Live from Wimbledon - Draw puts Serena, Swiatek on collision course

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1:30Matt Roberts: Hello and welcome to the Tennis Podcast live from Wimbledon presented by Barclays who are the official banking partner of Wimbledon and we're very pleased to have them along for the wild wild Wimbledon ride this year. I'm Catherine Wichko alongside me Matt Roberts and David Law as always behind the camera is Matthew who likes to remain anonymous but we don't like to keep him anonymous and behind us are the grounds of SW19 looking absolutely perfect just a couple of days away from the championships 2026 we see I mean look we love it when the tennis starts but we secretly love this time the most don't we when it's all pristine and perfect and we have the

2:15Catherine Whitaker: place to ourselves yeah never feel luckier really than in these build-up days to Wimbledon and you You know, I think the other slams do such an amazing job, obviously, putting on those big opening weeks. But there is still something special about the way the anticipation builds here to the start of the tournament, where it all goes quiet after qualifying at Roehampton, and then it all just arrives on Monday morning. And, yeah, we're very lucky getting to witness this build-up as the grounds come to life.

2:47Matt Roberts: Yeah, it's good to be back, David. Yeah, I've just gone with Matthew for a little walk around the grounds. We actually forgot a cable, so we went home and got it. But on the way out of the grounds and getting back in good time for the show, we walked past Henman Hill over there and we had to go around it because there are signs that say, keep off the grass. And it is perfection. I mean, it looks like you want to just lie on it and just engulf yourself in the most gorgeous mattress in the world. But no, I mean, what is it, nine o 'clock at night here right now? There is nobody else here. There's nobody around.

3:26It's just we've got the place to ourselves. It's incredible.

3:28Matt Roberts: Yeah, it's incredibly special. And the most special day of the tennis calendar, certainly for Matt Roberts, draw day at Wimbledon for the uninitiated, Matt. Please briefly explain why Wimbledon draw day of all the magical days in the very, very long tennis calendar. why is today the very best one?

3:51Catherine Whitaker: I love draws generally. I love knowing or having an idea of how the tournament's going to unfold in front of us. I think it just, you know, something in my brain chemistry that likes that order and sort of knowing what's ahead of us. And Wimbledon does draw ceremonies better than anyone. They cut to the chase, no faff, 10am start.

4:12Matt Roberts: I can't tell you how faff-free this thing is.

4:15Catherine Whitaker: It is on time and it is straight into the names of the women's draw. No faff, no speeches. It just gets on with it. It also is done on the Friday of this week once the qualifying has finished. So we know the 128 names in each draw. So we don't just have qualifier popping up a lot. And the drama of it, the theatre of it, one by one, pulling out the names from the velvet bag. It's perfection.

4:43Matt Roberts: I mean it literally is held in a theatre isn't it the the main press conference room they call the media theatre here and it is well there's a reason for that it feels like a theatre and it is also beautifully air-conditioned which I do appreciate I arrived in the room and thought I'd make a little bit of chat with the assistant referee who takes out the names from the velvet bag which Matt got to hold last year and I said you've got the best job in the world the coolest job in the world uh yeah and he looked at me as what i'm busy it was like you were breaking the fourth wall it was like you're not supposed to reach across i know i just you get to hold the velvet bag and do the ball it's great and he's like yes let's just hope nothing goes wrong and nothing went wrong nothing went wrong no it was i mean it was wonderful for drama we'll get on to that but there was nothing funny this time sometimes things go wrong and it's I was trying to create funny at that moment, but no, it didn't really land.

5:40Matt Roberts: Let's talk about the drama, shall we? Because there was always going to be drama, no matter where Serena Williams came out in this draw, making her singles comeback here at Wimbledon, where she's a seven-time champion at the age of 44. Totally unexpected as of a few weeks, months, years ago, all the way back to 2022 when she retired from the sport. it was always going to be dramatic whenever her name came out of the draw but the fact that she came out quite late in this draw and as Matt's describing they draw the names one by one with every name that came out the tension ramped up and it took almost to the end she's come out in the bottom half of the draw which is the same half as the defending champion Iga Svjantek and that means that she will play Tuesday because the defending champion always opens centre court well the men's champion opens centre court Monday the women's champion opens centre court Tuesday so Serena to play on Tuesday against Australian

6:41Catherine Whitaker: Maya Joint and there was such drama because I had not looked at the what they call the chip list of what number everyone is I kind of assumed Serena was 128 because she was the last wild card in but I wasn't entirely sure so every time a high number got called out first as they do number 123 I thought oh my god it's Serena and it was Saras Rivas Tormo and I just calmed down again but this kept happening I kept thinking it's going to be Serena it's going to be Serena and it just wasn't Serena until it was and yeah Maya Joints look it's not one of the you know it's not a Hollywood

7:23Matt Roberts: match-up it's not Bianca Andreescu or Naomi Osaka or Marina Sabalenka or Igor Shvantec, you know, there were a lot of names that could have been like, oh my God, and you know, for a lot of people listening, they weren't really know much about Maya Joint, other than she was briefly put on the backhand list and swiftly removed from it.

7:42Catherine Whitaker: It was this time a year ago, watching her win the Eastbourne final in a dramatic final set tiebreak against Ayala, which tells you about the level of tennis she can play and the quality she has on this surface in particular. I got so swept up by it I thought my joint backhand list I made an impulsive decision put her on the list she was on it for a few months and start of this year I did I did bump her off so and look it's very it's been a tough year for my very difficult to isolate cause and effect but she's

8:13Matt Roberts: barely won a match since then which makes this really I mean look it was going to be intriguing whoever it was right but but my adjoint i think i think psychologically this is particularly fascinating because my joint look she's a heck she's having an awful season there's no hiding from that she's lost 13 of her last 14 matches she's a very young player and some of those are below tour level yeah absolutely she's she's dropped down to she she ended up seeded here she got herself seated at a slam i think off the back of results from about a year ago it's been a horrible time um but she's a good player with a lot of potential particularly on the backhand although matt's long forgotten that to be clear anyone who's ever been on my list has a great

9:03Catherine Whitaker: backhand and we love them for it they're just levels there are levels exactly she is famously

9:10Matt Roberts: an introvert, an absolute textbook introvert. She doesn't seek out or enjoy the limelight at all. I remember she came into the Australian Open this year as the top-ranked Australian female player, and she was assigned to the main press conference room, and she walked in and went, oh, whoa. Like, she didn't... That didn't suit her at all. And I'm sure some of it is just... She will get more used to it, but I don't think that's ever going to be her jam. and she's going to come out into the full headlights of a situation, David, on Tuesday. Yeah, because it's hard to imagine that they wouldn't put that on centre court because it's Serena Williams.

9:51I think Serena against anybody in the draw is a centre court match. I think you just have to do that at the moment. I think from Serena's perspective, this is just about the best draw imaginable. if you want her comeback to feature a win. That doesn't mean to say she's guaranteed to win it, as you say. Maya Joind is a good player. She's a talented ball striker. But in that sort of run of form and with that level of kind of self-belief, you would imagine, and against somebody who she would have grown up regarding as the greatest because it would have been right in her childhood.

10:30Matt Roberts: Just thinking about that, is it possible that she's so young she might have missed the greatest well yeah I think she'll obviously be conceptually aware of it but she I'm not sure

10:39Catherine Whitaker: I think Serena had won seven majors before she was born

10:43Matt Roberts: right oh my so like but that might help a bit mightn't it that I think she is a bit too young to have had Serena posters on her wall yeah I mean it's an interesting one I just don't I can only imagine she when she saw it she would have gone wow you know and look hopefully from her perspective I don't want to see her feel terrible. I hope she comes out and plays kind of the match of her life for her own sake. But if you, like, my hope is that Serena Williams wins a match at this year's Wimbledon. Whatever else happens, happens. But I'd love to see her play well and win a match. I don't want to see my joints humiliated at all.

11:22But this is a great draw if you want Serena to be winning a match. And then we'll see. but it gives her chance to play this match because there are some players that she could have come out against that if she'd have played an Ostapenko or a Yastrzemska or somebody just is thrashing the ball, you wouldn't have had any chance to do that. She's going to get a chance to play.

11:48Matt Roberts: She came to press today, my adjoint. A lot of the lower-ranked players did their pre-tournament media today, some of them tomorrow and all of the the big guns are coming through tomorrow and we'll have a show after we've spent the day speaking to them all tomorrow evening 8 p.m did we say tomorrow night yeah 8 p.m tomorrow but my joint came today and obviously that was a more heavily attended press conference than it would have been before the draw and she did give one little nugget I wasn't And in this press conference, Charlie Eccleshire from The Athletic was. And he said that my joint had already had a chat with Isla Tomlianovic, who was Serena Williams' last singles opponent at the US Open in the third round in 2022.

12:33Matt Roberts: And she was the one that handled that moment with, you know, obviously in tennis terms, she handled it brilliantly. She beat Serena, but also she handled the occasion with such elegance and grace. and it was pitch perfect wasn't it from Tomlianovich so she had already spoken to her Tomlianovich I think had proactively been in touch a fellow Australian and she had said you know all the kind of obvious things about you know you can do this focus on yourself but she said remember she's going to be nervous too and I think that's really powerful advice I remember I remember getting that advice from my brother once about something that I was really nervous about and I remember being in a group and I was like everyone else seems to be like totally chill about this and he was like you know they're all absolutely bricking it too.

13:26Catherine Whitaker: Fresh as weak.

13:28Matt Roberts: Exactly, it was something just like that, it was a year abroad and I still remember it now and how soothing that felt and it is true isn't it Serena Williams will be nervous Oh, it doesn't matter how many times you do anything in life. You could be the most experienced person in the world. If you don't feel first day nerves, I don't think you are human, really. And especially if it matters to you. That's the other thing. It matters to Serena Williams. She's not doing this for nothing. She's doing this because she really wants to do it and needs to do it inside. I don't think you put yourself at risk otherwise you don't put yourself out there like this unless you care and are nervous about it it might be foolish to look beyond round one for Serena Williams we are going to do that right now of course because if she gets past my adjoint there's a potential round two with Alexandra Ayala and there's a potential round three with Iga Svantec.

14:39Matt Roberts: And P.S. that also means there's a potential round three between Alexandra Ayala and Iga Svantec, which, OK, it's not Hollywood in the way that Serena is, but it is fascinating in its own way. That is an interesting path, obviously, for Serena.

14:55Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, and that's the thing, isn't it? Like Serena, wherever she landed, it was going to be the focus, the attention, it was going to be dramatic, but actually she's also landed in a really dramatic section. So it's just added to the drama that would have been there anyway. Look, thinking about those match-ups, I always worry about the Ayala serve a little bit. And I do think Serena can be pretty intimidating on the return there. It was interesting how in her doubles matches she felt like it was the return that actually she was kind of struggling with quite a lot. She would have to have that dialed in if she's going to beat Ayala if they play.

15:31Catherine Whitaker: because, oh, there's such a good mover, and, you know, I think there'll be some advantages that she can have against a 44-year-old Serena. Yeah, it is absolutely tantalising.

15:45Matt Roberts: Eyal around two, Shontek round three. Are we going to see Serena Shontek round three? That I would be surprised about, personally. Like I said, to me, this is the perfect draw because she gets to play a player that really, if Serena plays decently on the scale of what we know. And that's the question mark, isn't it? We don't even know if she's on that scale anymore because we haven't seen her play a singles match. But if she's anything close to what she was before she left, then I think a decent performance should win this first-round match. But I like the fact that she's then got box office matches, both of which an Ayala followed by a Svante would be.

16:27but I would have thought Ayala, the age she is and the sort of level she is, would be probably too much.

16:35Matt Roberts: If it is Serena Ayala in round two, that could be the most viewed tennis match of all time. It could be extraordinary, couldn't it? Yeah. I mean, Ayala matches, a bog standard Ayala match is, you know, right up there with some of the most watched tennis matches ever. And obviously you're not comparing like for like, because not everybody had the same access to watch tennis, you know, back in Take Your Pick. But I can't imagine globally a tennis match with more interest on it, given the level of interest in Alexandre Ayala in the Philippines and the surrounding areas. I mean, that could set the world into a frenzy.

17:18Matt Roberts: Let's do that. But potentially globally a bigger deal than Serena, Shontek.

17:26Catherine Whitaker: yeah I mean we've seen the you know we've seen the effect of Ayala even on on things like YouTube highlights and you know press conference clips you know they get her her stuff gets watched by more people and yeah even if they're not necessarily watching it live I think this that match if it happens I think will be will be seen by so many and I do think Ayala is in

17:48Matt Roberts: the category of players that I would back to handle the moment and the occasion and I agree not be overly intimidated I think she'd love it I think she'd relish the chance now whether it went well is another matter but I think when she walked out onto the court she'd be buzzing I don't think she'd be overcome with nerves until the match started I don't know what would happen during the match but like I said I would back her at this stage having not even seen Serena play singles I may feel differently after she plays my joint Do you share David to you Matt Serena backing her to win round one yeah likely to stop there

18:31Catherine Whitaker: honestly I feel it's really hard to make Serena predictions before we see her play singles and I know I've predicted there's a win round one maybe that says something about my joint but like

18:43Matt Roberts: if that's a my joint it's a my joint prediction not a Serena prediction you know what I mean like

18:48Catherine Whitaker: it's possible Serena looks better than I'm expecting her to.

18:52Matt Roberts: Would you be predicting my joint to lose against anyone?

18:57Catherine Whitaker: Possibly.

18:58Matt Roberts: Her form is so bad.

19:03Catherine Whitaker: So I would like to reserve the right to make an ARL-Sereena prediction until we've seen Serena play singles.

19:10Matt Roberts: I will be asking you both for Serena predictions on every show for as long as she's in the tournament. What do you think?

19:20Matt Roberts: yeah I mean as you say like it's a joint prediction but you can't argue with that form can you it is about as bad as a player that gets into the draw it's been spadia yeah it really is so I think you have to predict her to lose maybe beat Greg um beyond that I don't think I would pick her to beat Ayala at this stage. No, Ayala is a good player. I know that serve is vulnerable, but she's had some good wins on grass this season. Yeah, I think she can move her around. She's got, you know, good lefty angles, hasn't she, Ayala? Yeah. Yeah, if I had to do a prediction now, I'd say Serena to win a match, and that would be fun.

20:07Matt Roberts: Not for my joint. Let's talk, continue to talk about this section of the draw because it is fascinating. But let's sort of zoom out from Serena and look at it maybe from a Shriantek perspective. The defending champion, of course, this is the third quarter of the draw. So the bottom half, her projected quarterfinal opponents would be either Svitolina, Navarro or Kostiuk and her semifinal opponents would be Rabakina, Anisimova, Keyes or Nozkova. She's got Taylor Townsend though. In round one, Iga Shantek. And if you're nervous, defending, coming out 1.30pm on Tuesday, defending Wimbledon champion for the first time, I imagine she is going to be quite nervous.

20:55Matt Roberts: I don't think that's a lot of fun, Taylor Townsend. See, the thing is, Iga Shantek could win this tournament, right? We know she can. She did it a year ago. And she did that without much form. So she can do it again, in theory. but I do think this is about as bad a draw as you can get. When I look at Taylor Townsend being a totally different type of player, followed by the winner of Karolina Pliskova and Teresa Valantova, two really tough opponents, particularly the way Pliskova strikes a ball on grass. You know, she's been to the final. You know, these are good players on this surface. So, yeah, it's immediately testing, on paper at least.

21:36Matt Roberts: I mean Taylor Townsend is not short of self-belief is she she's one that will sort of think great see this as an opportunity rather than a bad draw I would have thought yeah I think so she's not got a great Wimbledon record I don't think she's ever been out of the

21:53Catherine Whitaker: second round here whereas you know you would think her game could make some sense on this surface coming in taking the ball early on the backhand swinging serves out wide and there's a lot there that makes sense to me and could be really disruptive as well. Yeah, it feels like Svantec is immediately thrust into this draw in a very dramatic way with that one, with then potentially Pliskovo can take the racket out of your hand, Serena lurking, Eyal has beaten her before. This is tricky for Svantec right from the start, I think. But in a way, that might be helpful. You know, like I do think last year, having the lower expectations was great for her at Wimbledon this year.

22:42Catherine Whitaker: It's hard when you're the defending champion and all the attention's on you walking out on centre court on the Tuesday. That's a tricky experience, I think. But fascinating section.

22:55Matt Roberts: Ostapenko's in the other half.

22:57Catherine Whitaker: that's maybe all that Igor Shontek needs to know

23:01Matt Roberts: in terms of the fourth quarter the bottom half so potential semi-final opponents for Igor Shontek as I said, Rabakina, Anisimova, Keys and Nozkova, the big names down there Matt, you do not like Amanda Anisimova's draw you were making dodgy noises yes, I mean the moment that Madison Keys came out was Matt's first negative noise of the draw. Sitting next to Matt and trying to gauge what the noises mean is fun. Tell us why, Matt.

23:35Catherine Whitaker: Well, Keyes is in form, isn't she? She's into a final as we speak. She can be really bad, Madison Keyes. We saw that in her final set of the French Open when she played Schneider. It was just a total unforced error fest. She might have one of those days, but if she doesn't, she's just such a dangerous player. And that's in the third round. Keyes' ranking has dropped, but that's early. That's the third round. And then in the fourth round, Noskova's there. And Anissimova beat Noskova and root to the title here last year. That was a tense match. She almost lost that Anissimova. I think Noskova's better this year.

24:17Catherine Whitaker: It's tough to know what sort of form Anissimova's in. I don't think as good as last year, quite frankly, when she came in having won a load of matches on the grass with that good run at Queen's. And then Rabatkin as well in the quarters. I don't know whether I fully trust Rabatkin to get there. The one we've seen recently, you know, like McNally is a second round opponent for Rabatkin.

24:43Matt Roberts: She doesn't feel trustworthy at all at the moment with Rabatkin, does she?

24:46Catherine Whitaker: Siegman's in there. These are players that might be able to disrupt Rabatkin a little bit. But if she is in the quarters, she's got through that. She's probably playing a bit better. And having to go through keys, Noskova, Rabatkinow, if the draw holds, just feels really tough with the four Manisimova's been in, to be honest.

25:07Matt Roberts: Top half of the draw, obviously Sabalenka there, the top seed. Let's talk about her quarter, which I think is the most fun quarter. So there's a section in here which is absolutely bananas in the best possible way. Look, it starts off on paper pretty easy for Sabalenka, Teodora Kostovic in round one. Potential round two with Oleksandr Olenikova, the Ukrainian player who has been very outspoken about Russian and Belarusian players being on tour and in particular calling out Irina Sabalenka and doing it frequently and without fear. that could be a very uncomfortable match if it happens. Yeah, yeah, it could.

25:50I mean, but that's the way of every tennis tournament really now that Sabalenka, Olenikova, various Russian players, you're going to get these situations from time to time, if not more often. And yeah, I mean, second round, I do think McCartney-Kessler may be the favourite against Solonjikova in that match on this surface. But, yeah, definitely a chance that they could meet second round. And then that would be, as you say, probably an incident-filled build-up at the very least, certainly in the press conferences. And as you say, the rest of the section that Sabalenka's got there is pretty interesting.

26:37Matt Roberts: Yeah, there's the potential to face either Ostopenko or Raducanu in round three. Look, Raducanu is such an injury doubt at the moment. She didn't practice again today. The mood music there sounds really bad to me. It's a shame, isn't it? Such a blur. Yeah, it does seem like just a vicious cycle that Emma Raducanu is in at the moment where she needs to get tour fit, but she can't get enough momentum going because she's not tour fit. The word was she'd been in a boot and we haven't had that disproved. No, no, absolutely. So, I mean, she's got Antonia Ruzic, round one, talented young Croatian player.

27:22Matt Roberts: Ostapenko has Harriet Dart, which is sort of an indie, one for the indie kids that much, isn't it? It might not end up being at all consequential, but there will be aggro. Histrionics. Yeah. Do you remember Ostapenko Tomnijanovic? Do I remember it? That was on this court behind us here, wasn't it? Wasn't that on 18?

27:43Catherine Whitaker: I think it was on, I want to say 14. Ah, okay. Which is behind us. Which is behind us, yeah.

27:49Matt Roberts: And it was, well, beautifully eggy. And I think this will be the same. Well, that one ended with a major incident at the end of it. Had a big conversation at the net. And then didn't they play each other again? And then it was all very... It was such a shame. I hate it when that happens. They were all very nice to one another. Yeah. Be eggy. Lean into it. And Drava, the French Open champion, is the scheduled quarterfinal opponent for Irina Sabalenka if she gets there. And then it would be likely, according to seedings, Coco Goff or Jessica Bagula in the semifinals. How about this section in the top quarter?

28:30Matt Roberts: You've got Naomi Osaka. She's got Elsa Giacomo in round one. Karolina Mukova is in there. Bianca Andreescu, who qualified yesterday. she's had a kind draw Zhang Shuai in round one good player but you know there are tougher draws on paper out there Alicia Parks is in this section French Open finalist Maja Kvalinska Barbora Krejcikova the former champion here she's got the young Brit Hannah Klugman in round one Nicola Bartonkova is in this section she has Peyton Stearns in round one Matthew I can hear the rustling of whatever you're eating and Zheng Chin Wen is also in this section. She takes on Katerina Siniarkova in round one.

29:19Matt Roberts: Now he's just talking to us. We are live, Matthew.

29:24Catherine Whitaker: Oh, we're so back.

29:27Matt Roberts: That section, Matt, I almost don't have bandwidth. I mean, I do. It's glorious. but there's so much to take in there.

29:37Catherine Whitaker: There's so much. Like, there's, what, four Czechs? And they always turn up at Wimbledon, right? Mukova, Siniarkova, Bartonkova, Kwechikova, all in there, as you say. And look, I think, well, firstly, like, Osaka is a potential fourth-round opponent for Sabalenka, isn't she? Look, we've seen that match recently a lot. They keep landing in each other's sections. But, you know, by all accounts, Sasaka's been playing really well this week. And then the Andreeva section, I think this is a nightmare. If the draw holds for Andreeva, certified tricky Magda Lynette in the first round, then probably Krejcikova, and then potentially Barton Kovar, and then Mukova.

30:23Catherine Whitaker: Like, it's just an absolute nightmare. Mukova has lost round one at Wimbledon four times in a row. She lost her last five matches at this tournament.

30:32Matt Roberts: I don't understand that record. No.

30:34Catherine Whitaker: You know, it's her worst slam. Her best result here is the quarters, but she hasn't got there since 2021. It's just been round one defeat since then. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me because looking at it on paper, she'd probably be my pick to come through that section. I think it's going to be tricky for Andreeva, this turnaround, and I don't think grass is her best surface anyway.

30:59Matt Roberts: I think the forehand is tricky on grass, isn't it? It gets a bit exposed. A little bit like Coco Goff. Goff and Pagula in the second quarter. I mean, calling it the Goff section is... I'm not sure anybody would feel particularly confident about Coco Goff reaching the scheduled quarterfinal with Jessica Pagula. She has got a decent draw up until round of 16, maybe potentially Belinda Bencic lurking there and Pagula is as well decent early on. Potential round three with Jastrzemska and potential round four with Ivo Jovic for Pagula. But I...

31:40Catherine Whitaker: I love this draw for Pagula.

31:42Matt Roberts: Yeah, I think... I'm just feeling good about Pagula, you know.

31:46Catherine Whitaker: I have the same feeling about Pagula this year's Wimbledon as I had about Nisimovic last year's. Like, you look at the draw and you just think, I think she's going to get to the semis at least. and I actually think she might beat Samalenka in the semis. There's an early prediction. She lost in the first round last year. I know, that's why it's a bold pick. I thought you'd like it, David. I do.

32:09Matt Roberts: Hang on, wasn't it on this show last year that Matt saw the NSM overdraw and picked her for the semis?

32:15Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, that's it. You just look at it and you just think it makes a lot of sense. I'm very interested to hear from her tomorrow at Media Day about how this week of prep has been. Totally different to last year, isn't it? She's changed her approach. She's trying to get used to Wimbledon grass as opposed to the German grass. She won Bad Homburg last year, was it? Yes. And then she came straight here.

32:39Matt Roberts: She beat you on taking the final in Bad Homburg. And then she did the press conference and I've never seen a more upbeat. I was about to pick her for the title. And then she played Elizabeth Cotciareto. Where's she? she's nowhere near she's a potential

32:57Catherine Whitaker: quarterfinal opponent she'd have to go some

33:00Matt Roberts: I don't think she's losing sleep about that just yet I feel good about Pagula I just don't think she makes the same mistake twice Pagula, she's so smart

33:11Catherine Whitaker: yeah, it's the it's the match where she just doesn't really get going and show up, she's got that in her The flat match. In her locker, the flat match, exactly. We've seen a few of them. But, yeah, Pergoula.

33:27Matt Roberts: Just a quick mention of Putin's saver, Yulia Putin's saver against Tatiana Maria in this section. Fantastic. That created a noise out of Matt. Although Tatiana Maria is another one that doesn't have a great Wimbledon record. That one good run. Yeah, OK, but then nothing else, really. Matt full-on sniggered when that came out. It's funny isn't it? It is funny. Yeah it's funny. We do like funny. Anything else funny to pick out for the women's draw or you know not funny but interesting. Anything else of any kind of note?

34:03Catherine Whitaker: I think we've covered it well. I do think you know just to focus again on Goff a little bit. I do think Bencic in the fourth round is probably the favourite over Goff on this surface there. I'm really interested to see how Naomi Osaka does because of her reaching a final this weekend on grass.

34:23Matt Roberts: Huge, that, really. You know, this is not something she does. And the same thing kind of happened at Ronan Garo. She broke new grounds. And Elsa Giacomo is an interesting first round. And after that, I think, as well.

34:37Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, you did. But if she could get up and running Osaka, I want to see the game. I want to see whether she can crack it. And the one other name I'd pick out is someone who we were talking about a lot going into the French Open. Just a few...

34:53Matt Roberts: The last name out of the velvet bag? No?

34:57Catherine Whitaker: No.

34:57Matt Roberts: Oh, I was going to mention Boisson Rabacchina, round one. Oh, for funnies. For just... I don't know why that's funny, but it is. It did create amusement around me. It did, yeah. Sorry, who were you going to mention?

35:09Catherine Whitaker: I was going to say Svitolina. because you know like it's interesting how things can just change in your in your mind so quickly in this in this spot I know she retired this week in Bad Homburg I think that was so I hope there's not an injury concern there but you know she went into French Open we were all talking about her she'd had that brilliant clay court season she she played well you know and she lost to Kostiuk and she could have a rematch you know you know in the fourth round here and I you know she's played well at Wimbledon in the past. I think she's going in under the radar in a way that she wasn't at the Frank show.

35:46Matt Roberts: I don't quite know what to expect from Kostiuk.

35:50Catherine Whitaker: No.

35:50Matt Roberts: On grass here, sort of new Kostiuk. Does that work on grass? I don't know. No. There's only one way to find out, folks. Okay, that is it for our chat about the women's draw. We are going to talk about the men's draw in part two. Today's show is brought to you by Vanguard. To all the financial advisors listening, let's talk bonds for a minute. Capturing value in fixed income isn't easy. Bond markets are massive, murky, and let's be real, lots of firms throw a couple of flashy funds your way and call it a day, but not Vanguard. Vanguard bonds are institutional quality. Institutional quality isn't a tagline.

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38:27Matt Roberts: OK, let's talk about the men's draw now. And I feel like even though there is a first round matchup that is begging to be discussed and Taylor Fritz against Jack Draper, we are coming for you and we will be talking about that. I do feel like we need to talk about Novak Djokovic because which half of the draw Novak Djokovic comes out in is kind of the default biggest story of any men's Grand Slam draw at the moment, isn't it? and probably will be for as long as Carlos Alcaraz is out and Novak Djokovic is still playing because, you know, okay, Alexander Zverev is a Grand Sam champion now. He's still never beaten a seeded player, I don't think, here at Wimbledon.

39:12There is a good side of this draw and a bad side of this draw

39:16Matt Roberts: and Djokovic is in the bad side, David. Yeah, and that's the thing. The others are seeded where they are, so you know where the top two are coming out, but you don't know these days where Djokovic is coming out. And, I mean, it is hold-your-breath stuff, really, right at the start of the men's draw every time as a result of that. And he's come out in the top half. So he would have to get through Sinner in the semifinals if they both got that far. I mean, look, I think it's a long way to get there as it is. I do think when you look at the draw and see that the third seed is also in his quarter, which is Felix Ogieliasseem I mean he's a very good player Ogieliasseem and he's got a new haircut he's got a shaved head which I'm a big fan of as we know David advocates everybody shaving their heads well if you mean business if you're a top seed and you mean business you shave your head Carlos Alcraz style is my experience definitely definitely happened that one time yeah definitely did happen that one time it definitely was all about the shaved head and none other of Carlos Alcraz's attributes.

40:26If Ogilvy-Nasim goes further than he's ever been before at Wimbledon, then you'll all be saying he's on to something. But even so, I still think if Djokovic faces him in the quarters, he'd fancy it. He would fancy himself. But it's not an easy draw on paper, at least. I mean, the first round, Wu Yubing, OK. But Stefano Sitsipas, maybe in round two, he's not really that comfortable on grass but he could face

40:55Matt Roberts: he's not comfortable anywhere these days really he could face Oliver Tarvit in round 3 here we go Tarvit time Tarvit against Rindeknesh just for you David that was a perfect David bit that was the first one that I really got excited about Serena Williams who's winning that Tarvit you think Tarvit's upsetting Rindeknesh Yes. He beat Zverev here last year under Kness. Yeah, that's right.

41:29David's unfazed.

41:30Matt Roberts: Are we going to see Tarvit against Djokovic in round three, David? Yes. Yeah? Yes. Okay. I've gone big. Are we going to see Djokovic against Sinner in the semi-finals? Yes, I think we will. I think we will. And honestly, I think the, maybe not the bigger question, but the as big question with Djokovic is not only will he get there, but can he get there efficiently? Like, I can't shake that press conference after his second round match in Paris, Djokovic. I've already forgotten which French player it was.

42:11Catherine Whitaker: Royer?

42:11Matt Roberts: Royer, Valentin Royer, where it was extremely hot and he seemed to be winning comfortably. and they ended up dropping what he viewed as a kind of unnecessary, inefficient set and just got embroiled and played about an hour and a half, an hour and 45 minutes of extra tennis in extreme heat. And, OK, he didn't know electric Joel Fonseca was coming for him in the next round, but he knew. He knew coming into that press conference afterwards, that's it. I am too old now to be able to afford any kind of superfluous energy expenditure. That is where he's at. The weather is suiting him, though, for this next week, I think.

42:57Catherine Whitaker: It's hard to imagine, having just had the week we've had of weather, but it is meant to be a lot cooler next week, which is definitely helpful for Djokovic.

43:06Matt Roberts: I can't even remember the concept of cool. I'm excited.

43:11Catherine Whitaker: Also, I think the surface there suits him as well in terms of not turning matches into slugfests. You know, like I think he can play quicker on the grass and his serve can do more damage and get free points off it. You know, I think it's very much the question I agree with you. Like, how much has he got in the tank if he gets to Sinner in the semis? You know, because he played Sinner in the semis last year and he had nothing in the tank. He was injured and it was a bit of a dud of a match, really. But this time, you know, I definitely think he'd have preferred to have been in the other half. But if he can make his way through to it, he always fancies himself on this surface.

43:59Catherine Whitaker: Yeah.

43:59Matt Roberts: And look, he'd signed for Felix Orgelia, see him in the quarterfinals, wouldn't he?

44:04Catherine Whitaker: There is Fonseca's potential fourth round. I think, you know, obviously beats him at the French. He feels less of a threat here on Gros. Yeah, I think it's workable for Djokovic. I do.

44:16Matt Roberts: I think so too. I think he's going to get there.

44:18Catherine Whitaker: The thing is, remember how well he played against Fonseca at the French Open.

44:22Matt Roberts: Right. He played well.

44:25Catherine Whitaker: The form is less of a worry to me than it has been at other points in his last couple of years.

44:32Matt Roberts: So Djokovic in the second quarter, obviously Sinner, the top seed, the defending champion. He's at the top of the draw. He has Miamid Ketsomanovic in round one, potential quarterfinal opponent scheduled to be Daniel Medvedev and obviously Djokovic, the potential semifinal opponent. Other seeds in there in this top quarter are Rafael Hodah, who we're still yet to see on grass. He has never played a professional grass court match. He could be amazing on it. He doesn't know. We don't know. Kasper Rude is in this section. I think we do know what Kasper Rud is like on grass. He's got Hubert Hurkatch in round one.

45:13Matt Roberts: Enjoy your holiday, Kasper. Tommy Paul is in this section, and as is Brandon Nakashima, who obviously had a great run at Queen's, as did Tommy Paul. But having said all of that, it's hard to see threat to Yannick Sinner. I mean, regardless of the draw, quite honestly, it was hard to see threat to Yannick Sinner. It does feel like there has to be an unusual event like we had in Paris to feel like he's properly vulnerable.

45:46Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, I mean, there's the small unknown of he hasn't played in a while and he hasn't played a grass court match this season. You know, I remember Alcaraz as well talking last year about how nervous he felt as the defending champion walking back out and he almost lost to Fabio Fanini. like I think Sinner will will handle that well but it's an element there something he's not experienced before I heard Djokovic and Sinner were practicing on center court I think the other day and Laura Robson was interviewing them and Djokovic was saying that is a totally unique experience and it's tough to prepare for it my only advice is to try and enjoy it because it is special so there's that but I love I really like this draw for Sinner and I think it's definitely possible that he just clicks into gear very quickly and the men's draw has quite a different feel to it and suddenly it's like oh well this is the guy that swept everything from you know march through to that match at the french open i think that's very likely that that that you can do that with this draw yeah certainly until you know medvedev's beaten him here before and medvedev

47:02Matt Roberts: you know his highs are still very high but Medvedev's got Marin Cilic in round one Matt

47:06Catherine Whitaker: I think Medvedev could totally lose that yeah I think Paul as well like could probably beat Medvedev along the way so it feels foolish to be to be thinking about Medvedev's inner at this stage

47:20Matt Roberts: Cilic, Medvedev, David? Yeah I don't know how fit Cilic is I mean you know he is late 30s now it's not getting any easier but he's also from time to time producing some really good tennis It's like Pliskova isn't he? Yes And when you see him play you think he doesn't look like he's lost much he still hits such a beautiful ball he moves well he is good on the surface I think I might even go Cilic in that one

47:54Catherine Whitaker: Medvedev's slam record recently not good at all

47:58Matt Roberts: yeah okay the bottom half obviously alexander zverev the second seed so he's at the bottom of the draw look it's a comfy draw early rounds but the problem for him is taylor fritz has come out in his section and that's kind of his nightmare really like he knew he wasn't going to be in yannick sinner's section because he's the second seed and sinner's the top seed i'd say his biggest other threat might even be taylor fritz i suppose you have to say jockovic but Taylor Fritz is close to as big a problem I would say a very Alexander Zverev specific problem Yes, it's just that Fritz's draw when we saw that come out initially you thought, oh, Fritz Zverev, that's happening and then Fritz's draw started to fill up with names that you thought, oh my word, that's not easy including starting against Jack Draper Now, what we saw from Jack Draper today in Eastbourne was cause for concern, I think, about Draper's health and his ability to hit the forehand properly.

49:04We'll wait and see on that. But the fact that Tiafoe and Bublik are in a section that the winner of that would likely end up playing Fritz, for instance, before the winner gets to Zverev. There's no guarantees there, I think. But if Fritz does play Zverev, that's mentally a tough one for Zverev, isn't it? Given he's lost seven in a row to him.

49:30Matt Roberts: See, even despite the tough draw, I just feel good about Fritz. I feel really good about Fritz. I maybe feel the same way about him as I do about Pagula in the women's draw. Maybe not quite as confident, but I don't know, I think...

49:47Catherine Whitaker: It was massive for him, wasn't it, last week? Yeah. Getting the wins over Shelton and Zverev.

49:52Matt Roberts: Yeah, yeah, I think so. But Tiafoe then beat him pretty handily. True? Yep. Would you, if that match ends up happening round of 16, who would you be backing? How much would you factor that result from Haller into things? I don't think it would be irrelevant. I mean, the record until that had been very heavily in Fritz's favour. He'd won several in a row against him. But this one was one-sided. I do think Fritz looked a bit out of gas after the Shelton and Zverev matches. but Tiafa looked so confident and assured in what he was doing that's what I want to see him come out and do the reason that I'm excited about him is not only the level he's shown but my memory of him two years ago nearly beating Alcaraz he was close playing against a good Alcaraz and that made me then pick him to go and reach the final of the US Open which he ended up falling just short on he got to the semis and he lost to Fritz there's a lot of history between those two great mates the fact that Tiafa would likely have to he's got Terence Atman in the first round that's not easy, a left-hander on grass and then chances are he's playing Bublik in round three, Tiafa there's a lot of danger out there it must be horrible to come into a draw thinking you're playing as well as you could possibly play and think you're going to have a deep run you could run into one of these guys and it's just, you don't have a lot of say in the match.

51:20I guess I just, look, I agree.

51:24Matt Roberts: I was really taken with Tiafoe last week, but when the chips are really down, when it matters most, I back for it. I understand why. I mean, he's rock solid, isn't he? Again, he wants to avoid having too much taken out of the tank. I do think he's super fit and he's a great competitor. David's been looking at his thirst traps on Instagram. That's what he wants, David. He wants us all to see it and say that. I don't really know what a thirst trap is. Just sort of gym selfies. Oh, okay. Right, gotcha. We'll tell you all about what Morgan Riddle's been saying after the show, if you like. Okay. Or not.

52:04That's his ex.

52:04Matt Roberts: Or Matt and I will talk about that amongst ourselves. Oh, I'm very interested. That's fascinating. Well, she's been saying stuff about what it was like being with Taylor Fritz. Good or bad? Not great, I would say. All right. By the way, the guy who beat Tommy Paul in the final, Francisco Sarundolo, is in that section with Zverev.

52:28Catherine Whitaker: Is he still in our list of players who are a problem for Zverev? No, because Zverev's beaten him about four times in a row. It's more that Sarundolo has shown grass-court form by doing what he did. So that makes him interesting again to me.

52:42Matt Roberts: Just on Draper, quickly, if he's fit, what chance do you give him against Fritz?

52:53I haven't seen him today. I struggle with that sentence, if he's fit. I just don't see how he's fully fit. If he was fully fit and he'd play loads of matches, I'd give him a decent shot against Fritz. He's got a great game. He's a brilliant player. He's got real artillery that can hurt Fritz. But this version of him, I can't see that. Yeah.

53:15Catherine Whitaker: And I think Fritz will be ready for a tough first round. He's had a lot of tough first rounds at Wimbledon in the past. I think he's going to play pretty well in that one, Fritz. Draper's got the turnaround from this week. I think that's so tough for Draper.

53:34Matt Roberts: I think so too. I would back Fritz, I think, regardless of Draper's level of fitness. I think he can make more of a match of it, obviously, if he's OK physically. and I really hope he is, but I just think that is so tough. I think Fritz is just... He's not happy with his year so far and he's like, this is where I turn it around and he's such a stubborn so-and-so. Are you a Fritz guy now?

53:58Catherine Whitaker: I think this is what's happening live in front of us.

54:02Matt Roberts: I don't know, I don't want to identify as that. You didn't want to be a cabali guy a few months back. Yeah, I don't want to put any labels on it.

54:13Catherine Whitaker: But it is happening. Yeah, we do.

54:14Matt Roberts: I like his grit, you know. Do you think Taylor Swift is going to win Wimbledon? I think he's got big fangs. And I'm a sucker for fangs.

54:26Catherine Whitaker: How many of his early round matches outside of Draper are you going to, you know, be there for? No, no.

54:34Matt Roberts: As I said, we're not putting labels on this. Yeah, it's not.

54:38Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, that is the key, I think, of whether you are someone's guy or not. and I'm being very clear about this.

54:44Matt Roberts: I'm not identifying as a Fritz guy.

54:47Catherine Whitaker: Okay.

54:48Matt Roberts: He just impresses me. I've spent, again, to make the Pagula comparison, I feel like I've spent a long time sort of having to internally apologise to them for underestimating them. I feel like I've underestimated them both a lot and I'm now sort of paying them back.

55:07Catherine Whitaker: I think the difference for me is that Pagoula to me has gone up a level and like I I worry about the flat performance from Pagoula and I actually don't really worry about that from Fritz but I I I think Pagoula can beat the best players in the draw and I'm not sure Fritz can beat the best players in his draw like I wouldn't back him against Djokovic I wouldn't back him against Sinner yeah I agree I think obviously there's players that can beat Pagula but I think she's got a great shot in every matchup

55:42Matt Roberts: yeah I agree with all of that and that's why I'm not a Fritz guy, I'm not deluded about the guy I just think he deserves some respect the other the third quarter so still in the bottom half of the draw here this is the place to be isn't it you're not in Sinners half and frankly there are no big dogs in this section of the draw it's Domino and Ben Sholton he's the biggest dog here he is the one that really should be coming through this I think you've got Caballi in there he seems to have been in Florence having a lovely time barely even noticing that there's been a grass court season happening, good luck to him It's not what you say about Kasparud

56:27Catherine Whitaker: when he does that

56:30Matt Roberts: Touche there, Touche Karen Hashanov is in there Jakob Mensik, Art of Fees and Ugo and Bear are in there. And, yeah, of course, Alex de Minor as well. That would be a scheduled quarterfinal, Shelton-De Minor. But he's been pretty unconvincing recently, De Minor. This is Shelton's, right? Should be. The funny thing is I look at it and think, yes, I think he and De Minor should be facing one another. this is a great chance for Dimon or you know this half of the draw in this but he does look so short of him his normal self he looks an imitation of it really I'm hoping Wimbledon can ignite the juices in him really and get him going because he hasn't looked right at all recently but yeah Shelton's I felt like this about Tiafa I felt like this about several players Shelton right at the top of the list.

57:32They feel that they let one get away from them at Roland Garros, you know, when Sinner had gone out. And this isn't the worst draw in the world either because they're in the half that isn't Alcaraz. Somebody's going to reach the final here of Wimbledon and they need to make it them. It's pretty tantalising.

57:55Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, I find this bottom half really interesting from that perspective because you've got the guys who took advantage of Roland Garros in there. You've got Zverev and you've got Kabaly. But you've also got the guys who will feel like it was a slam that got away or a run that got away. Dimonor, Shelton, Fritz, Tiafoe. You know, all these guys are in that bottom half. Even like Feast. I know he can't think in terms of letting Roland Garros get away. He didn't let it get away. He was injured. but there must be a part of him. God, I'd love to have had a go at that Roland Garros draw. There's guys in that bottom draw who are, I think, motivated by what happened at Roland Garros, which is what makes it so interesting.

58:42Catherine Whitaker: I would say probably something I did at Roland Garros, and I'm probably doing here again, overlooking Jakub Mensik. He was one of the guys who did really deliver at the French Open.

58:54Matt Roberts: Revived himself from the dead.

58:55Catherine Whitaker: Multiple times. Multiple times, yeah. He's a potential fourth round opponent of Ben Shelton. Now, I do think actually he looked good on the clay when he had a bit more time on the forehand and that shot he hit as well as I've seen him hit throughout that tournament. I'm interested to see that on the grass. But there are elements of his game, his willingness to come forward, his big serve that you feel like could work on this surface as well. So I would definitely flag him in that section where we're maybe expecting Dimon or Shelton. I do think men's chicks are a big part of that conversation.

59:31Matt Roberts: I was surprised that Artifis is in this draw, David, given what happened in Paris and how severe that seems and how chronic this injury clearly is. He's in the draw. Does that mean he's OK? I don't know. I mean, speaking to Goran, he's practicing. he seems upbeat certainly compared to where he was a few weeks back but I don't I guess it must be so hard not to play all the time see it from Draper, when do you come back when do you rest, when do you sign it off it's so hard to know because you've got to come back sometime and you've got to put yourself out there so I guess that's what he's doing he's giving himself a chance I hope he feels okay I hope he could nothing would give me greater pleasure than seeing people like Fies and Draper these young guys and eventually Holger Rune all the ones who just can't play just see them being able to play properly again Fies Collignon you know if he's fit it's a nice first round match that you've got Wawrinka Berrettini in this section as a round one the noise that came out yeah that was a noise we thought the others were wildly appreciated when they came out but when Vavrinka and Berrettini came out the whole room went up Grigor Dimitrov's got Dane Sweeney David you never know you never know he'll take that draw though won't he he just wants a win I know you've got a couple in Mallorca this week but what he'd give for a Grand Slam win and you've also got Zizou Bergz against Ugo Mbair in this section which is the Eastbourne final which is going to be played tomorrow so they'll play that Eastbourne final tomorrow and then they'll come back and play on Tuesday in the first round of Wimbledon so that's fun OK, anything else to highlight or mention?

1:01:35Matt Roberts: Any other opportunities you want to give me to get hate from Kasper Rude fans?

1:01:40Catherine Whitaker: I don't need to give you the opportunities for that It's a bit, guys

1:01:45Matt Roberts: Good luck to you, Kasper but I do think you're going to lose to Hubert Hur catch in the first round and I don't think you'll be that bothered. Each to their own. AI is only as powerful as the platform it's built into. That's why it's no surprise that more than 85 % of the Fortune 500 use the ServiceNow AI platform. While other platforms duct tape tools together, ServiceNow seamlessly unifies people, data, workflows and AI connecting every corner of your business. And with AI agents working together autonomously, anyone in any department can focus on the work that matters most. Learn how ServiceNow puts AI to work for people at servicenow.com.

1:02:31Matt Roberts: Hi all, this is Kim and Penn Holderness from Lifeline. Summer is here, which means it's officially travel season. And when you're out there making plans, you need somewhere reliable to stay. That's why Best Western is such a solid option. This summer, get 1 ,000 bonus points and a chance to win 250 ,000 bonus points. So wherever you're headed, make it count with this limited time offer. Life's a trip. Make the most of it at BestWestern.com. No additional purchase necessary for sweeps. See bonus points, T's and C's and sweeps rules for details and visit BestWestern.com for complete terms and conditions.

1:03:06Matt Roberts: Media day tomorrow. Who are we most looking forward to speaking to? Is Serena Williams coming in? she's not on the list I'm hoping she will just rock up I mean she has been doing her post-match interview commitments as required but I think technically she's not required because only the top seeded players have to come that way everybody else does come in they don't do everything that's requested of them we've now got this latest protest by the players to factor in. Do you think Serena's participating in that? She's not a bit of becoming at all. She's taking it a step further. 15 minutes now. This is how you do it, right?

1:03:53Yeah. But no, I mean, I definitely want to hear from her. Yeah. You know, I want to see, I want to see Novak Djokovic. I also want to see him on the evening. He's coming in early tomorrow.

1:04:06Matt Roberts: Which is very rare. Well, his time is early. He's the last one in on the last day.

1:04:10Catherine Whitaker: his time is early well yeah he won't be in at that time no i think what i really want is like to hear serena talk about what she knows about my joint i just think that'll be really funny well she might know more tomorrow than she did today or maybe not a little bit she'll know that

1:04:34Matt Roberts: she's playing her do you think if my adjoint walked past her she would be able to say that's my adjoint confidently she's very easily identifiable my joint she's a rare sunglasses wearer on tour she takes eye health seriously i saw serena's agent go into the broadcast quarters and i did think at the time i wonder whether they're just going to go and ask for a bit of footage of my joint. Mind you, you could probably just go on YouTube now, couldn't you? I think Serena does know about YouTube. She might not know about my joint. This is what I would have to do, because I don't know where you find it.

1:05:14Matt Roberts: You'd be requesting VHS tapes. Yes! Matt, who are you looking forward to speaking to? Serena Williams is not an option, apparently.

1:05:24Catherine Whitaker: Well, look, you mentioned Djokovic. I do think he's always interesting to speak to. and he hinted, didn't he, at the start of Roland Garros about the injury that he'd had and how it sounded from that pre-tournament press conference like he thought it was going to be a struggle at Roland Garros this year. I've been led astray by Novak Djokovic's press conferences before, this year in fact, in Australia. But if he's punchy and talking up his chances and that kind of thing, that will be interesting to me tomorrow.

1:05:58Matt Roberts: Yeah. lots of people in the live chat pointing out how much headline writer potential there is with my joint being the one to face serena serena wrecks the joint that sort of that sort of thing yeah it's a rich scene excellent david loves a pun sometimes it depends who's delivering them so that is all tomorrow media day I made a list of all the players that we want to speak to or attend their press conferences earlier and it is long and overwhelming that was incredible work take a deep breath before you look at that list it's going to be a heck of a day we will be back at the end of it at 8pm tomorrow live on YouTube if you want to join us live up as a podcast as well soon after to talk about everything that we've learned in media day find out whether Serena Williams did come in and talk to us.

1:06:57Matt Roberts: And then we'll be back on Sunday as well with our final Wimbledon preview show at 7.30pm UK time. And then from Monday, we are live at the close of play, not before 9pm. So keep across our socials, our YouTube channel and our newsletter if you want to be able to join those shows live. And do hit that like and subscribe button on YouTube. Just final thing I wanted to say before we wrap tonight. the media theatre where all those big press conferences will be taking place tomorrow, we were in there earlier for what turned out to be a pretty incredible experience. We were invited to a screening of the Chris Evert and Martina Navratilova documentary, which is already out and available to watch on Netflix.

1:07:45Matt Roberts: Martina Navratilova was there. Chris Everett had been supposed to be there but obviously we had the news just in the last 24 or so hours that her ovarian cancer has recurred and she's not able to travel to Wimbledon she's back at home and she's having treatment once again for cancer which makes this documentary all the more moving and it was already incredibly poignant I mean what a piece of storytelling and the opportunity to get to watch that in the room with Martina who was overcome with emotion before the screening, obviously because of what's going on with Chrissie and she said she had wanted to cancel the screening but Chrissie had encouraged her to go ahead with it.

1:08:35Matt Roberts: We were with Pam, Pam Shriver, Martina's long-time doubles partner who features in the documentary and has some absolutely incredible lines in there, a bit of light relief in what is, well, just an incredibly beautiful and moving piece of storytelling. Yeah, I don't think they could have done a better job, really, in terms of interweaving the story of their lives and careers as rivals and upcoming young players and the struggles that Martina had defecting and just the totally different portrayals of themselves to then both going through cancer treatment at the same time and being each other's support.

1:09:20And it was beautiful. It was heartbreaking to watch it, and all the more so because we now know that Chrissie's going through it again for a third time. And when we first got notification that this screening was going to take place and we got invited to it, it was billed as an opportunity to watch it. we're in the company of Chris Everton, Martina Navratilova, and then for them to do a Q &A afterwards. And, of course, Chrissy isn't able to be here, and Martina could only say a few words before she broke down. She just couldn't, and we totally understand that. But it was both a wonderful watch and a tough watch, but I do encourage you to watch it.

1:10:03Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, it's incredible. There's incredible footage from the archive, but also just incredible moments of vulnerability from both Chrissy and Martina as they're going through their treatment. And, yeah, it's a story of how, you know, whether it be through rivalry on a court or friendship in hard times, like you know that kind of the story you can tell together is kind of bigger than than the story you can tell on your own it's it's incredibly powerful and moving in that way and yeah amazing contributions from talking heads like Pam and also Mary Carrillo, Billie Jean King it's really well put together and yeah thinking of thinking of Chrissy.

1:10:54Matt Roberts: Some people in the chat saying we should call our bear Chrissy we are taking suggestions for what to call the bear we love the bear so we have loved all of our little cuddly toy mascots

1:11:06Catherine Whitaker: I love his cap so much

1:11:08Matt Roberts: last year we had Jam Shriver, the strawberry irreplaceable Jam Shriver but we do love this bear and his little cap or her little cap their little cap so yeah we were going to name the bear after an England footballer because obviously the World Cup is going on We had Jude a couple of years ago. It's all up for grabs. We had Ted Perry. Yeah, Vicky and Hannah came up with Ted Perry, which I did enjoy a lot. Yeah. So anyway, submissions are open, folks. We will adjudicate... On Sunday. On Sunday. Okay, there we go. So back tomorrow at 8pm, back on Sunday at 7.30pm. It is the time of the night where we say a huge hello to Phoebe, our real mascot for this Wimbledon.

1:11:57Matt Roberts: Hello, Phoebe. Join me in saying a big hello to Phoebe. I'm looking at Phoebe.

1:12:03Catherine Whitaker: Phoebe's looking at me and the agenda. We like Phoebe.

1:12:06Matt Roberts: Tell me about Phoebe, Matt.

1:12:07Catherine Whitaker: Well, we've known Phoebe for a long time. This is Phoebe's sixth consecutive year being a tennis podcast mascot in some shape or form.

1:12:16Matt Roberts: consistent isn't it it's like Chris Evert's record of winning a Grand Slam at least one Grand Slam a season for 13 consecutive seasons you're on your way Phoebe yeah we love Phoebe she has been napping while her humans watch all the sports Wimbledon and the World Cup so yeah Priyanka says what an exciting time for me and the best of snooze soundtracks for her. Looking forward to a great tournament and I hope everyone keeps cool out there. Unfortunately, Priyanka, that is impossible at the moment, but we are doing our very best and pictures of cute dogs definitely help. Thank you, Mum, for sending lots of pictures of Billie Jean in the paddling pool.

1:13:03Matt Roberts: Much appreciated. Hello to our mascots. Hello to Maisie, Roger and I'm missing one.

1:13:16Matt Roberts: Bodhi. Bodhi. Thank you. It's late. Well, actually, what's happened is the picture of... I've copied and pasted the picture of Phoebe over some of the text. So I've just got an enormous picture of another dog obscuring my mascot, Bodhi. Please forgive me, Bodhi. And I'm now getting distracted again by looking at this glorious picture of Phoebe. Phoebe, Bodhi, Maisie and Roger. Hello and thank you to you. Hello to our executive producers, Greg, Chris and Jeff. Matt, let's have some shout outs, unless they are obscured by pictures of animals.

1:13:56Catherine Whitaker: See, we normally edit that out, but here we are, pressing on. The beauty of life. We have two shout outs tonight. We have Fee McGregor from Edinburgh. Hi, Fee.

1:14:08Matt Roberts: Hello, Fee.

1:14:09Catherine Whitaker: Fee says, I started listening in 2016 when living in Hong Kong, where TV coverage of tennis was very limited. So the podcast was a great way of keeping up to date. Ten years. Fee is now back in Edinburgh.

1:14:23Matt Roberts: That's like Judy Murray, who we spoke to today, and she said, I don't follow tennis much, but I do listen to your podcast.

1:14:31Catherine Whitaker: I've been thinking about that for a while. Me too, which is interesting. Hello, Judy. Does she make it to the shout outs? She made it through the Dan Evans interview, apparently.

1:14:43Matt Roberts: Fee, tennis, we've got Fiona Farrow I feel like we always land on Fiona Farrow Can't think of any Fees All I can think of is Fee Glover A British broadcaster With absolutely no connections to tennis whatsoever Worked for the BBC radio team Of which I work for There we go She wasn't at Wimbledon There we go No, but we'll take it Thank you Fee

1:15:06Catherine Whitaker: And finally we have Ingrid Holmberg from Victoria, British Columbia, Canada.

1:15:14Matt Roberts: Hi, Ingrid. Hello, Ingrid. Canada threw to the knockouts of the World Cup? Yep. Yep. Although they did lose their last match. They did, but everyone's threw to the knockouts in this new format, aren't they? They're letting anyone in. They were supposed to play in Canada, though, if they won. Yeah. So that's a bit of a blow. Yeah, that would have been cool. Yeah. What do we know about Ingrid?

1:15:36Catherine Whitaker: Ingrid says the crazy French Open just ended. Through all of the drama and pain, the tennis podcast was essential listening. Thank you very much, Ingrid. I was travelling through the first weekend and relying on hotel TV for entirely random and limited selections of tennis matches. So.

1:15:54Matt Roberts: That's relatable.

1:15:56Catherine Whitaker: Yeah. Yeah. Hopefully you can watch more of Wimbledon, Ingrid.

1:16:00Matt Roberts: Tennis Ingrids. I think Ingrid's a really cool name.

1:16:05Catherine Whitaker: Ingrid Ben...

1:16:06Matt Roberts: Ingrid Benzer.

1:16:07Catherine Whitaker: Benzer.

1:16:08Matt Roberts: Very good, man. Well done, Matt.

1:16:11Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, I got nervous halfway through. I should have committed to it.

1:16:14Matt Roberts: Ingrid Benzer, who was one of the founding members of the WTA in 1973. Correct. Very good, Matt. Thank you very much. Thank you, Fee. Thank you, Ingrid. Thank you generally to Bodie. I'm just going to... Keep saying it. I mean, it's Bodie, Taylor Fritz and Jessica Bagula that I just sort of owe generalised apologies to now. Thank you all for listening. Thank you for joining us live tonight. If you did, I cannot tell you how much we love doing these shows from this spot. It is a joy and an honor and we cannot wait to do 16 more of them. With bug spray, I think. Yeah.

1:16:58Catherine Whitaker: Yeah. Yeah. I forgot about that.

1:17:01Matt Roberts: 16 more with bug spray. We're learning. We're growing. We're very happy to be here. We are part of the athletic podcast network. Thank you for joining us tonight and we'll speak to you tomorrow.

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