening matches. We'll talk about those a little bit later in the show. But I wanted to start with the movement, or certainly a movement, if you like, because in the early rounds of Cincinnati, we've already seen losses for Kasparud, Stefanos Tsitsipas, Daniel Medvedev and Lorenzo Mazzetti, continuing the trend of early losses for all four of those players.

5:11Matt Roberts: Kasparud lost to Artur Rindeknesh, Daniel Medvedev to Adam Walton and Lorenzo Mazzetti and Stefanos Tsitsipas were both victims of Benjamin Bonzi, who of course took Daniel Medvedev out in the first round of Wimbledon as well. let's take Muzetti aside for now because I do think his case might be slightly different but with Ruud, Tsitsipas and Medvedev Matt we do seem to have a generation in crisis here

5:45Catherine Whitaker: yeah I mean I would I would potentially slightly push back on Ruud as well just because he has won a big title this year. He won a Masters 1000 event not that long ago in Madrid. OK, that was quite an isolated result when you look at his season as a whole. But I still think he's capable of that level of tennis. He has shown it. I think he's been struggling with the knee, hasn't he, since Roland Garros, that injury that he picked up that cost him there against Nuno Borges, kept him out of Wimbledon. And to me, I didn't see all of the match against Rindekanesh, but it certainly looked like he might still be a little bit compromised by that.

6:30Catherine Whitaker: But generally, I do absolutely agree. I mean, Medvedev and Tsitsipas in particular, the decline is pretty steep now, I think. Medvedev, well, to be honest, both of them we've talked about quite a lot, haven't we? different again different reasons but kind of the same overarching take that neither of them are the players they used to be and it's hard to see them getting back up to that point again given the new talent that's emerged since their decline and just given the just the eye test when you watch them play now Medvedev is the one who I saw here against Adam Walton and he was clearly struggling big time in the conditions.

7:24Catherine Whitaker: Brutal heat in Cincinnati. We got some...

7:27Matt Roberts: He put his head in the ice bin, didn't he?

7:30Catherine Whitaker: He put his head in the ice bin. He sort of stripped most of his clothes off and got the air conditioner hose sort of pointing at various parts of his body. He looked a state and I felt for him because he's brutal playing in those conditions. but Adam Walton is a guy who'd never won a set against a top 50 player and he'd played 24 of them. I know he's improving Adam Walton so that's perhaps a slightly misleading stat but he's not a guy that you really should be losing to if you're Daniil Medvedev and he's already lost nine matches this year against players outside of the top 50. The last time he lost that many was 2017 and the most in the year since then had been five.

8:17Catherine Whitaker: So just look at the numbers and the sorts of players that are beating Medvedev. It points to a pretty steep decline. And last year we talked about it with his game and how his serve wasn't as threatening, how he was struggling to make impacts in the court with his shots. But he kept having good slam results. His slam results last year were actually really good and they sort of propped him up. Well, this year the slam results have been really poor. and the general form on the tour has been poor. And this is where we are now with Daniil Medvedev, who is just constantly, for me, on upset watch, but it's no longer an upset.

8:55Catherine Whitaker: That's how I go into every tournament now, thinking about him and thinking about Tsitsipas as well. They're big names still in the sport. I'm kind of drawn to their matches because there is a part of me that thinks, OK, these two have been such good players, let's see. but inevitably they're losing early and it's not a surprise now.

9:16Matt Roberts: It's a shame, David, that they're famously not friends because I imagine they could offer quite a lot of support to one another just now. I did some maths for this section of the podcast and the average rank of players that they have each lost to this year is 55 for them both. the average ranking of the players that they're losing to. Medvedev's last top 10 win on an outdoor hardcourt was Indian Wells last year. And for Sittapas, his last top 10 win on an outdoor hardcourt was against Medvedev in the Cincinnati final in 2022. And these are both players, okay, Sittapas is, you'd say his best surface is clay, whereas Medvedev famously self-declared hardcourt specialist.

10:07Matt Roberts: But Sitsipas is a slam finalist on a hard court. I think it's OK to judge him somewhat by his hard court results. And these stats are pretty stark. And I agree with Matt that Rude is perhaps in a slightly different bracket. But the average rank of players that he's lost to this year is 41. and his last hard court win over a top 10 player was in Acapulco in February of last year. He got two of them there over Runa and de Menor. These players are simply not a factor on outdoor hard courts. Certainly, no. And certainly not on a, like, they're not really factors anywhere on a regular basis, which they used to be.

10:58They used to be frequent contenders. You know, there are isolated moments. Medvedev's constantly banging on about Haller. Sitsa passed. Do you remember when he won Dubai earlier this year? And he was really good. You know, there were reminders there that you thought, oh, this is the game that I remember. You know, this crowding of an opponent and an ability to take anything early and hurt you with forehands and his movement and his athleticism. And then, you know, he then lost relatively early in both the hardcore Sunshine Double tournaments. And you mentioned Ruud's win in Madrid. And again, you think, oh, yeah, that's the guy I remember.

11:38And they all look a bit burnt out. They all, in their varying ways, Sitsapas, I think, injury is in addition to burnout. But, you know, he spoke at the start of the year about, you know, that Dubai win was kind of like a reaction almost to the terrible loss he took against Alex Mickelson in Australia when he was so anemic. And Medvedev more recently, it just feels like they're serial losers in early stages now to people that would never have got near them. And I do think aura is part of that as well. It's not just the basics of your forehands and your backhands. I mean, I think you could look at all of them and think that they might say, well, I'm not doing this as well, I'm not doing that as well.

12:28But they are not carrying themselves in quite the way they used to, and the opponents are not looking at them in the way they used to. They're thinking, if I hang around here, I've got a chance. And that's the thing with Medvedev, you know, wins that first set. and then you think, actually, he's supposed to go away now and win this. And then next thing you know, he's drawn back in and he's kind of physically being defeated. I mean, it is some of the most horrible-looking conditions I've seen at a tennis tournament this last week. So I don't envy these guys. But it's a worry, really, that they're the ones that are faltering.

13:07Matt Roberts: Whose career of those three, or maybe of those two, kind of interpret the question how you would prefer, would you choose to have from this point out? I think Medvedev is 29. He's got two years on, I think, Sitsapas turned 27 today. Happy birthday, Stefanos. Hope you're not listening. And Rude is 26. So I guess sort of logically you'd go with Kasper Rude. but results-wise, whose career would you choose from this point?

13:43Catherine Whitaker: I think I would take Rude.

13:46Matt Roberts: And out of Medford-Evansitt to pass? Neither, retire. It's pretty close, aren't it? Retire and go to Ibiza? Who would you choose, David? I actually look at them all as very similar. I mean, there is that age difference And I think because Rude's got the clear clay court pedigree, I think his game still does stand up if he's fully fit. But the fact that he's getting niggled. Does it? Sitsapas is getting niggled. You think Kasper Rude's game still stands up at the top if he's fit? On clay, if he's fully fit. I mean, look, you know, when I say at the top, I think he's got a problem if he's playing those top two.

14:31I think anybody has. but I still think he's in the group in the top six.

14:36Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, I mean, we had a conversation about whether Ruud is in the mix at the French Open, which wasn't that long ago. And look, maybe we read too much into Madrid and those specific conditions there, but he did play great in that tournament. And I kind of think the thing with Ruud is that the peak level he reached always seemed like a surprise to me. And it sort of did with Medvedev as well, but he sustained it for so long that he just became that player. You know, consistent top five, world number one. So to see the drop off is then surprising. I think it's hard for them too. You know, I think that they struggle with that then.

15:19That they're not who they have managed to sort of somehow haul themselves to be.

15:27Matt Roberts: What about Mazzetti then? I mean, his situation is very different. He's significantly younger. He does seem still generally on the upward swing of his career. And yet, Matt, he's crap on hard courts. And not seeming to be making any progress.

15:45Catherine Whitaker: And I really thought this was going to be the year where the progress was going to be made. Because, look, he was sensational on the clay. Like, semi-finals or finals of all the big events that he played, he was brilliant. He obviously got that injury at the French Open, which then kept him out of the grass. And when he first came back on the hard courts, watching him against Norrie in Washington, I thought that injury was still lingering. He certainly wasn't explosive. But since then, I haven't watched his matches and thought injury is the problem. I've thought his game on hard courts is the problem.

16:23Catherine Whitaker: I think I've been trying to figure out what it is. I think the backhand is an issue for him on the hard courts because on the clay he can step back, he can give himself time and he can rip it and on the grass he can slice it. And he can't really do either of those things quite as effectively on the hard. And actually if you look at Bonzi there with his two wins I think he's targeted two kind of ineffective single-handed backhands on the hard court in Mazzetti and in Sitsapas. He's had a clear angle of attack and game plan against them. Mazzetti, I know, has been sort of in his matches really complaining about his serve.

17:05Catherine Whitaker: His serve is not very effective on the hard court. He doesn't get that many cheat points. But I kind of just feel like even when he's at his best Mazzetti, he often has sort of fluctuations in matches. And he has moments where he does something that seem a little bit mad. and I feel like with Clay underfoot and with grass underfoot he's got the confidence to sort of put those moments behind him and just keep bringing it whereas on a hard court it's almost like it just gets to him and his whole body language gets a bit negative and he has this sort of stream of consciousness that he's constantly muttering and chuntering to his coach about and it just feels like his confidence isn't there and therefore he's just a lot more vulnerable.

17:51Catherine Whitaker: But I did think this would maybe be the year because I know he was really targeting trying to qualify for Turin. And that actually might end up working against him because perhaps he's putting a bit more pressure on himself on the hard courts. He was suddenly, for the first time off the back of that clay season, in a really strong position to maybe qualify for Turin. And that would have been a really big deal for him playing at home. And it feels like he's playing with a bit of that pressure and that expectation maybe on his back. And it's all just leading to losses against players on clay. He would absolutely, absolutely take apart, I think.

18:33Catherine Whitaker: So it's a tricky, tricky place for him right now. Because it's a long time until we're back on the clay. You've got to learn to... OK, it might not be his best surface, but he's got to get better on hard courts because he can't just have three or four months every season if he's going to be a properly top player, which it does seem like his talent suggests he could be.

18:58Matt Roberts: Do you think he will crack it, David? I'm going to say yes. I'm going to say yes. What is cracking to you?

19:09Catherine Whitaker: Is it have as good results on hard as clay? It's not quite that to me. No, no, no, no. No, I don't think that.

19:15Matt Roberts: But more than just, I mean, I do think he'll improve just because you kind of have to, right, with just experience and time. Like, I don't, I think he's too good a player to not improve some, but like... Skills are there, aren't they? Will he reach Grand Slam quarterfinals on hard courts? I think he will. I mean, see, I look at it a little bit like Roode. Now, I think Roode overachieved by getting to the final of the US Open on a hard court. But I don't see that his game is perfectly suited to that surface, certainly versus Clay. I don't see why Mazzetti shouldn't be able to do it to a second week of a Grand Slam level of both Australia and the US multiple times.

20:06Catherine Whitaker: And he actually played OK in Melbourne. He lost to Shelton in a really good match. I want to say third round, I think, in Australia. He actually did start the season quite well on the hardcourt, sort of by his standards, but it has really dropped off. And I do think that injury was, you know, just really poorly timed in terms of, you know, he had a big break before his worst surface. So he's coming back on his worst surface, which I think is kind of a tricky thing to do. But then if you only have like three or four months of a season,

20:47Matt Roberts: it does put so much pressure on that time of the season that the chances are most injuries are going to be put, like increases the chances of injuries being poorly timed, like because your time window is that much shorter, I suppose. he's too good not to make significant strides on hard courts I think but I am a bit alarmed at how little progress there seems to have been he seems less alarmed he and Flavio Caballi we've all seen the clip of them having a riotous time at King's Island that is my style of putting a loss behind you they seem very surprised to be sort of in the wake of the log flume water like literally that's what that area is for and they seemed it was very surprised it was very it was very cute he is still in the doubles is he okay great easy playing with with fellow lorenzo

21:48Catherine Whitaker: sonago sonago no that's good for him i think yeah and i think good luck to them you know if you're top player and you go out early at one of these two week you know masters 1000 find something to do so kings island and doubles sounds sounds great

22:07Matt Roberts: um let's talk about the big two shall we uh very yannick sinner things have happened and very carlos alcaraz things have happened yannick sinner has won two matches in straight sets although pretty different straight sets matches it has to be said carlos alcaraz has just played the one match so far he won it but he played two good sets and one terrible set in the middle so Sinner has beaten Daniel Galan one and one in I think his quickest win ever under an hour I think we've all seen the clip haven't we of him having time to mop his brow mid-rally before hitting a smash that pretty much summed up summed up that victory slightly different straight sets win for him overnight though against Gabriel Diallo.

22:58Matt Roberts: Not even I stayed up for this one. I did watch highlights this morning, but obviously the highlights just showed everybody's great play, which I don't think was necessarily representative of this match because I get the feeling from what I've read that Yannick Senna was, by his very, very high and consistent standards, David, pretty subpar in this match. Yeah, and it's interesting because his opponent, I find very interesting. We've got a little bit of heat and humidity here in the UK at the moment. I mean, laughable levels compared to Cincinnati. But they were enough to wake me up at 2.30 in the morning.

23:37And whilst awake, I turned my phone on. And it was... You wanted to see if the TS12 news was real, didn't you? Yeah, that was it. And then I needed to Google who it was about. No, I just turned on the live scores and saw that Sinner was in a second set tiebreak against Diallo. I thought, OK, I'm going to turn this on. And I turned it on, and it's 5-all in the tiebreak. Diallo wins the next point against the serve, 6-5. And it's just this fascinating moment. I'm aware of the one-sided nature of these sets that Sinner's been getting. and suddenly this guy has got set point and pans to him. He's got the peroxide hair.

24:26He looks the business. Diallo just looks like somebody who believes I can beat any of these guys. He's 6 '8". He's got a huge serve. He's quite happy to go to the net. I really like the way he carries himself. Steps up to the line, smashes the serve down, and the ball is back on his shoelaces on the baseline within an instant. It's the most perfect Novak Djokovic-type return you could imagine. And you can't deal with what he's hit. Diallo looked shocked to his boots by this return. So that levels it. Go down the other end. He does it again. And suddenly he's match point down, mini breakdown, Sinner finishes the match.

25:10That's it. Peril over. But a little reminder, and I think that it really is important to remember, but that Sinner is not unbeatable. He is the best player in the world in men's tennis right now and recently it's taken, certainly at Grand Savile level, it's taken otherworldly stuff from Carlos Alcrast to beat him. But I do think that there are players that can hurt him and he can also have bad days. I didn't see enough of the match to be able to tell you what the bad day element of it was but I can tell you that Diallo certainly carries some threat.

25:46Catherine Whitaker: well I know that Sinner was very unhappy with his serving in the match and he actually well actually he and Carlos Alcruz both immediately went on to the practice court after their after their wins during this tournament and apparently Sinner hit a load of serves I think he got broken with three double faults in a game early on in this match against diallo um it was also a very weird day and night in cincinnati because there was a big power outage there was a generator on fire they lost all power and there was a big suspension of play for a while and then during the cinema match it was kind of like it was stuttering and restarting and therefore causing all sorts of problems like the led screen around the court went off for a long time and they had to pause a fire alarm went off in the building that overlooks the centre court.

26:40Matt Roberts: Is it just me, or does tennis have a disproportionate number of power outage-related incidents?

26:48Catherine Whitaker: Well, there was that big one in Madrid, wasn't there? Anecdotally, I'm going to say yes. There was the big one in Madrid that was a sort of Iberian Peninsula-wide thing that tennis got caught up in.

26:59Matt Roberts: Yeah, there was a big one at the French Open about ten years ago, I remember, where they ended up with just having... They got one camera up and running, one fixed, very highly positioned camera. And I think it was during the Venus Williams-Kristina Medinovich match. And sort of the players were barely visible. Anyway, here you go.

27:20Catherine Whitaker: Well, imagine my delight when this match is going on with all these interruptions. And I'm thinking, oh, you need a good umpire in that occasion. Of course it was Greg Allensworth in the chair. Just a drama.

27:33Matt Roberts: It's all coming up Matt Roberts today. Drama magnet.

27:37Catherine Whitaker: And Sinner, so this fire alarm's going off. And, you know, both the players are at the net and they're having to pause. And Sinner's like, I mean, I can play through that. Like, he's like, if the fans, you know, we're here for the fans. Like, they're annoyed that we're having to stop. I can play through that. And I think Greg was like, okay. So, yeah. So, I guess what I'm saying is, like, it was a weird match in that sense in that like they kept having to stop Sinner actually seems to be in an incredible mood I think I saw his Tennis Channel interview where he was really buzzing he was laughing through these interruptions like there seems to be a sort of lightness to him which I think there hasn't been I do wonder if he in the last year with all the doping stuff

28:22Matt Roberts: yeah I do wonder if he's look I know he won Cincinnati last year like his remarkable ability to not let the cloud that was hanging over him affect his tennis results is well documented and discussed by us and other people like extraordinary but in terms of the like it must have affected the the happiness he was he was able to experience while doing it and I do wonder if like he's now got the really direct visceral comparison of being here last year here being Cincinnati not not my living room um being in Cincinnati compared to last year when he knew the the announcement he knew going public with the with the doping situation was looming over him at that point he knew that that would be happening the day after Cincinnati whether he won it or not and that must have been grim really.

29:20Matt Roberts: So I do wonder if sort of having that direct kind of, God, it's so different this year is helpful to him.

29:32Catherine Whitaker: I think winning Wimbledon probably helps as well.

29:35Matt Roberts: Yeah.

29:35Catherine Whitaker: You know? Sure. Possibly more.

29:38Matt Roberts: Yeah.

29:38Catherine Whitaker: No, I think both. I really think it's a combination of everything right now for Sinner. yeah but he had a practice session with eminavaro did he oh did he i mean he got introduced then

29:53Matt Roberts: he was he went to the tennis channel set and he was asked about the mixed doubles and he just

29:59Catherine Whitaker: laughed he just laughed he's gonna pull out right i mean surely he's gonna win he's gonna win or he'll reach the final and pull out yeah yeah so he's like which is even if he was really into

30:13Matt Roberts: of the mixed doubles, I don't think you can reach the final of Cincinnati and not pull out of the mixed. But I think he might reach the final of Cincinnati and not be that bothered about pulling out of the mixed. I could be wrong. And look, Jack Draper will be waiting for Emi Navarro. Or anybody. Yeah, I mean, literally anybody at this point. Let's talk about Carlos Alcaraz, shall we? actually no I have one more question about Yannick Sinner before we move on David you said you know it's a reminder that Diallo match that he's not unbeatable what type of player what style of player do you think Yannick Sinner is most susceptible to well that type I think people who carry threat in their own game look at what Dimitrov managed look what Bublik managed you know these are players that carry threat and Diallo walks up to the line believing if I hit my spots you ain't getting the ball back and I think that there aren't that many like that I mean you know I would have said Shelton but because that matchup really hasn't worked for Shelton at all so far I think that that is maybe unlikely I think more likely at the US Open than anywhere on the Grand Slam stage, but I still think it doesn't look like a good matchup at all for Shelton.

31:45Some do. So I think it has to be people like that that are prepared to go through.

31:52Matt Roberts: Do you think it's variety? I don't think of it really like that. I think of it more as, I mean, you know, being able to mix that in is fine, but I think there's a degree of shock and awe. hold your serve, hold your serve, hold your serve, put the scoreboard pressure on, win a couple of points in the tie break. But he dances in a pressure storm.

32:13Catherine Whitaker: How about Adrian Manorino in the next round?

32:16Matt Roberts: Yeah.

32:17Catherine Whitaker: Wouldn't be my pick. Didn't he beat your man the best player in the world? He's beaten the best player in the world. And Tommy Paul.

32:25Matt Roberts: He's qualified, beating the best player in the world and beaten Tommy Paul. Bad loss for Tommy Paul, that, by the way, because he needs to be making hay on the US hardcourt. But Adrian Manorino in the year 2025.

32:37Catherine Whitaker: It's very much giving that run he had at the Australian Open and he then ran into Novak Djokovic and won about, what, one game, two games? Something like that.

32:46Matt Roberts: Yes, it is giving that. I won't be staying up into the wee hours to watch Sinner Manorino or watch the highlights. He's not the type. No. That will cause threat. Okay, Carlos Alcaraz. he very much is the type to win a tennis match 6-1, 2-6, 6-3 over Demir Jumher in the opener of a Masters 1000 event. Could this possibly, David, have been more trademark Carlos Alcaraz? And will this type of match ever not be trademarked Carlos Alcaraz? It's a great question. I've always thought that this won't last. This is just something he's doing while he's young until he's kind of locked his game down. But there's absolutely no sign of that at all.

33:32I mean, this was the quintessential Carlos Alcaraz performance in the first match of a tournament after a break. I mean, admittedly, I think Klein-Jumher exacerbates that because he's a shot maker and he likes to sort of show off. And then Alcaraz gets drawn into all that nonsense. And he's absolutely smashed through this first set. And then the next, you know, five minutes later, he's 4-1 down. and he just how is that happening and then in the third set you know he goes flying up 4-1 Al Kraz then he gets broken again and he's 4-3 and you think well actually I mean if he's not careful he's going to lose this and then he just wins two more games and that's the match and I mean there was one extraordinary rally where he was lobbed and he manages to win it and then his finger to the ear turn around and we're all you know everybody's pumped but it i don't think it's a very good performance really not not really not it's not what do you know how many do you know how many points he won on his second serve

34:37Matt Roberts: in the second set i don't it was zero david oh god it was zero serve bot alcaraz yeah there's some serve bot takes that haven't aged well although his first serve like he's serving bombs on the first serve. The speed seems to have gone up. And yet, would I net say Alcaraz's serve is in a brilliant place? I'm not sure that I would. What do you think, Matt? Oh, I think David said it perfectly,

35:10Catherine Whitaker: but also I wouldn't read too much into this because it just is what he does. and

35:19Matt Roberts: do you do you think it will always be what he does I'm starting

35:24Catherine Whitaker: to think so yeah I mean I've had the same I've been on the same journey as David because there have been there have been odd moments in his career where I've thought okay like he's he's really putting it together now he's just beating players handily but then he's sort of back to this and I think it's I think it's it's his it's his sort of DNA as a tennis player.

35:51Matt Roberts: I mean, this might be an exaggerated example because he is coming off the back of a three, he's coming off the back of a Grand Slam loss followed by three weeks of holiday, which is more holiday than he would even have in the off season, I think, because we're not talking training block. I'm sure he, like, there were some workouts in that three-week period, but it sounds like he really had proper holiday. He went to the south of Spain for a week, didn't he, and had holiday, holiday, Ibiza vibes. and then he spent two weeks with his family. So maybe this is an exaggerated situation of, you know, it can take a while to get your head back in the game.

36:31Matt Roberts: David forgot how to do podcasting last week. And we're both brilliant at it, really. Exactly. Exactly. Maybe it's that. I'm just trying to cut him a bit of slack.

36:45Catherine Whitaker: Who's he got now? Majedovic?

36:47Matt Roberts: is that right? Majedovic David's our Majedovic guy can he be more of a threat than Adrian Manorino to Yannick Sinner? I do find Majedovic very interesting because I'm a bit worried about the tennis podcast meets curse because when I met him at the French Open and he was so bullish the way he was talking then he retired from his next match and he was in a terrible state Mboko saved the tennis podcast meets curse forever I think we've got credit in the bank there when I spoke to Majedovic that time I mean, he did voice his frustration about not having been able to translate what is clear potential and clear form in pockets into a sustainable ranking that just has you in all the tournaments easily and so forth.

37:35But I do think he is one of the guys that has real threat. and he's one I would name as a guy that Sinner wouldn't necessarily love to come up against because he has point-ending power. In a one-off match, he backs himself to beat anybody and it's the piecing together of the rest of his career that's been more of a problem. I'm fascinated. Matt?

38:08Matt Roberts: Majedovic a threat I think this will be out of date soon so be careful

38:14Catherine Whitaker: I mean given what we saw from Alcraz in his first match I think you would have to say at this specific tournament yes Majedovic could be a bit of a threat for him I'm less I'm less sort of across Majedovic's career generally than David is so I don't feel quite as qualified to make me. It's because he beat Art of Feas at that next gen, you see. So I understand Majelovic on the basis that he beat Feas.

38:44Matt Roberts: Have you seen what the next gen field is shaping up to be like this year? It's a fallow next gen year. I mean, Fonseca is still age eligible, but he's not going to play again, is he? no it's not a good next gen situation Fonseca by the way, what's going on he's lost to Terence Atman I mean Atman also beat Flavio Caballi that's a good couple of wins for him but it is it's not happening for Fonseca isn't it do you think this is just your classic life has changed for him in the last six months and there will have been a natural adjustment to that I generally think the results he was having, all the performances he was putting in, were jaw-dropping beyond what is realistic to keep producing.

39:45And, I mean, people like me got carried away and said he's going to win the French Open. But, you know, realistically, that doesn't happen very often like that, does it? So, look, I think the fundaments of his game are strong and and he will come good but it's yeah it's gonna take a bit longer his scheduling

40:07Catherine Whitaker: is quite interesting isn't it because he really is pretty much only playing the big events which is kind of what we always ask players to do when they're really good you know like cut down on your events and sort of focus on the main ones i do wonder whether for him still in the developmental phase of his career would actually be prudent to play a few other events and get some wins. Do some winning. It's almost like he's scheduling for the amount of hype that he's got rather than for the actual game that he's got at the moment.

40:49Matt Roberts: And scheduling assuming that he's going to win

40:51Catherine Whitaker: a lot of matches at each event. Yeah.

40:55Matt Roberts: And therefore play a lot of matches at each event.

40:58Catherine Whitaker: But actually he ends up losing and therefore not playing much and having a long time between matches. I feel like when you're...

41:06Matt Roberts: He's not even got doubles, has he? He's kicking his heels at Kings Island exclusively.

41:13Catherine Whitaker: There are worse things to do. I just feel like when you're like that, you can play a lot of matches. And I think maybe also just perhaps he's not as physically ready as I thought he was. Perhaps like the front half of the season being so much better than the latter half, perhaps he just is finding it just tough on the tour kind of at the moment. And I feel like a way to build that up would be to kind of play more. So I think it's going to be interesting to see how he schedules going forward. Because, I mean, he was, again, I watched quite a lot of this match on replay this morning. So I just found it such an intriguing result.

41:58Catherine Whitaker: Like Terence Atman, to me, has always been a bit of a sort of troll figure. I've never really taken him that seriously.

42:04Matt Roberts: I mean, last time I saw him, he was being booed off court by his own crowd at Roland Garros. Yeah. That's who Terence Atman is, to me. Right.

42:13Catherine Whitaker: I mean, he's clearly talented, but what was striking here was Fonseca was a passenger. Like, he was being bossed around, and I think if I had to pinpoint one thing, and there's lots of things, but Fonseca's return is really, really below par, I think, especially off second serve. He doesn't really know how to, I don't know whether he's a step back to come in. He just looks totally lost trying to return serve at the moment. I think that's a big area. Fils was like that, you know, at the start of last year. And I just think if you're as good as they are, you can sort those things out with a few tweaks.

42:56Matt Roberts: He did technically get a win in the opening round, Fonseca, against Alejandro Davidovic for Kina. But that was by retirement a new devastating way to lose for Alejandro Davidovic for Kina, Matt. He's really racking up quite a CV of those. Yeah, I mean, I'm not exactly sure what happened.

43:19Catherine Whitaker: I think it was heat. I think he was struggling in the conditions. But he was...

43:23Matt Roberts: And he's not alone with that. Well, we've had a few, but Arta Rindeknesh yesterday was a really upsetting sight. He ended up retiring as well.

43:35Catherine Whitaker: Yeah. I mean, he was 7-6, 4-0, 30-0, up Davidovic for Kina. I mean, he's almost there. And yet he didn't win another game. He lost that game from 30-0, up, went 5-4 down in the set and had to retire. So that was, yeah, brutal for Davidovic for Kina.

43:56Matt Roberts: And a shock loss for Alex de Menor to Riley Opelka, who I, look, I suppose all the cliches about playing a guy with a game like Riley Opelka, like toss of the coin, anybody can lose to him.

44:09Catherine Whitaker: But Alex de Manor had never lost to him. He was 5-0 against him. And I do remember a few years ago Opelka saying what a nightmare he found playing de Manor. I've always thought that actually de Manor would do really well in that matchup. And yeah, as you said, Apelka is tricky.

44:33Matt Roberts: I absolutely do not think he's anywhere near the Sitsapas-Rude-Medvedev discussion that we had earlier, Alex de Menor. But he is on burnout watch for me. He is on, you know, potentially have you peaked? Like, I don't see a steep decline coming for him at all. I think he's going to hang around and be not far off his peak for a long time. But I do just wonder if that style of play and the fact that he's already talked about burnout. I don't know. He's just on amber alert for me, Alex de Menor. Is that unfair? I mean, look, he's already spoken about that, hasn't he? about how, I mean, speaking to him at Wimbledon, I remember thinking, crikey, this really is a day-to-day thing for him now.

45:28He's trying to manage this situation. But I don't, I still see enough good results. And, you know, I just think it's a management case. I don't think he's, I don't think his form's suffering like those other guys. They look lost. They look like they don't really know what their best self looks like anymore. Dimonor, absolutely. I think Diminor's playing some of the best tennis of his career, but it's a tough...

45:58Matt Roberts: Do you think he'll continue to qualify for Turin? Yeah, I do. For the foreseeable few years? Yeah, I certainly think in the next year or two, he's going to be in that conversation, certainly.

46:12Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, I think being a Turin contender is probably, to me, Alex Diminor's... you know that would be a really good season for him because there are there are players with bigger games who can probably win bigger titles but yeah new shelton's for example but he builds his season on that sort of week in week out consistency um yeah i suppose i suppose like kind of everyone to me is on amber alert for burnout it's kind of yeah how i would feel like if it can if it can get Alex Dimonor. Do you know what I mean? It feels like it can get everyone and he has been through it. I kind of just think he will manage to avoid the real trappings, the real pitfalls of it.

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49:21Matt Roberts: Right, the WTA event in Cincinnati. Let's start, shall we, with a match that we were all engrossed by last night. I'm sure the same is the case for many of you listening right now. Irina Sabalenka beating Emma Raducanu in a deciding set tiebreak 7-6, 4-6, 7-6. Sabalenka extending her tiebreak record for 2025 to 18 wins and just one loss. Not always the absolute highest quality match. I don't think Sabalenka will put this in her highlights reel of great matches. It was a lot of unforced errors from her, but an utterly compelling match. I absolutely loved it, Matt.

50:07Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, I think a real sort of lesson from the summer has been more Sapolenka-Raducanu matches, please, because the one at Wimbledon was compelling as well. And this one, very similarly so, if not as high a quality, I would agree. Raducanu began the match so well like hitting the ball brilliantly doing damage I sent a very David Law style text two games into the match like God Raducanu's playing well

50:38Matt Roberts: Well she'd run nine points in a row Right She won the first nine points in the match

50:42Catherine Whitaker: Yeah and then like lost four games in a row and it was like okay this is still Arena Savalenka

50:50Matt Roberts: That's why you've got to send the texts while they're relevant you've got to strike while the iron's hot although I then said I'm not sure Raducanu will win another game at that point 4-2 Dan hot takes were flying around

51:05Catherine Whitaker: they were flying about that's how into it we were and yeah look I think Raducanu played closer to her best than Sabalenka played to hers in this match but still just really really encouraging match from Raducanu I think the serve in particular was so effective in this match, particularly from the second set onwards. And, you know, he's got obviously a new coach, Francisco Roy, going in there. And I'm sure we'll talk a lot more about that partnership and sort of our first real view of it during a match. But what strikes me is that you see in a match like this what's a new coach going in, like why you would be drawn to the Emma Raducanu sort of project, to put it in really sort of horrible football parlance.

51:59Catherine Whitaker: But like there's just so much in her game that if you can tap into it, she can hurt the best players in the world. And obviously Raducanu has spoken about not feeling like her quality of shot is quite there with the best players in the world. And I do agree with that. But I think we saw little parts of this match where it absolutely was there. with Sabalenka, but we also see the other elements of her game, the way she can absorb some of Sabalenka's power, her hand skills on the baseline. I think her fitness has improved a lot. You know, this was a long match and in gruelling conditions, and yet I wasn't worried about Emerita Canu sort of lasting the course in it.

52:39Catherine Whitaker: In fact, it was Sabalenka who seemed to be struggling physically a bit more in parts of this match. So, so much good for Emerita Canu. There was an incredible 13-deuce, 23-minute game at 3-4 in the third set that Emerita Canu eventually held. Very reminiscent of the game they had in the first set at Wimbledon, when again Emerita Canu held. You know, just these battles that Emerita Canu was coming through. and yeah I absolutely loved this match but the difference was Sabalenka in the tie breaks and that is a phenomenal record that she's got 16 in a row she's won and it's slightly I know we talked about it at Wimbledon but I still feel like we haven't given it the credit it deserves like and I say we I mean us but also just like tennis as a whole hasn't been as across this Sabalenka tie break record as we for example used to be across Novak Djokovic's tie break record I think I think it's because with Djokovic, there was such a clear tactic that he had in those tie breaks, locking his game down.

53:49Catherine Whitaker: It was like he just went into a slightly different mode. I feel like with Savalenka, I haven't quite figured out what she's doing to win these tie breaks, other than being, to use Friday's word of the pod, like so clutch and just like being the best player in the world in the biggest moment. She still feels like she's playing her game, but just bringing it. And it's an incredible thing, especially for someone who has had a bit of an issue bringing her best tennis at the latter end of majors. There is a world where Sabalenka isn't always playing her best tennis in the biggest moments. And yet in tie breaks, which are like the biggest moments in matches, she's doing it repeatedly.

54:34Catherine Whitaker: So I kind of find that fascinating. Yeah, absolutely loved this match. I thought both players came out of it with so much to be really positive about, to be honest. And those are kind of my favourite matches.

54:52Matt Roberts: Yes, Emerita Carney, this is the first time she looks like a... Not the first match or tournament. the first sort of consistent period where I've really thought of her as like a properly hardened pro tour tennis player. And so much of that is about her body. Her body seemed able to stand up to it, and she obviously has confidence in her body in a way she hasn't done before. I feel like you can see she has core strength like never before. Those returns that Sabalenka hits, It's a little bit like the one you described from Yannick Sinner earlier, where you think you've hit a good serve, and suddenly you're just rocked back, shocked by this booming return that pushes you back.

55:40Matt Roberts: And so often, against power hitters like that, she's been caught out by those returns, and you see her getting pushed back and instantly off balance. I feel like she's able to stand up to those sorts of shots physically and not get instantly rocked back in a way that she wasn't before. I still think the movement out wide from side to side needs maybe a little bit of work, not necessarily the speed, but kind of the balance when she gets there and the shot she's able to produce once she gets there and maybe the recovery from being taken into the corners. But look, the signs of improvement are so clear from Emma Raducanu.

56:26Matt Roberts: And that's kind of before Francisco Roy, I presume, has really been able to have any kind of impact. And that is a man with ideas, David. He's got thoughts and we are hearing those thoughts. He is a chatty man. Now, I'm wary with this that, like, we are at the mercy of the television producers with this stuff, right, with the on-court coaching. It might be the microphone is better that they've got on the coaching box on Centre Court in Cincinnati than at other tournaments. It might be that we're just hearing a better version or hearing more of what the coaches have to say than we do elsewhere.

57:12But purely on the basis of what we saw and heard last night during this match, he has thoughts and he is making sure that Emma Raducanu hears them.

57:25Matt Roberts: What do we think of all that? Well, at least he was trying to. I mean, the thing is, I think we heard a lot more of what he'd got to say and think about than she did, because she's so far away from him. And she actually got ticked off by the umpire for going over to him, which is absurd. I mean, if you're going to have courtside coaching and she said, yes, but you're playing music. I can't hear him. So I've got to go physically closer if you want. You know, otherwise, give me give me the earphones and I'll hear what all the viewers are hearing because they're in everything. The rule is basically you're allowed to sort of passively take on as much on-court coaching, but you're not allowed to proactively seek it, go over and seek it out.

58:12Matt Roberts: Totally.

58:13Catherine Whitaker: I think unless your opponent is taking a bathroom break or something.

58:18Matt Roberts: Sabalenka went off court for an outfit change, didn't she? And Radhikarno instantly went over to Francisco Roy and sort of downloaded his brain. We're allowing coaching, but we don't want anybody to know about it. Just get over it. It's a stupid fudge at the moment. But, I mean, in terms of... Look, there was a good 45 minutes where we didn't hear from Francisco Roig at all. Now, they may have just turned off the mic. I think they turned off his mic. Because when you could hear him, he was relentless. And we heard not a peep out of the Sabalenka box. And I could see them talking at times and you couldn't hear them.

58:57So that's an element of it. But, yes, I mean, he was ongoing. And, I mean, look, some of what he's saying I found really fascinating. For instance, you talked about her ability to absorb the power of the shots coming towards her. He kept saying, feel the ball, don't kind of hit the ball. You know, as though he wanted to trust that she didn't have to panic and try and meet fire with fire all the time. She could just use it. he was strong on where he wanted her to stand personally I was thinking well if she can hear all this how long until she gets irritated by it because it was so non-stop and I'm sort of thinking gee if I've got a mind mind of my own I don't necessarily want to hear this all the time

59:44Matt Roberts: what we don't know is whether they've had a conversation about what she absolutely wants because I would be irritated by that and I would find it totally overwhelming I've absolutely no idea if she's saying I want to hear it, I want to hear it I want constant sort of reassurance and if she hasn't said that's specifically what I want I imagine she might have been slightly off put by it although she played great so maybe not maybe she's like, wow, this works, let's keep doing this.

1:00:23Catherine Whitaker: Within this specific match, it seemed well-received on Raducanu's end. She didn't seem annoyed by it. And, you know, I liked that his comments were, I think, generally positive in tone and constructive. It seemed, in this specific match, like it worked. But I always think it's a little bit of a red flag generally when there's that much relentless stuff coming from the box, like telling you where to serve and where to stand and all that kind of thing. I just am not sure that that lasts all that well. When things start going against you and you've got your coach constantly telling you stuff, that's when it's harder to receive.

1:01:11Catherine Whitaker: And just like what sort of player are you moulding there, like one that fully relies on you? I'm not sure that's good either. So I'm fascinated to see how it's going to develop.

1:01:21Matt Roberts: And coaches that want players to fully rely on them, that I find to be a red flag, generally. You should want to empower your player, surely, as far as possible. But yeah, this is small sample size. Very early stage. And she played great. She played great. And also, I quite liked that he was saying, you're the better player. he was sort of trying to really I mean I think great you know when they were going into that third set and look she was very close, she served out of her mind. She did yeah there was a lot going on in that match wasn't there, there was a point where there was clearly a lot of noise happening you know she said I can't hear my coach because of the music and then I think it was in the second set or the third set there had been a baby crying for a long time and Raducanu, after a while, said to the umpire, Miriam Blais, I think it was, she said, can we do anything about that?

1:02:23Matt Roberts: And Miriam Blais was like, well, it's a child. It's a child crying. She said, I can ask them to leave. What would you like me to do? I was very triggered by this. It really annoyed me. Miriam Blais is a great umpire and this might just be all me. It really annoyed me that she put that decision on Emma Raducanu. She was quite arsy with Emma about that, actually, I thought. It's lose-lose, isn't it? Either you're the absolute twat that asks for the baby and its parents to be kicked out, or you have to continue to put up with the screaming child. Yeah, I don't think that was the right way to handle that particular instance by the umpire.

1:03:05Matt Roberts: It reminded me of when a woman asked me to switch from my aisle seat to a middle seat so that she could sit across the aisle from her family on a plane.

1:03:20Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, that's unacceptable.

1:03:22Matt Roberts: It's unacceptable to ask that question. because now I'm in a situation of either being a total arsehole, which is the route I took, or sitting in a middle seat for a flight, which I go to great lengths to avoid. And if that's important to you, you too can go to those lengths to avoid that.

1:03:42Catherine Whitaker: Yeah. OK. I also think, like, the parents there have got to take the kid out. Like, it's a boiling hot day. The baby's screaming. Get out of there.

1:03:58Matt Roberts: Yeah, do better parenting.

1:04:00Catherine Whitaker: Go and watch in the shade on outside court or something. Like... Yeah.

1:04:05Matt Roberts: And don't make it Emma Adekarni's problem.

1:04:07Catherine Whitaker: No. Here, here.

1:04:11Matt Roberts: Thanks. I feel seen, Matt. Thank you. Madison Keyes is at it again. Saved match points to beat Ava Lees and then beat Aoi Ito last night, my new favourite player, in very different circumstances. kind of flattened her. Aoyito, by the way, was just absolutely bamboozled Pavlyuchenkova in the previous round. That was so much fun. But Madison Keyes and her saving match points. She's a great show at the moment, isn't she, Matt?

1:04:46Catherine Whitaker: Oh, she's been... I actually kind of think her and Sabalenka have played so many good matches this year. you know keys just continually all season coming back from the brink and she was asked about it on on tennis channel on her interview there at the desk and you know she was she was being heaped with praise like wow you keep doing this and she was kind of like yeah but what am i doing constantly putting myself in that position what am i doing i just really really loved her her sort of attitude. And look, she was in trouble against Ava Lees and she gave some great insight into how the court speed, which is, you know, most players seem to think it's playing really quickly in Cincinnati.

1:05:35Catherine Whitaker: She said, Lees is a great exponent of absorbing pace and of redirecting it. So Keyes said at the start of this match, she was hitting the ball to Lees with big power, but actually that was the worst thing she could be doing because Lees wanted that power and she was redirecting it. she was causing all sorts of problems but Keyes said if I can get width on my shots that's when the court speed helps me because suddenly I'm hitting these big shots and players having to chase them down they've got less time to do it because the conditions are fast and I thought it was really interesting analysis and she was in big trouble in this match, Keyes not only match point did she have to save but she was love three, love 30 down in the third set and then she just put together a string of points the like of which she just has kept doing this season when her back's against the wall.

1:06:24Catherine Whitaker: I find it so compelling. Now we've seen that tennis win a major. I'm just so drawn to Madison Keyes matches at the moment. And she came up with a completely ridiculous backhand winner down the line in the tie break that hit the sideline. And yeah, she just keeps coming up with it. And I think she wants her form to be a little bit better, you know but she's finding it at the right time to me yes

1:06:52Matt Roberts: is she in yours because of that because of the clutchness the big time stuff the kind of like I'm going for it might not make everything but I'm going for it and you've got to deal with it yeah yeah I do winning from match points down does something to a player it gives you just an extra layer of armor i think um yeah absolutely in the mix um and she got her back in the next david's which yeah also has winning from match point down kind of written all over it potentially that's i mean you know these these tournaments they to just go on forever, but there's some now, there are some good match-ups percolating, aren't there?

1:07:47And there's a perfect one pretty early on, really, but there's some good matches out there that are going to be set up now that the thing's finally getting going.

1:07:58Matt Roberts: Yeah, although not for Iga Shiontek, she played her first match on Saturday and she'll play her next one on Wednesday. She'll be Anna Potapova and then Marta Kostiuk had to withdraw from her scheduled next round match with that wrist injury that she was troubled by in Canada as well. So Shontek's having a weird tournament already. Matt, you multi-screened some Amanda Anisimova last night. I know you'll have been disappointed by the result, but was Anna Kaninskaya's dog any kind of consolation to you? because there were some good dog scenes, very good dog scenes.

1:08:42Catherine Whitaker: No, I turned it off by that point.

1:08:46Matt Roberts: I'll send you some clips.

1:08:48Catherine Whitaker: I am aware of Canon Sky's dog there. Bella, I believe. It's a good dog. I believe Bella is the name of the dog.

1:08:54Matt Roberts: It's a blonde, a toffee, Daxon, long-haired Daxon.

1:08:59Catherine Whitaker: And she's wearing a little hat, a little bonnet. Yeah, I did see the scenes on social media and was like, oh, maybe I shouldn't have turned off in such disgust.

1:09:12Matt Roberts: Was she bad?

1:09:14Catherine Whitaker: No, I think she wasn't great, but I wouldn't say she was really bad either. She lost her way at the end of both sets. She had 15.30 on Canon Sky's serve at 5.4 in the opener, didn't take that chance and then lost the set. and she had triple break point at 4-3 in the second set, didn't take those and lost her way. She let those moments get to her. Maybe some of the resilience that we've talked about a lot this year, being brilliant, was kind of missing in this one. And it's obviously been a slightly tricky stretch since the Wimbledon final. She played great against Raducanu in Canada, but that was kind of it.

1:09:57I do think she was hurt here by having a walkover in her first match.

1:10:04Catherine Whitaker: You know, she was meant to play Jean-Jean. That match didn't happen. So she's waiting around for a match. And suddenly she's got Kalinskaya, who's a really good player, who'd already got a tight win, was match tough. And she was match tougher than Anissimov in those big moments. But it has spared us a Sviontech rematch, because that match again was lurking in this draw there. They weren't far away.

1:10:31Matt Roberts: You're always on alert for that now, aren't you?

1:10:34Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, there's so much trauma.

1:10:35Matt Roberts: It'll happen eventually. Yeah, it will.

1:10:37Catherine Whitaker: And look, probably would be a good thing if it did happen. And Matt, it'll be better than last time. It has to be better than last time. I think for Anissa Mova, the thing is, she's at least going to be high-seeded at the US Open. If you think back to last year, she went into that tournament unseeded. She played Jung-Chin Wen in the first round. You know, there are some dangerous unseeded players, potentially, at this year's US Open, but I feel like she is going to be able to work her way, most likely, into the draw in a way that she just hasn't really been able to do since Wimbledon. So, not...

1:11:12Matt Roberts: Is she in the mix? Yeah. David? Matt is not a reliable answerer of this question. I'm going to say yes because I feel like her top level is such that she can win any of these things and I don't feel and look I think she needs some form obviously and some but even though there have been a couple of losses the last couple of weeks I think there's plenty banked for the year that if she can get into the draw get up and running I think she's absolutely a contender for the title I do think

1:11:51Catherine Whitaker: I think the US Open, and this is a factor for a lot of players, but the conditions can vary so much at the US Open, unlike Wimbledon, for example, where you might get a hot day, but it's not going to be, by their standards, awful. She was playing in the heat of the day yesterday in Cincinnati. And look, I think she's got a lot better at dealing with those sorts of conditions. But it's not her preferred conditions. I feel like along the way at the US Open, that's what really separates the very best players. They can kind of handle absolutely everything. You're not worried about the conditions of a match.

1:12:29Catherine Whitaker: But I think Anisimova could do with maybe a little bit of luck of the draw in that sense. not get a horribly sticky day session match that just takes it all out of her. Again, when we think about Wimbledon, she did say how much it took out of her beating Sabalenka on that hot day and how tired she was after that. I think that's kind of a factor in her US Open as well. And again, that's maybe an improvement she just still needs to make. But right now, I think it is a factor for her, the conditions of a match. I think of Doha. She played all her matches last on, basically, at night. And the conditions were the same every time.

1:13:09Catherine Whitaker: It was still. It was a bit cooler. I think these are sort of elements that can determine how well Anissa Mova plays.

1:13:19Matt Roberts: Barbora Krajcikova, biggest win of her comeback. Three-setter over Alina Svitolina. Great to see for Krajcikova. those scenes of her exiting Wimbledon will really haunt me. So glad to see her put that behind her. And the last result I wanted to mention, Emma Navarro, whose dad obviously owns this tournament and has invested$200 million in this incredible redevelopment for the complex. And when we talked about the event on Friday, I hadn't quite digested exactly how renovated this place is. like it's totally on steroids this year. And look, his ownership of that tournament is separate to the fact that his daughter is a top tennis player, but I'm sure he would have been hoping that she would have at least gone on a run and not lost her opening match to Ella Seidel, which is actually what ended up happening.

1:14:21Matt Roberts: It's quite stunning though, when you see those aerial shots that they're giving us a lot of, David, on the broadcast because they're obviously wanting to show off these renovations. And, well, good luck to them. I'd be wanting to show them off as well. You can see the 200 million, put it that way. Yeah, yeah, they've done an amazing renovation job and it's a cool facility. I do sometimes have some issues with the visibility of the ball on the centre court when it's really gleaming sun in certain angles because they've changed the colour coding, haven't they? You know, it's always been darker blue court with a green surround, the same as the US Open, to get that US Open series going, which I must admit, I preferred that.

1:15:07I liked that idea of having an identity for a swing of American hard courts.

1:15:14Matt Roberts: I liked the US Open series. Yes, so did I. Why did that die? I don't know. I think it's a shame but I really like they've obviously done a great job the players love going there the problem is it's so hot at the moment it looks like a miserable place to be spending time and it's out of their control it's where it is I've covered that event once in 2016 maybe and I think I struggle with the heat there more than more than the US Open. I found it absolutely brutal. They do have an ice cream sponsor, though. That helps.

1:16:00Catherine Whitaker: It does affect the vibe of the matches. You know, when people can't...

1:16:04Matt Roberts: And the vibe of the crowd. Well, that's what I mean.

1:16:07Catherine Whitaker: When people can't sit in those non-shaded seats, it just looks empty and... Yeah, it's a shame. People look sleepy. and this is all a bit much, isn't it? Yeah, I do think the brightness of that centre core has been a problem for a while. I don't think that's to do with the colour change. I think it's something to do with the position of the camera there on the centre core, because they've moved about a lot in Cincinnati. It used to be really low in Cincinnati. Now it's one of the higher ones. And yes, something's wrong, because as you said, during the day session it's really hard to see the ball really it's too bright you go to other courts it's fine it's not a court colour issue because they're perfect on other courts yeah

1:16:54Matt Roberts: it's a bit of a tough scene to have spent 200 million dollars making somewhere really sexy but to can't see the ball for the ball for the ball not to be visible

1:17:06Catherine Whitaker: Sabalenka called out a lack of space in the play of dining as well did you see that

1:17:10Matt Roberts: did she did she that is a that's very alejandro davidovich vikina calling out having to play at

1:17:21Catherine Whitaker: 11 a.m is it 11 a.m or 10 a.m oh it was 11 it was a perfectly normal time

1:17:28Matt Roberts: 11 a.m what a sport right join us in part three for a big announcement Is it a new Taylor Swift album? Who can say?

1:18:05Matt Roberts: on the work that matters most. Learn how ServiceNow puts AI to work for people at servicenow.com.

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1:18:49Matt Roberts: Welcome back to part three of the Tennis Podcast, where it is time for our big announcement. No, it is not a beloved pop star releasing new material. That's already been announced on a rival sports podcast. what we have to announce for you is potentially more exciting who can say there are no metrics for these things we the collective we myself david matt billy jean tbc are coming to wrexham melbourne london new york wrexham it's the new big four folks wednesday the 22nd of october we will be coming to the Grove Park Theatre for a live audience show. It's taking place during the Wrexham Open, which is the biggest tennis event in Wales since 1996 and the biggest women's tennis event in the UK outside of the grass court season.

1:19:48Matt Roberts: Tickets will be going on sale this week. The Friends pre-sale for an exclusive 48-hour ticket window for Friends of the Tennis Podcast will start tomorrow, Wednesday at 10am and then the tickets will go on general sale on Friday at 10am. Space in the theatre is limited so you know it's first come first serve, would encourage you to be hot off the button if you want to come and we are very excited i have a lot of roots in north wales um my my parents met and grew up there all of my grandparents lived there my my gran and all of my extended family is still there so yeah this is another very catherine wittaker coded location just like shrewsbury i'm very excited yes i'm very pumped actually as well and the theater is beautiful lovely it's it's not huge but it's just it's perfect for for us you know and i think um i think it's going to be a really nice environment to to do this can't wait matt your wrexham debut yeah wrexham's like a you

1:21:05Catherine Whitaker: know it's really on the map at the moment isn't it wrexham so excited ryan excited to go there Roberts.

1:21:13Matt Roberts: They're all going to Wrexham, folks. Yeah.

1:21:16Catherine Whitaker: We will have a documentary crew following us around and you will be able to watch us on Netflix in a couple of years' time about our Wrexham takeover.

1:21:30Matt Roberts: Yeah, it's a sporting hub. We're very excited. So, look, we will put the link in our show notes to tickets. If you'd like to get access to the pre-sale, then become a friend of the Tenors Podcast. We'll, of course, have the link to that in our show notes. And if you subscribe to the newsletter, then you'll get an alert about tickets going on sale as well. And I'll put it on socials and everywhere else too. So Wrexham, Wednesday, the 22nd of October. Tickets on sale for Friends on Wednesday and on general sale on Friday, both at 10am. We hope to see you there, folks. We have mascots plural for this episode.

1:22:11Matt Roberts: We have Rafa and Lulu who are owned by Grace Weinstein. And we also have Lana owned by Grace's friend Olivia. This is an animals being friends situation and I'm into it. All three of them are rescues. Rafa is a two-year-old red healer pit bull terrier mix. and Grace has specified that a red heeler is like bingo in bluey and I can't tell you how much I wish I understood that reference but I do not. But Grace, I will be Googling it. Matt, David, bluey? No. I think it might be a kid's show. No. Lana is an eight-year-old pitbull mix and I'm looking at a picture of them here where it looks like they're holding hands.

1:22:56Matt Roberts: Very, very into that. And Lulu, who is owned by Lana, is a three-legged, oh my God, it's a three-legged dog, a three-legged chihuahua pitbull mix. I'm going to overlook all of my questions about how a chihuahua and a pitbull mix and just focus on how completely adorable Lulu is. Oh my goodness me. This is a story of pet friendship and tennis podcast friendship, says Grace. I'm going to like this story, I think. Rafa and Lulu live together with their owners Grace and Kai in Rochester and Lana lives with their dear friends Olivia, Lisa and Dave. Rafa and Lana became close in part because of Grace and Olivia's shared love of the tennis podcast and discussing all things tennis.

1:23:45Matt Roberts: Lulu is relieved when the two of them play so she can be left alone to be the queen that she is and also according to Grace, how perfect is this, Lulu is a huge Swifty and permanently in her reputation era. Yes, Lulu. And if you're watching this on YouTube, you are looking at pictures of these dogs right now. Lucky you. And if you're not, then those pictures will be on our socials and in our newsletter. What incredible dogs. That is lovely dog content. Lovely backstory. Thank you, Grace. Thank you, Lana. no thank you Grace and Olivia are the humans Lana, Rafa and Lulu are the other dogs is that, have I got that straight?

1:24:33Matt Roberts: yes well done me hello to Phoebe, to Maisie and to Roger, our mascots of course, hello to Greg, Chris and Jeff our top folks and executive producers, hello and thank you to The Athletic, we are a part of The Athletic Podcast Network and Matt, we have some shout-outs today.

1:24:54Catherine Whitaker: We have Dana Douglas from Allendale, New Jersey. Every time. Hi, Dana.

1:25:03Matt Roberts: That's a great name, Dana Douglas. That's a good stage name.

1:25:10Catherine Whitaker: Dana goes to the US Open every year and last year she apparently weirdly loitered to try and say hello to us.

1:25:19Matt Roberts: Excellent. Well, that's very in the spirit of the tennis podcast, Dana. We're always weirdly loitering. Some of us more than others. Yeah. I think like Dana Leconti, who was the umpire in the 1991 Connors run to the semifinal. And yeah, I always remember that name and that visual of Connors just roaring at him. Yeah, but that was a bloke. but yes and I've been watching a lot of Connors on YouTube because YouTube just keeps suggesting Connors material to me so that'd be rude not to, wouldn't it? What a shout that is, David Dana, I hope you weirdly loiter with success at the US Open and we get to say hi to you

1:26:09Catherine Whitaker: We've also got Supna Shah

1:26:12Matt Roberts: Hello Supna

1:26:13Catherine Whitaker: Hi Supna Sutner is from Tribeca, New York and has been to all the slams except the Australian Open Oh, you've got to go Sutner

1:26:23Matt Roberts: You know what to do Sutner

1:26:24Catherine Whitaker: Well, Sutner is going to Australia for the Christmas holidays but because of kids' college schedules he's having to return home before the Australian Open they are going to take a tour of Melbourne Park and the Rod Laver Arena and she wants to know whether that counts as the spectator slam. I'm really sorry. I'm really sorry.

1:26:47Matt Roberts: I don't want to ruin Sopner's shout-out, but that doesn't count. Can't a kid's college on their own. Just change things. They're adults, aren't they? All the way to Australia, like two weeks before the Australian Open. Sopner. The tutors are understanding. Come on. Just change it all. Sopner, come on. Let's get a grip here.

1:27:16Matt Roberts: If you need me to talk to your kids and make them understand, I'm available for that. Or the tutors. Yeah, whoever needs to be spoken to to make them really understand the situation, I'll make myself available. Thank you, Supna.

1:27:31Catherine Whitaker: And finally, we have Mindy Pozov.

1:27:36Matt Roberts: Hello, Mindy.

1:27:37Catherine Whitaker: Hi, Mindy. Mindy is also from New York, but now living in Philadelphia and says is a native New Yorker, grew up nine miles from Forest Hills. And watching the US Open was a yearly ritual.

1:27:52Matt Roberts: It's a very New York coded set of shout outs. The only Mindy I'm aware of is from the old Robin Williams show, Mork and Mindy. But that is not tennis related. Or Mindy Kaling, who I know you're going to say you don't know, but you do know. I do know. Because you watch The American Office. From The Office. Yeah. Check me out. But I bet Pam knows tennis Mindies. It's a name that kind of is one of those names that doesn't really exist here, but does in America. I bet there are American Mindies. I'm disappointed in this right now.

1:28:26Catherine Whitaker: well our Mindy says that their first in person experience at Flushing Meadows was Sampras Lendl in five sets 1990 I was watching that the other day Mindy says Catherine Matt everything David says is 100 % true yeah

1:28:53Matt Roberts: what a great note to end today's podcast on Mindy, Supner and Dana. Thank you ever so much. Folks, we'll be back on Friday with our next podcast and then next Tuesday with the one after that. Tuesday, Friday, Tuesday. No, Friday, Tuesday, Friday, Tuesday. That's how we roll now, folks. So enjoy the next few days of Cincinnati. We'll be back on Friday to talk about it. Thank you all for listening, for watching however you have consumed today's tennis podcast. We will speak to you very soon.

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